Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2014-05-09 Thread Blibbet

On 5/9/14 1:08 PM, Steve Weis wrote:

Hi Tom. Does hibernation on a Mac protect from physical memory
extraction by default or is this something yontma configures?


There may be an ACPI/UEFI attack here... UEFI Runtime Service drivers 
continue to run in the background while the main OS is running. A UEFI 
driver can detect these ACLU Sx states. UEFI includes a full IPv4/IPv6 
network stack (optionally bootable via PXE), UEFI apps/drivers can talk 
over the net as well as to local storage media.


So, a UEFI runtime service driver could detect hibernation, start 
getting active in background over net. IF adversary is smart enough to 
figure out how to install an EFI driver onto your system. And you don't 
detect the change. So, your EFI malware runtime service might be able to 
work while you and the OS think the system is merely hibernating.


EFI's "Fast Boot" feature is the opposite of ACPI hiberation. The B 
states of EFI booting are conceptually similar to the S states of 
ACPI sleeping. Without "Fast Boot", EFI still controls ACPI hibernation, 
just not as quickly (there are redundant re-init/re-scans that are not 
"Fast").


ACPI is controlled by the firmware.
OS suspend/resume is controlled by the firmware.

IMO, power box off completely, to be sure there's no weirdness happening 
at firmware and silicon levels. Like people remove their batteries from 
their smartphones.


PS: EFI-free Novena reached their crowdsourcing goals! You have 9 days 
to act before prices increase:

http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=3750
http://www.crowdsupply.com/kosagi/novena-open-laptop
"at the conclusion of the Crowd Supply campaign on May 18, all the 
prices listed below will go up by 10%"


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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2014-05-09 Thread Tom Ritter
On 9 May 2014 16:08, Steve Weis  wrote:
> Hi Tom. Does hibernation on a Mac protect from physical memory
> extraction by default or is this something yontma configures?

Not sure what you mean.  Obviously we can't protect against someone
unscrewing the computer and stealing the chips ;)

> After a quick search, I ran across "destroyfvkeyonstandby" to destroy
> the FileVault key on standby. Is that sufficient?

So I read a lot about pmset, which is made more difficult because
Apple has a lot of terms they use in different situations (hibernate,
standby, power sleep, etc) that aren't always indicative of what we
think they are.  I BELIEVE that the minimal set of settings required
for a 'true' hibernate (memory snapshot to disk, then shut down
everything) are:

standbydelay - Needs to be 0. "the delay, in seconds, before writing
the hibernation image to disk and powering off memory for Standby."

destroyfvkeyonstandby - Needs to be 1.

hibernatemode - Needs to be 25. "The system will store a copy of
memory to persistent storage (the disk), and will remove power to
memory. The system will restore from disk image. If you want
"hibernation" - slower sleeps, slower wakes, and better battery life,
you should use this setting."

Now I believe that when you set hibernatemode to 25, 'standby' (as in
destroyfvkeyonstandby) actually becomes real 'hibernation'.  I
personally have set a bunch of other ones[0], but I don't believe
these are required.  Like I said, I'm fairly confident about these
settings, but Apple's documentation is confusing, so if you think I'm
wrong, do some research and argue back ;)  YoNTMA will prompt you if
it detects these settings are incorrect or you don't have FileVault
enabled.

> As for DMA attacks, my understanding is the latest OS X does pretty
> good job by default. DMA is disabled while the screen is locked and I
> wasn't able to hotplug arbitrary PCI devices via Thunderbolt (at least
> as of a year ago). I wasn't able to conduct DMA attacks via
> Thunderbolt unless the PCI device was connected on bootup and the
> laptop unlocked. That's an artificial setting, except perhaps for a
> laptop dock with a hidden Thunderbolt hub.

Ah cool.  I hadn't looked into DMA countermeasures too closely.

-tom


[0] My other pmset-tings:

#Do not go to sleep when plugged in and idle
sudo pmset -a autopoweroff 0
#Do go to sleep when idle
sudo pmset -a sleep 30
#Do wake up the computer when the lid is opened
sudo pmset -a lidwake 1
#Do not wake up the computer when the AC is plugged in
sudo pmset -a acwake 0
#Do put the screen to half brightness upon idle
sudo pmset -a halfdim 1
#Do put the display to sleep (actually half brightness) after 30 min
sudo pmset -a displaysleep 30
#Do not put the disk to sleep
sudo pmset -a disksleep 0
#Do not wake on magic packet
sudo pmset -a womp 0
#Or modem ring
sudo pmset -a ring 0
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2014-05-09 Thread Steve Weis
Hi Tom. Does hibernation on a Mac protect from physical memory
extraction by default or is this something yontma configures?

After a quick search, I ran across "destroyfvkeyonstandby" to destroy
the FileVault key on standby. Is that sufficient?

As for DMA attacks, my understanding is the latest OS X does pretty
good job by default. DMA is disabled while the screen is locked and I
wasn't able to hotplug arbitrary PCI devices via Thunderbolt (at least
as of a year ago). I wasn't able to conduct DMA attacks via
Thunderbolt unless the PCI device was connected on bootup and the
laptop unlocked. That's an artificial setting, except perhaps for a
laptop dock with a hidden Thunderbolt hub.

On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Tom Ritter  wrote:
>
> Hey all.  Reviving an ld thread with a new release:
> https://isecpartners.github.io/news/tools/2014/05/09/yontma-mac-release.html
>
> From the first email: If your encrypted laptop has its screen locked,
> and is plugged into power or ethernet, the tool will hibernate your
> laptop if either of those plugs are removed.  So if you run out for
> lunch, or leave it unattended (but plugged in) at starbucks, and
> someone grabs your laptop and runs, it'll hibernate to try to thwart
> memory attacks to retrieve the disk encryption key. Not foolproof, but
> something simple and easy.
>
> We've now released a version for Mac. (Open Source of course.)
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2014-05-09 Thread Tomer Altman
A related tool which employs Bluetooth to detect if your laptop from you has 
been untimely ripped:

http://blueproximity.sourceforge.net

You can tweak it to do arbitrary things when it gets tripped, so it can be 
scripted to hiberate.

HTH,

~T

- Original Message -
From: "Tom Ritter" 
To: "liberationtech" 
Sent: Friday, May 9, 2014 11:41:41 AM
Subject: Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

Hey all.  Reviving an ld thread with a new release:
https://isecpartners.github.io/news/tools/2014/05/09/yontma-mac-release.html

>From the first email: If your encrypted laptop has its screen locked,
and is plugged into power or ethernet, the tool will hibernate your
laptop if either of those plugs are removed.  So if you run out for
lunch, or leave it unattended (but plugged in) at starbucks, and
someone grabs your laptop and runs, it'll hibernate to try to thwart
memory attacks to retrieve the disk encryption key. Not foolproof, but
something simple and easy.

We've now released a version for Mac. (Open Source of course.)

-tom


On 30 May 2013 13:24, Seth David Schoen  wrote:
> Tom Ritter writes:
>
>> On 25 March 2013 11:57, Tom Ritter  wrote:
>> > It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
>> > coming[0].  \
>>
>> Due to some internal confusion, this happened a little bit ago, but I
>> didn't know about it.  You can now tell it "I'm smarter than you and
>> have FDE you don't know about"[0].  This will let it work with
>> Truecrypt.
>>
>> Mac and Linux support are still stalled.  Julian Oliver posted a quick
>> script for Linux that emulates some amount of the functionality last
>> March, I'm reposting:
>
> Jacob Appelbaum and I have some data sources for doing the whole thing
> in the thread at
>
> https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma/issues/2
>
> I'm not sure how fancy we want to make this.
>
> --
> Seth Schoen  
> Senior Staff Technologist   https://www.eff.org/
> Electronic Frontier Foundation  https://www.eff.org/join
> 815 Eddy Street, San Francisco, CA  94109   +1 415 436 9333 x107
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2014-05-09 Thread Tom Ritter
Hey all.  Reviving an ld thread with a new release:
https://isecpartners.github.io/news/tools/2014/05/09/yontma-mac-release.html

>From the first email: If your encrypted laptop has its screen locked,
and is plugged into power or ethernet, the tool will hibernate your
laptop if either of those plugs are removed.  So if you run out for
lunch, or leave it unattended (but plugged in) at starbucks, and
someone grabs your laptop and runs, it'll hibernate to try to thwart
memory attacks to retrieve the disk encryption key. Not foolproof, but
something simple and easy.

We've now released a version for Mac. (Open Source of course.)

-tom


On 30 May 2013 13:24, Seth David Schoen  wrote:
> Tom Ritter writes:
>
>> On 25 March 2013 11:57, Tom Ritter  wrote:
>> > It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
>> > coming[0].  \
>>
>> Due to some internal confusion, this happened a little bit ago, but I
>> didn't know about it.  You can now tell it "I'm smarter than you and
>> have FDE you don't know about"[0].  This will let it work with
>> Truecrypt.
>>
>> Mac and Linux support are still stalled.  Julian Oliver posted a quick
>> script for Linux that emulates some amount of the functionality last
>> March, I'm reposting:
>
> Jacob Appelbaum and I have some data sources for doing the whole thing
> in the thread at
>
> https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma/issues/2
>
> I'm not sure how fancy we want to make this.
>
> --
> Seth Schoen  
> Senior Staff Technologist   https://www.eff.org/
> Electronic Frontier Foundation  https://www.eff.org/join
> 815 Eddy Street, San Francisco, CA  94109   +1 415 436 9333 x107
> --
> Too many emails? Unsubscribe, change to digest, or change password by 
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-05-30 Thread Seth David Schoen
Tom Ritter writes:

> On 25 March 2013 11:57, Tom Ritter  wrote:
> > It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
> > coming[0].  \
> 
> Due to some internal confusion, this happened a little bit ago, but I
> didn't know about it.  You can now tell it "I'm smarter than you and
> have FDE you don't know about"[0].  This will let it work with
> Truecrypt.
> 
> Mac and Linux support are still stalled.  Julian Oliver posted a quick
> script for Linux that emulates some amount of the functionality last
> March, I'm reposting:

Jacob Appelbaum and I have some data sources for doing the whole thing
in the thread at

https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma/issues/2

I'm not sure how fancy we want to make this.

-- 
Seth Schoen  
Senior Staff Technologist   https://www.eff.org/
Electronic Frontier Foundation  https://www.eff.org/join
815 Eddy Street, San Francisco, CA  94109   +1 415 436 9333 x107
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-05-30 Thread Tom Ritter
On 25 March 2013 11:57, Tom Ritter  wrote:
> It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
> coming[0].  \

Due to some internal confusion, this happened a little bit ago, but I
didn't know about it.  You can now tell it "I'm smarter than you and
have FDE you don't know about"[0].  This will let it work with
Truecrypt.

Mac and Linux support are still stalled.  Julian Oliver posted a quick
script for Linux that emulates some amount of the functionality last
March, I'm reposting:

//->

#!/bin/sh

while true;
do
AC=$(acpi -a | awk '{ print $3 }')
if [ "$AC" = "off-line" ]:
then
echo "Power unplugged. Hibernating."
pm-hibernate
fi
sleep 1
done

//<

-tom

[0] 
https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma/commit/26cef9cc60ecbb68b7c6bc78c418d367e657af6a
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-26 Thread liberationtech
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 13:03:56 +
Michael Rogers  wrote:

> Last time I tried it wasn't simple to get Linux to hibernate with an
> encrypted swap partition. Are there now distros that support this out
> of the box?

Works fine for me in Debian Wheezy, Fedora 17, and FreeBSD 9.something.

-- 
Andrew
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pgp 0x6B4D6475
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-26 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 01:03:56PM +, Michael Rogers wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> On 26/03/13 09:59, Julian Oliver wrote:
> > For your Linux laptop why not just use an encrypted file-system and
> > lid-switch? Close the lid and the machine hibernates. If you forget
> > to close the lid then time it out to a screen lock. Can be done in
> > a few lines of shell script with xtrlock and a
> > /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state trigger.
> 
> Last time I tried it wasn't simple to get Linux to hibernate with an
> encrypted swap partition. Are there now distros that support this out
> of the box?

All good for me here with Debian and swap encryption.

Cheers,

-- 
Julian Oliver
http://julianoliver.com
http://criticalengineering.org
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-26 Thread Nick Daly
On Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 8:03 AM, Michael Rogers wrote:
> On 26/03/13 09:59, Julian Oliver wrote:
>> For your Linux laptop why not just use an encrypted file-system and
>> lid-switch? Close the lid and the machine hibernates. If you forget
>> to close the lid then time it out to a screen lock.
>
> Last time I tried it wasn't simple to get Linux to hibernate with an
> encrypted swap partition. Are there now distros that support this out
> of the box?

Debian.  It's worked beautifully for me since Squeeze (at least, maybe Lenny?).
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-26 Thread Michael Rogers
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 26/03/13 09:59, Julian Oliver wrote:
> For your Linux laptop why not just use an encrypted file-system and
> lid-switch? Close the lid and the machine hibernates. If you forget
> to close the lid then time it out to a screen lock. Can be done in
> a few lines of shell script with xtrlock and a
> /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state trigger.

Last time I tried it wasn't simple to get Linux to hibernate with an
encrypted swap partition. Are there now distros that support this out
of the box?

Cheers,
Michael

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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-26 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 10:59:22AM +0100, Julian Oliver wrote:
> ..on Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 05:55:19AM +, Andreas Bader wrote:
> > > Hi all - at the risk of shilling, my company has released an Open
> > > Source tool called "You'll Never Take Me Alive".  If your encrypted
> > > laptop has its screen locked, and is plugged into power or ethernet,
> > > the tool will hibernate your laptop if either of those plugs are
> > > removed.  So if you run out for lunch, or leave it unattended (but
> > > plugged in) at starbucks, and someone grabs your laptop and runs,
> > > it'll hibernate to try to thwart memory attacks to retrieve the disk
> > > encryption key. Not foolproof, but something simple and easy.
> > > 
> > > It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
> > > coming[0].  If you have suggestions - add them to the github issues
> > > page.
> > > 
> > > https://isecpartners.com/news-events/news/2013/march/yontma.aspx
> > > https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma
> > > 
> > > -tom
> > 
> > Great Idea, solves a huge problem with the hack of SEDs.
> > But Windows itself is a big security hole, why don't you offer this for
> > Linux? When I encrypt my Laptop with Bitlocker and Yontma, then I have a
> > half Open Source secured Laptop..
> 
> For your Linux laptop why not just use an encrypted file-system and 
> lid-switch?
> Close the lid and the machine hibernates. If you forget to close the lid then
> time it out to a screen lock. Can be done in a few lines of shell script with
> xtrlock and a /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state trigger.
> 

In fact here's a quick crude sketch that polls rather than triggers from /proc:

//->

#!/bin/sh

while true;
do  
   
AC=$(acpi -a | awk '{ print $3 }')
if [ "$AC" = "off-line" ]:
then 
echo "Power unplugged. Hibernating."
pm-hibernate
fi
sleep 1
done

//<

Add it to /etc/init.d/ and it will hibernate the machine when the power is
unplugged. You could also have it read STDIN, waiting N attempts for a password
before hibernating on failed auth.

Cheers,

-- 
Julian Oliver
http://julianoliver.com
http://criticalengineering.org
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-26 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 05:55:19AM +, Andreas Bader wrote:
> > Hi all - at the risk of shilling, my company has released an Open
> > Source tool called "You'll Never Take Me Alive".  If your encrypted
> > laptop has its screen locked, and is plugged into power or ethernet,
> > the tool will hibernate your laptop if either of those plugs are
> > removed.  So if you run out for lunch, or leave it unattended (but
> > plugged in) at starbucks, and someone grabs your laptop and runs,
> > it'll hibernate to try to thwart memory attacks to retrieve the disk
> > encryption key. Not foolproof, but something simple and easy.
> > 
> > It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
> > coming[0].  If you have suggestions - add them to the github issues
> > page.
> > 
> > https://isecpartners.com/news-events/news/2013/march/yontma.aspx
> > https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma
> > 
> > -tom
> 
> Great Idea, solves a huge problem with the hack of SEDs.
> But Windows itself is a big security hole, why don't you offer this for
> Linux? When I encrypt my Laptop with Bitlocker and Yontma, then I have a
> half Open Source secured Laptop..

For your Linux laptop why not just use an encrypted file-system and lid-switch?
Close the lid and the machine hibernates. If you forget to close the lid then
time it out to a screen lock. Can be done in a few lines of shell script with
xtrlock and a /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state trigger.

Cheers,

-- 
Julian Oliver
http://julianoliver.com
http://criticalengineering.org
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-25 Thread Andreas Bader
> Hi all - at the risk of shilling, my company has released an Open
> Source tool called "You'll Never Take Me Alive".  If your encrypted
> laptop has its screen locked, and is plugged into power or ethernet,
> the tool will hibernate your laptop if either of those plugs are
> removed.  So if you run out for lunch, or leave it unattended (but
> plugged in) at starbucks, and someone grabs your laptop and runs,
> it'll hibernate to try to thwart memory attacks to retrieve the disk
> encryption key. Not foolproof, but something simple and easy.
> 
> It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
> coming[0].  If you have suggestions - add them to the github issues
> page.
> 
> https://isecpartners.com/news-events/news/2013/march/yontma.aspx
> https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma
> 
> -tom

Great Idea, solves a huge problem with the hack of SEDs.
But Windows itself is a big security hole, why don't you offer this for
Linux? When I encrypt my Laptop with Bitlocker and Yontma, then I have a
half Open Source secured Laptop..

-Andreas
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-25 Thread Tom Ritter
On 25 March 2013 14:41, Karl Fogel  wrote:
> Your paragraph above doesn't mention it, but appears this is (right now)
> only for MS Windows.  Any chance of Linux support coming soon, and in
> the long run of getting folded in as a kernel service so that I can just
> configure it from my System Settings menu eventually? :-)
>
> I'm sure others will be asking about Mac OS X too.

https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma/issues/2 - Linux
https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma/issues/3 - Mac

The more folks add +1's to the tickets they care about, the more
likely the authors (who code it in their free time) will be to work on
it.  I know the authors don't have a lot of Linux/Mac experience
though, so any pointers into how those disk encryption systems could
be detected, and how to get the events for ethernet/power plug removal
would be appreciated and probably improve motivation. =)

-tom
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Re: [liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-25 Thread Karl Fogel
Tom Ritter  writes:
>Hi all - at the risk of shilling, my company has released an Open
>Source tool called "You'll Never Take Me Alive".  If your encrypted
>laptop has its screen locked, and is plugged into power or ethernet,
>the tool will hibernate your laptop if either of those plugs are
>removed.  So if you run out for lunch, or leave it unattended (but
>plugged in) at starbucks, and someone grabs your laptop and runs,
>it'll hibernate to try to thwart memory attacks to retrieve the disk
>encryption key. Not foolproof, but something simple and easy.
>
>It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
>coming[0].  If you have suggestions - add them to the github issues
>page.
>
>https://isecpartners.com/news-events/news/2013/march/yontma.aspx
>https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma

What a terrfic idea, Tom -- thanks.

Your paragraph above doesn't mention it, but appears this is (right now)
only for MS Windows.  Any chance of Linux support coming soon, and in
the long run of getting folded in as a kernel service so that I can just
configure it from my System Settings menu eventually? :-)

I'm sure others will be asking about Mac OS X too.

-K
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[liberationtech] A tool for encrypted laptops

2013-03-25 Thread Tom Ritter
Hi all - at the risk of shilling, my company has released an Open
Source tool called "You'll Never Take Me Alive".  If your encrypted
laptop has its screen locked, and is plugged into power or ethernet,
the tool will hibernate your laptop if either of those plugs are
removed.  So if you run out for lunch, or leave it unattended (but
plugged in) at starbucks, and someone grabs your laptop and runs,
it'll hibernate to try to thwart memory attacks to retrieve the disk
encryption key. Not foolproof, but something simple and easy.

It the moment it only supports Bitlocker, but support for Truecrypt is
coming[0].  If you have suggestions - add them to the github issues
page.

https://isecpartners.com/news-events/news/2013/march/yontma.aspx
https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma

-tom

[0] https://github.com/iSECPartners/yontma/issues/5
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