Hi again netters, Joining in on the discussion on 'odol worship'. Sharing a few lines from authorised catholic sites, and also a few of what the Lord taught. It is rather lengthy. Praise the Lord.
Do Catholics Worship Statues? "Catholics worship statues!" Despite how ridiculous the claim is, people still make this accusation. They say that because Catholics have statues in their churches and pray in front of them, they are violating God's commandment: "You shall not make for yourself a graven image or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in earth beneath, or that is in water under the earth: you shall not bow down to them or serve them" (Ex. 20:4-5); "Alas, this people have sinned a great sin; they have made for themselves gods of gold" (Ex. 32:31). This tract will examine the standard Fundamentalist arguments against the ancient Christian practice of using images, and it will as provide a brief biblical response to these arguments, showing the Scriptural evidence for this practice. First, let's point out that it's right to warn people against the sin of idolatry. But the accusation that Catholics are idolaters because they have images of Christ and the saints is completely incorrect, being based on a misunderstanding or ignorance of what the Bible says about the purpose and use (both good and bad) of statues. Anti-Catholic writer Loraine Boettner, in his book Roman Catholicism, claims that it is a sin to have statues because "God has forbidden the use of images in worship" (p. 281). Many Protestants embrace this claim, yet if they were to "search the scriptures" (cf. John 5:39), they would find that exactly the opposite is true. Not only did God never condemn the use of statues in worship (though to be sure he did condemn the worship of statues), he actually commanded their use! GOD SAID TO MAKE THEM While Protestants and others quote Exodus 20:4-5 to bolster their charge of Catholic "statue worship," they forget about the numerous other passages where the Lord commands the carving of statues: "And you shall make two cherubim of gold [i.e., two carved statues of angels]; of hammered work shall you make them, on the two ends of the mercy seat. Make one cherub on the one end, and one cherub on the other end; of one piece of the mercy seat shall you make the cherubim on its two ends. The cherubim shall spread out their wings above, overshadowing the mercy seat with their wings, their faces one to another; toward the mercy seat shall the faces of the cherubim be" (Ex. 25:18-20). David gave Solomon the plan "for the altar of incense made of refined gold, and its weight; also his plan for the golden chariot of the cherubim that spread their wings and covered the ark of the covenant of the Lord. All this he made clear by the writing of the hand of the Lord concerning it all, all the work to be done according to the plan" (1 Chr. 28:18-19). Note that all this was directed according to divinely inspired writing. Ezekiel 41:15 describes graven images in the Temple: "on the walls round about in the inner room and [on] the nave were carved likenesses of cherubim." THE RELIGIOUS USE OF IMAGES During a plague of serpents he sent to punish the wicked Israelites, God told Moses to "make [a statue of] a fiery serpent, and set it on a pole; and every one who is bitten, when he sees it shall live. So Moses made a bronze serpent, and set it on a pole; and if a serpent bit any man, he would look at the bronze serpent and live" (Num. 21:8-9). The fact that one had to look at the bronze statue of the serpent in order to be healed shows that statues could be used ritually, not merely as religious decorations. Catholics use statues, paintings, and other artistic devices to recall the person or thing depicted. Just as it is helps to remember one's mother by looking at her photograph, so it helps to recall the example of the saints by looking at pictures of them. Catholics also use statues as teaching tools. In the early Church they were especially useful for the instruction of the illiterate. Many Protestants themselves have pictures of Jesus and other Bible pictures in Sunday school for purposes of teaching children, especially those who haven't learned to read. Catholics also use statues to commemorate certain people and events, much like Protestant churches that have three-dimensional nativity scenes at Christmas. If one measured Protestants by the same rule, then by using these "graven" images, they would be practicing the "idolatry" which they accuse Catholics of practicing. But the fact is, there's no idolatry going on in these situations. God forbids the worship of images, but he doesn't ban the making of images in general. If he had, movies, videos, photographs, manger scenes, paintings, drawings, and all sorts of things would be banned, since they too are images. WHAT ABOUT BOWING? Sometimes anti-Catholics cite Deuteronomy 5:9, where God said concerning statues, "You shall not bow down to them." Since many Catholics sometimes bow or kneel in front of statues of Jesus and the saints, anti-Catholics confuse the legitimate veneration of a sacred image with the sin of idolatry. The fact is, Deuteronomy 5:9 doesn't help the anti-Catholic argument. First, remember that although bowing can be used as a posture in worship, not all bowing is worship. For example, in Japan it is the custom for people to show respect and politeness by bowing in greeting (the equivalent of shaking hands in the West). Obviously there is no "worship" going on here. The Catholic who kneels in front of a statue when praying isn't worshipping or even praying to the statue anymore than the Protestant who kneels with a Bible in his hands when praying is worshipping or praying to the Bible. When people had to look to the bronze serpent to be healed, they were not worshipping it, as shown by the fact that, years later when they did worship it, and even gave it a name ("Nehushtan") as a snake-god, the righteous king Hezekiah had it destroyed (2 Kgs. 18:4). Gen 19:1 And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and 'he bowed himself' with his face toward the ground; "HIDING" THE 2nd COMMANDMENT? Another charge made by Protestants is that the Catholic Church "hides" the second commandment. This is because in Catholic catechisms the first commandment is: "You shall have no other Gods before me" (Ex. 20:3) and the second is: "You shall not take the name of the Lord in vain." (Ex. 20:7). They argue that Catholics have deleted the prohibition of idolatry in order to justify their use of religious statues. But this is false. The fact is, Catholics simply group the commandments differently than Protestants traditionally have and abbreviate them for ease of memorization. That such abbreviating is reasonable to Protestants is demonstrated by their common rendering of the Sabbath Commandment as simply, "Remember the Sabbath to keep it holy," though the actual text of the commandment is quite lengthy: "Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor, and do all your work; but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, your manservant, or your maidservant, or your cattle, or the sojourner who is within your gates; for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it" (Ex. 20:8-11). Martin Luther recognized that the statements "You shall have no other gods before me" (Ex. 20:3) and "You shall not make for yourself a graven image" (Ex. 20:4) are in fact two parts of a single command, and he abbreviated them to "You shall have no other gods before me." The Catechism of the Catholic Church explains that "The division and numbering of the Commandments have varied in the course of history. The present catechism follows the division of the Commandments established by St. Augustine, which has become traditional in the Catholic Church. It is also that of the Lutheran confession. The Greek Fathers worked out a slightly different division, which is found in the Orthodox Churches and Reformed communities" (CCC 2066). Some anti-Catholics appeal to Deuteronomy 4:15-18, which says "[S]ince you saw no form on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb out of the midst of the fire, beware lest you act corruptly by making a graven image for yourselves, in the form of any figure, the likeness of male or female, the likeness of any beast that is on the earth, the likeness of any winged bird that flies in the air, the likeness of anything that creeps on the ground, the likeness of any fish that is in the water under the earth." They try to use this text to "prove" the prohibition of statues and images. We've already shown that God doesn't prohibit the making of statues or images of various creatures (e.g. angels, serpents, oxen, flowers, lions, etc.) for religious purposes (cf. 1 Kings 6:29-32; 8:6-67; 2 Chr. 3:7-14). But what about statues or images that represent God himself? Many Protestants would say that that's wrong because Deuteronomy 4 says God has no form, therefore we should not attempt to make images of him. But does Deuteronomy 4 actually forbid these kinds of images of the Lord? THE ANSWER IS NO Early in its history Israel was forbidden to make any depictions of God because he had not (yet) revealed himself in a visible form. Had the Israelites made depictions of God, they might have been tempted to worship him in the form of an animal or some natural object (e.g., a bull or the sun) just as the pagans around them worshipped such images. But later God did reveal himself under visible forms, such as in Daniel 7:9: "As I looked, thrones were placed and one that was Ancient of Days took his seat; his raiment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like pure wool; his throne was fiery flames, its wheels were burning fire." Protestants themselves make depictions of the Father under this form when they do illustrations of the Old Testament prophecies. The Holy Spirit revealed himself under at least two visible forms--that of a dove, at the baptism of Jesus (Matt. 3:16, Mark 1:10, Luke 3:22, John 1:32)--and as tongues of fire, on the day of Pentecost (Acts 2:1-4). Protestants make use of these images (especially the dove) when drawing or painting these biblical episodes and when they wear Holy Spirit lapel pins or place dove emblems on their cars. But more importantly, notice that in the Incarnation of Christ his Son, God showed mankind an icon of himself. Paul said, "He is the image (Greek: ikon) of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation." Christ himself is the tangible divine "icon" of the unseen, infinite God of the universe. We read of the Magi that when the were "going into the house they saw the child with Mary his mother, and they fell down and worshipped him. Then, opening their treasures, they offered him gifts, gold, frankincense, and myrrh" (Matt. 2:11). The bottom line is, Protestants too use all sorts of religious images: Pictures of Jesus and other biblical personages appear on a myriad of Bibles, biblical picture books, T-shirts, jewelry, bumper stickers, greeting cards, CDs, and manger scenes. Christ is even symbolically represented through the Icthus symbol--the "fish" emblem popular among American Evangelicals. Common sense tells us that since God has revealed himself in various images, most especially in the Incarnate Jesus Christ, we realize that it's not wrong for us to make use of images of these forms to strengthen and deepen our knowledge and love of God. That's exactly the purpose that Catholic statues of Jesus and the saints have: They are images that represent persons we cannot see with our physical eyes. IDOLATRY CONDEMNED BY THE CHURCH Since the days of the Apostles, the Catholic Church has clearly and consistently condemned the sin of idolatry. The early Church Fathers warn against this sin, and Church councils also dealt with the issue. Here some examples: The Second Council of Nicaea (787), which dealt largely with the question of the veneration of sacred images and icons, said, "[T]he one who redeemed us from the darkness of idolatrous insanity, Christ our God, when he took for his bride his holy Catholic Church, having no blemish or wrinkle, promised he would guard her and assured his holy disciples saying, 'I am with you every day until the consummation of this age.' "This promise, however, he made not only to them but also to us, who thanks to them have come to believe in his name. To this gracious offer some people paid no attention; being hoodwinked by the treacherous foe they abandoned the true line of reasoning . . . and they failed to distinguish the holy from the profane, asserting that the icons of our Lord and of his saints were no different from the wooden images of satanic idols. . . . Certainly [this respect] is not the full adoration in accordance with our faith, which is properly paid only to the divine nature, but it resembles that given to the figure of the honored and life-giving cross, and also to the holy books of the gospels and to other sacred . . . objects." The Catechism of the Council of Trent (1566) taught that idolatry is committed "by worshipping idols and images as God, or believing that they possess any divinity or virtue entitling them to our worship, by praying to, or reposing confidence in them" (p. 374). The Catechism of the Catholic Church (1993) explains that "Scripture constantly recalls this rejection of 'idols, [of] silver and gold, the work of men's hands. They have mouths, but do not speak; eyes, but do not see. 'These empty idols make their worshippers empty:' 'Those who make them are like them; so are all those trust in them' [Ps. 115:4-5, 8]. God, however, is the 'living God' [c.f. Joshua 3:10, Psalm 42:3.] who gives life and intervenes in history." "Idolatry not only refers to false pagan worship. It remains a constant temptation to faith. Idolatry consists in divinizing what is not God. man commits idolatry whenever he honor and reveres a creature in the place of God, whether this be gods or demons (for example, satanism), power, pleasure, race, ancestors, the state, money, etc. . . . Idolatry rejects the unique Lordship of God; it is therefore incompatible with communion with God. "Human life finds its unity in the adoration of the one God. The commandment to worship the Lord alone integrates man and saves him from an endless disintegration. "Idolatry is a perversion of man's innate religious sense. An idolater is someone who 'transfers his indestructible notion of God to anything other than God'" (CCC 2112-2114, citing Origen, Contra Celsum 2:40). At the time God had given the 10 commandments nobody in the land knew the real true God, the one and only Yahweh, and so it was a time when people of then worshipped images of animals, birds, reptiles, etc and trees, the sun, etc. So God intervenes and forbids the making of images of ‘any form’ and the worship of any other god. In the 1st commandment we see God telling not to worship idols and not to worship any other gods as He is the only One God and that there is no other. In the same Bible we see the same Almighty God commanding for images of ‘Winged creatures or Cherubs to be made to represent His presence. He also later commands Moses to make a bronze snake by looking at which people would be healed. Is the Lord God going back on His command of forbidding making of images when He asks for images of Cherubs and the bronze snake to be made or has He forgotten His earlier command. Not in any way. Actually what He means in His 1st commandment is only that 'there is no God but Him, and that nobody shall worship any other god but Him as He is the one and only God and tolerares no rivals'. Thus He wants to put an end to the worship of any other so called gods. Please find below the verses from the Bible that will help understand certain points. ["And you shall make two cherubim of gold [i.e., two carved statues of angels]; of hammered work shall you make them, on the two ends of the mercy seat. Make one cherub on the one end, and one cherub on the other end; of one piece of the mercy seat shall you make the cherubim on its two ends. The cherubim shall spread out their wings above, overshadowing the mercy seat with their wings, their faces one to another; toward the mercy seat shall the faces of the cherubim be" (Ex. 25:18-20).] David gave Solomon the plan "for the altar of incense made of refined gold, and its weight; also his plan for the golden chariot of the cherubim that spread their wings and covered the ark of the covenant of the Lord. All this he made clear by the writing of the hand of the Lord concerning it all, all the work to be done according to the plan" (1 Chr. 28:18-19). Note that all this was directed according to divinely inspired writing. Ezekiel 41:15 describes graven images in the Temple: "on the walls round about in the inner room and [on] the nave were carved likenesses of cherubim." Ex:25:22: And there I will meet with thee, and I will commune with thee from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubims which are upon the ark of the testimony, of all things which I will give thee in commandment unto the children of Israel. Ex:37:7: And he made two cherubims of gold, beaten out of one piece made he them, on the two ends of the mercy seat; Ex:37:8: One cherub on the end on this side, and another cherub on the other end on that side: out of the mercy seat made he the cherubims on the two ends thereof. Ex:37:9: And the cherubims spread out their wings on high, and covered with their wings over the mercy seat, with their faces one to another; even to the mercy seatward were the faces of the cherubims. Heb:9:5, 6: And over it the cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat; of which we cannot now speak particularly. 6. Now when these things were thus ordained, the priests went always into the first tabernacle, accomplishing the service of God. An image of Christ or any of the saints is not seen by a Catholic as a god in itself and so is not against the 1st commandment. The Catholic church also teaches that there is only one God and He is the only one to be worshipped. The church does not ask for the images of Christ and the saints to be worshipped as gods. These images representing Christ and the saints are to be honoured and venerated, not to be worshipped as gods. 1Corinthians 8:4 to 6 also clearly states the meaning of the 1st commandment. So 1Cor 8:4-6 also clearly states that in the Bible an idol and a god mean the same as both were treated the same, well that is not how it is now, is it? From 1Cor 8:4-6 we see that when telling you shall not have other gods as well as you shall not worship idols both mean the same thing. This is the content of the 1st command. Protestants divide the 1st command as 2 commands. Thou shall not have other gods as one command and Thou shall not worship idols as a different command, and this causes the confusion. 1Cor 8: 4-6 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one. 5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,) 6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. Common sense tells us that since God has revealed himself in various images, most especially in the Incarnate Jesus Christ, we realize that it's not wrong for us to make use of images of these forms to strengthen and deepen our knowledge and love of God. That's exactly the purpose that Catholic statues of Jesus and the saints have: They are images that represent persons we cannot see with our physical eyes. Since the days of the Apostles, the Catholic Church has clearly and consistently condemned the sin of idolatry. The early Church Fathers warn against this sin, and Church councils also dealt with the issue. Here some examples: The Second Council of Nicaea (787), which dealt largely with the question of the veneration of sacred images and icons, said, "[T]he one who redeemed us from the darkness of idolatrous insanity, Christ our God, when he took for his bride his holy Catholic Church, having no blemish or wrinkle, promised he would guard her and assured his holy disciples saying, 'I am with you every day until the consummation of this age.' "This promise, however, he made not only to them but also to us, who thanks to them have come to believe in his name. To this gracious offer some people paid no attention; being hoodwinked by the treacherous foe they abandoned the true line of reasoning . . . and they failed to distinguish the holy from the profane, asserting that the icons of our Lord and of his saints were no different from the wooden images of satanic idols. . . . Certainly [this respect] is not the full adoration in accordance with our faith, which is properly paid only to the divine nature, but it resembles that given to the figure of the honored and life-giving cross, and also to the holy books of the gospels and to other sacred . . . objects." The Catechism of the Council of Trent (1566) taught that idolatry is committed "by worshipping idols and images as God, or believing that they possess any divinity or virtue entitling them to our worship, by praying to, or reposing confidence in them" (p. 374). The Catechism of the Catholic Church (1993) explains that "Scripture constantly recalls this rejection of 'idols, [of] silver and gold, the work of men's hands. They have mouths, but do not speak; eyes, but do not see. 'These empty idols make their worshippers empty:' 'Those who make them are like them; so are all those trust in them' [Ps. 115:4-5, 8]. God, however, is the 'living God' [c.f. Joshua 3:10, Psalm 42:3.] who gives life and intervenes in history." "Idolatry not only refers to false pagan worship. It remains a constant temptation to faith. Idolatry consists in divinizing what is not God. Man commits idolatry whenever he honor and reveres a creature in the place of God, whether this be gods or demons (for example, satanism), power, pleasure, race, ancestors, the state, money, etc. . . . Idolatry rejects the unique Lordship of God; it is therefore incompatible with communion with God. "Human life finds its unity in the adoration of the one God. The commandment to worship the Lord alone integrates man and saves him from an endless disintegration. "Idolatry is a perversion of man's innate religious sense. An idolater is someone who 'transfers his indestructible notion of God to anything other than God'" (CCC 2112-2114, citing Origen, Contra Celsum 2:40). 2132. "The Christian veneration of images is not contrary to the first commandment which proscribes IDOLS. Indeed, 'the honor rendered to an image passes to its prototype,' and 'whoever venerates an image venerates the person portrayed in it.'[St. Basil, De Spiritu Sancto 18, 45: PG 32, 149C; Council of Nicaea II: DS 601; cf. Council of Trent: DS 1821-1825; Vatican Council II: SC 126; LG 67.] The honor paid to sacred images is a 'respectful veneration,' not the adoration due to God alone: 2131. "Basing itself on the mystery of the incarnate Word, the seventh ecumenical council at Nicaea (787) justified against the iconoclasts the veneration of icons - of Christ, but also of the Mother of God, the angels, and all the saints. By becoming incarnate, the Son of God introduced a new 'economy' of IMAGES." To 1160. "Christian iconography expresses in IMAGES the same Gospel message that Scripture communicates by words. Image and word illuminate each other: We declare that we preserve intact all the written and unwritten traditions of the Church which have been entrusted to us. One of these traditions consists in the production of representational artwork, which accords with the history of the preaching of the Gospel. For it confirms that the incarnation of the Word of God was real and not imaginary, and to our benefit as well, for realities that illustrate each other undoubtedly reflect each other's meaning.[Council of Nicaea II (787): COD 111.] " To Following the divinely inspired teaching of our holy Fathers and the tradition of the Catholic Church (for we know that this tradition comes from the Holy Spirit who dwells in her) we rightly define with full certainty and correctness that, like the figure of the precious and life-giving cross, venerable and holy IMAGES of our Lord and God and Savior, Jesus Christ, our inviolate Lady, the holy Mother of God, and the venerated angels, all the saints and the just, whether painted or made of mosaic or another suitable material, are to be exhibited in the holy churches of God, on sacred vessels and vestments, walls and panels, in houses and on streets.[Council of Nicaea II: DS 600.]" To Religious worship is not directed to images in themselves, considered as mere things, but under their distinctive aspect as images leading us on to God incarnate. The movement toward the image does not terminate in it as image, but tends toward that whose image it is.[St. Thomas Aquinas, STh II-II, 81, 3 ad 3.]" The real intention of Yahweh when giving the 1st commandment is clearly revealed in Deuteronomy chapter 4:15 to chapter 5:9. 1) 4:15 ye saw no manner of similitude on the day that the LORD spake unto you in Horeb. 2) 4:19 lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them 3) 4:23 Take heed unto yourselves, lest ye forget the covenant of the LORD your God, which he made with you, and make you a graven image, or the likeness of any thing, which the LORD thy God hath forbidden thee.24: For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God. 4) 5:7 Thou shalt have none other gods before me 5) Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God Clearly it is seen here that the reason for the Lord’s fordidding making of graven images was because ‘He is the only God, and is a jealous God ; meaning He will not tolerate any other to be called or treated as gods i.e He does not will to let any other take His place.. Now for some examples from the Bible with regards to how the apostles and holy objects were considered in the early church. Acts 4:34, 35 says that the believers sold all their possesions and brought the prices of the thins and “”laid them at the apostles feet””. (The apostles were then honoured as special people) Acts 5:15 and 19:12 & 13 show how even the ‘shadow of Peter’ and ‘handkerchiefs, aprons’ touched by Paul were instruments in curing the sick. This shows the difference between the idols of the Old Testament times and the images of now. The images in the church now, on being blessed with holy water is sanctified and the Holy Spirit is imparted on it thus giving it a purpose like the aprons, etc mentioned in Acts 19:12. Ac:7:33 again shows that the site of the burning bush is proclaimed by the Lord as ‘holy ground’. Likewise we have Jerusalem being called ‘the holy city’. So, places where the Lord had made His presence felt in a special manner are of course to be treated as ‘holy places’ A picture, or an image when blessed with the holy water does have the Spirit's presence and is holy indeed. In the Old Testament as well as the New Testament we see the role of holy water which is another form of the Holy Spirit, in the sanctification or dedication of objects. 1218. "Since the beginning of the world, water, so humble and wonderful a creature, has been the source of life and fruitfulness. Sacred Scripture sees it as 'oveshadowed' by the Spirit of God:[Cf. Gen 1:2 .] At the very dawn of creation your Spirit breathed on the waters, making them the wellspring of all holiness.[Roman Missal, Easter Vigil 42: BLESSING of Water.]" _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com **************************************************************** This mail is generated from JOYnet, a Jesus Youth mailing list. To unsubscribe, send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe to this mailing list, visit http://www.jesusyouth.org/joynet For automatic help, send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] In case of any issue related to the mailing list contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] ****************************************************************