Re: Suppressing TextSpanner right boundary text at a system break

[James Harkins]

 On Thu, 20 Sep 2018 01:17:57 +0800  wrote 
 
> From: foxfanfare
>  
> James Harkins-4 wrote 
> > I have many text spanners with text for both the left and right bounds. 
> >  
> > If a spanner crosses a system break, I would like the right-hand text to 
> > be hidden at the end of the first system. 
>  
> I think you'll have to play with "right-broken" and "left-broken". 
>   \override TextSpanner.bound-details.right-broken.text = ##f 

That's exactly it. Thanks!

Would be useful as a snippet perhaps... this totally eluded me in the manual. I 
tried to find info about bound-details but missed it somehow.

hjh


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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Br. Samuel Springuel]

On 9/19/18 6:23 PM, Urs Liska wrote:
Do you have any concerns about the limitations with regard to the use of 
the Score Wizard for the Score Wizard's use case too?


The limitations I was worried about were related to the lack of variety 
of the glyphs involved in the preview.  When it comes to previewing a 
layout, variety in glyphs isn't really necessary.  When it comes to 
picking a font, it is.  The whole point of the standard "quick brown 
fox" sentence for previewing text fonts is that it includes every letter 
in the English language.  While such coverage is probably impossible for 
a music font (which would contain a whole lot more glyphs), one does 
need to see a range of the available glyphs in order to make an informed 
choice.  What you demonstrated had much better variety and the ability 
to provide a custom template file would enable a user interested in 
particular glyphs to make sure they show up.


Now that I think about it, there is one limitation which affects the 
Score Wizard use case: length of the preview.  The preview music in the 
Score Wizard is limited to 2 measures or 10 notes (of the beat length), 
whichever is shorter (not counting the pickup note, if present).  This 
makes for a nice short preview, but it never shows what happens after a 
line break.  Having the ability to have a longer preview would be 
helpful when dealing with those settings which have an effect on the 
second line, but not the first (say, instrument names).


--
✝✝
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(R. Padraic Springuel)
St. Anselm’s Abbey
4501 South Dakota Ave, NE
Washington, DC, 20017
202-269-2300
(c) 202-853-7036

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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Aaron Hill]

On 2018-09-19 3:21 pm, Urs Liska wrote:

Am 19.09.2018 um 19:27 schrieb Karlin High:

On 9/19/2018 12:17 PM, Urs Liska wrote:

you can see a very preliminary version of the font preview.


(APPLAUSE)

Came through great in Thunderbird here. Very effective demo in a 126KB 
GIF.


Indeed, I like this tool very much: https://github.com/phw/peek very
easy to use, and the results are particularly efficient for this kind
of presentation, without the need for any configuration.


And for us few Windows folks around here, I can recommend ScreenToGif 
(https://www.screentogif.com/) as a free and open-source tool for the 
same task.


-- Aaron Hill

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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Urs Liska]

Am 19.09.2018 um 19:38 schrieb foxfanfare:

Urs Liska-3 wrote

In a nutshell (would take too long to explain in detail)

   * Significantly improve the "Show available fonts" dialog that so far
 only shows the pretty uncomprehensible LilyPond log:
   o Display real family names, grouped and sorted, with actual-font
 preview
   o Allow filtering by typing in a line edit.
   * Show all music fonts that are "installed" for the given LilyPond
 installation. The preview is what I'm asking about in this thread.
   * Remove music fonts from the current LilyPond installation
   * (Recursively) "Install" music fonts from a directory by linking them
 into the LilyPond installation
   * Planned: Select text and music fonts and generate the corresponding
 code to insert in the document


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Sounds very promising :) I didn't know Frescobaldi was still in development!


To be honest, it is "in development" but only very intermittently. You 
can see the sobering truth here: 
https://github.com/wbsoft/frescobaldi/graphs/contributors. Right now I'm 
in a rush to get through with a few of my long-standing wishes and 
ideas, but I can't tell how long that will last. Actually we've just 
started discussing an outline to a set of exciting new functions that 
will hopefully add significant usability improvements and lead to a 3.1 
release in the not-too-distant future.


But at the core is that we should urgently have at least one, better two 
or three fresh developers who can spend some sort of continued 
contribution (of course I'm not talking about full-time committment). 
Any referrals to forums where such people could be found or to concrete 
persons would be very welcome.


Best
Urs

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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Urs Liska]

Am 19.09.2018 um 19:46 schrieb Br. Samuel Springuel:
I was in the process of noting the limitations of the Score Wizard 
preview and how they made it less useful for a font preview when your 
preliminary demo came through.  Since I think the preliminary demo is 
great and addresses my concerns, I'm scrapping that post just to say I 
like where the demo is going.


Do you have any concerns about the limitations with regard to the use of 
the Score Wizard for the Score Wizard's use case too? If so please share 
them, here or on the issue tracker. Chances will never be as good again 
as right now that they might be addressed ;-)


Urs


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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Urs Liska]

Am 19.09.2018 um 19:27 schrieb Karlin High:

On 9/19/2018 12:17 PM, Urs Liska wrote:

you can see a very preliminary version of the font preview.


(APPLAUSE)

Came through great in Thunderbird here. Very effective demo in a 126KB 
GIF.


Indeed, I like this tool very much: https://github.com/phw/peek very 
easy to use, and the results are particularly efficient for this kind of 
presentation, without the need for any configuration.



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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Br. Samuel Springuel]

I was in the process of noting the limitations of the Score Wizard 
preview and how they made it less useful for a font preview when your 
preliminary demo came through.  Since I think the preliminary demo is 
great and addresses my concerns, I'm scrapping that post just to say I 
like where the demo is going.

--
✝✝
Br. Samuel, OSB
(R. Padraic Springuel)
St. Anselm’s Abbey
4501 South Dakota Ave, NE
Washington, DC, 20017
202-269-2300
(c) 202-853-7036

PAX ☧ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ

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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[foxfanfare]

Urs Liska-3 wrote
> In a nutshell (would take too long to explain in detail)
> 
>   * Significantly improve the "Show available fonts" dialog that so far
> only shows the pretty uncomprehensible LilyPond log:
>   o Display real family names, grouped and sorted, with actual-font
> preview
>   o Allow filtering by typing in a line edit.
>   * Show all music fonts that are "installed" for the given LilyPond
> installation. The preview is what I'm asking about in this thread.
>   * Remove music fonts from the current LilyPond installation
>   * (Recursively) "Install" music fonts from a directory by linking them
> into the LilyPond installation
>   * Planned: Select text and music fonts and generate the corresponding
> code to insert in the document
> 
> 
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Sounds very promising :) I didn't know Frescobaldi was still in development!




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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Karlin High]

On 9/19/2018 12:17 PM, Urs Liska wrote:

you can see a very preliminary version of the font preview.


(APPLAUSE)

Came through great in Thunderbird here. Very effective demo in a 126KB GIF.
--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

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Re: Suppressing TextSpanner right boundary text at a system break

[foxfanfare]

James Harkins-4 wrote
> Apologies if this is a basic question. I've searched but I didn't find the
> answer.
> 
> I have many text spanners with text for both the left and right bounds.
> 
> If a spanner crosses a system break, I would like the right-hand text to
> be hidden at the end of the first system.
> 
> The spanner represents an instruction for computer ensemble performance:
> at the left bound, begin transitioning to the next state; at the right
> bound, you should have arrived but not before.
> 
> Currently I'm getting "arrive" printed to the right of the last bar line
> of the system break. The performers should not arrive at this point! The
> score is misleading if it suggests that performers should have arrived at
> the end of the system.
> 
> I searched the manual and didn't find it. An LSR search for "spanner"
> finds a technique that is supposed to hide the spanner /line/ after a
> break (not what I want). I haven't found anything about controlling
> boundary text visibility.
> 
> Thanks,
> hjh
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Hi,

I think you'll have to play with "right-broken" and "left-broken".

Maybe this would help:

\version "2.19.81"

\new Staff \relative c'' {
  
  \override TextSpanner.bound-details.left.text = 
\markup { \small \bold Start }

  \override TextSpanner.bound-details.right.text = 
\markup { \small \bold STOP! }
  \override TextSpanner.bound-details.left-broken.text = ##f
  \override TextSpanner.bound-details.right-broken.text = ##f
  
  c\startTextSpan d e f 
  \break 
  g a b c 
  d1\stopTextSpan
  
}



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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Urs Liska]

Am 19.09.2018 um 18:11 schrieb foxfanfare:

tisimst wrote

My 2 cents...

A font preview is a font preview and the best, in my opinion, are those
that show something in a practical context. In this case, an image of a
single or grand staff showing 2-3 bars of a marginally interesting looking
passage would be much more representative of what actual music would look
like than a simple string or matrix of glyphs, though there's nothing
wrong
with that either.

I totally agree with that. I also find better to choose a font in a musical
context.
Exactly like for a text font, one cannot see how it works if you see it
glyph by glyph, you need to see words, sentences, paragraphs...
Urs, the preview you sent looks very interesting, may I ask what this will
be achieving exactly?


In a nutshell (would take too long to explain in detail)

 * Significantly improve the "Show available fonts" dialog that so far
   only shows the pretty uncomprehensible LilyPond log:
 o Display real family names, grouped and sorted, with actual-font
   preview
 o Allow filtering by typing in a line edit.
 * Show all music fonts that are "installed" for the given LilyPond
   installation. The preview is what I'm asking about in this thread.
 * Remove music fonts from the current LilyPond installation
 * (Recursively) "Install" music fonts from a directory by linking them
   into the LilyPond installation
 * Planned: Select text and music fonts and generate the corresponding
   code to insert in the document

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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[foxfanfare]

tisimst wrote
> My 2 cents...
> 
> A font preview is a font preview and the best, in my opinion, are those
> that show something in a practical context. In this case, an image of a
> single or grand staff showing 2-3 bars of a marginally interesting looking
> passage would be much more representative of what actual music would look
> like than a simple string or matrix of glyphs, though there's nothing
> wrong
> with that either.

I totally agree with that. I also find better to choose a font in a musical
context. 
Exactly like for a text font, one cannot see how it works if you see it
glyph by glyph, you need to see words, sentences, paragraphs...
Urs, the preview you sent looks very interesting, may I ask what this will
be achieving exactly?




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Re: Latest lilypond stable release?

[H. S. Teoh]

On Wed, Sep 19, 2018 at 01:53:38AM +0200, Simon Albrecht wrote:
> On 19.09.2018 01:46, H. S. Teoh wrote:
> > According to the website (lilypond.org), the latest stable release
> > is 2.18.2, and the unstable release is 2.19.82.
> > 
> > However, I've been using the latest version from git, and it claims
> > to be version 2.21.0.  So, what happened to 2.20.*?  Why does the
> > git version claim to be 2.21.0?
> > 
> > More pertinently, what version should I be using on the \version
> > line?
> 
> 2.19.82 is already a prerelease for 2.20.0, since we’re in the process
> leading up to this next stable release. IIUC, this is why the git
> version is called 2.21.0, because only some of the changes applied now
> will still make it into the stable release and most will be 2.21
> material.  It is customary for those who compile from current master
> to use a 2.21.0 version statement indeed.
[...]

Ah, that explains it.  Thanks!


T

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Suppressing TextSpanner right boundary text at a system break

[James Harkins]

Apologies if this is a basic question. I've searched but I didn't find the 
answer.

I have many text spanners with text for both the left and right bounds.

If a spanner crosses a system break, I would like the right-hand text to be 
hidden at the end of the first system.

The spanner represents an instruction for computer ensemble performance: at the 
left bound, begin transitioning to the next state; at the right bound, you 
should have arrived but not before.

Currently I'm getting "arrive" printed to the right of the last bar line of the 
system break. The performers should not arrive at this point! The score is 
misleading if it suggests that performers should have arrived at the end of the 
system.

I searched the manual and didn't find it. An LSR search for "spanner" finds a 
technique that is supposed to hide the spanner /line/ after a break (not what I 
want). I haven't found anything about controlling boundary text visibility.

Thanks,
hjh



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Re: Sample document to show music fonts

[Urs Liska]

Am 19.09.2018 um 01:20 schrieb Abraham Lee:

Hi, Urs!
On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 4:46 PM Urs Liska > wrote:




Am 18.09.2018 um 21:08 schrieb Aaron Hill:
> On 2018-09-18 4:58 am, Andrew Bernard wrote:
>> Hi Urs,
>>
>> I would like to set the glyph set as per Abraham Lee's foundry
website:
>>
>> https://www.musictypefoundry.com/product/mtf-cadence
>>
>> Much rather this than a piece of music. Any sample of music will be
>> irrelevant to some large subset of people. For example, my new
>> complexity
>> stuff would just annoy people, and I don't want to see a sample of
>> Brahms
>> (no disrespect to Brahms!!).
>>
>> Perhaps you could put music examples on a separate website, not
in the
>> program.
>>
>> On Tue, 18 Sep 2018 at 20:52, Urs Liska mailto:li...@openlilylib.org>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm looking for a nice template document that can be used to
>>> demonstrate
>>> a music font. It should not be too "heavy", and ideally it
would show
>>> off the font at a glance within the space seen in the attached
>>> screenshot.
>
> Another idea: make it customizable.  I doubt there is ever going
to be
> a one-size-fits-all preview template for fonts.  Of course, it's
more
> work to support this, but providing you are shelling out to
LilyPond
> behind the scenes to render the preview live, then allowing the
> end-user to provide a custom template would address concerns from
> folks who work in more esoteric branches of notation.

Although compelling I think this would be over the top.
a) if someone wants to see music fonts with specific music they can
simply use an existing or create a new document and test the fonts
with it.
b) These sample documents will usually not be generated live but are
cached, so in 95% of the cases (except the first time a new font is
installed) an existing PDF will be loaded.

So I think I'll go with the suggestion to create some sort of "glyph
matrix", showing the font elements without context.

I think the updated dialog will be used much more regularly than the
previous one, not only because the available (music but especially
text)
fonts are now nicely listed and displayed, but also because it will
additionally provide the tools to *select* fonts (i.e. create the
appropriate LilyPond code).


My 2 cents...

A font preview is a font preview and the best, in my opinion, are 
those that show something in a practical context. In this case, an 
image of a single or grand staff showing 2-3 bars of a marginally 
interesting looking passage would be much more representative of what 
actual music would look like than a simple string or matrix of glyphs, 
though there's nothing wrong with that either. I agree that trying to 
make it a "live" preview is not worth it until LilyPond can be made to 
run "live".


That's what I would prefer to see. Take that for what it's worth.


This gives me the idea that it might be the most straightforward and 
most consistent approach could be to actually use the code that creates 
the Score Wizard Preview sample scores.


Urs



Best,
Abraham


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Re: I'm sorry I feel stupid asking so many questions. How do I make fingering go OUTSIDE of the staff?

[foxfanfare]

tripleamia wrote
> I know you have the note-fingering but when i do this it goes inside the 
> staff and it looks crowded and ugly. Is there any way I can make it go 
> outside?
> 
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By default, the fingerings should be outside the staff:

\new Staff \relative c { 
  g-1 a-1 b-1 c-1 d-1 e-1 f-1 
  g-1 a-1 b-1 c-1 d-1 e-1 f-1 
  \override Fingering.direction = #-1
  g-1 a-1 b-1 c-1 d-1 e-1 f-1
  g-1 a-1 b-1 c-1 d-1 e-1 f-1 }

The only case it could happend to be inside it, is when you use fingerings
within a chord: < a-1 >.
You'd have then to set the fingeringOrientations as shown by Aaron. But this
would work by default: < a >-1



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