Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
Colin, After being without power for 5 hours this evening when a lightening bolt knocked a transmission line to toast, I finally got my power back. IBOCers are KSL-1160, KLOK-1170 and KEX 1190. The KLOK IBOC can be quite a noisy feature. Of course the stations will trash themseolves, but remember that the stations are not supposed to care about listeners outside their city of license. :) 73, Patrick Patrick Martin KAVT Reception Manager ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
There is also a thought, what if the Mexicans turn on the IBOC on combat our IBOC. Legal jamming anyone? 73, Patrick Patrick Martin KAVT Reception Manager ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
[IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
There is an ancient Chinese proverb: Dog who chases tail inevitably eats self... This resonated with me this morning at dawn as I discovered an IBOC user reaping havoc on 1160 and 1180. The less than obvious irony is the fact that KEX Portland is one of America's 1st IBOCers - a mere 10 khz away from the mess that 1170 was kicking up. Additionally, 1180 faces the double-whack of being pummelled by IBOC from 1170 and 1190. My overall point is: Once stations like KSL Salt Lake City, Utah and KGO San Francisco on 810 start getting their nightwave signals trounced by the hash-trash, they will actually turn on each other if not themselves. Overall, IBOC is a foolish scenario entered into way too lightly... like a Las Vegas wedding. I predict that within a year there will be more finger pointing than another Anna Nicole-Smith paternity suit. Random google searches reveal an unusual and stimulating amalgam of non-DXer discussion... Example: http://www.opengeek.org/2005/04/1190-kex-first-portland-hd-am-iboc.html 73, cheers and best of hash free DX! -- Colin Newell - Victoria B.C. Canada www.coffeecrew.com | www.dxer.ca ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
I think this could be a more important factor in the potential failure of IBOC than anything else. It's going to happen on both MW and to a lesser extent on FM. Let the games begin. Keith McGinnis South Hingham MA [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My overall point is: Once stations like KSL Salt Lake City, Utah and KGO San Francisco on 810 start getting their nightwave signals trounced by the hash-trash, they will actually turn on each other if not themselves. -- Colin Newell - Victoria B.C. Canada www.coffeecrew.com | www.dxer.ca ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
Colin Newell of Victoria, BC wrote: This resonated with me this morning at dawn as I discovered an IBOC user reaping havoc on 1160 and 1180. You must be referring to KPUG Bellingham. This is the first report I recall seeing of their turning on a First Adjacent Emaciator. Pete Taylor Tacoma, WA 12225w 4719n ICF2010 + Kiwa air core loop DX398; Palomar loop ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
Well said... For what it's worth, here in San Diego, we have two stations very close together: KOGO-600 running IBOC, and XESS-620, the fraudulent Tijuana station which pretends to be in Ensenada, not running IBOC. KOGO's daytime IBOC hash is enough to put a nasty squeal on top of XESS' signal on 620. It will be interesting to see what happens when two or more legitimate stations start interfering with each other... Although I'm prepared for the worst (a total AM apocalypse which renders the band useless for DXing, even in remote areas like national parks), I cautiously expect the actual outcome will be at least a little less horrible than that... 73, Tim On 4/9/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think this could be a more important factor in the potential failure of IBOC than anything else. It's going to happen on both MW and to a lesser extent on FM. Let the games begin. Keith McGinnis South Hingham MA [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My overall point is: Once stations like KSL Salt Lake City, Utah and KGO San Francisco on 810 start getting their nightwave signals trounced by the hash-trash, they will actually turn on each other if not themselves. -- Colin Newell - Victoria B.C. Canada www.coffeecrew.com | www.dxer.ca ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
Tim Hall wrote: For what it's worth, here in San Diego, we have two stations very close together: KOGO-600 running IBOC, and XESS-620, the fraudulent Tijuana station which pretends to be in Ensenada, not running IBOC. KOGO's daytime IBOC hash is enough to put a nasty squeal on top of XESS' signal on 620. It will be interesting to see what happens when two or more legitimate stations start interfering with each other... Although I'm prepared for the worst (a total AM apocalypse which renders the band useless for DXing, even in remote areas like national parks), I cautiously expect the actual outcome will be at least a little less horrible than that... There are a huge number of what ifs that will combine to tip the balance between less horrible and total AM apocalypse, and I've covered many of them in previous posts (and in an article I'm working on right now for a future issue of DXN.) The biggest question - and this will vary dramatically from station to station and from market to market - is to what extent incoming interference from first-adjacent skywave IBOC signals will damage local analog reception. There are a fair number of AM stations that put enough signal over substantially all of their target local market that they won't be hurt by any imaginable adjacent-channel IBOC. Here in Rochester, WHAM 1180, with its 50 kW ND signal from just a few miles outside of town, is one of those. By the time you get far enough from the 1180 analog signal that it's weak enough to be overcome by IBOC from WWVA on 1170 or WOWO/WLIB on 1190, you're outside the area WHAM sells to. WHAM's sister station on 1280, WHTK, is another story - it's got a 5 kW DA signal at night that's very good in the core of the market (I'll never hear any interference to it from my QTH, 2 miles north of the transmitter site in their main night lobe), but it falls off very quickly in some suburban areas that are still very much within the market. The question then becomes: who, if anyone, will be running IBOC on 1270 or 1290 that might interfere? Right now, nobody is - those channels are full of lots of low-power signals in the northeast, and the biggest 1290 is CJBK, which won't be going IBOC any time soon. But then consider a couple of other locals: WLGZ on 990 sends a narrow 2500-watt DA beam over Rochester from a site 15 miles or so west of town. It's so narrow that even though I'm only three miles south of downtown Rochester, I'm already on an edge of the lobe and already have trouble hearing the station clearly at night. If WMVP 1000 in Chicago turns on its IBOC 24/7, WLGZ stands to lose a big chunk of its nighttime audience. Even worse off are stations like WYSL 1040 in Avon, 25 miles south of Rochester. It now has a huge, booming 20 kW day signal that's easily the second-best AM in the market - but at sunset, it drops down to just 500 watts. That's still enough to mostly overcome WHO on-channel up here, but it will be hammered by WBZ when - and this one's a when, not an if - 'BZ stops turning off IBOC at night. Here's a real-life example of a station already feeling the pinch - WRKL 910 New City NY, in Rockland County, 35 miles NW of Manhattan, which has depended over the last few years on its fringe signal toward NYC for most of its audience: http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdfid_document=6518808409 It is important to note that the FCC still hasn't issued its full Report and Order implementing nighttime AM IBOC, which suggests strongly that the Commission still isn't sure how it's going to make good on its promise to address interference situations like that one. And none of this, in turn, even touches on the reality that there are still a handful of AMs - WBZ and KGO, in the big markets, for instance, but also a lot of Midwesterners like KRVN and KFYR and WNAX - that do still depend on reaching a skywave audience at night for at least part of their revenue. Some of them know what they're in for. Others don't, or are in denial about the effect that skywave will have on the edges of their signals...which will make for some very interesting times ahead. s ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is an ancient Chinese proverb: Dog who chases tail inevitably eats self... *** And another which says He who runs around in circles shall be known as 'big wheel'. Russ Edmunds Blue Bell, PA ( 360' ASL ) [15 mi NNW of Philadelphia] 40:08:45N; 75:16:04W, Grid FN20id [EMAIL PROTECTED] FM: Yamaha T-80 Onkyo T-450RDS w/ APS9B @15' AM: Hammarlund HQ-150 4' FET air core loop Never miss an email again! Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
Re: [IRCA] IBOC Hash trashes KSL
Scott Fybush wrote: Here's a real-life example of a station already feeling the pinch - WRKL 910 New City NY, in Rockland County, 35 miles NW of Manhattan, which has depended over the last few years on its fringe signal toward NYC for most of its audience: http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdfid_document=6518808409 And most of that audience is in Northern NJ and New York City, since Rockland County itself has a negligible Polish-speaking population. My area has thousands of Polish immigrants and coverage is not the best, but RKL is still audible here. They have been Polish-formatted since 1999. It's a simulcast with the Polnet station in Chicago. If you're a soccer junkie, they do all the Chicago Fire games. Bob Antoniuk Clifton NJ ___ IRCA mailing list IRCA@hard-core-dx.com http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org To Post a message: irca@hard-core-dx.com
