[GNC] rounding of Invoice vs Accounts Receivable

[flywire]

Since I use cash accounting I don't have any experience with GnuCash
invoicing. I process heaps of invoices, including recipient-created
invoices. Tax-inclusive or tax-exclusive costs are optional in Quickbooks
(which I use for business accounts) and calculated values can be user
overwritten. I assume it's round-down which is legally correct in my
jurisdiction and mostly agrees with invoices.
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Re: [GNC] rounding of Invoice vs Accounts Receivable

[Etienne]

In the Bill I enter the amount 109.95, and then select the columns Taxed, Taxes 
Included and the Tax Table entry. It then calculates both values 18.33 and 
91.63, which add up to 109.96 but the total I entered in the first amount 
column remains at 109.95.

Only when I Post the Bill, I see a 109.96 entry in A/Payable. So the Bill 
copies the sum of the 2 calculated values to the A/P and not my total entered.

I think for the time being that manual entry in the ledger correcting the 1ct 
will have to do. Hopefully GNC will have some option down the line for this.

VAT is charged at every stage of the “production process” until the 
end-consumer. So a lot of reverse tax charges and collected taxes on purchases 
to offset the VAT on the sale to the end-consumer.
That is why I use tables too, else I need to calculate taxes manually on every 
bill (as not every bill show taxes, just a “reverse tax charge” text only).
VAT in Europe depends on the country and varies between 19% and 25%.

@Michael, you pay VAT on the total invoice, but both items already have the VAT 
included on the item line. So the rounding happens at the total level. Else you 
get too big rounding errors (especially supermarkets when you have 9% 
categories and 21% items (e.g. rounding a 9% tax on a 49ct can of tomatoes is 
terrible with a full basket), they have to round on subtotals per tax category.
On 17 Oct 2022, 23:30 +0200, R. Victor Klassen , wrote:
> We encounter the same problem in jurisdictions with tax computed after. Which 
> is to say this problem is not unique to having tax-in pricing advertised.
>
> Where I see it is in bills where the GnuCash rounding differs from that used 
> by the vendor. And it only happens when there are multiple line items in the 
> bill. GnuCash appears to total tax the taxable items and then round and sum 
> the tax, whereas most vendors hereabouts add the taxable items and then 
> multiply by the tax rate and round. Because the “bill” I create within 
> GnuCash is only for internal use, I add a pair of entries - one taxable and 
> one non-taxable, that balance out the amount in Accounts Payable, while 
> adjusting the amount of VAT paid to match that on the bill from the vendor.
>
> In your case, is it making the invoice have the wrong total, or just your 
> internal Accounts Receivable and/or VAT payable? In the latter case you can 
> make an adjusting transaction to fix it. Ugly, and error prone, but possible. 
> At least it only happens  of the time.
>
> > On Oct 17, 2022, at 3:50 PM, Michael or Penny Novack 
> >  wrote:
> >
> > On 10/17/2022 11:03 AM, gnuc...@boeziek.nl wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > > I created a Sales Tax Table entry of 20%.
> > > When I create an Invoice of EUR 109,95 with tax included and select my 
> > > Tax table, GNUCash calculates EUR 18,33 tax and EUR 91,63 in net revenue.
> > > My Accounts Receivable however will not increase by EUR 109,95 but by 
> > > 109,96. So 1 cent difference. (the precise amounts are: sales is EUR 
> > > 91,625 and tax EUR 18,325 and thus both are rounded up)
> > >
> > > Is there a way to have the tax rounded down (by 0,5cent) so that the 
> > > total stays EUR 109,95?
> > > I really prefer to have accounts being 0 at the end of a period, instead 
> > > of all these loose cents adding up (makes reconciliation harder).
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Etienne
> >
> > This is NOT a rounded-up rounded-down issue. It is a when calculated issue 
> > if both a set of items and their sum.
> >
> > Rounded (A+B) does not (necessarily) equal (Rounded A) + (Rounded B) And 
> > how far the distance can become depends on the number of items involved. If 
> > there were a couple dozen items the range of "answers" could vary by 
> > several units. The calculation of "fuzz" is a fine art (when a computer 
> > program is checking for equality between amounts calculated in different 
> > ways the program decides they are equal if the difference between them is 
> > less than the "fuzz" -- and I have had to figure what the correct fuzz 
> > should be in my days in the cypher mines)
> >
> > SO --- what are the actual tax rules of the jurisdiction? If several items 
> > are bought at the same time is the correct VAT the sum of the VAT due for 
> > each item or is it the VAT due on the sum of the items?
> >
> > Michael D Novack
> >
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Re: [GNC] rounding of Invoice vs Accounts Receivable

[Michael or Penny Novack]

@Michael, you pay VAT on the total invoice, but both items already have the VAT 
included on the item line. So the rounding happens at the total level. Else you 
get too big rounding errors (especially supermarkets when you have 9% 
categories and 21% items (e.g. rounding a 9% tax on a 49ct can of tomatoes is 
terrible with a full basket), they have to round on subtotals per tax category.
On 17 Oct 2022, 23:30 +0200, R. Victor Klassen , wrote:


Misunderstanding.

Look, the problem is NOT a gnucash problem. It is NOT a "rounding" 
problem. It is a "politicians are not mathematicians" problem.


The politicians are free to pass legislation saying:

1) VAT will be figured for each item based on the cost of each item.

2) VAT for the total sale will be based on the sum of the cost of each 
item. This total is what the customer is expected to pay.


3) The sum of all in "1" will be the same as the total from "2"

The problem is that this legislation is mathematically inconsistent. "3" 
is not going to be true. It is untrue not because of a rounding error 
but the reality that (rounded A) plus (rounded B) is not necessarily 
equal to rounded (A plus B). In other words, you cannot expect to add up 
a series of rounded terms and have that sum be equal to the the terms 
added without rounding and the sum then rounded. The operation "round" 
lacks the property "distributive" with respect to the operation "add".


Example --- the operations addition and multiplication have the property 
"distributive" so x(A+B) = xA + xB   But the pair of operations "round" 
ans "+" do not have this property. Distribution is a property that a 
pair of operations may or may not have.


Michael D Novack

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[GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Tony Vanson]

I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
grips with my problem.
The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
basis.
My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
subtractions from it?
I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
operates it's obviously not.
Any advice would be much appreciated
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Gyle McCollam]

I would treat it as an asset.  When putting money on the card you would debit 
the card and credit checking or credit card,  however you pay for it.  When 
traveling you would debit tolls or auto expense or similar account and credit 
the card.



Sent from Samsung Galaxy smartphone.



 Original message 
From: Tony Vanson 
Date: 10/18/22 11:54 AM (GMT-05:00)
To: gnucash-user 
Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
grips with my problem.
The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
basis.
My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
subtractions from it?
I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
operates it's obviously not.
Any advice would be much appreciated
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Kevin Reid]

On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 8:54 AM Tony Vanson  wrote:

> Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be
> charged with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a
> regular basis.
> My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
> subtractions from it?
> I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
> operates it's obviously not.


It's an asset — something you have of value — that is measured in dollars.
So, create an Asset account for it. When you top it up, you move money from
your cash account to the toll card account. When you use it to pay tolls,
move money from the toll card account to Expenses:Transportation:Tolls or
whatever expense category makes sense for you.

In my own case I have a category under Assets just for all these restricted
assets that can only be spent on certain things, but that categorization is
up to you.

By the way: The only difference between the way you use this and the way
you use a credit card account is that the payments come before the usage
rather than after. If you were to change GnuCash's setting for “Reverse
balanced accounts” to “None”, then all account types would work the same
way, so that your credit card account would appear as having a negative
balance — because it's a liability, an opposite-of-value to you.
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[devaps]

You can treat it like a pre-paid card, so it resides under Assets.

So you have -

Assets->Bank Account
Assets->Toll pre-paid card
Expenses->Toll

When you top up the card, record a transfer between the 2 asset accounts above.

When you pay toll, record a transfer from Assets->Toll pre-paid card to 
Expenses->Toll.

Cheers.

> Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
> From: Tony Vanson 
> To: gnucash-user 
> Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
> Message-ID:
>   
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
> grips with my problem.
> The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
> Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
> with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
> basis.
> My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
> subtractions from it?
> I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
> operates it's obviously not.
> Any advice would be much appreciated
> *Tony Vanson*
>
>
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Fred Bone]

On 18 October 2022 at 22:54, Tony Vanson said:

> I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
> grips with my problem. The tolling system here is not the automated ones
> I'm used to. Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done,
> must be charged with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with
> cash on a regular basis. My question is what category is this card and how
> do I treat additions and subtractions from it? I initially thought it
> might be treated as a credit card but the way it operates it's obviously
> not. Any advice would be much appreciated *Tony Vanson*

I have
 Assets:Current Assets:Prepaid:Dart-Charge
to which I move funds from (usually) a credit card
and from which I subtract the charges as I incur them.


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Re: [GNC] pre-paid electronic toll card

[Chris Skudder]

   The card, with a cash value on it, is an asset - probably best
   described as a "prepaid expense."
   The fully accurate way to account for it:
   1. When you "put cash onto the card":
   -- credit "cash" (or bank account, or credit card, or wherever you get
   the money that you put onto the toll card)
   -- debit the pre-paid asset account (increasing its value).
   2. When you use some of the balance on the card to pay a toll:
   -- credit the pre-paid asset account (decreasing its value), and
   -- debit an "Expense-tolls" account
   The other way, the simple way, is to just debit "expense- tolls" when
   you "load up" the card.
   This is fewer transactions, less bookkeeping, but it "lumps" all your
   toll expense into a bigger amount and into the date on which you "load"
   the card.
   - Chris
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Today's Topics:

   1.  Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card (Tony Vanson)


--

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
From: Tony Vanson [7]
To: gnucash-user [8]
Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
Message-ID:
[9]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
grips with my problem.
The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
basis.
My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
subtractions from it?
I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
operates it's obviously not.
Any advice would be much appreciated
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*


--

Subject: Digest Footer

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[GNC] Enhancement request: multi-currency accounts

[Anton Tsyganenko]

Let's take a look on accounts that are created in gnucash by default. 
Generally most of the accounts may be multi-currency, i. e. not bond to 
a specific currency: you may have cash in multiple currencies, your 
opening balances may be in multiple currencies, you may have incomes and 
expenses in multiple currencies. Bank accounts generally have only one 
currency, but there are some banks that offer multi-currency cards and 
deposits. These surely can be considered as just a few different 
accounts, but it may be more convenient to group them together.Now I 
solve that by creating sub-accounts for each currency I need for each 
account where I need it. It looks like:

Expenses:Dining:USD
Expenses:Dining:EUR
Expenses:Dining:CAD
Expenses:Transport:USD
Expenses:Transport:EUR
Expenses:Transport:CAD

It's very painful to create all of them. I know that I may have only one 
account in my _main_ currency, but I prefer all currencies to be equal 
and not perform redundant currency conversions, for example when I spend 
CAD cash for dining in Canada.


So my proposal is:

All accounts that user creates are "multi-currency", like placeholder 
accounts without any specific currency. Sub-accounts for each currency 
are created automatically, when the first operation in this currency in 
this account is made. If a multi-currency account is deleted and 
operations are moved to another account, operations in all the 
subaccounts are moved to the corresponding subaccounts of the second 
account. Balances can be shown as a sum of (non-null) amounts in 
different currencies (but sometimes can be converted to one currency). 
In a multi-currency account's view (basic ledger) there should be just 
an additional column -- currency of an operation (editable as a 
drop-down menu). So user opens account "cash" and sees something like:


Date | Description | Transfer | Debit | Credit | Currency | Balance

2022-10-18 | Dinner in a restaurant | Expenses:Dining | | 25 | EUR | 100 
USD + 55 EUR


That operation is a transfer of 25 EUR from Assets:Cash:EUR to 
Expenses:Dining:EUR.


I would be happy to discuss the concept.
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Re: [GNC] Enhancement request: multi-currency accounts

[David Carlson]

This is interesting and it might be an optional configuration for the
automatic account creation wizard, but not for most users who use a single
currency in their accounting.  Also, this is not the usual place to propose
enhancements, but it would be a good place to refine a concept prior to
making an actual proposal.

What do others think?

On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 3:54 PM Anton Tsyganenko 
wrote:

> Let's take a look on accounts that are created in gnucash by default.
> Generally most of the accounts may be multi-currency, i. e. not bond to
> a specific currency: you may have cash in multiple currencies, your
> opening balances may be in multiple currencies, you may have incomes and
> expenses in multiple currencies. Bank accounts generally have only one
> currency, but there are some banks that offer multi-currency cards and
> deposits. These surely can be considered as just a few different
> accounts, but it may be more convenient to group them together.Now I
> solve that by creating sub-accounts for each currency I need for each
> account where I need it. It looks like:
> Expenses:Dining:USD
> Expenses:Dining:EUR
> Expenses:Dining:CAD
> Expenses:Transport:USD
> Expenses:Transport:EUR
> Expenses:Transport:CAD
>
> It's very painful to create all of them. I know that I may have only one
> account in my _main_ currency, but I prefer all currencies to be equal
> and not perform redundant currency conversions, for example when I spend
> CAD cash for dining in Canada.
>
> So my proposal is:
>
> All accounts that user creates are "multi-currency", like placeholder
> accounts without any specific currency. Sub-accounts for each currency
> are created automatically, when the first operation in this currency in
> this account is made. If a multi-currency account is deleted and
> operations are moved to another account, operations in all the
> subaccounts are moved to the corresponding subaccounts of the second
> account. Balances can be shown as a sum of (non-null) amounts in
> different currencies (but sometimes can be converted to one currency).
> In a multi-currency account's view (basic ledger) there should be just
> an additional column -- currency of an operation (editable as a
> drop-down menu). So user opens account "cash" and sees something like:
>
> Date | Description | Transfer | Debit | Credit | Currency | Balance
>
> 2022-10-18 | Dinner in a restaurant | Expenses:Dining | | 25 | EUR | 100
> USD + 55 EUR
>
> That operation is a transfer of 25 EUR from Assets:Cash:EUR to
> Expenses:Dining:EUR.
>
> I would be happy to discuss the concept.
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Re: [GNC] rounding of Invoice vs Accounts Receivable

[Maf. King]

On Tuesday, 18 October 2022 14:34:34 BST Etienne wrote:

> 
> I think for the time being that manual entry in the ledger correcting the
> 1ct will have to do. Hopefully GNC will have some option down the line for
> this.

Unless things have changed in recent versions of GC, that is not the solution, 
IIRC, you should not manually edit anything in the AR or AP registers.

what I do is add a line to the GC invoice before posting - something like

VAT rounding errorTo Account is the VAT account0.01  

hope that makes sense, and if I'm wrong about the manual edit to the register, 
am very happy to be corrected!

cheers,
Maf.



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Re: [GNC] Enhancement request: multi-currency accounts

[Jim DeLaHunt]

Hello, Anton:

On 2022-10-18 02:34, Anton Tsyganenko wrote:
Let's take a look on accounts that are created in gnucash by default. 
Generally most of the accounts may be multi-currency, i. e. not bond 
to a specific currency: you may have cash in multiple currencies, your 
opening balances may be in multiple currencies, you may have incomes 
and expenses in multiple currencies. Bank accounts generally have only 
one currency, but there are some banks that offer multi-currency cards 
and deposits. These surely can be considered as just a few different 
accounts, but it may be more convenient to group them together.Now I 
solve that by creating sub-accounts for each currency I need for each 
account where I need it. It looks like:

Expenses:Dining:USD
Expenses:Dining:EUR
Expenses:Dining:CAD
Expenses:Transport:USD
Expenses:Transport:EUR
Expenses:Transport:CAD


Wow, that looks a lot like my chart of accounts! For my expense 
accounts, I have sub-accounts for each currency that I might use. I am 
up to about five or six currencies in the Expenses:Travel:... accounts.


However, for my Asset and Liability accounts, I chose to break into 
currency at a higher level:


Assets:
Assets:Personal:
Assets:Personal:CAD:Current
Assets:Personal:CAD:Current:Chequing Account in Canada:
Assets:Personal:CAD:Investment
Assets:Personal:CAD:Investment:Brokerage Account in Canada:
Assets:Personal:USD:
Assets:Personal:USD:Current
Assets:Personal:CAD:Current:Chequing Account in USA:
Assets:Self-employed business:
Assets:Self-employed business:CAD:
Assets:Self-employed business:CAD:Current
Assets:Self-employed business:CAD:Current:Business Chequing Account in 
Canada:

Assets:Self-employed business:USD:
Assets:Self-employed business:USD:Current
Assets:Self-employed business:USD:Current:Business Chequing Account in USA:

So, can your proposal work with this kind of structure as well? Or mest 
the division into currencies happen at the lowest level of account?



...So my proposal is:

All accounts that user creates are "multi-currency", like placeholder 
accounts without any specific currency. Sub-accounts for each currency 
are created automatically, when the first operation in this currency 
in this account is made 


How do you "make an operation in this currency"?  Suppose I am entering 
a new transaction: what is the currency of that transaction?  I think 
there is an answer possible, but it needs to be defined.


How do you enter a multi-currency transaction? e.g. I pay for a dinner 
with a EUR price using my CAD credit card. The expense is in EUR, the 
credit card is in CAD, and the card company automatically converts the 
EUR charge to CAD and bills me in CAD. How would I enter that transaction?


If a multi-currency account is deleted and operations are moved to 
another account, operations in all the subaccounts are moved to the 
corresponding subaccounts of the second account. Balances can be shown 
as a sum of (non-null) amounts in different currencies (but sometimes 
can be converted to one currency). In a multi-currency account's view 
(basic ledger) there should be just an additional column -- currency 
of an operation (editable as a drop-down menu). So user opens account 
"cash" and sees something like:


Date | Description | Transfer | Debit | Credit | Currency | Balance

2022-10-18 | Dinner in a restaurant | Expenses:Dining | | 25 | EUR | 
100 USD + 55 EUR


That operation is a transfer of 25 EUR from Assets:Cash:EUR to 
Expenses:Dining:EUR.


I would be happy to discuss the concept.


I agree with David Carlson that this is not the right place to add 
enhancement requests to the queue. They belong at 
. But there is no harm having a preliminary 
discussion about the idea here.


Best regards,
  —Jim DeLaHunt

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Re: [GNC] Enhancement request: multi-currency accounts

[R Losey]

For me, since my salary, bank, and credit cards are in USD, even when I
spend EUR or CAN or AUS, I normally wait until the credit card expense
shows up in USD and enter the USD value.  Often, I will put the actual
local expense on the 2nd line (I don't remember if that is called
Description or Memo in Gnucash).

I said that to say that I think the proposal would generally be useful only
if you actually have bank accounts, credit cards in multiple currencies.


On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 4:19 PM David Carlson 
wrote:

> This is interesting and it might be an optional configuration for the
> automatic account creation wizard, but not for most users who use a single
> currency in their accounting.  Also, this is not the usual place to propose
> enhancements, but it would be a good place to refine a concept prior to
> making an actual proposal.
>
> What do others think?
>
> On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 3:54 PM Anton Tsyganenko <
> anton-tsygane...@yandex.ru>
> wrote:
>
> > Let's take a look on accounts that are created in gnucash by default.
> > Generally most of the accounts may be multi-currency, i. e. not bond to
> > a specific currency: you may have cash in multiple currencies, your
> > opening balances may be in multiple currencies, you may have incomes and
> > expenses in multiple currencies. Bank accounts generally have only one
> > currency, but there are some banks that offer multi-currency cards and
> > deposits. These surely can be considered as just a few different
> > accounts, but it may be more convenient to group them together.Now I
> > solve that by creating sub-accounts for each currency I need for each
> > account where I need it. It looks like:
> > Expenses:Dining:USD
> > Expenses:Dining:EUR
> > Expenses:Dining:CAD
> > Expenses:Transport:USD
> > Expenses:Transport:EUR
> > Expenses:Transport:CAD
> >
> > It's very painful to create all of them. I know that I may have only one
> > account in my _main_ currency, but I prefer all currencies to be equal
> > and not perform redundant currency conversions, for example when I spend
> > CAD cash for dining in Canada.
> >
> > So my proposal is:
> >
> > All accounts that user creates are "multi-currency", like placeholder
> > accounts without any specific currency. Sub-accounts for each currency
> > are created automatically, when the first operation in this currency in
> > this account is made. If a multi-currency account is deleted and
> > operations are moved to another account, operations in all the
> > subaccounts are moved to the corresponding subaccounts of the second
> > account. Balances can be shown as a sum of (non-null) amounts in
> > different currencies (but sometimes can be converted to one currency).
> > In a multi-currency account's view (basic ledger) there should be just
> > an additional column -- currency of an operation (editable as a
> > drop-down menu). So user opens account "cash" and sees something like:
> >
> > Date | Description | Transfer | Debit | Credit | Currency | Balance
> >
> > 2022-10-18 | Dinner in a restaurant | Expenses:Dining | | 25 | EUR | 100
> > USD + 55 EUR
> >
> > That operation is a transfer of 25 EUR from Assets:Cash:EUR to
> > Expenses:Dining:EUR.
> >
> > I would be happy to discuss the concept.
> > ___
> > gnucash-user mailing list
> > gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> > To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
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> > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
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> >
>
>
> --
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rlo...@gmail.com
Micah 6:8
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Re: [GNC] Enhancement request: multi-currency accounts

[William Prescott]

I have a somewhat more chaotic organization. Almost all my income is in USD and 
almost all my expenses are MXN. I have a top level Expense account for Pesos 
and another for Dollars with lots of subaccounts under them.

I have multiple bank accounts in both currencies and quite often have 
transactions with one side in one currency and the other side in the other 
currency. I transfer money between banks both within and across currencies. And 
occasionally I will spend money in one currency that is reimbursed in the 
other. GnuCash handles it all really cleanly, but it did take me a little time 
to figure out how it worked when I started.

Will

On 2022 Oct 18, at 10-18 19:45:56, R Losey  wrote:

For me, since my salary, bank, and credit cards are in USD, even when I
spend EUR or CAN or AUS, I normally wait until the credit card expense
shows up in USD and enter the USD value.  Often, I will put the actual
local expense on the 2nd line (I don't remember if that is called
Description or Memo in Gnucash).

I said that to say that I think the proposal would generally be useful only
if you actually have bank accounts, credit cards in multiple currencies.


On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 4:19 PM David Carlson 
wrote:

> This is interesting and it might be an optional configuration for the
> automatic account creation wizard, but not for most users who use a single
> currency in their accounting.  Also, this is not the usual place to propose
> enhancements, but it would be a good place to refine a concept prior to
> making an actual proposal.
> 
> What do others think?
> 
> On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 3:54 PM Anton Tsyganenko <
> anton-tsygane...@yandex.ru>
> wrote:
> 
>> Let's take a look on accounts that are created in gnucash by default.
>> Generally most of the accounts may be multi-currency, i. e. not bond to
>> a specific currency: you may have cash in multiple currencies, your
>> opening balances may be in multiple currencies, you may have incomes and
>> expenses in multiple currencies. Bank accounts generally have only one
>> currency, but there are some banks that offer multi-currency cards and
>> deposits. These surely can be considered as just a few different
>> accounts, but it may be more convenient to group them together.Now I
>> solve that by creating sub-accounts for each currency I need for each
>> account where I need it. It looks like:
>> Expenses:Dining:USD
>> Expenses:Dining:EUR
>> Expenses:Dining:CAD
>> Expenses:Transport:USD
>> Expenses:Transport:EUR
>> Expenses:Transport:CAD
>> 
>> It's very painful to create all of them. I know that I may have only one
>> account in my _main_ currency, but I prefer all currencies to be equal
>> and not perform redundant currency conversions, for example when I spend
>> CAD cash for dining in Canada.
>> 
>> So my proposal is:
>> 
>> All accounts that user creates are "multi-currency", like placeholder
>> accounts without any specific currency. Sub-accounts for each currency
>> are created automatically, when the first operation in this currency in
>> this account is made. If a multi-currency account is deleted and
>> operations are moved to another account, operations in all the
>> subaccounts are moved to the corresponding subaccounts of the second
>> account. Balances can be shown as a sum of (non-null) amounts in
>> different currencies (but sometimes can be converted to one currency).
>> In a multi-currency account's view (basic ledger) there should be just
>> an additional column -- currency of an operation (editable as a
>> drop-down menu). So user opens account "cash" and sees something like:
>> 
>> Date | Description | Transfer | Debit | Credit | Currency | Balance
>> 
>> 2022-10-18 | Dinner in a restaurant | Expenses:Dining | | 25 | EUR | 100
>> USD + 55 EUR
>> 
>> That operation is a transfer of 25 EUR from Assets:Cash:EUR to
>> Expenses:Dining:EUR.
>> 
>> I would be happy to discuss the concept.
>> ___
>> gnucash-user mailing list
>> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
>> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
>> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
>> -
>> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
>> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
>> 
> 
> 
> --
> David Carlson
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> 


-- 
_
Richard Losey
rlo...@gmail.com
Micah 6:8
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Tony Vanson]

Thank you Devaps, that clears my head 🤕

On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 11:25 PM  wrote:

> You can treat it like a pre-paid card, so it resides under Assets.
>
> So you have -
>
> Assets->Bank Account
> Assets->Toll pre-paid card
> Expenses->Toll
>
> When you top up the card, record a transfer between the 2 asset accounts
> above.
>
> When you pay toll, record a transfer from Assets->Toll pre-paid card to
> Expenses->Toll.
>
> Cheers.
>
> > Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
> > From: Tony Vanson 
> > To: gnucash-user 
> > Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
> > Message-ID:
> >   <
> cacnjauczzekyqroourhg7fkga7nf7s0r_zlndhys74318gh...@mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
> >
> > I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
> > grips with my problem.
> > The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
> > Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be
> charged
> > with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a
> regular
> > basis.
> > My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions
> and
> > subtractions from it?
> > I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
> > operates it's obviously not.
> > Any advice would be much appreciated
> > *Tony Vanson*
> >
> >
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-- 
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[devaps]

   Glad to hear your problem is resolved, Tony.
   Cheers.
   Sent using the mobile mail app
   On 19/10/22 at 9:45 AM, Tony Vanson wrote:
   From: "Tony Vanson" 
   Date: 19 October 2022
   To: dev...@asia.com
   Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   Subject: Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
   Thank you Devaps, that clears my head 🤕
   On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 11:25 PM <[1]dev...@asia.com> wrote:

 You can treat it like a pre-paid card, so it resides under Assets.
 So you have -
 Assets->Bank Account
 Assets->Toll pre-paid card
 Expenses->Toll
 When you top up the card, record a transfer between the 2 asset
 accounts above.
 When you pay toll, record a transfer from Assets->Toll pre-paid card
 to Expenses->Toll.
 Cheers.
 > Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
 > From: Tony Vanson <[2]tonyvan...@gmail.com>
 > To: gnucash-user <[3]gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
 > Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
 > Message-ID:
 >
 <[4]CACnjAucZzeKyqrOOUrHg7Fkga7Nf7S0R_zLNDHYs74318GH_EQ@mail.gmail.c
 om>
 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
 >
 > I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to
 get to
 > grips with my problem.
 > The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
 > Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must
 be charged
 > with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a
 regular
 > basis.
 > My question is what category is this card and how do I treat
 additions and
 > subtractions from it?
 > I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the
 way it
 > operates it's obviously not.
 > Any advice would be much appreciated
 > *Tony Vanson*
 >
 >
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 [5]gnucash-user@gnucash.org
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 -
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   Tony Vanson
   The older I get,
   the better I was

References

   1. mailto:dev...@asia.com
   2. mailto:tonyvan...@gmail.com
   3. mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   4. mailto:cacnjauczzekyqroourhg7fkga7nf7s0r_zlndhys74318gh...@mail.gmail.com
   5. mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   6. https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
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