Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Gerhard Weydt]

Hi László,

I forgot to remark that there are differences regarding point 2, in 
french/belgian/swiss usage for 70, 80, 90 and associated numbers, which 
are already covered in numbertext.github.io.


Am 04.05.2018 um 00:40 schrieb Gerhard Weydt:

Hi László,

not an easy task you have set out to accomplish! I think you will have 
to hope that more than one person per language will answer, because it 
will be easy to overlook some specialty, as a native speaker uses 
these terms without much thinking about.


Here are my answers for German, I hope they are complete as regards 
German for Germany, but I don't swear to it:


Am 03.05.2018 um 18:57 schrieb Németh László:

Hi,

LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
German examples):

  https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 

My questions to the native language speakers:

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?
For German one can only see cardinal numbers which are OK, including 
the reverse order for the last two digits (e.g. 43 = forty-three = 
dreiundvierzig).

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials
Ordinal numbers seem also to be OK (gender problem see below); ordinal 
indicator is simply a point/dot, as supplied in that site, so that's 
easy.

2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.
As regards this example, you may indeed say "einhundertundeins" or 
"einhunderteins" or even "hunderteins" and also "hundertundeins", 
which all will be regarded as correct, but the version 
"einhunderteins", which is also proposed by numbertext.github.io, is 
in my opinion the most common and sufficient for all German-speaking 
communities.
But there is one difference between german (and austrian and probably 
luxembourgian) and swiss usage (and I don't know which is followed by 
Liechtenstein): The Swiss don't use ß, but ss, so thirty = dreißig 
(Germany...), but dreissig (Switzerland). This is, for numbers, the 
only difference I know of; numbertext.github.io reflects this correctly.
3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. 
languages

to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal 
usage

in English outline numbering)
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in 
English, but

default numbering styles cover this, too)
No, it's not sufficient, if you intend to support the second style. 
For the first style cardinal numbers are used, so there's no problem. 
But for the ordinal numbers needed for the second style you have to 
respect the three genders:

In the sequence of your example:
Erstes Buch/Erster Teil/Erstes Kapitel/Erster Abschnitt/Erste 
Seite/Erster Absatz

or with gender:
neutral Buch/male Teil/neutral Kapitel/male Abschnitt/female 
Seite/male Absatz
Luckily, these suffixes ("s" for neutral, "r" for male, none for 
female, in addition to the form supplied by numbertext.github.io) are 
regular; and for the form "the first..." (don't know the grammatical 
term in English), if you should also cover it, there is only the 
female form which you already find in numbertext.github.io.
This, though, rises the question how to specify which gender should be 
used in a certain context.
Personally I would not object if you do not implement the second 
style, as it sounds antiquated, although it was certainly used. Even 
the first style (using text for a number) I would regard as 
uncommon/rare.
Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency 
and date

formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the 
NUMBERTEXT

Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
service).

Cardinal Number as seen above is OK for currency.
For date there are/may be differences, I know of one: Austrians use 
"Jänner" instead of "Januar" for january normally, also on TV, for 
example, but I cannot say if using "Januar" as in Germany would be OK 
for Austria as well.

Best regards,
László

P.S: A recent question (comes from Rene Engelhard) for Hebrew 
contributors:


Is the Hebrew correct in the next line of resource file of the 
Numbertext

Calc extension:

NUMBERTEXT() וMONEYTEXT() פונקציות גליון Calc


Gerhard



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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Gerhard Weydt]

Hi László,

not an easy task you have set out to accomplish! I think you will have 
to hope that more than one person per language will answer, because it 
will be easy to overlook some specialty, as a native speaker uses these 
terms without much thinking about.


Here are my answers for German, I hope they are complete as regards 
German for Germany, but I don't swear to it:


Am 03.05.2018 um 18:57 schrieb Németh László:

Hi,

LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
German examples):

  https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 

My questions to the native language speakers:

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?
For German one can only see cardinal numbers which are OK, including the 
reverse order for the last two digits (e.g. 43 = forty-three = 
dreiundvierzig).

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials
Ordinal numbers seem also to be OK (gender problem see below); ordinal 
indicator is simply a point/dot, as supplied in that site, so that's easy.

2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.
As regards this example, you may indeed say "einhundertundeins" or 
"einhunderteins" or even "hunderteins" and also "hundertundeins", which 
all will be regarded as correct, but the version "einhunderteins", which 
is also proposed by numbertext.github.io, is in my opinion the most 
common and sufficient for all German-speaking communities.
But there is one difference between german (and austrian and probably 
luxembourgian) and swiss usage (and I don't know which is followed by 
Liechtenstein): The Swiss don't use ß, but ss, so thirty = dreißig 
(Germany...), but dreissig (Switzerland). This is, for numbers, the only 
difference I know of; numbertext.github.io reflects this correctly.

3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
in English outline numbering)
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in English, but
default numbering styles cover this, too)
No, it's not sufficient, if you intend to support the second style. For 
the first style cardinal numbers are used, so there's no problem. But 
for the ordinal numbers needed for the second style you have to respect 
the three genders:

In the sequence of your example:
Erstes Buch/Erster Teil/Erstes Kapitel/Erster Abschnitt/Erste 
Seite/Erster Absatz

or with gender:
neutral Buch/male Teil/neutral Kapitel/male Abschnitt/female Seite/male 
Absatz
Luckily, these suffixes ("s" for neutral, "r" for male, none for female, 
in addition to the form supplied by numbertext.github.io) are regular; 
and for the form "the first..." (don't know the grammatical term in 
English), if you should also cover it, there is only the female form 
which you already find in numbertext.github.io.
This, though, rises the question how to specify which gender should be 
used in a certain context.
Personally I would not object if you do not implement the second style, 
as it sounds antiquated, although it was certainly used. Even the first 
style (using text for a number) I would regard as uncommon/rare.

Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency and date
formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the NUMBERTEXT
Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
service).

Cardinal Number as seen above is OK for currency.
For date there are/may be differences, I know of one: Austrians use 
"Jänner" instead of "Januar" for january normally, also on TV, for 
example, but I cannot say if using "Januar" as in Germany would be OK 
for Austria as well.

Best regards,
László

P.S: A recent question (comes from Rene Engelhard) for Hebrew contributors:

Is the Hebrew correct in the next line of resource file of the Numbertext
Calc extension:

NUMBERTEXT() וMONEYTEXT() פונקציות גליון Calc


Gerhard

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[libreoffice-l10n] Re: Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Michael Bauer]

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials

2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.
In Gaelic, there are "ands" all over the place in counting, so 101 would 
have to be

Ceud 's a h-aon
hundred and a-one (more on that a-one further down)


3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

It's not really permissible to do First, Second, Third without stating 
the object (even usage like "first we need to do this, second comes 
that" does not exist in Gaelic).

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
in English outline numbering)
The number system in Gaelic (and Irish) has a special number set 1-10 (I 
think Irish may go higher) if you're just counting One, Two, Three 
without stating the object i.e. counting pages is

aon duilleag, dà dhuilleag, trì duilleagan
but counting one two three without an object is
a h-aon, a dhà, a trì
sort of "a-one, a-two, a-three" until you reach ten, then it's just
aon deug, dà dheug, trì deug ...
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in 
English, but

default numbering styles cover this, too)
Here Scottish Gaelic and Irish will have the added complication that 
depending on the initial sound of the noun, the noun changes i.e. part = 
pàirt but

a' chiad phàirt (first part)
an dàrna pàirt (second part)
but with a dental
a' chiad duilleag (first page)
an dàrna duilleag (second page)

Irish in addition has a change with vowel initials e.g.
an chéad alt (first article)
an dara halt (second article)

So if these are presented for localization, they must come with the noun 
in question, otherwise the output will be ungrammatical. Unless a rule 
can be written for such locales.


Michael

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Olivier Hallot]

Hi László

Em 03/05/2018 13:57, Németh László escreveu:
> Hi,
> 
> LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
> Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
> as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
> German examples):
> 
>  https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 
> 
> My questions to the native language speakers:
> 
> 1. Are these numbers correct in your language?
> 
> You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
> index.html#testimonials
> 

For pt and pt-BR

Cardinal numbers: OK

Ordinal numbers: Depends on gender of the noun.
e.g. 1234 can be
"milésima duocentésima trigésima quarta" if the noun gender is feminine
"milésimo duocentésimo trigésimo quarto" if the noun gender is masculine

Ordinal indicator: Same as above
e.g.
"Parágrafo 1.º"
"Cláusula 2.ª"
(pt-BR keyboard has native support for º and ª)

Default currency: for both pt (EUR) and pt-BR (BRL) the currency gender
is masculine.

> 2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
> usage of your country/language variant?
> 
> For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
> English differ with the “and”
> 
> 101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
> 101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.
> 

not for pt or pt-BR

> 3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
> to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?
> 
> Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
> in English outline numbering)
> First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in English, but
> default numbering styles cover this, too)
> 

For pt & pt-BR, cardinal numbers have no gender.
"Página um"
"Página dois"
"Capítulo cinco"

> Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency and date
> formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
> languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the NUMBERTEXT
> Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
> com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
> service).
> 
> Best regards,
> László
> 
> P.S: A recent question (comes from Rene Engelhard) for Hebrew contributors:
> 
> Is the Hebrew correct in the next line of resource file of the Numbertext
> Calc extension:
> 
> NUMBERTEXT() וMONEYTEXT() פונקציות גליון Calc
> 

-- 
Olivier Hallot
LibreOffice Documentation Coordinator
Comunidade LibreOffice
Rio de Janeiro - Brasil - Local Time: UTC-03:00
http://tdf.io/joinus

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Stanislav Horáček]

Hi,

great initiative, thanks!


Dne 3.5.2018 v 18:57 Németh László napsal(a):

Hi,

LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
German examples):

  https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 

My questions to the native language speakers:

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials


Not correct for Czech: all words should be modified for ordinal numbers 
while it is the case for the last one only; there are also incorrect 
details in another categories.




2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.

3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
in English outline numbering)
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in English, but
default numbering styles cover this, too)


I assume that support for all genders is needed, in Czech both masculine 
and feminine are commonly used for the outline numbering.


Best regards,
Stanislav




Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency and date
formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the NUMBERTEXT
Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
service).

Best regards,
László

P.S: A recent question (comes from Rene Engelhard) for Hebrew contributors:

Is the Hebrew correct in the next line of resource file of the Numbertext
Calc extension:

NUMBERTEXT() וMONEYTEXT() פונקציות גליון Calc



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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Sveinn í Felli]

Þann fim  3.maí 2018 16:57, skrifaði Németh László:

Hi,

LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
German examples):

  https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 

My questions to the native language speakers:

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials


My language (Icelandic) is not there, but I don't see any trouble except 
for 1st, 2nd... which we treat as numbers (1., 2., ...) and then there's 
a big gender issue*.



2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.


In Icelandic there has to be an 'and': 'eitt hundrað og einn'



3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
in English outline numbering)
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in English, but
default numbering styles cover this, too)


Numbers/adjectives take on gender in Icelandic; Book/Page/Paragraph 
would be feminine, Chapter/Part/Section are masculine, and in formal 
speech without referencing which kind of item we would use neutral form.

Also this is a stylistic minefield...

Best regards,
Sveinn í Felli


Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency and date
formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the NUMBERTEXT
Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
service).

Best regards,
László

P.S: A recent question (comes from Rene Engelhard) for Hebrew contributors:

Is the Hebrew correct in the next line of resource file of the Numbertext
Calc extension:

NUMBERTEXT() וMONEYTEXT() פונקציות גליון Calc




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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Krunose]

On 03.05.2018 18:57, Németh László wrote:

Hi,

LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
German examples):

  https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 

My questions to the native language speakers:

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials

2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.

3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
in English outline numbering)
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in English, but
default numbering styles cover this, too)

Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency and date
formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the NUMBERTEXT
Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
service).

Best regards,
László

P.S: A recent question (comes from Rene Engelhard) for Hebrew contributors:

Is the Hebrew correct in the next line of resource file of the Numbertext
Calc extension:

NUMBERTEXT() וMONEYTEXT() פונקציות גליון Calc


I'm thinking about this for last two days and have some concerns. 
Chapters are spelled out like First, Second and so on, but Croatian has 
three genders and masculinum should be used in Calc when turning 
spelling out numbers, but in Writer - for chapter numbers - neutrum 
makes more sense but I doubt default format support both.


Current version of Croatian Numbertext is at

    https://github.com/krunose/hr-numbertext

and any advice would be much appreciated. Didn't include this to 
Numbertext.org as decimal number should be done first, but I guess this 
whole spell out thing might speed things up...


Thanks,
Kruno

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Rimas Kudelis]

hi,


2018.05.03 19:57, Németh László rašė:

Hi,

LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
German examples):

  https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 

My questions to the native language speakers:

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials


Lithuanian seems quite OK.


2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.


Not sure which format is the default.


3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
in English outline numbering)
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in English, but
default numbering styles cover this, too)

Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency and date
formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the NUMBERTEXT
Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
service).


Not sure if these questions only apply to Spanish or not. I would 
certainly think it's best to support all possible genders.


Also, I noticed that two ways of spelling out are currently not 
supported for Lithuanian (Year and Formal number, whatever that is).


Also, the default currency is incorrect for Lituania. We switched to 
Euro a few years ago, but the library default is still LTL. This should 
definitely be changed, unless it's not that library, but some other...


Cheers,
Rimas

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[libreoffice-l10n] Fixing new spell out numbering styles in LibreOffice 6.1

[Németh László]

Hi,

LibreOffice 6.1 will support “spell out” numbering styles of OOXML (One,
Two...; First, Second..., 1st, 2nd...),
as you can see in the following screen cast (only English, French and
German examples):

 https://youtu.be/c0j4Sjie8t4 

My questions to the native language speakers:

1. Are these numbers correct in your language?

You can check here, too: https://numbertext.github.io/
index.html#testimonials

2. Do we need to change the default format etc. according to the normal
usage of your country/language variant?

For example, in the recent implementation, British English and American
English differ with the “and”

101 -> “One hundred and one”: en-AU, en-GB, en-IE, en-NZ
101 -> “One hundred one”: en-US etc.

3. Is it enough to support only a single gender in Spanish etc. languages
to cover common outline and page number usage in publishing?

Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph One, or simply One (normal usage
in English outline numbering)
First Book/Part/Chapter/Section/Page/Paragraph (less common in English, but
default numbering styles cover this, too)

Note: there is a plan to use similar spell out formats in currency and date
formats of Writer, typical in contracts and invoices in several
languages. These formats are only supported in Calc yet by the NUMBERTEXT
Calc extension (or also in Writer macros via the new
com.sun.star.linguistic2.NumberText
service).

Best regards,
László

P.S: A recent question (comes from Rene Engelhard) for Hebrew contributors:

Is the Hebrew correct in the next line of resource file of the Numbertext
Calc extension:

NUMBERTEXT() וMONEYTEXT() פונקציות גליון Calc

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[libreoffice-l10n] Spellchecking language names showing up as ISO code

[Michael Bauer]

I'm helping out with two new spell checkers and we're almost there, but 
there's one thing I can't figure. The .oxt installs and I can select the 
language and the spellchecker words as expected. But when I select the 
language for the paragraph, the show up as the respective ISO codes ktz 
(expecting Juǀ’hoan) and nhr (expecting Naro). Does LO pull the language 
names from the spellchecker files or is there something I'm missing?


Michael

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[libreoffice-l10n] Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Multimedia in Help pages

[Sophie]

Hi Olivier,

Thanks for bringing the discussion on the l10n process here.

My comments:
Le 03/05/2018 à 17:51, Olivier Hallot a écrit :

[...]

> Further information on New Help
> ---
>• New help is now build-able and package-able
>  (thanks to Stephan Bergman and David Tardon)
>• New Help build distinct when ONLINE or OFFLINE
>   ◦ Offline is package-able.
>• OFFLINE help already has no multimedia ( tag is not
> rendered)

This is good to know, as it was not stated like that before and solve
several issues at once :)

>• ONLINE help has multimedia (master).
>  ◦ https://help.libreoffice.org/6.1/en-US/text/scalc/main.html
> 
> Options:
> 
>1. Remove all multimedia from Help either online and offline:
>   1. Problem vanish.
-1

>2. Remove all multimedia from offline Help.
>   => Done already

+1
>3. Implement language based multimedia enabler in XSLT / makefile
>   1. --without-help-multimedia=fr
>   2. if $lang = “fr” then multimedia > /dev/null

-1
>4. Have multimedia enabled and localize 
>   1. Change href= to localized contents
>   2. set width=”0” and height=”0” if no localized contents.

-1
> 
>  + was this built in discussion with l10n team ? (Michael)
>  + not presented the options to them (Olivier)
> + would like to have ESC input
> 
>  + l10n team are waiting for his proposals (Sophie)
>  + can we add – when video scripts are made available.
>  + where are these published before embedding ?
>  + expect each community to decide if they want it ? (Olivier)

I comment this at the end of this mail
> 
>  + a 5th option ? Different flavours of help  with & without ? (Heiko)
>  + off-line help has no MM enabled already (Olivier)
> + the on-line site can have this.
-1
> 
> => discuss this with the l10n teams for a decision.
> 
> -8<
> 
> What is left to work on is (not exhaustive)
> 
> + Local teams to inform what option(s) fits best its community needs

My proposal for l10n is: better to try to reach a consensus on the
process instead having a case by case decision if this is possible.

> 
> + Establish rules and guidelines for multimedia contents production to
> address
> + Quality
> + Accuracy
> + Security
> + Privacy
> + Cultural localization
> + LibreOffice Branding and reputation
> + Licensing
> + Maintainability
> + Other relevant issues
> 
> + Create an Editorial board to enforce the rules and guidelines above.

this is on the documentation team side.

What I would like to discuss here also is,

* once you (or the doc team) have decided to embed a video in the source:
** where is the scenario stored to translate or catch the video
** what is the process to localize (xml or html to change) the embedded file

* similarly, once you (or the doc team) have decided to embed an ODF file:
** where do we find the file before you embed it
** what is the process to localize (xml or html to change) the embedded
file.

Could this be done before it's integrated to the source, meaning we have
a dedicated place where to look when we want to translate the content?

Thanks again
Cheers
Sophie

-- 
Sophie Gautier sophie.gaut...@documentfoundation.org
GSM: +33683901545
IRC: sophi
Release coordinator
The Document Foundation

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[libreoffice-l10n] Multimedia in Help pages

[Olivier Hallot]

After a screening from the ESC meeting today I'm bringing here the
contents of the discussion on multimedia usage in the new Help system.

-8<

+ Proposal for handling multimedia.
  =

Objective of Multimedia:
---
• Will NOT replace textual description of LO resource or feature.
• Be a rich support for textual contents
• Introduce examples, use cases or tutorials on feature / resource.
• Indirectly: motivate communities to produce contents and
contribute.

Issue:
--
• Multimedia contents is asked to be localized on release,
  for some languages.

Concerns:
-
   • Not every community has resource for localization or
 local contents production to match release deadlines.
   • Localized captions not even accepted in some languages.

Further information on New Help
---
   • New help is now build-able and package-able
 (thanks to Stephan Bergman and David Tardon)
   • New Help build distinct when ONLINE or OFFLINE
  ◦ Offline is package-able.
   • OFFLINE help already has no multimedia ( tag is not
rendered)
   • ONLINE help has multimedia (master).
 ◦ https://help.libreoffice.org/6.1/en-US/text/scalc/main.html

Options:

   1. Remove all multimedia from Help either online and offline:
  1. Problem vanish.
   2. Remove all multimedia from offline Help.
  => Done already
   3. Implement language based multimedia enabler in XSLT / makefile
  1. --without-help-multimedia=fr
  2. if $lang = “fr” then multimedia > /dev/null
   4. Have multimedia enabled and localize 
  1. Change href= to localized contents
  2. set width=”0” and height=”0” if no localized contents.

 + was this built in discussion with l10n team ? (Michael)
 + not presented the options to them (Olivier)
+ would like to have ESC input

 + l10n team are waiting for his proposals (Sophie)
 + can we add – when video scripts are made available.
 + where are these published before embedding ?
 + expect each community to decide if they want it ? (Olivier)

 + a 5th option ? Different flavours of help  with & without ? (Heiko)
 + off-line help has no MM enabled already (Olivier)
+ the on-line site can have this.

=> discuss this with the l10n teams for a decision.

-8<

What is left to work on is (not exhaustive)

+ Local teams to inform what option(s) fits best its community needs

+ Establish rules and guidelines for multimedia contents production to
address
+ Quality
+ Accuracy
+ Security
+ Privacy
+ Cultural localization
+ LibreOffice Branding and reputation
+ Licensing
+ Maintainability
+ Other relevant issues

+ Create an Editorial board to enforce the rules and guidelines above.

+ Other relevant tasks.

Please comment on the issues.

Kind regards

-- 
Olivier Hallot
LibreOffice Documentation Coordinator
Comunidade LibreOffice
Rio de Janeiro - Brasil - Local Time: UTC-03:00
http://tdf.io/joinus

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