Re: [Goanet]Re: Freedom Fighters.
From: eric pinto [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: goanet@goanet.org To: goanet@goanet.org Subject: Re: [Goanet]Re: Freedom Fighters. Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 05:55:24 -0700 (PDT) The issue here is hate-speech, both Veronica and 'Bernardo' have vaulted that line. There are Christian states that would have stripped them of their citizenship, and i suspect Mr. Macao is not one to start with: to borrow from him - innit !! Veronica can worship in an Indian temple, he may not be present at 'Lebanese' Mass in a Kuwait church. Hitler was preceeded and backed by a vanguard of Goebbels, Doctor Mengellas and Speers. It is a tragedy that we are compelled to offer our fascists a forum they simply do not deserve.eric. My dear unworthy detractors of true Goan history and political evolution, The beads on the new, Luminous mysteries-included, rosary would hardly surfice to enumerate, my cherished and revered hindu friends and mentors, stalwart freedom fighters all... Most of them were not the registered 'freedom fighters' nor ever sought mercenary benefits... Shankar Bandhari, Mohan Karapurkar, Ravidra Kellekar, Laxman Rao Sardessai, several stout Dessais most lamentably departed all of them... Those amongst us: Gurunath Kellekar and many of his ilk also dito. Without these Goa would have been a (sub?) collectorate of Maharashtra ere long since, granted that any of the Maharashtrian colectorates are considerably larger, area- and populationwise, than Goa of the sixties. And, as many catholics. Why do so many fellow-netters find it so difficult to believe that there can not have been freedom fighters that neither cherished pompous fame/notoriety nor sought monetary gains? Willie is hardly unique in this category: Aloysius Soares, Armando Menezes, Edoardo Sousa, Sacru (Sally) Sobrinho, Isidorio Carvalho, Antonio Sequeira, among legion others, readily, and most nostalgically, spring to mind. If any doubt my claims, I can supply details, often of the Scarlet Pimpernel genre, about each and one of them. In fact, I think I will do so sometime. When Armando Menezes contested the South Goa Lok Sabha seat vs Erasmo Sequeira, he made Loutulim (his brother-in-law, Jose Torcato Sa's place) his headquarters. There I received first real awareness of democracy. Pukka gentleman that he was, Armando never attempted to win us over from our, often frenetical, United Goaness. On the contrary he willingly, with great gusto, coached us on how to drive the Maharahstrawaddis crazy, but using more Wodehousian antics than the bloody ones employed by the pre-Shiv Sena goondas that had been inflicted upon a rather unwilling Dayanand Bandodkar. Those were the days when the fledgling Navihind Times came out with three issues on a single day, the last one only released in the afternoon, with the editorial A Dangerous Hoax. About Willie and Froilano Machado, I received independent corroboration from Professor Armando Menezes, as he remisced about eralier times. Armando, I distinctly reacall, mentioned both Willie and Froilano as having been prominent among the student activists at Darwar. The Vassant Molio (a good friend) freedom fighters are the once that we have most come to know. None of them joined our Margao to Cabo Rajnivas padyatra, organized by Shenkar and led by Ravindr or the jyoti (flame) that we carried through most of the MG bastions, the valliant Shabu Dessai leading. These two events more than any other, turned to tempo and tide in favour of DON PANN'A. For the matter of record, Vassant Mollio should be required to give a public account of how he came about his printing press off the Station Rd, Margao. I have many such skeletons from many a cupboard at my call and recall. Beware! B'amon Alfred
Re: [Goanet]Re: Freedom Fighters.
The issue here is hate-speech, both Veronica and 'Bernardo' have vaulted that line. There are Christian states that would have stripped them of their citizenship, and i suspect Mr. Macao is not one to start with: to borrow from him - innit !! Veronica can worship in an Indian temple, he may not be present at 'Lebanese' Mass in a Kuwait church. Hitler was preceeded and backed by a vanguard of Goebbels, Doctor Mengellas and Speers. It is a tragedy that we are compelled to offer our fascists a forum they simply do not deserve.eric. --- George Pinto [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- A. Veronica Fernandes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Let it be known to everyone and to everywhere in the Goan World that for the good cause of Goa only the Christians worked and fought hard though the benefits of their hard work and hard fought battles were enjoyed by those who were watching from distance silently. The liberty to post on Goanet should not be treated as a license to post bigoted fiction based on religious chauvinism. Apologies to non-Christian members of this forum who had to read the post above. Regards, George __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
[Goanet]Re: Freedom Fighters.
--- A. Veronica Fernandes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Let it be known to everyone and to everywhere in the Goan World that for the good cause of Goa only the Christians worked and fought hard though the benefits of their hard work and hard fought battles were enjoyed by those who were watching from distance silently. The liberty to post on Goanet should not be treated as a license to post bigoted fiction based on religious chauvinism. Apologies to non-Christian members of this forum who had to read the post above. Regards, George
RE: [Goanet]RE: Freedom Fighters.
Hi all, I agree with what Tom and Carolina, that Dr. Wilie, whateve else he may be, is not a 'casteist'; I also agree that 'Freedom Fighter' is a matter of interpretation. Accordingly I announce myself as a 'Freedom Fighter'. I have never stated such a claim before. However I will not make any claim for special awards or pensions or any favours from the Govt. or the Community, unlike the many fake? freedom fighters who have added their names to the list during Mr. Parrikars torrid communal reign. At the time when Morarji Dessai was Ch. Mantri of the earstwhile Bombay State, a meeting was convened, at the Greens Hotel, at Apollo Bunder, Bombay. The Forum was titled: Focus On Goa. The Greens Hotel was where the new Taj Tower Bldg. now stands. It had beautifl views of the Gateway of India, and the harbour; this was the time when Bombay was really and truly beautiful; unlike now, when one has to run far and wide in search of beauty unencumbered! I was present at this forum and the nationalist in me had me support and vote for the actions as a whole, taken at its conclusion. At this meeting were present, besides the Ch Minister, Valerian Cardinal Gracious, prof. Aloysius Soares, prof. Armand Menezes, prof. Roque Correa Afonso, Dr. Simon Fernandes who at one time was Mayor of Bombay; among others whose names I cannot recollect, right now, (and sadly I was surprised there were no hindus from Goa); and a host of other small people like me. It was concluded at this forum, that instead of waiting for the Govt. to send an army, to liberate Goa; the people volunteers should walk into Goa peacefully; that was called 'Sathyagraha! This was the first ever effort made publicly to discuss the regime in Goa and bring about freedom. I had also secretly enrolled to go into Goa and get views etc from the local people, so as to gauge the public opinion on this; and we had to go thru the south of Goa, via Majali, in Karwar, on foot, thru no man's land et al; Within a month or two, came into being the first 'Sathyagrahis' marching in; and who were the sathyagrahis? they were the unemployed poor people from Maharastra (not Goa) and the Portuguese had no trouble after giving adequate warnings, to fire at these people and martyr them; This is the infamous incident of 'Do Do Marg! Then came in Nehru with his insulting words to a rep. of the Time Mazagine. and so on it went, until the day Krishna Menon's army marched in. Peaceful march soon turned into war like action and finally war! See, I can also call myself a Freedom Fighter too! Nasci Caldeira Melbourne From: Tom Carolina goanet@goanet.org Subject: [Goanet]RE: Freedom Fighters. Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 21:30:39 -0400 Freedom Fighters. The Portuguese government during the 50's and on the 19th. December 1961 was a dictatorship, and if I am not mistaken the Late Dr. oliveira Salazar was in power. At that particular time anyone accused of posting a simple anti-portuguese poster was considered a criminal and languished in portuguese jails in Aquada for over 8 to 10 years. After the liberation of Goa there were many who claimed to be freedom fighters. Some claimed that they had fought for freedom from other parts of India. There were also others who wrote books and letters against the portuguese from Bombay and if they had the courage to visit Goa, jail was imminent. Concluding how to define a freedom fighter is a matter of enterpretation. Tom de Sousa in Hong Kong
[Goanet]RE: Freedom Fighters.
Freedom Fighters. The Portuguese government during the 50's and on the 19th. December 1961 was a dictatorship, and if I am not mistaken the Late Dr. oliveira Salazar was in power. At that particular time anyone accused of posting a simple anti-portuguese poster was considered a criminal and languished in portuguese jails in Aquada for over 8 to 10 years. In aldona the village from where I was born and brought up there were 3 youngsters in around the age of 20 and three school teachers who were all jailed and suffered a lot of beatings that words cannot mention. There were also others in jail who were more aggressive and were also jailed for far longer periods. After the liberation of Goa there were many who claimed to be freedom fighters. Some claimed that they had fought for freedom from other parts of India. There were also others who wrote books and letters against the portuguese from Bombay and if they had the courage to visit Goa, jail was imminent. Concluding how to define a freedom fighter is a matter of enterpretation. Tom de Sousa in Hong Kong
