Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
Hi, On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 8:38 PM, Jason D. Clinton m...@jasonclinton.com wrote: On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 13:47, Jason D. Clinton m...@jasonclinton.com wrote: On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 13:15, Sriram Ramkrishna s...@ramkrishna.me wrote: On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 8:23 AM, William Jon McCann Yes. https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=604237 I thought we were on track for that but it seems not. I recommend that everyone make that gconf change to disable min and max buttons though. I've been using it that way. This might prove controversial, I think we'll need to put a FAQ on it on gnome3.org to explain the design decision on it. Personally, this will work well as long as the transition to overview is fast enough. I could articulate the minimize removal rationale to someone who asks but what's the design rationale for the maximize button removal? What's the status of a send to back button to replace the functionality of minimize? Also, I would rather not make a video about these but I suspect the change will be interesting enough to warrant mention in the context of a winder video of the design principals. Jon, I know that you're busy but if you don't have time to answer the above questions could you at least tell me if I'm making marketing assets with or without these buttons? Any communication would be helpful. You'll have to ask Owen about this I think. Jon ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
I think we can use the Dash like in NextStep OS. No? All application have an icon on the dash and the dash are juste auto-hide if user are don't on the activities layout (like the Notifications and messaging tray). Le mardi 01 février 2011 à 22:10 +0100, Christian Jäger a écrit : Am Dienstag, den 01.02.2011, 13:47 -0600 schrieb Jason D. Clinton: I could articulate the minimize removal rationale to someone who asks but what's the design rationale for the maximize button removal? What's the status of a send to back button to replace the functionality of minimize? I think that a way of managing the windows on the active workspace that spares us switching to activies overview unless we want to start a new activity or switch workspaces would help us with the perceived 'disruptiveness' of switching to the activities overview. My ideal would be to have downscaled representations of the non-active windows beside my active window all the time (except when having to windows opened side-by-side). That would make switching between windows really a breeze. Greets, Chris ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
I always liked how Window Maker and others minimized windows to small boxes. IMHO, it sounds like it would fit the Gnome Shell workflow very well indeed and integrate with the overview nicely. Good idea! Best regards, Andreas On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 8:07 AM, Christian Jäger christian.jae...@rub.de wrote: Hello all, thanks for bringing us gnome-shell! I'm quite enjoying it right now thanks to the GNOME:factory repository in the openSUSE build-service. Still, I could just imagine how it could be even better ^_- Please listen to a small suggestion that I think would make daily use an even smoother experience: ATM I find myself switching to activities overview very often just to find a minimized (or obscured) window. As others have pointed out, this has two disadvantages: 1. Mouse-travel: To go all the way up to the top-left corner admittedly quickly becomes second-nature; still I don't really think it's an improvement in usability over the previous state of things (GNOME 2's panel). 2. Window-management on the active desktop: While on the active desktop, windows now behave as they have before; i.e. they overlap and obscure each other. The difference to GNOME 2 is that ATM there is no way to tell whether a window has actually been closed or is only obscured by another window or minimized. This makes me often face the decision whether I should try to move windows around on the active desktop in order to try and look for a 'lost' window or whether I should just switch to activities overview. My idea would be to relief users of that dilemma by 'seaming together' the management of opened windows on the active desktop and switching to the activities overview. The idea is, if you minimize windows, they would not 'disappear' but shrink to a tile on the desktop to look exactly like they would in the activities overview. If the active desktop behaved like that, most inactivce windows could be easily found by moving the active windows a bit to the side. Minimizing all windows would be tantamount to switching to the activitie overview, so in my opinion it should do just that: minimizing all windows should be just another way of triggering the activities overview. So it would provide an intuitive way to the overview for users who have too many windows open to easily find the obscured one by moving the active window aside. Minimizing windows to desktop tiles would not only solve the 2 problems outlined above but also represent an improvement in two more respects: 1. It would effectively replace the old 'desktop' metaphor with the activities overview. 2. It would seamlessly integrate window-management on the active desktop with the wholly new gnome-shell experience we see in the activities overview. I'd be more than happy if you liked the idea. Again, gnome-shell already is the best new desktop-environment I've seen, and I'd also prefer it over GNOME 2 just the way it is. Greets, Chris ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
Hey Johannes, On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 3:48 AM, Johannes Schmid j...@jsschmid.de wrote: Hi! ATM I find myself switching to activities overview very often just to find a minimized (or obscured) window. As others have pointed out, this has two disadvantages: Wasn't the original design to remove the minimize button alltogether? Haven't heard of this in a while though. Yes. https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=604237 I thought we were on track for that but it seems not. I recommend that everyone make that gconf change to disable min and max buttons though. I've been using it that way. Jon ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 8:23 AM, William Jon McCann william.jon.mcc...@gmail.com wrote: Hey Johannes, On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 3:48 AM, Johannes Schmid j...@jsschmid.de wrote: Hi! ATM I find myself switching to activities overview very often just to find a minimized (or obscured) window. As others have pointed out, this has two disadvantages: Wasn't the original design to remove the minimize button alltogether? Haven't heard of this in a while though. Yes. https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=604237 I thought we were on track for that but it seems not. I recommend that everyone make that gconf change to disable min and max buttons though. I've been using it that way. This might prove controversial, I think we'll need to put a FAQ on it on gnome3.org to explain the design decision on it. Personally, this will work well as long as the transition to overview is fast enough. sri ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 13:15, Sriram Ramkrishna s...@ramkrishna.me wrote: On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 8:23 AM, William Jon McCann william.jon.mcc...@gmail.com wrote: Hey Johannes, On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 3:48 AM, Johannes Schmid j...@jsschmid.de wrote: Hi! ATM I find myself switching to activities overview very often just to find a minimized (or obscured) window. As others have pointed out, this has two disadvantages: Wasn't the original design to remove the minimize button alltogether? Haven't heard of this in a while though. Yes. https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=604237 I thought we were on track for that but it seems not. I recommend that everyone make that gconf change to disable min and max buttons though. I've been using it that way. This might prove controversial, I think we'll need to put a FAQ on it on gnome3.org to explain the design decision on it. Personally, this will work well as long as the transition to overview is fast enough. I could articulate the minimize removal rationale to someone who asks but what's the design rationale for the maximize button removal? What's the status of a send to back button to replace the functionality of minimize? Also, I would rather not make a video about these but I suspect the change will be interesting enough to warrant mention in the context of a winder video of the design principals. ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
Am Dienstag, den 01.02.2011, 13:47 -0600 schrieb Jason D. Clinton: I could articulate the minimize removal rationale to someone who asks but what's the design rationale for the maximize button removal? What's the status of a send to back button to replace the functionality of minimize? I think that a way of managing the windows on the active workspace that spares us switching to activies overview unless we want to start a new activity or switch workspaces would help us with the perceived 'disruptiveness' of switching to the activities overview. My ideal would be to have downscaled representations of the non-active windows beside my active window all the time (except when having to windows opened side-by-side). That would make switching between windows really a breeze. Greets, Chris ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
On Wednesday, 02 February, 2011 03:15 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote: Yes. https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=604237 I thought we were on track for that but it seems not. I recommend that everyone make that gconf change to disable min and max buttons though. I've been using it that way. This might prove controversial, I think we'll need to put a FAQ on it on gnome3.org http://gnome3.org to explain the design decision on it. Personally, this will work well as long as the transition to overview is fast enough. Yes controversial (removing the minimized button???). I am in doubt that this will take in effect but I am welling to be corrected. I still can't think of any replacement to this task: Get rid of the focused window immediately. Alt-tab is not going to help unless you are switching to the last focused window. The current problem is: Where is my minimized window? The purpose of the minimize button is to put the window in the task bar/panel, wherein the panel was now removed in GNOME Shell, the quick solution is to remove the minimize button. But the problem still continues: I need this window to disappear for a moment, and I need to get it back later, and removing the minimize button is not a solution after all. The current alternative is the alt-tab to which is not always helpful. The whole point of the minimize button is not only to put that active window out of your view but to make the current workspace uncluttered by too many windows at the same time, thus preserving the readability of the un-minimized windows for easy switching in overview mode. Plus, I do not want yet to switch to my minimized windows, as I only need it later. The overview mode defeats this purpose as it will show all windows regardless of their state. sri ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
Hi! ATM I find myself switching to activities overview very often just to find a minimized (or obscured) window. As others have pointed out, this has two disadvantages: Wasn't the original design to remove the minimize button alltogether? Haven't heard of this in a while though. Regards, Johannes signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
Fwd: Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience
Original Message Subject: Re: minimize-to-tile would make for a more seamless experience Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2011 22:32:29 +0100 From: twohot two...@fedoraproject.org To: Johannes Schmid j...@jsschmid.de On 31 January 2011 09:48, Johannes Schmid j...@jsschmid.de wrote: Wasn't the original design to remove the minimize button alltogether? Haven't heard of this in a while though. Regards, Johannes But he does have a point. As much as Gnome-shell is cool as is today, there is need for a way to defeat the obscurity problem without the task bar. Alt+tab is one way. May be there could be something less dramatic and direct. ___ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
