Re: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-16 Thread Brett McL Robinson
What a very interesting reply - thank you for sending it to Bob and us
all - even though off topic.

Cheers, Brett
B McL Robinson, Hamilton, New Zealand


On 17/07/2011 12:51 p.m., Jan Roberts wrote:
> A Deed Poll is a legal document - not a certificate.  It is a form of legal 
> contract but it differs from legal contracts between two or more parties in 
> that it only concerns one person (and it is only signed by that person in the 
> presence of a witness).  A Deed Poll legally binds the person who signs it to 
> a particular course of action as detailed on the Deed Poll document.
>
> Although Deed Poll documents are used for various purposes relating to an 
> individual or a company legally committing themselves to doing something, 
> they have one generally accepted meaning, that is, a change of name.  
> However, the correct legal name for a deed that has been drawn up to change 
> someone's name is a Deed of Change of Name (but more commonly known as a Deed 
> Poll).
>
> A Deed Poll for a change of name contains three declarations and by executing 
> the Deed Poll (signing, dating and having your signing witnessed) you are 
> legally committing yourself to:
>
>  Abandoning the use of your former name;
>  Using your new name only at all times;
>  Requiring all persons to address you by your new name only.
>
> Why is it called a Deed Poll?
>
> A deed is a written legal agreement that has been signed and delivered (shown 
> to all concerned parties).  Poll is an old English word used to describe a 
> legal document that had its edges cut (polled) so they were straight.  This 
> was done to visually distinguish between a deed signed by one person (a 
> polled deed - hence the term Deed Poll) and a deed signed by more than one 
> person (an indenture), which had an edge indented or serrated.  
> Interestingly, indentures were originally written twice (side by side) on one 
> piece of parchment, which was then torn down the middle and each half given 
> to each party.  The impossibility of matching the tear was a guard against 
> forgery.
>
> Deed Poll documents for a change of name can be traced back to 1851 and can 
> be seen at the National Archives, which is situated at Kew in Richmond, 
> Surrey.
>
> From: http://www.ukdps.co.uk/WhatIsADeedPoll.html
>
> This is info from a UK site, but I am in Australia where the legal system is 
> based on the British. My Google research has shown that in America it might 
> be called Master Title Deed, yet I see that Bill Clinton's father changed his 
> name by Deed Poll from Blythe to Clinton. 
> (http://www.history.malc.eu/Deed-Poll-USA.event.html)
>
> Cheers
> Jan
> -Original Message-----
> From: Bob Vary [mailto:oldcro...@optonline.net]
> Sent: Sunday, 17 July 2011 10:19
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)
>
> I may be going slightly off topic here, but what is a deed poll?  I've never 
> heard the term before.  I take it is has something to do with name changes?  
> Where are you located?  It sounds British.
>
> Bob
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jan Roberts [mailto:poo...@ozemail.com.au]
> Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 10:59 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)
>
> My late first husband changed his name by deed poll - I only ever knew him by 
> his 'new' name.  That became my surname when I married him, and is my 
> daughter's surname.  I have entered him in Legacy under his 'new' name, with 
> appropriate notes and a Deed Poll event.  But no, as far as I can see there 
> is no way to differentiate between the names in relation to time frames i.e. 
> before and after.  I look at it like entering a woman by her maiden name 
> (only sort of in reverse) - one name is used throughout the report.
>
> Cheers
> Jan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 8:01
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)
>
> Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not
> a gender changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor
> born as Mark Paul Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so
> he changed to a gender neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly
> Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't know him assumed he was a girl!
>
> Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so
> that notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul,
> but notes referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jes

Re: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-16 Thread Ron Ferguson
Bob,

A Deed Poll is an English/Welsh (I cannot speak for Scotland & Ireland)
legal document by which a person changes their name, in particular their
surname. At one time, except for marriage, it was the only legal method one
could use, however today it is not essential.

Ron Ferguson
http://www.fergys.co.uk/


-Original Message-
From: Bob Vary
Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 1:18 AM
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

I may be going slightly off topic here, but what is a deed poll?  I've never
heard the term before.  I take it is has something to do with name changes?
Where are you located?  It sounds British.

Bob


-Original Message-
From: Jan Roberts [mailto:poo...@ozemail.com.au]
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 10:59 PM
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

My late first husband changed his name by deed poll - I only ever knew him
by his 'new' name.  That became my surname when I married him, and is my
daughter's surname.  I have entered him in Legacy under his 'new' name, with
appropriate notes and a Deed Poll event.  But no, as far as I can see there
is no way to differentiate between the names in relation to time frames i.e.
before and after.  I look at it like entering a woman by her maiden name
(only sort of in reverse) - one name is used throughout the report.

Cheers
Jan

-Original Message-
From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 8:01
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not
a gender changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor
born as Mark Paul Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so
he changed to a gender neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly
Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't know him assumed he was a girl!

Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so
that notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul,
but notes referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jessie?
I doubt it, at least not one I could find. Anyone else?

Thank you.

Robert



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RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-16 Thread Jan Roberts
A Deed Poll is a legal document - not a certificate.  It is a form of legal 
contract but it differs from legal contracts between two or more parties in 
that it only concerns one person (and it is only signed by that person in the 
presence of a witness).  A Deed Poll legally binds the person who signs it to a 
particular course of action as detailed on the Deed Poll document.

Although Deed Poll documents are used for various purposes relating to an 
individual or a company legally committing themselves to doing something, they 
have one generally accepted meaning, that is, a change of name.  However, the 
correct legal name for a deed that has been drawn up to change someone's name 
is a Deed of Change of Name (but more commonly known as a Deed Poll).

A Deed Poll for a change of name contains three declarations and by executing 
the Deed Poll (signing, dating and having your signing witnessed) you are 
legally committing yourself to:

Abandoning the use of your former name;
Using your new name only at all times;
Requiring all persons to address you by your new name only.

Why is it called a Deed Poll?

A deed is a written legal agreement that has been signed and delivered (shown 
to all concerned parties).  Poll is an old English word used to describe a 
legal document that had its edges cut (polled) so they were straight.  This was 
done to visually distinguish between a deed signed by one person (a polled deed 
- hence the term Deed Poll) and a deed signed by more than one person (an 
indenture), which had an edge indented or serrated.  Interestingly, indentures 
were originally written twice (side by side) on one piece of parchment, which 
was then torn down the middle and each half given to each party.  The 
impossibility of matching the tear was a guard against forgery.

Deed Poll documents for a change of name can be traced back to 1851 and can be 
seen at the National Archives, which is situated at Kew in Richmond, Surrey.

From: http://www.ukdps.co.uk/WhatIsADeedPoll.html

This is info from a UK site, but I am in Australia where the legal system is 
based on the British. My Google research has shown that in America it might be 
called Master Title Deed, yet I see that Bill Clinton's father changed his name 
by Deed Poll from Blythe to Clinton. 
(http://www.history.malc.eu/Deed-Poll-USA.event.html)

Cheers
Jan
-Original Message-
From: Bob Vary [mailto:oldcro...@optonline.net]
Sent: Sunday, 17 July 2011 10:19
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

I may be going slightly off topic here, but what is a deed poll?  I've never 
heard the term before.  I take it is has something to do with name changes?  
Where are you located?  It sounds British.

Bob


-Original Message-
From: Jan Roberts [mailto:poo...@ozemail.com.au]
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 10:59 PM
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

My late first husband changed his name by deed poll - I only ever knew him by 
his 'new' name.  That became my surname when I married him, and is my 
daughter's surname.  I have entered him in Legacy under his 'new' name, with 
appropriate notes and a Deed Poll event.  But no, as far as I can see there is 
no way to differentiate between the names in relation to time frames i.e. 
before and after.  I look at it like entering a woman by her maiden name (only 
sort of in reverse) - one name is used throughout the report.

Cheers
Jan

-Original Message-
From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 8:01
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not
a gender changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor
born as Mark Paul Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so
he changed to a gender neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly
Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't know him assumed he was a girl!

Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so
that notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul,
but notes referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jessie?
I doubt it, at least not one I could find. Anyone else?

Thank you.

Robert


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RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-16 Thread Bob Vary
I may be going slightly off topic here, but what is a deed poll?  I've never 
heard the term before.  I take it is has something to do with name changes?  
Where are you located?  It sounds British.

Bob


-Original Message-
From: Jan Roberts [mailto:poo...@ozemail.com.au]
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 10:59 PM
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

My late first husband changed his name by deed poll - I only ever knew him by 
his 'new' name.  That became my surname when I married him, and is my 
daughter's surname.  I have entered him in Legacy under his 'new' name, with 
appropriate notes and a Deed Poll event.  But no, as far as I can see there is 
no way to differentiate between the names in relation to time frames i.e. 
before and after.  I look at it like entering a woman by her maiden name (only 
sort of in reverse) - one name is used throughout the report.

Cheers
Jan

-Original Message-
From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 8:01
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not
a gender changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor
born as Mark Paul Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so
he changed to a gender neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly
Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't know him assumed he was a girl!

Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so
that notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul,
but notes referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jessie?
I doubt it, at least not one I could find. Anyone else?

Thank you.

Robert


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RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-15 Thread Jan Roberts
Yes, I have also added an AKA - so the name change is well documented.

Cheers
Jan

-Original Message-
From: Linda French Dawson [mailto:texa...@comcast.net]
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 13:07
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

I am new to Legacy and the list but other programs use aka-also known as.i 
would use the most recent name as surname and then aka for birth name. Linda

-Original Message-
From: Jan Roberts [mailto:poo...@ozemail.com.au]
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 7:59 PM
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

My late first husband changed his name by deed poll - I only ever knew him by 
his 'new' name.  That became my surname when I married him, and is my 
daughter's surname.  I have entered him in Legacy under his 'new' name, with 
appropriate notes and a Deed Poll event.  But no, as far as I can see there is 
no way to differentiate between the names in relation to time frames i.e. 
before and after.  I look at it like entering a woman by her maiden name (only 
sort of in reverse) - one name is used throughout the report.

Cheers
Jan

-Original Message-
From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 8:01
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not
a gender changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor
born as Mark Paul Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so
he changed to a gender neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly
Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't know him assumed he was a girl!

Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so
that notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul,
but notes referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jessie?
I doubt it, at least not one I could find. Anyone else?

Thank you.

Robert


Legacy User Group guidelines:
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RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-15 Thread Linda French Dawson
I am new to Legacy and the list but other programs use aka-also known as.i 
would use the most recent name as surname and then aka for birth name. Linda

-Original Message-
From: Jan Roberts [mailto:poo...@ozemail.com.au]
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 7:59 PM
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

My late first husband changed his name by deed poll - I only ever knew him by 
his 'new' name.  That became my surname when I married him, and is my 
daughter's surname.  I have entered him in Legacy under his 'new' name, with 
appropriate notes and a Deed Poll event.  But no, as far as I can see there is 
no way to differentiate between the names in relation to time frames i.e. 
before and after.  I look at it like entering a woman by her maiden name (only 
sort of in reverse) - one name is used throughout the report.

Cheers
Jan

-Original Message-
From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 8:01
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not
a gender changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor
born as Mark Paul Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so
he changed to a gender neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly
Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't know him assumed he was a girl!

Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so
that notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul,
but notes referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jessie?
I doubt it, at least not one I could find. Anyone else?

Thank you.

Robert


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RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-15 Thread Jan Roberts
My late first husband changed his name by deed poll - I only ever knew him by 
his 'new' name.  That became my surname when I married him, and is my 
daughter's surname.  I have entered him in Legacy under his 'new' name, with 
appropriate notes and a Deed Poll event.  But no, as far as I can see there is 
no way to differentiate between the names in relation to time frames i.e. 
before and after.  I look at it like entering a woman by her maiden name (only 
sort of in reverse) - one name is used throughout the report.

Cheers
Jan

-Original Message-
From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2011 8:01
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not
a gender changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor
born as Mark Paul Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so
he changed to a gender neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly
Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't know him assumed he was a girl!

Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so
that notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul,
but notes referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jessie?
I doubt it, at least not one I could find. Anyone else?

Thank you.

Robert


Legacy User Group guidelines:
http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
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RE: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

2011-07-15 Thread Charles Apple
I also have a similar situation, and I did basically the same as mentioned in 
the previous thread. Personally, I would record his Given Birth Name as shown 
on source documents. In my particular case, the ancestor had their Given Names 
changed legally, therefore, I created an event indicating this change, and 
included the detail in the Notes Section as necessary. Really, it depends on 
the situation, if the name was casually changed (on a casual basis), or 
casually used, then I would most likely record that as an AKA.

I am sure others may do it differently, and will offer their suggestions as 
well.

Charles

-Original Message-
From: Robert E. Carneal [mailto:kentuckygenealog...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 6:01 PM
To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: [LegacyUG] Name Change (not by marriage)

Not to open a can of worms, but I have a related question. This is not a gender 
changing, but a gender-name changing. I.e. I have an ancestor born as Mark Paul 
Carneal. He decided "Mark" was too common a name, so he changed to a gender 
neutral name. He changed his name to Kelly Jessie Carneal. Everyone who didn't 
know him assumed he was a girl!

Now my question, is there a way to indicate a name change in Legacy so that 
notes referring to him *before* his name change used Mark Paul, but notes 
referring to him *after* his name change uses Kelly Jessie?
I doubt it, at least not one I could find. Anyone else?

Thank you.

Robert


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