Re: [Gimp-user] GAP Onionskin Question
On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 12:14 AM,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have some comments on Bhaaluu's onion-skinning tutorial which is
> included at the end of this message.
WOW! Your comments and suggestions are invaluable! This post is a keeper.
One other little thing that I did that I found very helpful. Usually a
pencil-test
that is made into a video doesn't translate very well into an MPEG video because
the pencil lines are too light/thin, or something. What I did to make the lines
darker was this on each PPM that I saved:
Filters > Artistic > Cartoon...
[X] Preview
Mask Radius: 23.27
Percent black: 0.500
Now, I really don't know what those things do, so I just played with the sliders
until I got what I wanted. What I wanted just turned out to be the
above settings.
I can't wait to try the new tutorial out!
Gimp-GAP tutorials are hard to find, even with Google, so this is a jewel.
Thank you ever so much, saulgoode.
--
b h a a l u u at g m a i l dot c o m
Kid on Bus: What are you gonna do today, Napoleon?
Napoleon Dynamite: Whatever I feel like I wanna do. Gosh!
>
> Step 9 instructs the user to perform a "File->Open" the second frame
> (f_02.xcf). When using GAP, you should not use File->Open to
> navigate frames; use one of the commands: "Video->Go To" (which is
> useful to assign keyboard shortcuts), "Video->Playback" (which
> provides some nice "scrubbing" functionality), or "Video->VCR
> Navigator" (which provides easy cut-n-pasting of frames). Not only
> will the operation take much less time, but some operations depend
> upon GAP managing the displays. Step 9 should instruct "Video->Go
> To->Next Frame".
>
> In Step 8, the Stack Position line should have a "0" in it; specifying
> that the onionskin layer should be placed at the top of the layerstack.
>Stack Position: 0 [From Top]
>
> In Step 10, the onion-skin layer should appear above the background
> layer in the layerstack and it should be unnecessary to lower it (if
> the instructions in the preceding comment are followed).
>
> In Steps 11 to 14, it would probably be better to use the Move Tool to
> align the layers, rather than the Selection Tool. The method that
> Bhaaluu proposed will only work with older versions (2.2 and earlier)
> of GIMP, whereas using the Move Tool works with all versions. The Move
> Tool permits the keyboard cursor keys to be used for moving in
> single-pixel increments (or SHIFT-cursor for larger steps). This also
> eliminates the need to make a selection and the need to anchor the
> layer.
>
> Instead of performing Steps 15 and 16, just move on to the next frame.
> Because the onionskin setup includes the "Auto delete before saving",
> the XCF file which gets saved (before you go to a different frame)
> will not have the onionskin layer. After you are done with all of your
> editing, delete the onionskin configuration, and use the
> "Video->Frames Convert..." command to save your results as PNM files.
>
> In Step 17, again "File->Open" should not be used. To navigate to the
> second frame, use one of the methods suggested in my first comment.
>
> Finally, the instructions of Step 19 suggest that using onionskin
> layers is not the best approach for this task. Onionskinning is useful
> if you want to align frame 2 with frame 1, frame 3 with frame 2, frame
> 4 with frame 3, and so on. It is not a particularly good method to
> align frame 2 with frame 1, frame 3 with frame 1, frame 4 with frame
> 1, etc.
>
> I would propose the following approach to accomplish the latter task
> (the first seven steps are identical to Bhaaluu's tutorial):
>
> 1. Create new directory and save all PNM files to the new directory.
> 2. Change to the new directory, and create a directory: PNM
> 3. Copy all the PNM files to the PNM directory. This is a backup.
> 4. Open The Gimp.
> 5. File > Open > f_01.pnm
> 6. Video > Frames Convert...
> Extension: .xcf
> GAP saves all the PNM files as XCF files, in sequential order.
> 7. Close f_01.pnm.
> 8. In f_01.xcf window, perform an "Image->Duplicate". A new
> "Untitled" image should be displayed.
> 9. In f_01.xcf window, perform a "Video->Move Path". Change the
> Stepmode to "None" and change the Opacity to "50%" (the From and To
> frames should be the first and last frames). Press OK. -- this will
> create a copy of the first frame as the top layer of each of the frames.
> 10. Perform a "Video->Go To->Next frame". (You should assign this
> command to a keyboard shortcut. I have assigned my F5, F6, F7, and F8
> keys to First, Previous, Next, and Last frame commands respectively.)
>
> 11. Activate the bottom layer ("Layer->Stack->Select Bottom Layer").
> This is conveniently accomplished with the END key.
> 12. Activate the Move Tool (keyboard shortcut "M"). Hold down the
> SHIFT key and use the mouse to align your registration points (or use
> the cursor keys)
>
> Repeat Steps 10 through 12. This amounts to the following keystrokes:
> F7, END, cursor
Re: [Gimp-user] GAP Onionskin Question
I have some comments on Bhaaluu's onion-skinning tutorial which is
included at the end of this message.
Step 9 instructs the user to perform a "File->Open" the second frame
(f_02.xcf). When using GAP, you should not use File->Open to
navigate frames; use one of the commands: "Video->Go To" (which is
useful to assign keyboard shortcuts), "Video->Playback" (which
provides some nice "scrubbing" functionality), or "Video->VCR
Navigator" (which provides easy cut-n-pasting of frames). Not only
will the operation take much less time, but some operations depend
upon GAP managing the displays. Step 9 should instruct "Video->Go
To->Next Frame".
In Step 8, the Stack Position line should have a "0" in it; specifying
that the onionskin layer should be placed at the top of the layerstack.
Stack Position: 0 [From Top]
In Step 10, the onion-skin layer should appear above the background
layer in the layerstack and it should be unnecessary to lower it (if
the instructions in the preceding comment are followed).
In Steps 11 to 14, it would probably be better to use the Move Tool to
align the layers, rather than the Selection Tool. The method that
Bhaaluu proposed will only work with older versions (2.2 and earlier)
of GIMP, whereas using the Move Tool works with all versions. The Move
Tool permits the keyboard cursor keys to be used for moving in
single-pixel increments (or SHIFT-cursor for larger steps). This also
eliminates the need to make a selection and the need to anchor the
layer.
Instead of performing Steps 15 and 16, just move on to the next frame.
Because the onionskin setup includes the "Auto delete before saving",
the XCF file which gets saved (before you go to a different frame)
will not have the onionskin layer. After you are done with all of your
editing, delete the onionskin configuration, and use the
"Video->Frames Convert..." command to save your results as PNM files.
In Step 17, again "File->Open" should not be used. To navigate to the
second frame, use one of the methods suggested in my first comment.
Finally, the instructions of Step 19 suggest that using onionskin
layers is not the best approach for this task. Onionskinning is useful
if you want to align frame 2 with frame 1, frame 3 with frame 2, frame
4 with frame 3, and so on. It is not a particularly good method to
align frame 2 with frame 1, frame 3 with frame 1, frame 4 with frame
1, etc.
I would propose the following approach to accomplish the latter task
(the first seven steps are identical to Bhaaluu's tutorial):
1. Create new directory and save all PNM files to the new directory.
2. Change to the new directory, and create a directory: PNM
3. Copy all the PNM files to the PNM directory. This is a backup.
4. Open The Gimp.
5. File > Open > f_01.pnm
6. Video > Frames Convert...
Extension: .xcf
GAP saves all the PNM files as XCF files, in sequential order.
7. Close f_01.pnm.
8. In f_01.xcf window, perform an "Image->Duplicate". A new
"Untitled" image should be displayed.
9. In f_01.xcf window, perform a "Video->Move Path". Change the
Stepmode to "None" and change the Opacity to "50%" (the From and To
frames should be the first and last frames). Press OK. -- this will
create a copy of the first frame as the top layer of each of the frames.
10. Perform a "Video->Go To->Next frame". (You should assign this
command to a keyboard shortcut. I have assigned my F5, F6, F7, and F8
keys to First, Previous, Next, and Last frame commands respectively.)
11. Activate the bottom layer ("Layer->Stack->Select Bottom Layer").
This is conveniently accomplished with the END key.
12. Activate the Move Tool (keyboard shortcut "M"). Hold down the
SHIFT key and use the mouse to align your registration points (or use
the cursor keys)
Repeat Steps 10 through 12. This amounts to the following keystrokes:
F7, END, cursor keys and should be rather quick to accomplish. If it
is necessary to use the Rotate Tool, you will have to anchor the
floating layer.
13. Go to the first frame ("Video->Go To->First Frame")
14. Perform a "Video->Frames Layer Delete" and delete "layerstack:
0" from the first to the last frame (leaving only your background).
15. Perform a "Video->Frames Convert..." as in Step 6, only change
the extension to ".pnm".
The GAP is rather intimidating at first; but it can be a powerful tool
for accomplishing repetitive image editing tasks, not just animations.
==
== START OF QUOTED TUTORIAL ==
==
On Thu, 23 Oct 2008, Bhaaluu wrote:
Recently, I asked a question about how to use the Onionskin feature
of the Gimp Animation Package. The following is a Summary of what I
did to align a series of drawings that had registration crosshairs
with the crosshairs on the first drawing, so all the drawi
Re: [Gimp-user] GAP Onionskin Question
Greetings! Thank you so very much for all the wonderful, fantastic help you provided! My Summary of how I implemented your information is included in this post, below your very helpful post. Perhaps it will serve to help someone else who needs to do something similar? I hope so. On Sat, Oct 18, 2008 at 8:39 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I would recommend first reading the reference documentation that is included > with the source code. > Online at: > http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gimp-gap/trunk/docs/reference/txt/plug-in-gap-onionskin-configuration.txt?revision=470&view=markup > > Next, your scanned files should be named sequentially in the form > "frame_0001.pnm", "frame_0002.pnm", "frame_0003.pnm", etc. The "frame" > part can be different, and the extension should match the filetype. > The numbering should be consecutive with no gaps. > > Once your scanned files are named properly, you should open up the > first one in GIMP, then perform a "Video->Frames convert"; specifying > an extension of ".xcf" (you can change the basename and/or the > directory path should you wish). You should then close your PNM image > window and work with the copy. > > Yes, you MUST use XCF format for onion-skinning to function properly. > Using XCF is also necessary for other useful GAP functionality > (masking, selections, etc). > >> As I've mentioned above, I'd like to be able to do two things: >> >> 1. Place one drawing over another and see the bottom drawing through the >>top drawing so I can lasso stuff in the top drawing and 'register' it >>with the bottom drawing. > Use the following Onionskin settings... > > Reference Mode: Normal > Onionskin Layers: 1 > Frame Reference: -1 > Stack Position: 0 [From Top] > Opacity: 50% 100% > Select Mode: All visible > "Auto create after load" & "Auto delete before save" should both be checked. > All other settings should use their defaults. > > >> 2. Place two 'key frame' drawings beneath the top drawing, and be able >>to do an 'in-between' drawing on the page on top, seeing both the >>bottom drawings through the top page. > > Alter the above settings as follows... > > Reference Mode: Bidirectional (double) > Onionskin Layers: 2 > > This will result in the onion layers appearing ABOVE your frame layer > (not underneath it as you specified). This is, in my opinion, > preferable so that you don't have to adjust the opacity of your frame > layer to see the previous and next frame layers. > > > > ___ > Gimp-user mailing list > Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU > https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user > Recently, I asked a question about how to use the Onionskin feature of the Gimp Animation Package. The following is a Summary of what I did to align a series of drawings that had registration crosshairs with the crosshairs on the first drawing, so all the drawings would be registered with each other. The drawings were all scanned into the computer using a flatbed scanner. All the drawings were saved as PNM image files from the scanner. The directions I was given were good for onionskinning a drawing with the one right behind it in numerical order. I slightly modified those instructions to align all 62 drawings with the very first drawing. 1. Create new directory and save all PNM files to the new directory. 2. Change to the new directory, and create a directory: PNM 3. Copy all the PNM files to the PNM directory. This is a backup. 4. Open The Gimp. 5. File > Open > f_01.pnm 6. Video > Frames Convert... Extension: .xcf GAP saves all the PNM files as XCF files, in sequential order. 7. Close f_01.pnm. 8. In f_01.xcf window: Video > Onionskin > Configuration... Reference Mode: Normal Onionskin Layers: 1 Frame Reference: -1 Stack Position: [X] From Top Opacity: 50.0 / 100.0 Select Mode: All Visible (ignore pattern) [X] Auto create after load [X] Auto delete before save Click [Okay] 9. File > Open > f_02.xcf 10. In the Layers window, make sure the onionskin_01 layer is above the Background layer otherwise, the onionskin effect can't be seen. I used the down arrow in the Layers window to move the Background down one. That will make the onionskin appear. 11. Lasso both drawings. 12. View > Zoom to whatever magnification you need to align the cross- hairs. I used 200%. 13. With the mouse cursor inside the lassoed area, press the mouse button and drag until the crosshairs are aligned. 14. Click outside of the lassed area to anchor the drawing. 15. Right click the onionskin_01 layer in the Layers windows and Delete Layer. Clean up drawing with eraser, or whatever. 16. Save the file. 17. File > Open > f_02.xcf 18. Move the Background under the onionskin layer in the Layers window. 19. Video > Onionskin > Configuration... Frame Reference:
Re: [Gimp-user] GAP Onionskin Question
I would recommend first reading the reference documentation that is included with the source code. Online at: http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gimp-gap/trunk/docs/reference/txt/plug-in-gap-onionskin-configuration.txt?revision=470&view=markup Next, your scanned files should be named sequentially in the form "frame_0001.pnm", "frame_0002.pnm", "frame_0003.pnm", etc. The "frame" part can be different, and the extension should match the filetype. The numbering should be consecutive with no gaps. Once your scanned files are named properly, you should open up the first one in GIMP, then perform a "Video->Frames convert"; specifying an extension of ".xcf" (you can change the basename and/or the directory path should you wish). You should then close your PNM image window and work with the copy. Yes, you MUST use XCF format for onion-skinning to function properly. Using XCF is also necessary for other useful GAP functionality (masking, selections, etc). > As I've mentioned above, I'd like to be able to do two things: > > 1. Place one drawing over another and see the bottom drawing through the >top drawing so I can lasso stuff in the top drawing and 'register' it >with the bottom drawing. Use the following Onionskin settings... Reference Mode: Normal Onionskin Layers: 1 Frame Reference: -1 Stack Position: 0 [From Top] Opacity: 50% 100% Select Mode: All visible "Auto create after load" & "Auto delete before save" should both be checked. All other settings should use their defaults. > 2. Place two 'key frame' drawings beneath the top drawing, and be able >to do an 'in-between' drawing on the page on top, seeing both the >bottom drawings through the top page. Alter the above settings as follows... Reference Mode: Bidirectional (double) Onionskin Layers: 2 This will result in the onion layers appearing ABOVE your frame layer (not underneath it as you specified). This is, in my opinion, preferable so that you don't have to adjust the opacity of your frame layer to see the previous and next frame layers. ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
Re: [Gimp-user] GAP Onionskin Question
bhaaluu ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote (in part) (on 2008-10-18 at 11:20): I am running a Debian GNU/Linux 'Etch' distribution with The Gimp 2.2. Can you upgrade to Gimp 2.6.1? - Following probably works with Gimp 2.2 but I don't have it anymore. Next, I need to know how to actually implement the Onionskin feature. I don't know anything about Onionskin (or much about GAP either) ... I currently have a 62-frame scene that I'd like to work with. Each frame came off the scanner as a PNM image file. I've already rotated and cropped all the images, using ImageMagick and the bash shell scripting language. Is there any way of batch coverting all the PNM files to XFC files without opening each one of them and saving it to an XCF file? ImageMagick's 'convert' tool doesn't recognize XCF image files. In Gimp 2.6.1 (in Windows - I assume its the same in Linux) just open an image of the same size as your PNM files. In your Explorer equivalent in Linux select all 62 images, drag them as a group to the toolbox with the Layers dialog shown and drop. Result should be 63 layers (lowest the background) and above that the 62 PNM images named to match. Delete the lowest one. From there you can (for example) save as a GIF file with 62 frames or (I presume) do anything else you want to do with GAP-onionskin. If you really want them saved as separate files ... this thread looks on-point (found with Google: [gimp save layers as files] http://groups.google.fr/group/comp.graphics.apps.gimp/browse_thread/thread/010e01bd0930438a/d796da451195ed1e?lnk=raot -- Regards ... Alec ([EMAIL PROTECTED] & WinLiveMess - [EMAIL PROTECTED]) ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
[Gimp-user] GAP Onionskin Question
Greetings, I am running a Debian GNU/Linux 'Etch' distribution with The Gimp 2.2. I have Akkana Peck's book: Beginning GIMP From Novice To Professional. My background is in Art. I have a small Art Bronze foundry, a small woodworking studio, a sculpture studio, and an animation studio. I also tinker with my digital camera, a new "used flatbed scanner", and an old computer (built in 2002) that runs GNU/Linux. What I am looking for is a tutorial for the Gimp Animation Package, specifically, for using the 'Onionskin' feature. I don't need to make an animated GIF, or any other type of movie format because I already do that with other tools (ImageMagick, mpeg2encode, ffmpeg, mencoder, bash shell scripts, and so forth). I have a traditional animation desk where I can do 2D hand drawn cartoon animation with a pencil and paper. Then I scan the individual frames on a flatbed scanner. Sometimes, I need to adjust the drawing, from one drawing to the next, and would like to use the 'Onionskin' feature. Specifically, I need to be able to 'register' drawings with each other so my scene won't be jumping all over the place when I play it. I also need to be able to do 'in-betweens.' Using the Onionskin feature seems like it would be very similar to how I use my animation desk, which has an underlit animation disk with a pegbar to register each drawing. I can make a drawing, turn on the light under the disk, place a new sheet of drawing paper on the pegbar, and see the first drawing through the new sheet of paper. I can also place two 'key' frames on the pegbar, and add a new piece of paper on top of those two, in order to do an 'in-between' drawing. In this case, I can see the two bottom drawings through the top sheet. Note: My Animation Desk and Animation Disk are not commercial products. I converted an old drafting table into an Animation Desk by cutting a 16-1/2 inch hole in it, in order to put the rotating Animation Disk in it. The Animation Disk is made from plywood and has a piece of Plexiglass inserted into it, with the wood beneath the Plexiglass cut away so a light can shine through it. The pegbar consists of three 1/4 inch dowels, placed 4 inches on-center, above the Plexiglass pane. I use 8-1/2 X 11 inch, 20 pound copy paper, with holes punched in it by an office punch, for animation paper. Thus, this is a studio-built tool. The 'Onionskin' feature is under the 'Videos' menu item in The Gimp. Video > Onionskin > [Configuration..., Create or Replace, Delete, Toggle Visibility] The first item is Configuration... That brings up a complicated looking dialog box with many things in it. As I've mentioned above, I'd like to be able to do two things: 1. Place one drawing over another and see the bottom drawing through the top drawing so I can lasso stuff in the top drawing and 'register' it with the bottom drawing. 2. Place two 'key frame' drawings beneath the top drawing, and be able to do an 'in-between' drawing on the page on top, seeing both the bottom drawings through the top page. Can you help me configure 'Onionskin' to do the above things? Next, I need to know how to actually implement the Onionskin feature. I currently have a 62-frame scene that I'd like to work with. Each frame came off the scanner as a PNM image file. I've already rotated and cropped all the images, using ImageMagick and the bash shell scripting language. So far, from what I've read, The GIMP can only do onionskinning with its native file format, which is XCF. Is there any way of batch coverting all the PNM files to XFC files without opening each one of them and saving it to an XCF file? ImageMagick's 'convert' tool doesn't recognize XCF image files. I have a very basic familiarity with Python, if that would help? Perhaps there is a simple Python script which would convert images [101.pnm ... 162.pnm] to [.xcf ... 0161.xcf]? My knowledge of The GIMP is also very basic. So far, I've read through Chapter 3 in Peck's book, which means I have a rudimentary familiarity with layers. I was not pleased with how my version of the GIF animation exercise in Chapter 3 turned out. I would prefer working with someone, one-on-one, off-list to get this going. Once I get it going, I will happily detail everything I've learned, and post it to the list as a Summary. If a one-on-one isn't possible, then any help at all will be appreciated, and if I'm able to get it going, then I'll still post a Summary of what I've learned to the list. I just feel it would be more productive to go one-on-one. If I've missed a tutorial that already explains what I'm looking for, a pointer to such a tutorial would be appreciated. Also, I may be trying to translate something I do in the real world, directly to a computer, and not realize that there may be another way to do the exact same thing, but not know what it is called. 'Onionskin' is what I think I'm looking for. I've also seen references
[Gimp-user] GAP Onionskin Question
Hey there. I've been playing around with GAP and trying to apply a more traditional approach with it, and ran into a problem. I can't seem to choose two separate onionskins from two (vastly separated frames.) This is a bit difficult for in-betweening. Here's the first three using a bouncing ball (24/fps with 48 frames total): First frame of ball (1) Ball in middle of bounce (24) End of ball's bounce (48) Now, if I were working with paper, I'd place frame 1 and 24 on a light box, then use those as a guide to draw where the ball would be, and the new drawing would be frame 12 (In-betweening). It's useful for accuracy. I haven't found a way to replicate it with GAP yet, and I was wondering if I was overlooking something. Thanks in advance. Ben ___ Gimp-user mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
