Re: [IAEP] do OLPC browsers support WebRTC microphone audio input?

[Sam P.]

OLPC OS ships with an ancient (2011?) version of WebKitGtk+.  I don't even think that the current version supports WebRTC.Maybe you could run a version of Firefox or chrome on it?___
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Re: [IAEP] Go Social via Social Media (Proposal/Motion)

[Sam P.]

Sean, I completely agree with everything you said.  We seem to have such a
leaky conversion funnel that advertising and social media would be a waste
of money anyway.  You are 100% right that content is key now.

Thanks,
Sam

On Thu, Jun 9, 2016, 19:41 Sean DALY  wrote:

> I'm sorry, I don't see how SL can support a new paid position. My
> suggestion would be to evaluate how the paid Translation Manager position
> works out.
>
> I'm glad Samson you are eager to work on social media (as I've said),
> however I don't understand your marketing objectives. Put another way, just
> what content, from where, will generate lots of likes and clicks, towards
> what goal? I think the goal is developer recruitment, not for teachers or
> education IT buyers, or small donors, or major donors. If they matter too,
> do we use the same plan and tactics for them?
>
> As I've said, I am opposed to associating random advertising with Sugar
> Labs for negligeable income. We should really do Google AdGrants. This can
> be done in cooperation with the SFC which is the nonprofit entity which
> will qualify (and Dave - we shouldn't try to control their account for
> this).
>
> I am pleased there is motivation to work on PR, however major media tech
> sites won't publish anything about us unless we have news, and right now we
> don't. (Ifeanyi - it's not the case that buying ads from news sites will
> generate coverage, that's not how journalists work.)
>
> I'm not comfortable with the idea of creating a Facebook-only version of
> Sugarizer (? if there are resources to do so?) - as fun and ubiquitous as
> fb is, it's a proprietary environment with highly questionable privacy
> policies. It's already possible to link to a public website from Facebook,
> this would be far better.
>
> The previous times I have raised these points they haven't been answered.
> Perhaps the time has come for me to step away from Marketing/PR at SL and
> let you guys reinvent the wheel.
>
> Sean
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 11:11 PM, Dave Crossland  wrote:
>
>> [ Here is the full text of the doc, by Samson with editing assistance
>> by myself ]
>>
>> Concerning SL vision 2016, I think that SL should add social media as
>> one of our main ways to get new members. With the big name we have, we
>> should use that as an advantage to get people into our community - but
>> we aren’t.
>>
>> Let me use myself as an example, I am a very active user in the social
>> world (facebook, twitter, instagram, and YouTube) even though I don’t
>> have a smartphone or a laptop of my own to use regularly. I have over
>> 560 followers on twitter. According to twitter official report, my
>> tweets receive more than 1.9k impressions per day. For the past 28
>> days I have gotten over 42.4k impressions. My lowest impression is
>> about 50 on a tweet. My highest tweet is about 4,800 on a tweet. Now
>> imagine if SL can get this number of impressions by activeness alone
>> on twitter. Same goes to facebook, also posting images on instagram.
>> We can get more than 400 impressions a day via twitter, Also facebook
>> and instagram. If we do the math correctly, SL can get over 600 people
>> a day from social media to sugarlabs.org. That’s valuable traffic for
>> our sites.
>>
>>
>> How do we get started with this new development?
>>
>>
>> It’s very simple; I propose the following motion:
>>
>>
>> Motion: create a “Social Media Manager,” role, similar to the
>> translation manager position, paid $1,000/month plus discretionary use
>> of an advertising budget of $100/month.
>>
>>
>> I believe that the role will not be taken seriously if it is volunteer
>> driven. I am in charge of the social accounts of my church,another
>> non-profit organization. Their social media marketing was also not
>> taken seriously until the church made a modestly paid role. The church
>> community and I both saw it as a responsibility when the role was
>> paid; and my work was effective, as now we have over 4,000 followers
>> on facebook.
>>
>>
>> Money should be spent in order to gain more. More social media
>> followers will lead to more active members which will lead to member
>> donations. I know it’s a non-profit organization but that does not
>> mean we shouldn’t grow.
>>
>> To get my contract approved by SLOBs. I spent almost 100 USD (21,000
>> naira) in cyber cafes answering questions that were not related to my
>> project, so if anyone does not understand this proposal, I strongly
>> suggest they make research on the internet first before asking
>> questions, because I will not answer if the questions are not
>> relevant.
>>
>>
>> I believe in the growth of SL, but I think we can’t grow big if we are
>> not doing well on social media. Even if I am not experienced in
>> business, based on the fact that I am still young and not yet a
>> college graduate, this seems essential to any non-profit business. I
>> always thank God for Nigeria because even if the government is not
>> doing well, we Nigerians a

Re: [IAEP] Sugar 0.106 Release Video sources?

[Sam P.]

It was just a small project made with kdenlive... What are the source files you 
desire?

On 17 May 2016 7:29:19 AM AEST, Dave Crossland  wrote:
>Hi!
>
>WOW! I just came across https://youtu.be/PXFaXAGIw04 :D
>
>Where are the source files for this? :)
>
>-- 
>Cheers
>Dave
>
>
>
>
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Re: [IAEP] Newbie on Sugar

[Sam P.]

For web activities, there is: https://developer.sugarlabs.org/activity.md.html

On 2 May 2016 5:03:57 AM AEST, Sameer Verma  wrote:
>I'm looking for instructions for a newbie to get started on building
>HTML 5
>activities for Sugar.
>
>The students in question are in high school, and have minimal coding
>experience. Typical equipment is either a Mac or Windows laptop. No
>prior
>OLPC or Sugar experience.
>
>Ideas? Starting points?
>
>My goal is to try this out with some of our younger members at OLPC-SF,
>and
>go from there.
>
>Cheers,
>Sameer
>
>
>
>
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Re: [IAEP] Wiki Gardening Weekend (May 14-15, Boston, USA)

[Sam P.]

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Dave, we already have a hosting solution for www-sugarlabs.  We don't need to 
put in the control of a third party (GitHub), it is working find as it is now.

Www-sugarlabs also hosts other special redirects for some application clients.  
Moving to github will break these, eg. Sugar-build.

On 13 April 2016 1:48:45 PM AEST, Dave Crossland  wrote:
>Hi Martin!
>
>On 12 April 2016 at 17:02, Martin Dengler 
>wrote:
>
>>
>> On 12 Apr 2016, at 14:45, Dave Crossland  wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 12 April 2016 at 15:38, Martin Dengler 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The point is that because it's a waste of work and nobody wants to
>do it,
>>
>>
>> Give me the keys and I'll do it.
>>
>>
>> You don't need keys. You need a wiki replacement. You need to do the
>work
>> to create a replacement for wiki.sl.o. Then the DNS can be changed.
>It's
>> super-easy to say "let's do it" and super-hard to actually do it. Put
>your
>> wiki where your mouth is :).
>>
>
>https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs is the replacement.
>
>Once https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs/pull/19 is merged, I'll
>ask
>systems@ to create two A records that point the sugarlabs.org domain to
>192.30.252.153 and 192.30.252.154, per
>https://help.github.com/articles/setting-up-an-apex-domain/
>
>
>--
>Cheers
>Dave

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Re: [IAEP] Wiki Gardening Weekend (May 14-15, Boston, USA)

[Sam P.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

Hi Dave,

Hosting a static site is a non-issue.  We can easily do it on SL servers.  We 
can even configure it to automatically rebuild on git update.

I would not use github pages.  It does not yet support TLS, which is very 
important in this day and age.

Don't let Jekyll limit you either.  I have not compared it to other solutions, 
especially not when making a wiki.  We can run anything on our servers.

Could this project also merge the developer site back into the static-wiki?  
Right now it feels very oddly separated.

Thanks,
Sam

On 12 April 2016 7:51:12 AM AEST, Dave Crossland  wrote:
>Hi Sebastian!
>
>In the "Seeking insights into Oversight_Board/Decisions" thread you
>said,
>
>On 11 April 2016 at 14:57, Sebastian Silva 
> wrote:
>
>> El 11/04/16 a las 13:56, Walter Bender escribió:
>>
>>
>>> Generally I think all mediawiki instances should be retired and
>replaced
>>> with a static site generator backed by a distributed version control
>"pull
>>> request" model of collaboration.
>>>
>>> http://designwithfontforge.com has semi-prominent "edit this page"
>(that
>>> could be even more prominent) and Github itself and 3rd party web
>editors
>>> like http://prose.io provide the "wiki" experience of editing pages
>>> directly, but with the PR permissions model that - IMHO - cultivates
>more
>>> quality.
>>>
>> Mediawiki has been an administration burden from infrastructure team
>and
>> Local Labs as well.
>>
>> +1 on static site generators. Last year we replaced Wordpress for
>Nikola
>> at somosazucar.org. Lektor is also interesting. Both are small enough
>to
>> fit into a Sugar Activity for offline scenarios :-)
>
>
>Both are pure python too. Cool :)
>
>I propose using https://pages.github.com for hosting the site, and thus
>the
>Jeykll static site generator (writte in ruby)
>
>If Nikola/Lektor/anything-else is used as the static site generator,
>the
>site source can be hosted on github, and travis can be used to run the
>SSG
>and upload the build to a server via SFTP or git or similar (in a
>secure
>way.)
>
>Here are some explanations:
>
>https://docs.travis-ci.com/user/deployment/custom/
>
>https://docs.travis-ci.com/user/uploading-artifacts/
>
>How to decide hosting sites on pages.github.com or elsewhere?
>
>Cheers
>Dave
>
>
>
>
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Re: [IAEP] 2015 SocialHelp Survey?

[Sam P.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

Hi Dave,

I will remove this post asap.  The survey had indeed stopped.

I will release the results.  Unfortunately I am currently away from my laptop.

Thanks,
Sam

On 12 April 2016 8:10:43 AM AEST, Dave Crossland  wrote:
>Hi Sam!
>
>Pinned to the top of https://socialhelp.sugarlabs.org is a thread,
>"Survey
>- “How bad is Sugar (software)?”"
>
>Are the results of this survey available anywhere? :)
>
>If not, the survey contents is anonymous, so I don't see any reason to
>keep
>the full results private, but perhaps I'm missing something :)
>
>--
>Cheers
>Dave

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[IAEP] Default Collaboration Server

[Sam P.]

Hi All,

Currently Sugar defaults to using "jabber.sugarlabs.org" as a collaboration
server in Sugar on a Stick and other GNU distros (fedora, debian, etc.).
However, I propose that we change the default (this release!) to use the
local network (telepathy salut).  This is a feature is that is already in
sugar, and is used on XOs and normal computers.

Why?

* Better activity support.  Tubes are supported by salut, but not by gabble
(server based collab.).  This means that activities that haven't been
ported this cycle (most of them) will still work under salut (proposed
default), but will not work under gabble (current default)

* More contextual neighbourhood view.  You only see people on your local
WiFi (or wired) network.  This is more helpful for finding your friends
than the trawling the crowded jabber.sugarlabs.org neighbourhood.

* More features.  File transfers work via salut, but not via
jabber.sugarlabs.org

* More speed and less lag.  Jabber.sugarlabs.org is hosted in the mit.
While that is good if you are a student at the mit, it is very laggy if you
are in say Australia.  I prefer near instant collaberation provided by my
local network.  Even if you are at the mit, your wifi router is still
closer than jabber.sugarlabs.org (hopefully)

* Privacy.  Users (specifically kids) aren't by default sharing their names
and colours online and inviting others to send them things.

Is this ok?  Will defaulting to use salut (local network) cause any issues
for anyone?  Is this ok for the 108 cycle?

Thanks,
Sam
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Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Approach

[Sam P.]

Hi Samson,

They are interesting in a way, and they seem to have a nice presentation
editor.  Maybe that could be something to hack with the new collab text
editor apis?

But I disagree with their approach many ways.  I was chatting with some
people about this and struggled to see pedagogical use of many of their
tools:

* "Quickfire" quiz thing - is talking to students hard?  Is it hard to get
them to pass you an answer on paper?  Well, spend a lot of time setting up
some computer thing instead!
* "Discuss" - too hard to get kids to put up hands to discuss something?
Too hard to get them into groups?  Too hard to "pair share pair" or
whatever strategy?  Have them talk at each other over the internet, after
wasting time fussing with tech.
* "Team Up" - too hard to get them into groups irl?  Too hard to let them
talk so they can work together?  Too hard to use a normal presentation app
to make slides?  Use this thing!

Overall, I think this represents an interesting trend in edu tech - making
normal classroom things digital.  This is a trend that I view as useless
from my experiences.  These are not useful tools for teachers to teach
with, it doesn't let the kids make things or research things.  The
currently successful devices in edu tech seem to be chromebooks - which
don't add a single thing that is educational.  Instead they have
collaboration for word processing, slides, etc.  Real tools for making real
stuff.

Spiral does make me thing about what our approach should be though (hint:
not like spiral) - making tools for kids to work together and make stuff.
Tools that teachers can use in their lesson plans.

Thanks,
Sam

On Sat, Jan 9, 2016 at 10:08 PM, samson goddy 
wrote:

> Someone tweeted @sugar_labs via twitter, asking if the sugarlabs might be
> interested in this application. But it seems like she does not know that
> Sugar Labs has an OS. But the interesting thing is the approach about the
> application. It will be really good to have something like this as an
> activity in Sugar OS so it might make work for teachers in school easier.
> Here is the link to the site http://spiral.ac/r/miB
>
> Samson
>
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>
>
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Re: [IAEP] Introduction of myself

[Sam P.]

Hi Alex,

On Thu, Jan 7, 2016, 11:11 AM Alex Eng  wrote:

> What feature request?  I don't keep up to date with the fedora community,
>> but there have definatly not been any recent localisation discourse on
>> sugar-devel or iaep.
>> Maybe publishing the feature on the mailing list would help?
>
>
> Sorry for the confusion, the feature I referring to is the localisation of
> SOAS desktop.
>

Sugar (and therefore SoaS) support localization and have a large range of
translations.  However, we don't currently have a language prompt on the
first boot screen.  Users must choose the language by navigating to my
settings after setting up.

Is that the bug your referring to?

Thanks,
Sam


>
> On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 9:43 AM, Sam P.  wrote:
>
>> Hi Alex,
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 7, 2016, 10:36 AM Alex Eng  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I am a member of Globalisation group from RedHat and Fedora community.
>>>
>>> With recent adapt of SOAS desktop into fedora, there's few requirements
>>> coming out from user on localisation of the SOAS desktop.
>>>
>>
>>
>>> I'm just wondering is there anyone that I can get contact with regarding
>>> this topic and feature request?
>>>
>>
>> What feature request?  I don't keep up to date with the fedora community,
>> but there have definatly not been any recent localisation discourse on
>> sugar-devel or iaep.
>>
>> Maybe publishing the feature on the mailing list would help?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Sam
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> ___
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>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Alex Eng
>
>
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Re: [IAEP] Introduction of myself

[Sam P.]

Hi Alex,

On Thu, Jan 7, 2016, 10:36 AM Alex Eng  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I am a member of Globalisation group from RedHat and Fedora community.
>
> With recent adapt of SOAS desktop into fedora, there's few requirements
> coming out from user on localisation of the SOAS desktop.
>


> I'm just wondering is there anyone that I can get contact with regarding
> this topic and feature request?
>

What feature request?  I don't keep up to date with the fedora community,
but there have definatly not been any recent localisation discourse on
sugar-devel or iaep.

Maybe publishing the feature on the mailing list would help?

Thanks,
Sam


>
>
> --
> Alex Eng
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Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN RFC] In-Sugar Introduction (was: Onboarding)

[Sam P.]

Hi All,

Thanks for the responses to my proposal.

Through reading, I have realized that it was very arrogant to imply that
this was *the* onboarding for sugar.  Onboarding is more than any
individual tour, it is the journey that users take before they can get
value from Sugar.  This journey is going to compose of multiple parts.

So how does the current landscape look like (in my opinion)?  We have lots
of great content.  There are Iain's slideshows and Training activity among
many others.  However many of these systems take time out of the users
control.  They require the user to do what the content says for 10 minutes
or multiple hours respectively.  This is perfectly appropriate in some
situations, and these are both easy to read/understand systems for
delivering good content.

However, users not all users are in the situation to use those mechanisms.
Some may be eager start working on their systems, and be dismissive of the
tutorials (users which the in-sugar intro would benefit from the contextual
hotspots when they are lost).  Others may be forgetful, or not in a good
state of mind during less interactive training, and benefit from the
reminders.  Some users may be evaluating sugar, and would benefit from
getting started on their own adventures sooner, which would be facilitated
better by the in sugar introduction.

I have updated my proposal to include F6 frame activation, help activity,
shutting down.  The link is now with https, and hopefully less line breaks:
 https://www.sam.today/blog/sugar-onboard-design.html

I have not updated it to include a better way of displaying progress.  I
agree with Quozl that it would be beneficial, however I am completely
unsure of how to visually design it.  Suggestions are always welcome.

Regarding teaching hotkeys over mouse based interactions, I feel that this
is not suited for a tour (unless it a tour of vim that is).  I don't want
to scare the user away in their first sitting, by trying to make them
remember every single key combination.  I also feel that hot keys can could
be more easily explained by a poster as Tony suggested initially.  I will
attempt to create a poster to demonstrate this idea.

Regarding translations and the promise of iconography:  I believe that
iconography is great.  But I think it is a very hard task to generate
images that represent the complex ideas in the sugar UI, a task above
myself.

Tony also raised the issue of users varying level of familiarity with
computers in general.  I have probably aimed this introduction proposal at
somebody who has never used sugar, but is familiar with basic computer
manipulation (how to use a mouse, how to "mouse over" something, how to
click buttons) as well as assuming that they may be familiar with basic
types of applications (do I want to launch "Write"?  It is probably like
MicroSoft Word, so yes).  In order to work with users without this
knowledge, I would need to change the introduction content very much, and
maybe even the mechanism.  I would probably need to also help the user
through the intro screen (where name and colour are setup) as well.
However, I plan to aim at the first subset of users, then it may be
possible to re-use the technology for the latter subset of users.  It is a
completely different debate about how to teach via the screen somebody to
use a mouse though.

Thanks,
Sam

On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 11:33 PM, Iain Brown Douglas <
i...@browndouglas.plus.com> wrote:

> Hi Sam,
>
> This is a fine proposal and I cannot fault your 15 points.
> One comment, some are essential, "first ten minutes of use issues" and
> some might be seen as essential to getting productive.
>
> Of course onboarding runs at many levels, and may be significantly
> different for different user groups.
>
> Elsewhere on this thread you asked for feedback on two items:
>
> 1.  adding references to the F6 and other Function keys. I say yes, as I
> try to introduce Function keys early - it is more easy to teach small
> children key presses than mouse movements.
>
> 2. I think a hint to Help Activity would be good.
>
> Without wanting to detract from your proposal, it is interesting that
> https://www.useronboard.com/ itself uses a slideshow technology.
>
> In general I like this, as it allows the user to speed read the material
> and salient points are more easily revisited in a slideshow than a
> youtube or screencast type presentation.
>
>
> My own New to Sugar concept lives here:
> http://inkyfingers.github.io/gallery/new.html
>
> I would very much like to hear detailed critical response to my work.
>
> This might give us both some insight into avenues that might be most
> appreciated by users.
>
> Kudos to all involved in champion work on www.sugarlabs.org btw.
>
> All the best in 2016,
>
> Iain
>
>
> On Sun, 2015-12-27 at 17:20 +1100

Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN RFC] Onboarding

[Sam P.]

Hi Tony,

Thank you for the comments on the proposal.

(For context, by onboarding I refer to the users first run experience.
Similar to [1].  Specifically something that helps them understand the
basics of sugar)

>From an implementation perspective it is important as you note to bind to
widgets rather than hard coded positions and recognise when the user
completes the task.  I think from that perspective, it would be very
complex to use a JSON file.  I would much prefer to have a singleton class
"Onboarder" (or whatever) which would have 2 main methods.
 "add_hotspot_over(hotspot, widget)" and simmilar for other places that
hotspots are placed over and "signal_hotspot_completed(hotspot)" which
signals that a hotspot has been completed.  There would then be a separate
list of hotspots and their content.  Having more of the implementation in
python in will give this flexability.

I feel that adding lots of different tutorial in different places almost
conflicts with our contextual help system (the help window that pops up).
I think that adding a small initial explanation/tutorial is a different
issue and targets a different need.  Does this need to be added to the
onboarding though (how to open the help)?

Supporting the F6 frame activation could be added, I will mock something up
tomorrow.

Earlier you mentioned that design should use more icons than text.  I think
that I could show screen shots of the expected result.  However, sometimes
I personally find icons can be more vauge than text for explaining ideas,
and I believe that some users may feel a similar way.  Therefore I believe
that the supplementary copy could be helpful for many users.  However, I
you point out the issue of translation loads.  Should the copy be hidden if
text is not available in the same language?

Thanks,
Sam

[1]  https://useronboard.com

On Wed, Dec 30, 2015 at 6:24 PM, Tony Anderson 
wrote:

> Some thoughts:
>
> Trigger this with the help button (see TurtleBlocks). If there is
> already a help, make the help button show options:
> help
> tutorial: how to launch an activity
>
> where tutorial is the Onboarding implementation. It should be possible to
> have more than one tutorial with some description of the purpose.
>
> Add a help button to the left of the home view button on the home view and
> the list view (list view help gives tutorial on list view.
> Add a help button to the right upper corner of the frame.
> Add a help button on the bottom bar of the Journal view (away from the
> mount icons but not in the far corner to avoid conflict with the frame)
> Add a help button on the top bar of the neighborhood and group views (to
> the right, away from the corner)
>
> Implement the system so that activity author/maintainers can create their
> own help button tutorials.
>
> Use a list of jsons to define the steps in the tutorial:
> [{'hotspot':'x,y,w,h','click':test for completion,}
>
> On the home view, at the deployments I support, pressing the alt key makes
> 'always start new' the default. This makes it easier to separate a
> deliberate attempt to resume a task (from the Journal) from a new task
> (from the Home view). With the above approach, the home view tutorial can be
> easily modified.
>
> For the frame, the corners are disabled so that the frame is only
> available from the frame key. This is essential for the original XO-1
> keyboard since moving the cursor to stop an activity almost invariably
> covers the button with the frame. It would be nice if the tutorial
> implementation had a way to show a keyboard hotspot (e.g. a on-screen
> keyboard) to show how to access various views from the keyboard.
>
> In the context of the proposal:
>
> Onboarding goals should be supported by the implementation but not
> limited.
>
> User flow: user clicks on help button and clicks on tutorial (if more
> than one option).
> home view tutorial shows how to launch an activity -
> but an activity has it's own help button and tutorial
>
> When a user completes an onboarding task, the window should flash through
> a huge tick, then fade away.
> a new hotspot appears to set up the next task.
>
> The image in the popup could be a screen shot showing the expected result
> of the previous task.
>
> So, in general, the tutorial definition should be separated from the
> tutorial mechanism.
>
> I suspect the 'hotspot' implementation to be relatively easy but the
> tricky code will be to determine whether the task was executed correctly.
>
> The hotspot mechanism must be able to handle changes. Suppose that a home
> view tutorial sets a task to launch 'Record' by placing a hotspot around
> the Record icon. The mechanism needs to find where the Record icon is on
> the home view, not just position it where Record shows in a
> freshly-installed Home View. The user (or deployment) could have added or
> removed activities from favorites.
>
> Tony
>
> On 12/29/2015 03:55 AM

Re: [IAEP] Membership deadline.

[Sam P.]

Hi James,

On Tue, Dec 1, 2015 at 9:17 AM, James Cameron  wrote:

> On Mon, Nov 30, 2015 at 10:34:11PM +0300, Dan Tenason wrote:
> > [...]  Secondly there are six candidates for seven open positions on
> > the oversight board.  [...]
>
> I can't find good evidence of that.  I perceive three candidates.
>
> Wiki page said "copied over from last year".  Can also be edited by
> anybody, not just the board.
>
> Looking at the edit history, the three candidates are;
>
> - Adam Holt (self edit, 4th November),
>
> - Walter Bender (self edit, 11th November), and;
>
> - Sam Parkinson (self edit, 1st December).
>
> But not Gonzalo Odiard (edited out by himself on 14th November, but
> reverted by Sam on 29th November).
>

I believe that was a mistake that I reverted Gonzalo's commit.  I'm am very
confused by media wiki in general.

Ignacio will also be nominating, however he currently is having issues
logging into the wiki.

Thanks,
Sam


>
> So I've moved the "copied over" tag accordingly.
>
> > In a quick search, I could not find any participation by at least
> > one of the candidates on any of the SugarLabs communication channels
> > since 2013. This opens a few options: Postpone the filing deadline
> > and subsequent election.  Appoint the the current candidate list
> > leaving one slot open. Reduce the size of the board to fire members
> > and hold the election as scheduled.
>
> I agree; if the candidates are less than the seats, then there is no
> election.  Good news; as elections are expensive.
>
> > Or, one might seek to understand why interest in Sugar and Sugarlabs
> > continues to decline.
>
> No, the governance of an organisation should not be distracted by
> such matters.
>
> --
> James Cameron
> http://quozl.netrek.org/
> ___
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> IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
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[IAEP] How bad is Sugar (software)?

[Sam P.]

Hi All,

I'm running an annon. survey about Sugar, and I am interested in hearing
everyone's perspective.

It will only take a minute or so to complete.

"How bad is Sugar (software)?"
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1MFs8qXpMP2udjuPdFa13DamkijNk_3_KwrtTgshD1Bg/viewform

I will use your responses to help improve Sugar.  I also plan to share an
analysis of the responses with the community.

Thanks,
Sam
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Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Open issues

[Sam P.]

Hello Dan,

On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 1:44 AM Dan Tenason  wrote:

> It was impressive to see how quickly Mr. Innocenti updated the
> infrastructure once he was made aware that the servers had gone down. Some
> other problem areas have not been dealt with as quickly.
>

We're all volunteers doing this in our own time to the best of my
knowledge.  Any contributions and patches always welcome!


>
> Sugar Labs has now been operating for six months without an oversight
> board. The early June meeting did not meet quorum and the mid June meeting
> seemed to happen. After appointing a membership committee, no visible
> progress has been made towards holding an election. Is it time to drop the
> Oversight Board as an unnecessary burden?
>

I'm pretty sure that the oversight board members are still alive and that
they are making productive decisions.  According to the wiki page [1] they
had a meeting 2 months ago which they made decisions relating towards the
Sugar Deployment Survey, Turtle Art Days and GSOC2015.  From my knowledge
they are also in control of the spending and domains and those important
oversight things.

I do not see any reason to drop the oversight board.

IDK about the election but.  Hopefully somebody who knows about that can
respond.


>
> The claim of 'Sugar’s Activities are used every school day by nearly 3
> million children' is still present as a fact on the Sugar Labs web site.
> That validity fact is in question. There are several example countries were
> current usage is well below 100% which puts the assumption that ever XO
> ever shipped is used daily.
>

I was chatting with Walter about the new website a while ago and he said
that we should say we have 3 billion users across 270 languages or
something like that.  I think that was just a joke, but you get the point.
I'm sure that 3million is probs legit because of SoaS and sugarizer as well
as XOs.

In my **personal** opinion I do not think that the number on the website is
an important issue.  We have many more bugs and UX bugs that need fixing,
and even in the context of the website there are bigger issues.


>
> It would be appreciated if someone from Sugar Labs could clarify the
> status of these issues.
>

Hopefully I did!  I'm just an individual volunteer, so don't count my word.

Thanks,
Sam

[1]  http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2015-05-04


>
> --
> Dan Tenason
> ___
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Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] [Marketing] New Fedora Spins Site

[Sam P.]

; > This is what we currently have, the Activities list
> >> and layout
> >> > are now set.
> >> >
> >> > http://spins.stg.fedoraproject.org/en/soas/
> >> >
> >> > We can tweak the text but I need to have the edits
> >> > co-ordinated,
> >>
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> The attached text file starts from
> >> http://spins.stg.fedoraproject.org/en/soas/, taken during
> >> Sunday,
> >> with contributions from Sean & Walter/Sam added.
> >>
> >>     There is still some work to do, additions, subtractions or
> >> comments
> >> please!
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Iain
> >>
> >> >  I
> >> > don't have time to to do that so please liaise with
> >> Walter to
> >> > come up
> >> > with the final edits so I can submit them early next
> >> week as a
> >> > single
> >> > final edit.
> >> >
> >> > Peter
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:25 AM, Sean DALY
> >> >  wrote:
> >> > > Peter - are the intro edits I sent going in?
> >> > > thanks
> >> > > Sean
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 3:00 PM, Peter Robinson
> >> > 
> >> > > wrote:
> >> > >>
> >> > >> It's already in process
> >> > >>
> >> > >> On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Sam P.
> >> >  wrote:
> >> > >> > Hi Peter,
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > I think Walter send out a good copy [1] with
> >> headers -
> >> > maybe we could
> >> > >> > use
> >> > >> > those headers?
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > Thanks,
> >> > >> > Sam
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > [1]
> >> >
> >>
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2015-May/050190.html
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 7:09 PM Peter Robinson
> >> > 
> >> > >> > wrote:
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >> On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 6:15 AM, Sam Parkinson
> >> > >> >> 
> >> > >> >> wrote:
> >> > >> >> > Hi Peter,
> >> > >> >> >
> >> > >> >> > Peter Robinson wrote:
> >> > >> >> >> Hi Sam, Gonzalo et el,
> >> > >> >> >>
> >> > >> >> >> I've worked with the Fedora web team to
> >> update it
> >> > some based
> >> > >> >> >> partially
> >> > >> >> >> on Sam's details below.
> >> > >> >> >>
> >> > >> >> >> Details are here:
> >> > >> >> >> http://spins.stg.fedoraproject.org/en/soas/
> >> > >> >> >>
> >> > >> >> >> Let me know of any feedback, I personally
> >> think it
> >> > looks really fab!
> >> > >> >> >
> >> > >> >> > Yeah, it does.
> >> > >> >> >
> >> > >> >> > Is there a way to have different headers?
> >> Some of the
> >> > headings (esp.
> >> > >> >> > Education) are not aappropriate for Sugar.
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >> Yes, provide me details in concise details and
> >> we'll
> >> > review them and
> >> > >> >> get them integrated. I knew it wasn't perfect
> >> but we
> >> > needed to get the
> >> > >> >> majority of the bits in place.
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >> Peter
> >> > >> ___
> >> > >> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop
> >> project!)
> >> > >> IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org
> >> > >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >> > ___
> >> > Sugar-devel mailing list
> >> > sugar-de...@lists.sugarlabs.org
> >> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Sugar-devel mailing list
> >> sugar-de...@lists.sugarlabs.org
> >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
> >
>
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Re: [IAEP] [Marketing] [Sugar-devel] New Fedora Spins Site

[Sam P.]

Hi Peter,

I think Walter send out a good copy [1] with headers - maybe we could use
those headers?

Thanks,
Sam

[1]  http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2015-May/050190.html

On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 7:09 PM Peter Robinson  wrote:

> On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 6:15 AM, Sam Parkinson 
> wrote:
> > Hi Peter,
> >
> > Peter Robinson wrote:
> >> Hi Sam, Gonzalo et el,
> >>
> >> I've worked with the Fedora web team to update it some based partially
> >> on Sam's details below.
> >>
> >> Details are here:
> >> http://spins.stg.fedoraproject.org/en/soas/
> >>
> >> Let me know of any feedback, I personally think it looks really fab!
> >
> > Yeah, it does.
> >
> > Is there a way to have different headers?  Some of the headings (esp.
> Education) are not aappropriate for Sugar.
>
> Yes, provide me details in concise details and we'll review them and
> get them integrated. I knew it wasn't perfect but we needed to get the
> majority of the bits in place.
>
> Peter
>
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Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] New Fedora Spins Site

[Sam P.]

The new site looks very nice!!!

Here is my attempt at some featured applications:

Understanding and Creating Content
---

* Write.  Make a story, poem, report or anything with write.  Use
formatting tools to add images or colors.  Work together with friends to
write together in real time.
* Labyrinth.  Put complex ideas on the computer.  Use Laybrinth activity to
mind map about new concepts, to explore new ideas or to reflect.
* FotoToon.  Use images and text to create comic strips.  FotoToon provides
many options to add motion, speech and though to creations.
* Paint.  Paint provides to tools to make artistic creations.  Use brushes,
stamps, shapes, text and images to create beautiful pictures.

Learn by Doing
--

* Turtle Blocks.  Learn programming concepts with snap together blocks.
Create art, animations and interactive programs in a graphics focused
environment.
* Physics.  Create real life simulations using shapes, motors, ropes and
bolts to explore physics in the world.  Work collaboratively on your
simulation with friends.

Getting Technical
-

* Pippy.  Program applications in a simple yet powerful environment.  The
Python back end provides unlimited opportunities within a simple language
and environment.
* Develop.  Make Sugar activities within Sugar itself.  Develop provides
templates for new games, native and web activities as well as simple
environment to edit existing activities.

Exploring the Wide World
-

* Browse.  Access the internet with Browse activity.  Bookmark sites to
research with friends and save sessions to the Journal to keep organized.
* Get Books.  Download electronic books from all over the web.  Explore the
classics and modern books with ease.
* Read.  Explore reports, documents, books and comic books with Read
activity.  Bookmarking and commenting tools integrate with the Journal to
allow limitless possibilities.

I think we could use the activity icons for the icons.  Maybe we should
color them, but that would not be consistent with the reset of sugar sites
(aslo...).

Also, could we use a better screenshot?  I'm not sure what the policy is,
but the current one has no journal icons and therefore no color on the home
view.  Color is a good thing.

Thanks,
Sam

(I'm not sure we should mention collab, 'cause collab always seems to fail
on fedora over jabber.slo.  Bugs to look at for this new release!!!)

On Sat, May 9, 2015 at 1:06 AM Gonzalo Odiard  wrote:

> Fedora Design Team is working in the new Fedora Spins site.
>
> Sugar on a Stick is included there, and they are asking for feedback and
> content.
>
>
> http://blog.linuxgrrl.com/2015/05/07/time-to-kick-the-tires-on-the-new-fedora-websites-in-staging/
>
> Who can provide the information requested?
>
> --
> Gonzalo Odiard
>
> SugarLabs - Software for children learning
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Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Planning for the future (Samuel Greenfeld)

[Sam P.]

I just found this interesting powerpoint from a few years ago.  Slide 25 is
basically a summary of this discussion:
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxtYXJrZXRsYWJzdWdhcnxneDo0Y2U3ODFjZDczMmU1Mjlh

Thanks,
Sam

On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 7:16 AM Gonzalo Odiard 
wrote:

> Thanks Sameer, very good points,
> a few comments/questions below
>
> On Fri, Mar 13, 2015 at 5:53 PM, Sameer Verma  wrote:
>
>> Interesting thread. I'll reply to Lionel's post, but my reply is more
>> of my own set of ideas and understanding.
>>
>> Putting on my business school researcher hat:
>>
>> 1) The eventual goal of this project should be to influence the
>> adoption of Sugar across the world. A person's attitude, combined with
>> subjective norms, forms his behavioral intention
>> (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_reasoned_action). To
>> influence adoption, we have to address the attitudes of the potential
>> adopter, and the subjective norms. Should Sugar be a part of that
>> ecosystem (such as a school's curriculum) or apart from it?
>>
>>
> Do we have a option? I don't say the school is the only channel to reach
> kids,
> but is the more massive channel without doubt.
>
>
>
>> 2) Role of marketing:  Most of what I've seen thus far is focused on
>> the internal producer view of OLPC/Sugarlabs. This is natural, given
>> that that's the world view we are most familiar with. The role of
>> marketing is to take this internal view, and adapt its value to make
>> it attractive to the consumer. If this adaptation fails, we end up
>> with over-engineered products that the market rejects. This adaptation
>> is largely dependent on addressing the perceptions of the consumer.
>> This is one of the reasons why shiny products sell - we associate
>> shiny with expensive, be it chrome polished plastic or iPads. At this
>> point if you are saying to yourself "we don't care for marketing or
>> consumer" you are sorely mistaken.
>>
>>
> We need more marketing without doubt.
>
>
>> 3) Vision and Mission are important for the project: Vision is an
>> inspirational, directional, future state description. Mission is
>> largely how we get there. Both should be referenced on the basis of a
>> time frame. So, vision and mission for now + 5 years is a good target.
>> These might appear cheesy, but FOSS projects are usually non-strategic
>> by design, because we are all busy writing small bits and pieces,
>> hoping someone will stitch it all together eventually. We "scratch our
>> own itch" in a piecemeal fashion, by writing scripts for battery
>> stats, frame icons, Journal data and such. FOSS projects strive for
>> operational excellence. Then, we hope that all this gets weaved into a
>> fabric that can be used by someone (kids). The same applies to Apache,
>> Ubuntu, Drupal, Linux, etc. In all those cases, there is a foundation
>> or association or company that puts resources (time and money) and
>> provides strategic direction, because the project isn't designed to do
>> so by itself. Apache Software Foundation, Canonical, Drupal
>> Association, Linux Foundation play that important role (I am on the
>> Board of Directors of the Drupal Association, and some of this
>> thinking is from my observations there). Vision, Mission, Goals,
>> Objectives etc. should come from somewhere for Sugar/olpc. For a while
>> it came from OLPC, but right now, I don't see any of it in an
>> organizational manner.
>>
>> 4) In the free and open source world, the consumer is also sometimes
>> the producer. So, instead of treating the consumer as someone with
>> limited feedback (as may be the case with Windows or MacOSX) the
>> consumer can switch roles and become a producer (like Ignacio or
>> SamP). http://www.oecd.org/sti/inno/37450155.pdf This can lead to a
>> myopic view of the target population being only people like Ignacio or
>> SamP. Should all kids open the hood to peek into Sugar and become
>> developers like Ignacio and SamP? Can we get into schools where they
>> have locked down Windows machines with no admin rights?
>>
>> 5) Sugar is not a product. Sugar is a project, that keeps evolving as
>> time goes by. A product is when we take a snapshot and polish it with
>> QC, QA and package it for delivery. OLPC's build for the XO platform
>> is a product. Sugarizer is a product. Suagr is NOT a product. This is
>> just like Fedora is NOT a product. It's a project. RHEL is a product.
>> Or for that matter, take the Ubuntu phone. The phone delivered by BQ
>> is a product that took Ubuntu 14.09 and made it RTM (release to
>> manufacturer) and ran it through QC and QA and produced the phone with
>> the polished stack on it. Customers buy products, while developers
>> work with projects. It is imperative that we understand the difference
>> and treat the two as different.
>>
>> I'm pretty sure Rangan Srikhanta has a strategy for
>> OLPCAU/OneEducation. So does Rodrigo Arboleda for OLPC Inc. I think we
>> (Sugarlabs+lowercase olpc) nee

Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] XO Infinity ?

[Sam P.]

Interesting article!

> That's why, he says, One Education designed a device that won't lock
children or schools into an operating system – it works with Android,
Windows and Linux – and why it concentrates on primary schools, with an
emphasis on equality.

This quote seems to reflect their lack of communications strategy.  Does
this mean we get sugar?  What is this "windows" thing all about?

> This week, the Australian 15-employee One Education will announce its new
generation low-cost computer. A Lego-like modular PC-and-tablet in one that
can be assembled by a four-year-old, updated as components reach their end
of life, and repaired in the classroom.to last their primary years

OMG, they have 15 people!!!  Last time I looked on their people page, they
had 1 coder/engineer/support and 1 graphical designer + management.  Plus
the people page only lists 10 people.

>  On Friday the Australian Information Industry Association (AIIA)
released a new report showing eight in 10 Australian parents think digital
skills and computer programming should be taught in primary and secondary
schools. Six in 10 parents believe it's important children learn to design,
build or program apps.

Ironically Android is a much more closed OS.  It lacks tools like pippy and
turtle.  Sugar is MUCH MUCH more aimed towards programming that the
arguably consumer OS android.

> "[We want] to teach kids they don't just have to be consumers. That they
can actually pull things together… and give them the opportunity to update
the parts."

If changing a battery made everyone a programmer, why is programming a
qualification?

> But the Australian charity did things a little differently. Where OLPC
began to encounter adoption barriers , OLPC Australia began innovating.
>
> Its offshoot, One Education , created
charging stations and repair kits, teacher incentive programs, and training
for student IT champions to fix other kids' PCs.

LOL, charging stations are much innovative.  I'm not sure if this is the
quality of Aussie journalism or quality of OLPC AU.

Also, I am very sad that the Sugar community has no mention throughout the
article.  Obviously Sugar played no part in the way the users used OLPC
AU's laptops.  I'm sure the experience would have been the same with no OS
installed.  Is that true?

Thanks,
Sam

On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 9:36 PM Christophe Guéret <
christophe.gue...@dans.knaw.nl> wrote:

> Hoi,
>
> Have you all seen this ?
> http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/computers/meet-rangan-srikhanta-the-former-refugee-who-wants-to-change-the-world-one-laptop-at-a-time-20150221-13l07r.html
> I guess the answer is yes but just in case...
>
> Christophe
>
>
> On 27 February 2015 at 18:14, Gonzalo Odiard 
> wrote:
>
>> I hope this is not affected by Osborne effect [1]
>> These looks like 3d software generated images,
>> from that to a product ready to ship, there are a long way.
>>
>> Gonzalo
>>
>> [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 2:48 PM, Lionel Laské 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> As some of you, I've seen: https://medium.com/road-to-infinity
>>>
>>> Something that look like to a new XO concept with an Android OS proposed
>>> by OLPC Australia. Just my guess.
>>>
>>> Is someone have more information on this ?
>>> Is it related to OLPC Foundation ?
>>> Is it related to Sugar ?
>>>
>>> Please share with us.
>>>
>>> Lionel.
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Gonzalo Odiard
>>
>> SugarLabs - Software for children learning
>>
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>>
>>
>
>
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> christophe.gue...@dans.knaw.nl
>
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>
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>
>
> Let op, per 1 januari hebben we een nieuw adres:
>
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Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Planning for the future (Samuel Greenfeld)

[Sam P.]

Hi,

+1

I think there are some ways to improve hardware independence.  Integrating
sugar with a display manager would make it work in many (traditional?) IT
situations where you have computers with networked student accounts.

Over the ensuing years, we have also made efforts to reach out in
other ways, some more successful than others: Sugar has been ported to
virtually every major flavor of GNU/Linux. As a community, it has been
difficult to support all of those efforts, but some, such as Trisquel,
rival Fedora, where we still do our development, in terms of
stability. (We have lagged behind in our Ubuntu support; given its
popularity this has been a tactical mistake.) We also initiated the
Sugar on a Stick and Sugar in a virtual machine efforts, which opened
the door to getting a taste of Sugar on iOS and MS Windows platforms.
These products have matured and are well maintained. In anticipation
of the tablet bubble, we added touch support to Sugar; (it works, but
the good news is that most people serious about using tablets for
learning are also including keyboards these days.) Sugar also runs
nicely on Chromebooks, which are making some inroads into the
classroom.

 Yeah, ubuntu is a big issue!

And, as Lionel mentioned, already three years ago we began in earnest
an effort to support Javascript as a first order language in Sugar so
as to both invite a broader community of developers in and being to
offer Sugar activities to users of web browsers and Android
(eventually iPhone) devices. Lionel has expanded upon that effort to
try to offer the whole Sugar experience, not just individual
activities. This work is on-going and is the focus of our proposal to
Google Summer of Code 2015.


 Yeah this is a really awesome movement.  Just throwing around another
opportunity idea, sugar activities are written in GTK, meaning it would be
possible to make sugar activities work inside GNOME (or other DEs) as
windows. Turtle does this, but it would be cool to expand this to a general
library (#GSOC?).

TB becoming a spin out is a great way to widen sugar's reach.  Tb is an
awesome "first step" towards coding, and export to python and stuff are
great features that help in a further intro to coding.

And it is worth noting that 50% of the patches in the latest Sugar
release came from kids.

 Yeah, but did 50% of the ideas come from users?

All of that said, our future is far from clear. OLPC and OLPC
deployments have been the largest source of funding, albeit erratic,
for Sugar development and maintenance. (We continue to get some
funding from Google, Trip Advisor, et al., but these $s are not
general funds for supporting developers and code maintenance.) It
seems that the OLPC well is running dry (We have a few proposals
circulating but none in hand at the moment.) We've gotten little
support from other hardware vendors, I believe in part because many of
them still see Sugar Labs as an extension of OLPC, with whom they were
competing.


 Well why not do a needles ui/design change :). It would probably change
people's perception if we changed the xo icon or something (a la android 5)
and made ourselves less look connected to olpc.  Not something to rush out
and do without thinking, not something that we should waste development
time on either, but an idea.

So either Sugar Labs finds support for the core development team to
remain focused full-time on Sugar or we scale back our release cycle
to one that can be managed entirely by part-time volunteers.

There are opportunities out there: for example, partnering with some
of the classroom management solutions; finding funding for specific
programs, such as Turtle Blocks, and finding more hardware partners.
Meanwhile, we also need to keep Sugar relevant. I take the long view
there, in that I think the core pedagogical ideas in Sugar are sound
and that over time we'll be better situated to get these ideas into
the hands of learners. (For example, Android is becoming more
Sugar-friendly as it evolves.)

Some of the reflection ideas that OLPC AU was pushing seemed really great.
Hopefully they can get implemented.

But I think whatever path we follow, consultation is the most important.
One issue OLPCs and sugarlabs seems to have is the lack of consultation
with students and teachers.  It is great that we have some educational idea
or have read some paper about education that an 'expert' has written,
however we are making an OS for students and teachers.  If the OS isn't
helping students or if it confuses teachers, then what good is it really
doing?  We can load sugar with data collection tools and what not, but
nothing replaces talking to teachers, watching how they use sugar, and
asking what they want changed.

In fact this is not unique to Sugar and OLPC.  I am yet to use edutech at
my school that feels like it was built for and WITH schools.  It feels
locked up and controlled by visual designers and corporate managers that
don't know the needs of schools.  Though sugar