Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
Hi, On Thu, 09 Sep 2010, Bron Gondwana wrote: On Wed, Sep 08, 2010 at 06:10:44PM +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: What happens if the sharedseen attribute is changed during the lifetime of a folder, when users may already have their own (or shared) \Seen flags? In Cyrus 2.3 and before (i.e. everything that's released now!) they are completely separate. Under the hood, the \Seen flags are actually owned by a 'nobody' user. I take it there's no way to sensibly migrate flag data from one to the other? When a user leaves, it's sometimes useful to hang onto their mailboxes and share them with another member of staff. The \Seen flags can be useful in this instance. In general we wouldn't set seenflags by default so you end up wishing to retro-fit it. In Cyrus 2.4 (when I finish it!) the sharedseen flags are actually the _owner_'s flags. So if I turned on sharedseen on user.brong.SharedFolder then everybody would inherit my \Seen flags. If I turned it back on again, they would each get back their own \Seen flags, and I would keep the shared flags. That sounds like exactly what I want :-) Thanks for the information, Gavin Cyrus Home Page: http://www.cyrusimap.org/ List Archives/Info: http://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/pipermail/info-cyrus/
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
On Thu, 2010-09-09 at 10:55 +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: On Thu, 09 Sep 2010, Bron Gondwana wrote: On Wed, Sep 08, 2010 at 06:10:44PM +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: What happens if the sharedseen attribute is changed during the lifetime of a folder, when users may already have their own (or shared) \Seen flags? In Cyrus 2.3 and before (i.e. everything that's released now!) they are completely separate. Under the hood, the \Seen flags are actually owned by a 'nobody' user. I take it there's no way to sensibly migrate flag data from one to the other? Not that I know of; would be really nice. When a user leaves, it's sometimes useful to hang onto their mailboxes and share them with another member of staff. Yep, we do that all the time. The \Seen flags can be useful in this instance. In general we wouldn't set seenflags by default so you end up wishing to retro-fit it. In Cyrus 2.4 (when I finish it!) the sharedseen flags are actually the _owner_'s flags. So if I turned on sharedseen on user.brong.SharedFolder then everybody would inherit my \Seen flags. If I turned it back on again, they would each get back their own \Seen flags, and I would keep the shared flags. That sounds like exactly what I want :-) So the user's own \Seen flags continue to exist [are just ignored] when shared seen state is enabled? Cyrus Home Page: http://www.cyrusimap.org/ List Archives/Info: http://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/pipermail/info-cyrus/
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
On Thu, Sep 09, 2010 at 06:03:49AM -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: On Thu, 2010-09-09 at 10:55 +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: On Thu, 09 Sep 2010, Bron Gondwana wrote: On Wed, Sep 08, 2010 at 06:10:44PM +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: What happens if the sharedseen attribute is changed during the lifetime of a folder, when users may already have their own (or shared) \Seen flags? In Cyrus 2.3 and before (i.e. everything that's released now!) they are completely separate. Under the hood, the \Seen flags are actually owned by a 'nobody' user. I take it there's no way to sensibly migrate flag data from one to the other? Not that I know of; would be really nice. You could use cyr_dbtool to copy the record from the nobody.seen file into the user's seen file, and vice versa. I'm not sure that's sensible as such! When a user leaves, it's sometimes useful to hang onto their mailboxes and share them with another member of staff. Yep, we do that all the time. Any reason you don't just enable shared seen for all mailboxes? Apart from that it's a huge performance cow on current releases of course. Bah. Sorry, it's hard to even think about Cyrus 2.3 any more because I've been working on the new code for 6 months and using it in production for two! The \Seen flags can be useful in this instance. In general we wouldn't set seenflags by default so you end up wishing to retro-fit it. Yeah - that will be nicer in 2.4 for sure. In Cyrus 2.4 (when I finish it!) the sharedseen flags are actually the _owner_'s flags. So if I turned on sharedseen on user.brong.SharedFolder then everybody would inherit my \Seen flags. If I turned it back on again, they would each get back their own \Seen flags, and I would keep the shared flags. That sounds like exactly what I want :-) So the user's own \Seen flags continue to exist [are just ignored] when shared seen state is enabled? Yes - it's functionally identical to using the owner's username for seen rather than a special nobody user. The .seen files don't get cleaned out, so if you turn shared seen back off, they still have the seen state for the messages they already knew about, but everything since then appears as unseen. Bron. Cyrus Home Page: http://www.cyrusimap.org/ List Archives/Info: http://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/pipermail/info-cyrus/
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
Hi, On Thu, 02 Sep 2010, Gavin McCullagh wrote: sharedseen Enables the use of a shared \Seen flag on messages rather than a per-user \Seen flag. The ’s’ right in the mailbox ACL still controls whether a user can set the shared \Seen flag. Brilliant, thanks. I hadn't noticed that. Just a further question on this. If a folder has sharedseen=true set in the metadata from its creation and forever, I would expect shared seen flags. If a folder always has sharedseen=false for its entire life, I expect per-user \Seen flags. What happens if the sharedseen attribute is changed during the lifetime of a folder, when users may already have their own (or shared) \Seen flags? Gavin Cyrus Home Page: http://www.cyrusimap.org/ List Archives/Info: http://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/pipermail/info-cyrus/
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
On Wed, Sep 08, 2010 at 06:10:44PM +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: If a folder has sharedseen=true set in the metadata from its creation and forever, I would expect shared seen flags. If a folder always has sharedseen=false for its entire life, I expect per-user \Seen flags. What happens if the sharedseen attribute is changed during the lifetime of a folder, when users may already have their own (or shared) \Seen flags? In Cyrus 2.3 and before (i.e. everything that's released now!) they are completely separate. Under the hood, the \Seen flags are actually owned by a 'nobody' user. In Cyrus 2.4 (when I finish it!) the sharedseen flags are actually the _owner_'s flags. So if I turned on sharedseen on user.brong.SharedFolder then everybody would inherit my \Seen flags. If I turned it back on again, they would each get back their own \Seen flags, and I would keep the shared flags. This is because the owner's flags will be stored in the index rather than a separate .seen file for efficiency in the common case - and shared seen is implemented by mapping all the \Seen flags to the index by ignoring the username. Bron ( this stuff it running in production at FastMail - it's not just in my imagination! It's the upgrade path and ancillary tools that aren't ready yet. The core is solid... ) Cyrus Home Page: http://www.cyrusimap.org/ List Archives/Info: http://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/pipermail/info-cyrus/
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
Hi, sorry for the very late reply. On Thu, 12 Aug 2010, Wesley Craig wrote: On 12 Aug 2010, at 09:17, Gavin McCullagh wrote: I gather courier shares the \seen flag between users sharing a folder. Is it possible to do this on cyrus? I believe sharedseen does what you're looking for. See man cyradm: sharedseen Enables the use of a shared \Seen flag on messages rather than a per-user \Seen flag. The ’s’ right in the mailbox ACL still controls whether a user can set the shared \Seen flag. Brilliant, thanks. I hadn't noticed that. The Kolab client may have direct support for managing sharedseen, so you might take a look at that, as well. It has a sufficiently new cyradm to support sharedseen, but it doesn't seem to have a web-based way to do this. Gavin -- Gavin McCullagh Senior System Administrator IT Services Griffith College South Circular Road Dublin 8 Ireland Tel: +353 1 4163365 http://www.gcd.ie http://www.gcd.ie/brochure.pdf http://www.gcd.ie/opendays This E-mail is from Griffith College. The E-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and may be privileged and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you are not the addressee you are prohibited from disclosing its content, copying it or distributing it otherwise than to the addressee. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by replying to this e-mail and delete the e-mail from your computer. Bellerophon Ltd, trades as Griffith College (registered in Ireland No. 60469) with its registered address as Griffith College Campus, South Circular Road, Dublin 8, Ireland. Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Admin API? [Was: Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders]
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 10:59 +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: Hi, sorry for the very late reply. On Thu, 12 Aug 2010, Wesley Craig wrote: On 12 Aug 2010, at 09:17, Gavin McCullagh wrote: I gather courier shares the \seen flag between users sharing a folder. Is it possible to do this on cyrus? I believe sharedseen does what you're looking for. See man cyradm: sharedseen Enables the use of a shared \Seen flag on messages rather than a per-user \Seen flag. The ’s’ right in the mailbox ACL still controls whether a user can set the shared \Seen flag. Brilliant, thanks. I hadn't noticed that. The Kolab client may have direct support for managing sharedseen, so you might take a look at that, as well. It has a sufficiently new cyradm to support sharedseen, but it doesn't seem to have a web-based way to do this. This is a constant pain (cyradm isn't very help-desk friendly). Does anyone know of a, even abandoned, project to implement the cyradm capabilities as a network API? SOAP, XML-RPC, REST, whatever It would be really nice to be able to manage a Cyrus server via an API (and make building clients for that task way easier). -- Adam Tauno Williams awill...@whitemice.org LPIC-1, Novell CLA http://www.whitemiceconsulting.com OpenGroupware, Cyrus IMAPd, Postfix, OpenLDAP, Samba Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
Adam Tauno Williams schrieb: On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 10:59 +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: Hi, sorry for the very late reply. On Thu, 12 Aug 2010, Wesley Craig wrote: On 12 Aug 2010, at 09:17, Gavin McCullagh wrote: I gather courier shares the \seen flag between users sharing a folder. Is it possible to do this on cyrus? I believe sharedseen does what you're looking for. See man cyradm: sharedseen Enables the use of a shared \Seen flag on messages rather than a per-user \Seen flag. The ’s’ right in the mailbox ACL still controls whether a user can set the shared \Seen flag. Brilliant, thanks. I hadn't noticed that. The Kolab client may have direct support for managing sharedseen, so you might take a look at that, as well. It has a sufficiently new cyradm to support sharedseen, but it doesn't seem to have a web-based way to do this. This is a constant pain (cyradm isn't very help-desk friendly). Does anyone know of a, even abandoned, project to implement the cyradm capabilities as a network API? SOAP, XML-RPC, REST, whatever It would be really nice to be able to manage a Cyrus server via an API (and make building clients for that task way easier). I started a small project a few years ago for this in java... https://sourceforge.net/projects/jcyrusapi/ It still does what we need (And we don't needed much at that time...) additionally a search on SF returns a list: https://sourceforge.net/search/?words=cyrustype_of_search=softwords=cyrussearch=Search André smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Admin API? [Was: Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders]
On Thu, 02 Sep 2010 21:47:42 +0900, Adam Tauno Williams awill...@whitemice.org wrote: On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 10:59 +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: Hi, sorry for the very late reply. On Thu, 12 Aug 2010, Wesley Craig wrote: On 12 Aug 2010, at 09:17, Gavin McCullagh wrote: I gather courier shares the \seen flag between users sharing a folder. Is it possible to do this on cyrus? I believe sharedseen does what you're looking for. See man cyradm: sharedseen Enables the use of a shared \Seen flag on messages rather than a per-user \Seen flag. The ?s? right in the mailbox ACL still controls whether a user can set the shared \Seen flag. Brilliant, thanks. I hadn't noticed that. The Kolab client may have direct support for managing sharedseen, so you might take a look at that, as well. It has a sufficiently new cyradm to support sharedseen, but it doesn't seem to have a web-based way to do this. This is a constant pain (cyradm isn't very help-desk friendly). Does anyone know of a, even abandoned, project to implement the cyradm capabilities as a network API? SOAP, XML-RPC, REST, whatever It would be really nice to be able to manage a Cyrus server via an API (and make building clients for that task way easier). I believe the protocol is IMAP. (cyradm is just a IMAP client focused to manage cyrus IMAP Server). -- OBATA Akio / ob...@lins.jp Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Admin API? [Was: Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders]
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 14:58 +0200, André Schild wrote: It has a sufficiently new cyradm to support sharedseen, but it doesn't seem to have a web-based way to do this. This is a constant pain (cyradm isn't very help-desk friendly). Does anyone know of a, even abandoned, project to implement the cyradm capabilities as a network API? SOAP, XML-RPC, REST, whatever It would be really nice to be able to manage a Cyrus server via an API (and make building clients for that task way easier). I started a small project a few years ago for this in java... https://sourceforge.net/projects/jcyrusapi/ It still does what we need (And we don't needed much at that time...) Interesting, I'll probably poke at it. additionally a search on SF returns a list: https://sourceforge.net/search/?words=cyrustype_of_search=softwords=cyrussearch=Search Yep; most of which are completely worthless. And so many go straight to building a WebUI that ends up tied into a myriad other things [LDAP, MySQL, etc...] which ends up not being very general-purpose. Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Admin API? [Was: Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders]
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 22:02 +0900, OBATA Akio wrote: On Thu, 02 Sep 2010 21:47:42 +0900, Adam Tauno Williams awill...@whitemice.org wrote: On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 10:59 +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: Hi, sorry for the very late reply. On Thu, 12 Aug 2010, Wesley Craig wrote: On 12 Aug 2010, at 09:17, Gavin McCullagh wrote: I gather courier shares the \seen flag between users sharing a folder. Is it possible to do this on cyrus? I believe sharedseen does what you're looking for. See man cyradm: sharedseen Enables the use of a shared \Seen flag on messages rather than a per-user \Seen flag. The ?s? right in the mailbox ACL still controls whether a user can set the shared \Seen flag. Brilliant, thanks. I hadn't noticed that. The Kolab client may have direct support for managing sharedseen, so you might take a look at that, as well. It has a sufficiently new cyradm to support sharedseen, but it doesn't seem to have a web-based way to do this. This is a constant pain (cyradm isn't very help-desk friendly). Does anyone know of a, even abandoned, project to implement the cyradm capabilities as a network API? SOAP, XML-RPC, REST, whatever It would be really nice to be able to manage a Cyrus server via an API (and make building clients for that task way easier). I believe the protocol is IMAP. (cyradm is just a IMAP client focused to manage cyrus IMAP Server). Understood; but that doesn't really change the question. mybinding.mailboxInfo(mailbox), just like cyradm info mailbox, is much more approachable than... 17 GETANNOTATION user.adam.fred * value.shared * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/duplicatedeliver (value.shared false) * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/sharedseen (value.shared false) * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/condstore (value.shared false) * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/pop3newuidl (value.shared true) * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/lastpop (value.shared ) * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/lastupdate (value.shared 2-Sep-2010 09:17:54 -0400) * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/size (value.shared 0) * ANNOTATION user.adam.fred /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/partition (value.shared default) 17 OK Complete Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
shared \seen flags on shared folders
Hi, we have a kolab server here which as you probably know uses Cyrus for its IMAP/POP/LMTP services. One issue we come across now and then is with a group who share a generic incoming email address as well as each having their own personal address. This email may take general customer queries for example. They want to be able to share the \seen flag between them, so that if one user reads the email and deals with it, the others no longer see it as unread in their clients. We can set up their email client to have several accounts and share the same username and password between them. However, this is awkward for various reasons. We'd prefer to share the folder among each user, but this gives each user their own copy of the \seen flag which is awkward. I gather courier shares the \seen flag between users sharing a folder. Is it possible to do this on cyrus? Needless to say I can see advantages in either behaviour but it would be handy to have the option of sharing that flag on cyrus. Gavin -- Gavin McCullagh Senior System Administrator IT Services Griffith College South Circular Road Dublin 8 Ireland Tel: +353 1 4163365 http://www.gcd.ie http://www.gcd.ie/brochure.pdf http://www.gcd.ie/opendays This E-mail is from Griffith College. The E-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and may be privileged and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you are not the addressee you are prohibited from disclosing its content, copying it or distributing it otherwise than to the addressee. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by replying to this e-mail and delete the e-mail from your computer. Bellerophon Ltd, trades as Griffith College (registered in Ireland No. 60469) with its registered address as Griffith College Campus, South Circular Road, Dublin 8, Ireland. Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
Dan White wrote: On 12/08/10 14:17 +0100, Gavin McCullagh wrote: we have a kolab server here which as you probably know uses Cyrus for its IMAP/POP/LMTP services. One issue we come across now and then is with a group who share a generic incoming email address as well as each having their own personal address. This email may take general customer queries for example. They want to be able to share the \seen flag between them, so that if one user reads the email and deals with it, the others no longer see it as unread in their clients. Gavin, The /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/sharedseen annotation will share the seen state for a given mailbox. In cyradm, you enable it with: mboxconfig mailbox sharedseen true See the cyradm man page. This feature was introduced in version 2.3.9. Note that setting flushseenstate may come in handy here as well. -- Jeroen van Meeuwen Senior Engineer, Kolab Systems AG e: vanmeeu...@kolabsys.com t: +316 42 801 403 w: http://www.kolabsys.com pgp: 9342 BF08 Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: shared \seen flags on shared folders
Hi, thanks guys, that's exactly what I was looking for. Gavin On Thu, 12 Aug 2010, Wesley Craig wrote: I believe sharedseen does what you're looking for. See man cyradm: On Thu, 12 Aug 2010, Dan White wrote: The /vendor/cmu/cyrus-imapd/sharedseen annotation will share the seen state for a given mailbox. In cyradm, you enable it with: See the cyradm man page. This feature was introduced in version 2.3.9. Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
