Re: [Goanet] Freedom (by Armando Menezes, 1902-1983)

[Venantius J Pinto]

Hi V M—
“A dance along an endless lane.”
Awesome.

Contemplating / Birthing a book of poetry? Perhaps annotated!
If yes, consider me to design the cover and perhaps pieces within.
But, and I say this in utter sincerity—only if the selection is truly
strong,
and there is sufficient time allotted.

+

Anyone?

Thank you,
—vjp



On Tue, Aug 15, 2017 at 1:23 AM, V M  wrote:

> Freedom
>
> Freedom is but a madman's dream,
> A dance along an endless lane.
> The slogans that you shout but seem
> To drown the clanging of the chain.
>
> Freedom is but a posturing,
> Before a necromantic glass;
> The old old song you newly sing,
> Falsetto, like an infant class.
>
> Freedom is greed, is violence,
> Lust, and the lordship of the fool.
> Freedom's not knowing either whence
> Or whither, or if chance be the rule.
>
> We dreamed, and now wake up from sleep:
> And dark indeed the day to see
> When Freedom's image cannot keep
> Even a poet's loyalty.
>

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters

[Vivian A. DSouza]

Hear tell that 90 percent of so-called Freedom Fighters are fake.  All they 
care for is the free pension.  Since the Portuguese were driven out 52 years 
ago, the current crop of so-called Freedom Fighters were tiny tots at the 
time.  The real Freedom Fighters would be Octogenerians or Nonogenerians 
if still alive.


Vivian A. DSouza
socorrokar at yahoo.com 

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters

[eric pinto]

        Rolly - i knew guys who refused to pay at eating places
because  i am Vietnam.  He now personified that war. Only,
this 'fighter' is not likely to admit that he was stoned on cheap smokes and 
barely performed  in the field.
       The cause in Goa cannot be questioned. 
       The question to ask is who decided to turn it into a no 
losers lottery stake.        eric.



On Thursday, November 28, 2013 10:22 AM, roland.francis 
roland.fran...@ymail.com wrote:
 
If Goa Police fought crime and Goa Firefighters fought fires, what did Goa 
Freedom Fighters fight?

Roland.


Sent from Samsung Mobile

Re: [Goanet] freedom fighters

[Gabe Menezes]

On 11 March 2013 23:21, manuel tavares duk...@bell.net wrote:

 Hi Gabe,
 It is a profound shame that our Goan brothers and sisters who die without
 adequate representation or destitute have to go through such humiliation at
 their final exit. I am sure that we can do better. I am surprised that the
 elderly Goan bachelor from Mombasa had to be perhaps buried in a pauper's
 grave despite having funds and this in a country like the U.K. where one
 would expect there to be better facilities for the authorities to
 coordinate information regarding funds etc in order to afford a person a
 burial utilizing his own funds.Tell me something Gabe, did you try to
 assist this poor soul and if so, could you publish the procedure so as to
 assist future such cases? I think we as a community should also establish a
 fund to ensure that our brothers and sisters who die in dire circumstances
  in any part of the world do receive a decent burial.
 I would not hesitate to contribute to such a fund.


 Manuel (Eddie) Tavares.


RESPONSE: I had in the past helped the man in question. I was on vacation
in Goa when he died. I was informed that a person who was intimate with him
was taking care of the whole committal. That being the case everyone stood
back and waited and waited. It is now three months since the passing away
and all calls to the person concerned are deflected. There has been no
notice of the Death let alone the funeral in the local GVUK. What I have
heard came from a good source but cannot be verified.

-- 
DEV BOREM KORUM

Gabe Menezes.

Re: [Goanet] freedom fighters

[Victor Rangel-Ribeiro]

Dear Gabe,
 You write: We had to help our parents as well as our children. The next 
generation are not obliged. And that is indeed a shame, but not all members of 
the next generation behave in such an uncaring manner.
 Regards,
 Victor

--- On Wed, 3/6/13, Gabe Menezes gabe.mene...@gmail.com wrote:

From: Gabe Menezes gabe.mene...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Goanet] freedom fighters
To: Goa's premiere mailing list, estb. 1994! goanet@lists.goanet.org
Date: Wednesday, March 6, 2013, 5:23 AM

On 26 February 2013 21:57, manuel tavares duk...@bell.net wrote:

 Regarding to Eugene Correia's Article:

 It is a pity that Laura has ended in this state. I had the privilege to
 attend her Lecture, when she came  to Kenya with Prof Lucio Rodrigues. She
 was elegant in her white Sari and spoke so well and passionately. Perhaps
 as you say, in old age, she was overcome by maladies which affect the human
 brain. It was very disheartening to learn that the Goa Freedom Fighters
 Association did not issue a condolence message. Perhaps it is as
 Shakespeare put it . The Evil that we do lives after us the good is oft'
 interred with our bones. So let it be with Laura. For those who knew her,
 her passion and devotion to the cause of Goa's Liberation cannot be
 forgotten and perhaps history will be kind to her and afford her her
 rightful place in Goa's Dossier.

 Manuel (Eddie) Tavares.


COMMENT: It is not just a pity but a profound tragedy when kith and kin
will not come forward to do the right thing. At lease she got a burial with
all rites performed. Here is an announcement courtesy GVUK:-

*Looking For: Family of Eluina Louzado (Nairobi)*
5 Mar: Goan Welfare Society, Nairobi. Mrs Eluina Louzado, aged 86 passed
away recently in in Nairobi. Her Baptism name is Josephine. Her children
are Gregory, William and Freda and are believed to be in the UK. Please
contact by  Email gwsnew...@gmail.com


Then there is the case of an elderly Bachelor Goan who died in St. George's
Hospital Tooting,( Ex Mombasa) nobody knows whether he was given a decent
burial - there is talk that he was given a pauper's grave along with 12
others. The Goans of Tooting know about this man and I find it hard to
believe that no one approached the Goan Welfare Service for assistance. He
did not die penniless, he had two people as co signatories on his Bank
accounts - I know his because he had told me so.


The time has come, that one should not rely on children or family. My
generation was caught with a double whammy, we had to help our parents as
well as our children. The next generation are not obliged.


-- 
DEV BOREM KORUM

Gabe Menezes.

Re: [Goanet] freedom fighters

[Gabe Menezes]

On 7 March 2013 13:13, Victor Rangel-Ribeiro vrangel...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Dear Gabe,
  You write: We had to help our parents as well as our children. The
 next generation are not obliged. And that is indeed a shame, but not all
 members of the next generation behave in such an uncaring manner.
  Regards,
  Victor


Deart Victor,

You are indeed correct and both Lily and I are fortunate to have brought up
our two sons having good morals. We hope they stay that way. I was ghastly
that  Laura's daughter intimated to the Nuns that she could not help her
mother Laura. Then there was a word sent by the grand daughter and a son in
Canada stating that they would intervene. Alas she had to be buried by the
Nuns.

Now hopefully Mrs Louzado of Nairobi will be buried by her children,
otherwise the burden will surely fall on the Nairobi Goan Welfare Service.

The London, Tooting incident is an indictment on not only the Goans of
Tooting but in a way on all Goans residing in London and especially the
powers that be within the Goan Community here in the U.K.

-- 
DEV BOREM KORUM

Gabe Menezes.

Re: [Goanet] freedom fighters

[Gabe Menezes]

On 26 February 2013 21:57, manuel tavares duk...@bell.net wrote:

 Regarding to Eugene Correia's Article:

 It is a pity that Laura has ended in this state. I had the privilege to
 attend her Lecture, when she came  to Kenya with Prof Lucio Rodrigues. She
 was elegant in her white Sari and spoke so well and passionately. Perhaps
 as you say, in old age, she was overcome by maladies which affect the human
 brain. It was very disheartening to learn that the Goa Freedom Fighters
 Association did not issue a condolence message. Perhaps it is as
 Shakespeare put it . The Evil that we do lives after us the good is oft'
 interred with our bones. So let it be with Laura. For those who knew her,
 her passion and devotion to the cause of Goa's Liberation cannot be
 forgotten and perhaps history will be kind to her and afford her her
 rightful place in Goa's Dossier.

 Manuel (Eddie) Tavares.


COMMENT: It is not just a pity but a profound tragedy when kith and kin
will not come forward to do the right thing. At lease she got a burial with
all rites performed. Here is an announcement courtesy GVUK:-

*Looking For: Family of Eluina Louzado (Nairobi)*
5 Mar: Goan Welfare Society, Nairobi. Mrs Eluina Louzado, aged 86 passed
away recently in in Nairobi. Her Baptism name is Josephine. Her children
are Gregory, William and Freda and are believed to be in the UK. Please
contact by  Email gwsnew...@gmail.com


Then there is the case of an elderly Bachelor Goan who died in St. George's
Hospital Tooting,( Ex Mombasa) nobody knows whether he was given a decent
burial - there is talk that he was given a pauper's grave along with 12
others. The Goans of Tooting know about this man and I find it hard to
believe that no one approached the Goan Welfare Service for assistance. He
did not die penniless, he had two people as co signatories on his Bank
accounts - I know his because he had told me so.


The time has come, that one should not rely on children or family. My
generation was caught with a double whammy, we had to help our parents as
well as our children. The next generation are not obliged.


-- 
DEV BOREM KORUM

Gabe Menezes.

Re: [Goanet] freedom fighters

[manuel tavares]

Regarding to Eugene Correia's Article:

It is a pity that Laura has ended in this state. I had the privilege to attend 
her Lecture, when she came  to Kenya with Prof Lucio Rodrigues. She was elegant 
in her white Sari and spoke so well and passionately. Perhaps as you say, in 
old age, she was overcome by maladies which affect the human brain. It was very 
disheartening to learn that the Goa Freedom Fighters Association did not issue 
a condolence message. Perhaps it is as Shakespeare put it . The Evil that we do 
lives after us the good is oft' interred with our bones. So let it be with 
Laura. For those who knew her, her passion and devotion to the cause of Goa's 
Liberation cannot be forgotten and perhaps history will be kind to her and 
afford her her rightful place in Goa's Dossier. 

Manuel (Eddie) Tavares.

Re: [Goanet] freedom fighters

[floriano lobo]

Ana Maria,
You are absolutely right, one hundred per cent.
Goa's freedom fighters are just freedole farters. One of them who calls 
himself a veteran FF is Flavian Dias. The only fight for Goa he did was to 
deliver press notes and press statements issued by Goan activists pushing 
Goa's liberation from Bombay to the offices of the newspaper there and to 
beg with  Nehru to throw the Portuguese out and take Goa into India for 
free. Useless people not worth talking about. If at all these guys and gals 
had self-respect, they would have held Nehru to his promises of not wanting 
to force Goans join Indian Union if they did not want to. But when Nehru saw 
these LEMBDES with their tongues out for dole, he took advantage of it all 
and annexed Goa into India without the mandatory Plebiscite under UN 
Charter. And yes, their pensions must be stopped and retrospectively 
re-claimed. Dr Laura D'Souza Rodrigues who recently died a destitute in 
Mumbai was the real Goa's Freedom Fighter and was even arrested by the 
Portuguese in Goa when she marched into Goa before the so called liberation. 
She never got any pension but punks like Flavian Dias did and are rolling in 
it.
At most these people have fallen to Nehrus feet and/ or Bandodkar's feet for 
Goa's merger into India and Maharashtra respectively.
Look at East Timor. They are free and independent people today in spite of 
Indonesia having occupied and played havoc with them. Timoreans have guts. 
Our Goan Freedom fighters had only knees strong enough to go down begging 
for pensions.

SHAME ON THEM ALL. They have let Goa and Goans down miserably.

Cheers
floriano
goasuraj
PS: The first thing GSRP will do when it comes to power is to stop all 
pensions to these fake freedom fighters and most probably recover everything 
retrospectively.





- Original Message - 
From: Ana Maria Fernandes amferns_n...@hotmail.com

To: goanet@lists.goanet.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2013 10:37 PM
Subject: [Goanet] freedom fighters


Mahtma Gandhi , Nehru and others really fought for the freedom of India and 
because of their efforts the British thought it wise to leave India into the 
hands of Indians and they went away.But in Goa some freedom might have made 
noise, meetings etc but it was the Indian army marched into the territory 
and used force Goa was liberated. Actually the Portuguese did not sign any 
documents and what actually took place was capture of the territory by 
force. I do not know if later on any treaty was signed and that is the 
reason all those who are born before 1961 are portuguese citizen. It is 
wrong to give awards to goan freedom fighters or pension .I am not hurting 
any one but these are my personal views.If I am wrong i want to say sorry i 
am wrong . I am not a lawyer, I was born much after all these fiasco and am 
not a portuguese citizen but I feel and want to know what others feel. 
= 

Re: [Goanet] Freedom of Press does not give licence to a newspaper to malign a political leader or mar his future political prospects by publishing fake and defamatory writings.

[amar kantak]

Dear Mr. Colaco,
 
Thank you for sharing my view. It is because of like minded people like us that 
society remains civilised and equilibrium is maintained. My salutations to you. 
Take care.
 
Amar

--- On Sat, 4/14/12, J. Colaco  jc cola...@gmail.com wrote:


From: J. Colaco  jc cola...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Goanet] Freedom of Press does not give licence to a newspaper to 
malign a political leader or mar his future political prospects by publishing 
fake and defamatory writings.
To: Goa's premiere mailing list, estb. 1994! goanet@lists.goanet.org
Cc: f...@goa-india.org
Date: Saturday, April 14, 2012, 3:28 AM


Under the title,  Freedom of Press does not give licence to a
newspaper to malign a political leader or mar his future political
prospects by publishing fake and defamatory writings,

amar kantak kanta...@yahoo.com wrote:

The fundamental objective of journalism is to serve the people with
news, views, comments and information on matters of public interest in
a fair, accurate, unbiased, sober and decent manner. To this end, the
Press is expected to conduct itself in keeping with certain norms of
professionalism, universally recognised.

The norms enunciated below and other specific guidelines appended
thereafter, when applied with due discernment and adaptation to the
varying circumstance of each case, will help the journalist to
self-regulate his or her conduct. etc etc

COMMENT:

Dear Mr. Kantak,

You are very right.

ALL of us (and that includes the 3 Ps i.e. Press, Politicians and
Public) have to exercise due care that we do not either Slander or
Libel another.

BTW: Slander or Libel are not loose words. They have specific
meanings. So does the word malign.

Let us remember that while a free press is a pillar of democracy (just
like freedom of speech for the public) there is a fine line between
freedom and excessive license.

Democracies around the world, allow a certain amount of latitude to
the Politicians and Press. Comedians (cartoonists) get an extra
latitude. Whatever our tolerance, it has got to be the same whether
the criticism (say) is about Mr. Parrikar or (to use an example) Mrs.
Gandhi.

Somehow, we appear not to be as equitable as we should be ... when
our chaps are sticking it to the other chaps.

In the INDEX case, IF what was reported is accurate, I would recommend
that the GUJ president please resign.

jc

Re: [Goanet] Freedom of Press does not give licence to a newspaper to malign a political leader or mar his future political prospects by publishing fake and defamatory writings.

[J. Colaco jc]

Under the title,  Freedom of Press does not give licence to a
newspaper to malign a political leader or mar his future political
prospects by publishing fake and defamatory writings,

amar kantak kanta...@yahoo.com wrote:

The fundamental objective of journalism is to serve the people with
news, views, comments and information on matters of public interest in
a fair, accurate, unbiased, sober and decent manner. To this end, the
Press is expected to conduct itself in keeping with certain norms of
professionalism, universally recognised.

The norms enunciated below and other specific guidelines appended
thereafter, when applied with due discernment and adaptation to the
varying circumstance of each case, will help the journalist to
self-regulate his or her conduct. etc etc

COMMENT:

Dear Mr. Kantak,

You are very right.

ALL of us (and that includes the 3 Ps i.e. Press, Politicians and
Public) have to exercise due care that we do not either Slander or
Libel another.

BTW: Slander or Libel are not loose words. They have specific
meanings. So does the word malign.

Let us remember that while a free press is a pillar of democracy (just
like freedom of speech for the public) there is a fine line between
freedom and excessive license.

Democracies around the world, allow a certain amount of latitude to
the Politicians and Press. Comedians (cartoonists) get an extra
latitude. Whatever our tolerance, it has got to be the same whether
the criticism (say) is about Mr. Parrikar or (to use an example) Mrs.
Gandhi.

Somehow, we appear not to be as equitable as we should be ... when
our chaps are sticking it to the other chaps.

In the INDEX case, IF what was reported is accurate, I would recommend
that the GUJ president please resign.

jc

Re: [Goanet] Freedom fighters or fraudsters/Let us move forward to retain what is left of GOA to be ruled by Good Goans not Goonies - REST IS FRILLS AND LACES as Marion Pereira would say!

[Oscar Lobo]

Hi Bernado

What do we know about this man – Tristao de Braganca Cunha? And why do 
we only blame the Hindus in Goa for the so called “Liberation of Goa”?


Best

Oscar C. Lobo.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goan_Catholics#Notable_Goan_Catholics

Tristão de Bragança Cunha

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search


Tristão de Bragança Cunha
Tristão de Bragança Cunha (sometimes spelled as Tristao de Braganza 
Cunha) (1891 -1958) was a prominent nationalist and anti-colonial 
activist from Goa (then part of Portuguese India, now modern India).


He is popularly known as the Father of Goan nationalism, and organizer 
of the first movement to liberate Goa from Portuguese rule.


[edit] Biography

Cunha was born on April 2, 1891 in the village Chandor in Goa. He 
complete his school education in Panjim and then went to Pondicherry to 
French College for his B.A. and then to Paris. There he studied at the 
Sorbonne University and obtained a degree in electrical engineering. In 
Paris, Cunha entered the circle of Romain Rolland and helped publicize 
the Indian independence movement generally, and the case of Portuguese 
India in particular, in the French-language press.


Cunha returned to Goa in 1926 and he set up the Comissão do Congresso de 
Goa (Goa Congress Committee) in Goa in 1928 to organize the Goan 
intelligentsia against Portuguese colonial rule. Pressured by Portuguese 
authorities, Cunha transferred operations to Bombay and in 1938, 
affiliated his organization with the Indian National Congress. He 
continued publicizing the Goan case in a stream of articles and books, 
denouncing Portuguese rule. Among his publications were booklets Four 
Hundred Years of Foreign Rule and The Denationalization of Goans (1944). 
Cunha was an advocate of Goan identification, political as well as 
cultural, with greater India.


In 1946, Cunha helped organize the famous assembly in Margão, inviting 
the INC speaker Ram Manohar Lohia to address what was arguably the first 
and largest mass gathering yet, setting in motion the Goa liberation 
movement. Along with the other organizers, Cunha was arrested by the 
Portuguese authorities in 1946. He was kept in dark damp cell at Fort 
Aguada. He was the first civilian to be tried by a military tribunal. He 
was court-martialed and sentenced to eight years imprisonment. He was 
deported to the Peniche prison in Portugal.


After his release from Portugal in 1954, Cunha returned to Bombay. Cunha 
formed and headed the Goa Action Committee, to help coordinate the 
numerous Goan liberation organizations that had emerged by this time. He 
published a newspaper called Free Goa.


He died on September 28, 1958, Loknayak Jaiprakash Narayan was one of 
the pallbearers. The Government of India issued a postage stamp in his 
honour.


[edit] References

[1]
[2]
[edit] External References

[3] Glória ao Herói no Quarto Aniversário da Morte de Tristão de 
Brangança Cunha - Poem by Visnum Porobo Sincró commemorating the fourth 
anniversary of Cunha Bragança's death (Portuguese)

Persondata
Name
Cunha, Tristao De Braganza
Alternative names

Short description

Date of birth
1891
Place of birth

Date of death
1958
Place of death

Re: [Goanet] Freedom fighters or fraudsters/Let us move forward to retain what is left of GOA to be ruled by Good Goans not Goonies - REST IS FRILLS AND LACES as Marion Pereira would say!

[Bernado Colaco]

Hi Oscar,

I blame all those Goans involved in the events of 61. Recently I 
challenged Valmiki Faleiro (Patroitism in Action) for eulogizing those 
Goans who were involved in the armed actions of 61. Chaps like Braganca 
etc were naive and donkeys. Today only full autonomy will save Goa under 
a Special Administrative region system. Putting good candidates up for 
elections is only a waste of time and money. Instead all efforts must be 
made to radicalize young Goans to fight the various dangers faced by our 
motherland, specially against those singing Jai Ram.


Regards

BC




Subject: RE: Freedom fighters or fraudsters/Let us move forward to 
retain what is left of GOA to be ruled by Good Goans not Goonies - REST 
IS FRILLS AND LACES as Marion Pereira would say!


Hi Bernado

What do we know about this man – Tristao de Braganca Cunha? And why do 
we only blame the Hindus in Goa for the so called “Liberation of Goa”?


Best

Oscar C. Lobo.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goan_Catholics#Notable_Goan_Catholics

Tristão de Bragança Cunha

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search


Tristão de Bragança Cunha
Tristão de Bragança Cunha (sometimes spelled as Tristao de Braganza 
Cunha) (1891 -1958) was a prominent nationalist and anti-colonial 
activist from Goa (then part of Portuguese India, now modern India).


He is popularly known as the Father of Goan nationalism, and organizer 
of the first movement to liberate Goa from Portuguese rule.

Re: [Goanet] Freedom fighters or fraudsters/Let us move forward to retain what is left of GOA to be ruled by Good Goans not Goonies - REST IS FRILLS AND LACES as Marion Pereira would say!

[Santosh Helekar]

How many characters are there in Goa who want to make Goa special 
administrative region of China? One or two?

Cheers,

Santosh



--- On Sat, 1/15/11, Bernado Colaco ole_...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

 Hi Oscar,
 
 I blame all those Goans involved in the events of 61.
 Recently I challenged Valmiki Faleiro (Patroitism in Action)
 for eulogizing those Goans who were involved in the armed
 actions of 61. Chaps like Braganca etc were naive and
 donkeys. Today only full autonomy will save Goa under a
 Special Administrative region system. Putting good
 candidates up for elections is only a waste of time and
 money. Instead all efforts must be made to radicalize young
 Goans to fight the various dangers faced by our motherland,
 specially against those singing Jai Ram.
 
 Regards
 
 BC
 


  

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters in Goa

[Tony de Sa]

Another Genuine Freedom Fighter and a great benefactor of teachers whom I
was closely associated with was the late Ravindranath Pai Raiturkar who for
a number of years headed the All Goa Secondary School Teachers Association
(AGSSTA).

Mr. Ravindra Pai Raiturkar refused to accept the Tamra Patra and a Freedom
Fighters Pension.

He headed the Teachers Association when the very fact that you joined the
Association was enough to give you the pink slip. Those were days in which
teachers had no job security - you could have your services terminated with
one months notice or a month's salary in lieu of notice without assigning
any reason. Some managements used this clause to suppress any organized
teachers movement. I know because I started teaching in those days way back
in 1969.

Raiturkar not only headed the teachers movement, but gave it a firm and
fixed direction. He was a tough negotiator and was a great champion of
teachers causes. It was under his Presidentship that managements were given
100 percent grant towards teachers salaries. This was achieved not without a
tough fight which included a torchlight march to Panjim from all corners of
Goa. Later on he fought and succeeded in getting teachers salaries paid
through banks. This prevented unscrupulous managements from making illegal
deductions from teachers salaries.

In one particular incident, Mr. Bonfilho da Cruz was the Director of
Education when the Directorate was housed in the Massano de Amorim building.
The office bearers and a few selected members of AGSSTA entered the
Director's cabin and laid siege to it. This was the first time that teachers
in Goa had resorted to a gherao

As in the seventies there was a great shortage of teachers, he was
responsible for getting teachers trained on deputation. This meant that they
would be paid full salaries during their teachers training course.

Mr. Ravindranath Pai Raiturkar deserves to be called a worthy son of Goa.


-- 
  \\\
Tony de Sa
tonyd...@gmail.com
M   : +91 9975 162 897
Ph. : +91 832 2470 148

^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters in Goa

[Tony de Sa]

 From: Rajesh Dessai goy...@gmail.com
To: goanet@lists.goanet.org
Subject: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters in Goa

Reply sent off list

-- 
  \\\
 Tony de Sa
  tonyd...@gmail.com
   M   : +91 9975 162 897
   Ph. : +91 832 2470 148

^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters in Goa

[floriano]

That a Man [ which we normally say 'Ata Man' ]

Yes dear Rajesh. You are that man who did not claim the FF's title when 
released from Jail in 1961.
And what you say is correct. There were hardly any freedom fighters in jail 
then but hard core as well as petty criminals. I believe Dayanand Bandodkar 
was one of them too. But his crime( as I am told) was that the Portuguese 
thought he was suspected to have been involved in harbouring the cross 
border satyagrahis which has blown off some mining machinery at that time. 
And Bandodkar was a mine owner himself.  And I am also told that DB also 
claimed the FF's status initially but withdrew from the same on good advice.


By any chance was DB with you? It is believed that DB wrote a clandestine 
letter to the Commandant of the Jail ratting on the satyagrahis (naming 
them) so that he could be in good books with the jailors and be released. As 
far as I know, this is authentic information. By any chance have you heard 
of it while in Jail??


We appreciate your strainght-forwardness. We all get involved in petty 
crimes sometime or the other.Even a well deserved  'punching of some idiot's 
nose and bloodying it'  is a crime now a days. The punishment then ( during 
the Portuguese regime) was hard and savage. Today, it is Amul Maska ( if one 
has the right connections or the right number of currency bills in the 
pocket) and that is why we have so many crimes and so many criminal to the 
extent that our very own legislators in the Legislative Assemblies and in 
our august Parliament are hard core criminals. Can any thing more be said on 
this??



Welcome to Goa. We need people like you now, before all is lost forever.

Cheers
floriano
goasuraj
9890470896
www.goasu-raj.org


GOA does not only need HONEST persons to contest elections, and,
Goa does not only need HONEST  voters to elect honest persons.
But GOA mainly needs an 'HONEST SYSTEM of GOVERNANCE'.
Wherein, even a dishonest person is forced to be honest  or to QUIT.
Such HONEST SYSTEM is knocking at GOA's portals.
A 'PRECIOUS GIFT' to GOA by committed GOANS.
A  'GIFT HORSE'  that must not be looked in the mouth.

PPS=PEOPLE for POLITICAL SANITY
Display the 'PPS' sticker on your vehicle today, to reject political madness 
tomorrow.





- Original Message - 
From: Rajesh Dessai goy...@gmail.com

To: goanet@lists.goanet.org
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 11:13 AM
Subject: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters in Goa



Today I read a post by Tony De Sa about his relations being freedom
fighters imprisoned at the Aguada Jail.  Can Tony please tell me the
names of his relatives who were in the jail at that time?  I would
like to know and catch up with my fellow inmates if they are still
around.

I have been a prisoner in that jail from 1958 till the liberation of
Goa.  I know most of the prisoners who were there in jail with me, and
none of us were 'freedom fighters'  Later on I heard that some  of the
chalu prisoners were claiming to be freedom fighters, and I have
always been wondering how that could be possible.  The prisoners that
I remember were in jail for real crimes, some small, some big.  It was
our lucky day to be released from jail by the India govt.  I had 3
more years to go.  Later, these chalu fellows applied for ff pension.
some got tamrapatras.  And I just laugh.

I was young at that time, and made many mistakes in my life.  And I
paid a big price for it, and learned from my mistakes. I am not proud
of my youth, and after my release from jail I moved to Sawantwadi as
my family were not happy with me. Now I am retired and am back in Goa.
It has changed.

Raj

Rajesh Dessai 

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters

[Marshall Mendonza]

Jose Colaco:
BTW Marshall, Where did you find this info that Nehru was a 'sick man' soon
after the Indo-China war?. Wasn't the event which culminated in his death in
1964, a sudden one?

Response:
After so many years I am unabIe to pinpoint the exact source. Whenever I
have time, I will try and trace the source. However, I recollect reading in
either Lt Gen B M Kaul's (The Untold Story) or M O Mathai's (My days with
Nehru) or maybe M C Chagla's(Roses in December) or Brig John Dalvi's
(Himalayan Blunder) book that the Chinese invasion took Nehru completely by
surprise especially after all that Hindi-Chini bhai- bhai stuff after the
Panchasheel declaration. The utter defeat of the Indian army and the loss of
territory to the Chinese broke Nehru's spirit. He was not his normal self
after that and was a broken man. He slowly deteriorated in health and mind
which culminated in his death in 1964. The exact cause of his death is
neither here nor there and he well have died from a heart failure. I am open
to correction.

Regards,

Marshall

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters

[J. Colaco jc]

Marshall Mendonza wrote

[1] the Chinese invasion took Nehru completely by surprise especially
after all that Hindi-Chini bhai- bhai stuff after the
Panchasheel declaration. The utter defeat of the Indian army and the
loss of territory to the Chinese broke Nehru's spirit. He was not his
normal self after that and was a broken man.

[2] He slowly deteriorated in health and mind which culminated in his
death in 1964.

[3] The exact cause of his death is neither here nor there and he well
have died from a heart failure. I am open
to correction.

==
jc comment:

Marshall is quite correct about #1, but not so about # 2.

re #3; The death was following an acute (sudden) event. The term
heart failure is too general, but this is not the forum for a
discussion on that topic.

Having said that, allow me to say this: Nehru was guided by his
side-kick, the lefty Krishna Menon. Nehru was also a politician who
(like ALL politicians) did everything (including make ANY promises) to
get what he wanted. The invasion of Goa was part of the political
expediency at the time. Anytime a governing party is at risk of losing
an election, expect a war or some anti-other religion nonsense, a
bogus VideoCD, or the laying of foundation stones for projects which
have not a farthing's chance of commencing in the next 10 years.

While Nehru may have made that speech about 'wanting to preserve the
identity of Goa', he did absolutely nothing to ensure that. If  he was
serious about it - he would have organised it in the ANNEXATION
document itself. But, he did not. Now, if Marshall knows otherwise for
sure, I am open to correction.

BTW: Goa Freedom Fighter, journalist and author, the now late Lino
Leitão had something to say about that this in  his piece on TGF.
http://www.colaco.net/1/nizgoemcar.htm

jc

Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters

[Alfred de Tavares]

Was'nt it in 1963 Nehru died?

 

AT
 
 Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 18:44:54 +0530
 From: mmendonz...@gmail.com
 To: goanet@lists.goanet.org
 Subject: Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters
 
 Jose Colaco:
 BTW Marshall, Where did you find this info that Nehru was a 'sick man' soon
 after the Indo-China war?. Wasn't the event which culminated in his death in
 1964, a sudden one?
 
 Response:
 After so many years I am unabIe to pinpoint the exact source. Whenever I
 have time, I will try and trace the source. However, I recollect reading in
 either Lt Gen B M Kaul's (The Untold Story) or M O Mathai's (My days with
 Nehru) or maybe M C Chagla's(Roses in December) or Brig John Dalvi's
 (Himalayan Blunder) book that the Chinese invasion took Nehru completely by
 surprise especially after all that Hindi-Chini bhai- bhai stuff after the
 Panchasheel declaration. The utter defeat of the Indian army and the loss of
 territory to the Chinese broke Nehru's spirit. He was not his normal self
 after that and was a broken man. He slowly deteriorated in health and mind
 which culminated in his death in 1964. The exact cause of his death is
 neither here nor there and he well have died from a heart failure. I am open
 to correction.
 
 Regards,
 
 Marshall

_
Drag n’ drop—Get easy photo sharing with Windows Live™ Photos.

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Re: [Goanet] Freedom Fighters

[Santosh Helekar]

--- On Sun, 6/28/09, J. Colaco  jc cola...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 re #3; The death was following an acute (sudden) event. The
 term heart failure is too general, but this is not the forum
 for a discussion on that topic.
 

I had heard many years ago as a medical student that Nehru died from a ruptured 
aortic aneurysm, the existence of which his personal physician, the eminent 
cardiologist Rustom Jal Vakil was aware of, and was courageous enough to tell 
him long before his death. I have not been able to confirm this through any 
authentic source. The official position is that he died of a stroke. Vakil also 
knew that Muhammed Ali Jinnah was suffering from lung cancer. But he kept it a 
secret because of patient-physician confidentiality. I have been able to 
confirm the latter through the medical literature.

Cheers,

Santosh


  

Re: [Goanet] Freedom fighters etc

[J. Colaco jc]

Just heard from Alfredo the day before yesterday.

He is with his family in Montevideo, Uruguay

jc

==

2009/6/25 Luis Vas luissr...@gmail.com:
Those debating the above subject may be interested in the link below
for  Alfredo de Mello's article on an aspect of the subject. By the
way is he  still alive?


 http://www.abbefaria.com/Abbe%20Faria%20Conspiracy.htm

Re: [Goanet] Freedom fighter week

[edward desilva]

* G * O * A * N * E * T  C * L * A * S * S * I * F * I * E * D * S *


  Renew your wedding vows in Goa,
  or gift a Ceremony Package to a close couple

Multiple options to make your day extra special!
http://www.renewalsetc.com


Reply to Message: 11 Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 05:53:08 -0800 (PST) From: Samir 
Kelekar who said:
Nachna na jane, aangan tedha. For a person with a warped vision, the world 
looks warped.
Dont blame it on freedom fighters; you who ran away from your responsibilities  
as a citizen are responsible for the above.
--
Hi,
Just because I have a Christian name and am an NRG (tough if you are jealous of 
my NRG status).
You seem to have a notion that, unless I come to Goa, take my trousers down and 
pi** and Sh** on the streets of Panjim and the Beaches I'm not one of your 
peers.
Alternatively been a freedom fighter.
--
Let me tell you a 'factual' traumatising experience I had to deal with (still 
do) in Goa with Freedom Fighters of Goa, when I was young.
A Goan gentleman who worked in the State Bank of India in Mumbai (Bombay), 
Retired and was living in Goa on his Indian State pension.
Freedom fighters came to his door and demanded money from him for their cause.
They said to him you have to support us because you are eating Indian money, we 
need some of it (a lot actually).
He said I do not have that kind of money I live on small pension. They told him 
they didn't care.
HE DID NOT KNOW WHAT WAS COMING TO HIM.
Next NIGHT they came for their money - he had none.
THEY SHOT HIM.
Goa freedom fighters? - lots of respect for human kind? - now want my tax money 
to eat sitting at home?
ED.


  

Re: [Goanet] Freedom

[Gabriel de Figueiredo]

--- On Sat, 16/8/08, Albert Desouza [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Whether
 you buy a TV, micro wave one does not know what is the
 actual price for the dealer looks at you and your needs and
 also goan mentality and fires a price which normally is four
 times more that the price sold in Delhi. 

Don't know about microwaves or TVs, but Duracells in Delhi were 2 * cost of the 
same package obtained in Goa, last April. And in Agra? 3 * the cost - the 
printed price was craftily cut off or blacked out. 




  Win a MacBook Air or iPod touch with Yahoo!7. 
http://au.docs.yahoo.com/homepageset

Re: [Goanet] FREEDOM FIGHTERS OR CHORS/CRIMIDORS?

[Frederick Noronha]

Hi AVF: Your fulminations against freedom fighters seems aimed at
basically (i) pointing to the dubious elements among them (and
obviously there would have been, more so with so many benefits being
created in the post-1961 territory) (ii) discrediting freedom-fighters
as a community (iii) somehow questioning an existing reality (the end
of Portuguese rule) and a situation which, while it may cause mental
disquiet for you, actually benefits the majority of people in Goa. Not
just Hindus, but the bulk of Christians who got it rough in
underdeveloped Portuguese times. (Or, as anthropologist Robert S
Newman would say, in feudal colonial times, compared to bourgeois
capitalist post-1961).

While you accuse very many Hindu freedom fighters of being fanatic
Hindus ... (wanting) to turn Goa into a Hindu Raj, the fact remains
that much of the little sorrow over the end of Portuguese rule stems
from a misplaced Catholic 'loss of power', which stems from the
perceived break in sharing the religion of the ruler!

A closer reading of history would reveal that there were groups which
were influenced by the Hindutva position (the Azad Gomantak Dal stands
out here, maybe Teo could correct me), and the RSS had to catch up on
lost time because of its almost total lack of involvement in the
anti-colonial movement against the British. (This also explains, in
part, though local factors cannot be forgotten, for the rise of the
MGP in post-1961 Goa.) But to simplify things to the level you do
simply isn't credible. -FN

PS: The Marathi masters you talk about were brought in mainly as
temple priests some 200-300 years ago. Ashok Row Kavi, writing in the
Week around 1987 (language controversy time) has a good exposition of
the relations between them and Goan Hindu society...

While concluding I demand apology from the Freedom Fighters Association in
Goa for the robberies, murders and other dirty acts the rascal freedom
fighters have committed in Goa in the name of freedom movement. Worst of the
crimes and brutalities against Goans during the Portuguese regime were
committed not by Portuguese soldats and Agente Monteiro but by the Chor
and Crimidor freedom fighters.

A. Veronica Fernandes,
Kuwait.
-- 
--
Frederick 'FN' Noronha   | Yahoomessenger: fredericknoronha
http://fn.goa-india.org| +91(832)2409490 Cell 9822122436
--
2248 copylefted photos from Goa: http://www.flickr.com/photos/fn-goa/
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