Re: Gis major key signature; Lily's key signature algorithm

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 08.02.2018 01:08, schrieb Urs Liska:

Am 07.02.2018 um 22:56 schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:
If you use equally tempered scale f♭ major is really identical with e 
major. (That is not true in just tempered tuning.) May be with my 
limited knowledge of music I misunderstood something?


Maybe you should start sudying music as an artistic and historical
matter instead of just an abstract or mathematical model.



Schwanengesang has 4 ♭s. Concerning to the circle of fifth that is f 
minor or a♭ major. That is not the same as f♭ major as mentioned in 
the original mail?


If you can't even tell if that song is in a flat major or f minor you
shouldn't even start discussing this.
Apart from that I already explained that this song's main key is a
flat major and that it moves on to reach f flat minor (as a sudominant
to c flat major) at a certain moment.

My point was that this f flat minor seventh chord is really f flat
minor and not e minor.



If one is doing functional harmony and stacking thirds, indeed f minor 
and a♭ major it is different, producing different chord progressions 
because starting with f or with a♭ major respectively. So the 
Schwanengaesang needs some investigation and harmonic analysis to make 
clear the used key, f minor and a♭ major. Skilled musicians (I am not) 
might do that.


To give some beginner-level hints: The song starts with an a flat
major chord, ends with an a flat major chord, and has a key signature
of four flats. So adventurous spirits might consider putting a bet on
one out of the two candidates.



If one is only playing the notes of the sheet is this really 
important?




YES!



Not in equally tempered scale. All that feelings of keys refer to the 
historic tunings. And by the way, do you know that Bachs 
"Wohltemperierte Klavier" was written just to show how awfull that 
sounds in the ears of musicians of taht time? (I heard that in my side 
studies to physics in the Music Academie and you find that theory on the 
net as well.)



To prevent myself from senseless discussions as a music hobbyist I will 
ignore future discussions of the experts. I do not think that makes 
sense on the basis of equally tempered scale that disturbes any musical 
feelings. Therefor I like string quartets!





Am 07.02.2018 22:18, schrieb Urs Liska:

Am 07.02.2018 um 21:13 schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

You mention f♭? Then you get a double ♭!
"
{\key fes \major c d e}

You go better with

{\key e \major c d e}

That double crosses and double ♭s happen frequently if you 
transcripe music. in this cases it's better to use the circle of 
fifth/fourth, however you might call it.




Wow, quite a bold statement, given that we have no clue about the
historical context of the original poster's question.
I'd always argue that depending on the style (actually most European
music from the 18th until far into the 20th century) E major is 
worlds

apart from Fes major (and with "worlds" I really mean heaven/earth,
life/death, dream/reality, whatever you want).

My favourite example is in Schubert's song Schwangesang D 744
(http://imslp.org/wiki/Schwanengesang,_D.744_(Schubert,_Franz) ).
The song is in a flat major, then turns to the darker mood of the
variant a flat minor and its parallel c flat major (both six flats)
and then reaches an absolute anticlimax on the word "auflösend"
(meaning: life is dissolving) on the minor subdominant: a fes minor
seventh chord (=> <fes' asas' ces'' eses''> in LilyPond language)!
There's no way this could ever make sense in e minor.
But what makes even *less* sense is the helpless rendering of the
original edition:  (the d even being "resolved" to des).

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Re: Gis major key signature; Lily's key signature algorithm

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I had a look at the sheet music and found it's f minor. As I alredy 
mentioned f minor is different from fb major.


Am 07.02.2018 22:36, schrieb Urs Liska:

Am 07.02.2018 um 22:18 schrieb Urs Liska:


My favourite example is in Schubert's song Schwangesang D 744
(http://imslp.org/wiki/Schwanengesang,_D.744_(Schubert,_Franz) [1]
).
The song is in a flat major, then turns to the darker mood of the
variant a flat minor and its parallel c flat major (both six flats)
and then reaches an absolute anticlimax on the word "auflösend"
(meaning: life is dissolving) on the minor subdominant: a fes minor
seventh chord (=>  in LilyPond language)!
There's no way this could ever make sense in e minor.
But what makes even *LESS* sense is the helpless rendering of the
original edition:  (the d even being "resolved" to
des).


 As a further reference, showing the composer's original intention,
the manuscript:
http://schubert-online.at/activpage/manuskripte.php?top=1_id=10149=allewerke
[2]


Links:
--
[1] http://imslp.org/wiki/Schwanengesang,_D.744_%28Schubert,_Franz%29
[2]
http://schubert-online.at/activpage/manuskripte.php?top=1werke_id=10149herkunft=allewerke

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Re: Gis major key signature; Lily's key signature algorithm

[Blöchl Bernhard]

If you use equally tempered scale f♭ major is really identical with e 
major. (That is not true in just tempered tuning.) May be with my 
limited knowledge of music I misunderstood something?


Schwanengesang has 4 ♭s. Concerning to the circle of fifth that is f 
minor or a♭ major. That is not the same as f♭ major as mentioned in the 
original mail?


If one is doing functional harmony and stacking thirds, indeed f minor 
and a♭ major it is different, producing different chord progressions 
because starting with f or with a♭ major respectively. So the 
Schwanengaesang needs some investigation and harmonic analysis to make 
clear the used key, f minor and a♭ major. Skilled musicians (I am not) 
might do that.


If one is only playing the notes of the sheet is this really important?



Am 07.02.2018 22:18, schrieb Urs Liska:

Am 07.02.2018 um 21:13 schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

You mention f♭? Then you get a double ♭!
"
{\key fes \major c d e}

You go better with

{\key e \major c d e}

That double crosses and double ♭s happen frequently if you transcripe 
music. in this cases it's better to use the circle of fifth/fourth, 
however you might call it.




Wow, quite a bold statement, given that we have no clue about the
historical context of the original poster's question.
I'd always argue that depending on the style (actually most European
music from the 18th until far into the 20th century) E major is worlds
apart from Fes major (and with "worlds" I really mean heaven/earth,
life/death, dream/reality, whatever you want).

My favourite example is in Schubert's song Schwangesang D 744
(http://imslp.org/wiki/Schwanengesang,_D.744_(Schubert,_Franz) ).
The song is in a flat major, then turns to the darker mood of the
variant a flat minor and its parallel c flat major (both six flats)
and then reaches an absolute anticlimax on the word "auflösend"
(meaning: life is dissolving) on the minor subdominant: a fes minor
seventh chord (=> <fes' asas' ces'' eses''> in LilyPond language)!
There's no way this could ever make sense in e minor.
But what makes even *less* sense is the helpless rendering of the
original edition:  (the d even being "resolved" to des).

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Fwd: Re: Gis major key signature; Lily's key signature algorithm

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Add on: I remember, that the brass and reed instruments always wanted 
keys with minor signs. They have flaps to lower the tone a half step but 
not to raise it  I argue that might be the reason for such "strange" 
keys from the perspective of other instrumentalists?


 Originalnachricht 
Betreff: Re: Gis major key signature; Lily's key signature algorithm
Datum: 07.02.2018 21:13
Von: Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net>
An: lilypond-user@gnu.org

You mention f♭? Then you get a double ♭!
"
{\key fes \major c d e}

You go better with

{\key e \major c d e}

That double crosses and double ♭s happen frequently if you transcripe 
music. in this cases it's better to use the circle of fifth/fourth, 
however you might call it.



Am 07.02.2018 20:31, schrieb Richard M:

This discrepancy is actually what led to my question. Why does
LilyPond notate it one way, while this image shows another? (My
research has shown at the image you provided was custom made in
MuseScore.)

Although G♯ major is enharmonic to A♭, there are still pieces that
use these "theoretical" key signatures (one brass quintet piece is
actually in F♭), and I'm wondering if there's an official source
that determines how they are to be notated.

On 02/07/2018 02:19 PM, Ben wrote:


On 2/7/2018 1:47 PM, Richard M wrote:


Hello, list,

how does LilyPond create the key signature for Gis major?

I've attached a file to compile the key signature, which results
in: C#, G#, D#, A#, E#, B#, and Fx. It is interesting to me that
the key signature begins with C#, and the Fx is placed at the end.


I'm wondering if there's a resource the developers used (perhaps
a notation manual) that gave a rule for how key signatures with
double accidentals should be formatted.


Hi,

What about this Wikipedia image showing the key signature order of
sharps + double?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G-sharp_major#/media/File:G-sharp-major_e-sharp-minor.png

[2]

...it looks like the double sharp is in the right spot, but even
still, could you just use the more common - enharmonic key of A♭
MAJOR instead?

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[2]
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Re: Gis major key signature; Lily's key signature algorithm

[Blöchl Bernhard]

You mention f♭? Then you get a double ♭!
"
{\key fes \major c d e}

You go better with

{\key e \major c d e}

That double crosses and double ♭s happen frequently if you transcripe 
music. in this cases it's better to use the circle of fifth/fourth, 
however you might call it.



Am 07.02.2018 20:31, schrieb Richard M:

This discrepancy is actually what led to my question. Why does
LilyPond notate it one way, while this image shows another? (My
research has shown at the image you provided was custom made in
MuseScore.)

Although G♯ major is enharmonic to A♭, there are still pieces that
use these "theoretical" key signatures (one brass quintet piece is
actually in F♭), and I'm wondering if there's an official source
that determines how they are to be notated.

On 02/07/2018 02:19 PM, Ben wrote:


On 2/7/2018 1:47 PM, Richard M wrote:


Hello, list,

how does LilyPond create the key signature for Gis major?

I've attached a file to compile the key signature, which results
in: C#, G#, D#, A#, E#, B#, and Fx. It is interesting to me that
the key signature begins with C#, and the Fx is placed at the end.


I'm wondering if there's a resource the developers used (perhaps
a notation manual) that gave a rule for how key signatures with
double accidentals should be formatted.


Hi,

What about this Wikipedia image showing the key signature order of
sharps + double?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G-sharp_major#/media/File:G-sharp-major_e-sharp-minor.png

[2]

...it looks like the double sharp is in the right spot, but even
still, could you just use the more common - enharmonic key of A♭
MAJOR instead?

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[2]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G-sharp_major#/media/File:G-sharp-major_e-sharp-minor.png

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Re: endless tab?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 06.02.2018 03:15, schrieb Andrew Bernard:

Hi bb,

Do you simply want 17/16? I use times like this very often. Just use
time 17/16 and you will get barlines.



Thank you! This is a possibilty if one really wants 17/16. I do not. But 
lilypond does not serve the sloppy user perfectly from using such 
constructs inattentively - lilypond could do!



But I think you are algorithmically generating the notes and
durations, in which case, why can't you also generate the /time
commands for each section where you want a particular time signature?




My hand written pieces often change time sig every bar, and with any
sort of signature you like - lilypond handles that just fine, and
places barlines as expected. I use 15/16 commonly. Not a problem. And
in fact I hide the time signatures (for reasons not relevant to this
topic) so you can do that too if you want, and still have barlines.


For this case I think it's better to \omit the bar check.



This is a deeply nested thread so it's hard to read. Apologies if I
have entirely missed the point!



It is always good to exchange ideas and discuss about.


Andrew



Let me add a third experiment:
\version "2.19.80"
\relative c ''{ d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a
#gis a b c d  e f g a b c
}


and a fourth experiment:
\version "2.19.80"
\relative c ''{ d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a
d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a
d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a
}

I find it remarkable that warnings arise "one bar later". I would 
understand this behaviour , if the first bar is not completed and there 
is missing something to fill the bar - bit in this case lilypond is not 
seting a bar line. Butt remeber that the first bar is overstuffed by 
1/16.



Thanks for your mail and regards.



Again old arguments. Imagine two experiments:


Case 1: I set an arbitrary bar (the manual calls it "bar check")
version "2.19.80"
relative { d''4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis | }
That enables lilypond to checking the bar content and tells me in
this case that the check failed ...
17/16 is > 4/4

Case 2: lilypond is setting the barline on the same position
(wrong/critcal, however you might call it)
version "2.19.80"
relative { d''4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis  }
The bar content is 17/16>4/4 again and tells NOTHING!
As there is set a barline lilypond can check the bar content and

Nobody has explained me why in this case lilypond should not be
able to use its algorithm to find 17/16 ? The algorithm is existing
- use it for this as well!


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Re: endless tab?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 04.02.2018 23:56, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

On 04.02.2018 14:19, bb wrote:
It is not really endless but the tab does not have any line break. If 
I try to insert \break this will be ignored? There must be something 
wrong with my code I cannot figure out?


Thanks for help

\version "2.19.80"
    \new TabStaff {
    \set TabStaff.tablatureFormat = 
#fret-number-tablature-format-banjo

 \set TabStaff.stringTunings = #banjo-open-g-tuning
    %\set TabStaff.stringTunings = #(four-string-banjo 
banjo-c-tuning)


   \tabFullNotation
   \stemDown
 cis'''16\1 c'''16.\1 b''8\1 ais''8.\1 a''4\1 gis''4.\1 g''2\1 
fis''2.\1 f''1\1 e''1.\1 dis''\1 d''\1 cis''\1 c''\1 b'\1 ais'\1 a'\1 
gis'\1 g'\1 fis'\1 f'\1 e'\1 dis'\1 d'\1 g'\3 ais''\2 a''\2 e'\3 g''\2 
fis''\2 f''\2 e''\2 dis''\2 d''\2 cis''\2 c''\2 b'\2 ais'\2 a'\2 
gis'\2 g'\2 fis'\2 f'\2 e'\2 dis'\2 d'\2 cis'\2 c'\2 b\2 g'\3 fis'\3 
f'\3 e'\3 dis'\3 d'\3 cis'\3 c'\3 b\3 ais\3 a\3 gis\3 g\3 d'\4 cis'\4 
c'\4 b\4 ais\4 a\4 gis\4 g\4 fis\4 f\4 e\4 dis\4 d\4 d\4 dis\4 e\4 f\4 
fis\4 g\4 gis\4 a\4 ais\4 b8\4 < c'\4 cis'\4 d'\4 >4 < g''\5 gis''\5 
a''\5 ais''\5 >8     }


First, that’s gruesome code formatting. Use line breaks to make your
code readable by splitting it into chunks that one may sensibly grasp.
Second, use bar checks in order to find rhythmic typos/errors.
Third, if you want breaks mid-note, use \remove 
"Forbid_line_break_engraver".


Best, Simon


This code is generated automaticly, nice isn't it?

The editor preset of frescobaldi is NOT to wrap long text. Change it if 
you are annoyed.


The question of lilypond setting barlines or not automaticly is still 
open in my opinion.  Lilypond is a nice program but does not use its 
intelligence perfectly for the good of the user.


Beside: There is spread a rumour on the list that I want lilypond to 
override my settings if wrong or not. But indeed I like to get informed 
by a warning etc.


I would appreciate the code David Kastrup sent me referred to this 
"gruesome code" (thanks) becoming part of lilypond standard to get such 
a message to help dummy users as myself.


Regards

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Re: duration longer than meter?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

A misunderstanding, sorry. Chopin etc was not MY argument. It was one in 
the thread Thomas Morley thankfully referred to

http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/turning-a-blind-eye-to-dotted-note-td209224.html
setting me on his "black list". One of many arguments (Thomas Hämmerle, 
correct, not to query:
"Situations like my tuplet example (even with tuplet bracket/beam 
crossing a
barline) can be found in Chopin's works among others, *so notes 
stretching
over barlines are, albeit rare, absolutely possible* and not necessarily 
a

"mistake". "
I know that hangers as I had a student pianist friend as studied (not 
music).
There is an interesting list 
https://music.stackexchange.com/questions/25562/help-with-interpreting-notation-in-chopins-nocturne-op-9-no-2.
There are some more, Tchaikowsky and others, mostly errors of the 
editors!

---

But to repeat and to correct the perspective, my basic question kept 
unanswered and I do not want to repeat vain discussions again, it does 
not make sense!


For short:
Why does not message me lilypond a warning (or something else) if I do 
this?

 \relative c'' {
 d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis
 }

I can work on i. e.
 \relative c'' {
 d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis a b c
 }
No problem for lilypond! That is beyond my understanding, to long and 
fro black list.


That was the start of the thread Thomas Morley referred to above. 
Slightly connected to the question "duration longer than meter?" Isn't 
it?



Regards



Am 03.02.2018 21:22, schrieb Noeck:

Hi Bernhard,


refer to examples of Chopin and Tschaikowsky ...


Do you have an example for that?

You can do anything that makes sense in terms of music:

- two voices at the same time may look like more notes than fit the
  measure (as in the case of this thread).
- If it is unmetered music, you can use \cadenzaOn … \cadenzaOff
- If the meter changes without indication, you can \omit the
  TimeSignature and still have correct measure lengths.
- If it is a implicit triplet or other tuplets you can use \tuplet or
  \times.

I have never seen anything that does not fall into these categories.
Have you?

Best,
Joram

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Re: duration longer than meter?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Tricky! Thanks! Might help in some (filthy) notation situations.

Am 03.02.2018 20:58, schrieb Stefano Troncaro:

Hi Vivyan. 

Although others have already pointed out that in this example you'll
be better off using simultaneous voices, I'll answer your original
question by saying that Lilypond allows you to modify the length of a
note. For example: e2.*1/3 will show a dotted half-note while
occupying one third of that duration, meaning it will take the same
space as a quarter note. 

This being said, I have to emphasize that I would not advise you
engrave this measure in this way, and use different voices instead.

I hope you find that useful,
Stéfano

On Feb 3, 2018 16:46, "Simon Albrecht"  wrote:


On 03.02.2018 20:14, Vivyan wrote:


This excerpt is from Gymnopedie which is in 3/4 but still, this
notation is
involved. I'm just trying to write it into lilypond.


Perhaps you should learn how to read music before copying it.

Best, Simon

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Re: duration longer than meter?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Please check
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/multiple-voices.html
If you are new to lilypond, on the bottom you can change the language of 
the manual.


Am 03.02.2018 19:08, schrieb Vivyan:
I need these notes to fit within the same meter? How can I stop 
lilypond from

pushing the notes out?

lower = \relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 3/4

e2. 4

}



--
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Re: duration longer than meter?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Agree!

But there are some exceptions concerning measures, refer to examples of 
Chopin and Tschaikowsky ... Great names! But the still unanswered 
question is how to notate that with lilypond. Not a a complain, but a 
serious question.



Am 03.02.2018 20:23, schrieb N. Andrew Walsh:

Bernhard, I'm not sure to what your first statement refers, but
regarding the second, the issue here is that Vivyan is reading the
measure wrong. There are two parallel voices in the linked image:

On Sat, Feb 3, 2018 at 8:14 PM,
Vivyan  wrote:


This excerpt is from Gymnopedie which is in 3/4 but still, this
notation is
involved. I'm just trying to write it into lilypond.


One voice is the two dotted half notes; the other is the quarter-rest
and two quarters. 

Vivyan, see NR
1.5.2: http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/multiple-voices
[1] for how to encode multiple voices in the same bar (and my previous
message for how to do cross-staff notes). 

Cheers,

A

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Re: duration longer than meter?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I only have some limited knowledge of music, have transcribed 
Gymnopedies repeatedly in the past. To my knowledge there are two 
different voices, for example one with a pointed half note and  and the 
second voice is a half note with a quarter rest. Your example might be 
an error, Have you check different editions for your example?


\relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 3/4or
e2. 4

}
for
Am 03.02.2018 19:08, schrieb Vivyan
I need these notes to fit within the same meter? How can I stop 
lilypond from

pushing the notes out?

lower = \relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 3/4

e2. 4

}



--
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Re: duration longer than meter?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Do not waste your time! I argue the majority does not want to discuss 
that topic seriously. Read the whole thread starting with:


Betreff turning a blind eye to dotted note
Von Blöchl BernhardAdd contact
Absenderlilypond-userAdd contact
An  lilypond-user@gnu.orgAdd contact
Datum   Mo 10:53

In my limited knowledge of music I think that bar is wrong because of 
the dotted 8th note?


Regards


%\version "2.19.80"
\version "2.18.20"
mus = \relative c'' {
d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis
}
<<
  \new Voice \mus




Am 03.02.2018 19:08, schrieb Vivyan:
I need these notes to fit within the same meter? How can I stop 
lilypond from

pushing the notes out?

lower = \relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 3/4

e2. 4

}



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Re: Lilypond download from linux.audio

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 01.02.2018 23:22, schrieb domini...@cazeaux.org:

I want to download Lilypond, it is impossible, may be a problem ?


http://lilypond.org/download.de.html
http://lilypond.org/development.de.html

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Fwd: Re: turning a blind eye to dotted note

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I always thought bar check is preset on???
Example 
(http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/displaying-rhythms.html 
-> Bar checks)


\version "2.19.80"
\cadenzaOn
mus = \relative {
  g'1 | e1 | c2. c' | g4 c g e | c4 r r2 |
}
<<
  \new Voice \mus




If i try this with   g'1  e1  c2. c'  g4 c g e  c4 r r2 I get an "opn 
end" as Urs described. But then bar check wont help?


Thanks anyway.

Regards

 Originalnachricht 
Betreff: Re: turning a blind eye to dotted note
Datum: 29.01.2018 11:30
Von: Thomas Morley <thomasmorle...@gmail.com>
An: Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net>
Kopie: lilypond-user <lilypond-user@gnu.org>

2018-01-29 11:21 GMT+01:00 Blöchl Bernhard 
<b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net>:
Thanks! Usually I take care of the notes in mesures and count 
correctly,
that was an error by chance I  overlooked. So I did not now that 
lilypond

behaviour. I was awaiting an error message or at least a warning.



Use bar-checks then.

Cheers,
  Harm

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Re: turning a blind eye to dotted note

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Thanks. I am not a lilypond power user. That was an error by chance, I 
awaited an error message or a warning.

Actually learned Completion_heads_engraver!

Regards

Am 29.01.2018 10:56, schrieb Malte Meyn:

Am 29.01.2018 um 10:53 schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:
In my limited knowledge of music I think that bar is wrong because of 
the dotted 8th note?


Regards


%\version "2.19.80"
\version "2.18.20"
mus = \relative c'' {
d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis
}
<<
   \new Voice \mus




LilyPond does the right thing here. Depending on what you want to
achieve you might consider using bar checks, \cadenzaOn, or the
Completion_heads_engraver.

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Re: turning a blind eye to dotted note

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Thanks! Usually I take care of the notes in mesures and count correctly, 
that was an error by chance I  overlooked. So I did not now that 
lilypond behaviour. I was awaiting an error message or at least a 
warning.


Regards


Am 29.01.2018 10:56, schrieb Urs Liska:

Am 29.01.2018 um 10:53 schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:
In my limited knowledge of music I think that bar is wrong because of 
the dotted 8th note?


Regards


%\version "2.19.80"
\version "2.18.20"
mus = \relative c'' {
d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis
}
<<
  \new Voice \mus







Indeed, it is, and therefore you see that space to the right of the
barline. This represents the second half of the last eighth note.
Urs

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turning a blind eye to dotted note

[Blöchl Bernhard]

In my limited knowledge of music I think that bar is wrong because of 
the dotted 8th note?


Regards


%\version "2.19.80"
\version "2.18.20"
mus = \relative c'' {
d4  cis8  c8  b8. ais8  a  gis
}
<<
  \new Voice \mus




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Re: TAB with right hand fingering(s) IN CHORDS ?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 29.01.2018 09:53, schrieb Éric:

Hi,


Thomas Morley-2 wrote

Though, you're right in so far as TabStaff is usually regarded as a
notation where already is shown what to _do_.
Thus, fingerings, stroke-finger, string-numbers are superfluous.


I think a tablature is a notation showing where_to_go but not 
how_to_do_it.
So fingerings in a tablature are not superfluous (but string numbers 
and

fret indications are, for sure).
They can be confusing to read for exemple for left hand numerals in a 
modern

numbered-tablature.


If confusing why do you use it?

Old lute lettered-tablature are using a dots system instead of letters 
for

right-hand fingerings to avoid any confusion.
But your proposition of capital letters instead, is very interesting in 
that

context.


Capital letters for right hand fingering are standard in Banjo TABS. I 
never have seen it different.





Thomas Morley-2 wrote

I didn't figure why lilypond complains about unset side-axis in
TabVoice, though.


Do you know why LilyBin in not complaining ?

Cheers
Éric




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Re: TAB with right hand fingering(s) IN CHORDS ?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Thank you for your help!

As you supposed \new TabVoice can handle this construct. I experimented 
a bit and found that one can define even one finger for a chord. That is 
important for Banjo played clawhammer style there single strings are hit 
and the chords are brushed with the back of the fingernail with I or M 
depending on the taste of the player. The drone is plucked by P. The 
warning or error message is not nice, but as long as it compiles 
correctly ...


\version "2.19.80"
\layout {
  \context {
\TabVoice
\override StrokeFinger.digit-names = ##("P" "I" "M" "A" "X")
%\consists #Test_engraver
\consists "New_fingering_engraver"
\consists "Fingering_engraver"
\consists "Script_column_engraver"
\consists "Fingering_column_engraver"
  }

}

#(define RH rightHandFinger)

mus = \relative c {
  \set strokeFingerOrientations = #'(left up )
  c-\RH #1 e-\RH #2 g-\RH #3 c-\RH #4
  %\set strokeFingerOrientations = #'(down right up )
\set strokeFingerOrientations = #'(down )
  < c-\RH #1 e-\RH #2 g-\RH #3 > 4
  < c-\RH #2 e-\RH #2 g-\RH #2 > 4
< c-\RH #2 e g > 4
}

<<
  \new Voice \mus
  \new TabVoice \mus



Am 29.01.2018 00:58, schrieb Thomas Morley:

Hi,

2018-01-28 19:52 GMT+01:00 Blöchl Bernhard 
<b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net>:

I experimente with this fingering notation:

\version "2.19.80"

\layout {
  \context {
\TabStaff


This should go into TabVoice not TabStaff, imho


  \override StrokeFinger.digit-names = ##("P" "I" "M" "A" "X")
\consists New_fingering_engraver
strokeFingerOrientations = #'(down )
  }
  %{
  The finger characters under the chord are written one above the 
other and
therefore unredable. To change this, I think there is some change in 
the

source by the developers necessary.


Nope.
Some change by the user ;)
If you consist New_fingering_engraver you should also include
Script_column_engraver.
I'd go for Fingering_engraver and Fingering_column_engraver as well.

  Tshe finger characters "upper case" are correct you see with this 
"\set

strokeFingerOrientations = #'(right)" example.
  The warnings show, that this case of fingering of of chords "down" 
is not

considered.
  %}


Not exactly.
Including the engravers building "column" already helps a bit.
Though, you're right in so far as TabStaff is usually regarded as a
notation where already is shown what to _do_.
Thus, fingerings, stroke-finger, string-numbers are superfluous.

That said, I think printing of stroke-fingerings should work if
actually desired.
I didn't figure why lilypond complains about unset side-axis in
TabVoice, though.

But I tried a proof-of-concept-engraver.

Please note the printed message :))

\version "2.19.65"

#(define Test_engraver
  (lambda (ctx)
(let ((stroke-fingers '())
  (str-fingr-or '()))
(ly:message
  "\n\tTHIS CODE IS A PROOF OF CONCEPT. NOT TESTED. USE AT OWN 
RISK.\n\n")

(make-engraver
  ((start-translation-timestep trans)
   (set! stroke-fingers '()))
  (acknowledgers
((stroke-finger-interface engraver grob source-engraver)
  (set! stroke-fingers (cons grob stroke-fingers))
  ;; To prevent LilyPond complaining, side-axis is set here
  ;; It may be reset in `stop-translation-timestep'
  (ly:grob-set-property! grob 'side-axis X)))
  ((stop-translation-timestep trans)
   (let* ((str-f-or
(ly:context-property ctx 'strokeFingerOrientations 
'(right)))

  (cleaned-str-f-or
(if (and (member 'left str-f-or) (member 'right 
str-f-or))

(filter
  (lambda (e)
(not (eq? 'left e)))
  str-f-or)
str-f-or))
  (sorted-str-f-or
(sort cleaned-str-f-or (lambda (p q) (symbol  (round (/ (length rev-str-f) 
2

 (cons
   (cadr sorted-str-f-or)
   (list-tail rev-str-f
  (round (/ (length rev-str-f) 
2))


  ((or (equal? sorted-str-f-or '(down left))
   (equal? sorted-str-f-or '(down right)))
   (list
 (cons
   (car sorted-str-f-or)
   (car rev-str-f))
 (cons
   (cadr sorted-str-f-or)
   (cdr rev-str-f

  ((or (equal? sorted-str-f-or '(left up))
   (equal? sorted-str-f-or '(right up)))
   (list
 (co

Re: TAB with right hand fingering(s) IN CHORDS ?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I experimente with this fingering notation:

\version "2.19.80"

\layout {
  \context {
\TabStaff
  \override StrokeFinger.digit-names = ##("P" "I" "M" "A" "X")
\consists New_fingering_engraver
strokeFingerOrientations = #'(down )
  }
  %{
  The finger characters under the chord are written one above the other 
and therefore unredable. To change this, I think there is some change in 
the source by the developers necessary.
  Tshe finger characters "upper case" are correct you see with this 
"\set strokeFingerOrientations = #'(right)" example.
  The warnings show, that this case of fingering of of chords "down" is 
not considered.

  %}
}
#(define RH rightHandFinger)

\new TabStaff \relative c {
  %\set strokeFingerOrientations = #'(down )
  {
  c-\RH #1 e-\RH #2 g-\RH #3 c-\RH #4
  }

  %\set strokeFingerOrientations = #'(right )
  %\set strokeFingerOrientations = #'(up right down)
  {
  < c-\RH #1 e-\RH #2 g-\RH #3 > 4
  }
}

Regards

Am 28.01.2018 17:36, schrieb David Kastrup:

Éric  writes:


Hello
expending the thread "TAB with right  hand fingering?", it's a pity it 
is

not usable in chords with more than 1 fingering?
Even with only 1 fingering in a chord, it works only when attached to 
the

1rst note  like this :


#(define RH rightHandFinger)

\score {
  \new TabStaff \relative c {

  }
}

\layout {
  \context {
\TabStaff
\consists New_fingering_engraver
strokeFingerOrientations = #'(down)
  }
}


If you just flip the notes, it doesn't works, like that :

#(define RH rightHandFinger)

\score {
  \new TabStaff \relative c {

  }
}


\layout {
  \context {
\TabStaff
\consists New_fingering_engraver
strokeFingerOrientations = #'(down)
  }
}


How about leaving a space after #1 ?  1> is not a known Scheme atom.
And "doesn't work" instead of actually posting the error message forces
anybody wanting to help you to compile the thing himself instead of
pointing out trivialities like that just off the cuff.


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capital letters for right hand fingering?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

How to get capital letters for right hand fingering? I add an example 
code.


#(define RH rightHandFinger)
\new Staff \relative c' {
   \set strokeFingerOrientations = #'( down)
  c-\RH #1 e-\RH #2 g-\RH #3 c-\RH #4
}

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TAB with right-hand fingerings?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

The left hand fingering is defined in the TAB, but how to get right a 
hand fingering?

I tried this:

#(define RH rightHandFinger)
\new TabStaff \relative c {
   \set strokeFingerOrientations = #'( down)
  c-\RH #1 e-\RH #2 g-\RH #3 c-\RH #4
}

Compiles, but without fingering

Thanks for Help

PS: I ask for capital letters for the right hand fingering in a separate 
thread.


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Re: Openlilylib edition-engraver. I need help understanding how to reference contexts.

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Thanks for the remark! Obviouslyis a private communication thread about 
a special topic not for common lilypond users. I will not interfere.


Regards



Am 26.01.2018 18:52, schrieb Urs Liska:
Am 26. Januar 2018 18:31:24 MEZ schrieb Simon Albrecht 
<simon.albre...@mail.de>:

On 26.01.2018 17:40, Blöchl Bernhard wrote:

I tried your code with my standard lilypond without success.

Obviously you use a package oll-core
https://github.com/openlilylib/oll-core
that is not part of standard install of lilypond and seems to be the
central problem of your code. May be you get competent help of the
oll-core users?


Not helpful.


Indeed. And especially totally wrong.
What leads you to believe that using oll-core is "the central problem"
here? Beside that you may not know what it is?
Your comment is behind the knowledge of the original post...


Jan-Peter already answered, and Urs is around here as
well,
and they have developed those tools.

Best, Simon

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Re: Openlilylib edition-engraver. I need help understanding how to reference contexts.

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I tryed your code with my standard lilypond without success.

Obviously you use a package oll-core
https://github.com/openlilylib/oll-core
that is not part of standard install of lilypond and seems to be the 
central problem of your code. May be you get competent help of the 
oll-core users?


Regards





Am 26.01.2018 16:55, schrieb Stefano Troncaro:

Thank you Jan-Peter, that's really useful!

In regards to the first problem, I experimented with it a little.
Using the same snippet as before, It turns out that if I write this
line like this:


new Staff with { editionID LH } { clef F <<

 Then the path to Piano.LH.Voice.A doesn't seem to work and the note
isn't colored. This is the output of the logfile:


[context-counter] Piano/LH/Staff: (0 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Staff/A:
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Voice: (1 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Voice/A:
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Voice/B:
[context-counter] Piano/PianoStaff: (0 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/PianoStaff/A:
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Staff: (0 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Staff/A:
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Voice: (1 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Voice/A:
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Voice/B:
[context-counter] Score: (0 . new)
[context-counter] Score/A: new
(Piano LH Staff A) ""
(Piano LH Voice A) ""
(Piano LH Voice B) ""
(Piano PianoStaff A) ""
(Piano RH Staff A) ""
(Piano RH Voice A) ""
(Piano RH Voice B) ""
(Score A) "new"


On the other hand, if I write it like this:


new Staff with { editionID LH } { << clef F

 Now that the clef F is inside the << >> the path to Piano.LH.Voice.A
works properly. This is the output of the logfile:


[context-counter] Piano/LH/Staff: (0 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Staff/A:
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Voice: (1 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Voice/A:
[context-counter] Piano/LH/Voice/B:
[context-counter] Piano/PianoStaff: (0 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/PianoStaff/A:
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Staff: (0 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Staff/A:
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Voice: (1 . #f)
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Voice/A:
[context-counter] Piano/RH/Voice/B:
[context-counter] Score: (0 . new)
[context-counter] Score/A: new
(Piano LH Staff A) ""
(Piano LH Voice A) ""
(Piano LH Voice B) ""
(Piano PianoStaff A) ""
(Piano RH Staff A) ""
(Piano RH Voice A) ""
(Piano RH Voice B) ""
(Score A) "new"

 Which is exactly the same as before. Yet one works and the other
doesn't. Is there a way to have more specific logging in order to
better trace the issue?

I attached a .ly for both examples in case you find it more
convenient.

Thank you for your help!
Stefano

2018-01-26 4:06 GMT-03:00 Jan-Peter Voigt :


Hello Stefano,

I can't reproduce the misbehaviour/error you mentioned first. The
overrides are applied irrespective of the clefs placement. If the
error persists, you might send the .edition.log file.

To reduce the redundancy you mentioned you can create variables:

LH = Piano.LH
RH = Piano.RH

Then you can use them like this:

editionMod test 1 0/4 RH.Voice.A { ... }

Internally the modifications are stored in a hierarchically
structured manner before the targets are known. Thet is the reason
the full path is needed.

HTH
Jan-Peter

Am 25.01.2018 um 23:35 schrieb Stefano Troncaro:


Hello everyone! So, I'm learning to use the edition-engraver, but
there are some behaviors that I can't figure out.

Take the following snippet:

    version  "2.19.80" language  "english" include 
"oll-core/package.ily" loadPackage  edition-engraver

    addEdition  test

    editionMod  test1 0/4  RH.Voice.A{ once override 
NoteHead.color  = #green } editionMod  test1 0/4  LH.Voice.A{
once override  NoteHead.color  = #green } consistToContexts 
#edition-engraver Score.PianoStaff.Staff.Voice

    score  { new  PianoStaff  << new  Staff  with  { 
editionID  RH} << new  Voice  relative  c''{  voiceOne 
c4.  d8  d4.  g8  | e4.(  d8  c b g4)  } new  Voice 
relative  c''{  voiceTwo  a2.  g4~  | g f2  e4  |} >> new 
Dynamics  {  s1mp  } new  Staff  with  {  editionID  LH} {
<< new  Voice  relative  c'{  clef  F  voiceOne  e8  d c4
d8  c b4  | c8  b a2  g4  |} new  Voice  relative  c{ 
voiceTwo  f2  e | d g,4  c |} >> } >> }

In the left hand staff, if I move the clef F from inside one of
the two voices to the outside, like in the following example:

    new  Staff  with  {  editionID  LH} {  clef  F  <<
new  Voice  relative  c'{  voiceOne  e8  d c4 d8  c b4  |
c8  b a2  g4  |} new  Voice  relative  c{  voiceTwo  f2 
e | d g,4  c |} >> }

then I can't find a way to reference the voices contained in the
Staff. Why does this happen?

Secondly, if I give an editionID to the PianoStaff, then I can
only reference the staves by giving a full route. For example, if
I gave it the ID Piano I would have to write Piano.LH.Voice.A to
reference the first voice. Is there a way to avoid this
redundancy?

In relation with the last question, I have tried and I can't
figure out how to give an ID to a Voice context so 

Re: maximumFretStretch in Manual, tablatures section ?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I carefully would  say you found a bug.

Am 25.01.2018 19:52, schrieb Éric:

Hello,

in this exemple, the 1rst chord is the default calculation of tablature 
but

not what I want.
The 2nd chord get an error message even your intuition do not…
The 3rd chord showing what I want.

\version "2.19.60"

\score {
  \new TabStaff
  {    }
}


The maximumFretStretch is set to 4 by default in translation.init.scm
Lilypond files, while this chord is a 5 stretched.
(yes, it can happen, specialy in highter notes position, where frets 
are

less large, or if you play a small instrument)

Looking to the manuel, the property maximumFretStretch is only 
belonging to

Fretboards context.
Don't you think that it should be mentionned  in the Tablature section 
of
the manual that, at least, you have to type all the string numbers 
involved

in a more than default stretch ?

By the way, is there a way to override this default, just for a score 
or a

section of it ?
(yes, one day I will learn Scheme !!)

Éric



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Re: 5 string Banjo Tab

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 25.01.2018 11:35, schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

I did not say that you attributed anything to ABC, but all that mails
refer to the thread "5 string Banjo Tab" that moved sideways to
"VocaTab" with the mail 24.01.2018 um 16:19 schrieb Éric: ..

There is another possible key to further misunderstanding. Not Eric 
wrote the following, but David Kastrup (see the original Mail below):


"... is not a notation since it has no printed form."

Then Wikipedia is wrong (it is often)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABC_notation
and the rest of the world as well?

Please, do not make me responsible for the topsy-turvy world that sees
that different!

Regards



Am 25.01.2018 10:39, schrieb David Kastrup:

Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net> writes:


David Kastrup sees some problems in implementing this notation in
lilypond.


Can you please _not_ wildly attribute stuff to me?  I don't remember
having said anything about this input language (and certainly it looks
like the input could be represented with the expedient of a note name
language) and it is not a notation since it has no printed form.


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Re: 5 string Banjo Tab

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I did not say that you attributed anything to ABC, but all that mails 
refer to the thread "5 string Banjo Tab" that moved sideways to 
"VocaTab" with the mail 24.01.2018 um 16:19 schrieb Éric: ..



"... is not a notation since it has no printed form."

Then Wikipedia is wrong (it is often)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABC_notation
and the rest of the world as well?

Please, do not make me responsible for the topsy-turvy world that sees 
that different!


Regards



Am 25.01.2018 10:39, schrieb David Kastrup:

Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net> writes:


David Kastrup sees some problems in implementing this notation in
lilypond.


Can you please _not_ wildly attribute stuff to me?  I don't remember
having said anything about this input language (and certainly it looks
like the input could be represented with the expedient of a note name
language) and it is not a notation since it has no printed form.


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Re: 5 string Banjo Tab

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Wildly

I refer to your mail from Wednesday Jan 24th 2018, concerning "VocaTab" 
(Topic Re:5 string Banjo Tab), last line of your mail:


"... That's so much of
a crutch that there may be other side effects."

Can't remember?

For short I call that proposing problems.

Regards


Am 25.01.2018 10:39, schrieb David Kastrup:

Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net> writes:


David Kastrup sees some problems in implementing this notation in
lilypond.


Can you please _not_ wildly attribute stuff to me?  I don't remember
having said anything about this input language (and certainly it looks
like the input could be represented with the expedient of a note name
language) and it is not a notation since it has no printed form.


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Re: 5 string Banjo Tab

[Blöchl Bernhard]

David Kastrup sees some problems in implementing this notation in 
lilypond. I think there is a better chance by modyfying an ABC notation 
program based from start on ASCII-code for handling such "VocaTabs".


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABC_notation
http://abcnotation.com/

May be somebady may modify one of the open sources?

https://sourceforge.net/directory/os:linux/?q=abc+notation

Regards


Am 24.01.2018 16:19, schrieb Éric:

David,
thanks very much for sharing this Lilypond TabTranslator.
A neophyte Schemer question : is it difficult to modify it to have a
traditionnal 6 line tablature for instruments with more than 6 strings 
? (7

strings but 7 lines in your exemple)

Letters instead of numbers, that's standart for lutenists.
How difficult is it for others to do so ? I don't know, after so many 
years

of use.

Off subject :
Pushing further the letters usage, I'm using "VocaTab", a 
full-letter-system

(only for memorie practice of solo playing).
The number of string is replaced by a voyelle, so that you can prononce 
(at

least mentally) : \1 is a, \2 is e, \3 is i, \4 is o, \5 is u, \6 is y.
Then if necessary, \7 is z, and then \8 is A, \9 is E, etc… (note that
capitals mimics the top strings, corresponding to tablature signs for
additionnal basses "\a" (one bar) "\\a" (two bars) etc…).

Thus, using VocaTab, your exemple starts as :
4 q8 de | 16 ce ce8 16 ae32 di ae8 |

If ever it make sense for someone else than me (!?), then, it should be
possible to use these tablature-codes as note-names in an another kind 
of

TabTranslator in Lilypond ?

VocaTab was inspired by — often called "hermetic"— XVI century german 
lute

tablature.

Éric



--
Sent from: http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/User-f3.html

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Re: bug in \repeat percent?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 24.01.2018 22:01, schrieb Thomas Morley:

2018-01-24 18:34 GMT+01:00 bb :
Thanks for explanation! I read the Manual but the information is very 
densly

packed, easy to overlook something. But I do not find that in a second
reading of 
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/snippets/repeats.


I tried

\version "2.19.80"


[...]

Please refer to the docs matching your version. Sometimes they improve 
;)


In
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/short-repeats#percent-repeats
you could read:

"
Known issues and warnings

Percent repeats will not contain anything else apart from the percent
sign itself; in particular, timing changes will not be repeated.
[...]
Any meter changes or \partial commands need to occur in parallel
passages outside of any percent repeat, e.g in a separate timing
track.
[...]
"

Same holds for bar-lines.

Cheers,
  Harm


Thank you for clarification! The description of \repeat percent in the 
manual for the latest lilypond version is extended and clearer. So my 
musical construct is outside the design limits of \repeat percent.


Clearly no bug but my misconception.

Thanks and regards

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Re: 5 string Banjo Tab

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Sorry, sent the German link to the lilypond manual, here it is to the 
English version: 
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/banjo.html


(As you write not to know lilypond here a hint: You can switch the 
languages at the bottom of the page.)


Am 24.01.2018 03:39, schrieb Richard Hoadley:

I just joined Lilypond, so am very new at this program. I can’t read
music and depend totally on Tabs. I need a table or list that shows
what letters create each of the notes on a Tab. Some samples of the
text would be helpful. Most of my Tabs are in Clawhammer style and
open G tuning.

Richard Hoadley
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Re: 5 string Banjo Tab

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I have generated lots of Banjo Tabs some time ago and played Banjo 
clawhammer style. Actually I am on a Laptop away from home and do not 
have examples here. But in the afternoon I will send examples. Without 
reading music it is nearly impossible to generate Tabs from the written 
notes. Reading music is not as hard as people often think. There is no 
way to write Tabs with lilypond directly omitting music notes. May be 
you find some help and links for this (if any) at 
https://www.banjohangout.org/forum/.


To get an idea how lilypond works, see 
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/banjo.


Regards



Am 24.01.2018 03:39, schrieb Richard Hoadley:

I just joined Lilypond, so am very new at this program. I can’t read
music and depend totally on Tabs. I need a table or list that shows
what letters create each of the notes on a Tab. Some samples of the
text would be helpful. Most of my Tabs are in Clawhammer style and
open G tuning.

Richard Hoadley
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Re: Left-handed fretboard?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I just jumped into that thread and will give my 2 cent:
I know violine- and guitar- and bass-teachers that have a large mirror 
in the teaching room for the leftys.


I have nothing against special coding if developers find it worth the 
time. But a mirror is a cheap, fast and easy solution.


regards


Am 18.01.2018 18:06, schrieb Karlin High:

On 1/18/2018 10:11 AM, Carl Sorensen wrote:
I believe that we should have some sort of display on the left-hand 
diagram indicating it's a left-hand diagram.  But I don't know what 
that should be.


Perhaps a left-pointing arrow at the top or the side of the fretboard?

If it's not text, it wouldn't need translation.


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Re: PDF woes

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Simply use Linux.

Linux has some (minor) issues as well, but you get that (minor) issues 
without cost.


Regards


Am 19.01.2018 02:06, schrieb Karlin High:
On Thu, Jan 18, 2018 at 5:13 PM, Travis Weller  
wrote:

The links work with Acrobat... and I'd happily use Acrobat, but as I
mentioned before it is a "known issue" that it won't update the PDF 
file

when you typeset repeatedly.


What other PDF readers for Mac are out there? How about the Linux ones
like Evince or Okular?

https://okular.kde.org/
--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

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Re: New information (success report) for Frescobaldi 3 and the Ubuntu 16.04 repositories

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 11.01.2018 07:40, schrieb Urs Liska:

Am 11.01.2018 um 05:38 schrieb Vaughan McAlley:


On 8 Jan 2018 12:35 p.m., "Andrew Bernard"
 wrote:

Hi Urs and All,

A totally successful install on a new Ubuntu 17.10 pristine image.
All works fine as per the source installations now updated.

A large vote of thanks to all who untangled this ball of wool.
Despite a lifetime of software development experience, I kept going
round in circles and never got it working. A big achievement and
well done to you all.

Andrew

On 7 January 2018 at 20:38, Urs Liska  wrote:

I've done a new iteration on the Wiki page. I've also added a
concise walkthrough at the end that leaves out all the explanations
and 

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It's good to know it's possible. Does anyone know whether a failed
installation of Frescobaldi 3 endangers a working 2.20 installation?


I have installed frescobaldi3 successful on 16.04.2-Ubuntu.On this and 
some other computers (16.04, 17.04, 17.10) i previously installed 
frescobaldi2 following installing python-ly version 0.9.5. (As was 
pointed out repeatedly the ubuntu repository version is 0.9.3 - to old 
for both frescobaldi 2 and 3!)You can check the version

~/frescobaldi-2.20.0 $ ly -v
ly 0.9.5

Python-ly 0.9.5 is one importand precondition for the installation of 
both frescobaldi versions.


Due to this mail I tried to start frescobaldi2
~/frescobaldi-2.20.0 $ python frescobaldi
and get the message that python ly is mising or to to old
In German
"Das Paket python-ly ist nicht verfügbar oder zu alt.
Frescobaldi benötigt mindestens Version 0.9.4."
I reported this message to github in the past. I installed python-ly 
0.95 from source and as shown above it is available on the system. I 
reported a problem in installing both frescobaldi versions in the past 
as well. Because of the lot of troubles with installing frescobaldi3 
that quirk went missing.


It is not clear for me if frescobaldi2 installs with python.ly 0.9.4 and 
dislikes 0.9.5? In the moment I am on another computer without access to 
the others and cannot check the ly version of the running frecobaldi2.


May be the frescobaldi versions are antagonistic. (THere had been such a 
case in the past, wasnt it Kain and Abel?)




 It *should* not, but of course that's a risky statement in the
context of this thread ;-)

 The packages don't affect each other, the point is to cleanly invoke
the right Python version with the right entry file and the right
python-ly in the pythonpath.

 How did you install 2.20 and what OS distribution are you on?

 Urs


Vaughan

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Links:
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[1] https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user

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Re: Generate Random Pitches and Accidentals?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I have not read the messages in the thread, so may be anybody has 
already provided a solution to your problem.

I always planned to try
http://projectabjad.org/
for algorithmic (fractal) composition of music, never found the time.
Check it, may be abjad is of use for you? (There is another program 
equally named Abjad - The Arabic Alphabet Learning System.)


Regards

Am 08.01.2018 18:44, schrieb Joshua Nichols:

I'm looking for a resource that can generate pitches at different
octaves, using different spellings, including accidentals.

Has someone already implemented this? I'm trying not to reinvent the
wheel.

--
Josh
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Re: Introducing Hacklily, another online LilyPond editor

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Actually tried https://www.hacklily.org on linux.

The only action is a message in the right window  "Could not connect to 
server ..."


Has anybody successfully tried  hackily on linux? If not, please send me 
a message so I can put that thread on my spam list. Does it work on 
Windows? May be it's such a Mac thingy only working on that platform 
contradicting the spirit of open source?


Regards


PS: The ingredients Docker, Node, Yarn, Qt5, qmake are available and 
running on linux.







Am 08.01.2018 12:23, schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

I am completely confused.

Hackily did not impress me, but due to this "not Windows" discussion I 
opened

https://github.com/hacklily/hacklily
and read
"... It consists of a frontend Lilypond editor using monaco (the
editor that powers vscode) and a backend Lilypond renderer. ..."
monaco is a visual script editor. Visual script is a Microsoft
language and available for the Mac, there is a link
https://code.visualstudio.com/docs/setup/linux, never tried it.
monaco looks interesting, downloaded with
npm install monaco-editor@0.10.1
npm is the package manager for JavaScript and the world’s largest
software registry. JavaScript is alanguage I am interested and ahe one
preferece (beside some others).
If I find some time I may check the code for curiosity.

To say it diplomatically, I do not have any problem with "an OS that
is not Windows" and do not say to appreciate this statement. But
beside strong liking of other OS, is there a technical reason for this
and which?

Regards


Am 08.01.2018 10:34, schrieb Thomas Morley:

2018-01-08 6:31 GMT+01:00 Hugh S. Myers <hsmy...@gmail.com>:
'OS that is not Windows'…so you are saying to hell with 7 out of 10 
users?

Well, that's one way to cut down on all that annoying customer noise!

--hsm
p.s. I write multi-platform modules for CPAN and yes it is a great 
deal of

extra work but it is pretty much 'the right thing to do'…




Let me quote a little more from https://github.com/hacklily/hacklily 
README


"
[...]
Running locally

Dependencies

You need:

Node -- tested with Node 7, earlier versions may or may not also work
Yarn
Qt 5 -- with qmake in your path (installing using the version from
Qt's website is recommended on macOS)
Docker
an OS that is not Windows (if you make it work, please contribute your 
fix!)

[...]
"

Sounds a little different, doesn't it?



-Harm

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Re: Introducing Hacklily, another online LilyPond editor

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I am completely confused.

Hackily did not impress me, but due to this "not Windows" discussion I 
opened

https://github.com/hacklily/hacklily
and read
"... It consists of a frontend Lilypond editor using monaco (the editor 
that powers vscode) and a backend Lilypond renderer. ..."
monaco is a visual script editor. Visual script is a Microsoft language 
and available for the Mac, there is a link 
https://code.visualstudio.com/docs/setup/linux, never tried it.

monaco looks interesting, downloaded with
npm install monaco-editor@0.10.1
npm is the package manager for JavaScript and the world’s largest 
software registry. JavaScript is alanguage I am interested and ahe one 
preferece (beside some others).

If I find some time I may check the code for curiosity.

To say it diplomatically, I do not have any problem with "an OS that is 
not Windows" and do not say to appreciate this statement. But beside 
strong liking of other OS, is there a technical reason for this and 
which?


Regards


Am 08.01.2018 10:34, schrieb Thomas Morley:

2018-01-08 6:31 GMT+01:00 Hugh S. Myers :
'OS that is not Windows'…so you are saying to hell with 7 out of 10 
users?

Well, that's one way to cut down on all that annoying customer noise!

--hsm
p.s. I write multi-platform modules for CPAN and yes it is a great 
deal of

extra work but it is pretty much 'the right thing to do'…




Let me quote a little more from https://github.com/hacklily/hacklily 
README


"
[...]
Running locally

Dependencies

You need:

Node -- tested with Node 7, earlier versions may or may not also work
Yarn
Qt 5 -- with qmake in your path (installing using the version from
Qt's website is recommended on macOS)
Docker
an OS that is not Windows (if you make it work, please contribute your 
fix!)

[...]
"

Sounds a little different, doesn't it?



-Harm

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Re: New information (success report) for Frescobaldi 3 and the Ubuntu 16.04 repositories

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I planned to try the installation following the new description 
Satureday evening

https://github.com/wbsoft/frescobaldi/wiki/Installing-Frescobaldi-3-on-Linux-(Package-or-Source)
but had some drinks with friends in the evening ...

I just read the description and found:

Note: As the desktop file will not read the PYTHONPATH environment 
variable defined in .bashrc, the easiest solution is installing 
python-ly through the package manager (it should be called python3-ly in 
most distributions); or pip (sudo pip3 install python-ly), in case you 
need the latest version.


I installed frescobaldi 2 and 3 repeatedly and as I remember both 
imperatively need python-ly version 0.9.5. The actual ubuntu 
distribution repositories provide python-ly version 0.9.3-1. That does 
not work!


To avoid trouble I would recommend to cancel "installing python-ly 
through the package manager" because python-ly version 0.9.3-1 provided 
by the package manager  does not work!


Regards BB


Am 07.01.2018 01:10, schrieb Urs Liska:
Am 7. Januar 2018 00:56:53 MEZ schrieb Simon Albrecht 
:

Hi Urs,
I did now test the instructions on an Ubuntu 16.04 Live system, and it
seems to work (Frescobaldi is up and running; I didn't test any of the
features). There's one typo: popller->poppler. My first question would
be: what solution to using a .desktop file and still use the correct
python-ly, but IIUC that's already covered by your TODO list.


I'm a bit surprised because I *did* write this but now I don't see it
on the wiki page. Well, I will look at it again tomorrow.

The solution is to create a wrapper script In your path (e.g.
~/bin/frescobaldi) that takes care of the python path. The desktop
file points to the wrapper script.

Urs



Another
item to be covered would be configuring MIDI output. I remember that 
on

one of the attempts that I made to install I also tried to set up
python-portmidi following http://frescobaldi.org/download, but that
seemed to be a new can of worms and I couldn't get it to work (didn't
dig deep either).   Best, Simon

Am 06-Jan-2018 15:19:32 +0100 schrieb li...@openlilylib.org:
I have now finished a run-through of installation instructions. As I
have once more renamed it the link is now
https://github.com/wbsoft/frescobaldi/wiki/Installing-Frescobaldi-3-on-Linux-(Package-or-Source)

I'd be glad about feedback:

* confirmation
* questions
* reports about mistakes
* reports about failures
* reports/comments about distributions not covered yet.

Urs

6. Januar 2018 11:41, li...@openlilylib.org schrieb:

> Hi all,
>

after all the discussion about getting Frescobaldi to run on

distributions based on Ubuntu < 17.xx
> I decided to give it a shot myself.
>

TL;DR Frescobaldi *can* be installed on Ubuntu 16.04/Mint 18.3 from

its own Git repositories and
> the Ubuntu package repositories without issues.
>
> Context/Situation:
> I freshly installed Linux Mint 18.3.

(NOTE: I use a previously existing $HOME directory, but I'm quite

sure this doesn't affect the
> process)

Mint 18.3 is based on Ubuntu 16.04 (Mint 19 will be based on Ubuntu

18.04, the next LTS release),

and the relevant packages are from the Ubuntu repositories (so no

Mint specifics added), which
> means I assume the behaviour on vanilla Ubuntu 16.04 is the same.
>
> Commented installation steps:
>
> # Make sure everything is up-to-date
> sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade
>
> sudo apt install git
>
> # Install Frescobaldi's primary dependencies

sudo apt install python3-pyqt5 python3-pyqt5.qtsvg

python3-pyqt5.qtwebkit
>
> # Obtain the Git repositories

# (I *assume* these could instead be downloaded from Github as ZIP

files)
> cd ~

mkdir git # this is just my personal base directory for Git

repositories
> cd git
> git clone https://github.com/wbsoft/python-ly.git python-ly
> git clone https://github.com/wbsoft/frescobaldi.git frescobaldi
>

First try to run Frescobaldi: Invoke python3 with the frescobaldi

entry file and add python-ly to
> the Python search path:
>

PYTHONPATH=$PYTHONPATH:~/git/python-ly python3

~/git/frescobaldi/frescobaldi
>

Frescobaldi correctly starts up, but (expectedly) doesn't show the

Music View because the Poppler
> package isn't installed.
>
> # Install the Poppler bindings from the Ubuntu repositories
> sudo apt install python3-poppler-qt5
>

After that Frescobaldi correctly starts and shows scores both in the

Music View and in the SVG
> View.
>

Knowing this one could have installed all dependencies with one

single
>

sudo apt install python3-pyqt5 python3-pyqt5.qtsvg

python3-pyqt5.qtwebkit python3-poppler-qt5
>
> ###
>

I don't know enough about this and I can't investigate on a "broken"

computer, but I have a
> suspicion.

The issue is that we have Qt, an application framework written in

C++. Frescobaldi is written in

PyQt, which is a set of Qt "bindings" for Python, so Python programs

can use the Qt infrastructure.
>

The point is that all bindings packages (which 

Re: Fwd: frescobaldi 3

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Thank you! Mails have crossed.

Regards

Am 06.01.2018 13:01, schrieb li...@openlilylib.org:
6. Januar 2018 12:27, "Blöchl Bernhard" <bb-543...@telecolumbus.net> 
schrieb:



Thanks for your kind support!

To avoid a false delusion, in advance for list members jumping into 
this thread the good message
for all linux users that the repository version of frescobaldi is 
always running clueless. This
installation discussions are mor or less gymnastic exercises around 
computer imperfection and not a

prerequisite to run a frescobaldi on a linux computer.

I installed, or tried to install frescobaldi 2.20.0 and frescobaldi 
3.0.0 a couple of times on
different linux brands but all based on different ubuntu versions from 
16.04 (LTS) up to 17, 17.04
and 17.10. I did not try ubuntu 16.10. With frescobaldi 2.20.0 I 
always had success, with

frescobaldi 3.0.0 it always flopped prior to ubuntu 17.x.

A "clean" installation has python3-ly 0.9.3-1 in the repository. Both 
frescobaldi versions need
indispensable python-ly version 0.9.5. I do not find the installation 
step for python-ly version
0.9.5 (https://pypi.python.org/pypi/python-ly) in your description? 
Obviously you use a previously
installed python-ly version 0.9.5, may be a path to another linux 
version?



As said I am currently updating the Wiki page, but the instructions
are there (alhtough somewhat scrambled ATM) how to run python-ly from
its own Git repository (which can also be downloaded).

I have the impression that installing packages through pip does not
work properly, so my recommendation (which I am currently formulating
in the Wiki page to be fully clear) for Ubuntu 16.04 (didn't check
16.10 and 17.04) is to install everything except python-ly and
frescobaldi through apt and download/clone these two from Github.
Linux Mint 18.3 is the same.

Urs


 The other steps I have
done quite often previously. I will install Linux Mint 18.3 today 
evening to a blank disk and give
frescobaldi 3.0.0 another (last) sportive try to satisfy an ambition. 
But at least I will wait for
ubuntu Bionic Beaver 18.04 (anounced for late April 2018) to set up a 
system for the LTS time span.


Kind regards BB

Am 06.01.2018 11:06, schrieb li...@openlilylib.org:


Hi,
I have now installed Linux Mint 18.3 (based on Ubuntu 16.04) on a
computer and installed Frescobaldi 3 through apt without *any* 
issues.

First I did
sudo apt install python3-pyqt5 python3-pyqt5.qtsvg
python3-pyqt5.qtwebkit git
Then I cloned the repositories of python-ly and frescobaldi.
When I launched Frescobaldi using
PYTHONPATH=$PYTHONPATH:/path/to/python-ly
Frescobaldi starts, but doesn't open the Music View (because Poppler
is missing, of course)
Then I tried
sudo apt install python3-poppler-qt5
upon which Frescobaldi started correctly with both SVG and PDF 
viewers

working.
This tells me that the Ubuntu packages are now working properly even
for Ubuntu 16.04.
There's one caveat that *might* be happening in addition: I am using 
a

previously existing $HOME directory, so there *might* be something I
had already configured earlier. But actually I'm quite sure this is
not the case, as before installing python3-poppler-qt5 it was not
detected at all, while after installation it worked properly.
I will write a post to the list with some more reasoning, just to 
have

it recorded publicly.
Best
Urs
5. Januar 2018 18:27, "bb" <bb-543...@telecolumbus.net> schrieb:
Sorry, I forgot to send regards.

PS: I will wait for the new ubuntu LTS version anounced for April.
 Weitergeleitete Nachricht 
BETREFF:

Re: frescobaldi 3

DATUM:

Fri, 5 Jan 2018 18:21:54 +0100

VON:

bb <bb-543...@telecolumbus.net>

AN:

li...@openlilylib.org

Am 05.01.2018 um 16:23 schrieb li...@openlilylib.org:
One more short "shot" 5. Januar 2018 15:08, "bb"

<bb-543...@telecolumbus.net> schrieb:

As the last line of the installation process of frescobaldi-3.0.0

is:RuntimeError: popplerqt5 cannot import type '' from
PyQt5.QtCore ~/frescobaldi-3.0.0 $
Does that mean you run the `setup.py` file from Frescobaldi? I 
have

never done so, and in "my" instructions this is not mentioned.


I first tried with " python3 frescobaldi". But "python3 frescobaldi"
does display the icon only for short time and disappears, as 
described

in the past mails. Then I read the INSTALL document of
fresobaldi-3.0.0 and experimented further. I will repeat to
load/install the libs and try again without using "sudo python3
setup.py install" from frescobaldi-3.0.0.
In a first step I installed PyQt5 from
https://pypi.python.org/pypi/PyQt5 [2] with
"pip3 install PyQt5"
My suspicion is that after having manually installed

python-poppler-qt5 from the Git repository using "setup.py" from
Frescobaldi will essentially trash that effort by installing the
package from the repositories.

I tried to i

Re: Introducing Hacklily, another online LilyPond editor

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I tried on Linux Mint with firefox and only get
"Could not connect to server.
Trying again in 28…"
in the right window, conting high the seconds (?)

Regards

Am 03.01.2018 15:22, schrieb Martin Tarenskeen:

On Wed, 3 Jan 2018, Joshua Netterfield wrote:


Hi all,

I've been working on an online LilyPond editor in my spare time, and 
would appreciate your feedback. You can use it as a scratchpad, or 
sign in with a GitHub account to save sheet music directly there.


Try it at https://www.hacklily.org


Hi,

Nice. First impression: the colorscheme choice for the textedit pane
is a little dark in my opinion. I would prefer brighter colors for the
textfont for better readability. A choice between different color
schemes would be even better. For example if a user prefers a
white/light background and instead.


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Re: Next round on frescobaldi dependencies

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I explicitly  consent!

Regards

Am 01.01.2018 16:45, schrieb Shane Brandes:

I don't think anyone is blaming you. We are just trying to help you
succeed. I think everyone here has encountered the dependency mismatch
hell somewhere along the line. And it is never a good time. Take a few
days off from fighting with it. Then try it again.

regards,
Shane

On Mon, Jan 1, 2018 at 3:04 AM, Andrew Bernard 
 wrote:

Hi Urs and Simon,

Since everybody wants to blame me here, I'll bow out.

Something wrong with my Ubuntu 17. I can't make it work. I shall give 
up.


Thanks all for the hints.

Andrew


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Re: Next round on frescobaldi dependencies

[Blöchl Bernhard]

You write "Ubuntu 17", there are two versions
Ubuntu 17.04 (Zesty Zapus)
On 17.04 I never got running frecobaldi3 and reported repeatedly about.
Ubuntu 17.10 (Artful Aardvark)
On 17.10 it is possible to install, as others confirmed reading the 
actual mails in the thread.
An ubuntu update might cure your frustration. But as reported, not 
without some difficulties with different library versions.


There is a new LTS ubuntu version anounced for 2018-04-26
Ubuntu 18.04 LTS (Bionic Beaver)
May be you have the patience to wait for it?

I for myself know - out of experience - that things never get better, 
but will produce new troubles with library versions.


Happy New Year!


Am 01.01.2018 09:04, schrieb Andrew Bernard:

Hi Urs and Simon,

Since everybody wants to blame me here, I'll bow out.

Something wrong with my Ubuntu 17. I can't make it work. I shall give
up.

Thanks all for the hints.

Andrew


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Re: Vintage Jazz Chords post in 2011 - Howto get it to display on Fresco?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Sorry, a necessary adition.
I read the document
https://github.com/OpenLilyPondFonts/lilyjazz/blob/master/LilyPond-Fonts-Installation-And-Usage.txt
to the end in the meantime and found chapter 3 close to the end
3. INSTALLATION (v2.18.0 - 2.19.11)

Am 25.12.2017 11:41, schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

Am 24.12.2017 16:49, schrieb Daryls_Produce:

Hi Forum People:

Back in 2011 Nathan Ho posted the following code to share code for 
jazzers

so that they can notate chords in their own way.

http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Jazz-Chord-Symbols-tt10516.html#a196223

I pasted this into Frescabaldi, there were no error, but it didn't 
display

anything!

How do I get it to display?


I pasted this into Frescabaldi...

you have to paste it to where lilypond can find it. That is not
necessarily the font directory of lilypond, but I think that is not a
wrong place. lilypond does not have frescobaldi in the search path.

I mentioned
https://github.com/OpenLilyPondFonts/lilyjazz
as an actual lilyjazz version in a past mail, but that is working with
lilypond v.2.19.12+
I am not sure if this expels older lilypond versions as
https://github.com/OpenLilyPondFonts/lilyjazz/blob/master/LilyPond-Fonts-Installation-And-Usage.txt
says:
"NOTE: Since LilyPond versions tend to get installed side by side, you
may need to repeat the process below ..."
?




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Re: Vintage Jazz Chords post in 2011 - Howto get it to display on Fresco?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 24.12.2017 16:49, schrieb Daryls_Produce:

Hi Forum People:

Back in 2011 Nathan Ho posted the following code to share code for 
jazzers

so that they can notate chords in their own way.

http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Jazz-Chord-Symbols-tt10516.html#a196223

I pasted this into Frescabaldi, there were no error, but it didn't 
display

anything!

How do I get it to display?


I pasted this into Frescabaldi...

you have to paste it to where lilypond can find it. That is not 
necessarily the font directory of lilypond, but I think that is not a 
wrong place. lilypond does not have frescobaldi in the search path.


I mentioned
https://github.com/OpenLilyPondFonts/lilyjazz
as an actual lilyjazz version in a past mail, but that is working with 
lilypond v.2.19.12+

I am not sure if this expels older lilypond versions as
https://github.com/OpenLilyPondFonts/lilyjazz/blob/master/LilyPond-Fonts-Installation-And-Usage.txt
says:
"NOTE: Since LilyPond versions tend to get installed side by side, you 
may need to repeat the process below ..."

?




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Re: Vintage Jazz Chords post in 2011 - Howto get it to display on Fresco?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Not an answer to your quesion, postings from about 2011 might be 
outddated?
but an actual information for real book (hand written) chord style may 
be

https://github.com/OpenLilyPondFonts/lilyjazz
and
http://lilypondblog.org/2013/09/lilypond-and-lilyjazz/
There are some more.
I think to remeber that there had been some postings on the lilypond  
mailing list a couple of weeks ago about this topic, concerning a new 
font library as the old one did not work any more?




Am 24.12.2017 16:49, schrieb Daryls_Produce:

Hi Forum People:

Back in 2011 Nathan Ho posted the following code to share code for 
jazzers

so that they can notate chords in their own way.

http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Jazz-Chord-Symbols-tt10516.html#a196223

I pasted this into Frescabaldi, there were no error, but it didn't 
display

anything!

How do I get it to display?

Your's truel,
Daryl from Daryl's Roadside Vegetable and Produce

% begin %

raisedSharp = \markup \raise #0.6 \sharp

chExceptionMusic = {

  % Major
  1-\markup ""
  1-\markup \small "6"
  1-\markup \small {
\override #`(baseline-skip . 1) {
  \general-align #Y #DOWN \column { "6" "9" }
}
  }

  1-\markup \small "maj7"
  1-\markup \small "maj9"
  1-\markup \small "maj11"
  1-\markup \small "maj13"

  1-\markup \small \concat { "(" \raise #0.6 \sharp "5" ")" }

  % Minor
  1-\markup \small "-"
  1-\markup \small "-6"
  1-\markup \small "-7"
  1-\markup \small "-(maj7)"
  1-\markup \small "-(add9)"
  1-\markup \small "-9"
  1-\markup \small \concat { "-7" \flat "5" }

  % Dominant
  1-\markup \small "7"
  1-\markup \small "9"
  1-\markup \small "11"
  1-\markup \small "13"

  % Dominant alterations
  1-\markup \small \concat { "7" \flat "5" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "9" \flat "5" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "11" \flat "5" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "13" \flat "5" }

  1-\markup \small \concat { "7" \raisedSharp "5" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "9" \raisedSharp "5" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "11" \raisedSharp "5" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "13" \raisedSharp "5" }

  1-\markup \small \concat { "7" \flat "9" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "11" \flat "9" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "13" \flat "9" }

  1-\markup \small \concat { "7" \raisedSharp "9" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "11" \raisedSharp "9" }
  1-\markup \small \concat { "13" \raisedSharp "9" }

  % Suspended
  1-\markup \small "sus2"
  1-\markup \small "7sus2"
  1-\markup \small "add2"

  1-\markup \small "sus4"
  1-\markup \small "7sus4"
  1-\markup \small "add4"
}

chExceptions = #(sequential-music-to-chord-exceptions chExceptionMusic 
#t)


% end %



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Re: Next round on frescobaldi dependencies

[Blöchl Bernhard]

try
sudo apt-get install python3-pyqt5.qtsvg

eventually install
python3-pyqt5.qtwebkit
as well.

Regards

Am 24.12.2017 12:28, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

Am 24-Dec-2017 11:07:32 +0100 schrieb b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net:



Have you installed python3-ly 09.5? The distro repository offers the
old
version 0.9.3-1. That does not work!
Get it from https://pypi.python.org/pypi/python-ly/0.9.5 [1]


Thanks, that's a step forward. At least Frescobaldi now launches
successfully.
Next: When I start opening some menus, very quickly this appears:

 File
"/usr/local/lib/python3.5/dist-packages/frescobaldi-3.0.0-py3.5.egg/frescobaldi_app/snippet/menu.py",
line 64, in populate
 from . import model, snippets, actions
 File
"/usr/local/lib/python3.5/dist-packages/frescobaldi-3.0.0-py3.5.egg/frescobaldi_app/snippet/model.py",
line 34, in 
 from . import snippets
 File
"/usr/local/lib/python3.5/dist-packages/frescobaldi-3.0.0-py3.5.egg/frescobaldi_app/snippet/snippets.py",
line 34, in 
 import symbols
 File
"/usr/local/lib/python3.5/dist-packages/frescobaldi-3.0.0-py3.5.egg/frescobaldi_app/symbols/__init__.py",
line 31, in 
 from PyQt5.QtSvg import QSvgRenderer
ImportError: No module named 'PyQt5.QtSvg'

I used pip3 to install PyQt5, so I'd've hoped it was the right
version…

Best, Simon

Links:
--
[1] https://pypi.python.org/pypi/python-ly/0.9.5


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Re: Next round on frescobaldi dependencies

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Have you installed python3-pyqt5, the python binding for Qt5?
sudo apt install python3-pyqt5
Have you installed python3-ly 09.5? The distro repository offers the old 
version 0.9.3-1. That does not work!

Get it from https://pypi.python.org/pypi/python-ly/0.9.5
Try again
sudo apt install python3-poppler-qt5

On my linux version (UBUNTU_CODENAME=xenial, that is a version 18.x) I 
could install frescobaldi 3.0.0. As I repeatedly pointed out in 
different postings I never could install version 3.0.0 on older ubuntu 
versions. (And I tryed hard!).


Let's check: Had somebody from the list success with frescobaldi 3.0.0 
on an older linux version than ubuntu 18?


check the version with
$ cat /etc/*-release
or
cat /etc/issue
or one of the many other commands for that.

I wish you good luck and all members of the list a merry christmas



Am 23.12.2017 19:34, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

Am 23-Dec-2017 15:49:11 +0100 schrieb noeck.marb...@gmx.de:


Out of curiosity: Did anyone writing here at least try the fix that
I
posted here twice which worked for me?

I.e. installing python3-poppler-qt5_0.24.2-3build1_amd64.deb?


Maybe I didn't - it would hardly be surprising if I had overlooked
specifying python_3_ in one of the many places.
So - now I tried. I take it getting the file from
https://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/amd64/python3-poppler-qt5/download
[1] is correct? The package linked there has "1build1" in its filename
instead of 3build1 - does that make any difference?
Then - how to actually install that?

ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo apt install python3-poppler-qt5
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
python3-poppler-qt5 is already the newest version (0.24.2-1build1).
You might want to run 'apt-get -f install' to correct these:
The following packages have unmet dependencies:
 python3-poppler-qt5 : Depends: sip-py3api-11.2 but it is not
installable
 Depends: libpoppler-qt5-1 (>= 0.24.5) but it is not going to be
installed
 Depends: python3-pyqt5 but it is not installable
E: Unmet dependencies. Try 'apt-get -f install' with no packages (or
specify a solution).
ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo apt-get -f install
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
Correcting dependencies... Done
The following packages will be REMOVED:
 python3-poppler-qt5
0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 1 to remove and 307 not upgraded.
1 not fully installed or removed.
After this operation, 429 kB disk space will be freed.
Do you want to continue? [Y/n] n
Abort.

Best, Simon

Links:
--
[1] 
https://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/amd64/python3-poppler-qt5/download


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Re: Another Timing error?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Helmut Kohl (long time German chancelor) was once heard to say: "What 
counts is what comes out at the other end." Do not think, try this and 
look what comes out at the end:


\version "2.19.80"

upper = \relative c'' {
  \clef treble
  \time 5/4
  \slurUp des,4( \pp\<  % 1st note of array
  \tuplet 3/2{
  8 %1st not from second row retrograde
\!\> %1st symetrical of  1st row
ges)\!\< %2nd sym of 1st row
  }
  \slurDown
  \tuplet 3/2{
^"rall -" % 2nd of 2nd row ret $
\!\mp\> % 2nd sym of 2nd row ret &&&
d' \fermata % 3rd note of sec row ret & symetry $ / &&&
   % aes''>
  }
  \tuplet 4/4{
   r16
   e des ees\!
  }

  4\pp

}

  lower = \relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 5/4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r8
  e4\pp

  }


\score {
  \new PianoStaff <<
\set PianoStaff.instrumentName = #"Piano  "
\new Staff = "upper" \upper
\new Staff = "lower" \lower
  >>
  \layout { }
  \midi { }
}

Am 10.12.2017 17:45, schrieb Vivyan:
I thought it would make sense to have 3 over four quarter notes rather 
than

half notes?



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Re: Another Timing error?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Helmut Kohl (long time German chancelor) was once heard to say"  What 
counts is what comes out at the other end." Do not think, try this and 
look what comes out at the end:


\version "2.19.80"

upper = \relative c'' {
  \clef treble
  \time 5/4
  \slurUp des,4( \pp\<  % 1st note of array
  \tuplet 3/2{
  8 %1st not from second row retrograde
\!\> %1st symetrical of  1st row
ges)\!\< %2nd sym of 1st row
  }
  \slurDown
  \tuplet 3/2{
^"rall -" % 2nd of 2nd row ret $
\!\mp\> % 2nd sym of 2nd row ret &&&
d' \fermata % 3rd note of sec row ret & symetry $ / &&&
   % aes''>
  }
  \tuplet 4/4{
   r16
   e des ees\!
  }

  4\pp

}

  lower = \relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 5/4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r8
  e4\pp

  }


\score {
  \new PianoStaff <<
\set PianoStaff.instrumentName = #"Piano  "
\new Staff = "upper" \upper
\new Staff = "lower" \lower
  >>
  \layout { }
  \midi { }
}


Am 10.12.2017 18:10, schrieb Phil Holmes:
- Original Message - From: "Vivyan" 


To: 
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2017 4:45 PM
Subject: Re: Another Timing error?


I thought it would make sense to have 3 over four quarter notes rather 
than

half notes?


The quarter notes thing is irrelevant.  It's 3 notes in the space
normally occupied by 2.

--
Phil Holmes


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Re: Another Timing error?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Polite questin:
Hve you read the chapter of the manual I sent you some time ago?
There are some other (unpolite) versions of that question.




Am 10.12.2017 17:45, schrieb Vivyan:
I thought it would make sense to have 3 over four quarter notes rather 
than

half notes?



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Re: Frescobaldi 3,.0 CRAHES

[Blöchl Bernhard]

What does "installed blindly" mean?

ubuntu studio? The actual version is 17.10, eventaully based in ubuntu 
17.10. I used that as well and tried hard to get frescobaldi 3.0.0 
installed, but never succeeded. That is true for other ubuntu blends 
based on versions older than 18.2.


May be it will do with actual (and correct) libraries in the correct 
python3 versions.


Regards


Am 08.12.2017 20:04, schrieb Son_V:

It's the second message on the same subject I post, but I don't see the
first, in case excuse me...
If I try to open a .ly file in Frescobaldi 3.0 (installed blindly as an
update) it (Frescobaldi) crashes in a breath.
What can I do? Thanks.



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Re: Python dependencies: plea for help

[Blöchl Bernhard]

There is not remarked which fresobaldi version you try to install? With 
frescobaldi 3.0.0 I found that python-poppler-qt5 does notb work, 
python3-poppler-qt5 is needed!!


I did not get frescobaldi 3.0.0 on Linux mint 17 (did not try 16), tried 
tons of library versions.


In general I found the error messages confusing. Example: popplerqt5 
cannot load, but because frescobaldi 3.0.0 uses python3 exclusively 
python3-poppler-qt5 will be needed- is in the repository of mint 18.2 
beside some other versions.


I needed long time and experiments to manage that as a dummy computer 
user. And I could not get frescobaldi installed on mint versions older 
than 18.2.


Regards

Am 08.12.2017 23:06, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

Hello everybody,

following the post by Vincenzo I take the liberty of turning to this
group for advice, even if it’s OT. It’s such a hassle working with
LilyPond without Frescobaldi, and I couldn’t solve the problem
described in .

So I beg your pardon and beg for advice on how to proceed, even if
it’s just about how to completely purge all of python3.x and
frescobaldi and the packages inbetween and reinstalling so that
everything works…

Best, Simon


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Re: Frescobaldi 3.0 CRASHES

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I am just jumping into that thread and have not read the rest of the 
conversation.
I did not get to run frescobaldi  3.0.0 on my Linux mate 17.04, 
python-ly did not work which version ever i tried. I installed Linux 
mint 18.2 Sonja 64 bit a couple of weeks ago and gave frescobaldi 3.0.0 
another try and got it to work after lots of updates of libraries to the 
python3 (!) versions. As far as I remember

python3-pyQt5 (from repository?)
python 3-ly 0.9.3-1 from https://python.org/pypi/python-ly.tar.gz (as I 
remember (?) had to install pypi as well - if it is not necessary it is 
not wrong)
Then got the message popplerqt5 cannot load, the error message 
popplerqt5 is misleading as python3-poppler-qt5 is needed

installed python3-poppler-qt5 0.2.4.2-1build1 from repository

The warnings and error messages are misleding as often it is not 
mentioned explicitly that the python3 version is needed. are different versions and builds in the repository. I needed some time 
to figure that out. I recommend to make this messages more specific, 
that could smoothen the installation process.


At least frescobaldi was starting an running for my needs.

If I try to import from "Vorlage", in english eventually "template" ? 
frescobaldi crashes -> PyQt5.QtSvg. I can use frescobaldi as long as iI 
do not use that menu item. Maybe some more issues arise while using?


Regards





Am 09.12.2017 09:22, schrieb Urs Liska:

Am 9. Dezember 2017 09:17:21 MEZ schrieb Simon Albrecht
:

On 09.12.2017 00:56, Noeck wrote:

I'm not too familiar with Ubuntu's update path, but is it possible

for

you to upgrade to 17.04 - maybe the poppler issue has been resolved

in

later releases? Just an idea for testing. If you're not wanting to

leave

your older-but-stable OS, I totally understand.

With 17.04 I had to install an older python3-poppler-qt5 as described
above to solve the issue. But with 17.10 Frescobaldi works again out

of

the box on my computer.


Until now I’ve stuck to my resolve to not open that can of potential
problems coming with less stable Ubuntu versions. How much of a risk 
is


there?


In general or specifically for LilyPond?
Frescobaldi has the discussed issue, *compiling* LilyPond is pretty
specific issue due to the infamous Guile2 problem - but I think in
general it's fairly safe to use the latest Ubuntu releases.
However, weren't you one of those who "enjoyed" the fun of a major
version update? ;-)

Urs



Best, Simon

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Re: Another Timing error?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

In "lower" you have 4 quarter rests an eighth rest and a quarter note, 
makes 5 quarters and an eighths. Should produce an error message? Might 
be an error? I am not an expert.


Am 04.12.2017 15:16, schrieb Vivyan:
I'm expecting the score so far to be within one meter. I'm using threes 
over
four. It does prefer when I put 3 over two, but I'm sure two is too 
long a

duration surly for what I need here?


[code]
\version "2.19.80"

upper = \relative c'' {
  \clef treble
  \time 5/4
  \slurUp des,4( \pp\<  % 1st note of array
  \tuplet 3/4{
  8 %1st not from second row retrograde
\!\> %1st symetrical of  1st row
ges)\!\< %2nd sym of 1st row
  }
  \slurDown
  \tuplet 3/4{
^"rall -" % 2nd of 2nd row ret $
\!\mp\> % 2nd sym of 2nd row ret &&&
d' \fermata % 3rd note of sec row ret & symetry $ / &&&
   % aes''>
  }
  \tuplet 4/4{
   r16
   e des ees\!
  }

  4\pp

}

  lower = \relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 5/4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r8
  e4\pp

  }


\score {
  \new PianoStaff <<
\set PianoStaff.instrumentName = #"Piano  "
\new Staff = "upper" \upper
\new Staff = "lower" \lower
  >>
  \layout { }
  \midi { }
}



[\code]



--
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Re: Another Timing error?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/writing-rhythms
use 3/2 instead of 3/4?

Regards


Am 04.12.2017 15:16, schrieb Vivyan:
I'm expecting the score so far to be within one meter. I'm using threes 
over
four. It does prefer when I put 3 over two, but I'm sure two is too 
long a

duration surly for what I need here?


[code]
\version "2.19.80"

upper = \relative c'' {
  \clef treble
  \time 5/4
  \slurUp des,4( \pp\<  % 1st note of array
  \tuplet 3/4{
  8 %1st not from second row retrograde
\!\> %1st symetrical of  1st row
ges)\!\< %2nd sym of 1st row
  }
  \slurDown
  \tuplet 3/4{
^"rall -" % 2nd of 2nd row ret $
\!\mp\> % 2nd sym of 2nd row ret &&&
d' \fermata % 3rd note of sec row ret & symetry $ / &&&
   % aes''>
  }
  \tuplet 4/4{
   r16
   e des ees\!
  }

  4\pp

}

  lower = \relative c {
  \clef bass
  \time 5/4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r4
  r8
  e4\pp

  }


\score {
  \new PianoStaff <<
\set PianoStaff.instrumentName = #"Piano  "
\new Staff = "upper" \upper
\new Staff = "lower" \lower
  >>
  \layout { }
  \midi { }
}



[\code]



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Re: Security problem: lilypond-invoke-editor

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Is this the well documented Windows URI security flaw dicussed about 
2007?


https://www.networkworld.com/article/2286774/lan-wan/microsoft-to-fix-uri-security-flaw-after-criticism.html

https://blog.mozilla.org/security/2007/07/23/related-security-issue-in-url-protocol-handling-on-windows/

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa767914(v=vs.85).aspx

If so, isn't that resolved already?

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=389106

Regards

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=389106Am 23.11.2017 10:11, 
schrieb Knut Petersen:

Hi everybody!

12 years ago a security problem was introduced into 
lilypond-invoke-editor.

On 2017/11/15 the problem was reported to the bug-lilypond mailing
list by Gabriel Corona.

If you decided to install lilypond-invoke-editor helper as a general
URI helper, you _are_ affected.

If you decided to install lilypond-invoke-editor to only handle
textedit URIs (or if you do not use it at all) you are _not_ affected.

If you do not know if you are affected:

1.: locate lilypond-invoke-editor

2. Open lilypond-invoke-editor in your favorite text editor. Search for

   (if (is-textedit-uri? uri)
 (run-editor uri)
 (run-browser uri)

and replace it with

   (if (is-textedit-uri? uri)
     (run-editor uri)

Knut

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Re:[OT] Linux Users

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Deeply interesting information.
http://orgmode.org/#docs
http://orgmode.org/org.pdf
Nice. But I think for literate programmers only .

Regards

Am 19.11.2017 04:08, schrieb James Harkins:

FWIW, Emacs org-mode is a really nice way to integrate LaTeX and
LilyPond for articles.

org-mode exports to LaTeX.

org-babel can automatically run LilyPond source blocks embedded in the
org document, generating EPS and dropping it seamlessly into the LaTeX
document. If you wrap the source block in a figure, you get a caption,
index number and references for free.

hjh


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Re: [OT] Linux Users

[Blöchl Bernhard]

LaTex, Lyx and Csound are not Linux specific.
Concerning Latex, Latex uses/references to lilypond as one of the 
possible music writing tools

How to write music with LaTeX
https://martin-thoma.com/how-to-write-music-with-latex/

Indeed I think about using LaTex with Lilypond. the preprocessor called 
lilypond-book lets you mix LaTeX code with Lilypond code in one source 
file.

Sample usage: tsst.lytex contains this:

\documentclass{article}
\begin{document}
\begin[quote,fragment,staffsize=26]{lilypond}
c' d' e'
\end{lilypond}
\end{document}

I used that many years ago. I do not know if it still works. I found a 
link from 2013:

http://lilypondblog.org/2013/07/creating-songbooks-with-lilypond-and-latex/
If so it might be documented in the Manual? (I have I have not used 
LaTex since abou a decade. Actually I sometime use the much more 
comfortable Lyx http://www.lyx.org/ instead of Latex. I do not know how 
to use Lilypond seamlessly - would be necessary for large music texts. 
for smaller texts The Graphics from Lilypond-Book can be inserted.


One can embed Latex code into a Lyx document. I do not know if that 
Latex snippet above will work as insert code. If I find some time I will 
try. Indeed I plan a larger music project where this might be helpful. I 
Prefer the document processor Lyx over Latex.


I have not used  csound. But I bookmarked the link for score preparation 
for future investigation

http://strasheela.sourceforge.net/strasheela/doc/MusicRepresentation.html#sec8
and I found
https://www.mail-archive.com/lilypond-user@gnu.org/msg36498.html

Regards





Am 18.11.2017 08:31, schrieb Jaime:

What do you mean by graphical tools?
J
Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 17, 2017, at 5:59 PM, Brett M. Gilio  
wrote:


How many Linux users are out there in the Lilypond community? Do any 
of
you use other type-setting software such as LaTeX or Csound rather 
than

graphical tools?


BMG

--
Brett M. Gilio
B.S. Biological Sciences
B.M. Music Composition
http://www.brettgilio.com/


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Re: [OT] Grammatic gender

[Blöchl Bernhard]

In this example ... Der Vogelsberg, wo's.." the apostrophe makes the 
sentence ambiguous. Grammatically it is correct, however the apostrophe 
can stand for "es" or "das" (non PC). The version "...wos " is not 
correct and not used in correct German.


Regards

Am 17.11.2017 10:48, schrieb Knut Petersen:

Am 17.11.2017 um 08:55 schrieb Henning Hraban Ramm:

The wrong use of an apostrophe in German is called "Deppen-Apostroph" 
(Deppostroph?), it shows only that you don’t master your mother 
language.


Sometimes an apostrophe completely changes the meaning of a sentence:

"Der Vogelsberg, wo's Vögeln gut geht."   !=  "Der Vogelsberg, wos
Vögeln gut geht." ;-))

Knut



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Re: [OT] Grammatic gender

[Blöchl Bernhard]

https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Maid
Maid, die
Wortart: ℹ Substantiv, feminin
Gebrauch: veraltet, noch spöttisch
https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Magd
Magd, die
Wortart: ℹ Substantiv, feminin
Häufigkeit: ℹ▮▮▯▯▯

For explanatory details of the semantic field of use please check the 
links to the "Duden". The Duden has a normativ power for the German 
language!


Annother usefull help may be
https://www.dict.cc/deutsch-englisch/Maid.html
https://www.dict.cc/?s=magd

Have fun with linguistic sophistry!

Regards



Am 14.11.2017 23:47, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

On 14.11.2017 18:54, Wols Lists wrote:

It's the same with gender - and that can also be confusing especially
when making a diminutive. "Die Frau" (feminine), "Das Fraulein"
(neuter). "Die Mad", "Das Madchen" likewise.


Actually, the base word is „Die Maid“. Mark Twain has famously and
hilariously roasted the German language, partly for its use of
grammatic gender :-)


  Again, here English is very
unusual because words do not have a gender (the objects they refer to
may, but that's different ... :-)


How would that be true? It may seem so, because the articles for all
three genders are the same, but words are referred to by ‘he’, ‘she’,
or ‘it’. In English the sun is male, the moon female (like in most
languages, and unlike in German, where it’s the other way around).
Only yesterday I talked with an American native english speaker about
the grammatic gender of death; she said it could be all three,
depending on circumstances…

Best, Simon

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Re: double time signature problem

[Blöchl Bernhard]

...
(neuter). "Die Mad", "Das Madchen" likewise. Again, here English is 
very

unusual ...


I argue there is meant "Die Magd", "das Mädchen" for maid/maiden in the 
job sensefarmgirl or maidservant. I argue Magd instead of Mad. (My 
talent for languages is absolutely nought.)


Regards



Cheers,
Wol

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Re: lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh

[Blöchl Bernhard]

May be I have not correctly explained the problem.

First, I HAVE installed a 64bit version of Linux
Aspire-ES1-571 ~ $ uname -a
Linux bb-Aspire-ES1-571 4.10.0-38-generic #42~16.04.1-Ubuntu SMP Tue Oct 
10 16:30:51 UTC 2017 i686 i686 i686 GNU/Linux


Second, as a fact I CANNOT get installed the 64bit version of lilypond 
on that system! I only could install the 32bit version and I did. At 
least I have a running version of lilypond.


But I wanted to make that curiousity public. Do have other users that 
experience?


Regards BB


Am 01.11.2017 09:44, schrieb  bit version of Linux
David Kastrup:

Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net> writes:


The 32 bit lilypond installs without problem. No further problem.

I find it curious that a 64 bit linux installs seamlessly on that
laptop.


Why wouldn't it?  Most modern CPUs support 64 bit mode.


Linux Mint definitely does not install a 64 bit version on a 32 bit
systems but definitely cries for a 32 bit install.


Your laptop is perfectly fine with 64 bit systems.  But you installed a
32 bit system.  Which the laptop is fine with also.  But current CPUs
tend to be optimized for performance in 64 bit mode, so unless your
physical memory and disk space make it prudent to stick with 32 bits
(like having less than 4GB of main memory or your disk almost filled
up), upgrading to 64 bit systems makes sense.


Concerning to reports about Pentium 3556U
it offers 64-bit OS support, Features SSE3 / SSE4.1 / SSE4.2
instructions
May be "OS support" is something less then full 64 bit support? (May
be a possible explanation.)


Your CPU would support 64 bit systems, but you are not running a 64 bit
system.

A 32 bit kernel _cannot_ run 64 bit code, even if the CPU itself would
be capable of it.

In contrast, a 64 bit kernel can be made to run 32 bit applications as
well.  Within limits: some ioctl calls are inherently system dependent,
so running 32bit sound applications (for example) on a 64 bit kernel is
likely to cause trouble.


Eventually there is a compiler option missing in make? I do not do
further analyses.


Make has nothing to do with it.


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Re: lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Thanks, I installed 32 bi lilypond in the meantime.

Am 01.11.2017 01:15, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

On 31.10.2017 18:22, Blöchl Bernhard wrote:
tried to install lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh on Acer Aspire E 15 
with intel Pentium 3556 prozessor (l3 Cache)


...
Warning: this build is not optimized for your architecture;
please install a i686 build instead.

Press C to install the program anyway (not recommended),
...
What to do now?


Obviously, you need the 32bit build at
<http://download.linuxaudio.org/lilypond/binaries/linux-x86/lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-x86.sh>.
See
<https://askubuntu.com/questions/444394/what-is-the-meaning-of-i686-in-ubuntu>
for more information.

Best, Simon

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Re: lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh

[Blöchl Bernhard]

The 32 bit lilypond installs without problem. No further problem.

I find it curious that a 64 bit linux installs seamlessly on that 
laptop. Linux Mint definitely does not install a 64 bit version on a 32 
bit systems but definitely cries for a 32 bit install.


Concerning to reports about Pentium 3556U
it offers 64-bit OS support, Features SSE3 / SSE4.1 / SSE4.2 
instructions
May be "OS support" is something less then full 64 bit support? (May be 
a possible explanation.)


Eventually there is a compiler option missing in make? I do not do 
further analyses.


Thanks anyway and regards BB


Am 31.10.2017 23:12, schrieb David Kastrup:

[Public Cc since you apparently only mailed me with your answer]

Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net> writes:


Am 31.10.2017 22:29, schrieb David Kastrup:

Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net> writes:


cannot install  lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh

 *-cpu:0
   Beschreibung: CPU
   Produkt: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 3556U @ 1.70GHz
   Hersteller: Intel Corp.
   Physische ID: 4
   Bus-Informationen: cpu@0
   Version: 6.5.1
   Seriennummer: 0004-0651----
   Steckplatz: U3E1
   Größe: 1201MHz
   Kapazität: 1700MHz
   Breite: 64 bits
   Takt: 100MHz

I have installed the 64 bit-Version of linux mint 18.2 mate "Sonya"


Sounds very much like you didn't.

What does

arch

reply?




Aspire-ES1-571 ~ $ arch
i686


That is a 32-bit system.  A 64-bit system would reply x86_64 instead.


Intel Product Specifications for Intel® Pentium® Processor 3556U
(
https://ark.intel.com/products/76621/Intel-Pentium-Processor-3556U-2M-Cache-1_70-GHz
)tells:
...
Intel® 64 ‡ Yes
Instruction Set 64-bit
...


That just means that your processor would be capable of running a 
64-bit

system.  Not that it is currently running one.


Aspire-ES1-571 ~/lilypond/usr/share $ lilypond -v
/home/bb/lilypond/usr/bin/lilypond: 1:
/home/bb/lilypond/usr/bin/lilypond: Syntax error: ")" unexpected


That's typical for calling 64bit executables on a 32bit system.


Indeed it is strange!


Note that this can also mean that you are running inside of 32-bit
container or VM.  Either way the level you are trying to install/run
LilyPond under is a 32-bit system.


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lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh

[Blöchl Bernhard]

cannot install  lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh

 *-cpu:0
   Beschreibung: CPU
   Produkt: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 3556U @ 1.70GHz
   Hersteller: Intel Corp.
   Physische ID: 4
   Bus-Informationen: cpu@0
   Version: 6.5.1
   Seriennummer: 0004-0651----
   Steckplatz: U3E1
   Größe: 1201MHz
   Kapazität: 1700MHz
   Breite: 64 bits
   Takt: 100MHz

I have installed the 64 bit-Version of linux mint 18.2 mate "Sonya"

I get:
...
Warning: this build is not optimized for your architecture;
please install a i686 build instead.

Press C to install the program anyway (not recommended),
E to only extract the program files, or any other key to exit.
C
Ignoring architecture incompatibility.

I installed anyway

You are about to install LilyPond in /home/bb/lilypond
A script in /home/bb/bin will be created as a shortcut.

but get

Aspire-ES1-571 ~/lilypond/usr/share $ lilypond -v
/home/bb/lilypond/usr/bin/lilypond: 1: 
/home/bb/lilypond/usr/bin/lilypond: Syntax error: ")" unexpected


After cleaning (uninstall does not work as well) I installed 
lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-x86.sh with success.



Regards


PS: My first post did not arrive concerning to my mail system? If this 
mail is double, I am sorry.


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lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh

[Blöchl Bernhard]

tried to install lilypond-2.19.80-1.linux-64.sh on Acer Aspire E 15 with 
intel Pentium 3556 prozessor (l3 Cache)


...
Warning: this build is not optimized for your architecture;
please install a i686 build instead.

Press C to install the program anyway (not recommended),
...
What to do now?

Regards

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Fwd: Re: Problem with partial measure at the beginning of the piece

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Sorry, for some reply mails I (faulty) pressed the wrong send button and 
sent it private. Here the last mail out of that sequence (of three) for 
some correction.


Regards

 Originalnachricht 
Betreff: Re: Problem with partial measure at the beginning of the piece
Datum: 18.09.2016 13:03
Von: bb 
An: Serious Fun 

\relative c'' {
%\global
% Music follows here.
\partial 16 * 5 % that already was a guess in a reply
e,16
%\noBeam
\tuplet 3/2 {g8 e g} |
... etc

There is a chapter in the manual for the version you use:
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/learning/advanced-rhythmic-commands.en.html
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/learning/advanced-rhythmic-commands.en.html

If you work intensively with lilypond trial and error is not efficient, 
you cannot avoid reading the appropriate chapters of the manual.



Am 18.09.2016 um 11:15 schrieb Serious Fun:

right = \relative c'' {

%\global

% Music follows here.

\partial 16 * 4

e,16

%\noBeam

\tuplet 3/2 {g8 e g} |  % 1/8

a8. [a16] % 2x 1/8 = 1/4

r4 % 1x1/4

r8.  a,16 % 1x 1/4
\noBeam
d8. c16 | %1x1/4

cis8. c16 %1x 1/4

}



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Re: makam.ly and Staff.keySignature

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I switched to another piece of code that was published a while ago, 
where \key works. At least for the european standard keys.
It uses the turkish clef (the morrored flat) for half diminished instead 
of the arab slashed flat.


Regards

Would be nice to get that makam.ly in combination with 
Staff.keySignature a bit better documented in the manual.


Am 23.08.2016 21:45, schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

I use makam.ly and found that
\key g \minor
does not work (no Glyph found ...)
Tried as a test
\set Staff.keySignature = #`(((0 . 6) . ,FLAT) ((0 . 5) . ,FLAT))
same result.
I tried an example from the reference as well

freygish = #`((0 . ,NATURAL) (1 . ,FLAT) (2 . ,NATURAL)
(3 . ,NATURAL) (4 . ,NATURAL) (5 . ,FLAT) (6 . ,FLAT))

\key c \freygish

same negative result.

I use Farahfaza (
http://www.maqamworld.com/maqamat/nahawand.html#farahfaza ), that is a
Nahawand transposed to g and compares to our g minor.

How can I get a key signature with makam.ly?

Thanks for any help and regards

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makam.ly and Staff.keySignature

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I use makam.ly and found that
\key g \minor
does not work (no Glyph found ...)
Tried as a test
\set Staff.keySignature = #`(((0 . 6) . ,FLAT) ((0 . 5) . ,FLAT))
same result.
I tried an example from the reference as well

freygish = #`((0 . ,NATURAL) (1 . ,FLAT) (2 . ,NATURAL)
(3 . ,NATURAL) (4 . ,NATURAL) (5 . ,FLAT) (6 . ,FLAT))

\key c \freygish

same negative result.

I use Farahfaza ( 
http://www.maqamworld.com/maqamat/nahawand.html#farahfaza ), that is a 
Nahawand transposed to g and compares to our g minor.


How can I get a key signature with makam.ly?

Thanks for any help and regards

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Re: LilyPond logo?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I recommend a simple solution:
Do not use it!

Am 06.08.2016 18:25, schrieb Graham Percival:

Why the emphasis on water flowers in the logo?  The important part
of LilyPond is the beautifully-engraved sheet music, not botany.



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Re: Installing on Ubuntu Studio

[Blöchl Bernhard]

"... I mean the possibility to work directly
on Lilipond without Frescobaldi or Denemo, writing code on Lilypond's
own text editor and compiling it in Lilypond as well ..."

http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/usage/command_002dline-usage


Am 05.07.2016 13:44, schrieb Phil Holmes:


I assume the editor that ships with the Mac is the little LilyPad
editor. This is a very rudimentary text editor, and can be replaced
with any other text editor of your choice. On my Linux system I use
gedit, but there are many other editors that you can use.

--
Phil Holmes

- Original Message -
FROM: Marcelo Carneiro de Lima
TO: Andrew Bernard
CC: lilypond-user@gnu.org
SENT: Tuesday, July 05, 2016 12:36 PM
SUBJECT: Re: Installing on Ubuntu Studio

Thanks for the reply. When I say "Gui" I mean the same interface I
have on Mac OS, for instance. I mean the possibility to work directly
on Lilipond without Frescobaldi or Denemo, writing code on Lilypond's
own text editor and compiling it in Lilypond as well. When I
downloaded Lilipond for Linux and installed it, no icon for launch the
software appears, no direct access to it, just by Frescobaldi. So, I
cannot work only with Lilypond's software, I have to use others, like
Denemo and Frescobaldi. Instead of the 'pond' icon, like when I
installed it on Mac, I have...nothing.
Thanks
Best Regards
Marcelo

Em segunda-feira, 4 de julho de 2016, Andrew Bernard
 escreveu:

Hi Marcelo,

There is no GUI for lilypond on Linux, only command line, as per any
UNIX tool. Frescobaldi is a fine GUI environment many find.

Andrew

On 5 July 2016 at 9:20:23 AM, Marcelo Carneiro de Lima
(marcelo.arc...@gmail.com) wrote:

Hi,
Despite the fact that the installations seemed to be fine, I cannot
access Lilypond Gui (texts, menus, etc).

--

MARCELO CARNEIRO
(21) 9382-3621
(21) 3497-0193
Skype: Carneiro3729

-

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Re: NR 2.10.2 - arabic key signatures

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 05.07.2016 11:43, schrieb Federico Bruni:

Il giorno lun 4 lug 2016 alle 12:10, Carl Sorensen
 ha scritto:



On 7/1/16 5:08 AM, "Federico Bruni"  wrote:


Hi all

In the following paragraph, taken from
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/arabic-music#arabic-k
ey-signatures


 Other maqams in the same bayati group, as shown in the table below:
 (bayati, hussaini, saba, and ushaq) can be indicated in the same 
way.

 These are all variations of the base and most common maqam in the
 group, which is bayati. They usually differ from the base maqam in
 their upper tetrachords, or certain flow details that don¹t change
 their fundamental nature, as siblings.


The last sentence seems quite obscure to me. What are "flow details"?
What are "siblings" in this context?


I think that "flow details" and "siblings" are arabic music terms, 
rather

than LilyPond internal terms.


ok



See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_maqam

Although, I can't really understand that wikipedia page either.  It
appears that maqams are so different from traditional western music 
that

the terms are very difficult to relate.


In this page:
http://www.maqamworld.com/maqamat.html

it talks about "melodic flow":

Another peculiarity of maqamat is that the same note is not always 
played with the same exact pitch. The pitch may vary slightly, 
depending on the __melodic flow__ and what other notes are played 
before and after that note. The idea behind this effect is to round 
sharp corners in the melody by drawing the furthest notes nearer. This 
effect is sometimes called the law of attraction or gravity, and is 
common in other musical traditions (e.g. in Byzantine music).


Perhaps the doc is implicitely about "melodic flow details"?
Then what would "siblings" mean in that context?




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That text of the manual is not a description of any real feature of 
lilypond, but describes the nature of arabic/turkish music in a very 
superficial form. Simply ignore it, it will not help you in any form - 
that is my personal opinion.


Arabic music/notation is different, as the arabic scale is 24-tet, 
whereas the Ottoman classical music uses a 53-tet scale. You easily find 
someone saying that is nonsense ... I simply agree, as it is 
oversimplified as well.


There had been some suggestions to extend lilypond for correct notation 
of arabic/turkish music. You might find mails about that attempts in the 
archive. But there was no real interest to add this feature to lilypond.


Regards

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Re: Cannot install lilypond on a shared Hostmonster server

[Blöchl Bernhard]

why /home1/myusername?
Normally linux uses /home/myusername
without a one.

Am 05.06.2016 16:43, schrieb David Wright:

Just a quick note before I go off to do real work...

On Sun 05 Jun 2016 at 07:49:41 (+), Mike wrote:

> > [~]# bash lilypond_install/lilypond-2.18.2-1.linux-64.sh --prefix lilypond
>   
> I can't understand this. It looks like root's prompt, not a user's.

It's just my user's prompt. It shows that I'm in my home dir.



[~]# pwd ; ls -l lilypond/usr/lib/libgs* 
lilypond/usr/etc/fonts/conf.d/

/home1/myusername
/bin/ls: cannot access lilypond/usr/lib/libgs*: No such file or 
directory
/bin/ls: cannot access lilypond/usr/etc/fonts/conf.d/: No such file or 
directory


[~]# pwd ; ls -l lilypond/lilypond/usr/lib/libgs*
lilypond/lilypond/usr/etc/fonts/conf.d/
/home1/myusername
-rwxr-xr-x 1 myusername myusername 6094432 Mar 17  2014
lilypond/lilypond/usr/lib/libgs.so.8.70*

lilypond/lilypond/usr/etc/fonts/conf.d/:
total 16
drwxr-xr-x 2 myusername myusername 4096 Oct  6  2013 ./
drwxr-xr-x 4 myusername myusername 4096 Mar 17  2014 ../
-rw-r--r-- 1 myusername myusername  180 Jun  5 01:34 00-lilypond.conf
lrwxrwxrwx 1 myusername myusername   39 Jun  5 01:34
20-fix-globaladvance.conf -> ../conf.avail/20-fix-globaladvance.conf


Interesting that you had to descend a level to see those links.

My suggestion is that you reinstall with the script just as I showed,
using a unique, non-existing prefix. The obvious prefix is
lilypond-2.18.2-1 which includes the version number. I'm *guessing*
that you've tried to install into directory that's already
populated.

Cheers,
David.

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Re: Embedding LilyPond in iOS app?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

from http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/web-big-page

Etude, “sheet music on steroids” is an iPhone app which displays piano 
music engraved with LilyPond, including many pieces from Mutopia. The 
app includes a virtual piano keyboard showing which keys to press to 
help beginners learn how to read sheet music.


That does not necessarily mean that lilypond is running on iOS and that 
it can produce pdf's. But iOS must be able to interprete lilypond code, 
supposedly one of the graphical presentations.




Am 30.05.2016 00:48, schrieb RonH:
But according to the LilyPond web site, this app was made with 
LilyPond:


http://etudeapp.com/

Doesn't that imply that it can be embedded in iOS?

RonH



--
View this message in context:
http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Embedding-LilyPond-in-iOS-app-tp190782p191141.html
Sent from the User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: Replying to posts

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 26.04.2016 01:16, schrieb Kieren MacMillan:

Hello all,


keep the fancy stuff for when it's needed.


Like PGP?  ;)

Regards,
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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A PGP signature has typically about 832 Byte. That does mean with 
1Mbit/s this signature needs 0,006656 s to be transfered. You need very, 
very fast thumbs to twiddle your thumbs in that time while waiting.


Best

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Re: Fw: new message

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 25.04.2016 15:45, schrieb MarcM:

Hello!

YOU HAVE A NEW MESSAGE, PLEASE READ
http://seguridadbravo.com/agreement.php [1]

[hidden email] [2]

-
 View this message in context: Fw: new message [3]
 Sent from the User mailing list archive [4] at Nabble.com.


Links:
--
[1] http://seguridadbravo.com/agreement.php?lsu4
[2]
http://webmailer.telecolumbus.net/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node=190013=0
[3] http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Fw-new-message-tp190013.html
[4] http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/User-f3.html

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Got this message multiple - SPAM?

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Re: Replying to posts

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Nonsense, to stay polite!

Have you ever heard of ASCII? If not, google ...

Am 25.04.2016 14:39, schrieb Tim McNamara:

On Apr 25, 2016, at 5:00 AM, Andrew Bernard 
wrote:
 what is now an out of date standard
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Re: How to get swing feel from dotted notation?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Music is written to be easily readable, and the musician is trusted to 
adopt the correct performance practice. But midi is not a feeling 
musician, it is a machine. It does not know the swing concept of unequal 
durations.


In conventional notation there is only possible 50/50 and 75/25, the 
equivalent of a dotted quaver and a consequent semiquaver. The real 
swing has a duration relation of about 67/33 (music scientists say) 
while the notation shows a relationship of 50/50.


Is'nt it possible to provide a "swing button" for 67/33 for to make the 
midi file swinging, but leaves the 50/50 notation in the pdf untouched?





Am 31.03.2016 08:51, schrieb David Kastrup:

Henry Law  writes:


On 31/03/16 01:48, Colin Campbell wrote:

into more of a triplet effect


If I, as a sometime jazz player, were trying to communicate the effect
of "swing" then I'd say, summarising brutally and rather inaccurately,
"It's written as 4/4 but played as 12/8."

In other words the player adds something that's not written down,


If typeset properly, the spacing will be swung as well (if you have 2
eighths against 3 eighth triplets, the second eighth will be aligned
with the last triplet, for example).


which is going to make it rather hard for you to generate MIDI which,
since it's generated from the written-down bits, is /ipso facto/
lacking the "feel" that the player adds.


8*4/3 8*2/3 should work for both typesetting as well as Midi.  But 
you'd

really want to have some music function to do the swinging rather than
having to do it manually for every note.


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Re: lilyjazz

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I actually tried  the example code but it does not compile.
1. My ily-file is LilyJAZZ, not lilyjazz - is there a newer version 
available?

2. I get a Warning:
 »(gs -q -dSAFER -dDEVICEWIDTHPOINTS=595.28 -dDEVICEHEIGHTPOINTS=841.89 
-dCompatibilityLevel=1.4 -dNOPAUSE -dBATCH -r1200 -sDEVICE=pdfwrite 
-sOutputFile=jazztest.pdf -c.setpdfwrite -f/tmp/lilypond-INH2ac)« 
gescheitert (256)

and no pdf.

Am 26.03.2016 15:14, schrieb Christoph Friedrich:

Good Morning

i am (like some others) also trying use lilyjazz with LP 2.19.32 and
Frescobaldi on a Mac.  It seems to run and i am getting a result, but
for some reasons the title /composer /piece and also the chord letters
appear in a „normal“ font, not in lilyjazz-text. Did anybody have
similar problem and could solve it?
Thank you very much


this is what i wrote:

%---
\version "2.19.36"
\include "lilyjazz.ily"

%\paper { #(define fonts (set-global-fonts #:music "lilyjazz" #:brace
"lilyjazz" #:roman "lilyjazz-text" #:sans "lilyjazz-chord" #:factor (/
staff-height pt 20) )) }

#(set-default-paper-size "a4" 'portrait)

\header {
title = "lilyjazz test"
composer = "Com Poser"
piece = "Latin"
}

staffmelody = \new Staff {
\set Staff.midiInstrument = #"acoustic grand"
\set Staff.instrumentName = #""
\time 4/4
\tempo "" 2 = 90
\clef treble
\key ees \major
\relative c' {
r1 r r r  \repeat volta 2  {
c4 d e f g

}}}


harmonies = \chordmode {  \set majorSevenSymbol = \markup { maj7 }

ees1:7 s s s  \break
ees1:7 s s s  \break
}

\score {

<<
\new ChordNames { \set chordChanges = ##t \harmonies}
\staffmelody
>>

\midi {
}

  \layout {
  }
}

\paper {
}



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Re: Question about Denemo accessibility with mac with voice overfor Richard Shann possibly?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Sorry for multiple replies, but I forgot to send this link
https://accessiblemusicnotation.wordpress.com/
I think, as your are willing to help, that might be the rewarding target 
...


Am 11.03.2016 19:06, schrieb Richard Shann:

On Thu, 2016-03-10 at 19:18 -0600, Daniel Contreras wrote:

Hello everyone,


Lilypond has been my go to software for the past few semesters and I
have found it very useful and I am very grateful to all who have
contributed to its development.  My question is about the Denemo
software,


denemo-de...@gnu.org is the place to ask...


 particularly the possibility of making it accessible for blind users.
I know that may be a long shot, but I am willing to help in anyway
that i can. If anyone is interested, and or if this is even remotely
possible, i haved copied a link which will hopefully be useful.


I think it is indeed a long shot, Denemo is very short of developers :(

Richard




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Re: Question about Denemo accessibility with mac with voice overfor Richard Shann possibly?

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Please check this link:
https://musescore.org/en/node/37476

Am 11.03.2016 19:06, schrieb Richard Shann:

On Thu, 2016-03-10 at 19:18 -0600, Daniel Contreras wrote:

Hello everyone,


Lilypond has been my go to software for the past few semesters and I
have found it very useful and I am very grateful to all who have
contributed to its development.  My question is about the Denemo
software,


denemo-de...@gnu.org is the place to ask...


 particularly the possibility of making it accessible for blind users.
I know that may be a long shot, but I am willing to help in anyway
that i can. If anyone is interested, and or if this is even remotely
possible, i haved copied a link which will hopefully be useful.


I think it is indeed a long shot, Denemo is very short of developers :(

Richard




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Re: OT: Help needed to package cross-platform python application

[Blöchl Bernhard]

My mistake. :( Sorry. Thanks! :-)

Am 11.03.2016 08:38, schrieb Marc Hohl:

Am 11.03.2016 um 08:12 schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:
OT? Indeed! Another blog highchecking attack. Why not stay in the 
python

blog?


s/highchecking/hijacking/ ;-)


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Re: OT: Help needed to package cross-platform python application

[Blöchl Bernhard]

OT? Indeed! Another blog highchecking attack. Why not stay in the python 
blog?


Am 11.03.2016 02:30, schrieb David Wright:

On Wed 09 Mar 2016 at 15:46:24 (-0700), Abraham Lee wrote:
   I have developed a couple of python PDF utilities that make certain 
batch
   processing operations a little easier. I'd like to make some binary 
files
   of the utilities so that users can just download and use them 
without
   needing to worry about setting up a python installation on their 
machines,

   but I don't have access to a Mac, just Linux and Windows. Any
   thoughts/recommendations are welcome.


If one has LilyPond installed, doesn't one already have python
installed also? (Thus I have LP's 2.4 as well as Debian's 2.7
and 3.4.)

BTW what do the utilities do?

Cheers,
David.

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Re: music patterns and octave

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 09.03.2016 09:52, schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

Obviously does changePitch.ly not understand the construct \tuplet 3/2
{ a8 a a }.


The use of patterns is completely wrong. Check the documentation how to 
use the construct correctly.

http://gillesth.free.fr/Lilypond/changePitch/changePitch-doc.pdf


You have to change the architecture of your program completely!

\version "2.16.2"
#(define cPCheckForTies #f)
\include "changePitch.ly"

rhythmPattern = {a16
 %\tuplet 3/2 { a8 a a }
 a16 a8 a4 a4} % a complex rhythm

scoreViolinI = \relative c'
{
 % \setOctave c' %this command is just an example and it does not exist!
  %\changePitch \rhythmPattern
  c d d d c b d e
  f g a b
  c d e f
  %\setOctave c'
  %\changePitch \rhythmPattern
  c d d d c b d e
}


\score
{
  <<
\new Staff
{
\rhythmPattern
\scoreViolinI
}
  >>
  \layout { }
}

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Re: music patterns and octave

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Obviously does changePitch.ly not understand the construct \tuplet 3/2 { 
a8 a a }.


\include "changePitch.ly"

rhythmPattern = {a16
%\tuplet 3/2 { a8 a a }
a16 a8 a4 a4} % a complex rhythm

scoreViolinI = \relative c'
{
 % \setOctave c' %this command is just an example and it does not exist!
  \changePitch \rhythmPattern {c d d d c b d e}
  f g a b
  c d e f
  %\setOctave c'
  \changePitch \rhythmPattern {c d d d c b d e}
}

scoreViolinII = \relative c'
{
  %\setOctave c'
  \changePitch \rhythmPattern {a b b b a b a a}
  f f a a
  c c f f
  %\setOctave c'
  \relative c' \changePitch \rhythmPattern {a b b b a b a a}
}

\score
{
  <<
\new Staff \scoreViolinI
\new Staff \scoreViolinII
  >>
  \layout { }
}

Am 09.03.2016 01:07, schrieb Gianmaria Lari:

Ciao David,

let's put it in another way. Have a look to the attached image and
please suggest me how you would write the code to generate it.

Then please have a look to the code I *would* like to write to obtain
it. Do you know if does exist anything similar to "setOctave"? Do you
see any logical mistake in trying to write it in this way? Sorry if
the example is not very simple, but I have not been able to make it
better.

version "2.19.35"
include "changePitch.ly"

rhythmPattern = {a16 tuplet 3/2 {a8 a a} a16 a8 a4 a4} % a complex
rhythm

scoreViolinI = relative c'
{
  setOctave c' %this command is just an example and it does not
exist!
  changePitch rhythmPattern {c d d d c b d e}
  f g a b
  c d e f
  setOctave c'  
  changePitch rhythmPattern {c d d d c b d e}
}

scoreViolinII = relative c'
{
  setOctave c' 

  changePitch rhythmPattern {a b b b a b a a}
  f f a a  
  c c f f
  setOctave c' 
  relative c' changePitch rhythmPattern {a b b b a b a a}
}

score
{
  <<
    new Staff scoreViolinI
    new Staff scoreViolinII
  >>
  layout { }
}

On Tue, Mar 8, 2016 at 7:39 PM, David Wright
 wrote:


On Tue 08 Mar 2016 at 17:45:35 (+0100), Gianmaria Lari wrote:

    [...]
    So, more precisely I would write:

      version "2.19.35"
      pattern =
      {
         c16 d e f g a b c
      }
      relative c' 
      {
        pattern d4 d4
        pattern c4 e4
        pattern e4 c4
      }

    But the previous code generate:
    [...]
    So I played a bit with "absolute" and at the end I have been

able to fix

    the issue.


I don't know what the issue is that you "fixed".


    Here it is the code:

      version "2.19.35"
      pattern = absolute
      {
         c'16 d' e' f' g' a' b' c''
      }
      relative c'' 
      {
        pattern d4 d4
        pattern c4 e4
        pattern e4 c4
      }

    Unfortunately this solution does not work well with

"changePitch" (that I

    need).


Now here's a clue as to what you're trying to do. Looking at the
changePitch documentation, patterns are only used as the first
argument to a changePitch function:
changePitch pattern newnotes
Judging by its purpose, I would assume (short of testing it) that
the
pattern has an _implied_ relative{} around it.

What one doesn't do, but you are trying to do, is typeset the
pattern
itself directly into a score. All that your examples here are doing
is to
demonstrate the rules that LilyPond uses to interpret notes within
{ ... } relative { ... } absolute { ... }

So the pattern's notes themselves are never seen in the score:
they're
replaced by the notes in the second argument (newnotes). That does
mean that we expect to see include "changePitch.ly" in any
compilable
examples you post.

Cheers,
David.



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Re: I'm not smart enough to figure out the math for this.

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Do not understand the signification to break the rules as you 
immediately get an error response of lilypond. But for education 
purposes ...


I hope Michael Rivers and the list will accept my apology.


Am 08.03.2016 21:41, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

On 08.03.2016 21:19, Blöchl Bernhard wrote:

May be you need some private coaching in waltz math ?
Here it is:

\relative c' { \time 3/4
  c4 c c | c c c
}


Bernhard, what the heck do you think you’re up to?
Please _read_ others’ posts before sneering at them, or better just
quit the sneering.
Michael wrote that he wanted a _printed_ time signature of 4/3, for
teaching purposes.

Regards, Simon


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Re: I'm not smart enough to figure out the math for this.

[Blöchl Bernhard]

May be you need some private coaching in waltz math ?
Here iot is:

\relative c' { \time 3/4
  c4 c c | c c c
}

Am 08.03.2016 21:00, schrieb Michael Rivers:
I'm trying to make a snippet for students with intentional mistakes for 
them

to correct. I want the time signature to say 4/3, but for the music to
actually be in 3/4. Should I use "scaleDurations", and what should the 
ratio

be? Or is there a better way to do this?

\version "2.19.24"

\relative c' { \time 4/3
   c4 c c | c c c }



--
View this message in context:
http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/I-m-not-smart-enough-to-figure-out-the-math-for-this-tp188290.html
Sent from the User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: OT: pagenumber

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Setting myself into the situation of a maybe user wanting to switch off 
the pagenumber I would google "lilypond pagenumber". Google is 
correcting me to page number (in correct English written separately).


The first hit is
LilyPond Notation Reference: 4.1.6 Other \paper variables
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/other-paper-variables
and there I can find
\paper variables for page numbering
and eventually land at

 print-page-number
If set to false, page numbers are not printed.

What to do now as a simple minded user?
 print-page-number = false
 print-page-number = "false"
etc. .

The second google hit is
3.2.4 Reference to page numbers
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/reference-to-page-numbers
Being familiar with lilypond ##f might find my attention - or not. But 
that link is not really helpful. To get the syntax I would have to 
google again 


I would recommend to add the options a user has to any item in the 
chapter (maybe in other chapters as well)

4.1.6 Other \paper variables
in the actual example that would mean
 print-page-number
default is ##true. If set to false (##f), page numbers are not 
printed. Example of use:

 print-page-number = ##f

Is there any adress to send this as a recommendation to the manual 
editors? It is not a bug so I think the bug list is not the correct 
address?



Am 04.03.2016 22:53, schrieb Blöchl Bernhard:

I know that thing with "read carefully" and RTFM very well and read a
lot of programming manuals as I was active working in that field - as
I was active ...

You refer to the section
" ...
Note the occurrence of hash signs, (#), in two different places – as
part of the Boolean value before the t or f, and before value in the
\set statement. So when a Boolean is being entered you need to code
two hash signs, e.g., ##t.
.."

But please do not forget that the manual is not addressed to
programmers in first place but simple minded users like me. As a
simple minded user I am only just interested how to get it work! At
least I would recommend to move that section above from "appendix" to
"prefix". That would ease the use of the manual. By practical
experience I know that no one really reads a manual (or even a section
of a manual) from beginning to end.

A much better solution might be (just as a question/recommendation)
not to strain a simple minded user like me
with such subtleties. KISS: there must be set two hash signs.


Am 04.03.2016 22:31, schrieb Trevor Daniels:

Blöchl Bernhard wrote Friday, March 04, 2016 9:11 PM



"false is ##f " really always?

Please check
http://www.lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/learning/modifying-context-properties

Seriously, is this an exception? Should one throw a bug report or may 
be
a suggestion for harmonization? That would ease the use of lilypond 
for

simple minded user like me. So a simple minded user is no longer
dependent on guesses.


Please read the section you quote more carefully.  In particular the 
bit that

says:

"Note the occurrence of hash signs, (#), in two different places – as
part of the
Boolean value before the t or f, and before value in the \set
statement. So when
a Boolean is being entered you need to code two hash signs, e.g., 
##t."


Trevor


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Re: OT: pagenumber

[Blöchl Bernhard]

I know that thing with "read carefully" and RTFM very well and read a 
lot of programming manuals as I was active working in that field - as I 
was active ...


You refer to the section
" ...
Note the occurrence of hash signs, (#), in two different places – as 
part of the Boolean value before the t or f, and before value in the 
\set statement. So when a Boolean is being entered you need to code two 
hash signs, e.g., ##t.

.."

But please do not forget that the manual is not addressed to programmers 
in first place but simple minded users like me. As a simple minded user 
I am only just interested how to get it work! At least I would recommend 
to move that section above from "appendix" to "prefix". That would ease 
the use of the manual. By practical experience I know that no one really 
reads a manual (or even a section of a manual) from beginning to end.


A much better solution might be (just as a question/recommendation) not 
to strain a simple minded user like me

with such subtleties. KISS: there must be set two hash signs.


Am 04.03.2016 22:31, schrieb Trevor Daniels:

Blöchl Bernhard wrote Friday, March 04, 2016 9:11 PM



"false is ##f " really always?

Please check
http://www.lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/learning/modifying-context-properties

Seriously, is this an exception? Should one throw a bug report or may 
be
a suggestion for harmonization? That would ease the use of lilypond 
for

simple minded user like me. So a simple minded user is no longer
dependent on guesses.


Please read the section you quote more carefully.  In particular the 
bit that

says:

"Note the occurrence of hash signs, (#), in two different places – as
part of the
Boolean value before the t or f, and before value in the \set
statement. So when
a Boolean is being entered you need to code two hash signs, e.g., ##t."

Trevor


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Re: OT: pagenumber

[Blöchl Bernhard]

"false is ##f " really always?

Please check
http://www.lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/learning/modifying-context-properties

Seriously, is this an exception? Should one throw a bug report or may be 
a suggestion for harmonization? That would ease the use of lilypond for 
simple minded user like me. So a simple minded user is no longer 
dependent on guesses.


Am 04.03.2016 21:47, schrieb Malte Meyn:

...
That’s not ‘more correct’; false is ##f, not #f in LilyPond
...
So maybe try out before guessing ;)

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Re: OT: pagenumber

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Just a guess, try
pagenumber = #f

Am 04.03.2016 21:11, schrieb Noeck:

Hi,

Am 04.03.2016 um 13:57 schrieb Andrew Bernard:

\layout {
  pagenumber = no
  ...
}


Sorry for diverging from the original topic, but what is pagenumber =
no? I couldn't find it in the documentation and I doubt that no is a
valid value. I see no effect of this statement. On the other hand,
lilypond is not printing any warning.

Cheers,
Joram

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Re: Fwd: Re: install frescoba 2.18.2 in Ubuntu

[Blöchl Bernhard]

tml before? There is a small "Install"
 section. What was missing for you?

 - Should it mention the --prefix option?
 - Should it mention that you can have several versions installed in
   parallel?
 - Was only the Frescobaldi settings part new to you? Should it be
   mentioned?

 Cheers,
 David.

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   On 03.03.2016 18:08, David Wright wrote:

 On Thu 03 Mar 2016 at 09:37:55 (+0100), Blöchl Bernhard wrote:


 ---- Originalnachricht 
 Betreff: Re: install frescoba 2.18.2 in Ubuntu
 Datum: 03.03.2016 09:03
 Von: Blöchl Bernhard [10]<b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net>
 An: [11]lilypond-user@gnu.org

 The headline in the original post was not correctly positioned! The
 subsequent text to it was NOT written by David Wright but lies in my
 own responsibility. The headline should only referencing the
 citation. Sorry for my mistake. Here the corrected version:

 I did not read the complete thread and after reading the last
 posting I will not do that.

 I have no idea which posting you mean by "last posting". "Last"
 is particularly ambiguous in English; we do not even have the
 distinction in meaning made AIUI by the position of "dernier"
 in French.


 That is a collection of citation of
 unverified storys, opinions and wishes.

 ... So I have no idea of what _your_ opinion refers to, which
 means it's impossible to agree or disagree with you. That's why
 we normally quote what we're referring to on mailing lists.


 I do not understand the
 central problem and how to address it to lilypond? And Frescobaldi
 AFAIK is anothert development team?

 I don't understand why you've written question marks here.
 Are you implying that someone has stated that "you do not understand
 the central problem and how to address it to lilypond" and that you
 disagree with them? If so, who implied it, and where?

 I can't parse the construction "And Frescobaldi as far as I know is
 another development team?". If _you_ don't know what you know, how 
can

 anyone else?


 Am 03.03.2016 06:40, schrieb David Wright:


 But even better, use a apt-get ppa repository, this you keep u to
 date your self, without being dependant of Debian.

 For the second time, you have posted that David Wright wrote 
something

 that David Wright didn't. Please take more care with your postings.


 The content and versions of a repository are in the responsibility
 and taste of the package manager(s) and usually can not simply be
 affected by the software developers, say lilypond or frescobaldi
 development team. A repository is a COLLECTION of software for a
 particular linux version

 I agree with all that.


 - you want a "repository" only contending
 lilypond/frescobaldi? Who should do that?

 I don't want anything; this isn't _my_ problem. There was an original
 problem that "Bernard [12]<lilyp...@bernardhulsman.nl>" was having, 
coping

 with mixing an ubuntu distribution with software downloaded from
 elsewhere:
 
[13]http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2016-02/msg00758.html

 Then there was a discussion about clarifying some instructions, but I
 don't know which instructions were being discussed becaues that 
wasn't

 made clear with a precise reference:
 
[14]http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2016-02/msg00772.html

 There followed a posting which contained "But even better, use a
 apt-get ppa repository, this you keep u to date your self, without
 being dependant of Debian" which is what I commented on:
 
[15]http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2016-02/msg00773.html

 This posting appeared to me to be muddling up different distributions
 (Debian, ubuntu), different ways of installing software (package
 managers, direct installation of upstream software), software that 
had

 and didn't have (versioned or absolute) dependencies (lilypond,
 frescobaldi, python-ly, pyqt4, pyqt5).

 It did not appear to me that progress was going to be made in
 clarifying instructions (whichever ones are being discussed) unless
 the terms people used were better defined, and naked version numbers
 were avoided particularly as the main players have identical or
 closely identical version numbers at present. It's no effort to write
 LP 2.18.2 or F 2.16.2.


 For clarification best would be to target your problem precisely for
 a simple minded reader.

 Cheers,
 David.

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Fwd: Re: install frescoba 2.18.2 in Ubuntu

[Blöchl Bernhard]

 Originalnachricht 
Betreff: Re: install frescoba 2.18.2 in Ubuntu
Datum: 03.03.2016 09:03
Von: Blöchl Bernhard <b_120902342...@telecolumbus.net>
An: lilypond-user@gnu.org

The headline in the original post was not correctly positioned! The 
subsequent text to it was NOT written by David Wright but lies in my own 
responsibility. The headline should only referencing the citation. Sorry 
for my mistake. Here the corrected version:


I did not read the complete thread and after reading the last posting I 
will not do that. That is a collection of citation of unverified storys, 
opinions and wishes. I do not understand the central problem and how to 
address it to lilypond? And Frescobaldi AFAIK is anothert development 
team?



Am 03.03.2016 06:40, schrieb David Wright:


But even better, use a apt-get ppa repository, this you keep u to
date your self, without being dependant of Debian.


The content and versions of a repository are in the responsibility and 
taste of the package manager(s) and usually can not simply be affected 
by the software developers, say lilypond or frescobaldi development 
team. A repository is a COLLECTION of software for a particular linux 
version - you want a "repository" only contending lilypond/frescobaldi? 
Who should do that?


For clarification best would be to target your problem precisely for a 
simple minded reader.





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Re: install frescoba 2.18.2 in Ubuntu

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 03.03.2016 06:40, schrieb David Wright:

I did not read the complete thread and after reading the last posting I 
will not do that. That is a collection of citation of unverified storys, 
opinions and wishes. I do not understand the central problem and how to 
address it to lilypond? And Frescobaldi AFAIK is anothert development 
team?



But even better, use a apt-get ppa repository, this you keep u to
date your self, without being dependant of Debian.


The content and versions of a repository are in the responsibility and 
taste of the package manager(s) and usually can not simply be affected 
by the software developers, say lilypond or frescobaldi development 
team. A repository is a COLLECTION of software for a particular linux 
version - you want a "repository" only contending lilypond/frescobaldi? 
Who should do that?


For clarification best would be to target your problem precisely for a 
simple minded reader.





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Re: makam.ly

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Thank you for your detailed information. There is something to think 
about for me. And I will investigate regular.ly.


Regards BB

Am 22.02.2016 15:46, schrieb Hans Åberg:

On 22 Feb 2016, at 13:23, BB  wrote:


one full tonal step divided into 9 comma, in my opinion this is only 
of interest for classical/historical Turkish music, or for geographic 
intonation differences of folk music for field studies.
In the today music practice notation is similar to the quarter tone 
notation.


This file tries to imitate the AUE (Arel-Ezgi-Uzdile), cf. Ozan
Yarman, "A Comparative Evaluation of Pitch Notations in Turkish Makam
Music”.

The AUE system uses E53, 53-equal temperament, which is very close to
Pythagorean tuning, The E53 tone steps are called commas, with major
second M = 9, minor second m = 4, and sharp # = 9 - 5 = 4 commas. The
AUE symbol # raises with 4 commas, and is not a Pythagorean tuning
sharp, which causes some confusion among performers.

The LilyPond implementation is not correct: it uses a multiple of E12,
and does not transpose correctly: the sharp should have been divided
into 5 steps.

One can use E53 by Graham Breed’s regular.ly, and the MIDI will then
come out correctly. And it is possible to use the SMuFL.org font with
http://www.openlilylib.org/, but that is a bit more complicated.


Arabic noatation \include arabic.ly
maqam -> plural maqamat
The notation simply divides a full tonal step into 4 intervals. There 
are geographic differences in the music practice as well. The lilypond 
practice to use italian note names does not meet the nowaday practice. 
I play Oud and most of the arbic players a meet use the english note 
names.The Italian note names are a hurdle for the English speaking 
users and others as well.


This is just a hack in E24 somebody did in order to do the notation.
E53 would be better, as above. The difference is to raise with with 2
commas for or lower with 3, except in Maqam Sikah Baladi [1].

1. http://www.maqamworld.com/maqamat/sikah.html#sikah-baladi


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Manual Chapter 2.10.2 Arabic music subchapter Selected Snippets Non-traditional key signatures

[Blöchl Bernhard]

\include "arabic.ly"
\relative do' {
  \set Staff.keyAlterations = #`(
(0 . ,SEMI-FLAT)
(1 . ,SEMI-FLAT)
(2 . ,FLAT)
(5 . ,FLAT)
(6 . ,SEMI-FLAT)
  )
  %\set Staff.extraNatural = ##f
  re reb \dwn reb resd
  dod dob dosd \dwn dob |
  dobsb dodsd do do |
}

The key accidentals in this example are shown in the turkish notation 
version. Is there any chance to get the key accidentals in the arabic 
view with the slashed half accidental, as with


dwn = {
  \once \override Voice.Accidental.stencil = #(lambda (grob)
  (ly:stencil-combine-at-edge
(ly:accidental-interface::print grob) Y UP
(grob-interpret-markup grob (markup #:line
  (#:fontsize -1 (#:musicglyph "flags.ugrace" -1.3))
}

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Re: manual Makam example

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Sorry! I pressed the wrong send button I corrected the error some 
minutes later.


Am 21.02.2016 16:15, schrieb Simon Albrecht:

Don’t reply off-list! I have no idea whatsoever about arabic music, so
there’s no point in e-mailing me.
Best, Simon

On 21.02.2016 14:44, BB wrote:
I still think that the snippet ifrom the world music chapter is better 
than the one actually in the arabic chapter. I will recommend it in 
the bug-lilypond mailing list, if I find some time. Actually I am 
fighting with some problems.


I would post a better one, if I could get an example code! There is 
some inconsisteny.

If i use
\include arabic.ly
the arabic maqams are defined and will be found, but the english note 
names are not known.


\include "arabic.ly"

\relative do' {

\key re \bayati

%\set Staff.extraNatural = ##f

dod dob dosd \dwn dob dobsb dodsd do do

}

That is another important fact to say that given example in the arabic 
chapter is double-crap! This snippet indeed uses english note names 
not known with \arabic.ly!


As I prefer the english note names. If I use
\include maqam.ly
the maqams are undefined, but the english note names are known.

\include "makam.ly"

\relative c' {

\key d \bayati

c4 cc db fk

gbm4 gfc gfb efk

fk4 db cc c

}


If I try the definition of Bayati from arabic.ly, the resukt is vey 
strange, I do not understand why?


\include "makam.ly" \relative c' { \set Staff.keyAlterations = #`( (0 
. ,NATURAL) (1 . ,SEMI-FLAT) (2 . ,FLAT) (3 . ,NATURAL) (4 . ,NATURAL) 
(5 . ,FLAT) (6 . ,FLAT) ) c4 cc db fk gbm4 gfc gfb efk fk4 db cc c }


I think that ha s to do with the missing key alteration order? May be 
an extension/redesign of maqam.ly is necessary? Help would be 
appreciated!

On 21.02.2016 13:27, Simon Albrecht wrote:

On 21.02.2016 12:54, BB wrote:
At the end of subchapter "Arabic key signatures" in chapter "2.10.2 
Arabic music" on page 
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/arabic-music 
there is in subchapter "Selected Snippets" a snippet example. It is 
very peculiar that in this example is not even a single quarter 
tone. Peculiar and totally displaced and useless in this arabic 
notation section dealing with the special case of quarter tone 
notation!
You’re welcome to come up with a better example and post it on the 
bug-lilypond mailing list, with a concise description what exactly it 
is for and why it is better. Best, Simon


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Re: Lilypond and Jazz chords

[Blöchl Bernhard]

Am 18.01.2016 08:44, schrieb Carl-Henrik Buschmann:

18. jan. 2016 kl. 02.40 skrev tim...@bitstream.net:


On Jan 17, 2016, at 4:16 PM, Carl-Henrik Buschmann
 wrote:

I'm not talking about code, i'm talking about style. And by the looks of 
it Sibelius at least have by and large been inspired by B But as you 
said, predefined is not the way to go. Even so, look at what they have 
done and simply mimick the behaviour. "Great artists steal".


Do you really believe that Sibelius was inspired by R?
The first edition of
Standardized chord symbol notation : (a uniform system for the music 
profession)

von Carl Brandt; Clinton Roemer Englisch
was published 1976 by Sherman Oaks, Calif. : Roerick Music Co.

Johan Julius Christian („Jean“) Sibelius * 8. Dezember 1865 in 
Hämeenlinna; † 20. September 1957 in Järvenpää near Helsinki;


Are you really doing in music? May be you are only a bit bored and like 
to make some noise?





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