Re: [Goanet] ravindra kelekar

[Frederick Noronha]

Dear Floriano, Again, to disagree

Konkani did not get a "bad deal for 450 years of Portuguee rule". 
However inconvenient it might be to admit this, there were some phases 
of Portuguese rule which were helpful to Konkani. The vast literature 
created in the Romi script is a pointer to this. (Of course, some might 
feel today that the Romi script was a diversion *away* from the real 
Konkani, but that is another point.)


Saraswat Hindu support for Konkani seems to be a post-20th century 
phenomenon, largely. Like the Catholics, who support the language for 
reasons other than linguistic (in my view), the Saraswat Hindus also 
have complex reasons for their support to the language.


Please see something I had written on language politics in Goa:
http://www.mail-archive.com/goanet-n...@lists.goanet.org/msg00067.html

Obviously, there's more than meets the eye. FN


floriano wrote:

Rico,
I appreciate your inputs. However, Konkani got the bad deal for 450 
years of the Portuguese rule. At the same time, Marathi  was something 
else.
How that happened if Konkani was at the heart of Goan Saraswats, I fail 
to understand. Either the numbers were ignorable or nobody cared enough.
It is a fact that Konkani is much alive in the Hindu world because of 
Saraswats, perhaps.
When I wrote below, I was talking of the overview from the mainstream 
Hindu point of view, which cannot be denied.
Konkani is the lingua franca and/or most  widely sponken language of Goa 
enough with the die-hard Marathi protagonists,  Marathi being the 
literary and the religious language. Why Konkani suffered so badly is 
the question that perplexes me.

Re: [Goanet] ravindra kelekar

[floriano]

Rico,
I appreciate your inputs. However, Konkani got the bad deal for 450 years of 
the Portuguese rule. At the same time, Marathi  was something else.
How that happened if Konkani was at the heart of Goan Saraswats, I fail to 
understand. Either the numbers were ignorable or nobody cared enough.
It is a fact that Konkani is much alive in the Hindu world because of 
Saraswats, perhaps.


When I wrote below, I was talking of the overview from the mainstream Hindu 
point of view, which cannot be denied.
Konkani is the lingua franca and/or most  widely sponken language of Goa 
enough with the die-hard Marathi protagonists,  Marathi being the literary 
and the religious language. Why Konkani suffered so badly is the question 
that perplexes me.


Cheers
floriano
goasuraj
9890470896
www.goasu-raj.org for expanded scrolling Party Presentation on the Home 
Page.




- Original Message - 
From: "Frederick Noronha" 

To: "Goa's premiere mailing list, estb. 1994!" 
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 1:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Goanet] ravindra kelekar



floriano wrote:
costs. Practically the Goan Hindu world believed to the contrary i.e. 
that

Konkani was a dialect of Marathi and therefore of no consequence. This
wide-spread attitude of the Goan Hindu world made  Ravindra Kelekar
altogether a laughing stalk

Re: [Goanet] ravindra kelekar

[Frederick Noronha]

floriano wrote:

costs. Practically the Goan Hindu world believed to the contrary i.e. that
Konkani was a dialect of Marathi and therefore of no consequence. This
wide-spread attitude of the Goan Hindu world made  Ravindra Kelekar
altogether a laughing stalk


Floriano,

This isn't quite true. The attitude of diverse groups in Goa towards the 
Konkani-Marathi divide is more complex than that.


The Hindu Saraswat has been on the (mostly devanagari) Konkani side, 
since at least the mid-20th side, and since  "Shenoy Goembab" (quotes 
because that was his pen-name).


Check this article below, a contentious piece by Ashok Row Kavi, who 
gives one point of view on a complex subject:

http://www.mail-archive.com/goanet@lists.goanet.org/msg21732.html

Catholics and Hindu Saraswats, in other words, supported Konkani in the 
1980s, but arguably for entirely differing reasons. FN

Re: [Goanet] ravindra kelekar

[floriano]

COMMENTS:

Let me relate some tidbits that I have been told about this  still living
great Konkani Language scion - Ravindra Kelekar.

1963-1965 he immersed himself to defend Goa's heritage, it's Language
KONKANI and thereby mount a fight against Bandodkar's Merger of Goa into
Maharashtra. It is believed that there were only a handful of persons [ 4 to
5] who were with him, believing in what he believed, i.e.  that KONKANI is
the bonafide LANGUAGE of Goans and therefore it must be preserved at all
costs. Practically the Goan Hindu world believed to the contrary i.e. that
Konkani was a dialect of Marathi and therefore of no consequence. This
wide-spread attitude of the Goan Hindu world made  Ravindra Kelekar
altogether a laughing stalk A member of the Indian National Congress, he got
his break when young and vibrant Victoria Fernandes wanted to try her hand
at politics, approached him at the Congress House. One thing led to another
and gauging her burning desire to do something, Ravindra Kelekar challenged
her to muster a strenght of just 10 to fifteen women. When she shot back "I
will get 50",  he was a little skeptical. But spektical no more when she
came to him with 50 women who wanted to do something, and thereafter the
fight never dimmed, especially with 'NAVI XHALA' a potent Konkani
publication. Enter Manoharai Sardesai, a graduate of Sorborne Uninversity,
France, Shankar Bhandari of Cumbarjua, Udai Bhembre and possibly other few
stalwarts for Konkani and against Merger, the fight was now rolling.

Today's  Goadoot edition has brought out a piece on Dr. Euclido Manuel
Francisco Ramiro D'Souza, born 3 February 1921; died 31 July, 2010, another
die-hard Konkani protagonist from Cuncolim who still, it is believed, has
the house name plate announcing the name as SESHGIRI SURIA VAMSHI. Ravidra
Kelekar, no doubt will be honoured after his death to be standing side by
side   Dr. Euclido Manuel Francisco Ramiro D'Souza  for their achievements
for GOA in the company of the Goan stalwart  Francisco Luis Gomes who, it is
said that  when prompted by the great French poet Lamartin as to who he was,
had replied that he a person who comes from the race who composed Mahabarata
and who gave the game of Chess to the world.

There always have been a clear 'earning' in my heart to visit Ravindra
Kelekar and have a one to one chat with him. Therefore, a year or so ago, I
did manage to get a slot to meet with him at his Priol  spread accompanied
by my colleague in the party, Dr. N.S. Dumo, who has always held Ravindra
Kelekar in highest of esteem for what he has done for Konkani and for Goa
vis a vis Merger. In Dr. Dumo's own words "I have grown up a total Goan but
with the background of Marathi. And I had thought that Ravindra Kelekar's
fight for Konkani was such a waste of time, until I realized that Konkani
did have a statutory place as Goa's Official Language - My hats off to him".
However, the meeting was a 'damp squib' and a big disapointment for a person
who want to see the Goa fighters glow,  as I found that frail but still
alert Ravindra Kelekar only wanted  to bask in the glory of his creditable
achievements for Konkani and for Goa and had no more stamina to likewise
bring about the downfall of his own dear Congress Party who was destroying
his dear dear Goa for which he has incessantly fought so hard. And I wonder
if he ever did have a moment of spare time or the desire to leaf through the
'Road Map for GOA' that I had presented to him and when he had promised to
go through it and let me know what he thought of it.

However, I shall keep my memoirs alive of having met and talked to this
great Goan Scion and I shall certainly pay my last respects to him when the
time comes for him to depart, all for Goa and  for Konkani.

Cheers
floriano
goasuraj
9890470896
www.goasu-raj.org for expanded scrolling Party Presentation on the Home
Page.



- Original Message - 
From: "Shiv Kumar" 

To: "raju nayak" ; 
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2010 10:38 AM
Subject: [Goanet] ravindra kelekar



The Tribune has a profile of Ravindra Kelekar. No I haven't written it.

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2010/20100808/edit.htm#5

shiv kumar