Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 8:07 AM, Graham Percival wrote: > I like the content of the announcement. > > I still don't like the idea of manually editing index.html. I was > expecting/hoping for something like > > Documentation/web/twits.txt: > - > The Ensemble 101 is going on a European tour where they'll sing > music typeset using LilyPond. Click \href=\"http://www.ensemble101.fr\";>here to learn more! > - > The Birmingham Amateur Theatre is presenting "Penzance Pirates", > starring our documentation editor Trevor Daniels as the talking lion![1] > - > Project manager Graham Percival has successfully defended his PhD > thesis. Only two days of edits left to go before he hands in the > final version![2] > - > Valentin is trying soy milk with his cereal. Still on the fence > about it.[3] > - > > and then the javascript would parse that file. I'm not picky > about the file format (it could be "each line is a separate > announcement; lines can be up to 256 chars long" since that's > probably easier to handle in javascript). +1 On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 9:54 AM, Trevor Daniels wrote: > Amazingly, there's an element of truth in it. Read Bicester for > Birmingham, though. I'm nearing the end of typesetting a new vocal score > for a musical pantomime based on Sullivan's music > from the Savoy operas. It has 19 musical numbers, all with > original words. It will be performed next November. Oh, and it has a > talking dragon rather than a lion, but probably not played > by me, although I have played Samuel twice in Pirates. lol! Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
I heart this response. =) K. On 2012-Apr-26, at 03:54, Trevor Daniels wrote: > Graham Percival wrote Thursday, April 26, 2012 7:07 AM > >> The Birmingham Amateur Theatre is presenting "Penzance Pirates", >> starring our documentation editor Trevor Daniels as the talking lion![1] > >> [1] this is (probably) not true. > > Amazingly, there's an element of truth in it. Read Bicester for > Birmingham, though. I'm nearing the end of typesetting a new vocal score for > a musical pantomime based on Sullivan's music > from the Savoy operas. It has 19 musical numbers, all with > original words. It will be performed next November. Oh, and it has a > talking dragon rather than a lion, but probably not played > by me, although I have played Samuel twice in Pirates. > > Trevor ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
Graham Percival wrote Thursday, April 26, 2012 7:07 AM The Birmingham Amateur Theatre is presenting "Penzance Pirates", starring our documentation editor Trevor Daniels as the talking lion![1] [1] this is (probably) not true. Amazingly, there's an element of truth in it. Read Bicester for Birmingham, though. I'm nearing the end of typesetting a new vocal score for a musical pantomime based on Sullivan's music from the Savoy operas. It has 19 musical numbers, all with original words. It will be performed next November. Oh, and it has a talking dragon rather than a lion, but probably not played by me, although I have played Samuel twice in Pirates. Trevor ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
I like the content of the announcement. I still don't like the idea of manually editing index.html. I was expecting/hoping for something like Documentation/web/twits.txt: - The Ensemble 101 is going on a European tour where they'll sing music typeset using LilyPond. Click http://www.ensemble101.fr\";>here to learn more! - The Birmingham Amateur Theatre is presenting "Penzance Pirates", starring our documentation editor Trevor Daniels as the talking lion![1] - Project manager Graham Percival has successfully defended his PhD thesis. Only two days of edits left to go before he hands in the final version![2] - Valentin is trying soy milk with his cereal. Still on the fence about it.[3] - and then the javascript would parse that file. I'm not picky about the file format (it could be "each line is a separate announcement; lines can be up to 256 chars long" since that's probably easier to handle in javascript). [1] this is (probably) not true. [3] this is (definitely) not true. [2] joke blantly stolen from Canadian politics. Also, probably not true. - Graham On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 11:28:59AM +, m...@mikesolomon.org wrote: > Why wouldn't this be a general solution? I think that anyone who wants > to add an announcement would have to: > > a) Add an entry to the array. > b) Build the website and make sure that their entry fits. > > Also, in the most recent patchset I've changed my text to get rid of the > kickstarter bit. I'll change the issue names as well. > > http://codereview.appspot.com/6068045/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
On 2012/04/25 11:25:02, Graham Percival wrote: First, editing embedded javascript is not a general solution. Second, I'm not at all certain we want to have commercial announcements in that area. I'm sorry if I gave the impression that this was to be a green light for any kind of announcement. Why wouldn't this be a general solution? I think that anyone who wants to add an announcement would have to: a) Add an entry to the array. b) Build the website and make sure that their entry fits. Also, in the most recent patchset I've changed my text to get rid of the kickstarter bit. I'll change the issue names as well. http://codereview.appspot.com/6068045/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
First, editing embedded javascript is not a general solution. Second, I'm not at all certain we want to have commercial announcements in that area. I'm sorry if I gave the impression that this was to be a green light for any kind of announcement. http://codereview.appspot.com/6068045/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
On 2012/04/19 22:25:17, mike_apollinemike.com wrote: The real-estate value of the upper right corner of http://lilypond.org is huge. Currently it is unexploited property, just sitting there. If there are people who can offer LilyPond-friendly exchanges for it that fulfill the criteria of (1) bringing value to LilyPond; and (2) not compromising the integrity of the page or of LilyPond's status as free software, then I think it is absolutely essential that LilyPond cultivate its real estate to this end. Otherwise, it is wasted potential. "Wasted potential" is another name for "we don't want to go there". If you take a look at, say, http://www.ardour.org>, you have an integrated frontpage advertisement for proprietary software tying into Ardour. The main programmer of Ardour (which in itself is free software) receives a percentage of sales of the advertised proprietary software. Now for better or worse, LilyPond is not a "Mike" project, or a "Graham" project, or a "David" project. It is a GNU project. We don't have an "official money sink" for LilyPond. We do have a page pointing out how to contribute or donate to LilyPond development. Its discoverability is debatable. I point out there what kind of work can be sponsored by paying me for it. I would certainly not object (and it would certainly be ridiculous if I did) if you pointed out your availability to work on the engraving backend for pay. It is actually something where I don't contribute significantly: my own focus is not as much on increasing the amounts of things one can achieve with LilyPond, but rather how much one can achieve without being clever. But "visit our concerts, pay entrance, keep the ensemble alive and I'll probably contribute more" is not actually appropriate there, either. It is not an offer, but a speculation and a story. That's fine for publishing in a lot of places, including the LilyPond Report, and I encourage you doing so. It is certainly more newsworthy than "LilyPond programmer for hire", and you should milk that for what it is worth. But the LilyPond _project_ pages are not the right milking machine here in my opinion. Of course, we have pages where we point out compositions and other uses of LilyPond (I remember some recent additions in that area): I don't think that you could be refused equal coverage there. http://codereview.appspot.com/6068045/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
On Apr 19, 2012, at 7:10 PM, Graham Percival wrote: > On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 04:40:08PM +0200, David Kastrup wrote: >> mts...@gmail.com writes: >> >>> We have a sweet plug in the project video for GNU LilyPond and I was >>> wondering if I could strike up a partnership with LilyPond to put a link >>> to the project on the LilyPond front page for the duration of the >>> Kickstarter fundraising drive (30 days). > > No. Fair 'nuf! I definitely don't want this to be an issue, so I rescind my request. However, now that it is rescinded and I have no direct interest anymore, I still stand by what I said and really think people should not shy away from the logic I'm putting forward. The real-estate value of the upper right corner of lilypond.org is huge. Currently it is unexploited property, just sitting there. If there are people who can offer LilyPond-friendly exchanges for it that fulfill the criteria of (1) bringing value to LilyPond; and (2) not compromising the integrity of the page or of LilyPond's status as free software, then I think it is absolutely essential that LilyPond cultivate its real estate to this end. Otherwise, it is wasted potential. Cheers, MS ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 04:40:08PM +0200, David Kastrup wrote: > mts...@gmail.com writes: > > > We have a sweet plug in the project video for GNU LilyPond and I was > > wondering if I could strike up a partnership with LilyPond to put a link > > to the project on the LilyPond front page for the duration of the > > Kickstarter fundraising drive (30 days). No. > I probably should be the last person to complain, but I would consider > that inappropriate. I don't think you should be the last person to complain -- after careful discussion and negotiation, we settled on having a "sponsoring" page under community. A proposal to have a personal, non-lilypond-specific, advertizement on the main website page goes far beyond that. In some ways I think you should be the *first* person to complain! > What I would suggest is that you write up a short article about your > tour and your use of LilyPond, mention the Kickstarter campaign, and > publish the article in the next LilyPond Report. +1 that's what we made David do. You have the added advantage that if Valentin is dragging his heels on the report, you can track him down and physically force him to release it. You're bigger than him. :) - Graham ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
>Message: 5 >Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 17:52:18 +0200 >From: "m...@apollinemike.com" >To: David Kastrup >Cc: mts...@gmail.com, re...@codereview-hr.appspotmail.com, > lilypond-devel@gnu.org >Subject: Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045) >Message-ID: <5c9ccceb-e21a-4209-8cc8-d47b2899b...@apollinemike.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >On Apr 19, 2012, at 4:40 PM, David Kastrup wrote: > >> mts...@gmail.com writes: >> >>> Reviewers: , >>> >>> Message: >>> Hey all, >>> >>> My ensemble is launching a Kickstarter project in a day or two to >>> support our tour in France and Ireland. >>> >>> We have a sweet plug in the project video for GNU LilyPond and I was >>> wondering if I could strike up a partnership with LilyPond to put a link >>> to the project on the LilyPond front page for the duration of the >>> Kickstarter fundraising drive (30 days). >> >> I probably should be the last person to complain, but I would consider >> that inappropriate. >> The benefit for LilyPond is rather indirect: > >There are three benefits: > >1) Imagine it like part of the bounty program. I don't cash in on bounties >because I devote all my time to my career in the arts, but this career in the >arts needs to succeed in order for me to devote the time I do. That's indirect and ambiguous; your own success doesn't guarantee nor even make likely more time for you to work on bounties. If you want to be fair, promise a certain amount of the proceeds to be added to the bounty amount for whatever it is you think you'd work on if success for you happens to lead to more time to work on Lilypond. Then if your own success happens to lead to less dev time, Lilypond still benefits _directly_ by having increased bounty amounts. -Jonathan ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
On Apr 19, 2012, at 4:40 PM, David Kastrup wrote: > mts...@gmail.com writes: > >> Reviewers: , >> >> Message: >> Hey all, >> >> My ensemble is launching a Kickstarter project in a day or two to >> support our tour in France and Ireland. >> >> We have a sweet plug in the project video for GNU LilyPond and I was >> wondering if I could strike up a partnership with LilyPond to put a link >> to the project on the LilyPond front page for the duration of the >> Kickstarter fundraising drive (30 days). > > I probably should be the last person to complain, but I would consider > that inappropriate. > The benefit for LilyPond is rather indirect: There are three benefits: 1) Imagine it like part of the bounty program. I don't cash in on bounties because I devote all my time to my career in the arts, but this career in the arts needs to succeed in order for me to devote the time I do. Part of this success is linked to donations, and the LilyPond site is an avenue that can lead to the getting of those donations. 2) Everywhere we go we propose talks and workshops on score making. So while LilyPond itself doesn't gain a benefit as in (1) above, people know more about it, which can't hurt. 3) In the video we're using (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsC6asiyEew) there's a big fat I <3 LilyPond. This is bound to be seen by 500-1000 people who know nothing about LilyPond. > basically every publisher or composer or user using LilyPond would have > similar grounds for comparable wishes, and we would have our front page > drowned in ads if we were to heed them. > With respect to the three points above: 1) The ads should not be paying and should be a community decision by the developers to support a worthy cause that somehow feeds back into LilyPond. If there's a developer or user whose LilyPond related project can benefit from the work they put into LilyPond, I for one would be happy to spread the word about it. 2) The project being promoted should link back into LilyPond somehow - not just "I use LilyPond" but "I use and I promote LilyPond." 3) We'd want said person to link back into LilyPond for the ad to be worthwhile running via their site or their ad, which is what my video does. I don't think we should go over 1 ad at a time, so there's no drowning. It's purely a question of choice. For example, Janek is currently applying to GSoC and there is another candidate who applied for LilyPond stuff as well. Either of them would stand to gain $5000ish from participating, which is huge. Only one of them will get chosen, and the LilyPond community has had no problem sorting out internally which project is most worthwhile. People can propose patches if they want the real-estate on the site which will be pushed or not depending on what people think. It is a great way for LilyPond to help those who help LilyPond and to benefit from the deal as well. > What I would suggest is that you write up a short article about your > tour and your use of LilyPond, mention the Kickstarter campaign, and > publish the article in the next LilyPond Report. You can then flaunt > that issue of the LilyPond Report to whatever music and/or computer news > sites you wish, and thus get a combined tour/LilyPond exposure to the > degree you find yourself willing on working on distribution. I think it > should be possible to time the next issue in a manner where it > reasonably agrees with your tour dates. > I am going to be sending hundreds of e-mails around flaunting the kickstarter site. The few forums where I won't be able to spread the word about Kickstarter and would need to talk about it obliquely via the LilyPond report won't get much traffic. I know that the LilyPond report is read (I read every issue!), but I doubt this'd have 1/100th of the effect that something on the main website would have. I remember that one of the reasons I didn't download LilyPond early on was because I didn't associate it with living music projects. I think that the rubric on the website w/ LilyPond projects is great, but I think it'd be even better to feature them on the front page. Like these sites: http://www.python.org/ (right corner) http://www.blender.org/ (the mango project, also on the right) http://www.appcelerator.com/ (the bottom of the page) These things pull me into the site - they certainly don't push me away. Of course, one can cite many differences between all of these projects and LilyPond. But I don't think these differences are prohibitive or impinge upon my logic.I think that this can set up a great precedent: if throwing something like this up on the LilyPond site winds up paying off for my ensemble AND sending new people to the lilypond site AND sending the message to people who want this real-estate "hey, if you want to get your project promoted, you better be promoting us and while your at it how bout some beam quanting code?", this seems like a win win win. Obviously
Re: 30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
mts...@gmail.com writes: > Reviewers: , > > Message: > Hey all, > > My ensemble is launching a Kickstarter project in a day or two to > support our tour in France and Ireland. > > We have a sweet plug in the project video for GNU LilyPond and I was > wondering if I could strike up a partnership with LilyPond to put a link > to the project on the LilyPond front page for the duration of the > Kickstarter fundraising drive (30 days). I probably should be the last person to complain, but I would consider that inappropriate. The benefit for LilyPond is rather indirect: basically every publisher or composer or user using LilyPond would have similar grounds for comparable wishes, and we would have our front page drowned in ads if we were to heed them. What I would suggest is that you write up a short article about your tour and your use of LilyPond, mention the Kickstarter campaign, and publish the article in the next LilyPond Report. You can then flaunt that issue of the LilyPond Report to whatever music and/or computer news sites you wish, and thus get a combined tour/LilyPond exposure to the degree you find yourself willing on working on distribution. I think it should be possible to time the next issue in a manner where it reasonably agrees with your tour dates. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
30 day webathon for kickstarter support (issue 6068045)
Reviewers: ,
Message:
Hey all,
My ensemble is launching a Kickstarter project in a day or two to
support our tour in France and Ireland.
We have a sweet plug in the project video for GNU LilyPond and I was
wondering if I could strike up a partnership with LilyPond to put a link
to the project on the LilyPond front page for the duration of the
Kickstarter fundraising drive (30 days). In return, I'd be glad to fix
a couple bounty items (my lack of development time in recent months has
come from the fact that I've been spending all my time on composing and
fundraising).
This patch is more or less what I'd need. I can change the layout based
on whatever people think is best. Currently, the spot for the ensemble
is towards the top of the page and the downloads are horizontally
aligned with the news.
This partnership would be a huge boost for my ensemble and I don't think
it'd divert any € that'd otherwise be going to LilyPond. I'll certainly
do my best to make sure that the tour promotes the software.
Cheers,
MS
Description:
30 day webathon for kickstarter support
Please review this at http://codereview.appspot.com/6068045/
Affected files:
M Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css
M Documentation/web.texi
Index: Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css
diff --git a/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css
b/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css
index
e5bf19280dd47d3533d0566051b95ebfe9b11206..806efe58687ea948f857680badce0be58e2760bb
100644
--- a/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css
+++ b/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css
@@ -473,7 +473,16 @@ div.news-item {
div#latestVersion {
position: absolute;
- top: 12.4em;
+ top: 16em;
+ right: 0;
+ width: 12em;
+ text-align: center;
+ border-left: 1px solid #5b7f64;
+}
+
+div#ensembleCinq {
+ position: absolute;
+ top: 0.0em;
right: 0;
width: 12em;
text-align: center;
@@ -488,6 +497,14 @@ div#latestVersion {
margin: 0;
}
+#ensembleCinq .subheading {
+ background: #5b7f64;
+ color: #fff;
+ text-align: center;
+ padding: 0 0.5em;
+ margin: 0;
+}
+
/* this might not work in certain browsers */
a[name="Stable"] + h4 {
background: #bdee9d url(../pictures/color1-bg.png) repeat-x top left;
Index: Documentation/web.texi
diff --git a/Documentation/web.texi b/Documentation/web.texi
index
b0e2b8311ad0794e729b2f3bda1a64956140364b..daa73b88d68267176ed5e59db9c2f08271f2ca02
100644
--- a/Documentation/web.texi
+++ b/Documentation/web.texi
@@ -150,6 +150,18 @@ Read more in our @ref{Introduction}!
@end ifclear
@ifset web_version
@c make the box:
+@divId{ensembleCinq}
+@subheading Ensemble 101
+
+The Ensemble 101 is going on a European tour where they'll sing
+music typeset using LilyPond. Click @uref{http://www.ensemble101.fr, here}
+to learn more and to help them out on Kickstarter!
+
+@divEnd
+@end ifset
+
+@ifset web_version
+ @c make the box:
@divId{latestVersion}
@subheading Quick links
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