Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
Kevin Krammer posted on Mon, 28 Oct 2013 14:29:37 +0100 as excerpted: Well, you could have used a + instead of /, same number of characters, no? :) Mmm, indeed. Thanks for the hint. It makes sense and I'll file it away to (hopefully remember to) use the next time. =:^) -- Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs. Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master. Richard Stallman ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] cannot cut/copy with dolphin
Kishore Jonnalagadda posted on Mon, 28 Oct 2013 17:36:40 +0530 as excerpted: On Monday 28 Oct 2013 10:31:12 AM Duncan wrote: Kishore Jonnalagadda posted on Mon, 28 Oct 2013 14:06:53 +0530 as excerpted: I can't be sure from when this problem occurs but its quite recent. I'm on KDE 4.11.2 and i cannot cut or copy files in dolphin with either the context menu or the CTRL+C and CTRL+V shortcuts. When i try to cut a file, the file briefly becomes light shaded (like it usually does when a file or folder is cut) but then restores itself to the normal icon in about a second. When i click copy on any file i do not get the paste option like i would expect it to. I do notice that klipper updates the file path each time i try to cut or copy. Do anybody know what could lead to this? That's a very interesting problem. I have little idea what this issue might be, but the fact that it exists for your normal user but NOT for a new user indicates it HAS to be something in your normal user's config. That means the problem should be resolvable by bisection. =:^) Thanks Duncan! Indeed i followed a similar process and came down to kdeconnect. kdeconnect allows your computer to pair with itself which is strange! Pairing with itself was the source of the problem. I don't know the technical reason behind it but i think it has to do with kdeconnect's feature of sharing the clipboard. Indeed, I /did/ have not the foggiest idea what the issue was! I don't use software such as kdeconnect (I do use ssh in a text terminal occasionally, but I don't even use X forwarding with it), so wouldn't have guessed that for sure! But if it has a clipboard sharing mechanism, and the idea is to allow remote connects, then yes, it stands to reason that it'd disable file cut/ copy/paste across the shared clipboards, and if you're effectively connected to yourself, then yes, that'd probably disable it there, too! That's surely one for the archives! Who knows when someone else will post with the same issue, and I'll look like a genius posting a solution like this out of left field, if it actually happens to be their problem too (tho I'll be sure to say it's not original to me but came from a previous post to the list with the same problem, since I don't even use kdeconnect or the like)! So thanks for the followup, who knows when it'll come in handy, and /I'd/ surely not have thought of that on my own! =:^) -- Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs. Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master. Richard Stallman ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
I'm going to disagree with you there DE. KDE is the most user friendly of desktops I've yet found. Odd behavior plagues all desktops, especially windoze. That Unity insanity which Windows 8 apparently attempted to mirror, trying to walk a new user through that garbage is like trying to learn a foreign language AS you are teaching it to somebody else. Gnome just seems primitive and unfriendly to me. It's usable but I suffer plenty of odd behavior under Gnome, probably more than under KDE. I have my own gripes about KDE (I still mourn the loss of Kedit for example. More so, so many of KDE's default apps are so lame when compared to other KDE apps availible). My biggest gripe is Dolphin which is all but unavoidable because opening up removable drives is a real pain with far better file managers. The whole single click thing which cannot be modified too a double click makes file transfers from disks an effort in frustration. I don't want to OPEN the thing, just because my control or shift key is not quite pressed hard enough. I might want to click on it so I can right click and view information or open with something other than default. Gah I HATE using Dolphin for file management. My complaints however are generally mild. The interface is highly customizable, friendly and I spend my time doing stuff WITH my computer not TOO it. KDE + Linux is an awesome combo. I can take a noob or an experienced user and they are able to sit down with little or no KDE experience and have at it. My daughter was 8 years old and without having to teach her anything really she was able to sit down and use my KDE machines. People look at Gnome or Unity or most other desktops and wonder just how to get started and what to do. I still prefer KDE 3 over KDE 4, but the future of KDE has more than enough promise to stay with KDE. Just wish I could get Kedit back and change the default file manager for removable media. On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:40 AM, dE de.tec...@gmail.com wrote: On 10/27/13 12:24, Michael wrote: Hi peops, I somewhat force myself to use KDE (once again), even though I am very likely to get annoyed rather fast when it comes to the KDE-specific kind of issues. Issues, I have never seen with any other project to that extent. And I ask myself, if others are annoyed too there or am I just a whiny little bitch and no one else really bothers there? To describe the kind of issues I am referring to, some examples: 1.) KSysGuard: I just closed a program via its own menu (file - close), wondered why even after several minutes (and even now, half an hour later) KSysGuard still showed that process, so I did look with ps and to my surprise, the process is *not* there anymore, but KSysGuard shows it nevertheless in the process table. https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.**cgi?id=261255https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=261255 2.) Panels: Changed the alignment on one panel (for DualHead mirrored panel setup), one should think now the alignment is changed like in any other tool (mostly word processing tools I guess) but well, it is not, widgets and stuff still want to fall to the left. I guess because of that and other bugs there, several issues arise. http://forum.kde.org/**viewtopic.php?f=67t=94642http://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=67t=94642 https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.**cgi?id=248186https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=248186 http://askubuntu.com/**questions/116040/how-to-right-** align-widgets-in-panel-in-**kubuntu-11-10http://askubuntu.com/questions/116040/how-to-right-align-widgets-in-panel-in-kubuntu-11-10 3.) Widgets, plasmoids, generel KDE features: Yeah well, really nice design (mostly), but from a usability standpoint? Often a mess. First one sees a feature and thinks Great and later on he might realize how bad that feature is implemented. I don't want to get into details yet, as this mail is going to be long enough already, but if there is any need and someone has no idea what I am talking about here, just ask. But remember, I don't say all and everything is implemented badly, with KDE-stuff it just looks to me the tendency is there that stuff gets implemented in a rather weird / bad / less- to un-usable way. 4.) Weird messages and... stuff: Be it annoying phonon messages that a audio device was removed, though it definitely was NOT, power-manager framework telling me it doesn't work because of... yada yada, but it does work nevertheless, starting others DEs stuff while KDE is running (or the other way around) might screw things up bigtime, configuration tends be be trashed every now and then, from one moment to the next (in the process of configuring KDE for example, so no change to the installed packages or other changes to the system) KDE may start to behave weird. Like starting KDE-apps (dolphin) takes several minutes while other apps just start fast as before, context-menu might need *minutes* to open, shutdown-, reboot-, logout-popup takes minutes to show...
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
Dnia 2013-10-29, o godz. 07:13:37 Draciron Smith draci...@gmail.com napisał(a): The whole single click thing which cannot be modified too a double click makes file transfers from disks an effort in frustration. Unless something changed in 4.11 (I am still using 4.10), you can go to configuration dialog in Dolphin and there, in Navigation pane, make double click open files (single click selects, then). -- Best regards Mirosław Zalewski ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
On Tuesday, 2013-10-29, 13:42:16, Mirosław Zalewski wrote: Dnia 2013-10-29, o godz. 07:13:37 Draciron Smith draci...@gmail.com napisał(a): The whole single click thing which cannot be modified too a double click makes file transfers from disks an effort in frustration. Unless something changed in 4.11 (I am still using 4.10), you can go to configuration dialog in Dolphin and there, in Navigation pane, make double click open files (single click selects, then). Or in system settings, input devices, mouse Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
Michael posted on Tue, 29 Oct 2013 06:48:40 +0100 as excerpted: Oh, KDE4 is more or less in maintenance-mode? Err... scratch that. As of now I still believe maintenance is something that does not apply well to the KDE-kind-of development-style, so KDE4 is more or less obsolete now? That would seem to be the case, yes. Well, it would fit the (current and as of now unofficial) description. If KDE5 will have the same QA-style, I guess KDE will go into the history books of open source software, as always shiny but buggy to a degree that it may even be unusable. Call me an optimist (heh, wrote that before noting your email address =:^) if you will, but I believe the kdeers are on the right track with this kde frameworks five stuff. Both the kde foundations and the qt it's based on are becoming a lot more modular, with the ability for developers to pick and choose the dependencies they want/need without having to bring in the whole big currently monolithic qtlibs and kdelibs. Qt itself is maturing as a developer-community-based toolkit in its own right, and qt5 is far more community-driven than any qt ever before in history. As part of that, it's both expanding and going modular, with most of its components becoming optional -- developers only pull in what they need, and will no longer have to depend on (and ship, for platforms where bundling is common) the parts they don't pull in. As part of the expansion and because it /is/ more community focused now and kde has been and remains a large part of that community, parts of what were kdelibs are now becoming part of qt5. But at the same time, because qt's becoming more modular and much of it is now optional, all those extra features aren't bloating qt5 out of control, because if a developer doesn't need them he simply won't pull them in, and the modular components that are pulled in may well be far slimmer with qt5 than with qt4. At the same time, kdelibs and the kdebase platform is similarly modularizing, allowing the same choice at the kde developer and user level as well as blurring the lines between what's qt and what's kde, since parts that were once kdelibs are now qt, but either way, they're now optional, so a formerly kde app may actually find itself only needing qt now, and even if it does pull in some kde libraries, because both the kde libs and qt are going modular, the dependencies may now well be smaller as a full kde app than they were previously as a qt-only app! Up the stack at the application level, kde5 is breaking up and shipping most individual apps with their own version tagging and release timing, so apps that are evolving fast can ship updates every month or even every week if they wish, while already mature apps in primarily maintenance mode might ship an update a year, mostly just to keep them building on current libraries with current tools, with the occasional security update as well when necessary. So the kde frameworks 5 core is going to be MUCH smaller, while most of the bundled apps we know as kde today will be unbundled and shipped separately, either as individual apps or possibly as a functional bundle -- dolphin and kmail and rekonq and konqueror and plasma will likely all release separately, with their own versions. (Actually, some of them have their own versions now; kmail is version 2.something these days for instance, but nobody knows their kmail version without looking, they simply say kmail 4.11.2 or whatever, the kde version.) But kdegames (for example) may still ship as a kdegames bundle, with a common kdegames (not kde) version. That means currently qt-but-non-kde apps and desktop options may become more popular as well. There's smplayer, and the razor-qt desktop. The effect should be that individual kde apps will be chosen on their merits, no longer simply because they're part of kde, and people doing what I'm effectively already doing here, mixing a few kde apps with a few gtk apps with a few independent apps, picking the app in each case that best fits their needs, will become much more common. Of course since I'm effectively already doing that, rejecting kmail since I don't like its akonadi and semantic-desktop dependencies and don't need that additional functionality, preferring the gtk-based claws-mail, and preferring firefox to konqueror/rekonq, but running it all on a (semantic- desktopless) core kde desktop including plasma. But what's going to be interesting is what happens with plasma vs the relatively new and much lighter razor-qt. I expect the latter to become very popular as a kde-lite desktop base, while plasma will continue to be the full-featured alternative. And then there's lxde, formerly a gtk- based lite desktop, that's switching to qt and cooperating with razor- qt in some development areas. I expect quite a few former lxde folks will end up running more kde apps, since the dependency gap will be FAR smaller than it
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
Frank Steinmetzger posted on Mon, 28 Oct 2013 20:36:02 +0100 as excerpted: But from a convenience standpoint, KDE beats them all with nice extra features (KIO, global keyboard shortcuts, range of consistent base-applications). And even though I have some issues with it now and then (like reliable and *easy* file transfer via Bluetooth), I come back to KDE every time, despite it taking 20 hours to compile on an Atom. ^^ FWIW, I run an old first-gen 32-bit-only atom netbook here too. But I couldn't tell you how long kde or anything else takes to build on it, because I have a 32-bit build-image chroot on my main 6-core Athlon fx with 16 gigs RAM and dual SSDs in btrfs raid1 mode. That's where I do all my atom/netbook targeted update builds, then rsync them across to the netbook. Tho I only actually update the netbook every year or longer... it's still running kde 4.6, IIRC, and I really should update it again, one of these days... -- Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs. Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master. Richard Stallman ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 06:48:40AM +0100, Michael wrote: Hi peops, […] 3.) Widgets, plasmoids, generel KDE features: Yeah well, really nice design (mostly), but from a usability standpoint? Often a mess. Plasma is a constant source of annoyance for me. I never really understood the need for a second UI style next to the “normal” one. The many animations that can’t be switched off and low contrasts are causes of grievance for me. There are layout bugs [...], redrawing bugs [...], UI bugs [...] and feature regressions [...]. I guess one has to be fair here. I guess KDE4 is designed to be feature-rich, beautiful, with many bells and whistles. One could argue, it is not designed to be stripped down to a bare minimum. Well, different to other “modern” desktops, which only seem to offer the lower end, KDE can be both simplistic and over-the-top full of stuff. I may be wrong, but I see it like a person walking in a car-salon, he wants to buy some means of transportation. No, he wants to buy a car. And usually already made up his mind about specifics, b/c salons commonly have only one or two brands. Sorry, car comarisons are common in IT discussion, but this one’s not very applicable. ;-) As he is offered some cars, he complains [...]. Don't go to a car-salon, if you really want a motorcycle or even a bike. What exactly is your KDE analogy? Don’t use KDE if you want a window manager? Btw. what about that netbook-design? Isn't that something specifically designed for lower-end hardware? To me, it’s the same plasma, just with a specific default widget setup. I never used it because (you might guess) it has too many animations and requires too much clicking. I prefer the classic K-Menu. [...] I suppose right now the migration to 5.0 takes lots of developer resources, so I imagine fixing bugs in “obsolete” 4 gets even less attention. I attempted fixing bugs before (and sent a patch in two instances), but it requires lots of work to get into the code, especially in bigger projects like Amarok or KMail. Oh, KDE4 is more or less in maintenance-mode? That was more of a sarcastic nudge at how fast KDE 3 was dropped in favour of the yet unusable 4.0. And I believe I read somewhere that 4.11 was to be the last 4.x release. Anyhoo, I remained with KDE 3 for a long time, then used both in parallel and only around 4.3 or even 4.4 I made the final switch (Gentoo provided for the parallel installation of both for a long time). -- Gruß | Greetings | Qapla’ Please do not share anything from, with or about me with any Facebook service. There are two kinds of people in this world: Those who are good with words and those who are... erm... thingy... signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
Michael posted on Mon, 28 Oct 2013 15:14:40 +0100 as excerpted: Am Mon, 28 Oct 2013 16:10:16 +0530 schrieb dE de.tec...@gmail.com: I think KDE is not suitable for production environment. Just for casual enthusiasts. I guess that view is a bit too extreme, but interesting nevertheless. As annoying as the typical KDE-issues might be or get, there will be a point where users know the issues and can adapt to the buggy situation, so that KDE is not a general show stopper to their workflow. I think it's extreme at one level, but not at another. I already stated that I think kde 4.5 (and will further specify here later 4.5, so 4.5.4 and 4.5.5) finally reached release quality. Since then, the quality has gone up and down a bit, but as a general rule, by 4.x.4 or so it tends to be reasonably good, production environment level, for at least some definition thereof. What's more disturbing to me, however, and why I agree that at a different level, dE's correct and kde is not production environment quality, is the longer term record of claims made vs. reality. We have a situation where a very public statement was made that kde3 support would continue as long as there were users, which WOULD have been production environment quality, but then exactly the opposite occurred, support was dropped for what real users were saying was the only reasonably working version. At the same time, kde was publicly insisting that the new version was ready, while the facts were very clearly otherwise, both because even the devs were saying various bits weren't ported yet, and because the real users were simply finding the new version unworkable in the state it was in at the time. That's not production environment quality by pretty much any measure, so even if the code does arguably literally reach production environment quality at some point (as I assert it did with late 4.5), taking the project as a whole including the claims made and evident behavior seen, no, kde in its 4.x state is NOT production environment quality -- it cannot be depended on over time to maintain a product that can be relied upon at claimed level of support, because the quality of the in-support code drops *WELL* below production environment quality for **YEARS** at a time, with users being left in the lurch. It remains to be seen if that has changed. With the 5/frameworks effort in full swing now, we'll see over the coming couple years just how much kde learned with the early kde4 disaster. If they continue to support kde4 code until *USERS* say 5/frameworks is actually ready, or at a very minimum, refrain from claiming that they'll do so and then dropping support just like that, then when USERS say 5/frameworks code is production environment ready, a reasonable argument can then be made that kde has learned from its earlier mistakes and really /is/ production environment ready, even if literal code quality does drop below that level from time to time. I'm actually quite optimistic, as the plan I've seen stated is to allow and support both 4.x and 5.x applications running side by side for a time, so users can upgrade individual apps to their frameworks-5 versions as /users/ consider them ready, while continuing to run other apps at the 4.x version level until they (the users) consider the frameworks-5 versions suitably stable to upgrade to them individually. This actually fits the whole more modular emphasis and theme of frameworks-5 as well, so as I said I'm optimistic. OTOH, the more cautious side of me says we've seen promises of continued support before, and we know how THAT turned out! So we'll see, but I really AM optimistic, hopefully not to my own detriment. Regardless, once bitten, twice shy, and I'm better prepared for a less-than-smooth transition this time, in part because over time I've been forced off of kde based technologies for one thing after another, so there's less kde on my system now TO be affected and the effect will thus be much more limited however it turns out, and if worse does come to worse, it'll be far easier to switch entirely off of kde, since there's simply less to switch out, now. We /will/ see! As of your problems -- if you continue to use KDE, you'll get used to it. For e.g. now removable disks will now show up in device manager. I've to restart KDE to fix it. Used to it? That is most unlikely. I could tolerate such issues for some time but I guess I could never adapt to a point where I would not even realize the issues anymore. Arguably, this is actually what happened to the kde devs themselves -- they became used to their workarounds to the point they ceased to even be aware of them as workarounds any longer, thus explaining their claim that kde 4.2 was ready for ordinary use. Only the new users still trying to upgrade from the by then unsupported 3.5.x could see how horribly broken 4.2 and 4.3 still were, because they still had to come
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 01:17:34PM +, Duncan wrote: Frank Steinmetzger posted on Mon, 28 Oct 2013 20:36:02 +0100 as excerpted: I thought of not sending this, as it is more like a collection of bug whining, but after having spent lots of time on composing, it would be a waste of electrons not to send it. FWIW, I've quit worrying much about that. [...] so I'm the better for having written it, regardless of whether I send it or simply hit the X and close the window without sending. That doesn’t help here, the screen session with mutt inside would still be running. Getting OT, but *SCNR*. -- Gruß | Greetings | Qapla’ Please do not share anything from, with or about me with any Facebook service. Three words to describe myself? Not good at maths. signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
On Monday, 2013-10-28, 20:36:02, Frank Steinmetzger wrote: On Sun, Oct 27, 2013 at 07:54:09AM +0100, Michael wrote: Hi peops, […] 3.) Widgets, plasmoids, generel KDE features: Yeah well, really nice design (mostly), but from a usability standpoint? Often a mess. Plasma is a constant source of annoyance for me. I never really understood the need for a second UI style next to the “normal” one. I think the UI style was more a side effect. The main idea of Plasma was to be able to create adaptable and customizable workspace shells. Quite forward looking given the time when this all started, but unfortunatly also hampered by the available technologies of the time (QGraphicsView). It took Qt itself until 5.1 to have widget like styling available for QtQuick (a.k.a QtQuick.Controls). 4.) […] configuration tends be be trashed every now and then, from one moment to the next (in the process of configuring KDE for example, so no change to the installed packages or other changes to the system) KDE may start to behave weird. Akonadi, the problem child for many, is a nice example with its (for this human) incomprehensible config and data file layout. Off-topic for this discussion about KDE's desktop environment or workspace, but as a new project Akonadi follows the guidelines for cross desktop locations: config in $XDG_CONFIG_HOME/akonadi, data in $XDG_DATA_HOME/akonadi I suppose right now the migration to 5.0 takes lots of developer resources, so I imagine fixing bugs in “obsolete” 4 gets even less attention. I think I read somewhere tht the workspace people will be going with 2.0, since the next version will be the second iteration of Plasma workspaces. But yes, it currently seems to bind a lot of their resources, however, I am pretty sure they still maintain the current version, after all there are more KDE software compilation releases scheduled which they are a part of. I attempted fixing bugs before (and sent a patch in two instances), but it requires lots of work to get into the code, especially in bigger projects like Amarok or KMail. No idea about Amarok and only very little about KMail, but as far as I can tell its developers are working quite determined on further modularization, making it easier to tackle sub areas. Still quite complicated due to being one of the oldest KDE application in existance, lots of generations of code and coders preferenecs in there :) Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
On Tuesday, 2013-10-29, 06:48:40, Michael wrote: Hi Frank, Am Mon, 28 Oct 2013 20:36:02 +0100 schrieb Frank Steinmetzger war...@gmx.de: I suppose right now the migration to 5.0 takes lots of developer resources, so I imagine fixing bugs in “obsolete” 4 gets even less attention. I attempted fixing bugs before (and sent a patch in two instances), but it requires lots of work to get into the code, especially in bigger projects like Amarok or KMail. Oh, KDE4 is more or less in maintenance-mode? Yes and no :) In the context of this discussion, i.e. KDE's desktop environment, yes. In the larger context of all KDE products, no. Duncan already explained that in more detail :) Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
Hi Duncan, as usual thanks for the thorough explanations. I've noted a couple of minor inaccuracies, so here we go :) On Tuesday, 2013-10-29, 14:35:29, Duncan wrote: Both the kde foundations and the qt it's based on are becoming a lot more modular, with the ability for developers to pick and choose the dependencies they want/need without having to bring in the whole big currently monolithic qtlibs and kdelibs. Qt itself is maturing as a developer-community-based toolkit in its own right, and qt5 is far more community-driven than any qt ever before in history. As part of that, it's both expanding and going modular, with most of its components becoming optional -- developers only pull in what they need, and will no longer have to depend on (and ship, for platforms where bundling is common) the parts they don't pull in. The modularisation of Qt5 compared to Qt4 is mostly on the respository level though. Qt4 is already split into several modules which can be used individually, e.g. a program can choose to use QtCore, QtGui and QtNetwork and not choose to depend on QtXml, QtSql and so on. That change already happened at the Qt3 to Qt4 transition. The Qt5 transition splits QtGui into two (QtGui and QtWidgets) but most other modules remained the same (library wise, some got their own respository source wise as noted above). As part of the expansion and because it /is/ more community focused now and kde has been and remains a large part of that community, parts of what were kdelibs are now becoming part of qt5. Mostly single classes though, nothing in the scope of a Qt module. Also some contributions of new code inspired by KDE code, contributed by KDE developers who worked on the original KDE code. Up the stack at the application level, kde5 is breaking up and shipping most individual apps with their own version tagging and release timing, so apps that are evolving fast can ship updates every month or even every week if they wish, while already mature apps in primarily maintenance mode might ship an update a year, mostly just to keep them building on current libraries with current tools, with the occasional security update as well when necessary. I am not sure that this has been fully established as the new procedure yet, but it is one of the possibilities. Applications might still be released together or in sets, etc. the full-featured alternative. And then there's lxde, formerly a gtk- based lite desktop, that's switching to qt and cooperating with razor- qt in some development areas. I think they actually are planning to merge. But I could be misinterpreting things. So the qt5/kde-frameworks-five generation is going to bring with it an entirely new level of choice and flexibility, both at the developer and user levels, and it's going to be very interesting indeed to watch how that ends up working, and what the fallout is in terms of app popularity say five years from now. Indeed! Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] KDE's rough edges... what are your experiences?
Kevin Krammer wrote, On 10/29/2013 06:53 AM: On Tuesday, 2013-10-29, 13:42:16, Mirosław Zalewski wrote: Unless something changed in 4.11 (I am still using 4.10), you can go to configuration dialog in Dolphin and there, in Navigation pane, make double click open files (single click selects, then). Or in system settings, input devices, mouse Or, kwriteconfig --file kdeglobals --group KDE --key SingleClick false You can use this to setup an /etc/kde/kdeglobals so all users default to double-click mode. But, this doesn't take effect for any currently open 'dolphin' windows (but it does for any subsequently opened windows). I tried: qdbus org.kde.dolphin-21870 /MainApplication reparseConfiguration but doesn't seem to be the right thing to do to notify the running dolphin Anybody know how to signal running applications to reprocess kdeglobals (or their own KConfig setup?) --stephen -- Stephen Dowdy - Systems Administrator - NCAR/RAL 303.497.2869 - sdo...@ucar.edu- http://www.ral.ucar.edu/~sdowdy/ ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
