Re: [GNU-linux-libre] DSFG in perpetuity

2018-03-28 Thread Luke Shumaker
On Mon, 26 Mar 2018 07:09:47 -0400,
bill-auger wrote:
> i can say though that this list is not always such high volume as it has
> been in recent months - it would be good if it continues at this pace
> but i do expect it to settle down after the current wave of applicants
> passes through

To put numbers on it: in 2017 there were 224 messages on this list.
This email that I'm sending makes 198 for 2018.

-- 
Happy hacking,
~ Luke Shumaker




Re: [GNU-linux-libre] DSFG in perpetuity

2018-03-28 Thread Luke
> Subject: Re: [GNU-linux-libre] DSFG in perpetuity
> Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2018 16:41:52 -0400
> From: bill-auger 
> Reply-To: Workgroup for fully free GNU/Linux distributions
> 
> To: gnu-linux-libre@nongnu.org
>
> On 03/26/2018 03:27 PM, Donald Robertson wrote:
>> and at this point we at the FSF need to bring some guidance.
>
> there has been a healthy flurry of activity on this list recently and i
> think the will exists to forgot about any friction in the past and move
> forward - but i must firmly say that "guidance" is too weak of a word
> for what the FSF needs to do to in order to smooth over the past
> wrinkles - as i understand, tensions have gotten high in the past and
> many are still not at ease - there are at least 2 issues that the
> community has argued over for years that only the FSF should decide
> definitively - namely:
>
> * are the debian kernel blob error log messages acceptable or are they
> unacceptable? *regardless of the distro*
>
> * what to do about chromium - now i think it is finally removed from all
> FSDG distros - should we just let that dog lie? - i am happy to tell
> users "forget it - she is a lost cause" (that probably is the case for
> 'electron') - but i was told that RMS was interested in doing something
> about it - so maybe the answer should be "not now - but maybe someday" -
> even that distinction would make a difference - i happen to know we have
> the co-operation of qt5-webengine - if only that library could be deemed
> acceptable, it would have the greatest impact.

I would also be interested in where the FSF stands on Chromium,  and how
to proceed moving forward.
Below is the article from last January which was apparently withheld
from publishing.

--

 Forwarded Message 
Subject:Re: Article: Chromium's subtle freedom flaws
Date:   Mon, 30 Jan 2017 23:33:15 +
From:   Luke 
To: r...@gnu.org



On 01/30/2017 02:49 AM, Richard Stallman wrote:

> [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider]]]
> [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]]
> [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
>
> Would you like the FSF to publish your article?
> If so, please send me the latest version.
>
Hello,

You may publish it. Here is the latest text. HTML / formatting can also
be adjusted as needed.

Thank you.

Sincerely,
Luke
Parabola GNU/Linux-libre Packager.
---
Chromium's subtle freedom flaws

As free software activists, we all enjoy using the latest and greatest
in free software, but we need to make sure that the software we are
using really does respect our freedom. Many users have expressed to us
their desire to run Chromium web browser, since it appears to be fully
free software, but it still fails in several ways.

In our research, we discovered that the situation is improving. Just a
few years ago, there were over one thousand unlicensed files which were
considered to be non-free. Thanks to Debian's Lintian Reports and
efforts, this number has come down to under 100 files as of this
writing. Licensing the remaining code with GPL-compatible licensing is
fairly trivial and is expected to be completed soon - the majority of it
being minified javascript.[1]

However, Chromium, by default, still has a number of issues that are of
concern for free software users - even if all the source code is
licensed properly.


-What are the issues?-


Queries to Google
---

By default, Chromium source code still has many lines of code that makes
direct internet connections to Google.
When building the software unpatched, much of your browsing experience
is under the control of Google's online web services.
As mentioned in our article "Who does that server really serve?"[2],
free software is only free when you are in control and should not be
dependant on third-party web services. Some work has already been done
to free Chromium from this problem, including the removal of "Google
OK", a Google web service plugin used for voice recognition, after user
outcry.[3]

Pre-built Binaries
---

By default, Chromium still includes some pre-built binaries to aid in
faster compiling. In order to have fully free software, we require all
software to be built from source. Packagers should not use
"use_prebuilt" as a compile option.

DRM and Proprietary Codecs
---

Chromium supports the use of Widevine DRM, Adobe Pepper Flash, and
third-party codecs which are non-free. Packagers must ensure that these
are removed and disabled in the makefile options prior to compiling in
order to be free software.


Privacy problems
---

While not specific to free software, we would like for users to have
control over their private information. Chromium has a number of
reported privacy concerns which made it ineligible for use with Tor.
Issues include outstanding proxy bugs which leak a user's IP address,
fingerprinting issues th

Re: [GNU-linux-libre] DSFG in perpetuity

2018-03-28 Thread bill-auger
yes i apologize for my poor choice of words there - that issue i raised
has nothing to do with commercial associations - in fact, the FSDG fully
allows for the distro itself to be a commercially operated entity - that
is, as i understand, essentially what ututo is - but, as far as i know,
the ututo parent company does not provide non-free software to it's
users, nether directly nor indirectly - please do correct me if i am
wrong about that

i attempted to back-paddle that about five minutes later - i do not to
intend cast any judgments myself - i like to think that i am just
shining a light in any grey areas that i stumble onto - let the
community decide how to interpret what is to be seen there

one could probably imagine RMS barking: "users looking for the free
source code for their system should not be directed to a server where
non-free software can be found for that same system" - of course, the
opinion depends on who you ask - some people are real sticklers about
that sort of thing


On 03/28/2018 01:30 AM, Jean Louis wrote:
> It appears to me that people working
> on that distribution are paid, and they may
> dedicate their time and efforts in making
> distribution free. 

you make a good point there - in theory that could be a very healthy
thing for the distro



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature