Re: [Libreoffice-qa] LO 3.6.2 : about Manage dialog from Conditional Formatting
Hi Bjoern, Thank you very much for your kind words. I think that this story shows that we need more discussion between developers, QA-team and power users. Later I will try to make constructive propositions to improve our collaboration, for the moment I am building the master to test the patches commited by Michael for fdo54940. :-) Best regards. JBF Le 28/09/2012 11:29, Bjoern Michaelsen a écrit : > Hi Jean-Baptiste, > > On Wed, Sep 26, 2012 at 10:29:20AM +0200, Bjoern Michaelsen wrote: >> On Wed, Sep 26, 2012 at 06:35:57AM +0200, Jean-Baptiste Faure wrote: >>> Nobody interested to test and answer? >> I think it is rather that most in QA already have their share of critical >> bugs >> to care about. > just wanted to follow up on this one as while we discussed the issue at hand > some more in private, my initial email was probably quite a bit harsh when > standing on its own. > > Given that, I was happy that you continued to discuss it constructively. Still > please accept my apologies for the inital blunt reply, and I hope the issue > at hand can be worked out satisfactorily in due time. > > Best, > > Bjoern > ___ > List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list > Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org > Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa > Problems? > http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ > Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette > List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/ > -- Seuls des formats ouverts peuvent assurer la pérennité de vos documents. ___ List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/
Re: [Libreoffice-qa] LO 3.6.2 : about Manage dialog from Conditional Formatting
Hi Jean-Baptiste, On Wed, Sep 26, 2012 at 10:29:20AM +0200, Bjoern Michaelsen wrote: > On Wed, Sep 26, 2012 at 06:35:57AM +0200, Jean-Baptiste Faure wrote: > > Nobody interested to test and answer? > > I think it is rather that most in QA already have their share of critical bugs > to care about. just wanted to follow up on this one as while we discussed the issue at hand some more in private, my initial email was probably quite a bit harsh when standing on its own. Given that, I was happy that you continued to discuss it constructively. Still please accept my apologies for the inital blunt reply, and I hope the issue at hand can be worked out satisfactorily in due time. Best, Bjoern ___ List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/
Re: [Libreoffice-qa] LO 3.6.2 : about Manage dialog from Conditional Formatting
On Tue, Sep 25, 2012 at 6:58 AM, Jean-Baptiste Faure wrote: > If nothing is possible, I think the better thing to do is to remove the > button Edit from the Manage dialog. I think this is the best thing to do in this case - there is even a bug because of this edit button. If you click edit -> remove one conditional formatting entry -> Ok -> Crash! What I would also do is leave "first condition" empty (or say something like ) if current selection is not in range and it includes a formula. Additional I would put up a warning and explain to the user what he sees (something like Caution! Cells references in formula condition are relative to the current selected cell ()). This is at least what I would do. Regards, Tomaž ___ List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/
Re: [Libreoffice-qa] LO 3.6.2 : about Manage dialog from Conditional Formatting
Hi there, On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 06:35 +0200, Jean-Baptiste Faure wrote: > Nobody interested to test and answer? Sigh - people are busy; in particular Markus - whose baby this is has just put in a great chunk of bug-fixing work for 3.6.2 / 3.6.3 to improve lots of conditional formatting corner-cases. I expect that high-priority bug work chews time he could spend on discussing changes to features. > Well, it is clear that QA peoples are not welcome in this area of the > code. :-( Please don't feel unwelcome if you don't get a quick response. It is -far- easier to ask questions and find problems than it is to consider and fix them; and some problems are more urgent than others. > > The problem has been described in fdo#54774, fdo#54940, and on QA and > > UX-advise mailing-list. We had very few answers and only one developer > > (Markus) point of view. So I decided to ask on developers ML as it is a > > developer problem. So - Markus is the authority there, since he's the one doing the hacking :-) last I checked he implemented it based on advice from the UX-advise list [ if it is a UI issue, please follow up only on that list instead of cross-posting ]. > > This Manage dialog is very important as it gives a summary of all CF > > defined in the current sheet. It is a long waited function for all > > peoples who are using CF in their spreadsheets. So a big thank you to > > Markus for that. Agreed, it's some great work. > > If nothing is possible, I think the better thing to do is to remove the > > button Edit from the Manage dialog. So - I imagine the discussion is just slow going; I havn't followed it in detail, perhaps there is some UX input needed, please be patient :-) All the best, Michael. -- michael.me...@suse.com <><, Pseudo Engineer, itinerant idiot ___ List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/
Re: [Libreoffice-qa] LO 3.6.2 : about Manage dialog from Conditional Formatting
Hi Jean-Baptiste, On Wed, Sep 26, 2012 at 06:35:57AM +0200, Jean-Baptiste Faure wrote: > Nobody interested to test and answer? I think it is rather that most in QA already have their share of critical bugs to care about. > Well, it is clear that QA peoples are not welcome in this area of the > code. :-( Please cut this passive aggressive tone. QA ia welcome and needed in all areas of the code, however neither QA nor UX does mean "make the developer do what I wish". Our developers are sensible people and if you have a convincing argument taking into account all aspects of the issue, I dont think they will shed such input. Best, Bjoern ___ List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/
Re: [Libreoffice-qa] LO 3.6.2 : about Manage dialog from Conditional Formatting
Hi, Nobody interested to test and answer? Well, it is clear that QA peoples are not welcome in this area of the code. :-( JBF Le 25/09/2012 06:58, Jean-Baptiste Faure a écrit : > Hi all, > > Now, the bottleneck fdo#54498 has been fixed for LO 3.6.2, it is a great > step toward making LO 3.6 usable for production ! > > So I think it's time for developers to consider the severe UX issue we > have with the Edit dialog from manage screen in Format -> Conditional > Formatting -> Manage. > The problem has been described in fdo#54774, fdo#54940, and on QA and > UX-advise mailing-list. We had very few answers and only one developer > (Markus) point of view. So I decided to ask on developers ML as it is a > developer problem. > > To make the story short, I think it is crucial to make the Edit dialog > from Format > CF > Manage > Button Edit to work exactly in the same way > as Format > CF > CF, regardless the constraints from using relative > references. > My main argument is here : > http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/2012-September/002653.html > > This Manage dialog is very important as it gives a summary of all CF > defined in the current sheet. It is a long waited function for all > peoples who are using CF in their spreadsheets. So a big thank you to > Markus for that. But now it is important to not give a bad user > experience with this new great function. > > If nothing is possible, I think the better thing to do is to remove the > button Edit from the Manage dialog. > > Best regards. > JBF, irritating QA people. > -- Seuls des formats ouverts peuvent assurer la pérennité de vos documents. ___ List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/
[Libreoffice-qa] LO 3.6.2 : about Manage dialog from Conditional Formatting
Hi all, Now, the bottleneck fdo#54498 has been fixed for LO 3.6.2, it is a great step toward making LO 3.6 usable for production ! So I think it's time for developers to consider the severe UX issue we have with the Edit dialog from manage screen in Format -> Conditional Formatting -> Manage. The problem has been described in fdo#54774, fdo#54940, and on QA and UX-advise mailing-list. We had very few answers and only one developer (Markus) point of view. So I decided to ask on developers ML as it is a developer problem. To make the story short, I think it is crucial to make the Edit dialog from Format > CF > Manage > Button Edit to work exactly in the same way as Format > CF > CF, regardless the constraints from using relative references. My main argument is here : http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/2012-September/002653.html This Manage dialog is very important as it gives a summary of all CF defined in the current sheet. It is a long waited function for all peoples who are using CF in their spreadsheets. So a big thank you to Markus for that. But now it is important to not give a bad user experience with this new great function. If nothing is possible, I think the better thing to do is to remove the button Edit from the Manage dialog. Best regards. JBF, irritating QA people. -- Seuls des formats ouverts peuvent assurer la pérennité de vos documents. ___ List Name: Libreoffice-qa mailing list Mail address: Libreoffice-qa@lists.freedesktop.org Change settings: http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-qa Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice-qa/
