Re: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
unsubscribe license-l begin:vcard n:Benedict, Sr.;Martin V. tel;cell:(315)868-5924 tel;fax:(775)587-0249 tel;home:(315)866-5924 x-mozilla-html:TRUE adr:;;324 Marion Street;Herkimer;New York;13350; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fn:Martin V. Benedict, Sr. end:vcard
RE: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
This is really a remedy clause so it does not appear to cover the same issue that unilateral revocation of the license involves. I think that the intent here is to inform licensees that a breach of the license by the licensee terminates the license. Generally, language like this is not unusual. The use of the word "any" could render the remedy a little harsh under circumstances where the licensee fails to comply with a minor term, but that is a different issue. Rod Dixon -Original Message- From: David Johnson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, September 08, 2000 9:48 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License On Fri, 08 Sep 2000, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 5. TERMINATION. In the event of any default or failure of User to abide by the terms hereof, this license may be revoked by TCG without prior notice and all rights granted hereunder rescinded. In the event of such revocation, the Program and all copies thereof however stored and on all media, temporary and permanent, shall be returned to TCG or destroyed or otherwise disabled by User. Upon request User shall provide sufficient evidence of compliance said obligation. Unilateral termination language is generally not favorably received. You can yank rights at any time. Sorry, I won't play. I think you have misinterpreted the clause. The way I read it, they can only yank rights away if the user does not abide by the license. This isn't unilateral, it can only happen through specific action by the user. Although I don't like how they can terminate usage rights. It would be much better if only distribution rights were terminated upon license violation. -- David Johnson _ http://www.usermode.org
Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
Dear Sir or Madam:
My name is Robert Buccigrossi, Ph.D. ("Butch"), part of the Turner
Consulting Group. We have released the application server "SteelBlue"
at http://www.steelblue.com/ , and as we are approaching our first
stable release, we were hoping to prepare it for wider distribution. We
feel that part of this is ensuring that what we claim as "Open Source"
is truly open source. Therefore, I would greatly appreciate your
posting the following license (listed after my signature) to the
license-discuss list. I am happy to be identified as one of the
authors, and will happily entertain questions and comments at my e-mail
address mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] . The main goals of this license is:
- To impose no restrictions upon the use of the software (i.e.
educational and commercial use is permitted)
- Applications developed using this application server do not have
to be open source (i.e. can be commercial and sold)
- Modifications made to the software, if released, should be
reported to the original authors (i.e. TCG)
- To permit the original authors (i.e. TCG) to be able to release
a commercial version of the software in the future if they choose
- Hold the original authors (i.e. TCG) not liable for any defects
in the program
- To be legally binding in the United States (we've had fun wrestling
with our lawyers over wording :)
Thank you so much for your time, and we look forward to your
suggestions.
Butch
SteelBlue License (SBL)
Non-Recourse, Non-Exclusive Revocable License Agreement
The attached software application ("Program") is owned exclusively by
Turner Consulting Group, Inc. ("TCG"), a Maryland corporation, and is
protected by United States copyright law and international treaty.
The right to use the Program for any and all purposes is subject to,
and by downloading, installing and/or using this software you
(sometimes referred to as "User") accept all of the terms and
conditions set forth below. The term "Program" shall include all
portions thereof, all versions, releases, upgrades, enhancements,
improvements, modifications, updates and all derivatives, as
determined by TCG to be part of the Program. Nothing herein shall be
construed as an offer by TCG to supply any such additional materials
or services, or restrict TCG's sale or licensing to others of products
based upon the Program in whole or in part.
1. LICENSE. The Program is provided or made available to User by TCG
on an open source and non-exclusive basis. The Program and any
and all rights therein, may not be sold, transferred, sublicensed,
distributed or otherwise conveyed by you in any manner for any
reason, other than in compliance with the terms of this License.
2. COPIES AND DISTRIBUTION. The Program may be copied and installed
on an unlimited number of User's workstations, networks and
information systems. The Program, in whole or in part, may be
distributed by User to others, provided that distribution
(i) permits and enables further distribution; and
(ii) in every instance be accompanied by this License. All users
and recipients shall remain subject to the terms and
conditions hereof.
3. RESTRICTIONS. Except in compliance with this License, the Program
may not be distributed, published, sublicensed or otherwise
disseminated or exploited by User or any other person or entity
without the prior written consent of TCG in each instance. All
use of the Program, and all copies, correspondence, publications
and other materials used therewith, shall indicate in a prominent
manner that the Program is subject to this License and the rights
of TCG, and shall be accompanied by the restrictions set forth
herein. The grant of the license of the Program does not include
the conveyance by TCG of any ownership right, title or other
interest.
4. MODIFICATIONS. Modifications of the Program may be made and
distributed only under the following conditions:
a. Modifications may not alter or remove any copyright notices in
the Program with respect to TCG.
b. All distributed modifications to the Program shall immediately
become subject to a permanent non-exclusive royalty-free right
hereby granted to TCG to include such modifications in the
Program as it may determine from time to time, and the
unrestricted right to distribute such modification in all future
versions of the Program, without obligation to User of any kind.
c. Upon distribution, the source code of all modifications to the
Program must be made available free of charge to TCG as
specified on the Web page at
http://www.steelblue.com/modifications/ .
5. TERMINATION. In the event of any default or failure of User to
abide by the terms hereof, this license may be revoked by TCG
without prior notice and all rights granted hereunder rescinded.
In the event
Re: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
Robert Buccigrossi wrote: 6. COPYRIGHT. All right, title and interest in and to the Program, including but not limited to the copyright and the right to sell, transfer, license or otherwise convey the Program and any rights therein, remain exclusively with TCG. This sentence looks problematic under the Open Source Definition (and, a fortiori, as Free Software as well). It seems to prohibit people from packaging the Program on a CD-ROM with other programs and selling the CD-ROM. -- There is / one art || John Cowan [EMAIL PROTECTED] no more / no less|| http://www.reutershealth.com to do / all things || http://www.ccil.org/~cowan with art- / lessness \\ -- Piet Hein
Re: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
On Fri, Sep 08, 2000 at 03:44:25PM -0400, Robert Buccigrossi ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
Dear Sir or Madam:
My name is Robert Buccigrossi, Ph.D. ("Butch"), part of the Turner
Consulting Group. We have released the application server "SteelBlue"
at http://www.steelblue.com/ , and as we are approaching our first
stable release, we were hoping to prepare it for wider distribution. We
feel that part of this is ensuring that what we claim as "Open Source"
is truly open source. Therefore, I would greatly appreciate your
posting the following license (listed after my signature)
If it's at all possible, attempt to use (or modify to the minimal extent
possible) an existing license. Queue time for license approval, as well
as general community confusion over licensing terms, and license
balkanization, not to mention the inevitable errors and issues arising
in sui generis license agreements, makes the "roll your own" approach
both suboptimal and very expensive.
to the
license-discuss list. I am happy to be identified as one of the
authors, and will happily entertain questions and comments at my e-mail
address mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] . The main goals of this license is:
- To impose no restrictions upon the use of the software (i.e.
educational and commercial use is permitted)
Consider: GPL, LGPL, BSD (w/o advertising clause), MIT, Mozilla Public
License (MozPL).
- Applications developed using this application server do not have
to be open source (i.e. can be commercial and sold)
Consider: LGPL, BSD, MIT, Mozilla, possibly dualed with one of the
other licenses above.
- Modifications made to the software, if released, should be
reported to the original authors (i.e. TCG)
Strongly urge you drop this requirement.
- To permit the original authors (i.e. TCG) to be able to release
a commercial version of the software in the future if they choose
Of your own work or of contributed work? Consider dual licensing as
with Mozilla (the project, not the license), StarOffice, or Troll Tech's
Qt.
- Hold the original authors (i.e. TCG) not liable for any defects
in the program
Consider: GPL, LGPL, BSD, MIT, MozPL, etc.
- To be legally binding in the United States (we've had fun wrestling
with our lawyers over wording :)
Take it to court and find out. Note issues which have been raised in
recent discussions here. Most strong licenses tend to fall back on
copyright law (17 USC) for most portions of protection. No public
software license has AFAIK been tested in court.
Thank you so much for your time, and we look forward to your
suggestions.
What is your overall objective with this technology? Are you trying to
create a technology standard? Consider a BSD/MIT license. Are you
trying to create a development environment? Consider an LGPL or MozPL
type license. Are you trying to promote and extend free software?
Consider the GPL or LGPL.
Butch
SteelBlue License (SBL)
Non-Recourse, Non-Exclusive Revocable License Agreement
The attached software application ("Program") is owned exclusively by
Turner Consulting Group, Inc. ("TCG"), a Maryland corporation, and is
protected by United States copyright law and international treaty.
The right to use the Program for any and all purposes is subject to,
and by downloading, installing and/or using this software you
(sometimes referred to as "User") accept all of the terms and
conditions set forth below. The term "Program" shall include all
portions thereof, all versions, releases, upgrades, enhancements,
improvements, modifications, updates and all derivatives, as
determined by TCG to be part of the Program. Nothing herein shall be
construed as an offer by TCG to supply any such additional materials
or services, or restrict TCG's sale or licensing to others of products
based upon the Program in whole or in part.
1. LICENSE. The Program is provided or made available to User by TCG
on an open source and non-exclusive basis. The Program and any
and all rights therein, may not be sold, transferred, sublicensed,
distributed or otherwise conveyed by you in any manner for any
reason, other than in compliance with the terms of this License.
Organization-specific license significantly weakens general
acceptability of license.
2. COPIES AND DISTRIBUTION. The Program may be copied and installed
on an unlimited number of User's workstations, networks and
information systems. The Program, in whole or in part, may be
distributed by User to others, provided that distribution
Gratuitous language. Is unrestricted copying and distribution available
or not?
(i) permits and enables further distribution; and
(ii) in every instance be accompanied by this License. All users
and recipients shall remain subject to the terms and
conditions hereof.
3. RESTRICTIONS. Except in compliance with this License, the Program
Re: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
On Fri, 08 Sep 2000, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 5. TERMINATION. In the event of any default or failure of User to abide by the terms hereof, this license may be revoked by TCG without prior notice and all rights granted hereunder rescinded. In the event of such revocation, the Program and all copies thereof however stored and on all media, temporary and permanent, shall be returned to TCG or destroyed or otherwise disabled by User. Upon request User shall provide sufficient evidence of compliance said obligation. Unilateral termination language is generally not favorably received. You can yank rights at any time. Sorry, I won't play. I think you have misinterpreted the clause. The way I read it, they can only yank rights away if the user does not abide by the license. This isn't unilateral, it can only happen through specific action by the user. Although I don't like how they can terminate usage rights. It would be much better if only distribution rights were terminated upon license violation. -- David Johnson _ http://www.usermode.org
Re: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
On Fri, Sep 08, 2000 at 06:48:03PM -0700, David Johnson ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, 08 Sep 2000, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 5. TERMINATION. In the event of any default or failure of User to abide by the terms hereof, this license may be revoked by TCG without prior notice and all rights granted hereunder rescinded. In the event of such revocation, the Program and all copies thereof however stored and on all media, temporary and permanent, shall be returned to TCG or destroyed or otherwise disabled by User. Upon request User shall provide sufficient evidence of compliance said obligation. Unilateral termination language is generally not favorably received. You can yank rights at any time. Sorry, I won't play. I think you have misinterpreted the clause. The way I read it, they can only yank rights away if the user does not abide by the license. This isn't unilateral, it can only happen through specific action by the user. Ok. I see it this way. In which case it appears that successor rights are also terminated (aka transmitted rights). Cf: Section 4 of the GNU GPL: "However, parties who have received copies...". Although I don't like how they can terminate usage rights. It would be much better if only distribution rights were terminated upon license violation. Yes. -- Karsten M. Self [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.netcom.com/~kmself Evangelist, Opensales, Inc.http://www.opensales.org What part of "Gestalt" don't you understand? Debian GNU/Linux rocks! http://gestalt-system.sourceforge.net/K5: http://www.kuro5hin.org GPG fingerprint: F932 8B25 5FDD 2528 D595 DC61 3847 889F 55F2 B9B0 PGP signature
Re: Proposal for OSI Certification: The SteelBlue License
On Fri, 08 Sep 2000, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think you have misinterpreted the clause. The way I read it, they can only yank rights away if the user does not abide by the license. This isn't unilateral, it can only happen through specific action by the user. Ok. I see it this way. In which case it appears that successor rights are also terminated (aka transmitted rights). Cf: Section 4 of the GNU GPL: "However, parties who have received copies...". Hmmm, a likely interpretation of "all copies thereof". It would be a good thing for them to clarify this (or use an existing license :-) ) -- David Johnson _ http://www.usermode.org
