Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
I know that early on in the pandemic, Baystate health, a huge hospital system based in Massachusetts, was looking for developers to finish integrating a [1]Jitsi instance into its tele-health platform. I don't know what came of that but it is worth looking into. Aaron E-J The Other Realm [2]http://otherrealm.org [3]http://theotherrealm.org (Blog) On 2020-09-09 5:54 AM, Don Saklad wrote: In the predicament when the doctor's office offers "zoom" for teleconferencing with patients from home what can a somewhat informed patient suggest instead of "zoom" considering this context where there's unfamiliarity with alternatives, unfamiliarity with the technology generally by doctor's frontline office staff, unfamiliarity of the doctor already using "zoom", unfamiliarity of the patient with the alternatives. ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list [4]libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org [5]https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss References 1. https://jitsi.org/ 2. http://otherrealm.org/ 3. http://theotherrealm.org/ 4. mailto:libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org 5. https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
נכתב על ידי Connor Doherty, ב־9.9.2020 בשעה 21:36: > Modern phone calls use a boatload of proprietary software from your >Telco anyway, and you can't control the systems it goes through. https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/network-services-arent-free-or-nonfree.html -- Caleb Herbert KE0VVT (816) 892-9669 https://bluehome.net/csh ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 02:36:23AM +, Connor Doherty wrote: >Modern phone calls use a boatload of proprietary software from your >Telco anyway, and you can't control the systems it goes through. Its >also easy to track and record. Yes, and the same is true for the majority of our email communication too. But most people (even here) don't demand that everyone they email with uses a fully-free email server and email client. We can only control our own side of the conversation. The point is that we shouldn't completely avoid telephony because we don't control all sides of the communication. We should control as much of our side as we can (just as we do with email), and there are many projects that help us do that (such as ones that help us avoid using non-free baseband firmware), including one that I work on myself. Of course, we should always prefer a free software solution, especially one that offers end-to-end encryption, but there's no reason to consider the telephone network as bad as Zoom - the telephone network is federated and standardized after all, and we can use it with free software. > So it would seem that 1 piece of >proprietary software (Zoom) on an otherwise free system is the superior >option for 1. freedom, 2. privacy (Zoom supports encryption) and 3. >Practicality - you have the option to show your doctor something >visually, get in the waiting room early, easily add other participants, >background noise suppression, etc. > >But of course you could get all of that with Jitsi as well, so if your >doctor is up for it, suggest Jitsi. Biggest sell: there's no software >to install on either end. Also supports dialing in by phone, and other >goodies. It's the Free option. I certainly agree. If you can get your doctor to use Jitsi, definitely do that. But if you can't, a telephone call is a good alternative. Denver https://jmp.chat/ ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
Connor Doherty writes: > Modern phone calls use a boatload of proprietary software from your > Telco anyway, and you can't control the systems it goes through. Indeed, if you care that much about privacy and distrust the relevant data protection rules, you need to know a lot more about how your doctor's office runs, or you need to avoid the doctor. However, if you are concerned simply with freedom to control your own computers, VoIP phone calls are fine. Only the part you set up needs to be free. You could use either a land line phone or free SIP software. It is the service provider's problem if it runs proprietary software. Zoom supports telephone. I am happy to join Zoom calls by telephone. ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
On 9/9/20 7:47 AM, Stephen Paul Weber wrote: In the predicament when the doctor's office offers "zoom" for teleconferencing with patients from home what can a somewhat informed patient suggest instead of "zoom" This is just silly. Your doctor, or their practice, is going to standardize on something. They're not going to do something else just because one patient or another doesn't like it. Don't waste their time, or yours, making a big deal of it. (Unless, they're asking your technical advice - in which case, if you don't already know enough to have an answer, just stay out of it.) Miles Fidelman -- In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is. Yogi Berra Theory is when you know everything but nothing works. Practice is when everything works but no one knows why. In our lab, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and no one knows why. ... unknown ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of zoom?
* Pedro Lucas Porcellis [2020-09-09 18:44]: > > In the predicament when the doctor's office offers "zoom" for > > teleconferencing with patients from home what can a somewhat informed > > patient suggest instead of "zoom" > > You can simple recommend to use alternatives, like Jitsi. Although, I > think you should do with common sense in mind. I know that people use the word "alternatives" yet I think there is no alternative to free software. For experiment, I have installed Android OS on one spare notebook, just to try the WhatsApp and to see what is it doing, as I never use it, I have my own page why not to use WhatsApp and I give to people explanations. And result of the experiment is that it will not work well if I do not allow WhatsApp application to get access to all my contacts, so all my contacts are moving to WhatsApp servers. It will be obvious that WhatsApp will take any contacts I have and I do not know what all is taking, is it taking notes, addresses, vCards, or just phone numbers, I have no idea. What I know is that I do not know anybody in that company. So what is common sense to me is to think about it and not to give away my contacts to unknown foreign companies where I do not know anybody face to face, neither I spoke with them on phone. So by common sense, I will tell this same to my friends, and never had problems in understanding, in fact they understood that Whatsapp is doing emotional threats to lose all your friends if they are not on Whatsapp. And I let them think. There is no force involved, everybody can think for themselves. And for the reason above explained, which is common sense, as giving away list of contacts to unknown people is outrageous, or grossly offensive to decency or morality, as anonymous asking for the list of contacts is not decent and not moral, for this reason, there is no alternative to proprietary software neither to centralized abusive networks. Apropos "alternative": https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/words-to-avoid.html#Alternative > I'm slowly teaching my therapist to use alternatives (she has only used > Google's Duo or WhatsApp for video-calls), like using Duo on the Web, > then proceeding to teach her to know other tools, like Jitsi. In my opinion, people like therapists should respect privacy of others, that is foremost priority, and by using WhatsApp, they give away list of contacts to unknown company, and contacts did not agree to that, and nobody asked them. Why would a therapist give away all contacts to unknown company? The unknown company, without proper due diligence have taken contacts, and we do not know what are they doing. At the day D, the contacts can as well be used for extermination of certain groups or friends, which have been done throughout the last 100 years with success, including in Rwanda, Bosnia recently and Europe in second world war. It was myself, who have asked a criminal organization in defense of a war criminal to remove the racist lists they made for extermination of thousands of people based on their names or nation belongings, and they did remove it, as they had to comply with certain privacy laws in Europe. Contacts inside of Whatsapp will be abused as they can be abused, as simple as that. > Being an activist for free software does not mean that I will force or > shout at people to use GNU / Linux or to join the cause, but every time > I feel that I have the opportunity *and it makes sense*, I will try to > give the hint. I have never encountered resistance and that may be due to fact that I do not put attention, and I do leave people decide how they wish. And I have never use any force, neither encountered resistance. I simply say what I use, why I use it, and I explain myself well what means freedom so that there is no misunderstanding between free of charge and freedom of using software. Free software makes sense all the time, proprietary software does not make sense all the time. There is this Aurora APK for Android OS, from F-Droid.org and inside there are those Exodus reports, try researching those Google Playstore applications, they are as abusive as they can be. For example simple keyboard application made by Google itself and by other provides as well is going to ask users for contacts, for Internet connections, for location, to read SMS and write SMS, and to read storage and so on, why would keyboard application be able to do that all? So it makes sense to warn people about the abuses and offer them abuse free operating system and software. > People need to understand why free software is better, and they will > naturally choose if they fully understand. That is right, and you may explain it better and with more details. Myself I stress privacy in first place. Jean ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
Modern phone calls use a boatload of proprietary software from your Telco anyway, and you can't control the systems it goes through. Its also easy to track and record. So it would seem that 1 piece of proprietary software (Zoom) on an otherwise free system is the superior option for 1. freedom, 2. privacy (Zoom supports encryption) and 3. Practicality - you have the option to show your doctor something visually, get in the waiting room early, easily add other participants, background noise suppression, etc. But of course you could get all of that with Jitsi as well, so if your doctor is up for it, suggest Jitsi. Biggest sell: there's no software to install on either end. Also supports dialing in by phone, and other goodies. It's the Free option. On Sep 9, 2020, at 10:45, Stephen Paul Weber <[1]singpol...@singpolyma.net> wrote: In the predicament when the doctor's office offers "zoom" for teleconferencing with patients from home what can a somewhat informed patient suggest instead of "zoom" Our family doctor has good success with doing our appointments using "telephone". ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org [2]https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discus s References 1. mailto:singpol...@singpolyma.net 2. https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
In the predicament when the doctor's office offers "zoom" for teleconferencing with patients from home what can a somewhat informed patient suggest instead of "zoom" Our family doctor has good success with doing our appointments using "telephone". ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
Telephone ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
Re: What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
> In the predicament when the doctor's office offers "zoom" for > teleconferencing with patients from home what can a somewhat informed > patient suggest instead of "zoom" You can simple recommend to use alternatives, like Jitsi. Although, I think you should do with common sense in mind. I'm slowly teaching my therapist to use alternatives (she has only used Google's Duo or WhatsApp for video-calls), like using Duo on the Web, then proceeding to teach her to know other tools, like Jitsi. This is not something I would do with my GP, for example. For lack of intimacy and also for common sense, after all I only see him once four to six months. Being an activist for free software does not mean that I will force or shout at people to use GNU / Linux or to join the cause, but every time I feel that I have the opportunity *and it makes sense*, I will try to give the hint. People need to understand why free software is better, and they will naturally choose if they fully understand. In fact, I've been seeing more and more people on my circles realizing and ditching stuff like YouTube for NewPipe merely by seeing how better is the app and how it works *for people*, not profit, and starting to experiment with things like Mastodon/Fediverse. ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
What can an informed patient suggest instead of "zoom"?
In the predicament when the doctor's office offers "zoom" for teleconferencing with patients from home what can a somewhat informed patient suggest instead of "zoom" considering this context where there's unfamiliarity with alternatives, unfamiliarity with the technology generally by doctor's frontline office staff, unfamiliarity of the doctor already using "zoom", unfamiliarity of the patient with the alternatives. ___ libreplanet-discuss mailing list libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
