Re: Google displays 2.9 doc

[David Kastrup]

Jan Nieuwenhuizen  writes:

> I'm not sure the solution to remove al older v2.9 etc. from google is
> a smart thing to do.

I think it is much better than the alternatives.

-- 
David Kastrup



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Re: Quit [now definitely O/T]

[David Kastrup]

Carl Sorensen  writes:

> David,
>
> I appreciate your persistence in this.  I think that you are having part of
> the difficulty in this conversation because it's on -user, not on -devel.
>
> The modifications to anything except input files (which use lilypond code
> and embedded scheme) really involve knowledge that's primarily discussed on
> -devel.

Certainly.  This thread started by a user throwing in the towel, on the
user list, explaining his reasons for doing so.  This was followed by
several comments that questioned his commitment in getting to learn
Lilypond.  As it is my impression that this in several respects was
doing the original poster injustice as well as pasting over existing
deficiencies in how Lilypond keeps up with what it is advertised for, I
wanted to pitch in with my personal take.

_Addressing_ the actual problems is definitely more suitably done on the
developer list.

-- 
David Kastrup



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Re: Google displays 2.9 doc

[Jan Nieuwenhuizen]

Op donderdag 12-11-2009 om 01:32 uur [tijdzone +], schreef Graham
Percival:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:19:02PM +0100, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote:
> > Op woensdag 11-11-2009 om 17:25 uur [tijdzone +], schreef Graham
> > Percival:
> > > On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 01:12:26PM +0100, Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool) 
> > > wrote:
> > > > can something be done to make Google display latest doc and not 2.9?

> That'll only fix the google search from our site.

Yes, well, it would help if we could say [and document]: use /this/
search box over here :-)

> If you go to
> google.com and search for "lilypond repeat" (random example), v2.9
> is the first one that comes up.
> 
> I *think* that we can add something to robots.txt to tell google
> to stop looking in v2.9  (hmm, maybe it thinks that v2.9 is higher
> than v2.12 ?),

Wow, it does look like that, doesn't it?  That would be stupid, 
in a smart way.  Does google have a bug tracker, Han-Wen? ;-)

> but I'd need to spend a few minutes looking it up,
> and this is really far down on the priority list.

I'm not sure the solution to remove al older v2.9 etc. from google
is a smart thing to do.


Jan.


-- 
Jan Nieuwenhuizen  | GNU LilyPond - The music typesetter
Avatar®: http://AvatarAcademy.nl| http://lilypond.org



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Re: lower-case html names

[Jan Nieuwenhuizen]

Op donderdag 12-11-2009 om 01:29 uur [tijdzone +], schreef Graham
Percival:

Hi Graham,

> Could we hold off on the @ref{} and @rgeneral{} changes for a few
> days while I take a look at this?

Sure.  I just think broken links are /bad/ so I always ruthlessly
followed-up to 404 reports.  Currently I give it a few days but
if nothing happens, I just fix them :-)

Greetings,
Jan.

-- 
Jan Nieuwenhuizen  | GNU LilyPond - The music typesetter
Avatar®: http://AvatarAcademy.nl| http://lilypond.org



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Re: Google displays 2.9 doc

[David Kastrup]

Graham Percival  writes:

> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:19:02PM +0100, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote:
>> Op woensdag 11-11-2009 om 17:25 uur [tijdzone +], schreef Graham
>> Percival:
>> > On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 01:12:26PM +0100, Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool) 
>> > wrote:
>> > > can something be done to make Google display latest doc and not 2.9?
>> > 
>> > It's a known bug in the issue tracker.  Patches appreciated.
>> 
>> Apparently the +v2.12 has been removed again.  It is still present in
>> some of the language directories.
>
> That'll only fix the google search from our site.  If you go to
> google.com and search for "lilypond repeat" (random example), v2.9
> is the first one that comes up.
>
> I *think* that we can add something to robots.txt to tell google
> to stop looking in v2.9  (hmm, maybe it thinks that v2.9 is higher
> than v2.12 ?), but I'd need to spend a few minutes looking it up,
> and this is really far down on the priority list.

But it's a good idea.  Some installers for Lilypond apparently don't
install any kind of information locally, and people just use Google.
Docs that may be behind half a version are bad enough, but being behind
years is worse.

-- 
David Kastrup



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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Graham,


I'll bet you a double-double and 20 timbits[1] that this is
because of "sudo make", or running sudo at some point when
downloading the source?  Once you do "sudo make clean; sudo make
distclean", all the out/ and out-www/ directories should be gone,
and you shouldn't have this problem any more if you run plain
"make".


Glad I'm hungry...  ;)

Doing as you said lead to a different — but still erroneous — build  
output:


ar: creating archive out/library.a
ranlib out/library.a || ar ts out/library.a || true
make PACKAGE=LILYPOND package=lilypond -C include all && true
mkdir -p ./out
touch ./out/dummy.dep
echo '*' > ./out/.gitignore
true
out/dispatcher.dep:1: *** multiple target patterns.  Stop.
make: *** [all] Error 2


Hmm, ok.  Those instructions look fine.  I forgot they were there.
I'm slightly supicious that they might be 10.5-specific


I've been toying with upgrading to 10.6 recently... maybe I'll just  
go out tomorrow and buy it, then do a clean sweep.


Thanks,
Kieren.

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Re: [PATCH] Source_file: remove mbrtowc() in favor of utf8_char_len()

[Patrick McCarty]

On 2009-11-10, Patrick McCarty wrote:
> I have uploaded a patch series to Rietveld for review:
> 
>   http://codereview.appspot.com/154046/show
> 
> This addresses the following report:
> 
>   http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-lilypond/2009-10/msg1.html
> 
> and keeps compatibility with the initial fix I made for this report:
> 
>   http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-lilypond/2009-10/msg00049.html

Additionally, I should mention that this patch assumes that the UTF-8
character sequences in a source file are *valid*, i.e. well-formed.
Invalid UTF-8 sequences are caught when text is processed by Pango, so
IMO there is no need for additional checks here.

Thanks,
Patrick


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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Graham Percival]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 09:35:35PM -0500, Kieren MacMillan wrote:
> Hi Graham,
>
>> - why modify configure.make ?!  that shouldn't be necessary.
>
> I tried make, and had problems — specifically,
>
> mkdir -p ./out
> echo 2.13.8 > out/VERSION
> /bin/sh: line 1: out/VERSION: Permission denied
> make: *** [out/VERSION] Error 1

I'll bet you a double-double and 20 timbits[1] that this is
because of "sudo make", or running sudo at some point when
downloading the source?  Once you do "sudo make clean; sudo make
distclean", all the out/ and out-www/ directories should be gone,
and you shouldn't have this problem any more if you run plain
"make".

[1]  I miss timbits.  :(

> There, I found the "Compiling on MacOS X" instructions which told me to 
> modify configure.make, etc.

Hmm, ok.  Those instructions look fine.  I forgot they were there.
I'm slightly supicious that they might be 10.5-specific, since I
never touched config.make when I had osx 10.4... but then again, I
never tried to build lilypond itself; I only compiled the docs.

Cheers,
- Graham


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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Graham,


- why modify configure.make ?!  that shouldn't be necessary.


I tried make, and had problems — specifically,

mkdir -p ./out
echo 2.13.8 > out/VERSION
/bin/sh: line 1: out/VERSION: Permission denied
make: *** [out/VERSION] Error 1

On


it says
"If you encounter any problems, please see Problems."

There, I found the "Compiling on MacOS X" instructions which told me  
to modify configure.make, etc.


Suggestions?
Kieren.

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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Graham Percival]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 09:11:28PM -0500, Kieren MacMillan wrote:
> Hi John (et al),
>
>> can't you grab and install last TeXlive release? (2008, 2009 beta, or 
>> 2009 in case it's out)
>
> I [apparently] installed texlive.
>
> Now, after doing the ./autogen stuff and modifying configure.make, I do
>
>   sudo make

- why modify configure.make ?!  that shouldn't be necessary.
- you don't need "sudo make"; a plain "make" is fine.  actually,
  it's better than a "sudo make"... I'd do "sudo make clean; sudo
  make distclean" and start again with a normal-user "make".
- if you only want to build the docs, you could skip over "make"
  entirely and do "make doc" with the EXTERNAL_BINARY trick given
  in the CG.

Cheers,
- Graham


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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi John (et al),

can't you grab and install last TeXlive release? (2008, 2009 beta,  
or 2009 in case it's out)


I [apparently] installed texlive.

Now, after doing the ./autogen stuff and modifying configure.make, I do

  sudo make

and get

chmod 755 out/lilypond-invoke-editor
/Users/kmac/Documents/03_personal/music/Lilypond/lilydev/scripts/ 
build/out/help2man out/lilypond-invoke-editor > out/lilypond-invoke- 
editor.1

ERROR: In procedure dynamic-link:
ERROR: file: "libguile-srfi-srfi-1-v-3", message: "file not found"
help2man: can't get `--help' info from out/lilypond-invoke-editor
make[1]: *** [out/lilypond-invoke-editor.1] Error 1
make: *** [all] Error 2

What now?
Kieren.


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Re: Fixing issue 800 (extender ending early if other voices present)

[Joe Neeman]

On Wed, 2009-11-11 at 14:41 -0500, Chris Snyder wrote:
> >> 1) Change melisma_busy() to return true if in the middle of a note
>  >> 2) Alternatively, add the check in
>  >> Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep instead
>  >
>  > I'm confused: isn't the current check in
>  > Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep?
> 
> For solution #2, I meant that we can add a check in 
> Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep to see if we're in the 
> middle of a note, in addition to the melisma_busy() call (since 
> melisma_busy() doesn't currently do such a check).

Now I'm even more confused. get_current_note_head finds a note head
(from the associatedVoice) that ends strictly after the current moment.
We only check melisma_busy if get_current_note_head finds something.
Therefore, we will only check melisma_busy if we are in the middle of a
note. Am I missing something?

To answer your original question, btw, I have a slight preference for
leaving melisma_busy as-is and modifying the call site.

Cheers,
Joe




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Re: Google displays 2.9 doc

[Graham Percival]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:19:02PM +0100, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote:
> Op woensdag 11-11-2009 om 17:25 uur [tijdzone +], schreef Graham
> Percival:
> > On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 01:12:26PM +0100, Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool) 
> > wrote:
> > > can something be done to make Google display latest doc and not 2.9?
> > 
> > It's a known bug in the issue tracker.  Patches appreciated.
> 
> Apparently the +v2.12 has been removed again.  It is still present in
> some of the language directories.

That'll only fix the google search from our site.  If you go to
google.com and search for "lilypond repeat" (random example), v2.9
is the first one that comes up.

I *think* that we can add something to robots.txt to tell google
to stop looking in v2.9  (hmm, maybe it thinks that v2.9 is higher
than v2.12 ?), but I'd need to spend a few minutes looking it up,
and this is really far down on the priority list.

Cheers,
- Graham


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lower-case html names

[Graham Percival]

Jan,

I like the changes to the @uref{} links, but we should be able to
make all the html filenames lower-case by changing 2 or 3 lines in
the texi2html-init file.  I'm still not certain whether makeinfo /
info is happy with lower-case node names, so I think the perl lc()
function is better than manually renaming the nodes.

Could we hold off on the @ref{} and @rgeneral{} changes for a few
days while I take a look at this?

Cheers,
- Graham


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Re: Tracker 836: Add facility to change output file-name for a \book block

[Carl . D . Sorensen]

A few whitespace errors (tab following spaces) and one indenting
mistake.  Then I think it's good to go.




http://codereview.appspot.com/150044/diff/11/1015
File ly/music-functions-init.ly (right):

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044/diff/11/1015#newcode611
ly/music-functions-init.ly:611: (filter
Tab following space -- we never want to have that.  Start the line with
as many tabs as desired, followed by spaces if necessary to create the
proper indentation.  Or use all spaces -- that's fine too.  But not
space tab space.

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044/diff/11/1015#newcode612
ly/music-functions-init.ly:612: (lambda (m) (eq? 'NoteEvent
(ly:music-property m 'name)))
Tab following space

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044/diff/11/1015#newcode613
ly/music-functions-init.ly:613: (ly:music-property ev-chord
'elements
Tab following space

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044/diff/11/1015#newcode624
ly/music-functions-init.ly:624: (for-each (lambda (m)
(for-each should align with (ly:pitch?.

(if (test-expression)
(true-expression)
(false-expression))

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044/diff/11/1015#newcode626
ly/music-functions-init.ly:626: (begin
After changing for-each, you'll need to change (begin to match.

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044/diff/11/1015#newcode633
ly/music-functions-init.ly:633: trill-events)
Tab following spaces

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044


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Re: serious doubts about waf

[Don Armstrong]

On Wed, 11 Nov 2009, Graham Percival wrote:
> What's the advantage of automake over the current system? (I'm not
> even certain what the current system is called!)

If anyone goes into this, could they PLEASE, PLEASE, document it
slightly better? [I'm almost certainly I'm doing insane things when
I'm building the packages in Debian.]
 

Don Armstrong

-- 
Some pirates achieved immortality by great deeds of cruelty or
derring-do. Some achieved immortality by amassing great wealth. But
the captain had long ago decided that he would, on the whole, prefer
to achieve immortality by not dying.
 -- Terry Pratchet _The Color of Magic_

http://www.donarmstrong.com  http://rzlab.ucr.edu


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Re: Quit [now definitely O/T]

[Carl Sorensen]

David,

I appreciate your persistence in this.  I think that you are having part of
the difficulty in this conversation because it's on -user, not on -devel.

The modifications to anything except input files (which use lilypond code
and embedded scheme) really involve knowledge that's primarily discussed on
-devel.



On 11/11/09 1:36 PM, "David Kastrup"  wrote:

> Kieren MacMillan  writes:
> 
>> 
>> c.f. 
>> > e>
>> What needs to be added/improved? Once again, I'm sincerely asking,
>> since you obviously still have questions about Lilypond coding style
>> that weren't answered by that page (and surrounding ones).
> 
> Uh, have you read it?  It worries about things like indentation, says to
> prefer C++ over Python (but Python please in "PEP 8" whatever that fancy
> acronym is supposed to be), and some identifier names.

I agree.  But at least for now, the coding style rules for LilyPond are the
GNU coding style without modifications.  Hence, the limited stuff that seems
to not make much sense.

> It does not say
> what kind of code to put where for what reason.
> 
> That is: it tells you minor details about how source should be formatted
> once you know perfectly what you are doing and which part of the code is
> appropriate to use.  Namely it tells you about the difference between
> something that compiles and fits in with the rest of the _code_.  It
> does not tell you what language/classes/operations to use to implement
> what kind of task.

That's right.  This kind of documentation does not exist.  Several years ago
I couldn't understand LilyPond at all, so I started trying such a document.
It didn't get very far and it wasn't very accurate (but it did get a
reference in Erik's thesis as the only available description).

I'm still not sure I'm up to speed.  I have some knowledge, but probably
just enough to be dangerous.  I could write a little bit better description,
but probably not a really *good* one.

> 
>>   
>> Same question as above.
> 
> The thesis is a thesis.  It is unclear what state of Lilypond it
> documents, and what the current state of Lilypond embeds from what is in
> the thesis.
> 
> And some thesis on the web is not a good substitute for programming
> docs.  Because it does not evolve with the program.

I agree, but the fact is that the thesis *is* currently the best description
we have of LilyPond's overall architecture.  And it is current, and will
likely be current at least through all of 2.x.  Details have changed, but
not the overall structure.

>> 
>>> The internals documentation should likely spell out the layers of C+
>>> +, Scheme, Music macros and what one can hope to reasonably implement
>>> in what layer.  What new functionality requires equivalence of new
>>> engravers or performers, can one implement them in Scheme, does one
>>> need C++, and what exactly does one _do_ when creating them?

I agree that this information is needed.  It doesn't belong in the internals
documentation, which is a dictionary, as described before.  It probably
belongs in the Contributors' Guide, or a separate Program Architecture
manual.

Would you be willing to create an outline of a Program Architecture manual?
It could have headings that relate to your questions, and then we could fill
in the answers, roughly at first and later in greater detail.

>> 
>> The introductory page
>> > -architecture#Overview-of-LilyPond-architecture>
>> does spell this out, I believe.
> 
> I don't see this.  Mostly, it points to sources for reference.  That's
> useful to some degree.  But if people write sources with only sources
> for reference, any design inherent in the first generation of the
> sources is going to become less and less discernible with successive
> layers of code.

As a matter of fact, Han-Wen is consistent in telling us to "Use the Source,
Luke", rather than referring to other materials. So referring to the source
is important, but need not be exclusive.

> 
> More educational than studying how existing code is written would be to
> study how the code is _supposed_ to be written.  Some self-contained
> example with well-defined functionality that sits well in the scheme of
> things.  If people can't make their own code as simple and
> self-contained (or see existing "real" code much uglier), that is an
> incentive for improving the state of their and preexisting "real" code.

I think this is a great idea -- a sort of Learning Manual for programming.
Aimed not at users, but at developers.  Something that works through a
simple engraver, and describes the key components that are used.

I don't know that we have anybody who knows enough and has the time and
interest to write such a beast, but it would probably help increase the
number of developers on the project.  I've cross-posted

Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Arthur Reutenauer]

>can't you grab and install last TeXlive release? (2008, 2009
> beta, or 2009 in case it's out)

  2009's just been released.  Wholeheartedly agreed on advising against teTeX.
It has been a great distribution, but there's no point in sticking to it today,
years after support has been discontinued.

Arthur


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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Graham Percival]

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 01:15:35AM +0100, John Mandereau wrote:
> Hi Kieren,
> Le mercredi 11 novembre 2009 à 19:05 -0500, Kieren MacMillan a écrit :
> > I'm trying to get a local build system in place (in order to edit the  
> > docs), and can't seem to get past some install errors — specifically
> > 
> > sudo port install tetex
> 
> I don't have a Mac and I have never used MacOS X for building LilyPond,
> but I hope you don't have to build teTeX, which hasn't been maintained
> for years; can't you grab and install last TeXlive release? (2008, 2009
> beta, or 2009 in case it's out)

whoops, that's exactly the kind of thing I should have noticed!
Thanks John!

Kieren:
  sudo port install texlive
(you might need texlive_texmf-full as well, but try it with just
that first)

granted, macports reports it as being unmaintainer, but it'll get
much more usage and testing than tetex.

Cheers,
- Graham



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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Graham Percival]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:05:18PM -0500, Kieren MacMillan wrote:
> I'm trying to get a local build system in place (in order to edit the  
> docs), and can't seem to get past some install errors — specifically
>
>sudo port install tetex

I can't see anything obviously wrong in the output... I mean, it
doesn't suggest anything nice like "oh, they forgot to add xyz as
a dependency; just do a port install xyz and then do tetex again".
I would just file a bug with macports.

BTW, what happens if you just do:
  sudo port install texi2html
  cp GNUmakefile.in GNUmakefile
  make web-gop

?  that _might_ work without any more hassle.  It's not a
long-term solution, but at least you could work on Alternate input
without potentially waiting days or weeks for the macports
maintainers to investigate their package(s).

Cheers,
- Graham


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Re: problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[John Mandereau]

Hi Kieren,
Le mercredi 11 novembre 2009 à 19:05 -0500, Kieren MacMillan a écrit :
> I'm trying to get a local build system in place (in order to edit the  
> docs), and can't seem to get past some install errors — specifically
> 
> sudo port install tetex

I don't have a Mac and I have never used MacOS X for building LilyPond,
but I hope you don't have to build teTeX, which hasn't been maintained
for years; can't you grab and install last TeXlive release? (2008, 2009
beta, or 2009 in case it's out)

Best,
John


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problem installing build requirements [Mac OS X 10.4.11]

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hello all,

I'm trying to get a local build system in place (in order to edit the  
docs), and can't seem to get past some install errors — specifically


   sudo port install tetex

leads [eventually] to

--->  Extracting teTeX
--->  Configuring teTeX
--->  Building teTeX
Error: Target org.macports.build returned: shell command " cd "/opt/ 
local/var/macports/build/ 
_opt_local_var_macports_sources_rsync.macports.org_release_ports_print_t 
eTeX/work/tetex-src-3.0" && /usr/bin/make -j2 all " returned error 2

Command output: sed -f sedscript <./xdvi.1.in >xdvi.1
/usr/bin/gcc-4.0 -DHAVE_CONFIG_H  -I. -I. -I.. -I./.. -W -Wall - 
Wunused -I../../libs/t1lib -I./../../libs/t1lib -I../../libs/t1lib/../ 
type1 -I./../../libs/t1lib/../type1 -DPS_GS  -I./gui -I../../libs/ 
t1lib/lib/t1lib -I../kpathsea  -I/opt/local/include  -O2 -arch i386  - 
c psheader.c -o psheader.o
/bin/sh ../libtool --mode=link /usr/bin/gcc-4.0 -o xdvi-xaw.bin -L/ 
opt/local/lib   browser.o dvi-draw.o dvi-init.o dvisel.o encodings.o  
events.o filehist.o font-open.o gf.o hypertex.o image-magick.o mime.o  
my-snprintf.o my-vsnprintf.o pagehist.o pk.o print-internal.o psdps.o  
psgs.o psheader.o psnews.o read-mapfile.o search-internal.o special.o  
string-utils.o tfmload.o util.o vf.o xdvi.o xserver-info.o x_util.o ./ 
gui/libgui.a ../../libs/t1lib/libt1.a ../../libs/t1lib/../type1/ 
libtype1.a  -lXaw -lXmu -lXt -lSM -lICE -lXp -lXext -lX11 -liconv - 
lXpm  ../kpathsea/libkpathsea.la -lm

mkdir .libs
/usr/bin/gcc-4.0 -o xdvi-xaw.bin browser.o dvi-draw.o dvi-init.o  
dvisel.o encodings.o events.o filehist.o font-open.o gf.o hypertex.o  
image-magick.o mime.o my-snprintf.o my-vsnprintf.o pagehist.o pk.o  
print-internal.o psdps.o psgs.o psheader.o psnews.o read-mapfile.o  
search-internal.o special.o string-utils.o tfmload.o util.o vf.o  
xdvi.o xserver-info.o x_util.o  -L/opt/local/lib ./gui/libgui.a ../../ 
libs/t1lib/libt1.a ../../libs/t1lib/../type1/libtype1.a -lXaw -lXmu - 
lXt -lSM -lICE -lXp -lXext -lXpm -lX11 -lXau -lXdmcp -lintl -liconv - 
lc ../kpathsea/.libs/libkpathsea.a -lm

/usr/bin/ld: warning multiple definitions of symbol _XtRemoveTimeOut
events.o definition of _XtRemoveTimeOut in section (__TEXT,__text)
/opt/local/lib/libXt.dylib(single module) definition of _XtRemoveTimeOut
/usr/bin/ld: warning multiple definitions of symbol _XtAddTimeOut
events.o definition of _XtAddTimeOut in section (__TEXT,__text)
/opt/local/lib/libXt.dylib(single module) definition of _XtAddTimeOut
/usr/bin/ld: warning multiple definitions of symbol _XtAppAddTimeOut
events.o definition of _XtAppAddTimeOut in section (__TEXT,__text)
/opt/local/lib/libXt.dylib(single module) definition of _XtAppAddTimeOut
/usr/bin/ld: multiple definitions of symbol _hash_create
/usr/lib/gcc/i686-apple-darwin8/4.0.1/../../../libc.dylib(strhash.So)  
definition of _hash_create
../kpathsea/.libs/libkpathsea.a(hash.o) definition of _hash_create in  
section (__TEXT,__text)

/usr/bin/ld: warning multiple definitions of symbol _vendorShellClassRec
/opt/local/lib/libXt.dylib(single module) definition of  
_vendorShellClassRec
/opt/local/lib/libXaw.dylib(single module) definition of  
_vendorShellClassRec
/usr/bin/ld: warning multiple definitions of symbol  
_vendorShellWidgetClass
/opt/local/lib/libXt.dylib(single module) definition of  
_vendorShellWidgetClass
/opt/local/lib/libXaw.dylib(single module) definition of  
_vendorShellWidgetClass
/usr/bin/ld: warning suggest use of -bind_at_load, as lazy binding  
may result in errors or different symbols being used
symbol _vendorShellWidgetClass used from dynamic library /opt/local/ 
lib/libXt.dylib(single module) not from earlier dynamic library /opt/ 
local/lib/libXaw.7.dylib(single module)
symbol _vendorShellClassRec used from dynamic library /opt/local/lib/ 
libXt.dylib(single module) not from earlier dynamic library /opt/ 
local/lib/libXaw.7.dylib(single module)

collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
make[2]: *** [xdvi-xaw.bin] Error 1
make[1]: *** [all] Error 1
make: *** [all] Error 1

Any help would be appreciated.
Kieren.

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Re: [PATCH] Re: serious doubts about waf

[John Mandereau]

Le mercredi 11 novembre 2009 à 23:36 +, Graham Percival a écrit :
> Hmm.  I don't completely follow, but does this explain why waf
> always succeeds on the second attempt?  If not, it might be
> something weirder... but then again, if you're following it up on
> the waf-user list, then it's no longer my concern.

I can't answer your question, because I haven't worked out the order Waf
executes code, especially what code is called when reading the wscripts
and what code is called when actually building.


> I'll check it out tomorrow.  If it works, I'll spend another few
> hours on waf -- particularly, trying out things that are more
> likely to fail.

If it wasn't likely to be true, I'd suspect some sarcasm here :-)


> If you're willing to follow up on any more cases like this, then I
> think I'll be willing to keep on waffing.

This means being almost completely idle on the academic side (because
learning Italian and new math tools already takes much time), but as my
PhD starts in January I feel like I can afford going for it; it will
make me more aware of Waf code than be productive on wscripts for
LilyPond, but this seems necessary to make those maoing wscripts
actually work.

Best,
John


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Re: serious doubts about waf

[Matthias Kilian]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 02:38:12PM -0800, Patrick McCarty wrote:
> I don't have much experience *using* automake, but from what I've
> read:
> 
>   - A Makefile.am is easier to maintain than an equivalent handcoded
> makefile.
>   - The generated makefiles will be very portable (not reliant on GNU
> make).
>   - Automake integrates well with Autoconf, probably more so than the
> current stepmake system.

One problem with automake (and autoconf) is that it's incredibly
difficult to debug if something goes wrong.

Ciao,
Kili


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Re: [PATCH] Re: serious doubts about waf

[Graham Percival]

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 12:21:47AM +0100, John Mandereau wrote:
> After hours of debugging and code inspection, I think you did nothing
> weird, it's a bug in Waf code: Node.py:Node.find_dir(), which looks up
> directories, call bld.rescan() which among others removes nodes of
> directories that haven't been yet created, like our call to
> bld.path.ensure_dir_node_from_path.

Hmm.  I don't completely follow, but does this explain why waf
always succeeds on the second attempt?  If not, it might be
something weirder... but then again, if you're following it up on
the waf-user list, then it's no longer my concern.

> Does the attached patch convince you to go on on Waf? I'm not going to
> do more Waf advocacy that I already did, because you may rightly accuse
> me of fluffing around :-)

I'll check it out tomorrow.  If it works, I'll spend another few
hours on waf -- particularly, trying out things that are more
likely to fail.


If you're willing to follow up on any more cases like this, then I
think I'll be willing to keep on waffing.

Cheers,
- Graham


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Re: serious doubts about waf

[John Mandereau]

Le mercredi 11 novembre 2009 à 23:07 +, Graham Percival a écrit :
> Given that most of our users are on windows, I defined
> "portability" as "it will run on operating system X with Y extra
> software installed", where X should be large and Y should be
> small.

Then SCons and Waf are reasonable choices in this respect.


> In all
> seriousness, I think that make (possibly including automake) is
> the best build system.  All the "next generation" build systems
> seem to shoot their feet off in various ways... cmake has the
> strictly-defined "open source" (i.e. "closed documentation") as
> well as its own invented scripting language...

Build systems tend to be complicated that specialized scripting
languages are no longer suitable, and I have neither the skills nor the
motivation to extend GNU Make or consorts (cmake) by hacking its source
code.


>  waf has the
> oddities details here...

Waf is not mature, it's kind of experimental, but come on, we already
almost managed to live with another piece of software that has a moving
target in place of a stable API, and you even convinced us to choose it
to output the website in HTML :-)


>  apparently scons is slow, although I
> personally don't care about the speed issue.

I don't care either at the moment, but if we went for Scons we would
probably all sing the same rant like a choir, like "Cygwin is slow!" a
few years ago :-P
(sorry for the wrong analogy between a build system and end-user
software, but I really couldn't help)

Best,
John



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[PATCH] Re: serious doubts about waf

[John Mandereau]

Le mardi 10 novembre 2009 à 23:34 +, Graham Percival a écrit :
> The basic problem is that waf doesn't like to have directories in the
> build tree that aren't present in the source tree.  After asking for
> help, the main author pointed out a not-really-documented function
> that allowed me to create an extra directory:
> 
> http://groups.google.com/group/waf-users/browse_thread/thread/1e3774fdf387e083
> 
> However, this special function doesn't seem to work instantaneously...
> or else I'm doing something really weird in
> Documentation/wscript_build

After hours of debugging and code inspection, I think you did nothing
weird, it's a bug in Waf code: Node.py:Node.find_dir(), which looks up
directories, call bld.rescan() which among others removes nodes of
directories that haven't been yet created, like our call to
bld.path.ensure_dir_node_from_path.

Does the attached patch convince you to go on on Waf? I'm not going to
do more Waf advocacy that I already did, because you may rightly accuse
me of fluffing around :-)

I'm following this up on waf-users too...


> In the discussion (shown in the above link), it turns out that the waf
> API is going to change in version 1.6.  This new version is only in
> the planning stages; no code exists for it... but I'm really starting
> to question if we really want to use waf.  I have to admit that I was
> really shaken by the directory thing.  I assumed that since it was
> python, I could do anything that python could do -- so making
> directories, moves files from directory to directory, etc. would be
> easy.  Apparently not.

It's not easy because custom directories and files management has to be
done in a suitable place in a build system, and as you just discovered
Waf has much less support for this that we'd naturally expect for
building docs the way we want.

Best,
John
Index: wafadmin/Node.py
===
--- wafadmin/Node.py	(révision 6794)
+++ wafadmin/Node.py	(copie de travail)
@@ -276,6 +276,9 @@
 current = prev.childs.get(name, None)
 if current is None:
 	current = self.__class__(name, prev, DIR)
+new_path = os.path.join (prev.name, name)
+if not os.path.isdir (new_path):
+	os.mkdir (new_path)
 		return current
 
 	# FIXME: remove in waf 1.6


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Re: serious doubts about waf

[Graham Percival]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 02:38:12PM -0800, Patrick McCarty wrote:
> On 2009-11-11, Graham Percival wrote:
> > What's the advantage of automake over the current system?  (I'm
> > not even certain what the current system is called!)
> 
> I don't have much experience *using* automake, but from what I've
> read:
> 
>   - A Makefile.am is easier to maintain than an equivalent handcoded
> makefile.

If we were doing this from scratch, I'd definitely push for
makefile.am rather than the stepmake system.  However, we already
have an almost-working stepmake system; at the moment I doubt that
the cost of switching to makefile.am is worth the benefits.

>   - The generated makefiles will be very portable (not reliant on GNU
> make).

Given that most of our users are on windows, I defined
"portability" as "it will run on operating system X with Y extra
software installed", where X should be large and Y should be
small.

Although I'd like to, I can't claim that cygwin (or manually
installing the GNU tools on windows) is a "small Y".


I'm quite annoyed at the build system situation.  In all
seriousness, I think that make (possibly including automake) is
the best build system.  All the "next generation" build systems
seem to shoot their feet off in various ways... cmake has the
strictly-defined "open source" (i.e. "closed documentation") as
well as its own invented scripting language... waf has the
oddities details here... apparently scons is slow, although I
personally don't care about the speed issue.

Cheers,
- Graham


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Re: Tracker 836: Add facility to change output file-name for a \book block

[ian]

Hi all,
Is it O K to push this patch now?

If so, can either Carl or Neil push this on origin/master.

Cheers and thanks for all the help on this one,
Ian

http://codereview.appspot.com/150044


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Re: serious doubts about waf

[Patrick McCarty]

On 2009-11-11, Graham Percival wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 06:36:37PM -0800, Patrick McCarty wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 3:58 PM, Graham Percival
> >  wrote:
> > > On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:34:35PM +, Graham Percival wrote:
> > >> I'm just about ready to give up on waf.
> > >
> > > As Jan put it, "a new build system should be a breath of fresh
> > > air".  I'm not feeling fresh.
> > 
> > Though I haven't been following these discussions very closely, I have
> > looked into automake a little bit.  It sounds like we could make it
> > work.  At least, I think it would simplify makefile maintenance once
> > we have initially set everything up.
> 
> What's the advantage of automake over the current system?  (I'm
> not even certain what the current system is called!)

I don't have much experience *using* automake, but from what I've
read:

  - A Makefile.am is easier to maintain than an equivalent handcoded
makefile.
  - The generated makefiles will be very portable (not reliant on GNU
make).
  - Automake integrates well with Autoconf, probably more so than the
current stepmake system.

> I used to maintain it (and the duplicate qmake build system) for
> marsyas before I got so annoyed at having two build systems and
> switched to cmake.  Given that windows users couldn't use
> automake, I'm not certain it's worth the effort of switching to
> it.

Well, there's always the option of keeping the generated Makefile.in
files alongside the Makefile.am automake files in the source tree.
Then Windows users should be able to build stuff if they have some
incarnation of "make" of their system, since Automake-generated
makefiles do not depend on GNU Make.

-Patrick


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Re: BOM mark from Windows notepad

[Patrick McCarty]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 1:53 PM, Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool)
 wrote:
> It is a regression. BOM was supported for sure.

Have you experienced this problem, too?

-Patrick


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Re: BOM mark from Windows notepad

[Patrick McCarty]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 11:57 AM, Francisco Vila  wrote:
> 2009/11/11 Patrick McCarty :
>> On 2009-11-11, Francisco Vila wrote:
>>> Hello. When LilyPond for Linux encounters a BOM from files made with
>>> the Windows notepad, it issues an error.
>>
>> Has this always been the case, or is this a new issue with 2.13.7?
>
> I vaguely remember it happening from 2005.
>
>>
>>> I think it should continue making the PDF anyway, because the file has
>>> an otherwise correct syntax; what do you think?
>>
>> Yes, definitely.  The BOM is permitted by the UTF-8 spec, so an error
>> should not be issued.
>
> The problem is that young starters receive perfectly detailed
> instructions and they give me working files except for this; it is
> embrassing for me having still to edit their files to produce a PDF in
> my Linux system.  A warning would suffice; is there a way to convert
> an error into a warning?

Not easily.  I'm actually having trouble reproducing this problem on
my Linux system.

The attached LY file was created in Windows Notepad, saved in UTF-8
encoding, and I compiled it on Linux with no errors or warnings.

Do you see an error message when compiling this file?  If so, can you
post the error?

Thanks,
Patrick
\version "2.12.1"

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Re: BOM mark from Windows notepad

[Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool)]

It is a regression. BOM was supported for sure.

Patrick McCarty wrote:

On 2009-11-11, Francisco Vila wrote:
  

Hello. When LilyPond for Linux encounters a BOM from files made with
the Windows notepad, it issues an error.



Has this always been the case, or is this a new issue with 2.13.7?

  

I think it should continue making the PDF anyway, because the file has
an otherwise correct syntax; what do you think?



Yes, definitely.  The BOM is permitted by the UTF-8 spec, so an error
should not be issued.

Thanks,
Patrick


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Re: 8 measures per line

[Matthew]

GODILLON wrote:
How can I reduce the print size 
in order to print 
8 measures per line instead of 4 .
  

Try
#(set-global-staff-size XX) where XX is your staff size; default = 20 see:
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.12/Documentation/user/lilypond/Setting-the-staff-size#Setting-the-staff-size
Hope that helps
Herbert


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8 measures per line

[GODILLON]

How can I reduce the print size 
in order to print 
8 measures per line instead of 4 .
Thanck you .
Odile Godillon



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Re: BOM mark from Windows notepad

[Francisco Vila]

2009/11/11 Patrick McCarty :
> On 2009-11-11, Francisco Vila wrote:
>> Hello. When LilyPond for Linux encounters a BOM from files made with
>> the Windows notepad, it issues an error.
>
> Has this always been the case, or is this a new issue with 2.13.7?

I vaguely remember it happening from 2005.

>
>> I think it should continue making the PDF anyway, because the file has
>> an otherwise correct syntax; what do you think?
>
> Yes, definitely.  The BOM is permitted by the UTF-8 spec, so an error
> should not be issued.

The problem is that young starters receive perfectly detailed
instructions and they give me working files except for this; it is
embrassing for me having still to edit their files to produce a PDF in
my Linux system.  A warning would suffice; is there a way to convert
an error into a warning?

-- 
Francisco Vila. Badajoz (Spain)
www.paconet.org
www.csmbadajoz.com


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Re: BOM mark from Windows notepad

[Patrick McCarty]

On 2009-11-11, Francisco Vila wrote:
> Hello. When LilyPond for Linux encounters a BOM from files made with
> the Windows notepad, it issues an error.

Has this always been the case, or is this a new issue with 2.13.7?

> I think it should continue making the PDF anyway, because the file has
> an otherwise correct syntax; what do you think?

Yes, definitely.  The BOM is permitted by the UTF-8 spec, so an error
should not be issued.

Thanks,
Patrick


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Re: Fixing issue 800 (extender ending early if other voices present)

[Chris Snyder]

>> 1) Change melisma_busy() to return true if in the middle of a note
>> 2) Alternatively, add the check in
>> Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep instead
>
> I'm confused: isn't the current check in
> Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep?

For solution #2, I meant that we can add a check in 
Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep to see if we're in the 
middle of a note, in addition to the melisma_busy() call (since 
melisma_busy() doesn't currently do such a check).


Chris Snyder
Adoro Music Publishing
1-616-828-4436 x800
http://www.adoromusicpub.com



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Re: Fixing issue 800 (extender ending early if other voices present)

[Joe Neeman]

On Wed, 2009-11-11 at 10:33 -0500, Chris Snyder wrote:
> I've done some work towards fixing issue 800, and at least now 
> understand what's happening:
> 
> The patch that introduced the bug added a check in 
> Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep() to check if the current 
> voice was in the middle of a melisma (calling melisma_busy(voice) ) and, 
> if not, completizing the extender. This fixed the neverending-extender 
> bug, but introduced issue 800.
> 
> The reason that this is happening is not simply because there's another 
> voice, but specifically because of the rhythm in the second voice: 
> Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep() is called after the 
> second beat in the measure, while the first voice is in the middle of 
> the dotted quarter-note. At this point, melisma_busy() returns false - 
> it apparently doesn't know how to handle being in the middle of a note.
> 
> It seems to me that there are two possible ways to address this:
> 
> 1) Change melisma_busy() to return true if in the middle of a note
> 2) Alternatively, add the check in 
> Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep instead

I'm confused: isn't the current check in
Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep?




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BOM mark from Windows notepad

[Francisco Vila]

Hello. When LilyPond for Linux encounters a BOM from files made with
the Windows notepad, it issues an error.

I think it should continue making the PDF anyway, because the file has
an otherwise correct syntax; what do you think?


-- 
Francisco Vila. Badajoz (Spain)
www.paconet.org
www.csmbadajoz.com


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Re: Google displays 2.9 doc

[Jan Nieuwenhuizen]

Op woensdag 11-11-2009 om 17:25 uur [tijdzone +], schreef Graham
Percival:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 01:12:26PM +0100, Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool) wrote:
> > can something be done to make Google display latest doc and not 2.9?
> 
> It's a known bug in the issue tracker.  Patches appreciated.

Apparently the +v2.12 has been removed again.  It is still present in
some of the language directories.

Fixed and uploaded.

Greetings,
Jan.

-- 
Jan Nieuwenhuizen  | GNU LilyPond - The music typesetter
Avatar®: http://AvatarAcademy.nl| http://lilypond.org



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Re: Google displays 2.9 doc

[Graham Percival]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 01:12:26PM +0100, Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool) wrote:
> can something be done to make Google display latest doc and not 2.9?

It's a known bug in the issue tracker.  Patches appreciated.

Cheers,
- Graham


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Fixing issue 800 (extender ending early if other voices present)

[Chris Snyder]

I've done some work towards fixing issue 800, and at least now 
understand what's happening:


The patch that introduced the bug added a check in 
Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep() to check if the current 
voice was in the middle of a melisma (calling melisma_busy(voice) ) and, 
if not, completizing the extender. This fixed the neverending-extender 
bug, but introduced issue 800.


The reason that this is happening is not simply because there's another 
voice, but specifically because of the rhythm in the second voice: 
Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep() is called after the 
second beat in the measure, while the first voice is in the middle of 
the dotted quarter-note. At this point, melisma_busy() returns false - 
it apparently doesn't know how to handle being in the middle of a note.


It seems to me that there are two possible ways to address this:

1) Change melisma_busy() to return true if in the middle of a note
2) Alternatively, add the check in 
Extender_engraver::stop_translation_timestep instead


Any guidance on which approach is preferable? Thanks.

--
Chris Snyder
Adoro Music Publishing
1-616-828-4436 x800
http://www.adoromusicpub.com


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Re: Fixes issue 786, "Extenders in lyrics stop prematurely if a single underscore is found."

[csnyder]

I've uploaded a patch that reverts the "fix" for issue 800, as it
reintroduced the neverending-extender bug. I also added some comments in
the code as requested.

http://codereview.appspot.com/150067


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Re: chord names in piano staff

[Kieren MacMillan]

Guten tag, Henrik:

In addition to the [correct] answer already given, I thought you  
should know that



r1 | r1 | r1 | r1 | \break


should be

  R1 | R1 | R1 | R1

(i.e., uppercase R).

Hope this helps!
Kieren.


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Re: Google displays 2.9 doc

[Jan Nieuwenhuizen]

Op woensdag 11-11-2009 om 13:12 uur [tijdzone +0100], schreef Bertalan
Fodor (LilyPondTool):

> can something be done to make Google display latest doc and not 2.9?

Use the search box on lilypond.org, it adds

   +v2.12 +site:lilypond.org

At least, it should do that.

Greetings,
Jan -- who remembers adding and re-adding this several times,
   something seems to eat this

-- 
Jan Nieuwenhuizen  | GNU LilyPond - The music typesetter
Avatar®: http://AvatarAcademy.nl| http://lilypond.org



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Google displays 2.9 doc

[Bertalan Fodor (LilyPondTool)]

Hi,

can something be done to make Google display latest doc and not 2.9?

Thanks,

Bert



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Re: serious doubts about waf

[Graham Percival]

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 06:36:37PM -0800, Patrick McCarty wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 3:58 PM, Graham Percival
>  wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:34:35PM +, Graham Percival wrote:
> >> I'm just about ready to give up on waf.
> >
> > As Jan put it, "a new build system should be a breath of fresh
> > air".  I'm not feeling fresh.
> 
> Though I haven't been following these discussions very closely, I have
> looked into automake a little bit.  It sounds like we could make it
> work.  At least, I think it would simplify makefile maintenance once
> we have initially set everything up.

What's the advantage of automake over the current system?  (I'm
not even certain what the current system is called!)

I used to maintain it (and the duplicate qmake build system) for
marsyas before I got so annoyed at having two build systems and
switched to cmake.  Given that windows users couldn't use
automake, I'm not certain it's worth the effort of switching to
it.

Cheers,
- Graham


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Re: Build failure on OS X 10.6: libguile missing

[Jan Nieuwenhuizen]

Op dinsdag 10-11-2009 om 23:38 uur [tijdzone +0100], schreef Harmath
Dénes:

> checking GUILE rational bugfix... ok

>From this message, it seems that the right Guile installation is
found.

However, as these earlier messages show,

> checking for scm_boot_guile in -lguile... no
> checking for scm_boot_guile... no

something is wrong with scm_boot_guile detection.

The thing to do here would be to look at config.log, figure out
what is going wrong, device a fix, test it, and send us a patch.
However, considering you did not know yet about config.log,
this may be a long road for you ;-)  Consider that you may
have to read /a lot/ of documentation and gain some experience
to get past errors that are more sublte.

Greetings,
Jan.

-- 
Jan Nieuwenhuizen  | GNU LilyPond - The music typesetter
Avatar®: http://AvatarAcademy.nl| http://lilypond.org



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chord names in piano staff

[henrik pantle]

hi,

i wonder where to find the solution for my problem.
i guess a lot of others do too.

i want the chord names above the piano staff:


guitarChords = \chordmode { c1 | c | c | c | f | f | c | c | g | f | c | g }

upper = \relative c' { 
\clef treble 
\key c \major 
\time 4/4

r1 | r1 | r1 | r1 | \break
r1 | r1 | r1 | r1 | \break
r1 | r1 | r1 | r1  \bar "|." 

}


lower = \relative c, { 
\clef bass 
\key c \major 
\time 4/4 

c4-5 e-3 g-2 a-1 | b-3 a-1 g-2 e-3 | c4 e g a | b4 a g e | 

f4 a c d | es4 d c a | c,4 e g a | b4 a g e |

g4 h d e |  f4 a c d | c e f fis | f e c b



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