Re: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier

[Mark Thomas]

On 01/07/17 14:57, Stephen Felts wrote:
> IMO:
> 
> 1. You should avoid `--add-modules java.se.ee' unless you need all of those 
> modules.  You should bring in only those modules that you need.  The choices 
> are java.activation, java.corba, java.transaction, java.xml.bind, 
> java.xml.ws, 
> java.xml.ws.annotation.  So use --add-modules java.xml.ws.

Thanks for the tip.

> 2. You can't use -XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions as a general solution 
> because that isn't available in JDK6 JRockit for example.

Good to know. I was leaning towards JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS anyway. This point
confirms that choice.

> 3. Setting JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS is good because only JDK9 recognizes it and it is 
> inherited by all nested invocations (unless there is an exec that excludes 
> the environment).  You might want to use
> export JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS="-XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions --add-modules 
> java.xml.ws"
> 
> 4. --add-opens is not needed starting in b175 so require that as a base.  It 
> will still be noisy (a 3-line WARNING will be printed to the standard error).

Tomcat won't officially support Java 9 until there is a GA release.
Anything before then is on the basis that is should work, but it might not.

Thanks again for the additional info.

Mark


> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Alan Bateman 
> Sent: Saturday, July 1, 2017 5:53 AM
> To: Mark Thomas; jigsaw-dev@openjdk.java.net
> Subject: Re: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier
> 
> On 01/07/2017 10:18, Mark Thomas wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Apache Tomcat needs to add the following options when running on Java 9:
>>
>> --add-modules=java.se.ee
>> --add-opens=java.base/java.lang=ALL-UNNAMED
>> --add-opens=java.rmi/sun.rmi.transport=ALL-UNNAMED
>>
>> The first is because it depends on javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRef and 
>> javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRefs.
>> We could work around this by shipping our own implementations but that 
>> sort of duplication should not be necessary.
> The java.xml.ws module is deprecated for removal (along with the other 
> modules shared with Java EE) so expect these modules to not be included in 
> the JDK some day (exactly when is TBD as it depends on when Java SE drops 
> them).
> 
> In the short term then `--add-modules java.se.ee` will resolve the EE modules 
> included in the JDK but it may bring complications, it all depends on whether 
> you have the EE java.transaction module or JAR files with annotations in the 
> javax.annotation package in your environment. An important page for the JDK 9 
> docs is a page with instructions and deployments options for those using 
> these APIs.
> 
> 
>>
>> The second and third are required by Tomcat's memory leak detection 
>> and prevention code. In an ideal world, web applications wouldn't have 
>> memory leaks. Unfortunately, the world isn't ideal and the memory leak 
>> detection and prevention code has proven immensely valuable over the years.
> Both of these packages are open since jdk-9+175 so the hacks to null fields 
> will continue to work.
> 
> That said, I thought the issue with TCCL in sun.rmi.transport.GC was fixed 
> via JDK-8157570. Have you tested that?
> 
> 
>> The problem we have is that Tomcat needs to run on Java 9 though 6. If
>> the above options aren't provided, Java 6 through 8 are fine but on Java
>> 9 at best the users see a bunch of errors and at worst Tomcat won't
>> start. If the above options are included, Java 9 is fine but then Tomcat
>> fails to start on Java 6 though 8.
>>
> The launch script could examine the JAVA_VERSION property in the 
> `release` file. Another approach is to set the JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS 
> environment variable as that is new 9 and so will be ignored by older 
> releases. There is also -XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions to ignore 
> unrecognized options.
> 
> -Alan
> 

Re: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier

[Mark Thomas]

On 01/07/17 10:53, Alan Bateman wrote:
> On 01/07/2017 10:18, Mark Thomas wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Apache Tomcat needs to add the following options when running on Java 9:
>>
>> --add-modules=java.se.ee
>> --add-opens=java.base/java.lang=ALL-UNNAMED
>> --add-opens=java.rmi/sun.rmi.transport=ALL-UNNAMED
>>
>> The first is because it depends on javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRef and
>> javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRefs.
>> We could work around this by shipping our own implementations but that
>> sort of duplication should not be necessary.
> The java.xml.ws module is deprecated for removal (along with the other
> modules shared with Java EE) so expect these modules to not be included
> in the JDK some day (exactly when is TBD as it depends on when Java SE
> drops them).
> 
> In the short term then `--add-modules java.se.ee` will resolve the EE
> modules included in the JDK but it may bring complications, it all
> depends on whether you have the EE java.transaction module or JAR files
> with annotations in the javax.annotation package in your environment. An
> important page for the JDK 9 docs is a page with instructions and
> deployments options for those using these APIs.

Alan,

Thanks for the info. Tomcat only recently dropped its own implementation
of those classes so the simplest thing to do is reinstate them.

>> The second and third are required by Tomcat's memory leak detection and
>> prevention code. In an ideal world, web applications wouldn't have
>> memory leaks. Unfortunately, the world isn't ideal and the memory leak
>> detection and prevention code has proven immensely valuable over the
>> years.
> Both of these packages are open since jdk-9+175 so the hacks to null
> fields will continue to work.

Yep. Partly I want to avoid the warnings entirely - for some users
start-up warnings are errors that MUST be resolved.

> That said, I thought the issue with TCCL in sun.rmi.transport.GC was
> fixed via JDK-8157570. Have you tested that?

Yes that bug is fixed. The RMI leaks in this case are application bugs,
not JRE bugs. They are typically caused by applications registering
stuff for RMI and then failing to de-register it. Tomcat needs to poke
around in the internals to find out if such a memory leak is present.

>> The problem we have is that Tomcat needs to run on Java 9 though 6. If
>> the above options aren't provided, Java 6 through 8 are fine but on Java
>> 9 at best the users see a bunch of errors and at worst Tomcat won't
>> start. If the above options are included, Java 9 is fine but then Tomcat
>> fails to start on Java 6 though 8.
>>
> The launch script could examine the JAVA_VERSION property in the
> `release` file. Another approach is to set the JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS
> environment variable as that is new 9 and so will be ignored by older
> releases. There is also -XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions to ignore
> unrecognized options.

Excellent. JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS is exactly what I need.

Many thanks for the response.

Kind regards,

Mark

Re: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier

[Alan Bateman]

On 01/07/2017 13:15, Enrico Olivelli wrote:

:

Alan,
Can you give some poonters to this page?
Thank you

There isn't a page to point at yet, mostly we are waiting for 
javaee.github.io to be updated to list stable Maven coordinates or 
download links for each of the standalone technologies.


-Alan.

RE: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier

[Stephen Felts]

IMO:

1. You should avoid `--add-modules java.se.ee' unless you need all of those 
modules.  You should bring in only those modules that you need.  The choices 
are java.activation, java.corba, java.transaction, java.xml.bind, java.xml.ws, 
java.xml.ws.annotation.  So use --add-modules java.xml.ws.

2. You can't use -XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions as a general solution because 
that isn't available in JDK6 JRockit for example.

3. Setting JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS is good because only JDK9 recognizes it and it is 
inherited by all nested invocations (unless there is an exec that excludes the 
environment).  You might want to use
export JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS="-XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions --add-modules 
java.xml.ws"

4. --add-opens is not needed starting in b175 so require that as a base.  It 
will still be noisy (a 3-line WARNING will be printed to the standard error).


-Original Message-
From: Alan Bateman 
Sent: Saturday, July 1, 2017 5:53 AM
To: Mark Thomas; jigsaw-dev@openjdk.java.net
Subject: Re: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier

On 01/07/2017 10:18, Mark Thomas wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Apache Tomcat needs to add the following options when running on Java 9:
>
> --add-modules=java.se.ee
> --add-opens=java.base/java.lang=ALL-UNNAMED
> --add-opens=java.rmi/sun.rmi.transport=ALL-UNNAMED
>
> The first is because it depends on javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRef and 
> javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRefs.
> We could work around this by shipping our own implementations but that 
> sort of duplication should not be necessary.
The java.xml.ws module is deprecated for removal (along with the other modules 
shared with Java EE) so expect these modules to not be included in the JDK some 
day (exactly when is TBD as it depends on when Java SE drops them).

In the short term then `--add-modules java.se.ee` will resolve the EE modules 
included in the JDK but it may bring complications, it all depends on whether 
you have the EE java.transaction module or JAR files with annotations in the 
javax.annotation package in your environment. An important page for the JDK 9 
docs is a page with instructions and deployments options for those using these 
APIs.


>
> The second and third are required by Tomcat's memory leak detection 
> and prevention code. In an ideal world, web applications wouldn't have 
> memory leaks. Unfortunately, the world isn't ideal and the memory leak 
> detection and prevention code has proven immensely valuable over the years.
Both of these packages are open since jdk-9+175 so the hacks to null fields 
will continue to work.

That said, I thought the issue with TCCL in sun.rmi.transport.GC was fixed via 
JDK-8157570. Have you tested that?


> The problem we have is that Tomcat needs to run on Java 9 though 6. If
> the above options aren't provided, Java 6 through 8 are fine but on Java
> 9 at best the users see a bunch of errors and at worst Tomcat won't
> start. If the above options are included, Java 9 is fine but then Tomcat
> fails to start on Java 6 though 8.
>
The launch script could examine the JAVA_VERSION property in the 
`release` file. Another approach is to set the JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS 
environment variable as that is new 9 and so will be ignored by older 
releases. There is also -XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions to ignore 
unrecognized options.

-Alan

Re: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier

[Enrico Olivelli]

Il sab 1 lug 2017, 11:53 Alan Bateman  ha scritto:

> On 01/07/2017 10:18, Mark Thomas wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > Apache Tomcat needs to add the following options when running on Java 9:
> >
> > --add-modules=java.se.ee
> > --add-opens=java.base/java.lang=ALL-UNNAMED
> > --add-opens=java.rmi/sun.rmi.transport=ALL-UNNAMED
> >
> > The first is because it depends on javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRef and
> > javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRefs.
> > We could work around this by shipping our own implementations but that
> > sort of duplication should not be necessary.
> The java.xml.ws module is deprecated for removal (along with the other
> modules shared with Java EE) so expect these modules to not be included
> in the JDK some day (exactly when is TBD as it depends on when Java SE
> drops them).
>
> In the short term then `--add-modules java.se.ee` will resolve the EE
> modules included in the JDK but it may bring complications, it all
> depends on whether you have the EE java.transaction module or JAR files
> with annotations in the javax.annotation package in your environment. An
> important page for the JDK 9 docs is a page with instructions and
> deployments options for those using these APIs.
>

Alan,
Can you give some poonters to this page?
Thank you

Enrico Olivelli

>
>
> >
> > The second and third are required by Tomcat's memory leak detection and
> > prevention code. In an ideal world, web applications wouldn't have
> > memory leaks. Unfortunately, the world isn't ideal and the memory leak
> > detection and prevention code has proven immensely valuable over the
> years.
> Both of these packages are open since jdk-9+175 so the hacks to null
> fields will continue to work.
>
> That said, I thought the issue with TCCL in sun.rmi.transport.GC was
> fixed via JDK-8157570. Have you tested that?
>
>
> > The problem we have is that Tomcat needs to run on Java 9 though 6. If
> > the above options aren't provided, Java 6 through 8 are fine but on Java
> > 9 at best the users see a bunch of errors and at worst Tomcat won't
> > start. If the above options are included, Java 9 is fine but then Tomcat
> > fails to start on Java 6 though 8.
> >
> The launch script could examine the JAVA_VERSION property in the
> `release` file. Another approach is to set the JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS
> environment variable as that is new 9 and so will be ignored by older
> releases. There is also -XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions to ignore
> unrecognized options.
>
> -Alan
>
-- 


-- Enrico Olivelli

Re: Cleanly starting apps on Java 9 and earlier

[Alan Bateman]

On 01/07/2017 10:18, Mark Thomas wrote:

Hi,

Apache Tomcat needs to add the following options when running on Java 9:

--add-modules=java.se.ee
--add-opens=java.base/java.lang=ALL-UNNAMED
--add-opens=java.rmi/sun.rmi.transport=ALL-UNNAMED

The first is because it depends on javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRef and
javax.xml.ws.WebServiceRefs.
We could work around this by shipping our own implementations but that
sort of duplication should not be necessary.
The java.xml.ws module is deprecated for removal (along with the other 
modules shared with Java EE) so expect these modules to not be included 
in the JDK some day (exactly when is TBD as it depends on when Java SE 
drops them).


In the short term then `--add-modules java.se.ee` will resolve the EE 
modules included in the JDK but it may bring complications, it all 
depends on whether you have the EE java.transaction module or JAR files 
with annotations in the javax.annotation package in your environment. An 
important page for the JDK 9 docs is a page with instructions and 
deployments options for those using these APIs.





The second and third are required by Tomcat's memory leak detection and
prevention code. In an ideal world, web applications wouldn't have
memory leaks. Unfortunately, the world isn't ideal and the memory leak
detection and prevention code has proven immensely valuable over the years.
Both of these packages are open since jdk-9+175 so the hacks to null 
fields will continue to work.


That said, I thought the issue with TCCL in sun.rmi.transport.GC was 
fixed via JDK-8157570. Have you tested that?




The problem we have is that Tomcat needs to run on Java 9 though 6. If
the above options aren't provided, Java 6 through 8 are fine but on Java
9 at best the users see a bunch of errors and at worst Tomcat won't
start. If the above options are included, Java 9 is fine but then Tomcat
fails to start on Java 6 though 8.

The launch script could examine the JAVA_VERSION property in the 
`release` file. Another approach is to set the JDK_JAVA_OPTIONS 
environment variable as that is new 9 and so will be ignored by older 
releases. There is also -XX:+IgnoreUnrecognizedVMOptions to ignore 
unrecognized options.


-Alan