[OSM-legal-talk] Guideline review: Substantial
All, Although I have not read up on any database legal cases (and do not have the time to), I do have some concerns as to the definition of "substantial". My assumption is that insubstantial use means that the ODBL does not apply (and therefore attribution and share-alike does not apply). If this is not the case then additional information may help. As for the term "substantial", the comparison I have always drawn is with copyright of text: >"In the Infopaq case, the European Court of Justice reviewed the Information Society Directive (2001/29) and determined that the reproduction of 11 consecutive words from a newspaper article may constitute an infringement of copyright in the article, provided that the extract contains elements which are the expression of the intellectual creation of the author." > http://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=464fb6fb-335b-4286-bb67-f84c4be0747a As such I've always treated the word "substantial" to basically mean anything useful. So for example, if you are using OSM data with the aim of producing a village map, then extracting OSM data for that village would, in my opinion, constitute a substantial use. To me an insubstantial use would be a partial extract for the purpose of demonstrating a proof of concept (e.g. a few features from the village to demonstrate the potential of using OSM data), or for the purpose of critiquing something in OSM. An OSM contributor may have spent a significant amount of time micro mapping a village. By attempting to define "substantial" we are setting a level that basically says, if you don't contribute more than this level, your work in insubstantial. :-( Worse still we are weakening our case if this ever gets challenged in court. If someone wants to use OSM data and believes their case is insubstantial then they should be willing to follow it through the legal system. If they're not willing to do this, then use our data as per the ODBL instructs. So to conclude, in my view we should concentrate our efforts on the other areas. Supporting those who want to create a village map by clearly explaining how to attribute OSM and when share alike kicks in would go a long way to helping out. Simon's diary entry helped me to understand this a lot better: http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/SimonPoole/diary/21225 Regards, Rob ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] OpenData attributes from closed vector data
I have since been provided a third data source that does not include any component of the national mapping agency's data. As such this particular instance is now irrelevant. However it is a common one, so I encourage users to engage with their national mapping agencies to enable more use of potentially derived data. Regards, Rob On 7 March 2014 22:40, Rob Nickerson wrote: > Hi list, > > I have been provided (i) original vector data and (ii) a printed map > leaflet both of which include attribute data about roads - for example, > whether the road is lit. > > The owner of the attribute data (whether the road is lit) has explicitly > stated that their data is available as OpenData and are happy for it to be > added to OSM. However, I know that the underlying vector data is most > likely derived from a closed source (national mapping agency). > > Given that I am only interested in the attribute data (we already have our > own version of the road vector data) can I go ahead and add it to OSM using > (i), (ii) or both? > > Thanks, > Rob > ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
[OSM-legal-talk] OpenData attributes from closed vector data
Hi list, I have been provided (i) original vector data and (ii) a printed map leaflet both of which include attribute data about roads - for example, whether the road is lit. The owner of the attribute data (whether the road is lit) has explicitly stated that their data is available as OpenData and are happy for it to be added to OSM. However, I know that the underlying vector data is most likely derived from a closed source (national mapping agency). Given that I am only interested in the attribute data (we already have our own version of the road vector data) can I go ahead and add it to OSM using (i), (ii) or both? Thanks, Rob ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
[OSM-legal-talk] Ordnance Survey OpenData Licence - request to OS required
Hi Mike, [posted to legal-talk and talk-gb; responses to legal-talk or personal email please] I understand that you have had previous correspondence with Ornance Survey and on requesting use of the OpenData you received the response that they have "no objections to geodata derived in part from OS OpenData being released under the Open Database License 1.0." [1] Since this request, several other UK public bodies have started to release geo data on their own websites using the OS OpenData Licence. Examples include: * Hampshire County Council - Public Rights of Way [2] * Communities.gov.uk - Public Assets [3] Oddly not all releases of geo data use the OS OpenData licence (Natural England's recent release is under the Open Government Licence). The problem with the OS OpenData Licence is two-fold. Firstly, it clearly states that the data is hosted on OS's website. This is not the case for the examples above. Secondly, it may be incompatible with ODbL v1.0 (hence the need to request use of the OpenData). Unfortunately, Ordnance Survey's response gives clearance for only their OpenData TM data sets. Can you kindly contact OS and ask what can be done about this. Does their legal team feel that the permission above can be extended to "no objections to geodata derived in part from OS OpenData LICENCED DATA being used under the Open Database Licence 1.0 irrespective of its origin"? If not then can I suggest that OS create a v2 of their OS OpenData Licence that both dilutes the statement that the data is hosted on their website and gives explicit clearance for use with ODbL 1.0? Can this be done soon before more public bodies release data under said licence. Kind Regards, RobJN [1] http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.gis.openstreetmap.region.gb/6516 [2] http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2012-May/013298.html [3] http://publicassets.communities.gov.uk/ ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
[OSM-legal-talk] Follow up : Hampshire Rights of Way Data released under OS OpenData licence
Hi Nick, All, Has any contact been made with either Ordnance Survey or Hampshire CC to get clarity on the use of the Hampshire "OS OpenData"? Recap of the Issue: * Hampshire CC : "The data has been published as Open Data under the Ordnance Survey Open Data Licence". Here the use of "Open Data" seems to be an internal term that Hants CC use [1]. To me this appears to suggest that they have contacted Ordnance Survey to check that they can release the data and OS came back with the suggestion that they use the OS Open Data Licence (it is clear that the rights of way are not derived from OS OpenData as the resolution is too high - i.e. very zoomed in) * The OS OpenData licence [2] states that it governs access to the data on OS's website. The Hampshire data is not on the OS website. This wording therefore looks "bad" but does it, in itself, prevent use of the data in OSM? * Ordnance Survey: Have stated that they have "no objections to geodata derived in part from OS OpenData being released under the Open Database License 1.0." Thus: If we take the Ordnance Surveys response to mean they have 'no objections to geodata derived in part from OS OpenData LICENSED DATA being released under the Open Database License 1.0.' then we are okay. But, it this one step too far? Alternatively, we go back to Hampshire and get them to confirm that we can add this to OSM. We can use OS's quote as supporting evidence. Regards, RobJN [1] http://www3.hants.gov.uk/opendata.htm [2] http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/docs/licences/os-opendata-licence.pdf ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
