Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 1:24 PM, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Freitag 15 Mai 2009, pk wrote: >> Alan McKinnon wrote: >> > DeviceKit isn't even in portage yet and not many packages support it. I >> > don't even know if the devs will change and improve the configs much, if >> > at all. The problem with hal is that it's code base is a mess, and it's >> > design is a mish- mash of stuff throwwn together. At least, that's what >> > the lead hal dev says >> >> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit#Dependencies >> >> I haven't looked into this in any depth but it seems like Devicekit will >> not be an improvement (looks like it brings in the "kitchen sink" in >> dependencies - I'm also "allergic" to gnome)... > > in my opinion a 'solution' that is based on the worst desktop (gnome) is the > worst possible 'solution'. What about kde users? what about xfce? fluxbox? > enlightenment users? > > Fedora screws everybody over. Like always. > Now that seems a bit strong. Presumably they aren't screwing over Fedora 11 Gnome users. (Draw Venn diagram now to look for small portion...) I don't disagree with you but it would seem that they have to start somewhere... Cheers, Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: On Freitag 15 Mai 2009, pk wrote: Alan McKinnon wrote: DeviceKit isn't even in portage yet and not many packages support it. I don't even know if the devs will change and improve the configs much, if at all. The problem with hal is that it's code base is a mess, and it's design is a mish- mash of stuff throwwn together. At least, that's what the lead hal dev says http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit#Dependencies I haven't looked into this in any depth but it seems like Devicekit will not be an improvement (looks like it brings in the "kitchen sink" in dependencies - I'm also "allergic" to gnome)... in my opinion a 'solution' that is based on the worst desktop (gnome) is the worst possible 'solution'. What about kde users? what about xfce? fluxbox? enlightenment users? Fedora screws everybody over. Like always. Um... that dependencies list is the dependencies for the feature to get done for Fedora. I would be shocked if the HAL replacement is dependent on Nautilus. Honestly, most of the libraries on that list are stuff likely already in the LSB (which btw includes both gnome stuff as well as Qt and Phonon) so while it may not be in your system it's not crazy to depend on. Tone down the Gnome/Fedora hate. Aaron
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Freitag 15 Mai 2009, pk wrote: > Alan McKinnon wrote: > > DeviceKit isn't even in portage yet and not many packages support it. I > > don't even know if the devs will change and improve the configs much, if > > at all. The problem with hal is that it's code base is a mess, and it's > > design is a mish- mash of stuff throwwn together. At least, that's what > > the lead hal dev says > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit#Dependencies > > I haven't looked into this in any depth but it seems like Devicekit will > not be an improvement (looks like it brings in the "kitchen sink" in > dependencies - I'm also "allergic" to gnome)... in my opinion a 'solution' that is based on the worst desktop (gnome) is the worst possible 'solution'. What about kde users? what about xfce? fluxbox? enlightenment users? Fedora screws everybody over. Like always.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Alan McKinnon wrote: > DeviceKit isn't even in portage yet and not many packages support it. I don't > even know if the devs will change and improve the configs much, if at all. > The > problem with hal is that it's code base is a mess, and it's design is a mish- > mash of stuff throwwn together. At least, that's what the lead hal dev says http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit#Dependencies I haven't looked into this in any depth but it seems like Devicekit will not be an improvement (looks like it brings in the "kitchen sink" in dependencies - I'm also "allergic" to gnome)... Best regards Peter K
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Alan McKinnon wrote: > On Friday 15 May 2009 18:42:10 Dale wrote: > >> Alan McKinnon wrote: >> >>> On Friday 15 May 2009 18:03:21 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: >>> On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann > > wrote: > >>> So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not >>> absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) >>> >> which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further. >> > I think editing /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-keymap.fdi is easier than that, > even. :) > and I think editing xorg.conf is the easiest way. >>> I think dumping hal for the stupid piece of software it is and moving to >>> devicekit like the developer intends, is an even easier way... >>> >> Since the "new" xorg-server was a complete flop here, when will this >> devicekit option be coming? Please tell me it will be easier that hal is. >> > > I have no idea, sorry :-( > > DeviceKit isn't even in portage yet and not many packages support it. I don't > even know if the devs will change and improve the configs much, if at all. > The > problem with hal is that it's code base is a mess, and it's design is a mish- > mash of stuff throwwn together. At least, that's what the lead hal dev says > > Well I won't disagree on it being a mess. I may make a fresh backup and try xorg-server one day but I still have a bad taste in my mouth from the last time. I was hoping maybe something better was on the way. < sighs > Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Paul Hartman wrote: > On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM, Dale wrote: > >> Since the "new" xorg-server was a complete flop here, when will this >> devicekit option be coming? Please tell me it will be easier that hal is. >> > > It (xorg+hal/fdi config) has worked fine for me since day 1 (and > continues to work), using a fully ~amd64 system. So not a complete > flop. And xorg devs have been using it like that for something like 5 > years. I think the migration from one style of config to another was > more the cause of many people's problems generally. I don't know > anything about devicekit but I would bet the config & operation would > be close to that of hal/fdi than the old xorg.conf style. > > > I never said it was a flop for anyone else, just that it was a flop here. I couldn't get a GUI working until I went back to the old xorg-server and even recompiled a few other things. I masked that puppy and it will be masked for a while here. Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Freitag 15 Mai 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM, Dale wrote: > > Since the "new" xorg-server was a complete flop here, when will this > > devicekit option be coming? Please tell me it will be easier that hal > > is. > > It (xorg+hal/fdi config) has worked fine for me since day 1 (and > continues to work), using a fully ~amd64 system. So not a complete > flop. And xorg devs have been using it like that for something like 5 > years. I think the migration from one style of config to another was > more the cause of many people's problems generally. I don't know > anything about devicekit but I would bet the config & operation would > be close to that of hal/fdi than the old xorg.conf style. because you use a keyboard with us layout and a standard mouse, Everybody else was screwed And what the devs use it not a good measurement. Devs also have used ext3 or 4k stack in the past
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Friday 15 May 2009 18:42:10 Dale wrote: > Alan McKinnon wrote: > > On Friday 15 May 2009 18:03:21 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > >> On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > >>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann > >>> > >>> wrote: > > So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not > > absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) > > which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further. > >>> > >>> I think editing /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-keymap.fdi is easier than that, > >>> even. :) > >> > >> and I think editing xorg.conf is the easiest way. > > > > I think dumping hal for the stupid piece of software it is and moving to > > devicekit like the developer intends, is an even easier way... > > Since the "new" xorg-server was a complete flop here, when will this > devicekit option be coming? Please tell me it will be easier that hal is. I have no idea, sorry :-( DeviceKit isn't even in portage yet and not many packages support it. I don't even know if the devs will change and improve the configs much, if at all. The problem with hal is that it's code base is a mess, and it's design is a mish- mash of stuff throwwn together. At least, that's what the lead hal dev says -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM, Dale wrote: > Since the "new" xorg-server was a complete flop here, when will this > devicekit option be coming? Please tell me it will be easier that hal is. It (xorg+hal/fdi config) has worked fine for me since day 1 (and continues to work), using a fully ~amd64 system. So not a complete flop. And xorg devs have been using it like that for something like 5 years. I think the migration from one style of config to another was more the cause of many people's problems generally. I don't know anything about devicekit but I would bet the config & operation would be close to that of hal/fdi than the old xorg.conf style.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Alan McKinnon wrote: > On Friday 15 May 2009 18:03:21 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > >> On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: >> >>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann >>> >>> wrote: >>> > > > So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not > absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) > which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further. >>> I think editing /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-keymap.fdi is easier than that, >>> even. :) >>> >> and I think editing xorg.conf is the easiest way. >> > > I think dumping hal for the stupid piece of software it is and moving to > devicekit like the developer intends, is an even easier way... > > Since the "new" xorg-server was a complete flop here, when will this devicekit option be coming? Please tell me it will be easier that hal is. Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Alan McKinnon wrote: > On Friday 15 May 2009 18:03:21 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > >> On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: >> >>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann >>> >>> wrote: >>> > > > So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not > absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) > which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further. >>> I think editing /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-keymap.fdi is easier than that, >>> even. :) >>> >> and I think editing xorg.conf is the easiest way. >> > > I think dumping hal for the stupid piece of software it is and moving to > devicekit like the developer intends, is an even easier way... > > Since the "new" xorg-server was a complete flop here, when will this devicekit option be coming? Please tell me it will be easier that hal is. Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Friday 15 May 2009 18:03:21 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann > > > > wrote: > > >> So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not > > >> absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) > > > > > > which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further. > > > > I think editing /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-keymap.fdi is easier than that, > > even. :) > > and I think editing xorg.conf is the easiest way. I think dumping hal for the stupid piece of software it is and moving to devicekit like the developer intends, is an even easier way... -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann > > wrote: > > On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > >> On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 11:31 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann > >> > >> wrote: > >> > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > >> > >but now you can skip the FDI unless you have > >> >> > >> >> some customized configuration > >> > > >> > customized like a german layout with a german keyboard.. I wasn't the > >> > first nor the last one stepping into that trap. > >> > >> I only have US keyboards so I can't say how it should be done. :) > >> According to the message when you emerge hal, it says: > >> > >> * If you wish to use a non US layout, you may do so by executing: > >> * setxkbmap or by utilizing your Desktop Environment's > >> * Keyboard Layout Settings mechanism. > >> * Under GNOME, this is gnome-keyboard-properties, and under KDE > >> * it is kxkb. > >> > >> So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not > >> absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) > > > > which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further. > > I think editing /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-keymap.fdi is easier than that, > even. :) and I think editing xorg.conf is the easiest way.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
sean wrote: > I agree, right now it is a step backward. A nasty one. > But if there were some sort of repository that you could just download a > config, or it automatically fetches, then that would be an improvement. > > If the repository was setup for example like the Gentoo-Portage.com site > interface, it might make things real easy. > > Just think, you search for a device like a Kensington Mouse or keyboard. > A list is presented of what features a config which has been created > will do for that device, you pick and download it into the proper > directory, done! > > Of course also set things up so people could upload a config they have > made or tweaked with some details of what it does. Yay! Think of all the wonderful variants we could have; people with UK keyboard with Chinese layout! Hurray for automated configuration! Best regards Peter K
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: >> On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 11:31 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann >> >> wrote: >> > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: >> > >but now you can skip the FDI unless you have >> >> >> >> some customized configuration >> > >> > customized like a german layout with a german keyboard.. I wasn't the >> > first nor the last one stepping into that trap. >> >> I only have US keyboards so I can't say how it should be done. :) >> According to the message when you emerge hal, it says: >> >> * If you wish to use a non US layout, you may do so by executing: >> * setxkbmap or by utilizing your Desktop Environment's >> * Keyboard Layout Settings mechanism. >> * Under GNOME, this is gnome-keyboard-properties, and under KDE >> * it is kxkb. >> >> So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not >> absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) > > which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further. I think editing /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-keymap.fdi is easier than that, even. :)
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Mittwoch 08 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 11:31 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann > > wrote: > > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > > >but now you can skip the FDI unless you have > >> > >> some customized configuration > > > > customized like a german layout with a german keyboard.. I wasn't the > > first nor the last one stepping into that trap. > > I only have US keyboards so I can't say how it should be done. :) > According to the message when you emerge hal, it says: > > * If you wish to use a non US layout, you may do so by executing: > * setxkbmap or by utilizing your Desktop Environment's > * Keyboard Layout Settings mechanism. > * Under GNOME, this is gnome-keyboard-properties, and under KDE > * it is kxkb. > > So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not > absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :) which is so idiotic I won't even comment on that any further.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 11:31 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > >but now you can skip the FDI unless you have >> some customized configuration > > customized like a german layout with a german keyboard.. I wasn't the first > nor the last one stepping into that trap. I only have US keyboards so I can't say how it should be done. :) According to the message when you emerge hal, it says: * If you wish to use a non US layout, you may do so by executing: * setxkbmap or by utilizing your Desktop Environment's * Keyboard Layout Settings mechanism. * Under GNOME, this is gnome-keyboard-properties, and under KDE * it is kxkb. So I think setting it in xorg.conf is easier, but at least it is not absolutely required if you can run setxkbmap in your xdm startup. :)
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Daniel Barkalow wrote: > On Tue, 7 Apr 2009, Mick wrote: > > > type="string">true > > Looks from the forum thread like the value of "TapButton1" should be a > button number, not a boolean. Someone reported success with: > > 1 Duh! Of course, it is an integer value - in my rush to get it working I typed in "true" when I wanted to type "1". > I suspect that the ctrl-alt-backspace thing (assuming ctrl, alt, and > backspace are working for you otherwise) is that DontZap is ending up > true, either by default or configuration. I think this has to be in > xorg.conf, in ServerFlags, and is Option "DontZap" "false". Right, so this *has* to be an xorg.conf entry. Thank you for your help. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Joseph wrote: > On 04/07/09 17:22, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > >> which pretty much makes hal a bad idea. 'use hal so you don't have to >> edit files' and then have to edit hal's convoluted xml files instead >> of the simple, easy to read xorg.conf ... > > I'll second it, why complicate simple design; going from text file > configuration to xml :-( > > I agree, right now it is a step backward. A nasty one. But if there were some sort of repository that you could just download a config, or it automatically fetches, then that would be an improvement. If the repository was setup for example like the Gentoo-Portage.com site interface, it might make things real easy. Just think, you search for a device like a Kensington Mouse or keyboard. A list is presented of what features a config which has been created will do for that device, you pick and download it into the proper directory, done! Of course also set things up so people could upload a config they have made or tweaked with some details of what it does.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tue, 7 Apr 2009, Mick wrote: > I have managed to: > > 1. Set gb as the default keyboard and used > the /use-multiple-layouts-with-kbd.fdi.bz2 with some mods to be able to > switch languages as before. > 2. Set up the synaptics driver so that it performs a right area - vertical > scroll. > > However, I have failed to: > > 3. Effect a left click when I tap on the synaptics pad. > 4. Double click on the synaptics pad. > 5. Press Ctrl+Alt+Backspace to restart xorg > > This is what my fdi currently looks like: > = > > > > > > >pc105 >gb,el > type="strlist">grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu > > > > > > > > synaptics > true > type="string">true > type="string">true > true Looks from the forum thread like the value of "TapButton1" should be a button number, not a boolean. Someone reported success with: 1 I suspect that the ctrl-alt-backspace thing (assuming ctrl, alt, and backspace are working for you otherwise) is that DontZap is ending up true, either by default or configuration. I think this has to be in xorg.conf, in ServerFlags, and is Option "DontZap" "false". Of course, I haven't gotten my keyboard to work right, and I haven't used the synaptics driver myself, so I could be entirely wrong. > true > > > > > = > > Can you please help? > -- > Regards, > Mick >
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, sean wrote: > Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > > just do the stuff in xorg.conf and hal's 'settings' should be ignored. > > My xorg.conf is being ignored for my trackball settings. > Is there something that needs to be added somewhere for the conf file to > be read? you could tell hald to ignore input devices.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > > just do the stuff in xorg.conf and hal's 'settings' should be ignored. > > > My xorg.conf is being ignored for my trackball settings. Is there something that needs to be added somewhere for the conf file to be read?
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > > However, I have failed to: > > > > 3. Effect a left click when I tap on the synaptics pad. > > 4. Double click on the synaptics pad. > > 5. Press Ctrl+Alt+Backspace to restart xorg > > > > Can you please help? > > just do the stuff in xorg.conf and hal's 'settings' should be ignored. Believe you me I have been tempted a lot to do just that! What I am worried though is that soon they will decide to no longer recognise the old xorg.conf and the switch will happen just at the moment I have no time to learn all this xml format. I am trying to pre-empt this going bad on me, if I hopefully put in the effort now. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Sebastian Günther wrote: > * Mick (michaelkintz...@gmail.com) [07.04.09 18:46]: > > However, I have failed to: > > > > 3. Effect a left click when I tap on the synaptics pad. > > 4. Double click on the synaptics pad. > > Just a double check: you did recompile the synaptics driver from xorg? Yep, just as recommended in the elog. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
* Mick (michaelkintz...@gmail.com) [07.04.09 18:46]: > > However, I have failed to: > > 3. Effect a left click when I tap on the synaptics pad. > 4. Double click on the synaptics pad. Just a double check: you did recompile the synaptics driver from xorg? Sebastian -- " Religion ist das Opium des Volkes. " | _ ASCII ribbon campaign Karl Marx | ( ) against HTML e-mail s...@sti@N GÜNTHER | X against M$ attachments mailto:sam...@guenther-roetgen.de | / \ www.asciiribbon.org pgpB2Hld7aP9I.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > > > On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 9:14 AM, sean wrote: > > > > Is there a repository somewhere that you can download fdi files for a > > > > device? > > > > It seems that would make things easier for all, since many people > > > > likely use the same devices in exactly or closely similar ways? > > > > > > > > I have to get my trackball working again the way I had before the > > > > upgrade. > > > > > > Not that I know of (but it's a good idea!); once you understand the > > > basic FDI syntax it is pretty easy to migrate your settings. Find the > > > device name of the trackball you want to set up in > > > /proc/bus/input/devices and then create an FDI which mimics the > > > settings you used in xorg.conf. The Ubuntu wiki has a decent little > > > tutorial on it: > > > > > > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/Input > > > > which pretty much makes hal a bad idea. 'use hal so you don't have to > > edit files' and then have to edit hal's convoluted xml files instead of > > the simple, easy to read xorg.conf ... > > I've reached a point where I feel I need to move away from this, before I > cause damage to something! I am really annoyed that something which worked > fine (for me and it seems others too) since late 2003, is now broken and 3 > hours later I am still struggling to get it working. > > The human interface is NOT something people should be allowed to mess up in > this fashion without providing exhaustive documentation. People who want > fancy GUIs to setup their windowing system have a solution already: they > use bloody MSWindows! If they want to use Linux then they have Ubuntu. > > For me the documentation is not exhaustive *because* three hours later I > still cannot understand what and does. The logic > of the xml fdi file is not explained anywhere ... and it seems my guessing > skills are poor when all I want to do is get on with my work, rather than > take a test on reading the mind of xorg devs. > > I have managed to: > > 1. Set gb as the default keyboard and used > the /use-multiple-layouts-with-kbd.fdi.bz2 with some mods to be able to > switch languages as before. > 2. Set up the synaptics driver so that it performs a right area - vertical > scroll. > > However, I have failed to: > > 3. Effect a left click when I tap on the synaptics pad. > 4. Double click on the synaptics pad. > 5. Press Ctrl+Alt+Backspace to restart xorg > > This is what my fdi currently looks like: > = > > > > > > >pc105 >gb,el > type="strlist">grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu > > > > > > > > synaptics > true > type="string">true > type="string">true > type="string">true type="string">true > > > > = > > Can you please help? just do the stuff in xorg.conf and hal's 'settings' should be ignored.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > > On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 9:14 AM, sean wrote: > > > Is there a repository somewhere that you can download fdi files for a > > > device? > > > It seems that would make things easier for all, since many people > > > likely use the same devices in exactly or closely similar ways? > > > > > > I have to get my trackball working again the way I had before the > > > upgrade. > > > > Not that I know of (but it's a good idea!); once you understand the > > basic FDI syntax it is pretty easy to migrate your settings. Find the > > device name of the trackball you want to set up in > > /proc/bus/input/devices and then create an FDI which mimics the > > settings you used in xorg.conf. The Ubuntu wiki has a decent little > > tutorial on it: > > > > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/Input > > which pretty much makes hal a bad idea. 'use hal so you don't have to edit > files' and then have to edit hal's convoluted xml files instead of the > simple, easy to read xorg.conf ... I've reached a point where I feel I need to move away from this, before I cause damage to something! I am really annoyed that something which worked fine (for me and it seems others too) since late 2003, is now broken and 3 hours later I am still struggling to get it working. The human interface is NOT something people should be allowed to mess up in this fashion without providing exhaustive documentation. People who want fancy GUIs to setup their windowing system have a solution already: they use bloody MSWindows! If they want to use Linux then they have Ubuntu. For me the documentation is not exhaustive *because* three hours later I still cannot understand what and does. The logic of the xml fdi file is not explained anywhere ... and it seems my guessing skills are poor when all I want to do is get on with my work, rather than take a test on reading the mind of xorg devs. I have managed to: 1. Set gb as the default keyboard and used the /use-multiple-layouts-with-kbd.fdi.bz2 with some mods to be able to switch languages as before. 2. Set up the synaptics driver so that it performs a right area - vertical scroll. However, I have failed to: 3. Effect a left click when I tap on the synaptics pad. 4. Double click on the synaptics pad. 5. Press Ctrl+Alt+Backspace to restart xorg This is what my fdi currently looks like: = pc105 gb,el grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu synaptics true true true true true = Can you please help? -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 10:22 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann > > wrote: > > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > >> On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 9:14 AM, sean wrote: > >> > Is there a repository somewhere that you can download fdi files for a > >> > device? > >> > It seems that would make things easier for all, since many people > >> > likely use the same devices in exactly or closely similar ways? > >> > > >> > I have to get my trackball working again the way I had before the > >> > upgrade. > >> > >> Not that I know of (but it's a good idea!); once you understand the > >> basic FDI syntax it is pretty easy to migrate your settings. Find the > >> device name of the trackball you want to set up in > >> /proc/bus/input/devices and then create an FDI which mimics the > >> settings you used in xorg.conf. The Ubuntu wiki has a decent little > >> tutorial on it: > >> > >> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/Input > > > > which pretty much makes hal a bad idea. 'use hal so you don't have to > > edit files' and then have to edit hal's convoluted xml files instead of > > the simple, easy to read xorg.conf ... > > Well, I think ultimately it's part of a larger hotplugging idea and > autoconfig, not simply changing it from one format to another with no > additional reasons. Without hotplugging you needed to define > everything in xorg.conf no, not everything. I have been switching mice on the fly with running X for years. trackball, scroll whell mouse back to trackball back to mouse. No extra entry for the trackball needed - and no hal (the trackball is retired, as is the nice, simple three-button-scroll-wheel-mouse). >but now you can skip the FDI unless you have > some customized configuration customized like a german layout with a german keyboard.. I wasn't the first nor the last one stepping into that trap. > (and even things like keyboard layout > could be set up in gnome/kde/whatever rather than in xorg.conf/FDI). which doesn't help you with the xdm/kdm/gdm login screen. > But, yes, xorg.conf is certainly more human-readable than FDI files > for sure. oooh yes.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 09:52:11 -0600, Joseph wrote: > I'll second it, why complicate simple design; going from text file > configuration to xml :-( Did anybody managed going back to > xorg-server-1.3 You don't need to, 1.5 will quite happily use an xorg.conf file. It may not need one in many cases, but that's far from stating it can't use one. If you are happy setting up X with xorg.conf, carry on doing so. -- Neil Bothwick I can resist everything except temptation. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 10:22 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: >> On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 9:14 AM, sean wrote: >> > Is there a repository somewhere that you can download fdi files for a >> > device? >> > It seems that would make things easier for all, since many people likely >> > use the same devices in exactly or closely similar ways? >> > >> > I have to get my trackball working again the way I had before the >> > upgrade. >> >> Not that I know of (but it's a good idea!); once you understand the >> basic FDI syntax it is pretty easy to migrate your settings. Find the >> device name of the trackball you want to set up in >> /proc/bus/input/devices and then create an FDI which mimics the >> settings you used in xorg.conf. The Ubuntu wiki has a decent little >> tutorial on it: >> >> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/Input > > which pretty much makes hal a bad idea. 'use hal so you don't have to edit > files' and then have to edit hal's convoluted xml files instead of the simple, > easy to read xorg.conf ... Well, I think ultimately it's part of a larger hotplugging idea and autoconfig, not simply changing it from one format to another with no additional reasons. Without hotplugging you needed to define everything in xorg.conf but now you can skip the FDI unless you have some customized configuration (and even things like keyboard layout could be set up in gnome/kde/whatever rather than in xorg.conf/FDI). But, yes, xorg.conf is certainly more human-readable than FDI files for sure.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On 04/07/09 17:22, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: which pretty much makes hal a bad idea. 'use hal so you don't have to edit files' and then have to edit hal's convoluted xml files instead of the simple, easy to read xorg.conf ... I'll second it, why complicate simple design; going from text file configuration to xml :-( Did anybody managed going back to xorg-server-1.3 -- Joseph
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Paul Hartman wrote: > On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 9:14 AM, sean wrote: > > Is there a repository somewhere that you can download fdi files for a > > device? > > It seems that would make things easier for all, since many people likely > > use the same devices in exactly or closely similar ways? > > > > I have to get my trackball working again the way I had before the > > upgrade. > > Not that I know of (but it's a good idea!); once you understand the > basic FDI syntax it is pretty easy to migrate your settings. Find the > device name of the trackball you want to set up in > /proc/bus/input/devices and then create an FDI which mimics the > settings you used in xorg.conf. The Ubuntu wiki has a decent little > tutorial on it: > > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/Input which pretty much makes hal a bad idea. 'use hal so you don't have to edit files' and then have to edit hal's convoluted xml files instead of the simple, easy to read xorg.conf ...
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 9:14 AM, sean wrote: > Is there a repository somewhere that you can download fdi files for a > device? > It seems that would make things easier for all, since many people likely > use the same devices in exactly or closely similar ways? > > I have to get my trackball working again the way I had before the upgrade. Not that I know of (but it's a good idea!); once you understand the basic FDI syntax it is pretty easy to migrate your settings. Find the device name of the trackball you want to set up in /proc/bus/input/devices and then create an FDI which mimics the settings you used in xorg.conf. The Ubuntu wiki has a decent little tutorial on it: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/Input
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Is there a repository somewhere that you can download fdi files for a device? It seems that would make things easier for all, since many people likely use the same devices in exactly or closely similar ways? I have to get my trackball working again the way I had before the upgrade.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > >> On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: >> >>> >> Down the bottom under section 3: >> http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/x/x11/xorg-server-1.5-upgrade-guide.x >> ml >> > > > emm. No. There is nothing about removing xorg.conf. > > but my real problem is that hal crap. In their fight to make x 'easier' they > make it harder. keyboard layout is incorrect? well, bad luck, because hal's > files are a bitch to deal with. > > ... > I think he is talking about this part: 3. Configuring the graphics card The "Device" section in your xorg.conf should mostly work unchanged. However, if you have any issues, here's a few steps you can try: * Try commenting out all "Options" in the "Device", "Screen" and "Monitor" sections in your xorg.conf * Even better, try running Xorg without any xorg.conf (you can rename it to xorg.conf.old) I got a pair but I'm not sure they are big enough to try that. I'm keeping mine if I upgrade and it works OK for me. Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009 09:46:45 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > > > My keyboard layout is no longer UK, but US (I think); i.e. the # symbol > > is not next to the return key, but at Shift+3. How can I change it > > back to UK? I did it in KDE, but that's no help if you aren't using it. > is there really a part in the documentation that says you should remove > it? Yes. -- Rgds Peter
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > > > Hi All, > > > > > > I've emerged the new xorg-server-1.5.3-r5, removed my xorg.conf as > > > advised and noticed two things which I am not sure how to fix: > > > > > > My keyboard layout is no longer UK, but US (I think); i.e. the # symbol > > > is not next to the return key, but at Shift+3. How can I change it > > > back to UK? > > > > > > I used to have this stanza in my xorg.conf to be able to switch > > > languages: = > > > Section "InputDevice" > > > Identifier "Keyboard0" > > > Driver "kbd" > > > Option "Name" "AT Translated Set 2 keyboard" > > > Option "XkbModel" "pc105" > > > Option "XkbLayout" "gb,el" > > > > > > Option "XkbOptions" > > > "grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu" EndSection > > > = > > > > > > How can I set up the same thing now? > > > > create a xorg.conf? > > > > is there really a part in the documentation that says you should remove > > it? > > Down the bottom under section 3: > http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/x/x11/xorg-server-1.5-upgrade-guide.x >ml emm. No. There is nothing about removing xorg.conf. but my real problem is that hal crap. In their fight to make x 'easier' they make it harder. keyboard layout is incorrect? well, bad luck, because hal's files are a bitch to deal with. ...
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Alan McKinnon wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009 10:39:45 Mick wrote: > > Hi All, > > > > I've emerged the new xorg-server-1.5.3-r5, removed my xorg.conf as > > advised and noticed two things which I am not sure how to fix: > > > > My keyboard layout is no longer UK, but US (I think); i.e. the # symbol > > is not next to the return key, but at Shift+3. How can I change it back > > to UK? > > http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/x/x11/xorg-server-1.5-upgrade-guide.x >ml Thanks Alan, it seems that I had to reboot for the changes to take. I forgot that hal does all the device management and restarting xorg is not enough. I modified the /usr/share/doc/hal-0.5.11-r8/use-estonian-layout.fdi.bz2 for "gb" and saved under /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-xinput-configuration.fdi. I now have the gb layout. Now if I want multiple keyboards am I supposed to append use-multiple-layouts.fdi.bz2 into the same /10-xinput-configuration.fdi, or should I create a new 20-xinput-configuration.fdi, or should I replace the initially modified 10-xinput-configuration.fdi for gb with the use-multiple-layouts.fdi.bz2? Also, what do these functions mean: Option "XkbOptions" "grp:caps_toggle,grp_led:caps,compose:ralt" -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
** (Tue, Apr 07, 2009 at 09:39:45AM +0100) Mick wrote: > Hi All, > > I've emerged the new xorg-server-1.5.3-r5, removed my xorg.conf as advised > and noticed two things which I am not sure how to fix: > > My keyboard layout is no longer UK, but US (I think); i.e. the # symbol is > not > next to the return key, but at Shift+3. How can I change it back to UK? > > I used to have this stanza in my xorg.conf to be able to switch languages: > = > Section "InputDevice" > Identifier "Keyboard0" > Driver "kbd" > Option "Name" "AT Translated Set 2 keyboard" > Option "XkbModel" "pc105" > Option "XkbLayout" "gb,el" > > Option "XkbOptions" "grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu" > EndSection > = > > How can I set up the same thing now? You can have at this: http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-722498-highlight-hal+keyboard.html Here's what I did. I kept xorg.conf, but removed InputDevices. Created the file /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-x11-input.fdi You can try the following. Modify it after your needs and remember to restart /etc/init.d/hald. -- Start: /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-x11-input.fdi evdev hal-setup-keymap evdev evdev gb,dk xorg grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu -- End: /etc/hal/fdi/policy/10-x11-input.fdi -- Khanh Nguyen
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: > On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > > Hi All, > > > > I've emerged the new xorg-server-1.5.3-r5, removed my xorg.conf as > > advised and noticed two things which I am not sure how to fix: > > > > My keyboard layout is no longer UK, but US (I think); i.e. the # symbol > > is not next to the return key, but at Shift+3. How can I change it back > > to UK? > > > > I used to have this stanza in my xorg.conf to be able to switch > > languages: = > > Section "InputDevice" > > Identifier "Keyboard0" > > Driver "kbd" > > Option "Name" "AT Translated Set 2 keyboard" > > Option "XkbModel" "pc105" > > Option "XkbLayout" "gb,el" > > > > Option "XkbOptions" > > "grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu" EndSection > > = > > > > How can I set up the same thing now? > > create a xorg.conf? > > is there really a part in the documentation that says you should remove it? Down the bottom under section 3: http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/x/x11/xorg-server-1.5-upgrade-guide.xml -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009 10:39:45 Mick wrote: > Hi All, > > I've emerged the new xorg-server-1.5.3-r5, removed my xorg.conf as advised > and noticed two things which I am not sure how to fix: > > My keyboard layout is no longer UK, but US (I think); i.e. the # symbol is > not next to the return key, but at Shift+3. How can I change it back to > UK? http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/x/x11/xorg-server-1.5-upgrade-guide.xml > > I used to have this stanza in my xorg.conf to be able to switch languages: > = > Section "InputDevice" > Identifier "Keyboard0" > Driver "kbd" > Option "Name" "AT Translated Set 2 keyboard" > Option "XkbModel" "pc105" > Option "XkbLayout" "gb,el" > > Option "XkbOptions" "grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu" > EndSection > = > > How can I set up the same thing now? -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] New xorg.conf with x11-base/xorg-server-1.5.3-r5
On Tuesday 07 April 2009, Mick wrote: > Hi All, > > I've emerged the new xorg-server-1.5.3-r5, removed my xorg.conf as advised > and noticed two things which I am not sure how to fix: > > My keyboard layout is no longer UK, but US (I think); i.e. the # symbol is > not next to the return key, but at Shift+3. How can I change it back to > UK? > > I used to have this stanza in my xorg.conf to be able to switch languages: > = > Section "InputDevice" > Identifier "Keyboard0" > Driver "kbd" > Option "Name" "AT Translated Set 2 keyboard" > Option "XkbModel" "pc105" > Option "XkbLayout" "gb,el" > > Option "XkbOptions" "grp:alt_shift_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu" > EndSection > = > > How can I set up the same thing now? create a xorg.conf? is there really a part in the documentation that says you should remove it?
