Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[paolo prete]

Thanks Thomas and Kieran,
That work-around works perfectly, without uncommenting the "  %\override
Dynamics.PianoPedalBracket #'shorten-pair = #'(0 . -1)  " line
(then, there's no need of the trial-and-error method mentioned by Kieran).
I tested it on 2.21.0
I don't understand yet if the default behaviour should be reported as bug
in the ml, though...




2018-03-24 22:38 GMT+01:00 Thomas Morley :

> 2018-03-24 17:19 GMT+01:00 paolo prete :
> > Hello,
> >
> > as you can see from the below snippet, the bracket of the sustain pedal
> is
> > not properly extended when the last note is shifted.
> > Is this a bug? Is there a way to fix it or a work-around ?
>
> Iiuc, the PianoPedalBracket is left/right bound by PaperColumns.
> If you move NoteColumn, then you move it relative to it's PaperColumn,
> but PaperColumn is _not_ changed.
> Thus the PianoPedalBracket doesn't move along.
> Not a bug but a consequencee of the current implementation.
>
> Btw, this was changed between 2.14 and 2.16.
> Most likely with
> https://sourceforge.net/p/testlilyissues/issues/2153/
>
> I did some more research/comparison with Hairpins, which may be
> bounded by PaperColumns as well.
> Obviously there is some more fine-grained hierarchy coded how to bound
> Hairpins.
> Something like: DynamicText present? -> NoteColumn? ->PaperColumn
> Nevertheless this does not explain the behaviour of the Hairpin in the
> last Dynamics-context below.
> Or probably I don't fully understand what's going.
>
> Make that a 'likely' lol
>
>
> The code prints a lot of info, visible in pdf/readable in terminal.
> You may try to uncomment the commands in the first Dynamics-context,
> might be a work-around.
> How to do final adjustments Kieren already demonstrated by using
> 'shorten-pair.
>
> Old syntax is used and some definitions added to make it work even with
> 2.14.
>
> #(use-modules (ice-9 pretty-print))
>
> #(define-public (grob::name grob)
>   "Return the name of the grob @var{grob} as a symbol."
>   (assq-ref (ly:grob-property grob 'meta) 'name))
>
> #(define print-info
>   (lambda (grob)
> (format #t "\ncurrent default-bounds:\n~y"
>   (list
> (grob::name grob)
> (ly:spanner-bound grob LEFT)
> (ly:spanner-bound grob RIGHT)
>
> #(define nc-bounds!
>   (lambda (grob)
> (let*  ((left-b (ly:spanner-bound grob LEFT))
> (left-elts (ly:grob-object left-b 'elements))
> (left-elts-ls
>   (if (ly:grob-array? left-elts)
>   (ly:grob-array->list left-elts)
>   '()))
> (left-nc
>   (filter
> (lambda (g)
>   (grob::has-interface g 'note-column-interface))
> left-elts-ls))
> (right-b (ly:spanner-bound grob RIGHT))
> (right-elts (ly:grob-object right-b 'elements))
> (right-elts-ls
>   (if (ly:grob-array? right-elts)
>   (ly:grob-array->list right-elts)
>   '()))
> (right-nc
>   (filter
> (lambda (g)
>   (grob::has-interface g 'note-column-interface))
> right-elts-ls)))
> ;(print-info grob)
> (if (pair? left-nc) (ly:spanner-set-bound! grob LEFT (car
> left-nc)))
> (if (pair? right-nc) (ly:spanner-set-bound! grob RIGHT (car
> right-nc))
>
> \score {
>   <<
> \new Staff \with { instrumentName = "Staff 1 " } {
>
>   c'2\sustainOn
>   f'
>   \once \override Score.NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10
>   c''\sustainOff
> }
> \new Staff \with { instrumentName = "Staff 2 " } {
>   c'\<
>   f'
>   c''\mf
> }
> \new Staff \with { instrumentName = "Staff 3 " } {
>   c'\<
>   f'
>   c''\!
> }
> \new Dynamics \with { instrumentName = "Dyn 1 " } {
>   %\override Dynamics.PianoPedalBracket #'after-line-breaking =
> #nc-bounds!
>   %\override Dynamics.PianoPedalBracket #'shorten-pair = #'(0 . -1)
>   s\sustainOn
>   s
>   s\sustainOff
> }
> \new Dynamics \with { instrumentName = "Dyn 2 " } {
>   s\<
>   s
>   s\mf
> }
> \new Dynamics \with { instrumentName = "Dyn 3 " } {
>   s\<
>   s
>   s\!
> }
>   >>
>
>   \layout {
>   \context {
> \Dynamics
> \consists "Instrument_name_engraver"
>   \override VerticalAxisGroup #'nonstaff-nonstaff-spacing =
> #'((padding . 2))
>   \override VerticalAxisGroup #'nonstaff-relatedstaff-spacing =
> #'((padding . 4))
> \override Hairpin #'after-line-breaking = #print-info
> \override PianoPedalBracket #'after-line-breaking = #print-info
>   }
> \context {
>   \Voice
>   \override Hairpin #'after-line-breaking = #print-info
> }
> \context {
>   

Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[paolo prete]

Hello Kieren,

sorry to insist again but IMHO this is a bug. Look at the snippet below:
all the objects are aligned to the shifted NoteColumn. Only the pedal is
not aligned.
There's no reason for which it has not to be aligned, and this forces to
apply work-arounds in order to put the end of the bracket below the  wanted
note.


%

\score {

  \tuplet 3/2
  { c'\sustainOn\<\startTextSpan
c'
\once \override Score.NoteColumn #'X-offset = 15
c'\!\mf\sustainOff\stopTextSpan
  }

  \layout {
\context {
  \Score
  pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed
}
  }

}




A possible better work-around  could be overriding the TextSpanner
properties so that it draws a pedal, like the snippet below, but I can't
find a good way to emulate the \sustainOn\sustainOff sequence which draws "
/\  " for the sustan pedal...
In addition, I have to override the TextSpanner properties BEFORE it is
attached to a note, and not "on the fly"...
Any help is greatly appreciated.


%%%

pedOn = \startTextSpan
pedOff = \stopTextSpan

{

  \override TextSpanner.style = #'line
  \override TextSpanner.bound-details.left.text = \markup { "ped." }
  \override TextSpanner.style = #'line
  \override TextSpanner.bound-details.right.text = \markup { \path  #0 #'(
(lineto 0 2) ) }


  a'4_\pedOn
  b'4 c''
  \once \override Score.NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10
  a'4 \pedOff

}

%%%






> I would say it’s expected behaviour, since that’s the way that pedals are
> traditionally marked.
>
> That being said, it would be nice to have an easier way to pin the end to
> the note — analogous to the Hairpin.to-barline property — since the method
> I show (above) is trial-and-error. Maybe you should submit a feature
> request?
>
> Hope this helps!
> Kieren.
> 
>
> Kieren MacMillan, composer
> ‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
> ‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info
>
>
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Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[Thomas Morley]

2018-03-24 17:19 GMT+01:00 paolo prete :
> Hello,
>
> as you can see from the below snippet, the bracket of the sustain pedal is
> not properly extended when the last note is shifted.
> Is this a bug? Is there a way to fix it or a work-around ?

Iiuc, the PianoPedalBracket is left/right bound by PaperColumns.
If you move NoteColumn, then you move it relative to it's PaperColumn,
but PaperColumn is _not_ changed.
Thus the PianoPedalBracket doesn't move along.
Not a bug but a consequencee of the current implementation.

Btw, this was changed between 2.14 and 2.16.
Most likely with
https://sourceforge.net/p/testlilyissues/issues/2153/

I did some more research/comparison with Hairpins, which may be
bounded by PaperColumns as well.
Obviously there is some more fine-grained hierarchy coded how to bound Hairpins.
Something like: DynamicText present? -> NoteColumn? ->PaperColumn
Nevertheless this does not explain the behaviour of the Hairpin in the
last Dynamics-context below.
Or probably I don't fully understand what's going.

Make that a 'likely' lol


The code prints a lot of info, visible in pdf/readable in terminal.
You may try to uncomment the commands in the first Dynamics-context,
might be a work-around.
How to do final adjustments Kieren already demonstrated by using 'shorten-pair.

Old syntax is used and some definitions added to make it work even with 2.14.

#(use-modules (ice-9 pretty-print))

#(define-public (grob::name grob)
  "Return the name of the grob @var{grob} as a symbol."
  (assq-ref (ly:grob-property grob 'meta) 'name))

#(define print-info
  (lambda (grob)
(format #t "\ncurrent default-bounds:\n~y"
  (list
(grob::name grob)
(ly:spanner-bound grob LEFT)
(ly:spanner-bound grob RIGHT)

#(define nc-bounds!
  (lambda (grob)
(let*  ((left-b (ly:spanner-bound grob LEFT))
(left-elts (ly:grob-object left-b 'elements))
(left-elts-ls
  (if (ly:grob-array? left-elts)
  (ly:grob-array->list left-elts)
  '()))
(left-nc
  (filter
(lambda (g)
  (grob::has-interface g 'note-column-interface))
left-elts-ls))
(right-b (ly:spanner-bound grob RIGHT))
(right-elts (ly:grob-object right-b 'elements))
(right-elts-ls
  (if (ly:grob-array? right-elts)
  (ly:grob-array->list right-elts)
  '()))
(right-nc
  (filter
(lambda (g)
  (grob::has-interface g 'note-column-interface))
right-elts-ls)))
;(print-info grob)
(if (pair? left-nc) (ly:spanner-set-bound! grob LEFT (car left-nc)))
(if (pair? right-nc) (ly:spanner-set-bound! grob RIGHT (car
right-nc))

\score {
  <<
\new Staff \with { instrumentName = "Staff 1 " } {

  c'2\sustainOn
  f'
  \once \override Score.NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10
  c''\sustainOff
}
\new Staff \with { instrumentName = "Staff 2 " } {
  c'\<
  f'
  c''\mf
}
\new Staff \with { instrumentName = "Staff 3 " } {
  c'\<
  f'
  c''\!
}
\new Dynamics \with { instrumentName = "Dyn 1 " } {
  %\override Dynamics.PianoPedalBracket #'after-line-breaking = #nc-bounds!
  %\override Dynamics.PianoPedalBracket #'shorten-pair = #'(0 . -1)
  s\sustainOn
  s
  s\sustainOff
}
\new Dynamics \with { instrumentName = "Dyn 2 " } {
  s\<
  s
  s\mf
}
\new Dynamics \with { instrumentName = "Dyn 3 " } {
  s\<
  s
  s\!
}
  >>

  \layout {
  \context {
\Dynamics
\consists "Instrument_name_engraver"
  \override VerticalAxisGroup #'nonstaff-nonstaff-spacing =
#'((padding . 2))
  \override VerticalAxisGroup #'nonstaff-relatedstaff-spacing =
#'((padding . 4))
\override Hairpin #'after-line-breaking = #print-info
\override PianoPedalBracket #'after-line-breaking = #print-info
  }
\context {
  \Voice
  \override Hairpin #'after-line-breaking = #print-info
}
\context {
  \Staff
  \override PianoPedalBracket #'after-line-breaking = #print-info
}
\context {
  \Score
  timing = ##f
  pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed
  \override PaperColumn #'stencil = #ly:paper-column::print
}
  }
}

Cheers,
  Harm

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Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Paolo,

> IMHO this is a bug.

Feel free to submit it to the bug list!

Best regards,
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Paolo,

> Sorry to insist: there's no way to put the end of the bracket at the wanted 
> note.

%%%  SNIPPET BEGINS
\version "2.19.80"
\language "english"

\score {

  {
\once \override Score.PianoPedalBracket.shorten-pair = #'(0 . -11.1) 
c'\sustainOn c' \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f'\sustainOff
r4\break
\once \override Score.PianoPedalBracket.shorten-pair = #'(0 . 22) 
c'\sustainOn c' \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f' r4\sustainOff
  }

  \layout {
\context {
  \Score
  pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed
}
  }

}
%%%  SNIPPET ENDS

> Is this a bug?

I would say it’s expected behaviour, since that’s the way that pedals are 
traditionally marked.

That being said, it would be nice to have an easier way to pin the end to the 
note — analogous to the Hairpin.to-barline property — since the method I show 
(above) is trial-and-error. Maybe you should submit a feature request?

Hope this helps!
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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RE: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[Mark Stephen Mrotek]

Paolo,

 

Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Shall be looking on the list for a resolution.

 

Mark

 

From: paolo prete [mailto:paoloprete...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2018 11:07 AM
To: Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com>
Cc: lilypond-user Mailinglist <lilypond-user@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

 

Mark,

 

unfortunately, using \new Dynamics for the pedal line doesn't seem to solve the 
issue...

 

2018-03-24 18:37 GMT+01:00 Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com 
<mailto:carsonm...@ca.rr.com> >:

Paolo, 

 

It is possible to input pedal markings with \new Dynamics. This is what I do 
for my piano scores.

I am trying to see how it would work with you example.

 

Mark

 

From: paolo prete [mailto:paoloprete...@gmail.com 
<mailto:paoloprete...@gmail.com> ] 
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2018 10:25 AM
To: Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com <mailto:carsonm...@ca.rr.com> >
Cc: lilypond-user Mailinglist <lilypond-user@gnu.org 
<mailto:lilypond-user@gnu.org> >
Subject: Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

 

Sorry to insist: there's no way to put the end of the bracket at the wanted 
note.

In the snippet below, I want to end the bracket at the note " f' "

Is this a bug?

 

%%

 

\score { 

 

  { 

c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f'\sustainOff

r4\break



c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f' 

r4\sustainOff

  }

 

  \layout { 

\context { 

  \Score  

  pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed   

} 

  }

 

}

 

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Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[paolo prete]

Mark,

unfortunately, using \new Dynamics for the pedal line doesn't seem to solve
the issue...

2018-03-24 18:37 GMT+01:00 Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com>:

> Paolo,
>
>
>
> It is possible to input pedal markings with \new Dynamics. This is what I
> do for my piano scores.
>
> I am trying to see how it would work with you example.
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> *From:* paolo prete [mailto:paoloprete...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Saturday, March 24, 2018 10:25 AM
> *To:* Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com>
> *Cc:* lilypond-user Mailinglist <lilypond-user@gnu.org>
> *Subject:* Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)
>
>
>
> Sorry to insist: there's no way to put the end of the bracket at the
> wanted note.
>
> In the snippet below, I want to end the bracket at the note " f' "
>
> Is this a bug?
>
>
>
> %%
>
>
>
> \score {
>
>
>
>   {
>
> c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10
> f'\sustainOff
>
> r4\break
>
>
>
> c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f'
>
> r4\sustainOff
>
>   }
>
>
>
>   \layout {
>
> \context {
>
>   \Score
>
>   pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed
>
> }
>
>   }
>
>
>
> }
>
>
>
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RE: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[Mark Stephen Mrotek]

Paolo, 

 

It is possible to input pedal markings with \new Dynamics. This is what I do 
for my piano scores.

I am trying to see how it would work with you example.

 

Mark

 

From: paolo prete [mailto:paoloprete...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2018 10:25 AM
To: Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com>
Cc: lilypond-user Mailinglist <lilypond-user@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

 

Sorry to insist: there's no way to put the end of the bracket at the wanted 
note.

In the snippet below, I want to end the bracket at the note " f' "

Is this a bug?

 

%%

 

\score { 

 

  { 

c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f'\sustainOff

r4\break



c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f' 

r4\sustainOff

  }

 

  \layout { 

\context { 

  \Score  

  pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed   

} 

  }

 

}

 

 

 

2018-03-24 17:32 GMT+01:00 Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com 
<mailto:carsonm...@ca.rr.com> >:

Paolo,

 

Put the \sustainOff outside of the tuplet { } and put it on the next pitch.

 

Mark

 

 

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Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[paolo prete]

Sorry to insist: there's no way to put the end of the bracket at the wanted
note.
In the snippet below, I want to end the bracket at the note " f' "
Is this a bug?

%%

\score {

  {
c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10
f'\sustainOff
r4\break

c'\sustainOn  c'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 f'
r4\sustainOff
  }

  \layout {
\context {
  \Score
  pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed
}
  }

}



>
> 2018-03-24 17:32 GMT+01:00 Mark Stephen Mrotek :
>
>> Paolo,
>>
>>
>>
>> Put the \sustainOff outside of the tuplet { } and put it on the next
>> pitch.
>>
>>
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[paolo prete]

I suspect this is a bug. Please see my previous snippet...

2018-03-24 18:22 GMT+01:00 Mark Stephen Mrotek :

> Welcome, Paolo
>
>
>
> “overriding” is out of my knowledge.
>
> Someone else might.
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>
>
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RE: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[Mark Stephen Mrotek]

Welcome, Paolo

 

“overriding” is out of my knowledge.

Someone else might.

 

Mark

 

From: paolo prete [mailto:paoloprete...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2018 10:06 AM
To: Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com>
Cc: lilypond-user Mailinglist <lilypond-user@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

 

Mark,

 

I would like to override the default behviour of  the pedal bracket.

 

is it possible to end that bracket at the position of the note's column, 
instead of extending it for the whole note's duration?

 

Thanks.

 

2018-03-24 17:32 GMT+01:00 Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonm...@ca.rr.com 
<mailto:carsonm...@ca.rr.com> >:

Paolo,

 

Put the \sustainOff outside of the tuplet { } and put it on the next pitch.

 

Mark

 

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Re: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[paolo prete]

Mark,

I would like to override the default behviour of  the pedal bracket.

is it possible to end that bracket at the position of the note's column,
instead of extending it for the whole note's duration?

Thanks.

2018-03-24 17:32 GMT+01:00 Mark Stephen Mrotek :

> Paolo,
>
>
>
> Put the \sustainOff outside of the tuplet { } and put it on the next pitch.
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
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RE: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

[Mark Stephen Mrotek]

Paolo,

 

Put the \sustainOff outside of the tuplet { } and put it on the next pitch.

 

Mark

 

From: lilypond-user [mailto:lilypond-user-bounces+carsonmark=ca.rr@gnu.org] 
On Behalf Of paolo prete
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2018 9:20 AM
To: lilypond-user Mailinglist 
Subject: SustainPedal on shifted notes (possible bug?)

 

Hello,

 

as you can see from the below snippet, the bracket of the sustain pedal is not 
properly extended when the last note is shifted. 

Is this a bug? Is there a way to fix it or a work-around ?

Thanks

 

 

%

 

\score { 

 

  \tuplet 3/2 {c'\sustainOn  f'  \once \override NoteColumn #'X-offset = 10 
c''\mf\sustainOff }

 

  \layout { 

\context { 

  \Score pedalSustainStyle = #'mixed 

} 

  }

 

}

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