Re: [IceHorses] Re: Legs, Form, Function, Flight and Movement
>Do you think you can get some video of Icelandics over there, moving >towards the camera, no identification of horse or rider, just the >flight of the front legs? Video is difficult for me to get as I'm usually taking still photos - but here are the ones I got from the front at the last show. In no particular order, a family horse, a couple of competition horses, a young horse at her first competition and a stallion. > >Do they wear their protective boots in dressage? The ones I've watched here didn't. In other countries, some wore simple bell boots, or nothing. > >Do you remember when some of the European subscribers said that the >legs had to be crooked to gait? > Sigh... Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
[IceHorses] Re: Legs, Form, Function, Flight and Movement
>>> 5 is the lowest that can be awarded, and is, effectively, a zero. > However, the lowest I've ever seen given is a 6 - but then I've not > seen horses with movement and legs as bad as shown on the video ever > presented at a breeding assessment. Do you think you can get some video of Icelandics over there, moving towards the camera, no identification of horse or rider, just the flight of the front legs? they also walk, do slow tolt, and (apart from at WC) do dressage Do they wear their protective boots in dressage? legs, the poor movement? Say we have a gaited horse show with several > >breeds how do you suppose the Icelandic looks compared to the > >other breeds, leg-wise? > > > Never happened so far in the UK! lol Ha! Yes, I understand! But it is more common here and the problems with the legs are recognized. Do you remember when some of the European subscribers said that the legs had to be crooked to gait? Judy
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Legs, Form, Function, Flight and Movement
i think some consideration should be given to--- how devices alter a horse's conformation. Like tiedowns, dropped nosebands too tight, held behind the verticle-- can creat a ewe neck. Also weighted boots. I see and ride with many many many gaited ex-show horses. Have you ever seen how a ballerina has a funny goofy walk and stance due to stretched tendons and years and years of over developed muscles, a funny stance, etc. they walk with toes out like a duck. I can often tell a gaited ex show horse by the way they stand and walk. They are sometimes loosey goosey in the front feet, stretched out tendons etc., muscle compensation. These are things that wont show up when used for breeding. BUT what WILL show up is the lousy gait they used the devices to correct in the first place. That shows up in breeding, and in fact the signature gait of the tennessee walking horse has been bred nearly out of existence. They breed for pace so the heavy shoes will square them up. Then everyone wants to breed to the WGC right? so then you have generation after generation of pacey horses going around clanking with chains and weighted shoes to square them up. its a tragedy really. and very very stupid. in my last TWHBEA "Stallion Registry" book there was only one horse pictured that was being ridden gaiting naturally. ALL the rest were posed in show ribbons, parked out. From that you would kinda get the idea of whats most important to that registry now. Show posing, not gaiting. Why didnt they just take quarter horses and pad them up instead of breeding the gait out of an entire breed. And of course when it first started happening everyone who pointed out what was happening was ridiculed, driven away. Thats how the RHBAA registry began, then next thing you know, it crept there, then the NWHA began, no soring, now its creeping into there. why? Because national level show people do whatever they need to do to win Janice Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Legs, Form, Function, Flight and Movement
>Do any of the horses who have legs and movement (as in the video) get >big fat ZERO for their leg scores? Should they? or shouldn't they? 5 is the lowest that can be awarded, and is, effectively, a zero. However, the lowest I've ever seen given is a 6 - but then I've not seen horses with movement and legs as bad as shown on the video ever presented at a breeding assessment. >In the competitions, the horses aren't asked to do much other than go >straight and fast, right? No - they also walk, do slow tolt, and (apart from at WC) do dressage etc. >legs, the poor movement? Say we have a gaited horse show with several >breeds how do you suppose the Icelandic looks compared to the >other breeds, leg-wise? > Never happened so far in the UK! lol Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
[IceHorses] Re: Legs, Form, Function, Flight and Movement
I would like to see video of the front legs in flight, of some evaluated Icelandic Horses. I think it would be good to see some of the stallions particularly, but any evaluated horse would be good. Anyone up for video'ing their horses' legs and flight? We need to learn more about the conformation of the front legs, and the biomechanics. I realize that this can make people and their horses vulnerable, but I think that, at some point, attention should be paid to breeding good functional legs, and we can only do that with knowledge and education. You can send the video to me anonymously if you want. And if you don't want to do that, at least go out and video your horse's legs and analyze the video. Try to look at it with an unbiased eye. Figure out if your breeding stock have legs good enough to reproduce. Thanks! Judy
[IceHorses] Re: Legs, Form, Function, Flight and Movement
> >Do you think anything else should be done to have a greater impact on people > >breeding better legs? > > > Make it count more in the breeding assessments - but saying that, a > lot of the most popular stallions are the ones that do really well in > competition, and many of them do not have really good conformation. Do any of the horses who have legs and movement (as in the video) get big fat ZERO for their leg scores? Should they? or shouldn't they? I mean, heck, the breeding guidelines are there for a reason; is anyone breeding legs according to the standard? > Handsome is as handsome does, I suppose. There was a talk at the WC > about this very subject - basically, how well do the marks gained in > the breeding assessment correlate with marks gained in competitions, > ie do good competition horses need good conformation? In the competitions, the horses aren't asked to do much other than go straight and fast, right? > My personal feeling is that a horse does not need straight legs/good > conformation to do well in competition IN THE SHORT TERM. That makes > sense to me - however, practically speaking, Icelandic competition > horses do seem to be competing at some ripe old ages, so perhaps good > sense and reality don't come that close together in this instance. Again, straight and fast, so they aren't doing much of anything that requires suppleness, agility, athleticism. Do we think that other people who see the horses don't see the crooked legs, the poor movement? Say we have a gaited horse show with several breeds how do you suppose the Icelandic looks compared to the other breeds, leg-wise? Judy
