Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 10:19 PM, Julien Rioux jri...@physics.utoronto.ca wrote: On 16/03/2012 4:45 PM, Janek Warchoł wrote: On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 6:53 PM, Carl Sorensenc_soren...@byu.edu wrote: On 3/16/12 11:44 AM, no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com wrote: Thank you for submitting LilyPond organization application to Google Summer of Code 2012. Unfortunately, we were unable to accept your organization's application at this time. We received many more applications for the program than we are able to accommodate, and we would encourage you to reapply for future instances of the program. Best regards, Google Open Source Programs As you can see, we did not qualify for GSOC this year. No!! :( :( :( That's all they wrote? No feedback on our application anywhere? There should be a possibility to email/chat with them about the application process and how they come to this decision. This would be the best indication for next year. Damn, we missed the IRC session dedicated for that! (friday, 23rd of March) It was mentioned here http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/events/google/gsoc2012 but not here http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2012/faqs#timeline - that's why i missed it. I don't understand why Google didn't mention it in the rejection message. :/ Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 3:49 AM, Han-Wen Nienhuys hanw...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/3/20 Łukasz Czerwiński milimet...@gmail.com: Can you share your thoughts? Lilypond would never be useful for Google products. There is absolutely no point for Google to pay for code that would never be useful for them. The point of GSOC is not to improve google products. See also: http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2011/faqs#goals I suppose that Łukasz (along with some other people that i've talked with) finds it hard to believe that Google does something that doesn't have to bring measurable profit :) Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com writes: On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 3:49 AM, Han-Wen Nienhuys hanw...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/3/20 Łukasz Czerwiński milimet...@gmail.com: Can you share your thoughts? Lilypond would never be useful for Google products. There is absolutely no point for Google to pay for code that would never be useful for them. The point of GSOC is not to improve google products. See also: http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2011/faqs#goals I suppose that Łukasz (along with some other people that i've talked with) finds it hard to believe that Google does something that doesn't have to bring measurable profit :) It certainly does bring measurable profit. It makes Google a cool company, and that means you get highly qualified and motivated people. Google is a company built around advertising, image and perception. As is its stock value. I think it is also encouraged of employees to work on one project of one's liking per week rather than on company business. That seems like it would carry a higher burden than the whole GSoC enterprise. Open Source proponents try to liken successful distributors of free software to the bottled water business. Google, in contrast, excels at bottling hot air and making that fly. Which is actually still more substantial than controlling the dispersion of bottled promises (bank notes), nowadays done mostly without the bottles (namely as electronic bank transfers, making it possible for, say, Icelandic banks to deal with many more promises than they could actually bottle). -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On 16 March 2012 21:45, Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com wrote: Can you share your thoughts? Lilypond would never be useful for Google products. There is absolutely no point for Google to pay for code that would never be useful for them. Łukasz ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
Łukasz Czerwiński milimet...@gmail.com writes: On 16 March 2012 21:45, Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com wrote: Can you share your thoughts? Lilypond would never be useful for Google products. There is absolutely no point for Google to pay for code that would never be useful for them. A music search that pops up the first few bars? Quick indexing of the musical content of videos or midi files? Excerpting of Finale files and similar that are free from rendering rights of Finale? Playalong scores for Youtube movies, possibly after uploading the corresponding Midi? -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
2012/3/20 Łukasz Czerwiński milimet...@gmail.com: Can you share your thoughts? Lilypond would never be useful for Google products. There is absolutely no point for Google to pay for code that would never be useful for them. The point of GSOC is not to improve google products. See also: http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2011/faqs#goals -- Han-Wen Nienhuys - han...@xs4all.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
Carl Sorensen c_soren...@byu.edu writes: On 3/16/12 11:44 AM, no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com wrote: Thank you for submitting LilyPond organization application to Google Summer of Code 2012. Unfortunately, we were unable to accept your organization's application at this time. We received many more applications for the program than we are able to accommodate, and we would encourage you to reapply for future instances of the program. Best regards, Google Open Source Programs As you can see, we did not qualify for GSOC this year. Perhaps the following mail from an internal list for GNU maintainers helps. From: jema...@gnu.org (Jose E. Marchesi) Subject: [gnu-prog-discuss] GNU got accepted in SoC 2012 Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 22:08:42 +0100 (11 hours, 7 minutes, 44 seconds ago) Hi hackers. The GNU Project was accepted as an organization in the Google Summer of Code 2012. We just filled the organization form so we would appear in the melange site. Several GNU programs applied separately as organizations. In case some of them were not accepted they are welcome to add their projects/idea under the umbrella of the GNU Project. Just send an email with the information (or a link to your ideas page) to summer-of-c...@gnu.org and we will update the general ideas page. -- Jose E. Marchesi http://www.jemarch.net GNU Project http://www.gnu.org ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 10:39 PM, Julien Rioux jri...@physics.utoronto.ca wrote: On 16/03/2012 5:16 PM, Julien Rioux wrote: There are a few organisations interesting for lilypond hackers: inkscape (to learn about svg), closure (to learn a scheme-like language), buildbot (could be helpful but we already have the gran unified builder). libreoffice (improve the lilypond plugin), wikimedia (lilypond plugin again) thanks a lot for these suggestions, Julien! We're going to be added to GNU umbrella, but i'm considering applying to one of the projects you mentioned, too. Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 05:53:57PM +, Carl Sorensen wrote: On 3/16/12 11:44 AM, no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com wrote: Unfortunately, we were unable to accept your organization's application at this time. If we are serious about doing this next year, I think we need to develop a stronger website around GSOC. As I read the requirements, it appears to me that to be competitive we need to have a more fully-developed infrastructure. If we really want to do this, we should probably start talking about next year now. It might be good to wait a week to see what projects were accepted, then compare our current GSoC website to theirs. What do they have that we lack? There are obviously things like previous GSoC history, publicity in general, usefulness and appeal to a wide range of users, but what differences are there on the project websites themselves? That said, I think that improving our development infrastructure in general is always a good thing, and there are many ways this can be improved if/when people want to work on it. - Graham ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 6:53 PM, Carl Sorensen c_soren...@byu.edu wrote: On 3/16/12 11:44 AM, no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com wrote: Thank you for submitting LilyPond organization application to Google Summer of Code 2012. Unfortunately, we were unable to accept your organization's application at this time. We received many more applications for the program than we are able to accommodate, and we would encourage you to reapply for future instances of the program. Best regards, Google Open Source Programs As you can see, we did not qualify for GSOC this year. No!! :( :( :( That's all they wrote? No feedback on our application anywhere? If we are serious about doing this next year, I think we need to develop a stronger website around GSOC. As I read the requirements, it appears to me that to be competitive we need to have a more fully-developed infrastructure. If we really want to do this, we should probably start talking about next year now. I agree. As i was in the middle of the whole thing, i suppose i don't have enough perspective; the only thing that comes to my mind at the moment is that our CG is a bit messy and he patch procedures should be more automated and unified, and the whole process described more clearly than it is now. Can you share your thoughts? On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 7:37 PM, Graham Percival gra...@percival-music.ca wrote: It might be good to wait a week to see what projects were accepted, http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2012 ? no cheers this time :( Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 09:45:05PM +0100, Janek Warchoł wrote: On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 6:53 PM, Carl Sorensen c_soren...@byu.edu wrote: If we are serious about doing this next year, I think we need to develop a stronger website around GSOC. As I read the requirements, it appears to me that to be competitive we need to have a more fully-developed infrastructure. I agree. As i was in the middle of the whole thing, i suppose i don't have enough perspective; FWIW, I think it's something like 20% of project applications are accepted. the only thing that comes to my mind at the moment is that our CG is a bit messy and he patch procedures should be more automated and unified, and the whole process described more clearly than it is now. Can you share your thoughts? That's pretty much it. I'd split it into a few separate tasks, though: 1. what are the pain points involved in experienced developers contributing to lilypond? Fix those first -- making it a more fun process might keep experienced developers around longer, but also anything that bugs us is likely to annoy or confuse new contributors. git-cl is the biggest contender here, along with patch management in general. 2. does the CG accurately reflect our current process? hint: it doesn't. The quick start description is flawed (there's something off about the printed stuff about lily-git.tcl), and even chapter 1 is inaccurate (it suggests that we have a mentoring program, which frankly we don't). 3. once the above two points are nailed down -- which will likely take 3-6 months -- *then* I think it's worth inviting/begging somebody new to start contributing as a programmer, *with* a dedicated mentor who will specifically find+fix pain points in that process. On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 7:37 PM, Graham Percival gra...@percival-music.ca wrote: It might be good to wait a week to see what projects were accepted, http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2012 ? Somebody on another venue pointed out that it'll take a few hours or days for the complete list to show up; at that time, it was only showing the first 30% of accepted projects. - Graham ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On 16/03/2012 4:54 PM, Graham Percival wrote: On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 7:37 PM, Graham Percival gra...@percival-music.ca wrote: It might be good to wait a week to see what projects were accepted, http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2012 ? Somebody on another venue pointed out that it'll take a few hours or days for the complete list to show up; at that time, it was only showing the first 30% of accepted projects. It's only showing projects that have filled up their landing page on google-melange.com There are a few organisations interesting for lilypond hackers: inkscape (to learn about svg), closure (to learn a scheme-like language), buildbot (could be helpful but we already have the gran unified builder). -- Julien ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On 16/03/2012 4:45 PM, Janek Warchoł wrote: On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 6:53 PM, Carl Sorensenc_soren...@byu.edu wrote: On 3/16/12 11:44 AM, no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com no-re...@google-melange.appspotmail.com wrote: Thank you for submitting LilyPond organization application to Google Summer of Code 2012. Unfortunately, we were unable to accept your organization's application at this time. We received many more applications for the program than we are able to accommodate, and we would encourage you to reapply for future instances of the program. Best regards, Google Open Source Programs As you can see, we did not qualify for GSOC this year. No!! :( :( :( That's all they wrote? No feedback on our application anywhere? There should be a possibility to email/chat with them about the application process and how they come to this decision. This would be the best indication for next year. -- Julien ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
Carl, On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 10:19 PM, Julien Rioux jri...@physics.utoronto.ca wrote: There should be a possibility to email/chat with them about the application process and how they come to this decision. who shall do this - you or me? Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: FW: [LilyPond] Your organization application has been rejected.
On 16/03/2012 5:16 PM, Julien Rioux wrote: There are a few organisations interesting for lilypond hackers: inkscape (to learn about svg), closure (to learn a scheme-like language), buildbot (could be helpful but we already have the gran unified builder). libreoffice (improve the lilypond plugin), wikimedia (lilypond plugin again) -- Julien ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
