[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #19 from mirko.piero...@studenti.polito.it ---
Concerning the issue of text outside the slide, I think that text should not be
allowed to exceed the boundaries of the slide. It should fit the text box and
its font should be adjusted automatically to fit the box where the text is
placed.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Regina Henschel  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||rb.hensc...@t-online.de

--- Comment #18 from Regina Henschel  ---
There is not only text outside the slide area.
Other examples:
A Bézier curve has often control points outside the slide area,
or a background picture is larger than the slide,
or a motion path, which starts/ends outside the slide,
or a drawing, which you need only partly.

Working in zoom out mode on objects or part of objects outside might be too
hard on the eyes. So the area outside the slide needs to be available on any
zoom level.

PowerPoint is not a good examples. Its "feature" that scrolling up and down
switches the slide, is very annoying, if you use want to get scroll to the
another object with the mouse wheel when you have zoomed in.

I'm not against an option to fix the scrollbar or to disable scrolling when
touching an edge on movement. But only, if it is off as default or can be set
off easily. Putting it deep into configuration settings, is no option for me.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Timur  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||mirko.piero...@studenti.pol
   ||ito.it

--- Comment #17 from Timur  ---
*** Bug 128067 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Heiko Tietze  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   See Also||https://bugs.documentfounda
   ||tion.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11
   ||7912

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Heiko Tietze  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Keywords|needsUXEval |needsDevEval
 CC|libreoffice-ux-advise@lists |tietze.he...@gmail.com
   |.freedesktop.org|

--- Comment #15 from Heiko Tietze  ---
Besides text scrolling beyond the slide today I'm afraid of copied objects from
a large presentation (A0) to a smaller (A4). But obviously all of the design
team agree with this proposal.

We could go with Brian's suggestion in c6/8. Or just limit the size until the
user moves an object outside. Up to development I'd say.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #14 from Thomas Lendo  ---
(In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #13)
> I support the idea of an option.
> But changing the default behavior that we must consider that people are used
> to work with, needs stronger arguments IMO.
If we change the default setting, would users of existing/old profiles see the
new default or would they stick in their old setting? If it doesn't change,
your argument against it is obsolete in my POV.

Just for the record, regardless what the default will be: It should be possible
to move/extend any object outside of paper/slide size but no scrollbars bars
should be shown with this option enabled and page down/up keys should not
change the canvas view if the paper/slide size fits in the canvas completely.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #13 from Cor Nouws  ---
(In reply to Thomas Lendo from comment #11)

> It should still be possible to add or extend objects outside of slide/paper
> size but the default is better to be restricted. I never understood why it
> is possible to scroll left/right/up/down of slide/paper size when this is
> ...

I support the idea of an option.
But changing the default behavior that we must consider that people are used to
work with, needs stronger arguments IMO.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #12 from Thomas Lendo  ---
(In reply to Thomas Lendo from comment #11)
> behavior in contrary to GIMP and Inkscape.
I meant Draw and Inkscape.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Thomas Lendo  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||thomas.le...@gmail.com

--- Comment #11 from Thomas Lendo  ---
I support the idea of the bug opener to restrict scrolling to slide/paper size
instead of scrolling through the entire canvas.

It should still be possible to add or extend objects outside of slide/paper
size but the default is better to be restricted. I never understood why it is
possible to scroll left/right/up/down of slide/paper size when this is the
intended area the user should work with and where users present their content
(presentation) to others. I don't see the benefit of the current behavior in
contrary to GIMP and Inkscape.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Thomas Lendo  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Blocks||105957


Referenced Bugs:

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=105957
[Bug 105957] [META] Scrollbar-related bugs and enhancements
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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #10 from Heiko Tietze  ---
(In reply to brian.bj.parker99 from comment #8)
> I think the issue of what happens to text boxes is orthogonal to the
> scrolling issue.

Pasting text requires horizontal (and/or vertical) scrolling resulting in a
blank canvas that doesn't accept controls. Therefore I understand text boxes
(and any large object) as the cause of the issue - otherwise there would be a
use case for not restricting the canvas.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Cor Nouws  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

Version|6.0.3.2 release |Inherited From OOo

--- Comment #9 from Cor Nouws  ---
(In reply to brian.bj.parker99 from comment #0)

> limited to the extent of the slide.  In LO the scroll bars are always
> present and allow the slide to be shifted an arbitrary amount off the screen
> with the mouse or arrow keys.

Horizontally it is allowed to scroll about to the width of the slide on both
sides. Vertically, it is allowed to scroll even less.

> This is very clumsy as when editing slides (moving textboxes with the mouse
> for example) it is very easy to accidentally flick the slide off the screen,
> which gives a very unstable UI.  

Might be. But than the number of complaints is rather low, to think this is a
widely experienced problem?

(In reply to brian.bj.parker99 from comment #6)

> I suggest adding a similar option to LO Impress (and ideally making it on by
> default).

The option and _off_ by default, would be fine for me..

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #8 from brian.bj.parke...@gmail.com ---
I think the issue of what happens to text boxes is orthogonal to the scrolling
issue.
Whatever LO does now is ok- just let the text go off the boundary of the slide
if necessary, and then the user can see and edit the off-slide text by either
(i) zooming out sufficiently to see the canvas around the slide, or (ii)
turning off the "auto-center" option and scrolling to see the off-slide text.

(Note that the proposed "auto-center" option, which limits the horizontal and
vertical scrolling, is independent of the "fit slide" button that is already in
LO Impress, which causes the slide to automatically zoom to fill the entire
screen).

(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #7)
> (In reply to brian.bj.parker99 from comment #6)
> > I suggest adding a similar option to LO Impress...
> 
> Sounds very reasonable. What should happen when the user pastes a lengthy
> text into a field, e.g. Lorem ipsum? Guess we do not max out the width
> anymore but in height, and virtually cut off the text (cursor up/down to
> scroll) after font size adjustment has been done to the minimum, if enabled.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #7 from Heiko Tietze  ---
(In reply to brian.bj.parker99 from comment #6)
> I suggest adding a similar option to LO Impress...

Sounds very reasonable. What should happen when the user pastes a lengthy text
into a field, e.g. Lorem ipsum? Guess we do not max out the width anymore but
in height, and virtually cut off the text (cursor up/down to scroll) after font
size adjustment has been done to the minimum, if enabled.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #6 from brian.bj.parke...@gmail.com ---
OSX Keynote has an option "auto-center" on its toolbar which is on by default.
When off it allows scrolling over the full canvas including regions off the
slide, as LO Impress does now. When on it gives the behaviour I suggest-
scrolling is limited to the extent of the slide.

I suggest adding a similar option to LO Impress (and ideally making it on by
default).

(An alternative UI would be that of Powerpoint, which allows scrolling a slide
horizontally and vertically to the bounding box of the slide and any off-slide
objects (off-slide objects can initially be added by zooming out the slide
until the surrounding canvas is shown). Thus, for the majority of slides, where
there are no off-slide objects, no scroll bars are shown and scroll bars appear
only for those slides that need it.)


(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #5)
> We could limit the start point of objects to be inside the slide. But
> typically when pasting text you have to scroll right or down, so the end
> point is outside. And the workflow would be strange if you cannot insert an
> object for some reason (out of the slide canvas) or it jumps automatically
> to the rightmost position.
> 
> Italo, Cor, what do you think?

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Heiko Tietze  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||c...@nouenoff.nl,
   ||it...@italovignoli.com

--- Comment #5 from Heiko Tietze  ---
We could limit the start point of objects to be inside the slide. But typically
when pasting text you have to scroll right or down, so the end point is
outside. And the workflow would be strange if you cannot insert an object for
some reason (out of the slide canvas) or it jumps automatically to the
rightmost position.

Italo, Cor, what do you think?

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #4 from brian.bj.parke...@gmail.com ---
(In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #3)

In Keynote you can still add and edit figures off-screen on the full canvas,
similarly to Draw, if you zoom out sufficiently. The only difference is that
when zoomed in you are limited to scrolling the display area and not the full
canvas (same for Powerpoint).

I agree that for LO Draw there is an advantage to being able to scroll over the
whole canvas when zoomed in, as it is usual to prepare figures outside the
display area and one is typically working on a single figure.

For a presentation program though, where you are regularly quickly shifting
between a large number of slides, and editing off-screen figures is less
common, that is a poor user interface due to the ease of shifting slides off
the display area when dragging text boxes etc.  I use both LO Impress and OSX
Keynote and Powerpoint regularly to prepare lectures and Keynote and Powerpoint
feel much more fluid and stable to me, due to this issue (particularly as LO
Draw is slower with a large number of slides).

I agree there may be some benefit to having consistency of UI between LO Draw
and LO Impress, but I think they are quite different applications and could
benefit from having different defaults in this case.


> Created attachment 141383 [details]
> ODF presentation with Draw objects positioned off the slide
> 
> While Presentation's slide object (or Draw's page) has an active display
> size (or print area)--the entire canvas is exposed to hold Draw objects.
> 
> Impress (or Draw) scrollbars are linked to the full extent of the canvas in
> memory--not to the display/print size.
> 
> See the attached presentation for an example, and to understand why the
> scroll bars must extend beyond slide/page settings to include the entire
> canvas.
> 
> Some potential to limit the active edit area to just the slide (or page);
> but that has never been the OOo, or LibreOffice way--many folks would see it
> as a regression.
> 
> =>WF

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

V Stuart Foote  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Keywords||needsUXEval
 Status|UNCONFIRMED |NEW
 CC||libreoffice-ux-advise@lists
   ||.freedesktop.org
 Ever confirmed|0   |1

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

V Stuart Foote  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||vstuart.fo...@utsa.edu

--- Comment #3 from V Stuart Foote  ---
Created attachment 141383
  --> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=141383=edit
ODF presentation with Draw objects positioned off the slide

While Presentation's slide object (or Draw's page) has an active display size
(or print area)--the entire canvas is exposed to hold Draw objects.

Impress (or Draw) scrollbars are linked to the full extent of the canvas in
memory--not to the display/print size.

See the attached presentation for an example, and to understand why the scroll
bars must extend beyond slide/page settings to include the entire canvas.

Some potential to limit the active edit area to just the slide (or page); but
that has never been the OOo, or LibreOffice way--many folks would see it as a
regression.

=>WF

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

--- Comment #2 from brian.bj.parke...@gmail.com ---
(In reply to Jean-Baptiste Faure from comment #1)
> There is a very useful button just on left side of zoom slider, it fit the
> slide to the current window.

Thanks, that is a fast way to correct from accidentally scrolling the slide off
the screen. I do still think though that the user interface of keynote and
powerpoint is much superior- limiting the extent of scrolling of the slide to
the slide edges.


> 
> Best regards. JBF

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 117009] In Impress UI scroll bars are active beyond the extent of the slide

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=117009

Jean-Baptiste Faure  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||jbfa...@libreoffice.org

--- Comment #1 from Jean-Baptiste Faure  ---
There is a very useful button just on left side of zoom slider, it fit the
slide to the current window.

Best regards. JBF

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