Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
Any ECKD device will have the associated overhead. Whether the virtual IRG corresponds to lost physical storage depends on the implementation. IAC, the IRG overhead depends on the block size and on whether keys are present. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of Michael Watkins [032966e74d0f-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu] Sent: Friday, January 20, 2023 9:05 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box I understood Jake's question differently; I thought he was just asking what was indicated by what he saw in the DS8k GUI and whether his z/OS capacity could be determined from the DS8k GUI. I do not believe it can be. People familiar with DS8k frames configured as ECKD storage can quibble about how much of the magnetic surface actually contains application data until the cows come home. All good. The question I hinted at (sorry, should have clearly asked) was how any of this changes as we move from a DS8k with spinning disked RAIDed together to a flash-based DS8900F. I ask because I have no experience with DS8900F technology. Without spinning parts, are there still IRGs, even virtual, when a DS8900F is configured as ECKD? An ECKD-configured DS8k still has this 'wasted' space, even though the 3390 IRGs do not necessarily correspond to anything phsical on the Seagate disks spinning inside the frame. The IRGs exist (I assume) so facilitate the DS8k appearing to be a native 3390 to z/OS. I intended to ask: 'Are all of these inefficienies still mirrored in this next generation (DS8900F) for the sake of still appearing to be a native 3390 to z/OS?' -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Allan Staller Sent: Friday, January 20, 2023 7:33 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Texas Comptroller's email system. DO NOT click links or open attachments unless you expect them from the sender and know the content is safe. Classification: Confidential With IRGs and other "overhead" the usable capacity is about 0.8 GB whis is what I use when making "capacity" calculations. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Michael Watkins Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 7:38 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box [CAUTION: This Email is from outside the Organization. Unless you trust the sender, Don't click links or open attachments as it may be a Phishing email, which can steal your Information and compromise your Computer.] See https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ibm.com%2Fdocs%2Fen%2Fzvse%2F6.2%3Ftopic%3DSSB27H_6.2.0%2Ffe6rf_optimizing_casize_disksizes.htm=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C6b4c0d7d69464b52810e08dafaefb0a7%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638098204654746104%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=PCmABgcrqIQRE7XsXvtLm1TfQhU6GPzPGVB78mlty%2Bg%3D=0 A 3390 MOD-1 has 1,113 cylinders. Each 3390 cylinder has 15 tracks. Each 3390 track has 56,664 bytes. 1,113 x 15 x 56,664 = 946,005,480 There are 946,005,480 bytes in a 3390 MOD-1 disk drive. Or roughly 0.946 GB. The PC-compatible disk drives in your DS8k frame have a fixed block architecture (FBA) which, after being RAIDed together (RAID is 'Redundant Array of Independent Disks'), create virtual FBA volumes consisting of multiple 1GB (1,000,000,000) extents. These extents are 'raw' storage. However, z/OS only recognizes count key data (CKD) formatted tracks and native 3390 drives (with a multiple platters on a single spindle) have not been manufactured in this century. To remedy this, when the DS8k frame is installed, each 1 GB FBA extent is configured as 1,113 CKD cylinders. Larger virtual 3390s are then constructed from these configured extents. Not exactly sure what you're looking at in the DS8k GUI, but '1.99Kmod1' sounds like '1.99 k mod1' 3390s, or 1.99 x 1000 x 946,005,480 bytes. Or 1,882,550,905,200 bytes. Or 1.88 TB Notice that almost 5.4% of the raw storage has been 'lost' when the FBA disk is configured as CKD storage. Now add the space 'lost' to VTOCs, VTOC indices, VVDSs, and unused space, both within the boundaries of an allocated data set and the free space on each 3390 volume. The remainder is data. Not sure how the all-flash DS8900F works as far as configuring and 'lost' space. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mike Schwab Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 3:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Texas Comptroller's email system. DO NOT click links or open attachments unless you expect them from the sender and know the content is safe.
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
I understood Jake's question differently; I thought he was just asking what was indicated by what he saw in the DS8k GUI and whether his z/OS capacity could be determined from the DS8k GUI. I do not believe it can be. People familiar with DS8k frames configured as ECKD storage can quibble about how much of the magnetic surface actually contains application data until the cows come home. All good. The question I hinted at (sorry, should have clearly asked) was how any of this changes as we move from a DS8k with spinning disked RAIDed together to a flash-based DS8900F. I ask because I have no experience with DS8900F technology. Without spinning parts, are there still IRGs, even virtual, when a DS8900F is configured as ECKD? An ECKD-configured DS8k still has this 'wasted' space, even though the 3390 IRGs do not necessarily correspond to anything phsical on the Seagate disks spinning inside the frame. The IRGs exist (I assume) so facilitate the DS8k appearing to be a native 3390 to z/OS. I intended to ask: 'Are all of these inefficienies still mirrored in this next generation (DS8900F) for the sake of still appearing to be a native 3390 to z/OS?' -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Allan Staller Sent: Friday, January 20, 2023 7:33 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Texas Comptroller's email system. DO NOT click links or open attachments unless you expect them from the sender and know the content is safe. Classification: Confidential With IRGs and other "overhead" the usable capacity is about 0.8 GB whis is what I use when making "capacity" calculations. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Michael Watkins Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 7:38 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box [CAUTION: This Email is from outside the Organization. Unless you trust the sender, Don't click links or open attachments as it may be a Phishing email, which can steal your Information and compromise your Computer.] See https://gcc02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ibm.com%2Fdocs%2Fen%2Fzvse%2F6.2%3Ftopic%3DSSB27H_6.2.0%2Ffe6rf_optimizing_casize_disksizes.htm=05%7C01%7Cmichael.watkins%40CPA.TEXAS.GOV%7C25d11e0d5d97418180ba08dafaeaf23b%7C2055feba299d4d0daa5a73b8b42fef08%7C0%7C0%7C638098184244423910%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=rd9gpav7skfFG71CwkHBsbThcTi2c1QopulawSE4WGA%3D=0 A 3390 MOD-1 has 1,113 cylinders. Each 3390 cylinder has 15 tracks. Each 3390 track has 56,664 bytes. 1,113 x 15 x 56,664 = 946,005,480 There are 946,005,480 bytes in a 3390 MOD-1 disk drive. Or roughly 0.946 GB. The PC-compatible disk drives in your DS8k frame have a fixed block architecture (FBA) which, after being RAIDed together (RAID is 'Redundant Array of Independent Disks'), create virtual FBA volumes consisting of multiple 1GB (1,000,000,000) extents. These extents are 'raw' storage. However, z/OS only recognizes count key data (CKD) formatted tracks and native 3390 drives (with a multiple platters on a single spindle) have not been manufactured in this century. To remedy this, when the DS8k frame is installed, each 1 GB FBA extent is configured as 1,113 CKD cylinders. Larger virtual 3390s are then constructed from these configured extents. Not exactly sure what you're looking at in the DS8k GUI, but '1.99Kmod1' sounds like '1.99 k mod1' 3390s, or 1.99 x 1000 x 946,005,480 bytes. Or 1,882,550,905,200 bytes. Or 1.88 TB Notice that almost 5.4% of the raw storage has been 'lost' when the FBA disk is configured as CKD storage. Now add the space 'lost' to VTOCs, VTOC indices, VVDSs, and unused space, both within the boundaries of an allocated data set and the free space on each 3390 volume. The remainder is data. Not sure how the all-flash DS8900F works as far as configuring and 'lost' space. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mike Schwab Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 3:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Texas Comptroller's email system. DO NOT click links or open attachments unless you expect them from the sender and know the content is safe. 846,236,160 bytes * 1990 M1s is 1,684,009,958,400 bytes. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 3:53 AM Mike Schwab wrote: 3390-1 is 846,236,160 bytes. Divide by 1000 or 1024 three times for a Gigabyte factor, or four times for a Terabyte conversion factor. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 1:29 AM Jake Anderson wrote: Hello I was going through the storage usage in DS8K Gui login And I can see the utilization of CKD Pool is given as 1.99Kmod1 Is there a way to convert these value in Terabyte? Jake -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
Classification: Confidential With IRGs and other "overhead" the usable capacity is about 0.8 GB whis is what I use when making "capacity" calculations. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Michael Watkins Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 7:38 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box [CAUTION: This Email is from outside the Organization. Unless you trust the sender, Don't click links or open attachments as it may be a Phishing email, which can steal your Information and compromise your Computer.] See https://apc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ibm.com%2Fdocs%2Fen%2Fzvse%2F6.2%3Ftopic%3DSSB27H_6.2.0%2Ffe6rf_optimizing_casize_disksizes.htm=05%7C01%7Callan.staller%40HCL.COM%7C7c799a3966fb4479bd1508dafa226a7d%7C189de737c93a4f5a8b686f4ca9941912%7C0%7C0%7C638097323032761646%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=1wsfScFEfiVR5dw2MXTEwU9dywSrr4STCYnLUgmcXMM%3D=0 A 3390 MOD-1 has 1,113 cylinders. Each 3390 cylinder has 15 tracks. Each 3390 track has 56,664 bytes. 1,113 x 15 x 56,664 = 946,005,480 There are 946,005,480 bytes in a 3390 MOD-1 disk drive. Or roughly 0.946 GB. The PC-compatible disk drives in your DS8k frame have a fixed block architecture (FBA) which, after being RAIDed together (RAID is 'Redundant Array of Independent Disks'), create virtual FBA volumes consisting of multiple 1GB (1,000,000,000) extents. These extents are 'raw' storage. However, z/OS only recognizes count key data (CKD) formatted tracks and native 3390 drives (with a multiple platters on a single spindle) have not been manufactured in this century. To remedy this, when the DS8k frame is installed, each 1 GB FBA extent is configured as 1,113 CKD cylinders. Larger virtual 3390s are then constructed from these configured extents. Not exactly sure what you're looking at in the DS8k GUI, but '1.99Kmod1' sounds like '1.99 k mod1' 3390s, or 1.99 x 1000 x 946,005,480 bytes. Or 1,882,550,905,200 bytes. Or 1.88 TB Notice that almost 5.4% of the raw storage has been 'lost' when the FBA disk is configured as CKD storage. Now add the space 'lost' to VTOCs, VTOC indices, VVDSs, and unused space, both within the boundaries of an allocated data set and the free space on each 3390 volume. The remainder is data. Not sure how the all-flash DS8900F works as far as configuring and 'lost' space. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mike Schwab Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 3:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Texas Comptroller's email system. DO NOT click links or open attachments unless you expect them from the sender and know the content is safe. 846,236,160 bytes * 1990 M1s is 1,684,009,958,400 bytes. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 3:53 AM Mike Schwab wrote: 3390-1 is 846,236,160 bytes. Divide by 1000 or 1024 three times for a Gigabyte factor, or four times for a Terabyte conversion factor. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 1:29 AM Jake Anderson wrote: Hello I was going through the storage usage in DS8K Gui login And I can see the utilization of CKD Pool is given as 1.99Kmod1 Is there a way to convert these value in Terabyte? Jake -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ::DISCLAIMER:: The contents of this e-mail and any attachment(s) are confidential and intended for the named recipient(s) only. E-mail transmission is not guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or may contain viruses in transmission. The e mail and its contents (with or without referred errors) shall therefore not attach any liability on the originator or HCL or its affiliates. Views or opinions, if any, presented in this email are solely those of the author and may not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of HCL or its affiliates. Any form of reproduction, dissemination, copying, disclosure, modification, distribution and / or publication of this message without the prior written consent of authorized representative of HCL is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error please delete it and notify the sender immediately. Before opening any email and/or attachments, please check them for virus
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
I could be wrong, but I suspect that any information you get from the GUI will simply tell you how much of the raw storage has been configured as volumes that can be used by the operating systems connected to your DS8k. The GUI cannot make sense of the data on the volumes. To the GUI, I think those volumes appear to be no more than a stream of zeros and ones. It cannot tell the difference between unused space and data. To ascertain the utilization of those volumes, you must use the commands or utilities executed on the operating systems that know them as data. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Jake Anderson Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 11:40 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Texas Comptroller's email system. DO NOT click links or open attachments unless you expect them from the sender and know the content is safe. Is there a command or facility within DS8K to generate storage array utilization report ? On Thu, Jan 19, 2023, 5:51 PM Paul Gorlinsky wrote: > This is the theoretical maximum… not realistic… the available usable > space is 100% determined by the blksize and optional key size… zOS use > at most > 1/2 track blocking … it you force a 32760 block size you will waste > about 12k per track… safe numbers are about 90% for estimating > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
Is there a command or facility within DS8K to generate storage array utilization report ? On Thu, Jan 19, 2023, 5:51 PM Paul Gorlinsky wrote: > This is the theoretical maximum… not realistic… the available usable space > is 100% determined by the blksize and optional key size… zOS use at most > 1/2 track blocking … it you force a 32760 block size you will waste about > 12k per track… safe numbers are about 90% for estimating > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
This is the theoretical maximum… not realistic… the available usable space is 100% determined by the blksize and optional key size… zOS use at most 1/2 track blocking … it you force a 32760 block size you will waste about 12k per track… safe numbers are about 90% for estimating -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
See https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zvse/6.2?topic=SSB27H_6.2.0/fe6rf_optimizing_casize_disksizes.htm A 3390 MOD-1 has 1,113 cylinders. Each 3390 cylinder has 15 tracks. Each 3390 track has 56,664 bytes. 1,113 x 15 x 56,664 = 946,005,480 There are 946,005,480 bytes in a 3390 MOD-1 disk drive. Or roughly 0.946 GB. The PC-compatible disk drives in your DS8k frame have a fixed block architecture (FBA) which, after being RAIDed together (RAID is 'Redundant Array of Independent Disks'), create virtual FBA volumes consisting of multiple 1GB (1,000,000,000) extents. These extents are 'raw' storage. However, z/OS only recognizes count key data (CKD) formatted tracks and native 3390 drives (with a multiple platters on a single spindle) have not been manufactured in this century. To remedy this, when the DS8k frame is installed, each 1 GB FBA extent is configured as 1,113 CKD cylinders. Larger virtual 3390s are then constructed from these configured extents. Not exactly sure what you're looking at in the DS8k GUI, but '1.99Kmod1' sounds like '1.99 k mod1' 3390s, or 1.99 x 1000 x 946,005,480 bytes. Or 1,882,550,905,200 bytes. Or 1.88 TB Notice that almost 5.4% of the raw storage has been 'lost' when the FBA disk is configured as CKD storage. Now add the space 'lost' to VTOCs, VTOC indices, VVDSs, and unused space, both within the boundaries of an allocated data set and the free space on each 3390 volume. The remainder is data. Not sure how the all-flash DS8900F works as far as configuring and 'lost' space. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mike Schwab Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2023 3:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: KMOD1 DS8k box CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Texas Comptroller's email system. DO NOT click links or open attachments unless you expect them from the sender and know the content is safe. 846,236,160 bytes * 1990 M1s is 1,684,009,958,400 bytes. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 3:53 AM Mike Schwab wrote: 3390-1 is 846,236,160 bytes. Divide by 1000 or 1024 three times for a Gigabyte factor, or four times for a Terabyte conversion factor. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 1:29 AM Jake Anderson wrote: Hello I was going through the storage usage in DS8K Gui login And I can see the utilization of CKD Pool is given as 1.99Kmod1 Is there a way to convert these value in Terabyte? Jake -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
846,236,160 bytes * 1990 M1s is 1,684,009,958,400 bytes. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 3:53 AM Mike Schwab wrote: > > 3390-1 is 846,236,160 bytes. Divide by 1000 or 1024 three times for a > Gigabyte factor, or four times for a Terabyte conversion factor. > > On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 1:29 AM Jake Anderson > wrote: > > > > Hello > > > > I was going through the storage usage in DS8K Gui login And I can see the > > utilization of CKD Pool is given as 1.99Kmod1 > > > > Is there a way to convert these value in Terabyte? > > > > Jake > > > > -- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > -- > Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA > Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: KMOD1 DS8k box
3390-1 is 846,236,160 bytes. Divide by 1000 or 1024 three times for a Gigabyte factor, or four times for a Terabyte conversion factor. On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 1:29 AM Jake Anderson wrote: > > Hello > > I was going through the storage usage in DS8K Gui login And I can see the > utilization of CKD Pool is given as 1.99Kmod1 > > Is there a way to convert these value in Terabyte? > > Jake > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
KMOD1 DS8k box
Hello I was going through the storage usage in DS8K Gui login And I can see the utilization of CKD Pool is given as 1.99Kmod1 Is there a way to convert these value in Terabyte? Jake -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
