EAI WG Interim Meeting
The EAI WG will hold an interim meeting to prompt the working process of the WG. Meeting Time: June 5, 2006( From 9:00 am to 18:00 pm) ( Note: We change the meeting time from June1/2 to June 5 to avoid conflict with other interim meeting) Local Host: China Internet Network Information Center(CNNIC) Meeting Venue: Conference Center of Computer Network Information Center, Chinese Academy of Sciences The 5th floor, Building 2, No.4 South 4th Street, ZhongGuanCun, Beijing, 100080, China Meeting Facilities: 1) The meeting room can support less than 100 persons 2) Wireless internet access will be availabe 3) IP-based Video conference facilities will be available, the address will be announce in one week later. Hotels: 1) Jade Palace Hotel(five star) http://www.jadepalace.com.cn/ (10 minutes to meeting venue by walk) 2) TianHong Plaza Hotel(four star) http://www.tianhongplaza.com/ (15 minutes to meeting venue by walk) If you need the local host to book hotel for you, please send email to me, including your requirement and budget. Proposed Agenda: 1) Drafts review ( Suggest you to read all the published drafts before attending this meeting, including framework, smtpext, utf8headers, downgrade, and etc. ) 2) *Testing plan( more email software developers providers or vendors are welcome to joining) 3) Open issues (TBD) Please add more issues into agenda, if needed. Please send your name to the WG co-chairs, if you plan to attend this interim meeting. And that, if you need invitation letter to get visa, send request to co-chairs, too. Harald Alvestrand Xiaodong Lee EAI WG co-chairs ___ IETF-Announce mailing list IETF-Announce@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce
RE: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: PI addressing in IPv6 advances in ARIN]
The end sites are demanding autonomy with a stable routing system. That set of requirements leads to structured allocations and topology constraints. ...it should be noted that the ones holding the money are the end sites. Which makes a case for concentrating the effort on a stable routing serving autonomous end sites. Frankly paying for an IP address makes as much sence as buying a street address (how about the Post Office putting hot street addresses on sale). It appears that IP address assignment reaches far and beyond Internet engineering and should be administered by the international politically / economically independed structure guided through RFC. [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Tony Hain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Noel Chiappa wrote: the desire not to pass a PI for everyone policy that would explode the routing table. Interesting that you should mention that, because there's zero technical differentiation between PI space and portable addresses. So I have to wonder if this initiative will raise the pressure from users for portable addresses. Depending on how they actually get defined and handed out, portability could be one outcome. Scott a few others of us are working on the next step which would put limits on the extent of that portability (ie: it is manageable to deal with porting between providers within a city, but not between cities). PS: From: Kevin Loch [EMAIL PROTECTED] I find this comment extremely offensive. ... Your implication that the participants were either uninformed or diddn't care about the consequences is completely off base. There's a certain deep irony here, because PI-addresses have been considered at length in the IETF in at least two different WG's - CIDR-D and Multi-6. Both rejected them after extensive discussion. Nevertheless, a policy-making body has seen fit to ignore that, and make an engineering decision to deploy PI-space. It's hard to read that decision any other way than to have it imply that the decisions in those WG's were technically uninformed. No, those groups couldn't see the forest for the trees. They were absolutely technically informed, but completely unwilling to listen to the big picture political reality. This thread is arguing that this policy decision has the opposite problem, but in fact it does not. It is an attempt to get in front of what is a growing wave of demand to head off an outright pronouncement from outside the community which will result in number portability. By moving first we can put in enough technical structure to contain foreseeable problems, while if we wait we will be forced into a quick and dirty random approach that we all know will fail. I was not happy with the policy as worded, but willing to live with it for now as a first step to really fixing the problems facing edge networks. The locator/id split approach is a nice thing to work on, but it will take more than a decade to deploy even if people agree to the result. The fundamental problem is that most of the meager security architecture we do have relies heavily on those being aligned. If they are split all of the firewall silicon will have to be rebuilt and new mechanisms for tracking the identity in flight will have to be developed. Of course none of that work will start until the non-deployable shim approach has proven itself viable. Add to that the fact that it moves any semblance of control the ISP thought they had to the end node and you will find that as they already have said they will do all they can to block its adoption. The IETF has consistently refused to acknowledge that prefixes independent of PA are necessary. The intense focus on maximum aggregation at all costs is just not viable for end customers. A broken routing system is equally not viable, but there is a middle ground that gets messy because it does not have simple solutions without constraining topology. These are all trade-offs, and the ISPs are demanding unconstrained topology with a minimal routing table. That set of requirements leads to efforts like shim6. The end sites are demanding autonomy with a stable routing system. That set of requirements leads to structured allocations and topology constraints. Both sides will have to give, but it should be noted that the ones holding the money are the end sites. Tony ___ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
RE: Reality (was RE: Stupid NAT tricks and how to stop them.)
real time inventory management Wow! I've heard all sorts of claims for what IPv6 will do/include, but I must say that's a new one It's like Wal-Mart approach: the inventory constantly moves, it never sits still on the shelf. IPv6 addressed RFID tags look promising. [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Noel Chiappa [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If Boeing had rolled out IPv6 in 1993-1994 by now they would have ... real time inventory management Wow! I've heard all sorts of claims for what IPv6 will do/include, but I must say that's a new one Noel ___ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
RE: Reality (was RE: Stupid NAT tricks and how to stop them.)
If Boeing had rolled out IPv6 in 1993-1994 when Eric wrote RFC1687 it would not have done anything to their bottom line as of today and wasted my money. If Boeing had rolled out IPv6 in 1993-1994 by now they would have an efficient production and real time inventory management; would have saved billions in costs and were giving (at least part of it) to Michel. As a shareholder you may want to think how you vote during the next shareholders meeting. Cheers, [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Michel Py [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brian, Michel Py wrote: v | /\ +-+ / \ ++ | Upgrade |__/ ? \__| Give money | | To IPv6 | \/ | to Michel | +-+ \ / ++ \/ M. Tough call. Brian E Carpenter wrote: Yes, it is. It's called long term strategic investment versus short term profit taking. That's a very tough call. If Boeing had rolled out IPv6 in 1993-1994 when Eric wrote RFC1687 it would not have done anything to their bottom line as of today and wasted my money. If they had deployed 5 years ago there still would be no return as of today and if they deployed today I see no return (in reduced operating costs) for 5 years. As a shareholder my best interest so far has been not to deploy. My instructions are: keep an eye on the situation, if there is a change in conditions that means IPv6 buck could bring bang _then_ go for it; in the mean time put my cash where it does bring some bang, either by developing new products or by paying me dividends 4 times a year. As long as other shareholders (especially the ones who work there and likely have scores of unvested shares) think the same way, this is the deal. Eliot Lear wrote: Boeing has enough devices and networks that it could on its own probably exhaust a substantial portion of remaining IPv4 address space we have now. They certainly have more than a /8's worth, and that poses RFC1918 problems Boeing has 159,000 employees. RFC1918 space is 17,891,328 addresses. That's more than 100 IP addresses per employee, I think Eric can manage. That being said, I do acknowledge that larger companies such as global ISPs do have a problem with the RFC1918 space being too small. This brings the debate of what to do with class E, either make it extended private space or make it global unicast. Michel. ___ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
OCSP/CA
Hi, I don't understand the publication of crl on the OCSP responder. Does the OCSP responder get the crl? Or Does the CA publish the crl on the OCSP responder? Thanks
Re: Cluster Addressing and CIDR
- Original Message - From: Louis Pouzin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2003 9:48 PM Subject: re: Cluster Addressing and CIDR On Wed, 15 Jan 2003 02:59:09 +0100, J-F C. (Jefsey) Morfin wrote: Louis, some old pre-IETFquestions. What was cata standing for? It's mispelled. The word is catenet. Obvious origin: latin catena - chain; french: caténaire; english: catena, catenation. = Thanks for the name...we partly named a programming language after itC@T http://www.ddj.com/articles/1993/9310/ http://www.computer.org/software/so1991/s3073abs.htm C@T is also aka CALICO as in a C@T of Many Colors... ...and also C+@ because of the addition of the @ operator from Smalltalk to C... Someday I may tell people the whole story behind it... ...but, 8 years of work resulted in Sun studying it and announcing Java... ...and now we have Microsoft with C#... ...instead of Go-Monomaybe it should be Go Figure... http://www.go-mono.com
Re: Searching for depressing moments of Internet history.....
By June and July of 1994 people were trying adult http sites. I'm afraid it's not clear how long before this these sites actually existed. I can tell you that there were very few adult sites in 1994. By 1996 the formula and format for such sites was pretty well fixed and that same formula and format is still used on 99% of sites today. Why the creation of the first porn site is a depressing moment I'm not sure. In the first couple years of the web, adult sites financed it's development. In 1997 and 1998 90% of commerce on the web was adult related. Within two years of the first nudie pic being served via http the adult operators had developed workable streaming video. A year later, in 1997, we installed the first live video with audio streaming from a Dallas office. Adult operators also developed technologies such as digital watermarking, the pay per click advertising model, and usable http payment processing gateways long before these technologies were adopted by mainstream companies. One of the biggest things to make the web the commercially attractive was efficient online payment processing. The first http 3rd party payment processing service was started in March of 1995 by my friend Laith Alsarraf. It would be another TWO YEARS before mainstream sites had a comparable online processor. Porn sites filtered: Date: 1994-07-08 18:37:06 PST http://groups.google.com/groups?q=naked+httpstart=60hl=enlr=ie=UTF-8oe=UTF -8as_drrb=bas_mind=1as_minm=1as_miny=1994as_maxd=13as_maxm=7as_maxy=1994 selm=1994Jul8.110718.18031%40umiami.ir.miami.edurnum=69 On Mon, 13 Jan 2003 11:04:16 +0100, Harald Tveit Alvestrand said: just to be clear - I was thinking of porn sites using the HTTP protocol for access. Best so far: Paul Hoffman thinks that the first one was called Adult Action, and probably predated the official Mosaic release. But that search term is too general for the Internet of today (8240 hits sigh...) Thanks to all who responded! Harald --On mandag, januar 13, 2003 10:53:03 +0100 jfcm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 17:03 12/01/03, Harald Tveit Alvestrand wrote: Despite having lived through much recent history, I've forgotten a lot of it I just wonder: does anyone know/remember when the first Web porn site came online? Wondering whether it was before or after the first official release of Mosaic Obviously depends on what you mean on-line. 1. as Dave said there were sex oriented areas on many computers. 2. I suppose the first commercial sex sites were on Minitel. 3. This means that technically they were on-line from the Internet legal perspective when it interconnected the public nets (84). Actually a few Internet private gateways existed before and some Intelmatics tests were probably carried in the USA as early as 1982, with protocol conversion. I would be surprised that no one test connected them from ARPANET. When people tested from abroad, I do not know why, they always did it with a porn site. 4.UK Universities also shared into Prestel and some where on the Internet (you should inquire there. They had a leading data brokering firm that on-line, I Oxford (?) I think). I do not know about Paris University, but we can investigate. jfc -- ~~~ Ray B. Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.WebmastersGuide.com
Re: Dan Bernstein and FREE PORN!!!
But even if Dan's writing style were something that SA tends to trap, it's not reasonable for people to have to write messages that SA won't trap in order to contribute to a working group. Keith I'D SAY THAT DEPENDS ON WHAT HE WROTE AND WHY IT WAS TAGGED AS SPAM!!! Any mailing list is FREE to filter this SPAM looking email if it appears to be a FREE OFFER for FREE PORN!!! THE SPAM IS BEING FILTERED AT NO CHARGE TO YOU AND I'LL GIVE YOU A LIMITED TIME OFFER - tell me why this message, which looks (to a computer) like it's a SALE on BIG TIT VIDEOS, shouldn't be rejected and you'll WIN A BIG PRIZE!!! Bernstein has told us that he doesn't post from his real email address. If a list I'm on gets a bunch of messages from bogus email addresses that look like this one I wonder why someone can't be expected to lay off the CAPS LOCK and EXCLAMATION POINTS if they want to post without getting on the posters list and they know that it's a problem. Note that with the method I mentioned the sender is notified of exactly why their post was rejected. The get a report like this telling them what to avoid: X-Spam-Report: 20 hits, 12 required; * 1.0 -- Subject: contains a question mark * 1.5 -- BODY: Asks you to click below * 2.0 -- URI: Includes a link to send a mail with a subject * 2.0 -- BODY: Includes a URL link to send an email * 3.5 -- Forged yahoo.com 'Received:' header found * 0.9 -- From and To the same address * 1.1 -- BODY: No experience needed! * 1.6 -- BODY: Contains Casino * 5.0 -- Message text disguised using base-64 encoding * 2.0 -- Received via a relay in ipwhois.rfc-ignorant.org [RBL check: found 11.194.228.204.ipwhois.rfc-ignorant.org., type: 127.0.0.6] ~~~ Ray B. Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.WebmastersGuide.com
Re: a personal opinion on what to do about the sub-ip area
It would seem that the primary objection to #3 (keep sub-IP for a while until some of the WGs finish) is that it may never actually be dissolved. Other than that concern, it would seem that #3 is the most popular option. I propose option #3.2 - pick a definite date some months from now to dissolve sub-IP. That would allow several WGs time to wrap up without extending sub-IP indefinitely. I'm not too familiar with the area, so someone else would probably be more qualified to choose the cut off date. However, for the sake of discussion I propose to continue sub-IP until 9-01-03. ~~~ Ray B. Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.WebmastersGuide.com
Game over. Bernstein 0, IETF 1 (namedroppers)
To Mr. Bernstein and the others involved in this discussion - Whether or not Mr. Bernstein is right, the clear consensus on this list is that the members of this list aren't going to be changing anything. You may be right, but since you clearly are not getting any support here please either take up this grievance somewhere where you can get some support or let it go. It is no longer productive to continue a debate between one person and the rest of the list. At least, it is clearly less productive than other things we could be discussing. ~~~ Ray B. Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.WebmastersGuide.com
[no subject]
Hi, my name is Marco and I write from Italy. I have to develop a system to increase the security on my switched LAN. Switches forward all the broadcast traffic while unicast traffic is redirected only on the right segment... My idea is relying on broadcast traffic to map the hosts.to map means that I would get some data about hosts like operating systems, open ports, etc... What type of broadcast traffic can I rely on?? Does already exists any tools to accomplish this task?? Thanks, Marco Antonioli
broadcast packets
Hi, I'm Marco from Italy and I'm working on a security LAN project. I have to analyze all the hosts on my ethernet relying on their broadcast packets. Already exists a tool that accomplishes this task?? Where can I find a list of broadcast packets sent by all Operating Sysyems?? Thanks, Marco Antonioli
IETF54 multicast/unicast
Hello. I am a student of the Internet. I was would like to attend the IETF54 meeting, however, cannot due to lack of funding. I remember that the IETF53 was broadcast online, and archives stored of the broadcast. I was wondering if the IETF54 would be the same. If so, what URL will it be broadcasted on? All responses greatly appreciated. --Don mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ .
FW: Carol Bertolet/LIONVILLE/WEST is out of the office.
ok, I'll bite. How did this wind up in my mailbox? NAT or fate?? BLB From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Subject: FW: Carol Bertolet/LIONVILLE/WEST is out of the office. Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 11:53:50 -0500 I will be out of the office starting 02/21/2002 and will not return until 02/25/2002. I will be out 1/2 day Thursday afternoon and all day Friday. Please contact MIS Customer Support for all computer issues. Carol Bertolet
Hello!who have the Formal Authentication Model of Security Protocol Based on Intruder codes?
hello! I need codes about "Formal Authentication Model of Security Protocol Based on Intruder " who know or have them?some matrials also is important for me! I am so nervous to programme these,wish to modify some codes to finish my tasks, Thank you a lot! please contract with me! yours Dav,Bob
Re: Jim Fleming's posting privilleges have been revoked
It is a silly question (and I will probably get flamed for this) but I will ask anyway. Was Jim really generating as much traffic as talking about Jim has been generating? BLB From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Subject: Re: Jim Fleming's posting privilleges have been revoked Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2001 09:36:00 -0400 Don't you think a discussion on not having a discussion is off topic? -- James W. Meritt CISSP, CISA
Internet Stock Survey
Dear Sir/Madam, Please allow me to introduce my firm, Internet Stock Surveys. We are undertaking a survey for a syndicate of major financial institutions to determine what their customers want of them. If you could take 3 minutes of your time to complete the survey, not only would we be grateful but you will be entered into a prize draw to win one of five $10,000 online trading accounts at the online broker of your choice. Confidentiality statement: This survey is completely confidential. Your details will not be released to the participating financial institutions or anyone else. If you have any questions, please email us on [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please click the following link to enter the 3 minute survey: http://www.internetstocksurvey.freeserve.co.uk Nigel Forde, President Internet Stock Surveys
FW: perspective
How about legalization of spams? Let's see, let's setup recognized spam server centers (NSC's). Receive revenues from customers , market will dictate acceptable spamming practices, by its success? We can RFC the setup and maintaining guidelines. Pan -Original Message- From: James P. Salsman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 9:44 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: perspective Congratulations. You are lucky I get plenty of spam, sometimes more than 20 per day, but seriously, it only takes me about 20 seconds to ignore it all. Sometimes when I see particularly obnoxious mail, I respond to it in a way that might prevent it in the future, but that usually doesn't take more than 20 minutes a day. The real question is whether I have time to respond, and the amount of ordinary UCBE never really has much impact on that. So it seems like luck has little to do with it. However, I've made more than 500 posts to USENET in the past five years, mostly from this address, so maybe I am lucky. My resume has been on the internet for about as long, so I guess so. If I was lucky as an attribute and not as an accident, then I would certainly be able to get the W3C to abandon its secrecy regulations and instead respect its conflict of interest regulations. If I was just moderatly lucky, it seems like at least a dozen speech technology research and development firms would have offered me work, but only a handful have. Those are the kind of unsolicited offers that make people really happy, so when people start talking about taking away my ability to learn about work that needs to be done, it offends me. Seriously, think about it. If you were laid off from a major networking firm because you were working too hard to improve their market share, wouldn't you love to have access to questions that might lead you to a better job? What if all the professional lists required people to pay before asking -- what would that do to your supply of information about leads? Cheers, James
Easy Money!!!!
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Common Radio Access Protocol Set (CRAPS) BOF
Given that the CRAPS BOF announcement has been sent out by Scott, Phil and I would like to send out an invitation to anyone that wishes to have a slot at the BOF in Pittsburgh. However, given that we have little face to face time, we would stress that we are interested in "presentations" that discuss the problem space and issues that should be addressed by the proposed WG. Protocol-related presentations are not appropriate for BOFs, since the intention is not to figure out how to fix the problem, but rather to understand what the problem is, and whether the IETF should work on the problem. We have no objections if the "presentations" contain a simple pointer to a protocol related Internet-Draft. If you are interested in a slot at the BOF, please send an e-mail to both myself ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) and Phil ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) with a title, a short description, any pointers to Internet-Drafts of relevance, and the amount of time you would need. Although we cannot guarantee that we will accomodate the amount of time requested, we will do our best to fit everyone in, while keeping time for the administravia required in a BOF. For those of you interested in the work being proposed in CRAPS, you may join the mailing list by sending an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and including "subscribe [e-mail]" in the body (do not include the quotes). Thanks, PatC Phil
New member seeks direction
Hello, I am interested in the following topics: 1) Internet television(all related tech info) 2) High speed Internet fundamentals 3) 801.11 DS cards (11mbps) If you can refer me to some web files, I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you for your time and make it a great day. dan
