Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

2012-01-29 Thread Tabitha Roder 
On 28 January 2012 17:28, Steve Thomas  wrote:

> Just found this: http://people.csail.mit.edu/pgbovine/python/
>
> This tool looks like an amazing tool for someone who already understands
programming concepts to teach with but it seems a stretch for someone to
learn on their own with this tool by itself.
The first example code is "aliasing" but doesn't explain what a variable
is, or a function, or a list. It might be possible to discover these
concepts using the simulator but it is probably better explained in words.
Does anyone know of a suitable ebook or tutorial which the simulator could
be used with? Thinking of the cases where there is no one to guide the
student.
Thanks
Tabitha
___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

2012-01-29 Thread Alan Kay 
Hi Tabitha

I don't think the premise of this system is for Python programming to be 
"discovered" while doing it, and I didn't see any claims for this. 


It simple "makes the invisible more visible" when manipulating computer 
entities and invoking processes that are usually shrouded at best.

Systems like Etoys and Scratch need this particular visualization less because 
they have mostly visible objects that are being given behaviors (and which also 
in Etoys' case have visible data structures -- e.g. "Holders" etc -- as well). 
The programmers can see the changes in the already visible objects. (That is 
partly the point in how they are designed for beginners.)


But these systems use a lot of parallel invocations, so one could imagine a 
facility like Bob Balzer's EXDAMS (in the 60s!) that captured all of the 
behavior for a stretch and allow it to be played forward and backward 
deterministically to help the programmer understand what was going on and the 
communications between objects.

I think the main point here is that it really helps any programmer, and 
especially beginners, when the computer can be used to aid both their short 
term memories and abilities in visualizing the consequences of their code.

A system like the Python visualizer is especially useful for low-level 
imperative-type data structure munging programming (and Python is often learned 
in this way).

Cheers,

Alan


>
> From: Tabitha Roder 
>To: Steve Thomas  
>Cc: iaep  
>Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 1:29 AM
>Subject: Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python
> 
>
>On 28 January 2012 17:28, Steve Thomas  wrote:
>
>Just found this: http://people.csail.mit.edu/pgbovine/python/
>>
>>This tool looks like an amazing tool for someone who already understands 
>>programming concepts to teach with but it seems a stretch for someone to 
>>learn on their own with this tool by itself. 
>The first example code is "aliasing" but doesn't explain what a variable is, 
>or a function, or a list. It might be possible to discover these concepts 
>using the simulator but it is probably better explained in words. 
>Does anyone know of a suitable ebook or tutorial which the simulator could be 
>used with? Thinking of the cases where there is no one to guide the student. 
>Thanks
>Tabitha
>
>___
>IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
>IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
>http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
>
>___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

2012-01-29 Thread STEPHEN JACOBS 
If you haven't seen Teagueduino yet, it's worth a look as a system that does a 
good job of making the invisible visible, especially parts of the programming 
interface that show you the signals/voltages in the chip being set high or low 
when things run.  The two pictures of the editor in the article below show some 
of this.


http://www.open-electronics.org/teagueduino-making-things-really-simple/
On Jan 29, 2012, at 8:55 AM, Alan Kay wrote:

> Hi Tabitha
> 
> I don't think the premise of this system is for Python programming to be 
> "discovered" while doing it, and I didn't see any claims for this. 
> 
> It simple "makes the invisible more visible" when manipulating computer 
> entities and invoking processes that are usually shrouded at best.
> 
> Systems like Etoys and Scratch need this particular visualization less 
> because they have mostly visible objects that are being given behaviors (and 
> which also in Etoys' case have visible data structures -- e.g. "Holders" etc 
> -- as well). The programmers can see the changes in the already visible 
> objects. (That is partly the point in how they are designed for beginners.)
> 
> But these systems use a lot of parallel invocations, so one could imagine a 
> facility like Bob Balzer's EXDAMS (in the 60s!) that captured all of the 
> behavior for a stretch and allow it to be played forward and backward 
> deterministically to help the programmer understand what was going on and the 
> communications between objects.
> 
> I think the main point here is that it really helps any programmer, and 
> especially beginners, when the computer can be used to aid both their short 
> term memories and abilities in visualizing the consequences of their code.
> 
> A system like the Python visualizer is especially useful for low-level 
> imperative-type data structure munging programming (and Python is often 
> learned in this way).
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Alan
> From: Tabitha Roder 
> To: Steve Thomas  
> Cc: iaep  
> Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 1:29 AM
> Subject: Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python
> 
> On 28 January 2012 17:28, Steve Thomas  wrote:
> Just found this: http://people.csail.mit.edu/pgbovine/python/
> 
> This tool looks like an amazing tool for someone who already understands 
> programming concepts to teach with but it seems a stretch for someone to 
> learn on their own with this tool by itself. 
> The first example code is "aliasing" but doesn't explain what a variable is, 
> or a function, or a list. It might be possible to discover these concepts 
> using the simulator but it is probably better explained in words. 
> Does anyone know of a suitable ebook or tutorial which the simulator could be 
> used with? Thinking of the cases where there is no one to guide the student. 
> Thanks
> Tabitha
> 
> ___
> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
> IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
> 
> ___
> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
> IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

2012-01-29 Thread Caryl Bigenho 

Hi All…


I took a look at this last night and agree with Tabitha that it is definitely 
not a stand-alone way to learn Python.  I have also looked at, Pippy, and the 
ebook "Byte of Python" (among others), and the the Khan Academy videos for 
learning Python.


It would be great if some master teacher of CS could put together a course 
syllabus using these free online resources that we could use to learn this 
handy, popular language.  


My programming days ended in the 80s with Pascal. I would love to learn Python 
and be able to create Activities for Sugar.  But with my busy schedule (and 
adult ADHD) I really need someone to give structure to my efforts.


I'll bet there are lots of other folks out there in the same boat… well… maybe 
without the ADHD!


Caryl
From: itprofjac...@gmail.com
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2012 10:08:31 -0500
To: alan.n...@yahoo.com
CC: tabi...@tabitha.net.nz; iaep@lists.sugarlabs.org; sthom...@gosargon.com
Subject: Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python



If you haven't seen Teagueduino yet, it's worth a look as a system that does a 
good job of making the invisible visible, especially parts of the programming 
interface that show you the signals/voltages in the chip being set high or low 
when things run.  The two pictures of the editor in the article below show some 
of this.

http://www.open-electronics.org/teagueduino-making-things-really-simple/
On Jan 29, 2012, at 8:55 AM, Alan Kay wrote:Hi Tabitha
I don't think the premise of this system is for Python programming to be 
"discovered" while doing it, and I didn't see any claims for this. 

It simple "makes the invisible more visible" when manipulating computer 
entities and invoking processes that are usually shrouded at best.
Systems like Etoys and Scratch need this particular visualization less because 
they have mostly visible objects that are being given behaviors (and which also 
in Etoys' case have visible data structures -- e.g. "Holders" etc -- as well). 
The programmers can see the changes in the already visible objects. (That is 
partly the point in how they are designed for
 beginners.)

But these systems use a lot of parallel invocations, so one could imagine a 
facility like Bob Balzer's EXDAMS (in the 60s!) that captured all of the 
behavior for a stretch and allow it to be played forward and backward 
deterministically to help the programmer understand what was going on and the 
communications between objects.
I think the main point here is that it really helps any programmer, and 
especially beginners, when the computer can be used to aid both their short 
term memories and abilities in visualizing the consequences of their code.
A system like the Python visualizer is especially useful for low-level 
imperative-type data structure munging programming (and Python is often learned 
in this way).
Cheers,
Alan
From: Tabitha Roder 
 To: Steve Thomas  
Cc: iaep  
 Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 1:29 AM
 Subject: Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python
   

On 28 January 2012 17:28, Steve Thomas  wrote:

Just found this: http://people.csail.mit.edu/pgbovine/python/
This tool looks like an amazing tool for someone who already understands 
programming concepts to teach with but it seems a stretch for someone to learn 
on their own with this tool by itself. 

The first example code is "aliasing" but doesn't explain what a variable is, or 
a function, or a list. It might be possible to discover these concepts using 
the simulator but it is probably better explained in words. 

Does anyone know of a suitable ebook or tutorial which the simulator could be 
used with? Thinking of the cases where there is no one to guide the student. 
Thanks
Tabitha


___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

  ___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
  ___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

2012-01-29 Thread Steve Thomas 
Caryl,

So what activity would you like to create.  Let me know and I will be glad
to spend time teaching you how to create it in Etoys.



Tabitha,

As to learning Python, you need multiple tools and multiple course syllabus
depending on the learner and the content.  This would definitely be one of
the tools I use as Alan said "it makes the invisible visible" and the
ability to step forward and *backward* at your own pace over and over,
would be a great aide for many learners.

For books/resources besides the one's Caryl mentioned:

   1. *Think Python*: How to Think Like a Computer
Scientist
   2. The Python tutorial 
   3. Google's Python
Class

It would be great if we could put together some of these ideas and lessons,
combined with a tool like The Online Python
Tutor for
kids to get started learning Python on the XO.  We could even put Think
Python and the Python documentation on school servers for those kids
interested in learning more.

Stephen

On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Caryl Bigenho wrote:

>  Hi All…
>
>
> I took a look at this last night and agree with Tabitha that it is
> definitely not a stand-alone way to learn Python.  I have also looked at,
> Pippy, and the ebook "Byte of Python" (among others), and the the Khan
> Academy videos for learning Python.
>
>
> It would be great if some master teacher of CS could put together a course
> syllabus using these free online resources that we could use to learn this
> handy, popular language.
>
>
> My programming days ended in the 80s with Pascal. I would love to learn
> Python and be able to create Activities for Sugar.  But with my busy
> schedule (and adult ADHD) I really need someone to give structure to my
> efforts.
>
>
> I'll bet there are lots of other folks out there in the same boat… well…
> maybe without the ADHD!
>
>
> Caryl
>
> --
> From: itprofjac...@gmail.com
> Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2012 10:08:31 -0500
> To: alan.n...@yahoo.com
> CC: tabi...@tabitha.net.nz; iaep@lists.sugarlabs.org;
> sthom...@gosargon.com
>
> Subject: Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python
>
> If you haven't seen Teagueduino yet, it's worth a look as a system that
> does a good job of making the invisible visible, especially parts of the
> programming interface that show you the signals/voltages in the chip being
> set high or low when things run.  The two pictures of the editor in the
> article below show some of this.
>
>
> http://www.open-electronics.org/teagueduino-making-things-really-simple/
> On Jan 29, 2012, at 8:55 AM, Alan Kay wrote:
>
> Hi Tabitha
>
> I don't think the premise of this system is for Python programming to be
> "discovered" while doing it, and I didn't see any claims for this.
>
> It simple "makes the invisible more visible" when manipulating computer
> entities and invoking processes that are usually shrouded at best.
>
> Systems like Etoys and Scratch need this particular visualization less
> because they have mostly visible objects that are being given behaviors
> (and which also in Etoys' case have visible data structures -- e.g.
> "Holders" etc -- as well). The programmers can see the changes in the
> already visible objects. (That is partly the point in how they are designed
> for beginners.)
>
> But these systems use a lot of parallel invocations, so one could imagine
> a facility like Bob Balzer's EXDAMS (in the 60s!) that captured all of the
> behavior for a stretch and allow it to be played forward and backward
> deterministically to help the programmer understand what was going on and
> the communications between objects.
>
> I think the main point here is that it really helps any programmer, and
> especially beginners, when the computer can be used to aid both their short
> term memories and abilities in visualizing the consequences of their code.
>
> A system like the Python visualizer is especially useful for low-level
> imperative-type data structure munging programming (and Python is often
> learned in this way).
>
> Cheers,
>
> Alan
>
>   --
> *From:* Tabitha Roder 
> *To:* Steve Thomas 
> *Cc:* iaep 
> *Sent:* Sunday, January 29, 2012 1:29 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python
>
> On 28 January 2012 17:28, Steve Thomas  wrote:
>
> Just found this: http://people.csail.mit.edu/pgbovine/python/
>
> This tool looks like an amazing tool for someone who already understands
> programming concepts to teach with but it seems a stretch for someone to
> learn on their own with this tool by itself.
> The first example code is "aliasing" but doesn't explain what a variable
> is, or a function, or a list. It might be possible to discover these
> concepts using the simulator but it is probably better explained in words.
> Does anyone know of a suitable ebook or t

Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

2012-01-29 Thread Thomas C Gilliard 

Sugar-Activity   Python Tute-29  (#4476) looks nice also.

"Easy to follow interactive tutorial for Python and Pygame."


  http://download.sugarlabs.org/activities/4476/python_tute-29.xo

runs on f16-SoaS v6 (Sugar 0.94.1); XO-1 os833 (sugar 0.94.1) ; and 
sugar 0.88 running in Debian squeeze.


Tom Gilliard
satellit_

On 01/29/2012 09:29 AM, Caryl Bigenho wrote:


Hi All…


I took a look at this last night and agree with Tabitha that it is 
definitely not a stand-alone way to learn Python.  I have also looked 
at, Pippy, and the ebook "Byte of Python" (among others), and the the 
Khan Academy videos for learning Python.



It would be great if some master teacher of CS could put together a 
course syllabus using these free online resources that we could use to 
learn this handy, popular language.



My programming days ended in the 80s with Pascal. I would love to 
learn Python and be able to create Activities for Sugar.  But with my 
busy schedule (and adult ADHD) I really need someone to give structure 
to my efforts.



I'll bet there are lots of other folks out there in the same boat… 
well… maybe without the ADHD!



Caryl



From: itprofjac...@gmail.com
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2012 10:08:31 -0500
To: alan.n...@yahoo.com
CC: tabi...@tabitha.net.nz; iaep@lists.sugarlabs.org; 
sthom...@gosargon.com

Subject: Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

If you haven't seen Teagueduino yet, it's worth a look as a system 
that does a good job of making the invisible visible, especially parts 
of the programming interface that show you the signals/voltages in the 
chip being set high or low when things run.  The two pictures of the 
editor in the article below show some of this.



http://www.open-electronics.org/teagueduino-making-things-really-simple/
On Jan 29, 2012, at 8:55 AM, Alan Kay wrote:

Hi Tabitha

I don't think the premise of this system is for Python programming
to be "discovered" while doing it, and I didn't see any claims for
this.

It simple "makes the invisible more visible" when manipulating
computer entities and invoking processes that are usually shrouded
at best.

Systems like Etoys and Scratch need this particular visualization
less because they have mostly visible objects that are being given
behaviors (and which also in Etoys' case have visible data
structures -- e.g. "Holders" etc -- as well). The programmers can
see the changes in the already visible objects. (That is partly
the point in how they are designed for beginners.)

But these systems use a lot of parallel invocations, so one could
imagine a facility like Bob Balzer's EXDAMS (in the 60s!) that
captured all of the behavior for a stretch and allow it to be
played forward and backward deterministically to help the
programmer understand what was going on and the communications
between objects.

I think the main point here is that it really helps any
programmer, and especially beginners, when the computer can be
used to aid both their short term memories and abilities in
visualizing the consequences of their code.

A system like the Python visualizer is especially useful for
low-level imperative-type data structure munging programming (and
Python is often learned in this way).

Cheers,

Alan


*From:* Tabitha Roder 
*To:* Steve Thomas 
*Cc:* iaep 
*Sent:* Sunday, January 29, 2012 1:29 AM
*Subject:* Re: [IAEP] Nice tool for learning Python

On 28 January 2012 17:28, Steve Thomas mailto:sthom...@gosargon.com>> wrote:

Just found this: http://people.csail.mit.edu/pgbovine/python/

This tool looks like an amazing tool for someone who already
understands programming concepts to teach with but it seems a
stretch for someone to learn on their own with this tool by
itself.
The first example code is "aliasing" but doesn't explain what
a variable is, or a function, or a list. It might be possible
to discover these concepts using the simulator but it is
probably better explained in words.
Does anyone know of a suitable ebook or tutorial which the
simulator could be used with? Thinking of the cases where
there is no one to guide the student.
Thanks
Tabitha

___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org 
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep



__

[IAEP] Fwd: What Sugar documentation do deployments need?

2012-01-29 Thread Edward Mokurai Cherlin 
On Fri, January 27, 2012 12:07 pm, Pablo Flores wrote:
> This question is meant for people working on OLPC/Sugar deployment teams:
> What documentation do you think is important to have about Sugar and to
> keep updated?

Thank you for this question. I would particularly like to hear from
teachers and students on this. Have you asked on the OLPC-Sur list?

> This arises from the idea that's being discussed in the mailing lists
> about making a documentation sprint on April in Boston.

Have you asked on the FLOSS Manuals FM-Discuss list?

> Initially we talked about
> updating http://laptop.org/manual/, as it got outdated with the recent
> changes to Sugar interface. After that, some ideas arose about developing
> solutions for making the manual's translations to other languages easier,
> of packaging it in different ways and of creating a pedagogic-oriented
> guide, among others.

I am nearing completion of an algebra textbook with software that I
plan to get Sugarized. Every math expression in the book can be
executed via simple copy and paste, and the text suggests explorations
going much further.

> I would like to know what deployments do think that would be useful for
> them.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Saludos,
> Pablo Flores
> ___
> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
> IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep

--
Edward Mokurai (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) Cherlin
Silent Thunder is my name, and Children are my nation.
The Cosmos is my dwelling place, the Truth my destination.
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Replacing_Textbooks
___
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep