Re: [IAEP] Which Language?
if your only tool is a hammer, all of your problems tend to look like nails. This single letter tool belongs on the XO ... it is highly cross platform + comes with a small footprint it comes from the mind of a Turing Award* winner * (a.k.a. computing's equivalent of the Nobel Prize) that mind was a teacher that teacher died at the keyboard at 83 composing a tutorial (a.k.a.a lab) for his language ... it is: J +/ 2 2 4 ajouter =. +/ ajouter 2 2 4 hinzufuegen =. ajouter hinzufuegen 2 2 4 aggiungere =. ajouter aggiungere 2 2 4 toevoegen =. ajouter toevoegen 2 2 4 adicionar =. ajouter adicionar 2 2 4 http://jsoftware.com/ "J is a modern, high-level, general-purpose, high-performance programming language. J is portable and runs on Windows, Unix, Mac, and PocketPC handhelds, both as a GUI and in a console. True 64-bit J systems are available for XP64 or Linux64, on AMD64 or Intel EM64T platforms. J systems can be installed and distributed for free." NB.===> free <=== http://jsoftware.com/platforms.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_E._Iverson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turing_Award Turing Award paper "Notation as a Tool of Thought": http://awards.acm.org/images/awards/140/articles/9147499.pdf c. 51 pp. http://awards.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=9147499&srt=year&year=1979&aw=140&ao=AMTURING ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] [support-gang] Which Language?
Caryl, in part: "the consensus is Python so far". (a) the sample is too small for a consenus. (b) why JUST one language? ~~ if your only tool is a hammer, all of your problems tend to look like nails (c) J (d) other candidates: LISP, LOGO, Forth (e) It's an educational project: that screams LOGO at me. __ Gerry Lowry, Principal Ability Business Computer Services ~~ Because it's your Business, our Experience Counts! 68 John W. Taylor Avenue Alliston · Ontario · Canada · L9R 0E1 · 705.250.0112 gerry.lo...@abilitybusinesscomputerservices.com http://abilitybusinesscomputerservices.com ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] [support-gang] Which Language?
Yamandu Ploskonka asked: can you LOGO in an image from the camera? -- why not? it might require an extension to LOGO (do not know) otoh, why? if your only tool is a hammer, all of your problems tend to look like nails -- use LOGO for its originally intended purpose -- I do not have a XO ... I've heard it has a LOGO variant called Etoys ? (can Etoys read a camera image?) ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Which Language?
"DancesWithCars" wrote in part "we have not heard what the project is" Let me clarify ... my comments are GENERAL in nature. My preference would be to see the XO ship will several small footprint languages. Each of those languages have their pros & cons. >From a private e-mail with an IAEP moderator, I wrote in part: XO imo needs to ship with multiple languages ... whereas LOGO may not be "a suitable alternative for a general-purpose language", it is hyper suitable as a language for XO end users "as a learning tool" ~~ as Ken Iverson might call it "as a tool for thought". I strongly belief that XO must ship with multiple small footprint language tools for thought and that those tools need to include J, LOGO, LISP, and Forth. ... one can also request from the IAEP community "enhancements and extensions" that make sense ... does LOGO need to be able to work with a camera image ... in general terms, no ... would the XO benefit from an API that allows extensions for J, LOGO, LISP, Forth, Python, and whatever ... that would be good. Look at Microsoft's .NET Framework ... while it has c# and vb as its foundation languages, it can accommodate many languages and they can all interoperate. In that I do not have a XO and even if I did, at the present, my time is too limited, I have taken the opportunity to add my own thoughts to this thread. I am no Alan Kay. I am no Ken Iverson. OTOH, I have been programming for 40+ years and have taught programming up to the community college level as well as to young people ... thus, I have no doubt that I can offer the occasional useful suggestions and insights. Frequently I quote: If your only tool is a happy, all of your problems tend to look like nails. Please ship the XO with the tools mentioned above so that XO end users and educators who create learning materials for the XO can have their choice of "tools for thought". Gerry __ Gerry Lowry, Principal Ability Business Computer Services ~~ Because it's your Business, our Experience Counts! 68 John W. Taylor Avenue Alliston · Ontario · Canada · L9R 0E1 · 705.250.0112 gerry.lo...@abilitybusinesscomputerservices.com http://abilitybusinesscomputerservices.com ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Which Language?
Correction: brain RAM parity error and/or fetch error in my previous post: Frequently I quote: If your only tool is a happy, all of your problems tend to look like nails. Frequently I quote: If your only tool is a hammer, ... happy ~~ hammer perhaps my brain was thinking XO users will be happy if we give them more than just a hammer. g. ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Which Language?
Jim Simmons, in part: "The original question was about developing Activities for a classroom assignment, with the idea that these Activities could be widely distributed." If (big IF) J will run on XO, "labs" is a built in feature of J. Ken Iverson had his stroke at 83 while at the keyboard composing a lab AFAIK. J is free: http://jsoftware.com Gerry ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Which Language?
Martin Dengler: "Since you don't know if J can run on the XO, J is not a good thing to recommend for developing activities on the XO, right?" Wrong. J is worth investigating. J is so cross platform and so powerful that it is a lifetime useful tool for teaching and for thought. J, like APL, sadly does not get the publicity that it deserves. I would not be surprised if Roger Hui were willing to create an implementation of J for the XO if that were necessary. Gerry ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Re: [IAEP] Which Language?
Martin wrote: The question was "what language can be used now". You're answering a different question. Possibly. Depends on whether J can be used now (or soon). I do not know the answer. Let us assume the answer is no. Then the next relevant J question is whether Roger Hui et al would provide a port for the XO; if yes, the next question is would that port be available in a reasonable time frame? What I do know is that J is a great teaching tool and would meet many needs and can with relative ease present lessons (labs) in both natural language neutral and natural language specific forms according to implementation used by the designer of a given lab: +/ 2 2NB. natural language neutral 4 add =. +/ NB. natural language specific [English] add 2 2 4 Gerry ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
