Re: [Gimp-developer] Dither patch...

2004-12-12 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi,

Adam D. Moss [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 I've been sitting on a backend patch for probably most of
 the year, that greatly improves the quality of positional/fixed
 dither -- against GIMP 2.0.x.  I was hoping to find time to get
 a GIMP 2.1.x build working and forward-port the patch, but that
 didn't transpire and it's likely too late for 2.2 now...

 I will attempt to file the 2.0.x patch in Bugzilla some time
 soon and if anyone cares they can forward-port it (hopefully
 the dithering back-end didn't suffer many changes during 2.1.x).

Please do file your bug report as soon as possible. We might even
still sneak it into 2.2 if you are confident that your changes don't
introduce any major bugs.


Sven
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable? [was [Bug 160890] Change Gimp name (fwd)]

2004-12-12 Thread Adam D. Moss
Alan Horkan wrote:
Some people have difficulty dealing with the connotations of the term The
GIMP.   I wont go into details again about why some people have issues
with the name, some even finding it offensive.
I still find it baffling that people would get upset about something
so lighthearted and harmless, but the idea of making the name
configurable in the interests of a quiet life vaguely appeals if it
can be done non-intrusively.
Has anyone thought of (ab)using the i18n system for this?  If
all occurances of 'GIMP' can be tagged, someone can easily derive
a en_US.TriviallyOffended translation from en_US...
--Adam
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable? [was [Bug 160890] Change Gimp name (fwd)]

2004-12-12 Thread David Gómez
Hi Alan,

 I don't think it is a good idea to change the project name.

So you kind of answered to yourself...

 It is a good sign that the gimp has improved so much that people are only
 left with the name to complain about :)

I don't complain about the name.

 I think it would be a fair compromise to accept patches that make it
 easier for those who would like to configure the name.

That a non-sense claim. I think that people that get offended by
a name have deeper problems. And they should worry first about them
instead of changing everybody's minds to their way of thinking.

I answer to you, because i work on a window manager with a name
that could be considered offensive by spanish-speakers with similar
ideas to the users who claim that gimp should change its name.
But we didn't intend to offense anyone when we choosed the name,
it was just a joke. People who complained about the name understood this
when we explained it to them.

 If a project as big as Mozilla Firefox allows it name to be changed, why
 would it be an issue for the gimp?

There was another project called Firebird, so there was a good reason
to change it.

 Why require people to fork or maintain their own patchsets for the sake of
 a little extra configurability.

I wouldn't call it configurability.

Regards,

-- 
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Dither patch...

2004-12-12 Thread Adam D. Moss
Ah, it's worse than I remembered, since the
patch is actually against GIMP 1.2!  But I'm
compiling up GIMP 2.0.x now and so hope to have time to
port this to 2.0 today, and from there hopefully it's
only a short hop to 2.1.x (but I can't test that).
--Adam
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[Gimp-developer] scheduling name change to boondoggle

2004-12-12 Thread Carol Spears
hi,

lets schedule the changing of the name TheGIMP to Boondoggle right after
it is announced that you can change the name of photoshop to something
less hyped and media driven also.

carol

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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable?

2004-12-12 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi,

Alan Horkan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 I have to ask why reject such patches?

Because IMO the name is important. If we allow the name to be changed
easily, our users will not any longer know what software they are
using. Contributors will be lost because they will look for the Foo
project instead of the GIMP project. It would also make it way too
easy for anyone who wants to make some quick money out of The GIMP.
We must not allow people to change the name by means of a simple
configure option and let them benefit from our hard work.

 You are in the lead developer in charge and can do anything you want
 and I certainly wouldn't expect you to make the changes but I'd feel
 a lot better if you gave a good reason to reject patches that would
 make it easier to get more people to use Free Software?

I seriously doubt that the name is effectively keeping GIMP from being
used. And I am all happy to ignore the very few people who are so
narrow-minded as to having a problem with the name.

 If a project as big as Mozilla Firefox allows it name to be changed,
 why would it be an issue for the gimp?

For Firefox having the name configurable is part of the business plan.
I can't find any such note in the GIMP's business plan. Heck, I can't
even find the plan.

 Why require people to fork or maintain their own patchsets for the
 sake of a little extra configurability.

So that it becomes harder for them to do this. And if they really
think it's worth all the hassle, well, then they can do it.


Sven
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable? [was [Bug 160890] Change Gimp name (fwd)]

2004-12-12 Thread Carol Spears
i have a question for you; you don't need to answer it to anyone but
yourself.  what does the word gimp mean to you and where ever could you
have come up with this meaning?

when i hear the word gimp, i get a chuckle from a media image that some
pack of film geniuses inbedded into our collective language lately.
also, i did not see this movie when it first came out because there was
too much hype.  had it not been for the hype, this movie would have
only been seen by a handful of similar film geeks (not gimp -- geek) and
you might never had associated that word with that image.

i was a girl scout when i was a kid.  this means a lot of different
things, one of the things that was necessary to do when you were
affiliated with this organization when i was growing up was you were
required to tie this sort of knot:
http://www.angelfire.com/ca7/sierratses/images/lanyard.jpg with this
sort of cord:
http://www.boondoggleman.com/what_is_it.htm

so i am going to suggest that the only name we consider to change
TheGIMP to is Boondoggle.

children know what they can tell their grandparents better than their
parents, i think.  adults get plagued with interesting media images
much more than children do, especially when both see the same image.  to
say that TheGIMP is an inappropriate name is to bring human beings all
down to this level that is unnecessary.  

i am becoming confusing again.  i am sorry.  let me try to sum it up
this way:  what gives you the right to inflict your perversions on a
group of developers like that?  if you have a problem with the name,
perhaps you should fix yourself.  that was a well done movie, over hyped
but well done and extremely funny.  do you *know* anyone like any
character in it?  

what i would like for you to do is to get some gimp, tie up a lanyard
and think about all of this.  what is it that you think of when you read
the characters TheGIMP?

leave bugzilla for software problems.

carol

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Re: [Gimp-developer] Dither patch...

2004-12-12 Thread Michael Schumacher
Adam D. Moss wrote:
Ah, it's worse than I remembered, since the
patch is actually against GIMP 1.2!  But I'm
compiling up GIMP 2.0.x now and so hope to have time to
port this to 2.0 today, and from there hopefully it's
only a short hop to 2.1.x (but I can't test that).
Why can't you test 2.1 (or 2.2pre, rather)? On a decent distro, getting 
all of the dependencies of 2.0 should get you ready for building 
2.1/2pre without any additional work.

Michael
--
The GIMP  http://www.gimp.org  | IRC: irc://irc.gimp.org/gimp
Wiki  http://wiki.gimp.org | .de: http://gimpforum.de
Plug-ins  http://registry.gimp.org |
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Re: [Gimp-developer] multiple instances of splash winners

2004-12-12 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi,

Joseph Heled [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Note/Disclaimer: I am *not* suggesting adding this feature into
 gimp. And please don't tell me I am doing something wrong or stupid
 or degrading gimp in any way or form.


 I like many of the splash screens submitted, so I select a random one
 at startup. If you wish to do the same,

   - create a gimp-splash subdirectory under ~/.gimp-2.2
   - place all your favorites there
   - Apply the included patch (patch -p1  rand-splash.diff)
   - recompile gimp

You don't need to apply any patch since that feature is already
there. The directory is called ~/.gimp-2.2/splashes though.


Sven
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[Gimp-developer] Re: Why not allow the name to be configurable? [was [Bug 160890] Change Gimp name (fwd)]

2004-12-12 Thread GSR - FR
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (2004-12-12 at 1719.26 +0100):
  If a project as big as Mozilla Firefox allows it name to be changed, why
  would it be an issue for the gimp?
 There was another project called Firebird, so there was a good reason
 to change it.

I think Firefox option was from one point of view, a joke, and from
another, a way to cover their ass, just in case they had to do it
again (Phoenix, Firebird, Firefox... what next? ;] ).

GSR
 
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Dither patch...

2004-12-12 Thread Adam D. Moss
Michael Schumacher wrote:
Why can't you test 2.1 (or 2.2pre, rather)?
I thought GIMP 2.2 required GTK = 2.4.
 On a decent distro
I'm not on a decent distro. :)
--Adam
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[Gimp-developer] A beginning GIMP Developer?

2004-12-12 Thread Henry Roeland
He all GIMP developers out there,
I'm new to this list and therefore lets introduce myself first. As a  
Software developer I'm working for about 2 years now with Java/C/C++ and  
other languages like XML/XSLT. My expirence with C/C++ is about medium and  
I know a little about Linux/UNIX programming but have more expirence with  
Win32 platforms.My expirence with GTK+ and GIMP code is zero.

At this time I'm working(Using) now about 2 weeks with The GIMP for  
graphical stuff (as a hoby) and I'm very excited about all that GIMP  
offers! Because I'm a developer I like to help fixing bugs or add some new  
features. A already debuged some of the code but because of my lack of  
expirence with GTK+ and all I like to begin easy :-).

In short: Can I help with bug fixing? If so should I start with bug fixing  
(which bugs) and how and to who can I deliver the patches?

Greetings,
Henry Roeland
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable?

2004-12-12 Thread Robert L Krawitz
   From: Sven Neumann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 18:05:46 +0100

   Alan Horkan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

I have to ask why reject such patches?

   Because IMO the name is important. If we allow the name to be
   changed easily, our users will not any longer know what software
   they are using. Contributors will be lost because they will look
   for the Foo project instead of the GIMP project. It would also
   make it way too easy for anyone who wants to make some quick money
   out of The GIMP.  We must not allow people to change the name by
   means of a simple configure option and let them benefit from our
   hard work.

Changing the source code and documentation is the easiest part of it.
The hard part is changing the web site, references all over the net,
etc.  I speak here from ongoing experience -- the Gimp-Print project
is in the process of renaming to Gutenprint.  Changing the source took
Roger Leigh perhaps a week or so, but the web site, hosting, etc. are
still moving along very slowly, and we have a lot of work to do.  This
is probably the primary reason that 5.0 wasn't released perhaps a
month ago.

If a project as big as Mozilla Firefox allows it name to be
changed, why would it be an issue for the gimp?

   For Firefox having the name configurable is part of the business
   plan.  I can't find any such note in the GIMP's business
   plan. Heck, I can't even find the plan.

Firefox had a little legal problem on their hands, and didn't have
much choice.

-- 
Robert Krawitz [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Tall Clubs International  --  http://www.tall.org/ or 1-888-IM-TALL-2
Member of the League for Programming Freedom -- mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Project lead for Gimp Print   --http://gimp-print.sourceforge.net

Linux doesn't dictate how I work, I dictate how Linux works.
--Eric Crampton
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Dither patch...

2004-12-12 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi,

Adam D. Moss [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Submitted as bug 161113.  I've given it the usual selection
 of tests and I'm confident that it doesn't introduce any major
 bugs...

It's in CVS now.

 I'll see if I can move my tree to 2.2pre tonight, though I
 suspect that the patch in that bug should apply to 2.2 pretty
 cleanly, since it's all 'deep code' stuff and would probably
 only collide with any cosmetic code-formatting changes.

We refrainded from doing any cosmetic code-formatting changes to that
part of the GIMP code.


Sven
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[semi-OT] Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable?

2004-12-12 Thread Adam D. Moss
 The word itself is inappropriate for software if you're trying
to feed it to the unwashed masses.  I said this when GIMP was chosen as
a name back when it moved from Motif to GTK 
A correction...
GIMP was called GIMP long before the move from Motif to GTK.
The first public release (0.53 IIRC) was called GIMP.  It's
always been GIMP.  The only naming change that happened during
the time of which you speak is that the 'G' started to stand
for 'GNU' instead of 'General'.
--Adam
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable?

2004-12-12 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi,

Michael J. Hammel [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 On Sun, 2004-12-12 at 11:05, Sven Neumann wrote:
 I seriously doubt that the name is effectively keeping GIMP from being
 used. And I am all happy to ignore the very few people who are so
 narrow-minded as to having a problem with the name.

 While I agree with most of what you've said in response to this
 thread, Sven, I take a bit of exception with this.  Being one of the
 few open minded liberals stuck in Texas, I tend to be a little
 sensitive to being called narrow minded.

My apologies. I shouldn't have generalized here. As you pointed out
there's a difference between having a problem with the name and
refusing to accept the software because of the name and despite better
knowledge.

So what I suggest we do is to keep the name, but perhaps we can indeed
do something about the way it is perceived. It could help to use the
full name more. Not saying that we should avoid using the acronym but
perhaps it would be good if we could try to mention the full name in
release announcements and such at least once. If someone wants to
review the README, NEWS. INSTALL files as well as the man-pages for
this, that would be appreciated.


Sven
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Re: [Gimp-developer] multiple instances of splash winners

2004-12-12 Thread Joseph Heled

Note/Disclaimer: I am *not* suggesting adding this feature into gimp. And 
please don't tell me I am doing something wrong or stupid or degrading gimp in 
any way or form.

I like many of the splash screens submitted, so I select a random one at 
startup. If you wish to do the same,

 - create a gimp-splash subdirectory under ~/.gimp-2.2
 - place all your favorites there
 - Apply the included patch (patch -p1  rand-splash.diff)
 - recompile gimp
-Joseph
*** gimp-2.2-pre2/app/gui/splash.c2004-12-13 08:46:25.0 
+1300
--- gimp-2.2-pre2s/app/gui/splash.c 2004-12-13 08:46:25.0 +1300
***
*** 74,92 
  
g_return_if_fail (splash == NULL);
  
!   filename = gimp_personal_rc_file (gimp-splash.png);
!   pixbuf = gdk_pixbuf_new_from_file (filename, NULL);
!   g_free (filename);
! 
!   if (! pixbuf)
! {
!   filename = g_build_filename (gimp_data_directory (),
!images, gimp-splash.png,
!NULL);
pixbuf = gdk_pixbuf_new_from_file (filename, NULL);
!   g_free (filename);
  }
  
if (! pixbuf)
  return;
  
--- 74,119 
  
g_return_if_fail (splash == NULL);
  
!   {
! int nFiles = 0;
! GError* err;
! const char* folder = gimp_personal_rc_file(gimp-splash);
! GDir* d = g_dir_open(folder, 0, err);
! 
! filename = 0;
! if( d ) {
!   srandom(time(NULL));
!   G_CONST_RETURN gchar* name;
!   while( (name = g_dir_read_name(d)) ) {
!   if( (random() % (nFiles+1)) == 0 ) {
! filename = g_build_filename(folder, name, NULL);
!   }
!   ++nFiles;
!   }
!   g_dir_close(d);
! }
! 
! if( filename ) {
pixbuf = gdk_pixbuf_new_from_file (filename, NULL);
!   g_free(filename);
  }
+   }
  
+   if (!pixbuf ) {
+ filename = gimp_personal_rc_file (gimp-splash.png);
+ pixbuf = gdk_pixbuf_new_from_file (filename, NULL);
+ g_free (filename);
+ 
+ if (! pixbuf)
+   {
+   filename = g_build_filename (gimp_data_directory (),
+images, gimp-splash.png,
+NULL);
+   pixbuf = gdk_pixbuf_new_from_file (filename, NULL);
+   g_free (filename);
+   }
+   }
+   
if (! pixbuf)
  return;
  
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable?

2004-12-12 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Would it be too much of a compromise to just drop the P at the end?
GNU Image Manipulator
instead of 
GNU Image Manipulation Program
?

Of course I would suggest planning and waiting until a major version change to 
change it.

_-T


Juno Gift Certificates
Give the gift of Internet access this holiday season.
http://www.juno.com/give

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Re: [Gimp-developer] Dither patch...

2004-12-12 Thread Adam D. Moss
Sven Neumann wrote:
Please do file your bug report as soon as possible. We might even
still sneak it into 2.2 if you are confident that your changes don't
introduce any major bugs.
Submitted as bug 161113.  I've given it the usual selection
of tests and I'm confident that it doesn't introduce any major
bugs...
I'll see if I can move my tree to 2.2pre tonight, though I
suspect that the patch in that bug should apply to 2.2 pretty
cleanly, since it's all 'deep code' stuff and would probably
only collide with any cosmetic code-formatting changes.
--Adam
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Re: [Gimp-developer] A beginning GIMP Developer?

2004-12-12 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi,

Henry Roeland [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 He all GIMP developers out there,

 I'm new to this list and therefore lets introduce myself first. As a
 Software developer I'm working for about 2 years now with Java/C/C++
 and  other languages like XML/XSLT. My expirence with C/C++ is about
 medium and  I know a little about Linux/UNIX programming but have more
 expirence with  Win32 platforms.My expirence with GTK+ and GIMP code
 is zero.

 At this time I'm working(Using) now about 2 weeks with The GIMP for
 graphical stuff (as a hoby) and I'm very excited about all that GIMP
 offers! Because I'm a developer I like to help fixing bugs or add some
 new  features. A already debuged some of the code but because of my
 lack of  expirence with GTK+ and all I like to begin easy :-).

 In short: Can I help with bug fixing? If so should I start with bug
 fixing  (which bugs) and how and to who can I deliver the patches?

Most of this is answered in the Developer FAQ
(http://developer.gimp.org/faq.html) but I will happily answer your
questions anyway.

A good way to get start is to make yourself familiar with
Bugzilla. You can use the predefined queries at
http://developer.gimp.org/bugs.html as a start. Some bugs have the
easy-fix keyword set. Those might be a good start. But we have only
just started to use that keyword, so if a bug doesn't have it set,
doesn't necessarily mean that it is very complex.

We will be releasing 2.2.0 real soon now and will enter a new
development cycle as soon as this has happened (or perhaps wait until
2.2.1 is done). That's a good time to start working on new features.
Just let us know what you are working on and, most importantly, don't
be afraid to ask.


Sven
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Why not allow the name to be configurable?

2004-12-12 Thread Michael J. Hammel
On Sun, 2004-12-12 at 11:05, Sven Neumann wrote:
 I seriously doubt that the name is effectively keeping GIMP from being
 used. And I am all happy to ignore the very few people who are so
 narrow-minded as to having a problem with the name.

While I agree with most of what you've said in response to this thread,
Sven, I take a bit of exception with this.  Being one of the few open
minded liberals stuck in Texas, I tend to be a little sensitive to being
called narrow minded.

The GIMP *is* a silly name and I've always had a problem with it.  In
the US (perhaps elsewhere) gimp implies hobbled or broken:  His
gimp leg kept him from running the race or Her gimp hand prevented her
from reaching the jar on the top shelf.  See this definition:
http://www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn?stage=1word=gimp It
doesn't have to imply a guy strapped in leather just because of a
movie.  The word itself is inappropriate for software if you're trying
to feed it to the unwashed masses.  I said this when GIMP was chosen as
a name back when it moved from Motif to GTK (though I'd be hard pressed
to find the mailing list entry that proves this).  But no one listened,
or at least they didn't agree, then.  And that's okay.  It really isn't
that big a deal.  It probably isn't keeping that many people from using
it.  But it is a silly name.  And I have wished for years that it would
be changed to something more inviting.

That said, I don't see any reason to change it.  It would be like asking
Moon Unit Zappa to change her name.  Its a silly name.  But it's hers. 
And she's apparently satisfied to keep it.  So let it be. Not to mention
(though I see Robert Krawitz just did) that there are very practical
reasons not to change it - it would be an awful lot of work for very
little gain.

BTW, I couldn't even find the bug in question.  Maybe someone already
closed it. 
-- 
Michael J. HammelIf we could just get everyone to close their eyes
The Graphics Museand visualize world peace for an hour, imagine how
[EMAIL PROTECTED]   serene and quiet it would be until the looting 
http://www.ximba.org started.  Deep Thoughts, Jack Handey

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Re: [Gimp-developer] A beginning GIMP Developer?

2004-12-12 Thread Joao S. O. Bueno Calligaris
Hi and welcome!

There are people in better position to answer you on this!

But I am just quite happy to see a mail like this - I myself just go 
around proposing weird features, and eventually finding and fixing a 
minor bug. Lots of fun, either way.

So...bugzilla is the way to deliver bug corrections.
You should better be using GIMP from CVS, read the 'Hacking' file in 
there for building tips - if you aren't already. Them, just check the 
bugs in bugzilla, erradicate them, taking care to maintain the coding 
style (it is GNU style, I've read somewhere). After it works, make a 
patch by running diff with -u3 option, and attach that patch to the 
bug report.

Now, keep online to hear from Sven, Bolsh, Alan, Carol and others... 

Oh, also, underliying GTK and the GIMP object system is Glib and 
Gobject - you should learn about these. There is a small app called 
devhelp which allows for interactive browsing of the API.

Regards,
js
--

On Sunday 12 December 2004 19:52, Henry Roeland wrote:
 He all GIMP developers out there,

 I'm new to this list and therefore lets introduce myself first. As
 a Software developer I'm working for about 2 years now with
 Java/C/C++ and other languages like XML/XSLT. My expirence with
 C/C++ is about medium and I know a little about Linux/UNIX
 programming but have more expirence with Win32 platforms.My
 expirence with GTK+ and GIMP code is zero.

 At this time I'm working(Using) now about 2 weeks with The GIMP for
 graphical stuff (as a hoby) and I'm very excited about all that
 GIMP offers! Because I'm a developer I like to help fixing bugs or
 add some new features. A already debuged some of the code but
 because of my lack of expirence with GTK+ and all I like to begin
 easy :-).

 In short: Can I help with bug fixing? If so should I start with bug
 fixing (which bugs) and how and to who can I deliver the patches?

 Greetings,

 Henry Roeland
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