Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
On Thu, 9 Apr 2009 16:01:00 -0500, Scott Fagen scottfagen...@yahoo.com wrote: Palmisano's publicly stated principals. Self correction: principles Scott Fagen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
On Fri, 3 Apr 2009 09:54:10 -0500, Eric Bielefeld eric-ibmm...@wi.rr.com wrote: I know there is a good case for IBM expanding in China and India and other Asian countries because they are doing more and more business over there, but to cut US jobs and just move them overseas just ain't right. http://www.ibm.com/ibm/governmentalprograms/samforeignaffairs.pdf Without vitriol, humor, nor any of my opinions, IBM is simply pursuing Mr. Palmisano's publicly stated principals. Scott Fagen Enterprise Systems Management -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
On 9 Apr 2009 14:03:00 -0700, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: On Fri, 3 Apr 2009 09:54:10 -0500, Eric Bielefeld eric-ibmm...@wi.rr.com wrote: I know there is a good case for IBM expanding in China and India and other Asian countries because they are doing more and more business over there, but to cut US jobs and just move them overseas just ain't right. http://www.ibm.com/ibm/governmentalprograms/samforeignaffairs.pdf Without vitriol, humor, nor any of my opinions, IBM is simply pursuing Mr. Palmisano's publicly stated principals. My general belief is that IT functions should only be done in countries where the organization is operating anyway. Indeed in decentralized countries such as Canada and the United States, I would change the word to jurisdictions since legal system differ by province or state. My reasoning is that the organization needs to be conversant with the legal rules that apply and should not add legal exposure. In the case of Microsoft and IBM for example, both companies see a major market in which they need to participate. For political reasons if nothing else, that needs to be matched by an employment presence. They are adding little if any legal exposure to that they would have had. If Canada only has the importance of California relative to the United States based on population, consider that the US has maybe a third of the population of either China or India and Canada probably only has the population of a major metropolitan area in either of those countries. Eventually China and India may be the major markets for both companies with the US 3rd if that. This has very interesting implications for the citizens of many countries and is not just limited to the two companies I picked. It can have interesting implications for how data centers (centres in Canada) are run. Scott Fagen Enterprise Systems Management -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
Trusted Scout. I don't think Gary Larson got the etymology right... And you should have seen the look on the Lone Ranger's face when he finally found out what Keomsabe really meant. [A bit of levity appeared to be needed for this post.] Regards, Steve Thompson -- Normal disclaimer applies about my opinions and those of my employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
I didn't get it from Gary (although he reminded me of it). I got it from an old friend who said something to that effect in the mid-70s. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ron Hawkins Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 3:03 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs Trusted Scout. I don't think Gary Larson got the etymology right... And you should have seen the look on the Lone Ranger's face when he finally found out what Keomsabe really meant. [A bit of levity appeared to be needed for this post.] Regards, Steve Thompson -- Normal disclaimer applies about my opinions and those of my employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
Bill I was skipping this topic as one having been raised suspiciously close to April 1st. However I spotted the text of your post in my daily digest and so I'm yielding to the temptation to mention that expression of absolute justice Hoist with your own petard!. Chris Mason P.S. And a bit more levity for Steve Thompson! On Fri, 3 Apr 2009 07:15:15 -0400, Bill Fairchild bi...@mainstar.com wrote: What if the five IBM software designers who created the product and filed for a patent on it were the first five employees whose jobs were offshored due to IBM's using their patented software? Sigh. One can only fantasize of such things. Bill Fairchild From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ed Gould Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:01 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs IBM withdraws software patent application on offshoring jobs Employees fearful of more layoffs at IBM work sites in U.S. ROCHESTER (KTTC-DT) -- Computer giant IBM has abruptly withdrawn a patent application for software that helps companies decide the benefits or disadvantages of moving jobs to another country. Five IBM software designers created the product and filed for a patent on it in September, 2007. But after news of the project broke on Monday, IBM quickly withdrew the patent application, calling it a mistake. IBM spokesman Steve Malkiewicz is quoted as saying the filing was an error. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
What if the five IBM software designers who created the product and filed for a patent on it were the first five employees whose jobs were offshored due to IBM's using their patented software? Sigh. One can only fantasize of such things. Bill Fairchild From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ed Gould Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:01 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs IBM withdraws software patent application on offshoring jobs Employees fearful of more layoffs at IBM work sites in U.S. ROCHESTER (KTTC-DT) -- Computer giant IBM has abruptly withdrawn a patent application for software that helps companies decide the benefits or disadvantages of moving jobs to another country. Five IBM software designers created the product and filed for a patent on it in September, 2007. But after news of the project broke on Monday, IBM quickly withdrew the patent application, calling it a mistake. IBM spokesman Steve Malkiewicz is quoted as saying the filing was an error. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
You are surprised that foreign people would write software that recommends to employee foreign people? -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ed Gould Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:01 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs IBM withdraws software patent application on offshoring jobs Mar 31, 2009 1:03 PM Apr 01, 2009 9:24 AM IBM is reportedly hiring 32,000 for its work sites in India and China Employees fearful of more layoffs at IBM work sites in U.S. ROCHESTER (KTTC-DT) -- Computer giant IBM has abruptly withdrawn a patent application for software that helps companies decide the benefits or disadvantages of moving jobs to another country. Five IBM software designers created the product and filed for a patent on it in September, 2007. But after news of the project broke on Monday, IBM quickly withdrew the patent application, calling it a mistake. IBM spokesman Steve Malkiewicz is quoted as saying the filing was an error. Ironically, it took the U.S. Patent Office about a year and a half to publish the application, and it did so on March 26--the very day that IBM was initiating one of its resource actions. In this case, industry observers believe IBM was eliminating four to five thousand jobs from its Global Business Services and Global Technology Services divisions, and moving them to India. The jobs outsourcing software patent application is titled METHOD AND SYSTEM FOR STRATEGIC GLOBAL RESOURCE SOURCING. Its somewhat complex abstract describes what it purports to do: Method and system for strategic global resource sourcing in one aspect incorporates concurrently a plurality of qualitative and quantitative attributes that influence performance of sourcing strategy with respect to one or more quantitative measures, quantifies an impact of said qualitative attributes using said one or more quantitative measures, and optimizes the sourcing strategy with respect to said one or more quantitative measures subject to one or more constraints. The software's five designers are all based in the Westchester County, New York, region near IBM's world headquarters in Armonk. The five listed on the patent application are Ching-Hua Chen-Ritzo of Mahopac, Daniel Patrick Connors of Pleasant Valley, Markus Ettl of Yorktown Heights, Mayank Sharma of White Plains and Karthik Sourirajan, also of White Plains. IBM Rochester was not significantly touched by the latest downsizing of Big Blue's U.S. work force, from the information at hand. However, hundreds were cut in southeastern Minnesota in the so-called resource action the company pursued in late January. As KTTC NewsCenter reported in early March, it was an eye-opener for many long-time IBMers who lost their jobs in Rochester to see job descriptions for their old positions popping up in China. And anger built up when an analysis of the terminations showed that most of them came among those who were over age 50. The wife of one former IBM Rochester employee says there is fear over future IBM layoffs here in the U.S., but it is quite a different story as the company bulks up its operations in China and India. There are TONS of new IBM jobs opening in China, she said. It's going crazy over there. The number of IBM China positions listed on Project Match has really jumped in the last three months. Five years ago, IBM had about 1,000 jobs in India. My husband just read that they have 90,000 employees there now. For years, IBM has sought to employ its work force over a world-wide platform. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
And how do you know that they are foreign people? Some of the five have what might have been foreign-sounding names before the USA became the great so-called melting pot, but that does not make them foreign people. The news item quoted gives home towns for all five of them as being in the Westchester County region of New York. What is there about the name Daniel Patrick Connors that proves he is foreign? Ah, maybe he's Irish. That's definitely foreign. Perhaps their families have lived for 100 years in Westchester County. Please explain how you know that all five of them are foreign people. And you made a spelling error in your post (to employee should have been to employ). Maybe you are foreign, too, since you are not proficient in English. I am never surprised when anyone does anything in his own interest, but your leap of logic is outrageous and ill-founded. Bill Fairchild From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Adams, Tracy Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 8:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs You are surprised that foreign people would write software that recommends to employee foreign people? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
I apologize to all the members of IBM-MAIN, and especially to Tracy Adams, for the angry and vituperative tone of my previous post. I should have disagreed with Adam's post more politely and gentlemanly. Bill Fairchild -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
On 3 Apr 2009 05:59:30 -0700, tad...@cvps.com (Adams, Tracy) wrote: You are surprised that foreign people would write software that recommends to employee foreign people? I'm not surprised that people would write software that recommends employing foreign people. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
Yes you are right that is a very presumptuous statement... nothing personal and no offense meant for those developers of the application or anyone who doesn't have the name of Kemosobe and may have taken offense to such an outrageous ill-founded statement. (Seriously, I do apologize) As for grammar police, I hate you all. I hold no regrets that my career has been based on my technical ability not my ability to write a book that would get by a NY Times editor with no corrections. If I had seen the writing on the wall 30 years ago to learn some Spanish, Chinese or Indian dialects, I probably would have slacked in those classes as well. I do have a friend that is a Chinese translator and not only does he make twice the money I do, he gets to visit a beautiful country 10 months out of the year. So my friend Bill Fairfield, thanks for slapping me in the face to the rudeness of previous post. I wish you the best. You are obviously a person of passion for all man kind. I like that. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Bill Fairchild Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 9:19 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs And how do you know that they are foreign people? Some of the five have what might have been foreign-sounding names before the USA became the great so-called melting pot, but that does not make them foreign people. The news item quoted gives home towns for all five of them as being in the Westchester County region of New York. What is there about the name Daniel Patrick Connors that proves he is foreign? Ah, maybe he's Irish. That's definitely foreign. Perhaps their families have lived for 100 years in Westchester County. Please explain how you know that all five of them are foreign people. And you made a spelling error in your post (to employee should have been to employ). Maybe you are foreign, too, since you are not proficient in English. I am never surprised when anyone does anything in his own interest, but your leap of logic is outrageous and ill-founded. Bill Fairchild From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Adams, Tracy Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 8:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs You are surprised that foreign people would write software that recommends to employee foreign people? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
Big opps Mr Fairchild -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Adams, Tracy Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 10:25 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs Yes you are right that is a very presumptuous statement... nothing personal and no offense meant for those developers of the application or anyone who doesn't have the name of Kemosobe and may have taken offense to such an outrageous ill-founded statement. (Seriously, I do apologize) As for grammar police, I hate you all. I hold no regrets that my career has been based on my technical ability not my ability to write a book that would get by a NY Times editor with no corrections. If I had seen the writing on the wall 30 years ago to learn some Spanish, Chinese or Indian dialects, I probably would have slacked in those classes as well. I do have a friend that is a Chinese translator and not only does he make twice the money I do, he gets to visit a beautiful country 10 months out of the year. So my friend Bill Fairfield, thanks for slapping me in the face to the rudeness of previous post. I wish you the best. You are obviously a person of passion for all man kind. I like that. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Bill Fairchild Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 9:19 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs And how do you know that they are foreign people? Some of the five have what might have been foreign-sounding names before the USA became the great so-called melting pot, but that does not make them foreign people. The news item quoted gives home towns for all five of them as being in the Westchester County region of New York. What is there about the name Daniel Patrick Connors that proves he is foreign? Ah, maybe he's Irish. That's definitely foreign. Perhaps their families have lived for 100 years in Westchester County. Please explain how you know that all five of them are foreign people. And you made a spelling error in your post (to employee should have been to employ). Maybe you are foreign, too, since you are not proficient in English. I am never surprised when anyone does anything in his own interest, but your leap of logic is outrageous and ill-founded. Bill Fairchild From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Adams, Tracy Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 8:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs You are surprised that foreign people would write software that recommends to employee foreign people? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Adams, Tracy Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 9:25 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs SNIPPAGE Kemosobe SNIPPAGE And you should have seen the look on the Lone Ranger's face when he finally found out what Keomsabe really meant. [A bit of levity appeared to be needed for this post.] Regards, Steve Thompson -- Normal disclaimer applies about my opinions and those of my employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
Ed - thanks for posting this article. It is very enlightening. I think the worst thing is the last line quoted below - most of the people cut are over 50. Also, to see an ad for your job pop up in China or India - thats got to be really tough to take. I just talked to a friend of mine from IBM Milwaukee a few days ago. He's thankful that he still has a job, but worried. I would think that the people cut would have a very good case in our court system for age discrimintation. I know there is a good case for IBM expanding in China and India and other Asian countries because they are doing more and more business over there, but to cut US jobs and just move them overseas just ain't right. Eric Eric Bielefeld Sr. Systems Programmer Milwaukee, Wisconsin 414-475-7434 - Original Message - From: Ed Gould ps2...@yahoo.com IBM Rochester was not significantly touched by the latest downsizing of Big Blue's U.S. work force, from the information at hand. However, hundreds were cut in southeastern Minnesota in the so-called resource action the company pursued in late January. As KTTC NewsCenter reported in early March, it was an eye-opener for many long-time IBMers who lost their jobs in Rochester to see job descriptions for their old positions popping up in China. And anger built up when an analysis of the terminations showed that most of them came among those who were over age 50. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
IBM Withdraws Patent Application on offshoring jobs
IBM withdraws software patent application on offshoring jobs Mar 31, 2009 1:03 PM Apr 01, 2009 9:24 AM IBM is reportedly hiring 32,000 for its work sites in India and China Employees fearful of more layoffs at IBM work sites in U.S. ROCHESTER (KTTC-DT) -- Computer giant IBM has abruptly withdrawn a patent application for software that helps companies decide the benefits or disadvantages of moving jobs to another country. Five IBM software designers created the product and filed for a patent on it in September, 2007. But after news of the project broke on Monday, IBM quickly withdrew the patent application, calling it a mistake. IBM spokesman Steve Malkiewicz is quoted as saying the filing was an error. Ironically, it took the U.S. Patent Office about a year and a half to publish the application, and it did so on March 26--the very day that IBM was initiating one of its resource actions. In this case, industry observers believe IBM was eliminating four to five thousand jobs from its Global Business Services and Global Technology Services divisions, and moving them to India. The jobs outsourcing software patent application is titled METHOD AND SYSTEM FOR STRATEGIC GLOBAL RESOURCE SOURCING. Its somewhat complex abstract describes what it purports to do: Method and system for strategic global resource sourcing in one aspect incorporates concurrently a plurality of qualitative and quantitative attributes that influence performance of sourcing strategy with respect to one or more quantitative measures, quantifies an impact of said qualitative attributes using said one or more quantitative measures, and optimizes the sourcing strategy with respect to said one or more quantitative measures subject to one or more constraints. The software's five designers are all based in the Westchester County, New York, region near IBM's world headquarters in Armonk. The five listed on the patent application are Ching-Hua Chen-Ritzo of Mahopac, Daniel Patrick Connors of Pleasant Valley, Markus Ettl of Yorktown Heights, Mayank Sharma of White Plains and Karthik Sourirajan, also of White Plains. IBM Rochester was not significantly touched by the latest downsizing of Big Blue's U.S. work force, from the information at hand. However, hundreds were cut in southeastern Minnesota in the so-called resource action the company pursued in late January. As KTTC NewsCenter reported in early March, it was an eye-opener for many long-time IBMers who lost their jobs in Rochester to see job descriptions for their old positions popping up in China. And anger built up when an analysis of the terminations showed that most of them came among those who were over age 50. The wife of one former IBM Rochester employee says there is fear over future IBM layoffs here in the U.S., but it is quite a different story as the company bulks up its operations in China and India. There are TONS of new IBM jobs opening in China, she said. It's going crazy over there. The number of IBM China positions listed on Project Match has really jumped in the last three months. Five years ago, IBM had about 1,000 jobs in India. My husband just read that they have 90,000 employees there now. For years, IBM has sought to employ its work force over a world-wide platform. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
