Re: PATCH: Lyrics break estimation of vertical spacing

2010-04-22 Thread Joe Neeman
On Wed, 2010-04-21 at 20:37 -0400, Boris Shingarov wrote:
> What makes me really depressed about the situation with pure-height, is 
> that we have fixed a number of "reasonable" bugs in this area 
> (intersystem begin/rest, overridden stem length, deprecated space, 
> padding of markup -- these are the ones that I did in the immediate 
> past, -- the slur fix from Joe yesterday, and I also recall a bunch of 
> other fixes in this area in the last few months), but we are not only 
> not closer to having reasonable trouble-free page layout, but starting 
> to look at page overfill/underfill problems which are very deeply 
> rooted in the nature of pure-height estimation. 
> 
> So much so that I am starting to think that sacrificing the benefit of 
> linebreaking/pagebreaking integration in the sake of always running 
> real (non-pure) height, would be the path to having a reasonable layout 
> for our book.  That is, calculate the line breaks disregarding page 
> breaking; calculate tallness of all lines; then run the page breaking 
> algorithm. 
>  

You are welcome to add a variable in the paper block to allow this sort
of behaviour. It used to be that setting system-count would fall back to
non-estimated heights, but people complained (see bug 325) because it
stopped vertical stretching from happening, which is a deal-breaker for
orchestral and choral scores. You also wouldn't be able to get good page
turns (which was my original motivation for integrating the page- and
line-breaking).

You might want to modify the page-breaker to accept skylines. As far as
I remember, the page-breaker has always been extent-based (even when
those extents were not estimated) whereas the page layout is
skyline-based, so it can space things more tightly.

Cheers,
Joe




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Re: PATCH: Lyrics break estimation of vertical spacing

2010-04-21 Thread Boris Shingarov

What makes me really depressed about the situation with pure-height, is
that we have fixed a number of "reasonable" bugs in this area
(intersystem begin/rest, overridden stem length, deprecated space,
padding of markup -- these are the ones that I did in the immediate
past, -- the slur fix from Joe yesterday, and I also recall a bunch of
other fixes in this area in the last few months), but we are not only
not closer to having reasonable trouble-free page layout, but starting
to look at page overfill/underfill problems which are very deeply
rooted in the nature of pure-height estimation.

So much so that I am starting to think that sacrificing the benefit of
linebreaking/pagebreaking integration in the sake of always running
real (non-pure) height, would be the path to having a reasonable layout
for our book.  That is, calculate the line breaks disregarding page
breaking; calculate tallness of all lines; then run the page breaking
algorithm.
 
 
 
 
 
 



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Re: PATCH: Lyrics break estimation of vertical spacing

2010-04-21 Thread Boris Shingarov



On Wed, 21 Apr 2010 20:37:52 -0400, Boris Shingarov  wrote:

not closer to having reasonable trouble-free page layout, but starting

 > to look at page overfill/underfill problems which are very deeply
 > rooted in the nature of pure-height estimation.

I meant Bug 1061 in particular.
 



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