Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Using Google Street View to perform virtual survey
@Pieren Well that is exactly the point: we should hold ourselves to a higher standard than other organisations. @Martin It is undoubtedly so that the information in question is -not- simply available for use. You need to invest the time and effort to actually go out and collect it. Google has done so and that we should respect, regardless of legalities*. Simon * depending on jurisdiction this could go far further that copyright, database and contract law, for example unfair competition legislation and so on. Am 08.04.2014 10:23, schrieb Pieren: On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 7:57 PM, Simon Poole si...@poole.ch wrote: do we really want to use data collected by somebody that doesn't want us to do so? Asking this question about Google is more than a little ironic ... Pieren ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Using Google Street View to perform virtual survey
2014-04-08 10:39 GMT+02:00 Simon Poole si...@poole.ch: @Martin It is undoubtedly so that the information in question is -not- simply available for use. You need to invest the time and effort to actually go out and collect it. Google has done so and that we should respect, regardless of legalities*. I am aware of this, but you have put ethics into play. If someone developped a system to analyze and store the DNA information of another person (or of an animal, plant), should they be able to become the proprietor of this information and forbid others to use it or ask license fees? Collecting information about the world, nature, the universe ,etc. (regardless how great the effort is) does not automatically make you the exclusive owner of this information. Now in some jurisdictions it is actually possible to put patents and the like on stuff that is basically derived from nature, but it doesn't seem very ethical, at least not to me. To make it clear, I am not advocating to use Google StreetView to derive information for OSM, I agree that we cannot allow to do so, because we want to have a dataset that is globally usable in every jurisdiction for any use, I was simply replying to the ethical argument that you have raised. cheers, Martin ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Using Google Street View to perform virtual survey
Am 08.04.2014 10:55, schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer: 2014-04-08 10:39 GMT+02:00 Simon Poole si...@poole.ch mailto:si...@poole.ch: @Martin It is undoubtedly so that the information in question is -not- simply available for use. You need to invest the time and effort to actually go out and collect it. Google has done so and that we should respect, regardless of legalities*. I am aware of this, but you have put ethics into play. If someone developped a system to analyze and store the DNA information of another person (or of an animal, plant), should they be able to become the proprietor of this information and forbid others to use it or ask license fees? Collecting information about the world, nature, the universe ,etc. (regardless how great the effort is) does not automatically make you the exclusive owner of this information. That is a completely different kettle of fish and a very different discussion. I am not aware of google or any of the other relevant companies or body (with the exception of some states and some national monopoly organisations) claiming exclusivity on such collections. With other words we are free to go out and replicate their effort, which in the end, is what OSM is all about. Yes, there is some concern on my behalf that we may run in to some non-copyright related IP issues at some point in time but google is -very- unlikely to be the problem. Simon signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Using Google Street View to perform virtual survey
-- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2014 11:19:51 +0200 From: Simon Poole si...@poole.ch To: legal-talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Using Google Street View to perform virtual survey Message-ID: 5343bf37.5030...@poole.ch Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Am 08.04.2014 10:55, schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer: 2014-04-08 10:39 GMT+02:00 Simon Poole si...@poole.ch mailto:si...@poole.ch: @Martin It is undoubtedly so that the information in question is -not- simply available for use. You need to invest the time and effort to actually go out and collect it. Google has done so and that we should respect, regardless of legalities*. I am aware of this, but you have put ethics into play. If someone developped a system to analyze and store the DNA information of another person (or of an animal, plant), should they be able to become the proprietor of this information and forbid others to use it or ask license fees? Collecting information about the world, nature, the universe ,etc. (regardless how great the effort is) does not automatically make you the exclusive owner of this information. That is a completely different kettle of fish and a very different discussion. I am not aware of google or any of the other relevant companies or body (with the exception of some states and some national monopoly organisations) claiming exclusivity on such collections. With other words we are free to go out and replicate their effort, which in the end, is what OSM is all about. Yes, there is some concern on my behalf that we may run in to some non-copyright related IP issues at some point in time but google is -very- unlikely to be the problem. Simon Hi, Simon! I guess I missed something. Can you, please, explain that? I didn't get the IP issues part and consequently why Google unlikely would be the problem. That leads to the question about who would pose problems. regards, Paulo ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Using Google Street View to perform virtual survey
Am 08.04.2014 16:16, schrieb Paulo Carvalho: .. I guess I missed something. Can you, please, explain that? I didn't get the IP issues part and consequently why Google unlikely would be the problem. That leads to the question about who would pose problems. There is simply a possibility that we might be violating somebodies patents. When one of the big four players or even smaller ones go belly up in the future I expect a flurry of patent related suits just as we have seen in the mobile space. There is nothing we can do about this except lobby against software patents, so really there is no reason to loose sleep over it. Simon signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
