Re: [id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[Jim]

curiga oleh sebab yang sama karena ZTE dan Huawei juga pegang infrastruktur 
seluler.
cuman ZTE bonus aja ada penjualan ke Korea Utara

padahal Korea Utara juga borong Mac lho ... 

On Sunday, April 22, 2018 at 5:19:20 PM UTC+7, Hans wrote:

> Bukannya beda kasus om ?
> Huawei dianggap memata matai pengguna ponsel, makanya pemerintah AS 
> menghimbau warganya jangan pake huawei
>
> Sedangkan Zte melanggar embargo, akibatnya Zte dilarang menggunakan 
> teknologi AS dlm hal ini ya android dkk nya.
>
>>

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Re: [id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[Anwar Thamrin]



Ga sanggup juga belinya om.

Sent from my Razer

On Sun, 22 Apr 2018, 10:40 Defriando Riza,  wrote:

> fyi.. padahal niat nya mo icip icip zte axon m nya mbah antham ini..,
>
> ZTE no longer has a viable smartphone program thanks to U.S. sanctions,
> but was it a fair decision?
>
> The U.S. government has basically killed ZTE's smartphone business by
> blocking access to Google's services. There are a lot of headlines that
> talk about the ban in different ways, but when you get right down to the
> nitty-gritty that is what you are left with.
>
> The short version is this: ZTE was caught (and admitted to) selling mobile
> equipment to Iran and North Korea, which are two of the very few countries
> that the U.S. considers the "enemy," and a company isn't allowed to do
> business with either if it wants to do business with U.S. based companies.
> A punishment was set for this, which ZTE agreed to, and the U.S. says that
> ZTE did not adhere to it so the Secretary of Commerce issued a denial order
> against the company that says in part:
>
> [ZTE] may not, directly or indirectly, participate in any way in any
> transaction involving any commodity, software or technology exported or to
> be exported from the United States.
>
> The long version of the events is an interesting read and I don't want to
> downplay what ZTE did here. Whether you like the U.S. position or not, ZTE
> admittedly sold goods to the two countries knowing what the outcome could
> be. Whether or not the company followed the original order that levied a
> $1.19 billion fine, directed the company to fire four executives and to
> dole out a reprimand to 35 other employees is in question as ZTE claims it
> did what was required while the U.S. says it did not, but there's no doubt
> that ZTE did what it did knowing what the outcome could be. And that's what
> it ended up being — ZTE can't use software exported from the U.S.
>
> ZTE can use Android but can't use the software that makes people want
> Android.
>
> That doesn't mean the company can't use Android. but it does mean it can't
> use the part of Android that makes people in the west want to buy a phone.
> Android is just a bunch of source code that anyone can download and build
> into their operating system. The final product will work almost the same as
> a phone you can buy anywhere else, but will not have any of Google's apps
> or services, including the Play Store. Millions of phones like this are
> sold every year in China where vendors have developed their own app
> store(s) so it is a viable alternative, but almost zero phones like this
> are sold in the U.S. and Western Europe. ZTE will either have to try and
> compete with established brands in China or try to build their own app
> store for Europe, neither of which seems very likely. In either case it
> won't be able to sell a phone or anything else in the U.S.
>
> 
>
> All of this sounds very draconian when you consider the U.S. position. And
> it's easy to compare this to the recent ban on Huawei phones, though they
> two instances are very different. Huawei is accused of being a shell
> company of the Chinese government and U.S. intelligence services say using
> their products — including smartphones — is a danger to consumers and to
> government interests. Huawei vehemently denies these claims. ZTE was
> actually charged with, and pleaded guilty to, what amounts to aiding and
> abetting an enemy of the state then failed to follow through with the
> punishment it was given. The fact that both companies are from China and
> also big players when it comes to network infrastructure equipment and 5G
> technology adoption shouldn't be ignored, but "officially" has nothing to
> do with either companies treatment by the U.S.
>
> ZTE claims it followed the original U.S. order but the Dept. of Commerce
> says it did not.
>
> What the Secretary of Commerce did to ZTE is harsh. I don't think anyone
> can argue that it's not, because it will likely end the company's
> smartphone business. But was is fair? Originally, ZTE was fined, ordered to
> fire four executives and reprimand 35 additional employees. The U.S. claims
> that ZTE did not sufficiently reprimand those 35 employees though it did
> pay the $1.19 billion fine and fire the company executives. ZTE
> disagrees, but even if the U.S. is correct with the assertion that ZTE did
> not follow through, not allowing the company to engage in commerce with
> U.S. software companies is not something to be taken lightly. Nor is ZTE's
> original sin of doing business with Iran and North Korea.
>
> We all have our own opinion here, both on U.S. policy towards Iran and
> North Korea as well as the ruling against ZTE. I think ZTE got exactly what
> it deserved.
>
> I have no position on whether Iran and North Korea are enemy states. I
> hope that the U.S. wouldn't withhold any humanitarian aid should the need
> arise, but I can't have any opinion on relations 

Re: [id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[han s]

Bukannya beda kasus om ?
Huawei dianggap memata matai pengguna ponsel, makanya pemerintah AS
menghimbau warganya jangan pake huawei

Sedangkan Zte melanggar embargo, akibatnya Zte dilarang menggunakan
teknologi AS dlm hal ini ya android dkk nya.




On Sun, 22 Apr 2018, 4:30 PM Jim,  wrote:

> Efek langsungnya ZTE dan Huawei gak bisa rilis resmi hape mereka dan dapat
> market share besar di Amerika. Meski marketnya gak terlalu besar, tapi
> eksposur mereka akan lebih baik kalo bisa rilis flagship di pasar Amerika.
>
> --
> ===
> Install  #MyTelkomsel Apps Terbaru dari Play Store
> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.telkomsel.telkomselcm
>
> --
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> ---
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>
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>
> ==
> ---
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> Indonesian Android Community" dari Google Grup.
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> kirim email ke id-android+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> Kunjungi grup ini di https://groups.google.com/group/id-android.
>

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Re: [id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[armansyah]

semoga gara2 ini harganya bisa turun

On Sun, Apr 22, 2018, 17:30 Jim  wrote:

> Efek langsungnya ZTE dan Huawei gak bisa rilis resmi hape mereka dan dapat
> market share besar di Amerika. Meski marketnya gak terlalu besar, tapi
> eksposur mereka akan lebih baik kalo bisa rilis flagship di pasar Amerika.
>
> --
> ===
> Install  #MyTelkomsel Apps Terbaru dari Play Store
> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.telkomsel.telkomselcm
>
> --
> Kontak Admin, Twitter  @agushamonangan
> ---
> FB Groups :  https://www.facebook.com/groups/android.or.id
>
> Aturan Umum  ID-ANDROID >> goo.gl/mL1mBT
>
> ==
> ---
> Anda menerima pesan ini karena Anda berlangganan grup "[id-android]
> Indonesian Android Community" dari Google Grup.
> Untuk berhenti berlangganan dan berhenti menerima email dari grup ini,
> kirim email ke id-android+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> Kunjungi grup ini di https://groups.google.com/group/id-android.
>

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Re: [id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[Jim]

Efek langsungnya ZTE dan Huawei gak bisa rilis resmi hape mereka dan dapat 
market share besar di Amerika. Meski marketnya gak terlalu besar, tapi eksposur 
mereka akan lebih baik kalo bisa rilis flagship di pasar Amerika.

-- 
===
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https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.telkomsel.telkomselcm

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---
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==
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Android Community" dari Google Grup.
Untuk berhenti berlangganan dan berhenti menerima email dari grup ini, kirim 
email ke id-android+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
Kunjungi grup ini di https://groups.google.com/group/id-android.

Re: [id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[Arif Budiman]

Apakah bakal masih bisa install Google Apps terpisah? Kan sudah biasa
begitu saat pakai custom rom yang nggak ada google appsnya.

On Sun, 22 Apr 2018, 10:40 Defriando Riza,  wrote:

> fyi.. padahal niat nya mo icip icip zte axon m nya mbah antham ini..,
>
> ZTE no longer has a viable smartphone program thanks to U.S. sanctions,
> but was it a fair decision?
>
> The U.S. government has basically killed ZTE's smartphone business by
> blocking access to Google's services. There are a lot of headlines that
> talk about the ban in different ways, but when you get right down to the
> nitty-gritty that is what you are left with.
>
> The short version is this: ZTE was caught (and admitted to) selling mobile
> equipment to Iran and North Korea, which are two of the very few countries
> that the U.S. considers the "enemy," and a company isn't allowed to do
> business with either if it wants to do business with U.S. based companies.
> A punishment was set for this, which ZTE agreed to, and the U.S. says that
> ZTE did not adhere to it so the Secretary of Commerce issued a denial order
> against the company that says in part:
>
> [ZTE] may not, directly or indirectly, participate in any way in any
> transaction involving any commodity, software or technology exported or to
> be exported from the United States.
>
> The long version of the events is an interesting read and I don't want to
> downplay what ZTE did here. Whether you like the U.S. position or not, ZTE
> admittedly sold goods to the two countries knowing what the outcome could
> be. Whether or not the company followed the original order that levied a
> $1.19 billion fine, directed the company to fire four executives and to
> dole out a reprimand to 35 other employees is in question as ZTE claims it
> did what was required while the U.S. says it did not, but there's no doubt
> that ZTE did what it did knowing what the outcome could be. And that's what
> it ended up being — ZTE can't use software exported from the U.S.
>
> ZTE can use Android but can't use the software that makes people want
> Android.
>
> That doesn't mean the company can't use Android. but it does mean it can't
> use the part of Android that makes people in the west want to buy a phone.
> Android is just a bunch of source code that anyone can download and build
> into their operating system. The final product will work almost the same as
> a phone you can buy anywhere else, but will not have any of Google's apps
> or services, including the Play Store. Millions of phones like this are
> sold every year in China where vendors have developed their own app
> store(s) so it is a viable alternative, but almost zero phones like this
> are sold in the U.S. and Western Europe. ZTE will either have to try and
> compete with established brands in China or try to build their own app
> store for Europe, neither of which seems very likely. In either case it
> won't be able to sell a phone or anything else in the U.S.
>
> 
>
> All of this sounds very draconian when you consider the U.S. position. And
> it's easy to compare this to the recent ban on Huawei phones, though they
> two instances are very different. Huawei is accused of being a shell
> company of the Chinese government and U.S. intelligence services say using
> their products — including smartphones — is a danger to consumers and to
> government interests. Huawei vehemently denies these claims. ZTE was
> actually charged with, and pleaded guilty to, what amounts to aiding and
> abetting an enemy of the state then failed to follow through with the
> punishment it was given. The fact that both companies are from China and
> also big players when it comes to network infrastructure equipment and 5G
> technology adoption shouldn't be ignored, but "officially" has nothing to
> do with either companies treatment by the U.S.
>
> ZTE claims it followed the original U.S. order but the Dept. of Commerce
> says it did not.
>
> What the Secretary of Commerce did to ZTE is harsh. I don't think anyone
> can argue that it's not, because it will likely end the company's
> smartphone business. But was is fair? Originally, ZTE was fined, ordered to
> fire four executives and reprimand 35 additional employees. The U.S. claims
> that ZTE did not sufficiently reprimand those 35 employees though it did
> pay the $1.19 billion fine and fire the company executives. ZTE
> disagrees, but even if the U.S. is correct with the assertion that ZTE did
> not follow through, not allowing the company to engage in commerce with
> U.S. software companies is not something to be taken lightly. Nor is ZTE's
> original sin of doing business with Iran and North Korea.
>
> We all have our own opinion here, both on U.S. policy towards Iran and
> North Korea as well as the ruling against ZTE. I think ZTE got exactly what
> it deserved.
>
> I have no position on whether Iran and North Korea are enemy states. I
> hope that the U.S. wouldn't withhold any 

Re: [id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[Dhany Sus]

Trump thing...sol

On Sun, Apr 22, 2018, 10:40 AM Defriando Riza 
wrote:

> fyi.. padahal niat nya mo icip icip zte axon m nya mbah antham ini..,
>
> ZTE no longer has a viable smartphone program thanks to U.S. sanctions,
> but was it a fair decision?
>
> The U.S. government has basically killed ZTE's smartphone business by
> blocking access to Google's services. There are a lot of headlines that
> talk about the ban in different ways, but when you get right down to the
> nitty-gritty that is what you are left with.
>
> The short version is this: ZTE was caught (and admitted to) selling mobile
> equipment to Iran and North Korea, which are two of the very few countries
> that the U.S. considers the "enemy," and a company isn't allowed to do
> business with either if it wants to do business with U.S. based companies.
> A punishment was set for this, which ZTE agreed to, and the U.S. says that
> ZTE did not adhere to it so the Secretary of Commerce issued a denial order
> against the company that says in part:
>
> [ZTE] may not, directly or indirectly, participate in any way in any
> transaction involving any commodity, software or technology exported or to
> be exported from the United States.
>
> The long version of the events is an interesting read and I don't want to
> downplay what ZTE did here. Whether you like the U.S. position or not, ZTE
> admittedly sold goods to the two countries knowing what the outcome could
> be. Whether or not the company followed the original order that levied a
> $1.19 billion fine, directed the company to fire four executives and to
> dole out a reprimand to 35 other employees is in question as ZTE claims it
> did what was required while the U.S. says it did not, but there's no doubt
> that ZTE did what it did knowing what the outcome could be. And that's what
> it ended up being — ZTE can't use software exported from the U.S.
>
> ZTE can use Android but can't use the software that makes people want
> Android.
>
> That doesn't mean the company can't use Android. but it does mean it can't
> use the part of Android that makes people in the west want to buy a phone.
> Android is just a bunch of source code that anyone can download and build
> into their operating system. The final product will work almost the same as
> a phone you can buy anywhere else, but will not have any of Google's apps
> or services, including the Play Store. Millions of phones like this are
> sold every year in China where vendors have developed their own app
> store(s) so it is a viable alternative, but almost zero phones like this
> are sold in the U.S. and Western Europe. ZTE will either have to try and
> compete with established brands in China or try to build their own app
> store for Europe, neither of which seems very likely. In either case it
> won't be able to sell a phone or anything else in the U.S.
>
> 
>
> All of this sounds very draconian when you consider the U.S. position. And
> it's easy to compare this to the recent ban on Huawei phones, though they
> two instances are very different. Huawei is accused of being a shell
> company of the Chinese government and U.S. intelligence services say using
> their products — including smartphones — is a danger to consumers and to
> government interests. Huawei vehemently denies these claims. ZTE was
> actually charged with, and pleaded guilty to, what amounts to aiding and
> abetting an enemy of the state then failed to follow through with the
> punishment it was given. The fact that both companies are from China and
> also big players when it comes to network infrastructure equipment and 5G
> technology adoption shouldn't be ignored, but "officially" has nothing to
> do with either companies treatment by the U.S.
>
> ZTE claims it followed the original U.S. order but the Dept. of Commerce
> says it did not.
>
> What the Secretary of Commerce did to ZTE is harsh. I don't think anyone
> can argue that it's not, because it will likely end the company's
> smartphone business. But was is fair? Originally, ZTE was fined, ordered to
> fire four executives and reprimand 35 additional employees. The U.S. claims
> that ZTE did not sufficiently reprimand those 35 employees though it did
> pay the $1.19 billion fine and fire the company executives. ZTE
> disagrees, but even if the U.S. is correct with the assertion that ZTE did
> not follow through, not allowing the company to engage in commerce with
> U.S. software companies is not something to be taken lightly. Nor is ZTE's
> original sin of doing business with Iran and North Korea.
>
> We all have our own opinion here, both on U.S. policy towards Iran and
> North Korea as well as the ruling against ZTE. I think ZTE got exactly what
> it deserved.
>
> I have no position on whether Iran and North Korea are enemy states. I
> hope that the U.S. wouldn't withhold any humanitarian aid should the need
> arise, but I can't have any opinion on relations with either country
> because I 

[id-android] wti :ZTE is DOA, but has the U.S. government gone too far?

[Defriando Riza]

fyi.. padahal niat nya mo icip icip zte axon m nya mbah antham ini..,

ZTE no longer has a viable smartphone program thanks to U.S. sanctions, but
was it a fair decision?

The U.S. government has basically killed ZTE's smartphone business by
blocking access to Google's services. There are a lot of headlines that
talk about the ban in different ways, but when you get right down to the
nitty-gritty that is what you are left with.

The short version is this: ZTE was caught (and admitted to) selling mobile
equipment to Iran and North Korea, which are two of the very few countries
that the U.S. considers the "enemy," and a company isn't allowed to do
business with either if it wants to do business with U.S. based companies.
A punishment was set for this, which ZTE agreed to, and the U.S. says that
ZTE did not adhere to it so the Secretary of Commerce issued a denial order
against the company that says in part:

[ZTE] may not, directly or indirectly, participate in any way in any
transaction involving any commodity, software or technology exported or to
be exported from the United States.

The long version of the events is an interesting read and I don't want to
downplay what ZTE did here. Whether you like the U.S. position or not, ZTE
admittedly sold goods to the two countries knowing what the outcome could
be. Whether or not the company followed the original order that levied a
$1.19 billion fine, directed the company to fire four executives and to
dole out a reprimand to 35 other employees is in question as ZTE claims it
did what was required while the U.S. says it did not, but there's no doubt
that ZTE did what it did knowing what the outcome could be. And that's what
it ended up being — ZTE can't use software exported from the U.S.

ZTE can use Android but can't use the software that makes people want
Android.

That doesn't mean the company can't use Android. but it does mean it can't
use the part of Android that makes people in the west want to buy a phone.
Android is just a bunch of source code that anyone can download and build
into their operating system. The final product will work almost the same as
a phone you can buy anywhere else, but will not have any of Google's apps
or services, including the Play Store. Millions of phones like this are
sold every year in China where vendors have developed their own app
store(s) so it is a viable alternative, but almost zero phones like this
are sold in the U.S. and Western Europe. ZTE will either have to try and
compete with established brands in China or try to build their own app
store for Europe, neither of which seems very likely. In either case it
won't be able to sell a phone or anything else in the U.S.



All of this sounds very draconian when you consider the U.S. position. And
it's easy to compare this to the recent ban on Huawei phones, though they
two instances are very different. Huawei is accused of being a shell
company of the Chinese government and U.S. intelligence services say using
their products — including smartphones — is a danger to consumers and to
government interests. Huawei vehemently denies these claims. ZTE was
actually charged with, and pleaded guilty to, what amounts to aiding and
abetting an enemy of the state then failed to follow through with the
punishment it was given. The fact that both companies are from China and
also big players when it comes to network infrastructure equipment and 5G
technology adoption shouldn't be ignored, but "officially" has nothing to
do with either companies treatment by the U.S.

ZTE claims it followed the original U.S. order but the Dept. of Commerce
says it did not.

What the Secretary of Commerce did to ZTE is harsh. I don't think anyone
can argue that it's not, because it will likely end the company's
smartphone business. But was is fair? Originally, ZTE was fined, ordered to
fire four executives and reprimand 35 additional employees. The U.S. claims
that ZTE did not sufficiently reprimand those 35 employees though it did
pay the $1.19 billion fine and fire the company executives. ZTE disagrees,
but even if the U.S. is correct with the assertion that ZTE did not follow
through, not allowing the company to engage in commerce with U.S. software
companies is not something to be taken lightly. Nor is ZTE's original sin
of doing business with Iran and North Korea.

We all have our own opinion here, both on U.S. policy towards Iran and
North Korea as well as the ruling against ZTE. I think ZTE got exactly what
it deserved.

I have no position on whether Iran and North Korea are enemy states. I hope
that the U.S. wouldn't withhold any humanitarian aid should the need arise,
but I can't have any opinion on relations with either country because I
don't have access to any of the reasons why, outside of speculation. None
of us regular folks do. I do know enough to say that anyone arguing
differently is either blowing smoke or subject to court martial so there is
no way to discuss whether the U.S. is