[lace] Hand made crochet - not.
Seen in Sainsbury's yesterday. T-shirt labelled as having "hand crocheted" lace. It was chemical lace and didn't even look like crochet, but at not a lot of money what would one expect. Now, do I report them or leave people thinking they are wearing a little bit of hand made lace? Jacquie in Lincolnshire. - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
[lace] Hand made crochet - not
A neighbour called in and admired a cardigan I had over the back of the chair. She said how much she liked the lace around the bottom hem and did I make it? It was a Marks and Spencer cardigan with chemical lace motifs around the lower edge. So not only won't they know, but as Bev says people who don't do handwork at all won't care. Jean in Poole, Dorset, UK - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
[lace] Hand made crochet - not
The first comment on this was about a garment from Sainsburys, and it was wondered whether complaining to them would have any effect. On a consumer TV programme a couple of weeks ago a man had bought a frying pan from Sainsburys which was described as British made. When he got it home and looked at the label more closely, in small print was "Made in China". The programme questioned Sainsburys about the two different countries of origin and they looked into it and found that it wasn't made in China at all, but was totally British made. So would it do any good telling them that the crochet wasn't hand made? Do they even know themselves? Do they know what they're selling at all? Is ignorance an excuse? Apart from sitting down with their buyer and showing them what's wrong, you'd probably just baffle them with science. Jean in Poole, Dorset, UK - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
H maybe there *should* be lace police! If you report them, chances are nothing will happen, but on the off-chance that it *does*, then others (perhaps even those perennial ebay sellers!) may sit up and take note. Tell the authorities that you're doing it on behalf of Arachne, a world-wide group of lacemakers! Clay On 5/2/2011 10:06 AM, laceandb...@aol.com wrote: Seen in Sainsbury's yesterday. T-shirt labelled as having "hand crocheted" lace. It was chemical lace and didn't even look like crochet, but at not a lot of money what would one expect. Now, do I report them or leave people thinking they are wearing a little bit of hand made lace? Jacquie in Lincolnshire. - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003 - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
There's that., People who know hand crochet will see it as it is, people who don't do handwork at all won't care. A visitor saw some of my bobbin lace doo-dads on the table and said 'oooh so pretty! Did you knit them yourself?' An explanation would have been lost... However, if the price of the item was based on it being hand-made, and it wasn't, for sure I would make a fuss :) On 5/2/11, Clay Blackwell wrote: > H maybe there *should* be lace police! If you report them, > chances are nothing will happen, but on the off-chance that it *does*, > then others (perhaps even those perennial ebay sellers!) may sit up and > take note. > -- Bev in Shirley BC, near Sooke on beautiful Vancouver Island, west coast of Canada - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
Ahhh... the voice of reason... Thanks for the level-headed perspective, Bev! Clay On 5/2/2011 11:56 AM, bev walker wrote: /snip/ An explanation would have been lost... However, if the price of the item was based on it being hand-made, and it wasn't, for sure I would make a fuss :) - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
> However, if the price of the item was based on it being hand-made, and > it wasn't, for sure I would make a fuss :) I agree. Some people will still think it must be hand-made because the label says so, but some people will think anything. Years ago I saw a beautiful wool sweater that was labelled "Hand-Knit in Wales". Now, I've worked a knitting machine and I know the difference it makes to the way a piece of knitting feels when compared with the same yarn knit by hand. So I turned to the saleswoman and said "Hand-knit?" with raised eyebrows. She immediately pointed out that although it *was* machine-knit, it was *also* hand-knit because a human hand had worked the knitting machine. I'm still wrapping my brain around that one. The sweater was priced at the level of a beautiful piece of machine knitting, which it was, so I bought it happily. I still have it, and even though it's way out of style it's still a prized possession. I see the first Chinese knockoff of The Dress has not only been made, but been worn by a bride at her wedding. The lace on the knockoff cost $1 a yard - motifs *not* cut out, carefully placed, and finely stitched, I think. Adele North Vancouver, BC (west coast of Canada) - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
RE: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
Maybe not worth reporting to the Trades Descriptions people, but why not object in writing to Sainsburys - they will have to reply, and maybe be a bit more careful? Margery. margerybu...@o2.co.uk in North Herts, UK > -Original Message- > From: owner-l...@arachne.com [mailto:owner-l...@arachne.com] > On Behalf Of laceandb...@aol.com > Sent: Monday, May 02, 2011 3:06 PM > To: lace@arachne.com > Subject: [lace] Hand made crochet - not. > > Seen in Sainsbury's yesterday. T-shirt labelled as having > "hand crocheted" > lace. It was chemical lace and didn't even look like > crochet, but at not a > lot of money what would one expect. > > Now, do I report them or leave people thinking they are > wearing a little > bit of hand made lace? > > Jacquie in Lincolnshire. > > - > To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing > the line: > unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to > arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: > http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003 > - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
I was in a high end store where there was a very nice lacy garment. I examined it carefully and deduced that the elaborate decorative ornaments on the front were chemical lace that looked just like Irish crochet. In fact, they were very good copies. So, I was explaining this to my companion when the sales lady came over and told me the garment was hand-crocheted. We returned to the garment together and I looked at it again. I then realized that, while the spectacular ornaments were machine made, the mesh that joined them together was hand crocheted. I had not been looking at the uninteresting part of the garment, thinking, in my ignorance that if you were going to have an expensive garment you would choose to have beautiful hand-made ornaments on a machine made background, not beautiful machine made ornaments on a non-descript handmade background. It was sort of a double crochet filet that filled out the uninteresting part of the garment. I realized that I had been wrong and that the garment actually was hand crocheted, in a sense. The sales lady sniffed and said to me, "Believe me, I would know." I almost retorted, "Believe me, I would know," except it was a humiliating moment for the Lace Study Editor of the International Old Lacers. I am not sure that the sales lady actually realized that the ornaments were machine made. However, it was still a rookie mistake on my part not to look more carefully. Just goes to show you that sometimes the lace police might be guilty of false arrest. Devon In a message dated 5/2/2011 11:08:20 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, clayblackw...@comcast.net writes: H maybe there *should* be lace police! If you report them, chances are nothing will happen, but on the off-chance that it *does*, then others (perhaps even those perennial ebay sellers!) may sit up and take note. Tell the authorities that you're doing it on behalf of Arachne, a world-wide group of lacemakers! Clay - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
There was a time when knitting machines made for home use were all the rage. They're still available, but not as many people that I know seem to be interested in them, preferring their knitting the "old fashioned" way. Still, back when the machines were something of a novelty, there was a basic machine (made by "Bond" as I recall), that simply knitted. Any color work, cables, increases or decreases, etc., all had to be made by hand. So, people who made a garment on the Bond knitting machine were allowed to enter it to be judged in the same category as hand-knits. But things made on the computerized machines were not allowed in the same class for judging. Does that shed any light on the subject? You probably know more about this than I do! Clay On 5/2/2011 12:35 PM, Adele Shaak wrote: However, if the price of the item was based on it being hand-made, and it wasn't, for sure I would make a fuss :) I agree. Some people will still think it must be hand-made because the label says so, but some people will think anything. Years ago I saw a beautiful wool sweater that was labelled "Hand-Knit in Wales". Now, I've worked a knitting machine and I know the difference it makes to the way a piece of knitting feels when compared with the same yarn knit by hand. So I turned to the saleswoman and said "Hand-knit?" with raised eyebrows. She immediately pointed out that although it *was* machine-knit, it was *also* hand-knit because a human hand had worked the knitting machine. I'm still wrapping my brain around that one. - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
bev walker wrote: People who know hand crochet will see it as it is, people who don't do handwork at all won't care. I disagree. Yes, there are people who won't care, but there will also be people who will buy the garment because they believe it has handmade crochet trim. Lying to convince people they're buying something of value is fraud. Robin P. Los Angeles, California, USA robinl...@socal.rr.com - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
From: Adele Shaak <> As one lady said to me 'it's hand made because I made it' to which I replied 'but you made it on a machine'. This was about knitting. I tried to explain that she wouldn't call something made with a sewing machine hand made but she said she would. Nowt so queer as folk. Kind Regards Liz Baker thelace...@btinternet.com My chronicle of my bobbins can be found at my website: http://thelacebee.weebly.com/ - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
RE: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
Is this the difference between "hand made" and "home made", then? Margery. margerybu...@o2.co.uk in North Herts, UK > -Original Message- > From: owner-l...@arachne.com [mailto:owner-l...@arachne.com] > On Behalf Of The Lace Bee > Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2011 7:37 PM > To: Arachne list > Subject: Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not. > > From: Adele Shaak > > < machine-knit, it was > *also* hand-knit because a human hand had worked the knitting > machine. I'm > still wrapping my brain around that one. >> > > > As one lady said to me 'it's hand made because I made it' to > which I replied > 'but you made it on a machine'. This was about knitting. I > tried to explain > that she wouldn't call something made with a sewing machine > hand made but she > said she would. > > Nowt so queer as folk. > > Kind Regards > > Liz Baker - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
I'm not sure where one would draw the line--do the seams have to be handsewn? The cloth hand-woven? The thread hand-spun? The fibers hand-harvested or carded? The cotton hand-grown or the sheep hand-reared and shorn? The reason I take the question to such a silly extreme is that we can all agree that the extreme is silly, but where in-between does it stop being silly? There are lace equivalents, I think, such as Carrickmacross and Battenberg. I've had people tell me that they don't consider either "real lace", the first because it is "basically embroidery" and the second because it uses machine-made tapes. But both require handwork to achieve the results, and skilled handwork if the results are going to be pleasing, and the results are certainly lace if one uses any of several definitions--e.g., holes with threads around them, textiles with a pattern of holes in them, etc. Perhaps Carrickmacross on machine-made net is not lace but guipure Carrickmacross is? What about drawn work? Well, these statements/questions should bring some opinions out of the closet!! Nancy Connecticut, USA From: Margery Allcock To: Arachne list Sent: Tue, May 3, 2011 3:24:07 PM Subject: RE: [lace] Hand made crochet - not. > that she wouldn't call something made with a sewing machine > hand made but she > said she would. Is this the difference between "hand made" and "home made", then? Margery. margerybu...@o2.co.uk in North Herts, UK ... - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
What about if it's only "influenced by traditional Carrickmacross lace" as per the Royal School of Needlework's press release about the lace used on a certain wedding dress for which the designer "sourced a series of lace motifs"? Brenda On 3 May 2011, at 20:43, Nancy Neff wrote: > There > are lace equivalents, I think, such as Carrickmacross and Battenberg. I've > had > people tell me that they don't consider either "real lace", the first > because it > is "basically embroidery" and the second because it uses > machine-made tapes. > But both require handwork to achieve the results, and > skilled handwork if the > results are going to be pleasing, and the results are > certainly lace if one uses > any of several definitions--e.g., holes with > threads around them, textiles with > a pattern of holes in them, etc. Perhaps > Carrickmacross on machine-made net is > not lace but guipure Carrickmacross is? Brenda in Allhallows www.brendapaternoster.co.uk - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
Re: [lace] Hand made crochet - not.
Liz, The next time you have this conversation you can mention that if she were to enter a quilt that was made with a sewing machine into a show she would be expected to enter it in the machine made category. At least that is how it works for most quilt shows in the USA. Liz Redford Raleigh, NC, USA The Lace Bee wrote: > As one lady said to me 'it's hand made because I made it' to which I replied > 'but you made it on a machine'. This was about knitting. I tried to explain > that she wouldn't call something made with a sewing machine hand made but she > said she would. > > Nowt so queer as folk. > > Kind Regards > > Liz Baker - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003
