Re: Cloud Haskell and network latency issues with -threaded
Hi Kostirya, I'm putting the parallel-haskell and ghc-users lists on cc, just in case other (better informed) folks want to chip in here. First of all, I'm assuming you're talking about network latency when compiling with -threaded - if not I apologise for misunderstanding! There is apparently an outstanding network latency issue when compiling with -threaded, but according to a conversation I had with the other developers on #haskell-distributed, this is not something that's specific to Cloud Haskell. It is something to do with the threaded runtime system, so would need to be solved for GHC (or is it just the Network package!?) in general. Writing up a simple C program and equivalent socket use in Haskell and comparing the latency using -threaded will show this up. See the latency section in http://haskell-distributed.github.com/wiki/networktransport.html for some more details. According to that, there *are* some things we might be able to do, but the 20% latency isn't going to change significantly on the face of things. We have an open ticket to look into this (https://cloud-haskell.atlassian.net/browse/NTTCP-4) and at some point we'll try and put together the sample programs in a github repository (if that's not already done - I might've missed previous spikes done by Edsko or others) and investigate further. One of the other (more experienced!) devs might be able to chip in and proffer a better explanation. Cheers, Tim On 6 Feb 2013, at 13:27, kosti...@gmail.com wrote: Haven’t you had a necessity to launch Haskell in no-threaded mode during the intense network data exchange? I am getting the double performance penalty in threaded mode. But I must use threaded mode because epoll and kevent are available in the threaded mode only. [snip] среда, 6 февраля 2013 г., 12:33:36 UTC+2 пользователь Tim Watson написал: Hello all, It's been a busy week for Cloud Haskell and I wanted to share a few of our news items with you all. Firstly, we have a new home page at http://haskell-distributed.github.com, into which most of the documentation and wiki pages have been merged. Making sassy looking websites is not really my bag, so I'm very grateful to the various author's whose Creative Commons licensed designs and layouts made it easy to put together. We've already had some pull requests to fix minor problems on the site, so thanks very much to those who've contributed already! As well as the new site, you will find a few of us hanging out on the #haskell-distributed channel on freenode. Please do come along and join in the conversation. We also recently split up the distributed-process project into separate git repositories, one for each component that makes up Cloud Haskell. This was done partly for administrative purposes and partly because we're in the process of setting up CI builds for all the projects. Finally, we've moved from Github's issue tracker to a hosted Jira/Bamboo setup at https://cloud-haskell.atlassian.net - pull requests are naturally still welcome via Github! Although you can browse issues freely without logging in, you will need to provide an email address and get an account in order to submit new ones. If you have any difficulties logging in, please don't hesitate to contact me directly, via this forum or the cloud-haskell-developers mailing list (on google groups). As always, we'd be delighted to hear any feedback! Cheers, Tim ___ Glasgow-haskell-users mailing list Glasgow-haskell-users@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/glasgow-haskell-users
Re: Cloud Haskell and network latency issues with -threaded
Hi Edsko, Can you explain the figure linked to on that page a bit? E.g. how should the axes be labelled? On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 9:33 AM, Edsko de Vries ed...@well-typed.com wrote: Hi, Just for clarity's sake (as the author of that Latency section that Tim referred to): I have addressed all of the issues listed there in Network.Transport.TCP, with the exception of the first (the -threaded issue). As Tim points out, this is not a Cloud Haskell specific issue; I have written this up as a short blog post at http://www.edsko.net/2013/02/06/performance-problems-with-threaded . Edsko On Wednesday, 6 February 2013 14:09:22 UTC, Tim Watson wrote: Hi Kostirya, I'm putting the parallel-haskell and ghc-users lists on cc, just in case other (better informed) folks want to chip in here. First of all, I'm assuming you're talking about network latency when compiling with -threaded - if not I apologise for misunderstanding! There is apparently an outstanding network latency issue when compiling with -threaded, but according to a conversation I had with the other developers on #haskell-distributed, this is not something that's specific to Cloud Haskell. It is something to do with the threaded runtime system, so would need to be solved for GHC (or is it just the Network package!?) in general. Writing up a simple C program and equivalent socket use in Haskell and comparing the latency using -threaded will show this up. See the latency section in http://haskell-distributed.**github.com/wiki/* *networktransport.htmlhttp://haskell-distributed.github.com/wiki/networktransport.htmlfor some more details. According to that, there *are* some things we might be able to do, but the 20% latency isn't going to change significantly on the face of things. We have an open ticket to look into this (https://cloud-haskell.** atlassian.net/browse/NTTCP-4https://cloud-haskell.atlassian.net/browse/NTTCP-4) and at some point we'll try and put together the sample programs in a github repository (if that's not already done - I might've missed previous spikes done by Edsko or others) and investigate further. One of the other (more experienced!) devs might be able to chip in and proffer a better explanation. Cheers, Tim On 6 Feb 2013, at 13:27, kost...@gmail.com wrote: Haven't you had a necessity to launch Haskell in no-threaded mode during the intense network data exchange? I am getting the double performance penalty in threaded mode. But I must use threaded mode because epoll and kevent are available in the threaded mode only. [snip] среда, 6 февраля 2013 г., 12:33:36 UTC+2 пользователь Tim Watson написал: Hello all, It's been a busy week for Cloud Haskell and I wanted to share a few of our news items with you all. Firstly, we have a new home page at http://haskell-distributed.** github.com http://haskell-distributed.github.com, into which most of the documentation and wiki pages have been merged. Making sassy looking websites is not really my bag, so I'm very grateful to the various author's whose Creative Commons licensed designs and layouts made it easy to put together. We've already had some pull requests to fix minor problems on the site, so thanks very much to those who've contributed already! As well as the new site, you will find a few of us hanging out on the #haskell-distributed channel on freenode. Please do come along and join in the conversation. We also recently split up the distributed-process project into separate git repositories, one for each component that makes up Cloud Haskell. This was done partly for administrative purposes and partly because we're in the process of setting up CI builds for all the projects. Finally, we've moved from Github's issue tracker to a hosted Jira/Bamboo setup at https://cloud-haskell.**atlassian.nethttps://cloud-haskell.atlassian.net- pull requests are naturally still welcome via Github! Although you can browse issues freely without logging in, you will need to provide an email address and get an account in order to submit new ones. If you have any difficulties logging in, please don't hesitate to contact me directly, via this forum or the cloud-haskell-developers mailing list (on google groups). As always, we'd be delighted to hear any feedback! Cheers, Tim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups parallel-haskell group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to parallel-haskell+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. ___ Glasgow-haskell-users mailing list Glasgow-haskell-users@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/glasgow-haskell-users
RE: Cloud Haskell and network latency issues with -threaded
I (with help from Kazu and helpful comments from Bryan and Johan) have nearly completed an overhaul to the IO manager based on my observations and we are in the final stages of getting it into GHC This is really helpful. Thank you very much Andreas, Kazu, Bryan, Johan. Simon From: parallel-hask...@googlegroups.com [mailto:parallel-hask...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Andreas Voellmy Sent: 06 February 2013 14:28 To: watson.timo...@gmail.com Cc: kosti...@gmail.com; parallel-haskell; glasgow-haskell-users@haskell.org Subject: Re: Cloud Haskell and network latency issues with -threaded Hi all, I haven't followed the conversations around CloudHaskell closely, but I noticed the discussion around latency using the threaded runtime system, and I thought I'd jump in here. I've been developing a server in Haskell that serves hundreds to thousands of clients over very long-lived TCP sockets. I also had latency problems with GHC. For example, with 100 clients I had a 10 ms (millisecond) latency and with 500 clients I had a 29ms latency. I looked into the problem and found that some bottlenecks in the threaded IO manager were the cause. I made some hacks there and got the latency for 100 and 500 clients down to under 0.2 ms. I (with help from Kazu and helpful comments from Bryan and Johan) have nearly completed an overhaul to the IO manager based on my observations and we are in the final stages of getting it into GHC. Hopefully our work will also fix the latency issues in CloudHaskell programs :) It would be very helpful if someone has some benchmark CloudHaskell applications and workloads to test with. Does anyone have these handy? Cheers, Andi On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 9:09 AM, Tim Watson watson.timo...@gmail.commailto:watson.timo...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Kostirya, I'm putting the parallel-haskell and ghc-users lists on cc, just in case other (better informed) folks want to chip in here. First of all, I'm assuming you're talking about network latency when compiling with -threaded - if not I apologise for misunderstanding! There is apparently an outstanding network latency issue when compiling with -threaded, but according to a conversation I had with the other developers on #haskell-distributed, this is not something that's specific to Cloud Haskell. It is something to do with the threaded runtime system, so would need to be solved for GHC (or is it just the Network package!?) in general. Writing up a simple C program and equivalent socket use in Haskell and comparing the latency using -threaded will show this up. See the latency section in http://haskell-distributed.github.com/wiki/networktransport.html for some more details. According to that, there *are* some things we might be able to do, but the 20% latency isn't going to change significantly on the face of things. We have an open ticket to look into this (https://cloud-haskell.atlassian.net/browse/NTTCP-4) and at some point we'll try and put together the sample programs in a github repository (if that's not already done - I might've missed previous spikes done by Edsko or others) and investigate further. One of the other (more experienced!) devs might be able to chip in and proffer a better explanation. Cheers, Tim On 6 Feb 2013, at 13:27, kosti...@gmail.commailto:kosti...@gmail.com wrote: Haven't you had a necessity to launch Haskell in no-threaded mode during the intense network data exchange? I am getting the double performance penalty in threaded mode. But I must use threaded mode because epoll and kevent are available in the threaded mode only. [snip] среда, 6 февраля 2013 г., 12:33:36 UTC+2 пользователь Tim Watson написал: Hello all, It's been a busy week for Cloud Haskell and I wanted to share a few of our news items with you all. Firstly, we have a new home page at http://haskell-distributed.github.com, into which most of the documentation and wiki pages have been merged. Making sassy looking websites is not really my bag, so I'm very grateful to the various author's whose Creative Commons licensed designs and layouts made it easy to put together. We've already had some pull requests to fix minor problems on the site, so thanks very much to those who've contributed already! As well as the new site, you will find a few of us hanging out on the #haskell-distributed channel on freenode. Please do come along and join in the conversation. We also recently split up the distributed-process project into separate git repositories, one for each component that makes up Cloud Haskell. This was done partly for administrative purposes and partly because we're in the process of setting up CI builds for all the projects. Finally, we've moved from Github's issue tracker to a hosted Jira/Bamboo setup at https://cloud-haskell.atlassian.net - pull requests are naturally still welcome via Github! Although you can browse issues freely without logging in, you will need to provide
