Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
-Original Message- From: juniper-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net [mailto:juniper-nsp- boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Richard A Steenbergen Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2011 7:16 PM To: juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net Subject: Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 03:46:36PM -0500, Richard A Steenbergen wrote: The process of upgrading to a resilient dual-root partitions release takes longer due to the additional step of upgrading the loader software and a longer reboot time while the disk is reformattedto four partitions during the reboot of the switch that completes the Junos OS upgrade. The reformat increases the reboot time for EX2200, EX3200, EX4200, and EX4500 switches by 5 to 10 minutes. For EX8200 switches, the reboot time increases by 10 to 25 minutes per Routing Engine, and additional reboots are required. Also, in reading the upgrade process for the new boot loader, it says: For an EX8200 switch with redundant Routing Engines, you must upgrade the loader software on both Routing Engines. You can upgrade the loader software on a Routing Engine only when it is master. Make sure that graceful Routing Engine switchover (GRES) and nonstop active routing (NSR) are disabled before you begin the upgrade. The requirement that you can only upgrade it when the RE is the master is a pretty serious issue. This means you can't just pre-stage the upgrade on the backup RE and then switch over to it in a single move, you've got to take down the entire device for the duration of multiple reloads (4 apparently, 2 per RE * 2 REs) to complete the upgrade. Is there some other interpretation of this that I'm missing? From my quick lab testing it looks like you can at least get the jinstall and 25 minute reformatting out of the way beforehand, but you've still got to be master to upgrade the actual loader. ...and ISSU flies right out the window... :( Presumably this is only a one time thing right? Subsequent upgrades shouldn't require reformatting since the dual-root partitions will already be in existence... at least until they decide to go with NANDFS or quad-root partitions eh'? ; Stefan Fouant, CISSP, JNCIEx2 www.shortestpathfirst.net GPG Key ID: 0xB4C956EC ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 01:48:04PM -0700, Kaj Niemi wrote: It took 838 seconds on a 2 member EX4200 VC bundle. Yes, I did time it. ;-) Around 13 minutes downtime for a EX3200... Best regards, Daniel -- CLUE-RIPE -- Jabber: d...@cluenet.de -- dr@IRCnet -- PGP: 0xA85C8AA0 ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
On Wed, Mar 23, 2011 at 11:14 AM, Daniel Roesen d...@cluenet.de wrote: On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 01:48:04PM -0700, Kaj Niemi wrote: It took 838 seconds on a 2 member EX4200 VC bundle. Yes, I did time it. ;-) Around 13 minutes downtime for a EX3200... Best regards, Daniel -- CLUE-RIPE -- Jabber: d...@cluenet.de -- dr@IRCnet -- PGP: 0xA85C8AA0 ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp Took about 20 minutes on a VC with 4 members. Didn't sit and watch though. -- Brent Jones br...@servuhome.net ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 4:15 PM, TiM t...@muppetz.com wrote: On Wed, March 23, 2011 8:54 am, Kaj Niemi wrote: Hi, sarcasm To whomever who decided to introduce new features in a R3 release, thanks ;-( Specifically installing jloader separately is highly appreciated. /sarcasm You'll probably be thanking them when your switch loses power* and when you restore it, you find your bootable filesystem isn't corrupted. At least I'm _hoping_ that's what this 4th partition is designed to fix. Context: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/nsp/juniper/25513 Just to be fair.. The original point was to highlight the fact that they add features in the maintenance releases which is still bad software engineering. These are supposed to be dot releases so that people know when there is a potential for new bugs. So instead of 10.4R3 there should be something like 10.4.0R3 with normal partitioning and 10.4.1R3 with the new features. What if you're only upgrading to fix a PR only to find out that ISSU is impossible and reboots will take longer? ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 12:54:25PM -0700, Kaj Niemi wrote: Hi, sarcasm To whomever who decided to introduce new features in a R3 release, thanks ;-( Specifically installing jloader separately is highly appreciated. /sarcasm Sadly, they've been silently introducing new features in the middle of a bug fix release (and introducing new bugs too, which is how I find out about them) for a while now. But for extra bonus points, be prepared for the upgrade to take a REALLY long time to complete too. :) From the release notes: How Long Will the Upgrade Process Take? The process of upgrading to a resilient dual-root partitions release takes longer due to the additional step of upgrading the loader software and a longer reboot time while the disk is reformattedto four partitions during the reboot of the switch that completes the Junos OS upgrade. The reformat increases the reboot time for EX2200, EX3200, EX4200, and EX4500 switches by 5 to 10 minutes. For EX8200 switches, the reboot time increases by 10 to 25 minutes per Routing Engine, and additional reboots are required. -- Richard A Steenbergen r...@e-gerbil.net http://www.e-gerbil.net/ras GPG Key ID: 0xF8B12CBC (7535 7F59 8204 ED1F CC1C 53AF 4C41 5ECA F8B1 2CBC) ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
It took 838 seconds on a 2 member EX4200 VC bundle. Yes, I did time it. ;-) Kaj On 22/3/2011 22:46, Richard A Steenbergen r...@e-gerbil.net wrote: On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 12:54:25PM -0700, Kaj Niemi wrote: Hi, sarcasm To whomever who decided to introduce new features in a R3 release, thanks ;-( Specifically installing jloader separately is highly appreciated. /sarcasm Sadly, they've been silently introducing new features in the middle of a bug fix release (and introducing new bugs too, which is how I find out about them) for a while now. But for extra bonus points, be prepared for the upgrade to take a REALLY long time to complete too. :) From the release notes: How Long Will the Upgrade Process Take? The process of upgrading to a resilient dual-root partitions release takes longer due to the additional step of upgrading the loader software and a longer reboot time while the disk is reformattedto four partitions during the reboot of the switch that completes the Junos OS upgrade. The reformat increases the reboot time for EX2200, EX3200, EX4200, and EX4500 switches by 5 to 10 minutes. For EX8200 switches, the reboot time increases by 10 to 25 minutes per Routing Engine, and additional reboots are required. -- Richard A Steenbergen r...@e-gerbil.net http://www.e-gerbil.net/ras GPG Key ID: 0xF8B12CBC (7535 7F59 8204 ED1F CC1C 53AF 4C41 5ECA F8B1 2CBC) ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
On Wed, March 23, 2011 8:54 am, Kaj Niemi wrote: Hi, sarcasm To whomever who decided to introduce new features in a R3 release, thanks ;-( Specifically installing jloader separately is highly appreciated. /sarcasm You'll probably be thanking them when your switch loses power* and when you restore it, you find your bootable filesystem isn't corrupted. At least I'm _hoping_ that's what this 4th partition is designed to fix. Context: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/nsp/juniper/25513 Tim *Yes, I know you should have a working UPS etc. ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 3:54 PM, Kaj Niemi kaj...@a51.org wrote: Hi, sarcasm To whomever who decided to introduce new features in a R3 release, thanks ;-( Specifically installing jloader separately is highly appreciated. /sarcasm sarcasm more sarcasm I think they've begun outsourcing their dev to microsoft. /more sarcasm /sarcasm ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
Hi, On Wed, Mar 23, 2011 at 7:48 AM, Kaj Niemi kaj...@a51.org wrote: It took 838 seconds on a 2 member EX4200 VC bundle. Yes, I did time it. ;-) That does sound a bit painful, but not as painful as the file system corruption this feature aims to fix. I wonder what happened to the idea of implementing NANDFS? Cheers, Dale (..looking forward to putting 10.4R3 in the lab.) ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
Yes the resilient dual root partition was implemented to deal with this issue on the EX. I believe this is pretty similar to what the branch SRX do today. Doug -Original Message- From: juniper-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net [mailto:juniper-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of TiM Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2011 1:15 PM To: Kaj Niemi Cc: juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net Subject: Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX On Wed, March 23, 2011 8:54 am, Kaj Niemi wrote: Hi, sarcasm To whomever who decided to introduce new features in a R3 release, thanks ;-( Specifically installing jloader separately is highly appreciated. /sarcasm You'll probably be thanking them when your switch loses power* and when you restore it, you find your bootable filesystem isn't corrupted. At least I'm _hoping_ that's what this 4th partition is designed to fix. Context: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/nsp/juniper/25513 Tim *Yes, I know you should have a working UPS etc. ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
Another feature of the dual root partition is that it will allow you to switch between software versions using request system software rollback without reinstalling the image. Don't forget in production to keep both the partitions in sync with request system snapshot slice You can check to see what versions are installed on each partition with show system snapshot media internal Doug -Original Message- From: juniper-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net [mailto:juniper-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Doug Hanks Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2011 2:45 PM To: t...@muppetz.com; Kaj Niemi Cc: juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net Subject: Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX Yes the resilient dual root partition was implemented to deal with this issue on the EX. I believe this is pretty similar to what the branch SRX do today. Doug -Original Message- From: juniper-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net [mailto:juniper-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of TiM Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2011 1:15 PM To: Kaj Niemi Cc: juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net Subject: Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX On Wed, March 23, 2011 8:54 am, Kaj Niemi wrote: Hi, sarcasm To whomever who decided to introduce new features in a R3 release, thanks ;-( Specifically installing jloader separately is highly appreciated. /sarcasm You'll probably be thanking them when your switch loses power* and when you restore it, you find your bootable filesystem isn't corrupted. At least I'm _hoping_ that's what this 4th partition is designed to fix. Context: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/nsp/juniper/25513 Tim *Yes, I know you should have a working UPS etc. ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
Re: [j-nsp] about 10.4R3 on EX
On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 03:46:36PM -0500, Richard A Steenbergen wrote: The process of upgrading to a resilient dual-root partitions release takes longer due to the additional step of upgrading the loader software and a longer reboot time while the disk is reformattedto four partitions during the reboot of the switch that completes the Junos OS upgrade. The reformat increases the reboot time for EX2200, EX3200, EX4200, and EX4500 switches by 5 to 10 minutes. For EX8200 switches, the reboot time increases by 10 to 25 minutes per Routing Engine, and additional reboots are required. Also, in reading the upgrade process for the new boot loader, it says: For an EX8200 switch with redundant Routing Engines, you must upgrade the loader software on both Routing Engines. You can upgrade the loader software on a Routing Engine only when it is master. Make sure that graceful Routing Engine switchover (GRES) and nonstop active routing (NSR) are disabled before you begin the upgrade. The requirement that you can only upgrade it when the RE is the master is a pretty serious issue. This means you can't just pre-stage the upgrade on the backup RE and then switch over to it in a single move, you've got to take down the entire device for the duration of multiple reloads (4 apparently, 2 per RE * 2 REs) to complete the upgrade. Is there some other interpretation of this that I'm missing? From my quick lab testing it looks like you can at least get the jinstall and 25 minute reformatting out of the way beforehand, but you've still got to be master to upgrade the actual loader. -- Richard A Steenbergen r...@e-gerbil.net http://www.e-gerbil.net/ras GPG Key ID: 0xF8B12CBC (7535 7F59 8204 ED1F CC1C 53AF 4C41 5ECA F8B1 2CBC) ___ juniper-nsp mailing list juniper-nsp@puck.nether.net https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp
