Re: Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

[Przemyslaw Pawelczyk]

Hi, Mark!

On Wed, Jan 27, 2016 at 9:45 PM, Mark Stephen Mrotek
 wrote:
> If acceptable, the use of "bracket" style can eliminate the conflict.

Going in my pedal definition with:

\set pedalSustainStyle = #'bracket

is other kind of workaround, but text style is much more visually
appealing to me.

There is also mixed style, which visual "goodness" is inbetween to me,
but then Ped. is too close to or even collides with closing bracket,
so if it isn't fine out-of-the-box (in my case), then I can as well
play with SustainPedal.X-offset globally and in some cases locally (as
I've shown in my previous mail) and have IMHO better effect in the
end.

Anyway, thanks for your suggestion.

Regards.

-- 
Przemyslaw Pawelczyk
Cross-site thinker, rookie composer, Linux apprentice
https://soundcloud.com/przemoc86

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Re: Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

[Przemyslaw Pawelczyk]

Hi, Kieren!

On Wed, Jan 27, 2016 at 10:25 PM, Kieren MacMillan
 wrote:
>> No one played with positions of \sustainOn and \sustainOff?
>
> Well, I took a couple of seconds, and failed.
>
> Then, just now, I realized there’s a possible solution:
> 
>
> I don’t know if markup (or even “fake markup”) support in pedalSustainStrings
> has been added officially… but it certainly could be, if you (or someone
> else) sends the appropriate patch.
>
> Hope this helps!

I'm sorry, but I don't understand what you actually suggest as a workaround.
Do you perhaps indirectly suggest something like replacing closing
asterisk "*" with asterisk with some space padding "* "?
That could work too, I guess, if it's possible.

Regards.

-- 
Przemyslaw Pawelczyk
Cross-site thinker, rookie composer, Linux apprentice
https://soundcloud.com/przemoc86

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Re: Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Przemyslaw,

> Do you perhaps indirectly suggest something like replacing closing
> asterisk "*" with asterisk with some space padding "* “?

That’s exactly what I’m suggesting.

> That could work too, I guess, if it's possible.

Yes. And it would be the superior workaround, since it would involve pedal 
grobs, and not TextSpanner.

Unfortunately, I think it’s currently [still] not possible (without a patch to 
the Lilypond source code) to put markup in sustainPedalStrings. I would be 
happy to be proven wrong, though!  =)

Best,
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

[Przemyslaw Pawelczyk]

Hi!

No one played with positions of \sustainOn and \sustainOff?

On Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 1:33 PM, Przemyslaw Pawelczyk
 wrote:
> I have a problem with \sustainOn and \sustainOff colliding each other
> in some cases.
> I use following pattern
>
> s32*31\sustainOn s32\sustainOff
[...]
> but it often looks bad on the paper.

You can see the problem below:
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mark-collision.pdf
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mark-collision.ly

BTW Isn't it a bug that those collisions happen at all?

>
> Is there any way to improve it globally?
> Is there any way to fine tune horizontal position of the pedal indication?

I came up with:

\override SustainPedal.X-offset = -1

which improves the situation globally, but doesn't avoid collisions in
case of denser pedaling like:

   s32*15\sustainOn s32\sustainOff s32*15\sustainOn s32\sustainOff

I can mitigate such issues by correcting X-offset manually then, e.g.:

\once \override SustainPedal.X-offset = -2

(finding value looking appropriately in the context is trial and error
process, though)

If there is any smarter way, then I will replace it instantly.

Example of above workarounds:
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mark-collision-workaround.pdf
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mark-collision-workaround.ly

>
> Or maybe there is even a way to use some Scheme magic that would allow
> writing simpler form (s1\sustainOff\sustainOn), yet modifying it for
> MIDI (changing off placement by given duration, 32 in  the example)?

This would be super handy.

Regards.

-- 
Przemyslaw Pawelczyk
Cross-site thinker, rookie composer, Linux apprentice
https://soundcloud.com/przemoc86

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RE: Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

[Mark Stephen Mrotek]

Przemyslaw,

If acceptable, the use of "bracket" style can eliminate the conflict.

Mark

-Original Message-
From: lilypond-user-bounces+carsonmark=ca.rr@gnu.org
[mailto:lilypond-user-bounces+carsonmark=ca.rr@gnu.org] On Behalf Of
Przemyslaw Pawelczyk
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2016 11:34 AM
To: lilypond-user <lilypond-user@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

Hi!

No one played with positions of \sustainOn and \sustainOff?

On Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 1:33 PM, Przemyslaw Pawelczyk <mu...@pawelczyk.it>
wrote:,
> I have a problem with \sustainOn and \sustainOff colliding each other 
> in some cases.
> I use following pattern
>
> s32*31\sustainOn s32\sustainOff
[...]
> but it often looks bad on the paper.

You can see the problem below:
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mar
k-collision.pdf
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mar
k-collision.ly

BTW Isn't it a bug that those collisions happen at all?

>
> Is there any way to improve it globally?
> Is there any way to fine tune horizontal position of the pedal indication?

I came up with:

\override SustainPedal.X-offset = -1

which improves the situation globally, but doesn't avoid collisions in case
of denser pedaling like:

   s32*15\sustainOn s32\sustainOff s32*15\sustainOn s32\sustainOff

I can mitigate such issues by correcting X-offset manually then, e.g.:

\once \override SustainPedal.X-offset = -2

(finding value looking appropriately in the context is trial and error
process, though)

If there is any smarter way, then I will replace it instantly.

Example of above workarounds:
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mar
k-collision-workaround.pdf
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/piano-pedal-mar
k-collision-workaround.ly

>
> Or maybe there is even a way to use some Scheme magic that would allow 
> writing simpler form (s1\sustainOff\sustainOn), yet modifying it for 
> MIDI (changing off placement by given duration, 32 in  the example)?

This would be super handy.

Regards.

--
Przemyslaw Pawelczyk
Cross-site thinker, rookie composer, Linux apprentice
https://soundcloud.com/przemoc86

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Re: Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi,

> No one played with positions of \sustainOn and \sustainOff?

Well, I took a couple of seconds, and failed.

Then, just now, I realized there’s a possible solution:


I don’t know if markup (or even “fake markup”) support in pedalSustainStrings 
has been added officially… but it certainly could be, if you (or someone else) 
sends the appropriate patch.

Hope this helps!
Kieren.



Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Piano pedal mark collision (\sustainOn, \sustainOff)

[Przemyslaw Pawelczyk]

Hi!

I have a problem with \sustainOn and \sustainOff colliding each other
in some cases.
I use following pattern

s32*31\sustainOn s32\sustainOff

instead of

s1\sustainOff\sustainOn

to achieve a bit better pedalling in MIDI, but it often looks bad on the paper.

Is there any way to improve it globally?
Is there any way to fine tune horizontal position of the pedal indication?

Or maybe there is even a way to use some Scheme magic that would allow
writing simpler form (s1\sustainOff\sustainOn), yet modifying it for
MIDI (changing off placement by given duration, 32 in  the example)?

Exemplary source file and PDF:
http://paste.przemoc.net/lilypond/piano-pedal-mark-collision/

Regards.

-- 
Przemyslaw Pawelczyk
Cross-site thinker, rookie composer, Linux apprentice
https://soundcloud.com/przemoc86

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