Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 24 October 2012 15:59, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: > Brian, > > I was going to refer a young engineering student to the page > > https://launchpad.net/kicad-winbuilder > > and ask that he try and use it to build newest KiCad. > > However after reading the initial page, I began to question if there is enough > instructional information in those few paragraphs for a complete novice. > > Specifically, does it say: > > > a) what bzr and cmake are? > > b) that they have to be installed ahead of time? > > c) where to get them from? > > > > I ended up holding off asking the kid to proceed, and this could simply be a > mis-understanding on my part. I'd wish for the above 3 items to be covered > on the > introductory page. > > > > I do like the idea of having a cup of coffee, which is one of the > recommendations on the page. > > > Thanks for your work, > > Dick Hi Dick, I've added some more information to the project's description. The information was/is at the start of the script, but it's not intuitive to open the script with a text editor before doing anything else! Perhaps a simple readme.txt would be better. Best Regards, Brian. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
Brian, I was going to refer a young engineering student to the page https://launchpad.net/kicad-winbuilder and ask that he try and use it to build newest KiCad. However after reading the initial page, I began to question if there is enough instructional information in those few paragraphs for a complete novice. Specifically, does it say: a) what bzr and cmake are? b) that they have to be installed ahead of time? c) where to get them from? I ended up holding off asking the kid to proceed, and this could simply be a mis-understanding on my part. I'd wish for the above 3 items to be covered on the introductory page. I do like the idea of having a cup of coffee, which is one of the recommendations on the page. Thanks for your work, Dick ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
Hello Adam. Can you remove dependency of kicad.deb from kicad-common.deb and make kicad-common to be dependent from kicad instead as it done in original ubuntu repository? Kicad can work without libraries while libraries are unusable without kicad. I didn't use kicad libraries from kicad-common, i have my own ones and I don't want to download 30Mb of unused data every day over limited 3G connection. Sergey. On 19.10.2012 16:19, Adam Wolf wrote: I have some time today to set it up. I'll be taking a look through the readmes/list to see if there's a place where it explains how to turn it on during the build shortly. Adam Wolf On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Hans Henry von Tresckow mailto:hvont...@gmail.com>> wrote: On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Adam Wolf mailto:adamw...@feelslikeburning.com>> wrote: > My thought is to create an additional PPA called > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy > right now. > > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. > > Adam Wolf > Wayne and Layne > Adam, any progress on the scripting ppa? I would love to test out the scripting stuff, but I have been using your PPA instead of trying to set up a local build instead. -- Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 15 October 2012 18:56, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: >> Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the new >> nanometer units? > > > After a period of no objections, I set CMakeList.txt to use nanometers as the > default build mode. > > It is my understanding that this will affect KicadWinbuilder and Adam's PPA > as well as anyone else who does not explicitly override this setting. > > FYI, > > Dick > Hi Dick, Thanks for updating the cmake default value for USE_PCBNEW_NANOMETRES. The behaviour of this change with KicadWinbuilder is to make all new downloads of the script build with nanometre support, but it does not force old builds to build with nanometre support as the cached value for options is not overwritten by default values - which seems logical. The only way to force previous KicadWinbuilder scripts to build with nanometre support is to SET(USE_PCBNEW_NANOMETRES ON), rather than have it as OPTION(... So we should at least start to see a trickle of people changing over to the nanometre support when building on Windows. Best Regards, Brian. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 2:33 PM, Adam Wolf wrote: > I spent a while today wrestling bzr. I'm testing the build locally, because > you only get a few builds a day remotely, and I've got some bzr performance > issues. Wrestling those found a bzr bug, and on and on the yak got shaved > today. Thanks for looking into this. And on the upside, you can now make a nice Yak sweater :) -- Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
I spent a while today wrestling bzr. I'm testing the build locally, because you only get a few builds a day remotely, and I've got some bzr performance issues. Wrestling those found a bzr bug, and on and on the yak got shaved today. I'll see if I can get this out tomorrow. After I get this out, I want to take a look at the current PPA, fix some wrong assumptions I copied in from the existing Debian package, and then see if I can become the new maintainer, to get nice packages upstream before big OS releases. Adam Wolf On Oct 19, 2012 12:59 PM, "Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo" wrote: > Exactly, if possible all must go, but that will generate pcbnew.so > installed to python directories, may be that's better to build as a > separate package? > > That's for use from python (without all the kicad suite installed). > > (import pcbnew ) > > > There is one flag to enable "python inside pcbnew" other for "pcbnew > inside python" (candidate to be in a separate package), and then another to > enable the wxpython support (for better ui integration from pcbnew). > > Sorry for the vague explanation, I'm just having to leave for some > minutes, but will be back in 15-20min again. > > > 2012/10/19 Adam Wolf > >> Thanks Miguel! That helps a lot. We also want to turn on all three >> scripting options offered in the CMakeList in this build, right? >> >> Adam Wolf >> >> >> On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 12:54 PM, Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo < >> miguelan...@nbee.es> wrote: >> >>> Great!!! :), please Adam let me know if you need any kind of information >>> of help. >>> no big special care needed, just adds dependencies to: >>> >>> 1) wxPython-devel >>> 2) Python-devel (tested with 2.6 and 2.7) >>> 3) swig 2.x.x >>> >>> >>> 2012/10/19 Adam Wolf >>> I have some time today to set it up. I'll be taking a look through the readmes/list to see if there's a place where it explains how to turn it on during the build shortly. Adam Wolf On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Hans Henry von Tresckow < hvont...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Adam Wolf > wrote: > > My thought is to create an additional PPA called > > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be > exactly > > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned > > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to > switch > > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a > > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy > > right now. > > > > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's > > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is > > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I > > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. > > > > Adam Wolf > > Wayne and Layne > > > > Adam, any progress on the scripting ppa? I would love to test out the > scripting stuff, but I have been using your PPA instead of trying to > set up a local build instead. > -- > Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) > ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo >>> http://www.nbee.es >>> +34 636 52 25 69 >>> skype: ajoajoajo >>> >> >> >> ___ >> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >> >> > > > -- > > Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo > http://www.nbee.es > +34 636 52 25 69 > skype: ajoajoajo > ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
Exactly, if possible all must go, but that will generate pcbnew.so installed to python directories, may be that's better to build as a separate package? That's for use from python (without all the kicad suite installed). (import pcbnew ) There is one flag to enable "python inside pcbnew" other for "pcbnew inside python" (candidate to be in a separate package), and then another to enable the wxpython support (for better ui integration from pcbnew). Sorry for the vague explanation, I'm just having to leave for some minutes, but will be back in 15-20min again. 2012/10/19 Adam Wolf > Thanks Miguel! That helps a lot. We also want to turn on all three > scripting options offered in the CMakeList in this build, right? > > Adam Wolf > > > On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 12:54 PM, Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo < > miguelan...@nbee.es> wrote: > >> Great!!! :), please Adam let me know if you need any kind of information >> of help. >> no big special care needed, just adds dependencies to: >> >> 1) wxPython-devel >> 2) Python-devel (tested with 2.6 and 2.7) >> 3) swig 2.x.x >> >> >> 2012/10/19 Adam Wolf >> >>> I have some time today to set it up. I'll be taking a look through the >>> readmes/list to see if there's a place where it explains how to turn it on >>> during the build shortly. >>> >>> Adam Wolf >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Hans Henry von Tresckow < >>> hvont...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Adam Wolf wrote: > My thought is to create an additional PPA called > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy > right now. > > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. > > Adam Wolf > Wayne and Layne > Adam, any progress on the scripting ppa? I would love to test out the scripting stuff, but I have been using your PPA instead of trying to set up a local build instead. -- Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> >> Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo >> http://www.nbee.es >> +34 636 52 25 69 >> skype: ajoajoajo >> > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > -- Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo http://www.nbee.es +34 636 52 25 69 skype: ajoajoajo ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
Thanks Miguel! That helps a lot. We also want to turn on all three scripting options offered in the CMakeList in this build, right? Adam Wolf On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 12:54 PM, Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo < miguelan...@nbee.es> wrote: > Great!!! :), please Adam let me know if you need any kind of information > of help. > no big special care needed, just adds dependencies to: > > 1) wxPython-devel > 2) Python-devel (tested with 2.6 and 2.7) > 3) swig 2.x.x > > > 2012/10/19 Adam Wolf > >> I have some time today to set it up. I'll be taking a look through the >> readmes/list to see if there's a place where it explains how to turn it on >> during the build shortly. >> >> Adam Wolf >> >> >> On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Hans Henry von Tresckow < >> hvont...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Adam Wolf >>> wrote: >>> > My thought is to create an additional PPA called >>> > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly >>> > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned >>> > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch >>> > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a >>> > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy >>> > right now. >>> > >>> > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's >>> > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is >>> > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I >>> > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. >>> > >>> > Adam Wolf >>> > Wayne and Layne >>> > >>> >>> Adam, any progress on the scripting ppa? I would love to test out the >>> scripting stuff, but I have been using your PPA instead of trying to >>> set up a local build instead. >>> -- >>> Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) >>> >> >> >> ___ >> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >> >> > > > -- > > Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo > http://www.nbee.es > +34 636 52 25 69 > skype: ajoajoajo > ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
Great!!! :), please Adam let me know if you need any kind of information of help. no big special care needed, just adds dependencies to: 1) wxPython-devel 2) Python-devel (tested with 2.6 and 2.7) 3) swig 2.x.x 2012/10/19 Adam Wolf > I have some time today to set it up. I'll be taking a look through the > readmes/list to see if there's a place where it explains how to turn it on > during the build shortly. > > Adam Wolf > > > On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Hans Henry von Tresckow < > hvont...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Adam Wolf >> wrote: >> > My thought is to create an additional PPA called >> > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly >> > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned >> > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch >> > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a >> > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy >> > right now. >> > >> > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's >> > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is >> > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I >> > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. >> > >> > Adam Wolf >> > Wayne and Layne >> > >> >> Adam, any progress on the scripting ppa? I would love to test out the >> scripting stuff, but I have been using your PPA instead of trying to >> set up a local build instead. >> -- >> Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) >> > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > -- Miguel Angel Ajo Pelayo http://www.nbee.es +34 636 52 25 69 skype: ajoajoajo ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
I have some time today to set it up. I'll be taking a look through the readmes/list to see if there's a place where it explains how to turn it on during the build shortly. Adam Wolf On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Hans Henry von Tresckow wrote: > On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Adam Wolf > wrote: > > My thought is to create an additional PPA called > > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly > > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned > > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch > > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a > > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy > > right now. > > > > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's > > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is > > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I > > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. > > > > Adam Wolf > > Wayne and Layne > > > > Adam, any progress on the scripting ppa? I would love to test out the > scripting stuff, but I have been using your PPA instead of trying to > set up a local build instead. > -- > Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) > ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Adam Wolf wrote: > My thought is to create an additional PPA called > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy > right now. > > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. > > Adam Wolf > Wayne and Layne > Adam, any progress on the scripting ppa? I would love to test out the scripting stuff, but I have been using your PPA instead of trying to set up a local build instead. -- Henry von Tresckow (hvontres) ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
It takes up to 24 hours to affect the PPA. Every day, it checks if there were changes in the last 24 hours, and if so, builds. Adam Wolf On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 12:56 PM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: >> Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the new >> nanometer units? > > > After a period of no objections, I set CMakeList.txt to use nanometers as the > default build mode. > > It is my understanding that this will affect KicadWinbuilder and Adam's PPA > as well as anyone else who does not explicitly override this setting. > > FYI, > > Dick > > > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
> Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the new > nanometer units? After a period of no objections, I set CMakeList.txt to use nanometers as the default build mode. It is my understanding that this will affect KicadWinbuilder and Adam's PPA as well as anyone else who does not explicitly override this setting. FYI, Dick ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 11 October 2012 11:47, Lorenzo Marcantonio wrote: > On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 11:27:10AM +0100, Brian Sidebotham wrote: >> Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the >> new nanometer units? > > IMHO the nano build is (mostly) production quality. There was some issue > with module import/export but IIRC these were fixed. > > Already did 3 board with it, no new problem found (i.e. nothing that wasn't > in the decimil buildXD) > > That's for the Linux build but I don't see what could be different (last > famous words...) > > -- > Lorenzo Marcantonio > Logos Srl It's great to hear that it's been used in real boards and hasn't seemingly had any major issues! Thanks for the info. :-) Best Regards, Brian. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
11.10.2012 18:31, Dick Hollenbeck kirjoitti: (My only suspicion is with respect to grabbing zone borders with the mouse pointer. I have felt for some time that the hit testing there should use pixels to measure acceptable distance, not IU which are subject to variances on zoom factor. There is a general bunch of hit testing problems all around, including Eeschema. Maybe also "copy block" breaking has something to do with it. I've been using nm build so long that I didn't even think the problem may come from it. There just have been a bit more serious work going on lately and the problems surfaced. Switching for the nm build would make sense. It says "testing" on the wrapping anyway... -Vesa ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 10/11/2012 4:28 PM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: Let this serve as a round of applause to Brian, who acted on a suggestion from me and made something truly wonderfully useful for scores of people out of it. This has become truly a competitive advantage to KiCad relative to alternatives. Sort of like the first electric starter in automobiles. Those guys having to get out of the cars to hand crank them gave notice. (No, I am not really that old, but I watch black and white movies sometimes.) Fantastic job Brian! fantastic_job_brian++ I agree. Brian has made building and installing KiCad on Windows very easy and that is something to be applauded. Wayne ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
Let this serve as a round of applause to Brian, who acted on a suggestion from me and made something truly wonderfully useful for scores of people out of it. This has become truly a competitive advantage to KiCad relative to alternatives. Sort of like the first electric starter in automobiles. Those guys having to get out of the cars to hand crank them gave notice. (No, I am not really that old, but I watch black and white movies sometimes.) Fantastic job Brian! ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 10/11/2012 03:14 PM, Adam Wolf wrote: > My thought is to create an additional PPA called > kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly > the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned > on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch > PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a > warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy > right now. > > Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's > holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is > something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I > take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. > > Adam Wolf > Wayne and Layne If the packages are named differently, then presumably they can both be installed, but only if they can co-exist. Maybe some thought should be given to tinkering with the directories such that they can both be installed at the same time? What about making library directories common Some thought is needed, and mine is done for the day. In general though, this is an exciting proposition, and I thank you for your work Adam. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
My thought is to create an additional PPA called kicad-daily-testing-with-scripting or something, which will be exactly the same as kicad-daily-testing, only with the scripting stuff turned on. Anyone on the current kicad-daily-testing PPA will have to switch PPAs to get the scripting-enabled packages, and I can include a warning on the PPA web page saying that that scripting can be crashy right now. Honestly, I use my own PPA, and not having a scripting PPA is what's holding me back from playing with the scripting stuff! If this is something you folks think is a good idea, I'll publicize it after I take the few minutes to set it up and test a build. Adam Wolf Wayne and Layne On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 3:06 PM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: > On 10/11/2012 03:00 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote: >> On 10/11/2012 3:39 PM, Adam Wolf wrote: >>> I'll set my PPA to whatever is decided. I am also considering making >>> a "scripting PPA" with the scripting support turned on--if it's still >>> something that has to be turned on. >> Scripting support is disabled by default. I haven't had a chance to use >> it yet but it seems like there are quite a few folks out there who are >> using it. Maybe some of them will weigh in as to whether or not >> scripting is ready for initial user testing. I am reluctant to turn on >> scripting as the default because building it on Windows it is much more >> involved than Linux. I don't know if Brian has the windows builder up >> to date to support scripting on Windows yet or not. If he does, then it >> may be something worth considering. > > > There is it again, Linux shining as a superior build environment. > > > We encounter it all the time, but this time I just felt like saying it, > rather than just > driving by it like you drive by a beautiful park. > > > ++linux_is_a_superior_build_environment_than_windows > > > > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 10/11/2012 03:00 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote: > On 10/11/2012 3:39 PM, Adam Wolf wrote: >> I'll set my PPA to whatever is decided. I am also considering making >> a "scripting PPA" with the scripting support turned on--if it's still >> something that has to be turned on. > Scripting support is disabled by default. I haven't had a chance to use > it yet but it seems like there are quite a few folks out there who are > using it. Maybe some of them will weigh in as to whether or not > scripting is ready for initial user testing. I am reluctant to turn on > scripting as the default because building it on Windows it is much more > involved than Linux. I don't know if Brian has the windows builder up > to date to support scripting on Windows yet or not. If he does, then it > may be something worth considering. There is it again, Linux shining as a superior build environment. We encounter it all the time, but this time I just felt like saying it, rather than just driving by it like you drive by a beautiful park. ++linux_is_a_superior_build_environment_than_windows ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 04:00:29PM -0400, Wayne Stambaugh wrote: > Scripting support is disabled by default. I haven't had a chance to > use it yet but it seems like there are quite a few folks out there > who are using it. Maybe some of them will weigh in as to whether or > not scripting is ready for initial user testing. I am reluctant to Scripting has the potential of crashing pcbnew (until everything is delegated with checks - i.e. probably not in the near future), but it's substantially working (also the batch plot feature is actually done with it). Anyway it's pretty invisible if you don't actively use it; I don't think that only compiling scripting it would break something. -- Lorenzo Marcantonio Logos Srl ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 10/11/2012 3:39 PM, Adam Wolf wrote: I'll set my PPA to whatever is decided. I am also considering making a "scripting PPA" with the scripting support turned on--if it's still something that has to be turned on. Scripting support is disabled by default. I haven't had a chance to use it yet but it seems like there are quite a few folks out there who are using it. Maybe some of them will weigh in as to whether or not scripting is ready for initial user testing. I am reluctant to turn on scripting as the default because building it on Windows it is much more involved than Linux. I don't know if Brian has the windows builder up to date to support scripting on Windows yet or not. If he does, then it may be something worth considering. Adam Wolf Wayne and Layne, LLC On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 2:30 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote: On 10/11/2012 11:31 AM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: On 10/11/2012 05:27 AM, Brian Sidebotham wrote: Hi Guys, Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the new nanometer units? It should get more people testing the nanometer support and provide some feedback. I think quite a few people use Winbuilder to get access to the latest versions, but don't change anything in the setup. This way it will gradually get you some more nanometer beta testers and feedback. Let me know as I will only take a few minutes to change. Best Regards, Brian. I am using the nanometer build without issue. (My only suspicion is with respect to grabbing zone borders with the mouse pointer. I have felt for some time that the hit testing there should use pixels to measure acceptable distance, not IU which are subject to variances on zoom factor. Pixels are not subject to zoom factor. Its in the TODO.txt file. It is painfully hard to select a zone boarder reliably in the nanometer build.) I like the idea of forcing folks to smoke out problems. Because it has to happen sometime. There are no beta testers on some kind of payroll. Pcbnew files (even legacy format files) created from that point forward are not compatible with the deci-mils build. So it is a bridge which is difficult to traverse backwards across. I've found that the Eagle plugin needs the nanometer build to avoid rounding errors, because coming from metric to deci-mils is and has been a problem regardless of plugin. This was the whole impetus to move to nanometers as a means of avoiding rounding errors even within legacy files in the first place. The fork in the road looks like this: a) change now, generate a bunch of new mm based footprint libraries and mm based legacy board files, which are not compatible with deci-mil builds. b) wait until the *.kicad_pcb files and s-expression footprints are fully supported, those will only ever be in mm, meaning this is mandatorily the nanometer build. Legacy files generated from this build are also not compatible with deci-meter builds. a) and b) both have the same disadvantage. I have personally chosen to go the a) route, because I can get more accurate footprints and boards in play now. I never have to use an older version of the software anyway. I cannot speak for other users, only for myself, and for the benefits to the project. Mostly we might be speaking about new users being affected by your change to your script. For them I might be inclined to lean towards a) also. If there was a pause point in the script's execution, or a way you can explain how to change from the default of nanometers to rebuild, that might be enough to make everyone minimally grumpy. On balance, I find your suggestion more positive than negative. I think it's a pretty good idea. You might want to see what the Ubuntu PPA folks are using just so we're all on the same page. There may be a few corner cases like print and plot scaling where things are not quite 100%. It also might be a good idea to get the nanometre stuff fixed before we unleash the new board and footprint library file formats. I'm sure there will be some grumbling because board file unit changes will create a large diff when they didn't make any changes to the board but that is to be expected. No good deed goes unpunished. Wayne ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 10/11/2012 3:38 PM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: I think it's a pretty good idea. You might want to see what the Ubuntu PPA folks are using just so we're all on the same page. Thats a good point. But I would guess they are using our defaults in the CMakeList.txt file for this decision. If its good enough for Windows, it should be good enough for the default build. I'd say we should toggle the default in CMakeList.txt any time now. This would basically mean that Brian has nothing to do then. Sounds good to me if no one else has any objections. There may be a few corner cases like print and plot scaling where things are not quite 100%. It also might be a good idea to get the nanometre stuff fixed before we unleash the new board and footprint library file formats. I'm sure there will be some grumbling because board file unit changes will create a large diff when they didn't make any changes to the board but that is to be expected. No good deed goes unpunished. Wayne ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
I'll set my PPA to whatever is decided. I am also considering making a "scripting PPA" with the scripting support turned on--if it's still something that has to be turned on. Adam Wolf Wayne and Layne, LLC On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 2:30 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote: > On 10/11/2012 11:31 AM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: >> >> On 10/11/2012 05:27 AM, Brian Sidebotham wrote: >>> >>> Hi Guys, >>> >>> Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the >>> new nanometer units? >>> >>> It should get more people testing the nanometer support and provide >>> some feedback. I think quite a few people use Winbuilder to get access >>> to the latest versions, but don't change anything in the setup. This >>> way it will gradually get you some more nanometer beta testers and >>> feedback. >>> >>> Let me know as I will only take a few minutes to change. >>> >>> Best Regards, Brian. >> >> >> I am using the nanometer build without issue. >> >> (My only suspicion is with respect to grabbing zone borders with the mouse >> pointer. I >> have felt for some time that the hit testing there should use pixels to >> measure acceptable >> distance, not IU which are subject to variances on zoom factor. Pixels >> are not subject to >> zoom factor. Its in the TODO.txt file. It is painfully hard to select a >> zone boarder >> reliably in the nanometer build.) >> >> >> I like the idea of forcing folks to smoke out problems. Because it has to >> happen >> sometime. There are no beta testers on some kind of payroll. >> >> >> Pcbnew files (even legacy format files) created from that point forward >> are not compatible >> with the deci-mils build. So it is a bridge which is difficult to >> traverse backwards across. >> >> >> I've found that the Eagle plugin needs the nanometer build to avoid >> rounding errors, >> because coming from metric to deci-mils is and has been a problem >> regardless of plugin. >> This was the whole impetus to move to nanometers as a means of avoiding >> rounding errors >> even within legacy files in the first place. >> >> The fork in the road looks like this: >> >> a) change now, generate a bunch of new mm based footprint libraries and mm >> based legacy >> board files, which are not compatible with deci-mil builds. >> >> >> b) wait until the *.kicad_pcb files and s-expression footprints are fully >> supported, those >> will only ever be in mm, meaning this is mandatorily the nanometer build. >> Legacy files >> generated from this build are also not compatible with deci-meter builds. >> >> >> a) and b) both have the same disadvantage. >> >> >> I have personally chosen to go the a) route, because I can get more >> accurate footprints >> and boards in play now. I never have to use an older version of the >> software anyway. >> >> >> I cannot speak for other users, only for myself, and for the benefits to >> the project. >> >> Mostly we might be speaking about new users being affected by your change >> to your script. >> For them I might be inclined to lean towards a) also. >> >> >> If there was a pause point in the script's execution, or a way you can >> explain how to >> change from the default of nanometers to rebuild, that might be enough to >> make everyone >> minimally grumpy. >> >> >> On balance, I find your suggestion more positive than negative. >> > > I think it's a pretty good idea. You might want to see what the Ubuntu PPA > folks are using just so we're all on the same page. There may be a few > corner cases like print and plot scaling where things are not quite 100%. > It also might be a good idea to get the nanometre stuff fixed before we > unleash the new board and footprint library file formats. I'm sure there > will be some grumbling because board file unit changes will create a large > diff when they didn't make any changes to the board but that is to be > expected. No good deed goes unpunished. > > Wayne > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
> I think it's a pretty good idea. You might want to see what the Ubuntu > PPA folks are using just so we're all on the same page. Thats a good point. But I would guess they are using our defaults in the CMakeList.txt file for this decision. If its good enough for Windows, it should be good enough for the default build. I'd say we should toggle the default in CMakeList.txt any time now. This would basically mean that Brian has nothing to do then. > There may be a > few corner cases like print and plot scaling where things are not quite > 100%. It also might be a good idea to get the nanometre stuff fixed > before we unleash the new board and footprint library file formats. I'm > sure there will be some grumbling because board file unit changes will > create a large diff when they didn't make any changes to the board but > that is to be expected. No good deed goes unpunished. > > Wayne > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 10/11/2012 11:31 AM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote: On 10/11/2012 05:27 AM, Brian Sidebotham wrote: Hi Guys, Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the new nanometer units? It should get more people testing the nanometer support and provide some feedback. I think quite a few people use Winbuilder to get access to the latest versions, but don't change anything in the setup. This way it will gradually get you some more nanometer beta testers and feedback. Let me know as I will only take a few minutes to change. Best Regards, Brian. I am using the nanometer build without issue. (My only suspicion is with respect to grabbing zone borders with the mouse pointer. I have felt for some time that the hit testing there should use pixels to measure acceptable distance, not IU which are subject to variances on zoom factor. Pixels are not subject to zoom factor. Its in the TODO.txt file. It is painfully hard to select a zone boarder reliably in the nanometer build.) I like the idea of forcing folks to smoke out problems. Because it has to happen sometime. There are no beta testers on some kind of payroll. Pcbnew files (even legacy format files) created from that point forward are not compatible with the deci-mils build. So it is a bridge which is difficult to traverse backwards across. I've found that the Eagle plugin needs the nanometer build to avoid rounding errors, because coming from metric to deci-mils is and has been a problem regardless of plugin. This was the whole impetus to move to nanometers as a means of avoiding rounding errors even within legacy files in the first place. The fork in the road looks like this: a) change now, generate a bunch of new mm based footprint libraries and mm based legacy board files, which are not compatible with deci-mil builds. b) wait until the *.kicad_pcb files and s-expression footprints are fully supported, those will only ever be in mm, meaning this is mandatorily the nanometer build. Legacy files generated from this build are also not compatible with deci-meter builds. a) and b) both have the same disadvantage. I have personally chosen to go the a) route, because I can get more accurate footprints and boards in play now. I never have to use an older version of the software anyway. I cannot speak for other users, only for myself, and for the benefits to the project. Mostly we might be speaking about new users being affected by your change to your script. For them I might be inclined to lean towards a) also. If there was a pause point in the script's execution, or a way you can explain how to change from the default of nanometers to rebuild, that might be enough to make everyone minimally grumpy. On balance, I find your suggestion more positive than negative. I think it's a pretty good idea. You might want to see what the Ubuntu PPA folks are using just so we're all on the same page. There may be a few corner cases like print and plot scaling where things are not quite 100%. It also might be a good idea to get the nanometre stuff fixed before we unleash the new board and footprint library file formats. I'm sure there will be some grumbling because board file unit changes will create a large diff when they didn't make any changes to the board but that is to be expected. No good deed goes unpunished. Wayne ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On 10/11/2012 05:27 AM, Brian Sidebotham wrote: > Hi Guys, > > Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the > new nanometer units? > > It should get more people testing the nanometer support and provide > some feedback. I think quite a few people use Winbuilder to get access > to the latest versions, but don't change anything in the setup. This > way it will gradually get you some more nanometer beta testers and > feedback. > > Let me know as I will only take a few minutes to change. > > Best Regards, Brian. I am using the nanometer build without issue. (My only suspicion is with respect to grabbing zone borders with the mouse pointer. I have felt for some time that the hit testing there should use pixels to measure acceptable distance, not IU which are subject to variances on zoom factor. Pixels are not subject to zoom factor. Its in the TODO.txt file. It is painfully hard to select a zone boarder reliably in the nanometer build.) I like the idea of forcing folks to smoke out problems. Because it has to happen sometime. There are no beta testers on some kind of payroll. Pcbnew files (even legacy format files) created from that point forward are not compatible with the deci-mils build. So it is a bridge which is difficult to traverse backwards across. I've found that the Eagle plugin needs the nanometer build to avoid rounding errors, because coming from metric to deci-mils is and has been a problem regardless of plugin. This was the whole impetus to move to nanometers as a means of avoiding rounding errors even within legacy files in the first place. The fork in the road looks like this: a) change now, generate a bunch of new mm based footprint libraries and mm based legacy board files, which are not compatible with deci-mil builds. b) wait until the *.kicad_pcb files and s-expression footprints are fully supported, those will only ever be in mm, meaning this is mandatorily the nanometer build. Legacy files generated from this build are also not compatible with deci-meter builds. a) and b) both have the same disadvantage. I have personally chosen to go the a) route, because I can get more accurate footprints and boards in play now. I never have to use an older version of the software anyway. I cannot speak for other users, only for myself, and for the benefits to the project. Mostly we might be speaking about new users being affected by your change to your script. For them I might be inclined to lean towards a) also. If there was a pause point in the script's execution, or a way you can explain how to change from the default of nanometers to rebuild, that might be enough to make everyone minimally grumpy. On balance, I find your suggestion more positive than negative. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Kicad-developers] Winbuilder Nanometer support
On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 11:27:10AM +0100, Brian Sidebotham wrote: > Would it be beneficial if I changed KicadWinbuilder to build with the > new nanometer units? IMHO the nano build is (mostly) production quality. There was some issue with module import/export but IIRC these were fixed. Already did 3 board with it, no new problem found (i.e. nothing that wasn't in the decimil buildXD) That's for the Linux build but I don't see what could be different (last famous words...) -- Lorenzo Marcantonio Logos Srl smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
