Re: Project Idea..

[Ruben Safir]

On 03/01/2016 10:07 AM, SUNITA wrote:
> I located the following implementations on lwn.net  for finding the
> energy consumption pattern
> 
> http://lwn.net/Articles/603504/
> http://lwn.net/Articles/597279/
> http://lwn.net/Articles/558234/
> http://lwn.net/Articles/557822/
> 
> Are there any more articles which i have missed.
> 

what kind of question is that?


this is a mailing list in kernel internals for newbies.  This is not
hand holding for HW.  If that is all the articles you found then that is
all you will see.

BTW Greg gave you the answer to your inquire on a silver platter and you
ignored it.


Ruben

-- 
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that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
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but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013

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Re: Project Idea..

[Greg KH]

On Tue, Mar 01, 2016 at 07:00:36AM +0530, SUNITA wrote:
> There are four scheduling policies.  Is it feasible if i design a scheduling
> policy which will overcome the drawbacks of sched_RR. 
> The purpose is to reduce the number of context switches.
> I have to modify fair.c

That sounds like a homework question, why are you trying to do this
without doing research into how it has already been solved 4 different
times?

Hint, if you have an Android phone, odds are one of those solutions is
in the kernel in it, go get the source tree and look at the changes that
were made.

good luck,

greg k-h

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Re: Project Idea..

[SUNITA]

Hello,

I want to measure the battery usage of various  applications in linux.
I executed powerstat and powertop tools.  Are there any other tools
which indicate the power consumption by programs in linux.

I want to calculate the power used by various scheduling programs.

Also can Sysbench be an alternative to Mibench.

Regards,
Sunita


On 2/22/16, Greg KH  wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 10:54:54AM +0530, SUNITA wrote:
>> Respected Sir/Madam,
>> I am trying to study the effect of Scheduler Policies on Energy
>> Consumption of Portable Device.
>
> There are lots of people currently working on this, and have been for
> many years.  I know of at least 3 complete implementations at the
> moment (two of which ship in some Android phones), so I would suggest
> working with one of those groups to try to get their code merged into
> the Linux kernel.  To create a 4th implementation would seem like a bit
> of a redundant effort.
>
> Search the archives of lwn.net for details about this if you are
> interested.
>
> good luck!
>
> greg k-h
>

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Fwd: Re: Project Idea..

[SUNITA]

-- Forwarded message --
From: "SUNITA" <sunitad...@gmail.com>
Date: 23 Feb 2016 17:23
Subject: Re: Project Idea..
To: "Mulyadi Santosa" <mulyadi.sant...@gmail.com>
Cc:

Dear Mulyadi,

Thank you for your reply.  I m proceeding with the modification in
CFS.  Hope this will be useful research.

Regards,
Sunita

On 2/22/16, Mulyadi Santosa <mulyadi.sant...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 12:24 PM, SUNITA <sunitad...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Respected Sir/Madam,
>> I am trying to study the effect of Scheduler Policies on Energy
>> Consumption of Portable Device.
>>
>> This will be achieved by modifying the current Completely Fair
>> Scheduler by changing the range of nice values from 40 to 100 and
>> adding a new scheduing policy.
>> CFS uses SCHED_RR, SCHED_FCFS, SCHED_OTHER, SCHED_BATCH Policy for
>> scheduling any process.  The idea is to insert a new scheduling policy
>> by modifying the header files.
>>
>> Can this be a good topic to carry out research.I welcome any other
>> idea related Linux Kernel CFS.
>>
>> Regards,
>> SUNIITA
>>
>> ___
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>> Kernelnewbies@kernelnewbies.org
>> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>>
>
> Hi Suniita
>
> Sounds challenging.
>
> It might be good topic. Just make sure you understand how to measure power
> consumption and prepare various scenario of load simulation to mimic real
> power consumption pattern.
>
>
> --
> regards,
>
> Mulyadi Santosa
> Freelance Linux trainer and consultant
>
> blog: the-hydra.blogspot.com
> training: mulyaditraining.blogspot.com
>
> This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast.
> www.avast.com <https://www.avast.com/sig-email>
> <#DDB4FAA8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>
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Re: Project Idea..

[SUNITA]

On 22 Feb 2016 21:48, "Greg KH"  wrote:

> On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 10:54:54AM +0530, SUNITA wrote:
> > Respected Sir/Madam,
> > I am trying to study the effect of Scheduler Policies on Energy
> > Consumption of Portable Device.
>
> There are lots of people currently working on this, and have been for
> many years.  I know of at least 3 complete implementations at the
> moment (two of which ship in some Android phones), so I would suggest
> working with one of those groups to try to get their code merged into
> the Linux kernel.  To create a 4th implementation would seem like a bit
> of a redundant effort.
>
> Search the archives of lwn.net for details about this if you are
> interested.
>
> good luck!
>
> greg k-h
>
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Re: Project Idea..

[Greg KH]

On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 10:54:54AM +0530, SUNITA wrote:
> Respected Sir/Madam,
> I am trying to study the effect of Scheduler Policies on Energy
> Consumption of Portable Device.

There are lots of people currently working on this, and have been for
many years.  I know of at least 3 complete implementations at the
moment (two of which ship in some Android phones), so I would suggest
working with one of those groups to try to get their code merged into
the Linux kernel.  To create a 4th implementation would seem like a bit
of a redundant effort.

Search the archives of lwn.net for details about this if you are
interested.

good luck!

greg k-h

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Re: Project Idea..

[Mulyadi Santosa]

On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 12:24 PM, SUNITA  wrote:

> Respected Sir/Madam,
> I am trying to study the effect of Scheduler Policies on Energy
> Consumption of Portable Device.
>
> This will be achieved by modifying the current Completely Fair
> Scheduler by changing the range of nice values from 40 to 100 and
> adding a new scheduing policy.
> CFS uses SCHED_RR, SCHED_FCFS, SCHED_OTHER, SCHED_BATCH Policy for
> scheduling any process.  The idea is to insert a new scheduling policy
> by modifying the header files.
>
> Can this be a good topic to carry out research.I welcome any other
> idea related Linux Kernel CFS.
>
> Regards,
> SUNIITA
>
> ___
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> Kernelnewbies@kernelnewbies.org
> http://lists.kernelnewbies.org/mailman/listinfo/kernelnewbies
>

Hi Suniita

Sounds challenging.

It might be good topic. Just make sure you understand how to measure power
consumption and prepare various scenario of load simulation to mimic real
power consumption pattern.


-- 
regards,

Mulyadi Santosa
Freelance Linux trainer and consultant

blog: the-hydra.blogspot.com
training: mulyaditraining.blogspot.com

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Project Idea..

[SUNITA]

Respected Sir/Madam,
I am trying to study the effect of Scheduler Policies on Energy
Consumption of Portable Device.

This will be achieved by modifying the current Completely Fair
Scheduler by changing the range of nice values from 40 to 100 and
adding a new scheduing policy.
CFS uses SCHED_RR, SCHED_FCFS, SCHED_OTHER, SCHED_BATCH Policy for
scheduling any process.  The idea is to insert a new scheduling policy
by modifying the header files.

Can this be a good topic to carry out research.I welcome any other
idea related Linux Kernel CFS.

Regards,
SUNIITA

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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Carlos Rimola]

Hi All,

I have some quick and general questions regarding IPP over USB (IPP USB
for short). Some are related to Till's proposed project Google Summer of
Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support. Any help and feedback will be
greatly welcomed. I should mention that I am in favor of the proposed
project for this event.

Assumptions (please confirm or correct):

1) This first one may be obvious but to be sure - I am assuming that we are
referring to IPP USB as defined in the USB Print Interface Class IPP
Protocol Specification Revision 1.0 dated 12/5/2012 and published by
USB-IF and authored by HP's Smith Kennedy and Andrew R. Mitchell. I'll
refer to it as the IPP USB Spec.

2) As I understand the IPP USB Spec, there is NO network interface, NOR
TCP/IP involved. The Communication Protocol to be used between Host and
Device (Printer) is *purely HTTP + IPP directly over USB*. A place where
this is noted is section 6.2 - HTTP Headers which states the following:

*Since there is NO network interface connection, NO DNS hostnames or IP
addresses, and NO TCP port numbers associated with USB connection, the
requirements of the HTTP Host field is addressed by requiring that the
value of this header MUST be localhost.*

Please correct me if I am wrong on either of these assumptions.


Questions:

1) I know the Spec is already cast in stone but I would like to understand
what function HTTP serves and if it is only used for identifying Host:
localhost and the /ipp/printer path? In other words, could pure IPP
Requests/Responses and IPP expected format Print Data have sufficed?

 2) Section 3.2 Interface Set paragraph 2 states that All IPP USB capable
Print class interfaces provided by a device MUST be functionally equal from
an IPP operation or HTTP perspective.  In other words, any IPP operation or
resource path that is valid over one IPP USB interface MUST be
reachable viaany and
all of the IPP USB interfaces.

Does this imply that, for example, a Request from the host can be sent over
one interface (I/F #1) and the response received over a different interface
(e.g., I/F #2)?

3) The last question is much simpler but would be helpful to an implementor
- what specific printers (manufacturer, line and model) *on the
market*support IPP USB? I have seen references to HP Photosmart and
OfficeJet but
no model given. Similarly, what Host(s) on the market, including OS and
version, support the IPP USB protocol with these Printers?

Knowing this would be helpful to implement and test either device and/or
host support.

I look forward to your reply and discussing the project further.


Thanks!


Carlos Rimola

Software Developer

crim...@gmail.com

408-508-8339
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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Carlos Rimola]

Michael,

Thanks for the comprehensive response to my questions on IPP USB and
confirming my assumptions.

The only remaining question I have for the list at this time is - are there
any Hosts, including model, OS and OS version (or other S/W requirements),
presently available on the market (or otherwise) which support IPP USB as
per the Specification?

Thanks again,

Carlos Rimola


On Thu, Feb 27, 2014 at 7:37 AM, Michael Sweet msw...@apple.com wrote:

 Carlos,

 On Feb 26, 2014, at 9:33 PM, Carlos Rimola crim...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi All,

 I have some quick and general questions regarding IPP over USB (IPP USB
 for short). Some are related to Till's proposed project Google Summer of
 Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support. Any help and feedback will be
 greatly welcomed. I should mention that I am in favor of the proposed
 project for this event.

 Assumptions (please confirm or correct):

 1) This first one may be obvious but to be sure - I am assuming that we
 are referring to IPP USB as defined in the USB Print Interface Class IPP
 Protocol Specification Revision 1.0 dated 12/5/2012 and published by
 USB-IF and authored by HP's Smith Kennedy and Andrew R. Mitchell. I'll
 refer to it as the IPP USB Spec.

 Correct.

 2) As I understand the IPP USB Spec, there is NO network interface, NOR
 TCP/IP involved. The Communication Protocol to be used between Host and
 Device (Printer) is *purely HTTP + IPP directly over USB*. A place where
 this is noted is section 6.2 - HTTP Headers which states the following:

 *Since there is NO network interface connection, NO DNS hostnames or IP
 addresses, and NO TCP port numbers associated with USB connection, the
 requirements of the HTTP Host field is addressed by requiring that the
 value of this header MUST be localhost.*

 Please correct me if I am wrong on either of these assumptions.


 Correct (a port number can be passed by the client over USB to allow
 gateways/proxies to work...)

 Questions:

 1) I know the Spec is already cast in stone but I would like to understand
 what function HTTP serves and if it is only used for identifying Host:
 localhost and the /ipp/printer path? In other words, could pure IPP
 Requests/Responses and IPP expected format Print Data have sufficed?

 While you might get away with that for simple IPP messages, that wouldn't
 work for document data since IPP by itself has no framing or other niceties
 - you'd never know when the data ended.

 Also, the HTTP portion is used for the embedded web server, doing firmware
 updates, and so forth.

  2) Section 3.2 Interface Set paragraph 2 states that All IPP USBcapable
 Print class interfaces provided by a device MUST be functionally equal
 from an IPP operation or HTTP perspective.  In other words, any IPP
 operation or resource path that is valid over one IPP USB interface MUST
 be reachable via any and all of the IPP USB interfaces.

 Does this imply that, for example, a Request from the host can be sent
 over one interface (I/F #1) and the response received over a different
 interface (e.g., I/F #2)?

 No, each interface is an independent channel to the printer.

 The reason for this requirement is to prevent having an IPP USB endpoint
 just for printing, and another just for scanning, and so forth.
  Effectively IPP USB defines an interface protocol that allows arbitrary
 HTTP and IPP requests to be performed.

 3) The last question is much simpler but would be helpful to an
 implementor - what specific printers (manufacturer, line and model) *on
 the market* support IPP USB? I have seen references to HP Photosmart and
 OfficeJet but no model given. Similarly, what Host(s) on the market,
 including OS and version, support the IPP USB protocol with these Printers?

 Here is the latest list we have from HP:

 Deskjet 3520
 Envy 120
 Envy 4500
 Envy 5530
 Officejet 3620
 Officejet 4630
 Officejet 7610
 Officejet Pro 276 MFP
 Officejet Pro X576 dw
 Photosmart 5520
 Photosmart 6520
 Photosmart 7520

 I know of four other manufacturers that either have shipping products or
 will soon be shipping - will post here when I can do so publicly...

 _
 Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair


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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Carlos Rimola]

Hello All,

I have a couple of simple follow-up questions on IPP USB (IPP-over-USB)
Host device support:

Is IPP USB designed to support connecting and printing from a device like a
tablet or smartphone (e.g., iPad, iPhone, Etc.) directly connected to a
printer over USB? If the answer is yes - is there any device that currently
supports this? I imagine a special cable or converter would be needed?

Or is IPP USB designed only for Hosts like Linux or Mac acting as print
servers/gateways for these, and other, devices?

Thanks,

Carlos


On Thu, Feb 27, 2014 at 11:29 AM, Michael Sweet msw...@apple.com wrote:

 Carlos,

 Any Mac running OS X 10.9 supports IPP USB; note that we have a bunch of
 pending bug fixes (sorry, can't say when the fixes will be released...)
 that address issues found in testing with multiple vendors' implementations
 of IPP USB, but the current 10.9.2 will work with all of the HP printers
 mentioned below.


 On Feb 27, 2014, at 2:23 PM, Carlos Rimola crim...@gmail.com wrote:

 Michael,

 Thanks for the comprehensive response to my questions on IPP USB and
 confirming my assumptions.

 The only remaining question I have for the list at this time is - are
 there any Hosts, including model, OS and OS version (or other S/W
 requirements), presently available on the market (or otherwise) which
 support IPP USB as per the Specification?

 Thanks again,

 Carlos Rimola


 On Thu, Feb 27, 2014 at 7:37 AM, Michael Sweet msw...@apple.com wrote:

 Carlos,

 On Feb 26, 2014, at 9:33 PM, Carlos Rimola crim...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi All,

 I have some quick and general questions regarding IPP over USB (IPP USB
 for short). Some are related to Till's proposed project Google Summer
 of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support. Any help and feedback will
 be greatly welcomed. I should mention that I am in favor of the proposed
 project for this event.

 Assumptions (please confirm or correct):

 1) This first one may be obvious but to be sure - I am assuming that we
 are referring to IPP USB as defined in the USB Print Interface Class IPP
 Protocol Specification Revision 1.0 dated 12/5/2012 and published by
 USB-IF and authored by HP's Smith Kennedy and Andrew R. Mitchell. I'll
 refer to it as the IPP USB Spec.

 Correct.

 2) As I understand the IPP USB Spec, there is NO network interface, NOR
 TCP/IP involved. The Communication Protocol to be used between Host and
 Device (Printer) is *purely HTTP + IPP directly over USB*. A place where
 this is noted is section 6.2 - HTTP Headers which states the following:

 *Since there is NO network interface connection, NO DNS hostnames or IP
 addresses, and NO TCP port numbers associated with USB connection, the
 requirements of the HTTP Host field is addressed by requiring that the
 value of this header MUST be localhost.*

 Please correct me if I am wrong on either of these assumptions.


 Correct (a port number can be passed by the client over USB to allow
 gateways/proxies to work...)

 Questions:

 1) I know the Spec is already cast in stone but I would like to
 understand what function HTTP serves and if it is only used for identifying
 Host: localhost and the /ipp/printer path? In other words, could pure
 IPP Requests/Responses and IPP expected format Print Data have sufficed?

 While you might get away with that for simple IPP messages, that wouldn't
 work for document data since IPP by itself has no framing or other niceties
 - you'd never know when the data ended.

 Also, the HTTP portion is used for the embedded web server, doing
 firmware updates, and so forth.


  2) Section 3.2 Interface Set paragraph 2 states that All IPP USBcapable
 Print class interfaces provided by a device MUST be functionally equal
 from an IPP operation or HTTP perspective.  In other words, any IPP
 operation or resource path that is valid over one IPP USB interface MUST
 be reachable via any and all of the IPP USB interfaces.

 Does this imply that, for example, a Request from the host can be sent
 over one interface (I/F #1) and the response received over a different
 interface (e.g., I/F #2)?

 No, each interface is an independent channel to the printer.

 The reason for this requirement is to prevent having an IPP USB endpoint
 just for printing, and another just for scanning, and so forth.
  Effectively IPP USB defines an interface protocol that allows arbitrary
 HTTP and IPP requests to be performed.

 3) The last question is much simpler but would be helpful to an
 implementor - what specific printers (manufacturer, line and model) *on
 the market* support IPP USB? I have seen references to HP Photosmart and
 OfficeJet but no model given. Similarly, what Host(s) on the market,
 including OS and version, support the IPP USB protocol with these Printers?

 Here is the latest list we have from HP:

 Deskjet 3520
 Envy 120
 Envy 4500
 Envy 5530
 Officejet 3620
 Officejet 4630
 Officejet 7610
 Officejet Pro 276 MFP
 Officejet Pro X576 

Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Michael Sweet]

Carlos,

On Mar 4, 2014, at 5:28 PM, Carlos Rimola crim...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hello All,
 
 I have a couple of simple follow-up questions on IPP USB (IPP-over-USB) 
 Host device support:
 
 Is IPP USB designed to support connecting and printing from a device like a 
 tablet or smartphone (e.g., iPad, iPhone, Etc.) directly connected to a 
 printer over USB?

Honestly, no.  Who would want to tether their mobile device to print something?

Wi-Fi (and soon Wi-Fi Direct) offer ways of printing from mobile devices to 
these same printers (most of which already have Wi-Fi and/or Ethernet 
interfaces...)

 ...
 Or is IPP USB designed only for Hosts like Linux or Mac acting as print 
 servers/gateways for these, and other, devices?

It is mainly for existing desktop/portable/personal server/NAS/other-embedded 
usage that currently relies on the old USB printer class protocol and printer 
drivers.  The (hopefully not too) long term goal is to eliminate the need for 
printer drivers, much as today you don't need a special driver for a USB 
keyboard or mouse.  (and like keyboards and mice you might still get some 
software from the vendor to provide additional functionality, but generally 
you'll be able to just plug a printer in and print something without installing 
extra software...)

For IPP USB in particular I think we'll see adoption by NAS and other network 
boxes that already provide primitive printer sharing.

_
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair



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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Michael Sweet]

Carlos,

On Feb 26, 2014, at 9:33 PM, Carlos Rimola crim...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi All,
 
 I have some quick and general questions regarding IPP over USB (IPP USB for 
 short). Some are related to Till's proposed project Google Summer of Code 
 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support. Any help and feedback will be greatly 
 welcomed. I should mention that I am in favor of the proposed project for 
 this event.
 
 Assumptions (please confirm or correct):
 
 1) This first one may be obvious but to be sure - I am assuming that we are 
 referring to IPP USB as defined in the USB Print Interface Class IPP 
 Protocol Specification Revision 1.0 dated 12/5/2012 and published by USB-IF 
 and authored by HP's Smith Kennedy and Andrew R. Mitchell. I'll refer to it 
 as the IPP USB Spec.
 
Correct.
 2) As I understand the IPP USB Spec, there is NO network interface, NOR 
 TCP/IP involved. The Communication Protocol to be used between Host and 
 Device (Printer) is purely HTTP + IPP directly over USB. A place where this 
 is noted is section 6.2 - HTTP Headers which states the following:
 
 Since there is NO network interface connection, NO DNS hostnames or IP 
 addresses, and NO TCP port numbers associated with USB connection, the 
 requirements of the HTTP Host field is addressed by requiring that the value 
 of this header MUST be localhost.
 
 Please correct me if I am wrong on either of these assumptions.
 

Correct (a port number can be passed by the client over USB to allow 
gateways/proxies to work...)
 Questions:
 
 1) I know the Spec is already cast in stone but I would like to understand 
 what function HTTP serves and if it is only used for identifying Host: 
 localhost and the /ipp/printer path? In other words, could pure IPP 
 Requests/Responses and IPP expected format Print Data have sufficed?
 
While you might get away with that for simple IPP messages, that wouldn't work 
for document data since IPP by itself has no framing or other niceties - you'd 
never know when the data ended.

Also, the HTTP portion is used for the embedded web server, doing firmware 
updates, and so forth.
  2) Section 3.2 Interface Set paragraph 2 states that All IPP USB capable 
 Print class interfaces provided by a device MUST be functionally equal from 
 an IPP operation or HTTP perspective.  In other words, any IPP operation or 
 resource path that is valid over one IPP USB interface MUST be reachable via 
 any and all of the IPP USB interfaces.
 
 Does this imply that, for example, a Request from the host can be sent over 
 one interface (I/F #1) and the response received over a different interface 
 (e.g., I/F #2)?
 
No, each interface is an independent channel to the printer.

The reason for this requirement is to prevent having an IPP USB endpoint just 
for printing, and another just for scanning, and so forth.  Effectively IPP USB 
defines an interface protocol that allows arbitrary HTTP and IPP requests to be 
performed.
 3) The last question is much simpler but would be helpful to an implementor - 
 what specific printers (manufacturer, line and model) on the market support 
 IPP USB? I have seen references to HP Photosmart and OfficeJet but no model 
 given. Similarly, what Host(s) on the market, including OS and version, 
 support the IPP USB protocol with these Printers?
 
Here is the latest list we have from HP:

Deskjet 3520
Envy 120
Envy 4500
Envy 5530
Officejet 3620
Officejet 4630
Officejet 7610
Officejet Pro 276 MFP
Officejet Pro X576 dw
Photosmart 5520
Photosmart 6520
Photosmart 7520

I know of four other manufacturers that either have shipping products or will 
soon be shipping - will post here when I can do so publicly...

_
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair



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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Michael Sweet]

Carlos,

Any Mac running OS X 10.9 supports IPP USB; note that we have a bunch of 
pending bug fixes (sorry, can't say when the fixes will be released...) that 
address issues found in testing with multiple vendors' implementations of IPP 
USB, but the current 10.9.2 will work with all of the HP printers mentioned 
below.


On Feb 27, 2014, at 2:23 PM, Carlos Rimola crim...@gmail.com wrote:

 Michael,
 
 Thanks for the comprehensive response to my questions on IPP USB and 
 confirming my assumptions. 
 
 The only remaining question I have for the list at this time is - are there 
 any Hosts, including model, OS and OS version (or other S/W requirements), 
 presently available on the market (or otherwise) which support IPP USB as per 
 the Specification?
 
 Thanks again,
 
 Carlos Rimola
 
 
 On Thu, Feb 27, 2014 at 7:37 AM, Michael Sweet msw...@apple.com wrote:
 Carlos,
 
 On Feb 26, 2014, at 9:33 PM, Carlos Rimola crim...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi All,
 
 I have some quick and general questions regarding IPP over USB (IPP USB 
 for short). Some are related to Till's proposed project Google Summer of 
 Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support. Any help and feedback will be 
 greatly welcomed. I should mention that I am in favor of the proposed 
 project for this event.
 
 Assumptions (please confirm or correct):
 
 1) This first one may be obvious but to be sure - I am assuming that we are 
 referring to IPP USB as defined in the USB Print Interface Class IPP 
 Protocol Specification Revision 1.0 dated 12/5/2012 and published by USB-IF 
 and authored by HP's Smith Kennedy and Andrew R. Mitchell. I'll refer to it 
 as the IPP USB Spec.
 
 Correct.
 2) As I understand the IPP USB Spec, there is NO network interface, NOR 
 TCP/IP involved. The Communication Protocol to be used between Host and 
 Device (Printer) is purely HTTP + IPP directly over USB. A place where this 
 is noted is section 6.2 - HTTP Headers which states the following:
 
 Since there is NO network interface connection, NO DNS hostnames or IP 
 addresses, and NO TCP port numbers associated with USB connection, the 
 requirements of the HTTP Host field is addressed by requiring that the value 
 of this header MUST be localhost.
 
 Please correct me if I am wrong on either of these assumptions.
 
 
 Correct (a port number can be passed by the client over USB to allow 
 gateways/proxies to work...)
 Questions:
 
 1) I know the Spec is already cast in stone but I would like to understand 
 what function HTTP serves and if it is only used for identifying Host: 
 localhost and the /ipp/printer path? In other words, could pure IPP 
 Requests/Responses and IPP expected format Print Data have sufficed?
 
 While you might get away with that for simple IPP messages, that wouldn't 
 work for document data since IPP by itself has no framing or other niceties - 
 you'd never know when the data ended.
 
 Also, the HTTP portion is used for the embedded web server, doing firmware 
 updates, and so forth.
 
  2) Section 3.2 Interface Set paragraph 2 states that All IPP USB capable 
 Print class interfaces provided by a device MUST be functionally equal from 
 an IPP operation or HTTP perspective.  In other words, any IPP operation or 
 resource path that is valid over one IPP USB interface MUST be reachable via 
 any and all of the IPP USB interfaces.
 
 Does this imply that, for example, a Request from the host can be sent over 
 one interface (I/F #1) and the response received over a different interface 
 (e.g., I/F #2)?
 
 No, each interface is an independent channel to the printer.
 
 The reason for this requirement is to prevent having an IPP USB endpoint just 
 for printing, and another just for scanning, and so forth.  Effectively IPP 
 USB defines an interface protocol that allows arbitrary HTTP and IPP requests 
 to be performed.
 3) The last question is much simpler but would be helpful to an implementor 
 - what specific printers (manufacturer, line and model) on the market 
 support IPP USB? I have seen references to HP Photosmart and OfficeJet but 
 no model given. Similarly, what Host(s) on the market, including OS and 
 version, support the IPP USB protocol with these Printers?
 
 Here is the latest list we have from HP:
 
 Deskjet 3520
 Envy 120
 Envy 4500
 Envy 5530
 Officejet 3620
 Officejet 4630
 Officejet 7610
 Officejet Pro 276 MFP
 Officejet Pro X576 dw
 Photosmart 5520
 Photosmart 6520
 Photosmart 7520
 
 I know of four other manufacturers that either have shipping products or will 
 soon be shipping - will post here when I can do so publicly...
 
 _
 Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
 
 

_
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair



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Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Till Kamppeter]

Hi,

a new standard not yet supported under Linux but starting to penetrate
the market is IPP-over-USB (Internet Printing Protocol over USB).

IPP, the Internet Printing Protocol from the Printing Working Group
(PWG, http://www.pwg.org/) is a standard protocol for network printers
(and also used by CUPS, the standard printing environment on practically
all non-Windows operating systems). IPP network printers have a lot of
advantages compared to USB printers (letting the ability of several
computers on a network being able to access them aside):

- Encrypted job transfer
- Possibility to request printer status and printer capabilities
- Web interface to configure the printer

All this works with standard protocols and without any requirement of
printer manufacturer/model specific software. For printers which also
understand standard languages for the jobs themselves (PostScript, PDF,
PWG Raster, PCL, JPG, TIFF) this means completely driverless printing
(IPP Everywhere).

Unfortunately, this is a network protocol for network printers.

Fortunately, the PWG has added a standard to make it also go into USB
printers, IPP-over-USB. Problem is that there is no Linux support for that.

First, I want to make a feature request to the kernel to add it. Second,
I want to suggest this as a Google Summer of Code project, asking for
mentors on the kernel side. Mentoring Organization will be the Linux
Foundation, hosting projects for both OpenPrinting and the kernel.

It should not be too complex. Probably one can start on the driver for
USB Ethernet or WLAN sticks, as they are also USB devices which
introduce a network interface to the system. What one has to do is to
create a driver for another, probably similar device, the IPP-over-USB
printer. The driver should not be specific to the printer model (it is
an open standard protocol) and it also should provide a network
interface to the system under which there is only found the printer. The
printer should be accessible under this interface via port 80 (web
interface), 631 (IPP), and 443 (encrypted).

There are already HP printers available which do IPP-over-USB. I will
try to make arrangements for developers/students to get samples.

WDYT? Is this a viable project? Should we post it on the ideas lists?
Who would mentor it?

   Till


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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Michael Sweet]

Till,

Some comments inline...

On Feb 25, 2014, at 12:01 PM, Till Kamppeter till.kamppe...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi,
 
 a new standard not yet supported under Linux but starting to penetrate
 the market is IPP-over-USB (Internet Printing Protocol over USB).
 ...
 Fortunately, the PWG has added a standard to make it also go into USB
 printers, IPP-over-USB. Problem is that there is no Linux support for that.

Actually, it was the USB Implementers Forum (USB-IF) that defined and published 
the IPP USB specification, not the PWG.

 First, I want to make a feature request to the kernel to add it.

I don't think the kernel is the right place for this.  IPP USB isn't like 
IP-over-USB, and you'll want the interface to provide arbitration and 
multiplexing of HTTP requests over the available IPP USB interfaces.

 Second,
 I want to suggest this as a Google Summer of Code project, asking for
 mentors on the kernel side. Mentoring Organization will be the Linux
 Foundation, hosting projects for both OpenPrinting and the kernel.

This will make an excellent SoC project, but you'll need someone familiar with 
Avahi, libusb, HTTP, systemd, and general networking for this.  This isn't a 
kernel project.

 It should not be too complex. Probably one can start on the driver for
 USB Ethernet or WLAN sticks, as they are also USB devices which
 introduce a network interface to the system. What one has to do is to
 create a driver for another, probably similar device, the IPP-over-USB
 printer. The driver should not be specific to the printer model (it is
 an open standard protocol) and it also should provide a network
 interface to the system under which there is only found the printer. The
 printer should be accessible under this interface via port 80 (web
 interface), 631 (IPP), and 443 (encrypted).

OK, let's be clear on this - you DO NOT do SSL/TLS over IPP USB.  As there is 
no connection management, you would never be able to safely do a TLS 
negotiation or session management, and once encrypted you would not be able to 
multiplex access to the limited number of USB interfaces that are provided by 
the printer.

Conceptually you might want to support encryption to the IPP USB proxy 
(assuming you allow remote access to the local USB printer), but communications 
from the proxy to the USB printer need to be unencrypted.

_
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair



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Re: Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Till Kamppeter]

On 02/25/2014 06:20 PM, Linus Torvalds wrote:
 On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 9:01 AM, Till Kamppeter
 till.kamppe...@gmail.com wrote:

 First, I want to make a feature request to the kernel to add it. Second,
 I want to suggest this as a Google Summer of Code project, asking for
 mentors on the kernel side. Mentoring Organization will be the Linux
 Foundation, hosting projects for both OpenPrinting and the kernel.
 
 It certainly sounds like a worthy thing, but wasn't the deadline for
 GSoC last Friday? I know both Subsurface and X.org did that, and got
 accepted early this week.

No, the deadline was only for mentoring org applications (and as
mentoring org we, the LF, are accepted). Project ideas can be added
until the student application deadline, only the earlier they get
posted, the more potential student candidates will read them and
consider them for their applications. In addition, project ideas get
posted on the project's sites, not at Google. Also they can get posted
at more than one place.

So we should determine ASAP who could mentor this project and post the
project on our idea lists.

   Till


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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Greg KH]

On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 01:42:00PM -0500, Michael Sweet wrote:
 Till,
 
 Some comments inline...
 
 On Feb 25, 2014, at 12:01 PM, Till Kamppeter till.kamppe...@gmail.com wrote:
  Hi,
  
  a new standard not yet supported under Linux but starting to penetrate
  the market is IPP-over-USB (Internet Printing Protocol over USB).
  ...
  Fortunately, the PWG has added a standard to make it also go into USB
  printers, IPP-over-USB. Problem is that there is no Linux support for that.
 
 Actually, it was the USB Implementers Forum (USB-IF) that defined and 
 published the IPP USB specification, not the PWG.
 
  First, I want to make a feature request to the kernel to add it.
 
 I don't think the kernel is the right place for this.  IPP USB isn't
 like IP-over-USB, and you'll want the interface to provide arbitration
 and multiplexing of HTTP requests over the available IPP USB
 interfaces.

So you want to do this as a userspace library talking directly to the
USB device through usbfs/libusb?  Or should the kernel provide a basic
pipe-like functionality to the hardware to make it easier for things
to be queued up to the device?

Is there a pointer to the spec somewhere so that I can see what is
needed here?

  Second,
  I want to suggest this as a Google Summer of Code project, asking for
  mentors on the kernel side. Mentoring Organization will be the Linux
  Foundation, hosting projects for both OpenPrinting and the kernel.
 
 This will make an excellent SoC project, but you'll need someone
 familiar with Avahi, libusb, HTTP, systemd, and general networking for
 this.  This isn't a kernel project.

That's a non-trivial set of experience to try to find, good luck :)

And why systemd?  What is needed from it for this?

thanks,

greg k-h

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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Michael Sweet]

Greg,

On Feb 25, 2014, at 8:47 PM, Greg KH g...@kroah.com wrote:
 ...
 So you want to do this as a userspace library talking directly to the
 USB device through usbfs/libusb?  Or should the kernel provide a basic
 pipe-like functionality to the hardware to make it easier for things
 to be queued up to the device?

libusb is enough.

 Is there a pointer to the spec somewhere so that I can see what is
 needed here?

http://www.usb.org/developers/devclass_docs

 Second,
 I want to suggest this as a Google Summer of Code project, asking for
 mentors on the kernel side. Mentoring Organization will be the Linux
 Foundation, hosting projects for both OpenPrinting and the kernel.
 
 This will make an excellent SoC project, but you'll need someone
 familiar with Avahi, libusb, HTTP, systemd, and general networking for
 this.  This isn't a kernel project.
 
 That's a non-trivial set of experience to try to find, good luck :)

Agreed.

 And why systemd?  What is needed from it for this?

Just for the launch-on-demand functionality.  Not absolutely required, but it 
helps to minimize the overall weight of the OS when you aren't printing 
constantly...

_
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair



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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Till Kamppeter]

I have posted this project on our project ideas list now:

https://www.linuxfoundation.org/collaborate/workgroups/gsoc/google-summer-code-2014

Feel free to do corrections on the posting.

I have also announced our participation in the GSoC on our front page:

https://www.linuxfoundation.org/collaborate/workgroups/openprinting

   Till

On 02/26/2014 02:56 AM, Michael Sweet wrote:
 Greg,
 
 On Feb 25, 2014, at 8:47 PM, Greg KH g...@kroah.com wrote:
 ...
 So you want to do this as a userspace library talking directly to the
 USB device through usbfs/libusb?  Or should the kernel provide a basic
 pipe-like functionality to the hardware to make it easier for things
 to be queued up to the device?
 
 libusb is enough.
 
 Is there a pointer to the spec somewhere so that I can see what is
 needed here?
 
 http://www.usb.org/developers/devclass_docs
 
 Second,
 I want to suggest this as a Google Summer of Code project, asking for
 mentors on the kernel side. Mentoring Organization will be the Linux
 Foundation, hosting projects for both OpenPrinting and the kernel.

 This will make an excellent SoC project, but you'll need someone
 familiar with Avahi, libusb, HTTP, systemd, and general networking for
 this.  This isn't a kernel project.

 That's a non-trivial set of experience to try to find, good luck :)
 
 Agreed.
 
 And why systemd?  What is needed from it for this?
 
 Just for the launch-on-demand functionality.  Not absolutely required, but it 
 helps to minimize the overall weight of the OS when you aren't printing 
 constantly...
 
 _
 Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
 


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Re: Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Valdis . Kletnieks]

On Tue, 25 Feb 2014 18:01:07 +0100, Till Kamppeter said:

 all non-Windows operating systems). IPP network printers have a lot of
 advantages compared to USB printers (letting the ability of several
 computers on a network being able to access them aside):

 - Encrypted job transfer

I'll merely point out that encrypted transfer doesn't mean much for
a USB transfer - if an attacker is able to play with your USB you have
far greater problems than that to worry about...


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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Greg KH]

On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 08:56:23PM -0500, Michael Sweet wrote:
 Greg,
 
 On Feb 25, 2014, at 8:47 PM, Greg KH g...@kroah.com wrote:
  ...
  So you want to do this as a userspace library talking directly to the
  USB device through usbfs/libusb?  Or should the kernel provide a basic
  pipe-like functionality to the hardware to make it easier for things
  to be queued up to the device?
 
 libusb is enough.
 
  Is there a pointer to the spec somewhere so that I can see what is
  needed here?
 
 http://www.usb.org/developers/devclass_docs

In reading the spec, it looks like some kernel code will have to be
written, as the default configuration for the printer device will cause
the usblp driver to bind to the device.  Are you thinking that libusb
will just unbind the printer driver and take over from there?  Why not
just use the kernel driver to expose another device node and have cups
talk to that?

thanks,

greg k-h

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Re: [Printing-architecture] Google Summer of Code 2014 - IPP-over-USB printer support - Joint project idea for OpenPrinting and the kernel

[Michael Sweet]

Greg,

We already unload the usblp driver - it isn't compatible with most of the 
multifunction printers out there today...


On Feb 26, 2014, at 6:02 PM, Greg KH g...@kroah.com wrote:

 On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 08:56:23PM -0500, Michael Sweet wrote:
 Greg,
 
 On Feb 25, 2014, at 8:47 PM, Greg KH g...@kroah.com wrote:
 ...
 So you want to do this as a userspace library talking directly to the
 USB device through usbfs/libusb?  Or should the kernel provide a basic
 pipe-like functionality to the hardware to make it easier for things
 to be queued up to the device?
 
 libusb is enough.
 
 Is there a pointer to the spec somewhere so that I can see what is
 needed here?
 
 http://www.usb.org/developers/devclass_docs
 
 In reading the spec, it looks like some kernel code will have to be
 written, as the default configuration for the printer device will cause
 the usblp driver to bind to the device.  Are you thinking that libusb
 will just unbind the printer driver and take over from there?  Why not
 just use the kernel driver to expose another device node and have cups
 talk to that?
 
 thanks,
 
 greg k-h

_
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair



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Re: GSoC project idea: HFS Plus journal

[Rajat Sharma]

On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 2:15 AM, Greg Freemyer greg.freem...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Sun, Mar 20, 2011 at 1:07 PM, Naohiro Aota na...@elisp.net wrote:
 Greg KH g...@kroah.com writes:

 On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 06:57:27PM +0900, Naohiro Aota wrote:
 Hi,

 I see some of you are talking about GSoC participation. I'm also
 thinking of it.

 I have MacBookPro booting both MacOSX and Linux. Now Linux can write the
 filesystem safely only when HFS Plus journal is off. My life would be
 more better if Linux have complete HFS Plus filesystem read/write
 support.

 So I'm thinking of implementing HFS Plus Journal support on Linux. I've
 searched and found a technote about HFS Plus format describe its Journal
 [1].

 How do you think about it?

 Looks like a nice self-contained, project proposal, good luck!

 Thanks. I need someone to mentor me :) How can I find him/her? Maybe I
 should post developing mailing list. But I don't find HFS+ developing
 list :(

 Regards,

 You can try linux-fsde...@vger.kernel.org,

 That is where generic file system and vfs discussions take place.  I
 assume all  the major file system developers subscribe to that.

 Greg (not KH)

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The code files for HFS mention following copyright:

Copyright (C) 1995-1997  Paul H. Hargrove
(C) 2003 Ardis Technologies ro...@ardistech.com

probably you should talk to Paul and take a lock for your development :)

Rajat

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Re: GSoC project idea: HFS Plus journal

[Naohiro Aota]

Greg KH g...@kroah.com writes:

 On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 06:57:27PM +0900, Naohiro Aota wrote:
 Hi,
 
 I see some of you are talking about GSoC participation. I'm also
 thinking of it.
 
 I have MacBookPro booting both MacOSX and Linux. Now Linux can write the
 filesystem safely only when HFS Plus journal is off. My life would be
 more better if Linux have complete HFS Plus filesystem read/write
 support.
 
 So I'm thinking of implementing HFS Plus Journal support on Linux. I've
 searched and found a technote about HFS Plus format describe its Journal
 [1].
 
 How do you think about it?

 Looks like a nice self-contained, project proposal, good luck!

Thanks. I need someone to mentor me :) How can I find him/her? Maybe I
should post developing mailing list. But I don't find HFS+ developing
list :(

Regards,


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Re: GSoC project idea: HFS Plus journal

[Greg KH]

On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 02:07:40AM +0900, Naohiro Aota wrote:
 Greg KH g...@kroah.com writes:
 
  On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 06:57:27PM +0900, Naohiro Aota wrote:
  Hi,
  
  I see some of you are talking about GSoC participation. I'm also
  thinking of it.
  
  I have MacBookPro booting both MacOSX and Linux. Now Linux can write the
  filesystem safely only when HFS Plus journal is off. My life would be
  more better if Linux have complete HFS Plus filesystem read/write
  support.
  
  So I'm thinking of implementing HFS Plus Journal support on Linux. I've
  searched and found a technote about HFS Plus format describe its Journal
  [1].
  
  How do you think about it?
 
  Looks like a nice self-contained, project proposal, good luck!
 
 Thanks. I need someone to mentor me :) How can I find him/her? Maybe I
 should post developing mailing list. But I don't find HFS+ developing
 list :(

You need to propose projects for GSoC, the mentor matching comes
afterward.  Please go read the procedures for how the program works.

best of luck,

greg k-h

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Re: GSoC project idea: HFS Plus journal

[Greg Freemyer]

On Sun, Mar 20, 2011 at 1:07 PM, Naohiro Aota na...@elisp.net wrote:
 Greg KH g...@kroah.com writes:

 On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 06:57:27PM +0900, Naohiro Aota wrote:
 Hi,

 I see some of you are talking about GSoC participation. I'm also
 thinking of it.

 I have MacBookPro booting both MacOSX and Linux. Now Linux can write the
 filesystem safely only when HFS Plus journal is off. My life would be
 more better if Linux have complete HFS Plus filesystem read/write
 support.

 So I'm thinking of implementing HFS Plus Journal support on Linux. I've
 searched and found a technote about HFS Plus format describe its Journal
 [1].

 How do you think about it?

 Looks like a nice self-contained, project proposal, good luck!

 Thanks. I need someone to mentor me :) How can I find him/her? Maybe I
 should post developing mailing list. But I don't find HFS+ developing
 list :(

 Regards,

You can try linux-fsde...@vger.kernel.org,

That is where generic file system and vfs discussions take place.  I
assume all  the major file system developers subscribe to that.

Greg (not KH)

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