Re: Fw: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
Jon, Calm down. I've uploaded two get_i to TPB in the last year, both for Arrse members who are posted overseas. Links are only mentioned on Arrse and broadcasts are of little interest to general public. RadioArchive.cc was a good place to put them until their admin went on a power trip. Unfortunately, hotfiles etc are not viable as connection speed/quality for heroes is poor. Peter http://www.holidays4heroes.org/make-an-impression On 18 January 2013 09:20, Jon Davies wrote: > On 17 January 2013 23:45, Peter S Kirk wrote: >> I up BBC radio to TPB now. > > Admitting in a public forum that you're acting in a way that's clearly > contrary to the law isn't such a good idea. > > get_iplayer is intended for personal use within the law: I'm not a > lawyer (though I do a fair amount of contract/commercial stuff in my > day job) but my interpretation of both copyright law and the terms and > conditions for accessing the BBC website leads me to conclude that > get_iplayer enables legitimate uses of data from the BBC. > > Sharing the programmes you download is contrary to both copyright law > (which allows timeshifting of broadcasts, amongst other things) and > the BBC's terms and conditions. get_iplayer is not intended for such > uses. Please desist. > > Regards > Jon ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Re: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
On 18/01/2013 10:20, Jon Davies wrote: On 18 January 2013 09:57, Chris Marriott wrote: Actually, Jon, British copyright law is surprisingly lax when it comes to radio broadcasts. Here's what Wikipedia has to say about the copyright on UK radio broadcasts, in its article "Copyright Law of the United Kingdom" [snip] Hence recording or copying a radio broadcast for non-commercial purposes is not a copyright infringement. Two things: (a) note that there's a distinction between a broadcast and making an audio or video stream available on the net. Loosely speaking it's a broadcast if it's the same as what's currently being broadcast over terrestrial or satellite. So the live streams on the BBC site are broadcasts, the iPlayer content is not. (b) quoting a wikipedia articel whose factual accuracy is noted as "disputed" doesn't make a strong argument From the Act itself, the right to issue copies of a work to the public is reserved to the copyright owner. The fair dealing provisions enable certain archiving, academic and personal uses, but don't allow public distribution. Uploading to TPB feels like public distribution to me. Anything that's no longer in (or was never in) copyright is clearly a different matter. It may of course be against the iPlayer terms of service, but that's a different matter. different to copyright, but still one of the points of my email. "Live broadcast" and "on-demand" mostly apply in the context of the TV tax; for copyright purposes there's little distinction - both are handled in the same way and treated as sound recordings. Public performance clauses cover all broadcast scenarios in addition to existing sound recording copyright. Jon and others have it right here; do not conflate the right of recording with the right of distribution. By distributing a copyright worked you are reproducing the work where you do not have permission to do so. In law, this is defined as 'making available' and is viewed far more harshly than downloading whatever from wherever to hoard without ever sharing it with anyone else. See also the EU rights of communication, reproduction and fixation, which works alongside the right of distribution and also dealt with in part by clauses in the rental and lending rights clauses of the EU Copyright Directive (as enacted in the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act as amended). EU's copyright laws now are almost entirely harmonised so the EU Copyright Directive can be viewed as authoritative on this matter. I quote, 7. Restricted acts It is an offence to perform any of the following acts without the consent of the owner: Copy the work. Rent, lend or issue copies of the work to the public. Perform, broadcast or show the work in public. Adapt the work. [http://www.copyrightservice.co.uk/copyright/p01_uk_copyright_law] And this isn't even considering that seeding torrents is a cross-border, and therefore cross-territory infringement! It has the potential to piss off original copyright owners as well as licensees and is generally Something To Avoid Doing. Essentially, redistribution or reissuing is a breach of European copyright law. Broadcasters' copyrights on all broadcasts exist for 50 years (from end of that calendar year; to increase to 70 years for all new sound recordings from 2014 onwards) in which a broadcast was first made. Also consider that there will always be exceptions to the rule -- not all BBC programmes have cleared music for all media (e.g. they have rights for broadcast and specifically the iPlayer, but no other format hence why podcasts hardly ever have music in as they would need to seek coupling - compilation - licenses for each podcast or just blanket licence for both publishing and mechanical as they currently do for TV sync). Samples from other sound recordings also fall into this bracket. Complex copyright and licensing agreements are reasons why the iPlayer's geolocked... Never mind potential technical issues like 'clogging the tubes' if worldwide unfettered access was available. It's also how broadcasters continue to cover their costs. Brazen disregard of EU copyright and wilful copyright infringement will only result in Bad Times For You should you stick your head over the parapet too noisily. Nobody likes a civil conviction. ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Re: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
On 18 January 2013 09:57, Chris Marriott wrote: > Actually, Jon, British copyright law is surprisingly lax when it comes to > radio broadcasts. Here's what Wikipedia has to say about the copyright on UK > radio broadcasts, in its article "Copyright Law of the United Kingdom" [snip] > > Hence recording or copying a radio broadcast for non-commercial purposes is > not a copyright infringement. Two things: (a) note that there's a distinction between a broadcast and making an audio or video stream available on the net. Loosely speaking it's a broadcast if it's the same as what's currently being broadcast over terrestrial or satellite. So the live streams on the BBC site are broadcasts, the iPlayer content is not. (b) quoting a wikipedia articel whose factual accuracy is noted as "disputed" doesn't make a strong argument >From the Act itself, the right to issue copies of a work to the public is reserved to the copyright owner. The fair dealing provisions enable certain archiving, academic and personal uses, but don't allow public distribution. Uploading to TPB feels like public distribution to me. Anything that's no longer in (or was never in) copyright is clearly a different matter. > It may of course be against the iPlayer terms > of service, but that's a different matter. different to copyright, but still one of the points of my email. Regards Jon ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Re: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
On 18 January 2013 10:12, Jonathan Wiltshire wrote: > On 2013-01-18 09:57, Chris Marriott wrote: >> >> Actually, Jon, British copyright law is surprisingly lax when it comes to >> radio broadcasts. Here's what Wikipedia has to say about the copyright on >> UK >> radio broadcasts, in its article "Copyright Law of the United Kingdom". > > > It also says: > > "This article has multiple issues. Please help improve it or discuss these > issues on the talk page. > - This article needs additional citations for verification. (January 2009) > - This article includes a list of references, related reading or external > links, but its sources remain unclear because it lacks inline citations. > (April 2012) > - This article's factual accuracy is disputed. (January 2009)" > http://xkcd.com/978/ ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Re: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
On 2013-01-18 09:57, Chris Marriott wrote: Actually, Jon, British copyright law is surprisingly lax when it comes to radio broadcasts. Here's what Wikipedia has to say about the copyright on UK radio broadcasts, in its article "Copyright Law of the United Kingdom". It also says: "This article has multiple issues. Please help improve it or discuss these issues on the talk page. - This article needs additional citations for verification. (January 2009) - This article includes a list of references, related reading or external links, but its sources remain unclear because it lacks inline citations. (April 2012) - This article's factual accuracy is disputed. (January 2009)" Hence recording or copying a radio broadcast for non-commercial purposes is not a copyright infringement. It may of course be against the iPlayer terms of service, but that's a different matter. A different matter perhaps, but one that is very pertinent to this discussion. I refer you to a previous similar discussion in the list archives. -- Jonathan Wiltshire j...@debian.org Debian Developer http://people.debian.org/~jmw 4096R: 0xD3524C51 / 0A55 B7C5 1223 3942 86EC 74C3 5394 479D D352 4C51 i have six years of solaris sysadmin experience, from 8->10. i am well qualified to say it is made from bonghits layered on top of bonghits ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Re: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
Actually, Jon, British copyright law is surprisingly lax when it comes to radio broadcasts. Here's what Wikipedia has to say about the copyright on UK radio broadcasts, in its article "Copyright Law of the United Kingdom". - Under the terms of the 1956 Act, copyright in a radio broadcast is not infringed by recording it for non-commercial use. The Act only prohibits recording a broadcast if done other than for private purposes, and it also prohibits causing a broadcast (if it is a television broadcast) to be seen in public by a paying audience: section 14(4), Copyright Act 1956. In respect of the first point, a recording is not made for a commercial purpose (i.e. a non-private purpose) unless it is offered for sale; so where a recording was made for home use, and is not subsequently offered for sale, at no stage is it used for a commercial purpose. In respect of the second point, where the broadcast is radio, not television, it does not fall within the terms of the restriction. The effect is that it is not an infringement of copyright to record or copy a broadcast made on or after 1 January 1959, unless it is done for commercial purposes (i.e. for payment). The copyright law of the United Kingdom was not amended further until 1988; and the 1988 Act has no application to a broadcast made before it came into force, on 1 August 1989: section 170 and Schedule 1 paragraph 5(1), Copyright Designs and Patents Act 1988. The 1988 Act is relevant to an earlier broadcast only in that it now expressly permits the making of a copy for private study: section 29, Copyright Designs and Patents Act 1988. This strengthens the previous provision, in section 14 of the 1956 Act, that permits a broadcast to be recorded for private purposes. - Hence recording or copying a radio broadcast for non-commercial purposes is not a copyright infringement. It may of course be against the iPlayer terms of service, but that's a different matter. Chris -Original Message- From: Jon Davies Sent: Friday, January 18, 2013 9:20 AM To: get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org Subject: Re: Fw: RadioArchive.cc - RIP On 17 January 2013 23:45, Peter S Kirk wrote: I up BBC radio to TPB now. Admitting in a public forum that you're acting in a way that's clearly contrary to the law isn't such a good idea. get_iplayer is intended for personal use within the law: I'm not a lawyer (though I do a fair amount of contract/commercial stuff in my day job) but my interpretation of both copyright law and the terms and conditions for accessing the BBC website leads me to conclude that get_iplayer enables legitimate uses of data from the BBC. Sharing the programmes you download is contrary to both copyright law (which allows timeshifting of broadcasts, amongst other things) and the BBC's terms and conditions. get_iplayer is not intended for such uses. Please desist. Regards Jon ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Re: Fw: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
On 17 January 2013 23:45, Peter S Kirk wrote: > I up BBC radio to TPB now. Admitting in a public forum that you're acting in a way that's clearly contrary to the law isn't such a good idea. get_iplayer is intended for personal use within the law: I'm not a lawyer (though I do a fair amount of contract/commercial stuff in my day job) but my interpretation of both copyright law and the terms and conditions for accessing the BBC website leads me to conclude that get_iplayer enables legitimate uses of data from the BBC. Sharing the programmes you download is contrary to both copyright law (which allows timeshifting of broadcasts, amongst other things) and the BBC's terms and conditions. get_iplayer is not intended for such uses. Please desist. Regards Jon ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Re: Fw: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
LiquidNet? Wasn't that the host for superseeds who went down on ~3 Jan 2013? I stopped unloading to RadioArchive when admin changed from helpful to obstructive jobsworths who insisted all unloads had full meta-data in description. I asked who cared or was interested in it and suggested they make things easy for those sharing and add it themselves if they believed it was so essential. Result: torrents deleted. I up BBC radio to TPB now. On 17 Jan 2013 at 15:30, Chris J Brady Chris J Brady wrote: > This talking radio site has been offline since before Christmas. It is > rumoured that the Beeb took legal action to > close it down. It was hosted by LiquidNet Ltd - who decline to say whether > the site is still active. It was a great > resource for talking radio - plays, documentaries, OTR (of otherwise 'lost' > or wiped programmes), etc. CJB ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
Fw: RadioArchive.cc - RIP
This talking radio site has been offline since before Christmas. It is rumoured that the Beeb took legal action to close it down. It was hosted by LiquidNet Ltd - who decline to say whether the site is still active. It was a great resource for talking radio - plays, documentaries, OTR (of otherwise 'lost' or wiped programmes), etc. CJB ___ get_iplayer mailing list get_iplayer@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/get_iplayer
