from:"Grammostola Rosea"

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday 28 July 2009 13:58:06 Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>> Robert Keller wrote:
>> 
>>> Arnold, thank you. I think I have everything in SF now. I added GPL
>>> notice to the package-info.java files and added INSTALL.txt,
>>> COPYING.txt, and LICENSE.txt.
>>>
>>> Is there anything else I should have?
>>>
>>> I appreciate your help.
>>>   
>> In Copying it's say: GPLv2 or at your option, any later version.
>> License says GPLv3
>>
>> Don't know if that's a problem...
>> 
>
> Yes, it is a problem.
>
> Mr Keller, YOU ARE STILL VIOLATING THE GPL!
>
> You must use the correct version of the license or else you
> are VIOLATING THE GPL!
>
> Can you understand that or do you need some kind of tutor?
>
> STOP VIOLATING THE GPL!!!
>
>
>   
One of the main reasons why R. Stallman started GNU/FSF/GPL because of 
it's social aspect. You learn kids on schools for example to corporate 
and help each other, being social.

99% of this list is trying to help Prof Keller how to use the GPL 
license, how to put the project on SourceForge and how to manage such an 
GPL project, being social.

You, Raymond, act a-social:

1) You are not coorporative
2) You yell to more then one person, say rude things and use bad language
3) You scream about violating GPL, and not helping him not violating GPL
4) you disturb the corporation and the work of other LAD developers
5) You are giving GPL and FSF a bad name


STOP VIOLATING THE SPIRIT OF FSF/GNU and GPL, RAYMOND MARTIN!

Thanks in advance,

\r

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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor created on sourceforge

Grammostola Rosea wrote:
> Robert Keller wrote:
>>
>> On Jul 28, 2009, at 1:27 PM, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>>
>>> Robert Keller wrote:
>>>> I fixed it to v2. Thanks!
>>>>
>>>> Bob
>>>
>>> Bob,
>>>
>>> We don't post on top. Quote the relevant part and place your message
>>> below, because of our mail archive ;)
>>
>> Sorry, it was something that gmail seems to encourage, and I didn't 
>> realize about the archive.
>>
>>>
>>> About the licenses. I think Impro-visor should have the same license of
>>> the GPL source you use (Jmusic or something(?)).
>>>
>>> About setting up a mailinglist, one for users one for developers, 
>>> that's
>>> pretty easy.
>>>
>>> I think this should help you:
>>>
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> \r
>>
>>
>> A question: On sourceForge, I see how to commit to svn.
>>
>> But how to post files, such as a zip distribution, on the Files page? 
>> My Files section is empty, but I'd like to put something there.
>>
>
Bob,

You better do 'reply to all'. So more people can give suggestions. I'm 
not very experienced in that sort of stuff (yet).

Regards,

\r

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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor created on sourceforge

Robert Keller wrote:
> I fixed it to v2. Thanks!
>
> Bob

Bob,

We don't post on top. Quote the relevant part and place your message 
below, because of our mail archive ;)

About the licenses. I think Impro-visor should have the same license of 
the GPL source you use (Jmusic or something(?)).

About setting up a mailinglist, one for users one for developers, that's 
pretty easy.

I think this should help you:

https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo

Regards,

\r

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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor created on sourceforge

Robert Keller wrote:
> Arnold, thank you. I think I have everything in SF now. I added GPL  
> notice to the package-info.java files and added INSTALL.txt,  
> COPYING.txt, and LICENSE.txt.
>
> Is there anything else I should have?
>
> I appreciate your help.
>   
>
In Copying it's say: GPLv2 or at your option, any later version.
License says GPLv3

Don't know if that's a problem...


\r

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Re: [LAD] Fwd: Fw: Re: At the hands of Professor Keller and Raymond

alex stone wrote:
> Just on a more serious note, amidst all this mayhem and frivolity, we
> forked a project recently to more specifically add and modify a set of
> tools for a defined purpose.
> Unlike this trainwreck, we not only tried our best to do so in a
> decent way, but the original author was thoroughly civilised about it,
> and showed a lot of class in his positive and encouraging responses.
>
> I certainly learned a lot from the process, and have even more respect
> for Chris (Cannam) as a result.
>
> It goes without saying that if Chris can use anything we write, then
> he's most welcome to do so, and has our encouragement as well.
>
> There's a way to do this that doesn't involve throwing digital
> hatchets or burning anyone at the stake.
>
>   
I guess you are talking about Rosegarden and openoctave as a 'fork'...
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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor created on sourceforge

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday 28 July 2009 05:08:49 Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>> Robert Keller wrote:
>> 
>>> Dear linux-audio developers,
>>>
>>> I have created New Project https://sourceforge.net/projects/impro-
>>> visor/
>>>   
>> Thanks
>>
>> 
>>> for Impro-Visor, which is its correct name. I will populate the
>>> source later today, as I need time to get acquainted with their
>>> system, but I have to be off right now to another important meeting
>>> for the afternoon and can't do it instantly. The source I will post
>>> will be our version 4.0.
>>>   
>> Ok, I see there is a svn version:
>> |svn co https://impro-visor.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/impro-visor
>> 
>
>   
>> impro-visor |
>>
>> I don't see copyright and license files yet though. I think it's wise to
>> add them.
>> 
>
> GPL violations on SF right away. Good work Keller.
>
>   
>> Is there already a binary, because I can't find build/install options.
>> Would be nice if we could also download the binary from sourceforge,
>> without having to subscribe to the yahoo group.
>> 
>
> Another GPL violation on SF. You have to supply everything to build the 
> application.
>
> And, again, my project is still there with all the files. Keller was wrong,
> as I said previously.
>
>
>   
ik word een beetje moe  van jou

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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor created on sourceforge

Robert Keller wrote:
> Dear linux-audio developers,
>
> I have created New Project https://sourceforge.net/projects/impro- 
> visor/ 
Thanks

> for Impro-Visor, which is its correct name. I will populate the  
> source later today, as I need time to get acquainted with their  
> system, but I have to be off right now to another important meeting  
> for the afternoon and can't do it instantly. The source I will post  
> will be our version 4.0.
>   
Ok, I see there is a svn version:
|svn co https://impro-visor.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/impro-visor 
impro-visor |

I don't see copyright and license files yet though. I think it's wise to 
add them.

Is there already a binary, because I can't find build/install options.
Would be nice if we could also download the binary from sourceforge, 
without having to subscribe to the yahoo group.

I think it will be good for the project if you start a mailing list for 
your application. That can be a user mailing list and a development 
mailing list, but I think especially the latter will be very useful for 
discussing development topics.

Thanks so far. Take it easy.

\r

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Re: [LAD] Fw: Re: At the hands of Professor Keller and Raymond


> PS: You all do remember what your next employer will find out about you when 
> googling your name, do you? :-)
>   
Fuck Google! Fork Google! Fuck Google! Fork Google!  Fuck Google! Fork 
Google! Fuck Google! Fork Google!

Uh...

Good night ;)

\r





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Re: [LAD] Fw: Re: At the hands of Professor Keller and Raymond

Fons Adriaensen wrote:
> While I'd  normally respect the private nature of any
> message, this one goes well above any reasonable limit
> so I do feel free to quote it:
>
> - Forwarded message from lase...@gmail.com -
>
> From: lase...@gmail.com
> To: Fons Adriaensen 
> Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:29:23 -0400
>
> On Monday 27 July 2009 16:11:54 Fons Adriaensen wrote:
>   
>> On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 08:33:30PM +0200, Jörn Nettingsmeier wrote:
>> 
>>> welcome to the linux audio developers' community, thanks for joining
>>> this list.
>>>   
>> (and lots more)
>>
>> While being away to have dinner at some nice place in the Italian
>> countryside I've been musing about writing to prof. Keller.
>>
>> No need to do so as Joern has basically said everything I'd wanted
>> to say. But I want to repeat his welcome, and would want to reassure
>> Bob that most of us are considerably less corrosive and rude than
>> the one member he's had to deal with up to now.
>>
>> Kind regards from hot Parma,
>> 
>
> Hey, go fuck yourself. Is that corrosive enough for you?
>
> You should keep your mouth shut when you do not understand things.
>
> You rude insulting bastard.
>   
What wrong with this, just a misspell.

"go fork yourself!"

;)

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Re: [LAD] At the hands of Professor Keller and Raymond

Chris Cannam wrote:
> 2009/7/27 Jörn Nettingsmeier :
>   
>> which means that raymond has a point. and he is also entitled to forking
>> your project any way he sees fit.
>> 
>
> It isn't necessarily the case that he is entitled to fork it.  Raymond
> has repeatedly said that it was distributed to him without a GPL
> license.
I have asked Mr Keller two times if Impro-Visor was released under GPL 
license, which he confirmed to me and also to others.

And Mr Keller still is planning to release it with the GPL license, if I 
understood him right.

Regards,

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Re: [LAD] Background on the Impro-Visor project

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday 27 July 2009 13:10:50 Ralf Mardorf wrote:
>   
>>> I have contacted sourceForge
>>> about his posting of sources relating to the project, and they
>>> suggested filing a copyright infringement (the project is copyright by
>>> me and Harvey Mudd College).
>>>   
>> You don't want that Raymond does forge his own version of Impro-Visor?
>> Why not? I can't see any damage by doing this.
>> 
>
> Of course, because there is no damage. In fact, my fork will help popularize
> the application. That guy does not understand that though. There is no
> such thing as negative publicity, ever heard that expression?
>
> The only reason people like that do not want forks is that they cannot bear
> the thought that someone might take their idea and improve upon it in ways
> that they could not. It is all power-tripping to maintain control of something
> that you have already released into the wild by virtue of using the GPL.
>
> When you use the GPL you essentially are letting go of control. People
> should read more before they use certain licenses. If that is not what they
> want, then do something else. It is ultimately the responsibility of each
> person to understand the license conditions and obligations upfront.
> Anything less is just incompetence.
>
> Complaining about actions that are completely legitimate and ethically
> correct is a one way ticket to looking like a fool.
>
>   
>>> a lot of the thinking that went into the project is
>>> that of me and my students.
>>>   
>> And also by some GPL coders.
>>
>> You won't share your knowledge?
>> 
>
> Exactly. Selfishness. Keep control. Be top dog. All ideas that do not
> sit well with those of us that believe in the philosophy of free software.
>
> Free software is about meritocracy. You do good things, share those things,
> welcome others to contribute, discuss differences of opinion (when people
> are reasonable, this is not of one of those cases), and so on.
>
> Raymond
>
> P.S. The Improvisor project still exists on SF along with the files.
>
> Check: http://sf.net/projects/improvisor
>
> I wonder why that is. I know, because there is nothing wrong being done.
> Unlike the packages on the Impro-Visor Yahoo group, mine actually
> have the GPL license. Thus, Impro-Visor continues to violate the GPL
> even with the old version up. Check for yourself and see how incredulous
> that guy is. Plus, he also lies about any copyright infringement. There
> aren't any infringements with the packages I put up, they are exactly the
> same as the ones on the Yahoo group, aside from actually being in compliance
> with the GPL or the file names.
>
>
>   
I  like to see also some comments about the issue by others, who know a 
lot of GPL etc.

Thanks in advance,

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Re: [LAD] At the hands of Professor Keller and Raymond

Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> "My recommendation is, that Bob forge the project within the next 3 
> month, that he will be the head of the project, but coders from the 
> community get access to the source directories, after they have shown by 
> some patches, that they are able to program, or what ever the regular 
> way for FLOSS projects might be."
>
> At least the source code should be available within the next 3 month.
> Maybe we can try to find something similar to this and stop anything else:

First thanks for your reply on list Bob, cause that's what we need, an 
open dialogue.

The relation between Raymond and Bob is not on it's high at the moment, 
we'll leave it by that now ;)

I don't think Ralf is the one who should do a proposal for a base for 
corporation. I think the owner of the project Bob, should clarify 
reasonably what his plans are with the project and how much space his is 
willing to give to other developers and contributors. Also he should say 
something about how he will act according to what the GPL license says.

I think it's your turn Bob and don't speak to anyone personal... speak 
to the community.

Thanks in advance,

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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor packages now on SF

2009-07-26 Thread Grammostola Rosea

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Sunday 26 July 2009 15:53:30 nescivi wrote:
>   
>> On Sunday 26 July 2009 09:31:10 lase...@gmail.com wrote:
>> 
>>> Impro-Visor compiles in the jMusic code, which makes it even more
>>> evident that there is a violation. And the header clearly mentions
>>> using jMusic. So there is no mystery in whether this under GPL
>>> or that violations have occurred.
>>>   
>> Unless the authors of jMusic gave them permission to use it in a non-GPL
>> context.
>> Did they react at all on your emails about this issue?
>> 
>
> I tried last year to contact them and just recently. No response
> either time, but now the binaries were taken down so no real point.
>
> I will try again soon. I am also going look more into jMusic while
> working on this program. There may be improvements I can contribute.
> So maybe I will have some communication then.
>
>
>   
I have had good contact with Bob so far. But not on development issues.  
Actually Bob mailed me for advise in this issue. I gave him the options 
he had as far as I knew. 
He obviously decided to remove the preview. I mailed him with the advise 
of an open dialogue with the linux audio dev community. No response so 
far. But maybe we can wait for that.

\r

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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor packages now on SF

2009-07-25 Thread Grammostola Rosea

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday 25 July 2009 15:04:05 Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>> lase...@gmail.com wrote:
>> 
>>> On Saturday 25 July 2009 14:09:26 you wrote:
>>>   
>>>> While you have every right to fork the code, one quibble I have (most
>>>> likely just with your wording) is where you say that they are
>>>> obligated to provide the binary. They have no such obligation
>>>> whatsoever. If they provide a binary they are obligated to provide
>>>> source, but they are free to offer neither without violating the GPL.
>>>> 
>>> Okay, it was just a quick wording, so don't misconstrue my meaning.
>>> The binaries were out, under GPL, source has to be available
>>> then in accord with the license. That is what this is about.
>>>   
>> The guy removed the preview version from his website.
>> You don't have to release the source of development versions.
>> 
>
> Yes you do. This has been explained previously.
>   
I asked this on #gnu , they told me, it is not necessary


>   
>> You don't have to make your source available, but people who gets your
>> binaries should be able to get the source too.
>> 
>
> Yes you do. Depends on how you use the license. This also was established
> previously.
>   
Same #gnu
>   
>> Mmhh I'd rather saw a better corporation here.  I don't know who is
>> non-coorporative here though, Raymond or Bob Keller.
>> 
>
> Bob. Do not equate packaging with contents. This seems to be
> the practical misunderstanding you are having.
>
>   
>> Maybe it would be good to invite  Bob Keller  for a reasonable
>> dialogue  on this list. I like to hear his opinion about corporation.
>> After such a public discussion we can decide whether there are good
>> reasons to bundle forces on _his_ project or to fork it.
>>
>> my 2 cents,
>> 
>
> There you go again giving that guy the benefit of the doubt, even after
> he had a number of chances to act reasonably.
>
> In my last email to him I suggested we discuss this matter on his Yahoo
> group with others (court of public opinion), but I know he will never do that
> (which I directly mentioned to him). 
>
> He will never allow free discussion of this point so that people can come to a
> consensus. As I already stated, a few people sided with him initially and then
> reversed their positions once they actually had the facts. Despite this he
> does not seem to be able to reason the whole thing out to its logical
> conclusion.
>
> In any event, I already have a project now and can do what I like in accord
> with the GPL. So there is no "we" to really decide anything. I already made
> the decision and will move forward. Others are free to do as they wish, also
> in accord with the GPL. If you want to participate on my project, fine.
> I will hook you up. If you want to make your own, also fine. Fork my stuff,
> when I put it up, I encourage it. Forks don't hurt a project they help to
> create that FOSS eco-system we are all happy to use. More versions will
> encourage better development. Do as you will and I will even help you out if
> you want to fork within my project, have separate branches of development,
> etc.
>
>   
We will see how it goes. For myself I wait to see how Bob acts in the 
coming time.
I'm happy though that more people seems to have interest in this project.

Regards,

\r
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Re: [LAD] Impro-Visor packages now on SF

2009-07-25 Thread Grammostola Rosea

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday 25 July 2009 14:09:26 you wrote:
>   
>> While you have every right to fork the code, one quibble I have (most
>> likely just with your wording) is where you say that they are
>> obligated to provide the binary. They have no such obligation
>> whatsoever. If they provide a binary they are obligated to provide
>> source, but they are free to offer neither without violating the GPL.
>> 
>
>
> Okay, it was just a quick wording, so don't misconstrue my meaning.
> The binaries were out, under GPL, source has to be available
> then in accord with the license. That is what this is about.
>
>
>   
The guy removed the preview version from his website.
You don't have to release the source of development versions.
You don't have to make your source available, but people who gets your 
binaries should be able to get the source too.

Mmhh I'd rather saw a better corporation here.  I don't know who is 
non-coorporative here though, Raymond or Bob Keller.

Maybe it would be good to invite  Bob Keller  for a reasonable  
dialogue  on this list. I like to hear his opinion about corporation. 
After such a public discussion we can decide whether there are good 
reasons to bundle forces on _his_ project or to fork it.

my 2 cents,

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Re: [LAD] Impro-visor source code and fork

2009-07-19 Thread Grammostola Rosea

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Apart from that, I will be looking into forking Impro-visor in the next few
> days. After making contact with the responsible parties about the GPL
> violations, I have received no reply and the source code has not been
> posted along with the binaries as is legally required. I also contacted
> the department head at the institution responsible for this work to see
> if they would look into the matter. Perhaps they can sort this out in the
> next little while. Failing that, I will probably start a new project on 
> SourceForge and be looking to put together a development team.
> Contributions to the software by users will also be welcome. There will
> be a need for new leadsheets, transcriptions, documentation, and even
> translations of the user interface.
>   
It's holiday in this part of the world... I don't know if that makes 
responding delayed?


\r

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Re: [LAD] Improvisor lilypond support!?

2009-07-18 Thread Grammostola Rosea

lase...@gmail.com wrote:
 Thanks man. I'll forward this to Bob Keller too. 
 I think he mentioned in a message that he is willing to give developers 
 svn access to the recent code. 

 
>>> Really. Last year I found Improvisor and wanted to contribute to it,
>>> so I got  in contact with Bob. I made some changes to integrate the
>>> application better into the desktop (on Mac OS X also) and did some
>>> initial cleanup.  
>>> The reaction I received was less than welcoming. In fact, the message I
>>> got was that they were not interested in really allowing outside
>>> developers to contribute. Thus my changes were never used, or considered
>>> as far as I can tell. What I got was a bunch of excuses about the
>>> situation with the application until finally this Bob guy came straight
>>> out and harshly refused to cooperate on development. I even had to ask
>>> numbers of time before I could finally get the source code and this
>>> resulted in it finally being posted on the group. 
>>> Basically the group that works on it is his student research group at the
>>> educational institution he is employed at. So it appears that they just
>>> want to keep all the glory and credit for the application to themselves by
>>> disallowing outside contributions. This is really not manner that we
>>> usually associate with FOSS. The fact that you have to subscribe to a user
>>> group even to get the binary is one big clue. To my mind the only reason
>>> it is under GPL is because they use other libraries that are, not because
>>> they see some benefit to doing so. 
>>> The only way to go with this application, at the moment, is to fork it. I
>>> was considering doing this a while ago, but have other projects keeping me
>>> busy. If you can convince them to open it up, great. I wouldn't hold my
>>> breath though. If enough other developers are interested then I could give
>>> some time to a fork. 
>>>   
>
>   
>> This is what he replied me 
>> 
>  
>   
>> "If there are developers who are serious, I could provide svn access to 
>> our repository. Right now there are 3 people who are active. We are 
>> about to release version 4, which is almost a year out from version 3.39 
>> that is in the user group. " 
>> 
>  
>   
>> So I think we have to go the working together way first. 
>> I've forwarded the message of Lasconic to him, let's wait for his reply 
>> on that. 
>> 
>  
>  
> No, I think you are wrong here to even consider trying to cooperate. I waited
> after your initial reply to respond because obviously you weren't fully
> considering my points, so I decided to see what happens. Now a preview of the 
> next version of impro-visor has been released and it is as I expected. No
> source code, again. Blatant GPL violation again. That was unexpected, not!
>
> Where's that SourceForge project also? That's right, it does not exist.
>
> I sent a message about the missing source code, again. I wonder what excuses
> he will give, again (or has he decided to not even respond to my legitimate
> inquiries now). Last time it was that he was on the road or busy or  lame excuse here>. He had the time to package up binaries for Linux,
> Mac, and Windows, but could not zip up the source and post it at the same 
> time?! Go check that with him and let's see how the responses match what I am
> saying.
>
> Now I am seriously considering forking this application myself, to make
> sure that everyone can get the current source code, they do not have
> to join some group just to get the binary, and that real contributions can
> actually get in. Yeah, I'm a serious developer, but that guy never offered to
> give me any access and the new version still has bugs that I already fixed
> which he would not accept.
>
> I will give it a little longer, but if these people don't get their act
> together and start doing things in accord with the GPL, then they should
> either change their license and remove all GPL stuff or not be surprised when
> a forked version appears (Improvisor+ sounds good: Improvisor, plus the source
> code and the ability for others to contribute, and not needing to be in some
> group just to get it, and ...).
>  
> There has been plenty of time for them to do the right thing. Time has run
> out already. Let's not be naive. Some people put out applications as GPL
> just so they can say they did, but really they just want to ride on the FOSS
> bandwagon to look good. Then when you try to get involved, contribute, or
> ask for the source code, all of a sudden they clamp down on things and show
> you that they want to control everything, as if it is a commercial proprietary
> program. Sorry this does not fly with me. I have had this experience with
> another project that thinks they are FOSS and that they can do no wrong. The 
> end result was that I did actually end up having to fork the program because 
> of their inability to conduct themselves properly.
>
> Perhaps some other peo

Re: [LAD] Improvisor: public repository (was:Improvisor lilypond support!?)

2009-07-04 Thread Grammostola Rosea

Robert Keller wrote:
>
> On Jun 11, 2009, at 5:19 AM, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>
>> lasconic wrote:
>>> I took some time yesterday night to take a look to improvisor code and
>>> estimate the cost of adding musicXML export. Import is indeed more
>>> complicated.
>>> I downloaded the code of improvisor 3.39. It's the last and only code
>>> available. Improvisor inner model is a little bit different than 
>>> musicXML
>>> one. Common practice in musicXML is to don't "time" the chords and 
>>> put them
>>> in the middle of notes. At least, this is my experience with finale 
>>> musicXML
>>> export features. I managed to make a quick and dirty prototype to 
>>> export a simple melody (no
>>> tuplet) and chord root and bass (no extension yet). Chords are in 
>>> between
>>> notes but lily+musicML2ly shoud be able to deal with it. 
>>> Unfortunately, 3.39
>>> is an old version, and according to Bob Keller the code base changed 
>>> a lot
>>> but it's not public yet.  With some more voices, perhaps we can 
>>> convince Bob Keller and his team to
>>> open up the repository to the public. After all, improvisor is a 
>>> fine piece
>>> of software which can benefit from open development, moreover if 
>>> time and
>>> resources are an issue.
>>>
>>> Lasconic
>>>
>>>
>> Thanks man. I'll forward this to Bob Keller too.
>> I think he mentioned in a message that he is willing to give 
>> developers svn access to the recent code.
>>
>> Bob, could you comment on this?
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>> \r
>>
>
> I'll be looking toward moving Impro-Visor to a public repository, as 
> soon as I stabilize the current version, which I hope will be before 
> the end of June. Is SourceForge the best bet?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bob
>
> Robert Keller
> Csilla & Walt Foley Professor
> Computer Science
> Harvey Mudd College
>
>
>
>
>
Hey Bob,

How are things going? New version almost ready? And is the source public 
on SourceForge yet? Looking forward to it.

Kind regards,

Roos
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Re: [LAD] [LAU] [ANN] lv2fil version 2.0 "New hope" released

2009-06-13 Thread Grammostola Rosea

Nedko Arnaudov wrote:
> Four-band parametric equaliser LV2 plugin. DSP code by Fons Adriaensen.
>
> Homepage: http://nedko.arnaudov.name/soft/lv2fil/
>
> Screenshot: http://nedko.arnaudov.name/soft/lv2fil/lv2fil.png
>
> Tarball download:
> http://nedko.arnaudov.name/soft/lv2fil/lv2fil-2.0.tar.bz2
> http://nedko.arnaudov.name/soft/lv2fil/lv2fil-2.0.tar.bz2.sig
>
> = Overview =
> Stereo and mono LV2 plugins, four-band parametric equalisers.
> Each section has an active/bypass switch, frequency, bandwidth and
> gain controls. There is also a global bypass switch and gain control.
>
> = DSP =
> The 2nd order resonant filters are implemented using a Mitra-Regalia
> style lattice filter, which has the nice property of being stable
> even while parameters are being changed.
>
> All switches and controls are internally smoothed, so they can be
> used 'live' whithout any clicks or zipper noises. This should make
> this plugin a good candidate for use in systems that allow automation
> of plugin control ports, such as Ardour, or for stage use.
>
> = GUI =
> The GUI provides knobs and toggle buttons for tweaking filter
> parameters. It also provides frequency response widget with
> differently coloured curve for each section and separate curve for
> total equalization effect.
>
> The GUI uses the External UI extension. lv2rack (part of zynjacku)
> supports this extension. Ardour-2.8 needs patch to support the
> external UI extension.
>
>   
Wow you must have been busy. Thanks.

Btw I saw an discussion about Pianoteq, which was not released as LV2 
plugin, because LV2 seems to lack some things in the eyes of the 
pianoteq devs... Maybe it's interesting to find out what that was:

http://ardour.org/node/2741#comment-13134

\r
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Re: [LAD] Improvisor lilypond support!?

2009-06-11 Thread Grammostola Rosea

Robert Keller wrote:
>
> On Jun 11, 2009, at 5:19 AM, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>
>> lasconic wrote:
>>> I took some time yesterday night to take a look to improvisor code and
>>> estimate the cost of adding musicXML export. Import is indeed more
>>> complicated.
>>> I downloaded the code of improvisor 3.39. It's the last and only code
>>> available. Improvisor inner model is a little bit different than 
>>> musicXML
>>> one. Common practice in musicXML is to don't "time" the chords and 
>>> put them
>>> in the middle of notes. At least, this is my experience with finale 
>>> musicXML
>>> export features. I managed to make a quick and dirty prototype to 
>>> export a simple melody (no
>>> tuplet) and chord root and bass (no extension yet). Chords are in 
>>> between
>>> notes but lily+musicML2ly shoud be able to deal with it. 
>>> Unfortunately, 3.39
>>> is an old version, and according to Bob Keller the code base changed 
>>> a lot
>>> but it's not public yet.  With some more voices, perhaps we can 
>>> convince Bob Keller and his team to
>>> open up the repository to the public. After all, improvisor is a 
>>> fine piece
>>> of software which can benefit from open development, moreover if 
>>> time and
>>> resources are an issue.
>>>
>>> Lasconic
>>>
>>>
>> Thanks man. I'll forward this to Bob Keller too.
>> I think he mentioned in a message that he is willing to give 
>> developers svn access to the recent code.
>>
>> Bob, could you comment on this?
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>> \r
>>
>
> I'll be looking toward moving Impro-Visor to a public repository, as 
> soon as I stabilize the current version, which I hope will be before 
> the end of June. 
Ah that's good news. Thanks.

> Is SourceForge the best bet?
>
>
I think SourceForge is good, but others might think different (I have 
little experience with it myself, others?)

Let us know when it's up there.

Kind regards

\r



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Re: [LAD] Improvisor lilypond support!?

2009-06-11 Thread Grammostola Rosea

raymond wrote:
> On Thursday 11 June 2009 08:19:56 Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>> lasconic wrote:
>> 
>>> I took some time yesterday night to take a look to improvisor code and
>>> estimate the cost of adding musicXML export. Import is indeed more
>>> complicated.
>>> I downloaded the code of improvisor 3.39. It's the last and only code
>>> available. Improvisor inner model is a little bit different than musicXML
>>> one. Common practice in musicXML is to don't "time" the chords and put
>>> them in the middle of notes. At least, this is my experience with finale
>>> musicXML export features.
>>> I managed to make a quick and dirty prototype to export a simple melody
>>> (no tuplet) and chord root and bass (no extension yet). Chords are in
>>> between notes but lily+musicML2ly shoud be able to deal with it.
>>> Unfortunately, 3.39 is an old version, and according to Bob Keller the
>>> code base changed a lot but it's not public yet.
>>> With some more voices, perhaps we can convince Bob Keller and his team to
>>> open up the repository to the public. After all, improvisor is a fine
>>> piece of software which can benefit from open development, moreover if
>>> time and resources are an issue.
>>>
>>> Lasconic
>>>   
>> Thanks man. I'll forward this to Bob Keller too.
>> I think he mentioned in a message that he is willing to give developers
>> svn access to the recent code.
>> 
>
> Really. Last year I found Improvisor and wanted to contribute to it, so I got
> in contact with Bob. I made some changes to integrate the application better
> into the desktop (on Mac OS X also) and did some initial cleanup.
>
> The reaction I received was less than welcoming. In fact, the message I got
> was that they were not interested in really allowing outside developers to
> contribute. Thus my changes were never used, or considered as far as I can 
> tell. What I got was a bunch of excuses about the situation with the 
> application until finally this Bob guy came straight out and harshly refused 
> to cooperate on development. I even had to ask numbers of time before I could 
> finally get the source code and this resulted in it finally being posted on 
> the group.
>
> Basically the group that works on it is his student research group at the 
> educational institution he is employed at. So it appears that they just want 
> to keep all the glory and credit for the application to themselves by 
> disallowing outside contributions. This is really not manner that we usually 
> associate with FOSS. The fact that you have to subscribe to a user group
> even to get the binary is one big clue. To my mind the only reason it is under
> GPL is because they use other libraries that are, not because they see some 
> benefit to doing so.
>
> The only way to go with this application, at the moment, is to fork it. I was
> considering doing this a while ago, but have other projects keeping me busy.
> If you can convince them to open it up, great. I wouldn't hold my breath
> though. If enough other developers are interested then I could give some time
> to a fork.
>
>
>   
This is what he replied me

"If there are developers who are serious, I could provide svn access to 
our repository. Right now there are 3 people who are active. We are 
about to release version 4, which is almost a year out from version 3.39 
that is in the user group. "

So I think we have to go the working together way first.
I've forwarded the message of Lasconic to him, let's wait for his reply 
on that.

Kind regards,

\r
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Re: [LAD] Improvisor lilypond support!?

2009-06-11 Thread Grammostola Rosea

lasconic wrote:
> I took some time yesterday night to take a look to improvisor code and
> estimate the cost of adding musicXML export. Import is indeed more
> complicated.
> I downloaded the code of improvisor 3.39. It's the last and only code
> available. Improvisor inner model is a little bit different than musicXML
> one. Common practice in musicXML is to don't "time" the chords and put them
> in the middle of notes. At least, this is my experience with finale musicXML
> export features. 
> I managed to make a quick and dirty prototype to export a simple melody (no
> tuplet) and chord root and bass (no extension yet). Chords are in between
> notes but lily+musicML2ly shoud be able to deal with it. Unfortunately, 3.39
> is an old version, and according to Bob Keller the code base changed a lot
> but it's not public yet.  
> With some more voices, perhaps we can convince Bob Keller and his team to
> open up the repository to the public. After all, improvisor is a fine piece
> of software which can benefit from open development, moreover if time and
> resources are an issue.
>
> Lasconic
>
>   
Thanks man. I'll forward this to Bob Keller too.
I think he mentioned in a message that he is willing to give developers 
svn access to the recent code.

Bob, could you comment on this?

Kind regards,

\r
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Re: [LAD] Improvisor lilypond support!?

2009-06-10 Thread Grammostola Rosea

Robert Keller wrote:
>
> On Jun 10, 2009, at 2:09 PM, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>
>> but Impro-visor doesn't have musicXML support right? Is it possible 
>> to add that?
>
> Correct, it doesn't. It is possible to add musicXML output. Anything 
> is possible. However, I have too much else to do at this point in time 
> to give that a high priority.
>
> Input would be harder, because Impro-Visor has only a single melody 
> line, but musicXML, I'm pretty sure, can specify polyphony, so there 
> would be the issue of how to interpret that. Also, I'm not sure how 
> musicXML deals with chord symbols, but that could be a second issue.
>
> Regards,
>
> Bob
>
> Robert Keller
> Csilla & Walt Foley Professor
> Computer Science
> Harvey Mudd College
>
>

Thanks again.

I understand, time is scares these days...

Maybe other Lilypond devs or people who can work on adding Musicxml 
support could help you a bit. I will Cc this mail to the Lilypond users 
mailinglist (you have to check that app!) and the Linux dev list.

We will see. If you have questions, requests or announcements, just let 
us know. We (Lilypond and Linux users) like to stay in tune with 
Impro-Visor.

Kind regards,

\r

Ps. If people have problems to get sound working on GNU/Linux you can 
point them to:
http://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=860
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Re: [LAD] [LAU] [Fwd: [Fwd: Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?]]

Grammostola Rosea wrote:
> I've uploaded Improvisor here, so you don't have to subscribe to yahoo 
> groups:
>   
Ok, sorry I was to quick with that.


"I'd prefer you didn't. If there are developers who are serious, I could 
provide svn access to our repository. Right now there are 3 people who 
are active. We are about to release version 4, which is almost a year 
out from version 3.39 that is in the user group.

If you host it somewhere else, integration becomes more of a problem.

I realize that the code is not in the best of shape, partly due to the 
fact that we have had lots of students working on it. I'd like to get it 
in better condition, but time is an issue.

Bob"

His email:  kellerATcs.hmc.edu


\r




>
> Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>> This is an very interesting application, and it is released as GPL 
>> software.
>> The only drawback on GNU/Linux is that sound is not working very well, 
>> at least in my experience:
>> http://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=860
>>
>> I dunno if there is a way to get better sound out of java applications.
>> Maybe some devs can help this application with ALSA and/or Jack support?
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>> \r
>>
>> --------
>>
>> Subject:
>> [Fwd: Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?]
>> From:
>> Grammostola Rosea 
>> Date:
>> Tue, 09 Jun 2009 22:30:53 +0200
>> To:
>> lilypond-user 
>>
>> To:
>> lilypond-user 
>>
>>
>> I got this reply from the main developer:
>>
>> ------------
>>
>> Subject:
>> Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?
>> From:
>> Robert Keller 
>> Date:
>> Tue, 9 Jun 2009 13:17:25 -0700
>> To:
>> Grammostola Rosea 
>>
>> To:
>> Grammostola Rosea 
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jun 9, 2009, at 12:44 PM, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>>
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>>
>>> I've found a very interesting application, Improvisor
>>>
>>> *Impro-Visor* (short for “Improvisation Advisor”) is a music notation 
>>> program designed to help jazz musicians compose and hear solos 
>>> similar to ones that might be improvised. The objective is to improve 
>>> understanding of solo construction and tune chord changes. There are 
>>> other, secondary, things it can do, such as improvise on its own. It 
>>> has also been used for transcription. Because rhythm-section (e.g. 
>>> piano, bass, drums) accompaniment is automatically generated from 
>>> chords, Impro-Visor can be used as a play-along device. Now having a 
>>> wider array of accompaniment styles 
>>> <http://www.cs.hmc.edu/%7Ekeller/jazz/improvisor/Styles.htm>, its use 
>>> is not limited to jazz. Distributed with Impro-Visor is "The 
>>> Imaginary Book 
>>> <http://www.cs.hmc.edu/%7Ekeller/jazz/improvisor/ImaginaryBookIndex.html>", 
>>> a chords-only fakebook with chord progressions to about 2500 tunes.
>>> http://www.cs.hmc.edu/~keller/jazz/improvisor/
>>>
>>>
>>> Afaik it's GPL software and that makes me dreaming about having 
>>> Lilypond functionality in it... It has an midi export function, so 
>>> maybe the midi can be converted to lilypond?
>>>
>>> Are people here working with this application?
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> \r
>>>
>>>   
>> Yes, this is the home of Impro-Visor.
>>
>> It is GPL.
>>
>> There is no Lilypond export to speak of, although it should be 
>> possible. However, I don't believe I can work on it myself, as there 
>> is too much else to do at the moment.
>>
>> In the next release, we will be redirecting questions to the Yahoo! 
>> impro-visor forum and improvi...@cs.hmc.edu will be phased out 
>> (because it attracts too much spam).
>>
>> I'd be happy to answer any other questions.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Bob Keller
>>
>> Robert Keller
>> Csilla & Walt Foley Professor
>> Computer Science
>> Harvey Mudd College
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>> ___
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>> lilypond-u...@gnu.org
>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
>>   
>> 
>>
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>>   
>> 
>
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>
>   

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Re: [LAD] [Fwd: [Fwd: Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?]]

I've uploaded Improvisor here, so you don't have to subscribe to yahoo 
groups:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=ANIZYM07

Maybe someone has a better place for it?

\r



Grammostola Rosea wrote:
> This is an very interesting application, and it is released as GPL 
> software.
> The only drawback on GNU/Linux is that sound is not working very well, 
> at least in my experience:
> http://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=860
>
> I dunno if there is a way to get better sound out of java applications.
> Maybe some devs can help this application with ALSA and/or Jack support?
>
> Kind regards,
>
> \r
>
> 
>
> Subject:
> [Fwd: Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?]
> From:
> Grammostola Rosea 
> Date:
> Tue, 09 Jun 2009 22:30:53 +0200
> To:
> lilypond-user 
>
> To:
> lilypond-user 
>
>
> I got this reply from the main developer:
>
> 
>
> Subject:
> Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?
> From:
> Robert Keller 
> Date:
> Tue, 9 Jun 2009 13:17:25 -0700
> To:
> Grammostola Rosea 
>
> To:
> Grammostola Rosea 
>
>
>
> On Jun 9, 2009, at 12:44 PM, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>> I've found a very interesting application, Improvisor
>>
>> *Impro-Visor* (short for “Improvisation Advisor”) is a music notation 
>> program designed to help jazz musicians compose and hear solos 
>> similar to ones that might be improvised. The objective is to improve 
>> understanding of solo construction and tune chord changes. There are 
>> other, secondary, things it can do, such as improvise on its own. It 
>> has also been used for transcription. Because rhythm-section (e.g. 
>> piano, bass, drums) accompaniment is automatically generated from 
>> chords, Impro-Visor can be used as a play-along device. Now having a 
>> wider array of accompaniment styles 
>> <http://www.cs.hmc.edu/%7Ekeller/jazz/improvisor/Styles.htm>, its use 
>> is not limited to jazz. Distributed with Impro-Visor is "The 
>> Imaginary Book 
>> <http://www.cs.hmc.edu/%7Ekeller/jazz/improvisor/ImaginaryBookIndex.html>", 
>> a chords-only fakebook with chord progressions to about 2500 tunes.
>> http://www.cs.hmc.edu/~keller/jazz/improvisor/
>>
>>
>> Afaik it's GPL software and that makes me dreaming about having 
>> Lilypond functionality in it... It has an midi export function, so 
>> maybe the midi can be converted to lilypond?
>>
>> Are people here working with this application?
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> \r
>>
>
> Yes, this is the home of Impro-Visor.
>
> It is GPL.
>
> There is no Lilypond export to speak of, although it should be 
> possible. However, I don't believe I can work on it myself, as there 
> is too much else to do at the moment.
>
> In the next release, we will be redirecting questions to the Yahoo! 
> impro-visor forum and improvi...@cs.hmc.edu will be phased out 
> (because it attracts too much spam).
>
> I'd be happy to answer any other questions.
>
> Regards,
>
> Bob Keller
>
> Robert Keller
> Csilla & Walt Foley Professor
> Computer Science
> Harvey Mudd College
>
>
>
>
>
> 
>
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>   
> 
>
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Re: [LAD] [Fwd: [Fwd: Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?]]

Jens M Andreasen wrote:
>> http://www.cs.hmc.edu/~keller/jazz/improvisor/
>>
>> 
> Thats the user-manual or something. Where is the *.jar, *.zip or how
> this is distributed?
>
> The download link leads to Yahoo ...
>
>
>   
yeah you have to subsribe there... before you can download.

I'll sent the file to you

\r
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Re: [LAD] [Fwd: [Fwd: Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?]]

Jens M Andreasen wrote:
> Where is the application hosted???
>
> On Tue, 2009-06-09 at 22:39 +0200, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>> This is an very interesting application, and it is released as GPL software.
>> The only drawback on GNU/Linux is that sound is not working very well, 
>> at least in my experience:
>> http://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=860
>> 
>
>
>
>   
http://www.cs.hmc.edu/~keller/jazz/improvisor/


\r
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[LAD] [Fwd: [Fwd: Re: Improvisor lilypond support!?]]

This is an very interesting application, and it is released as GPL software.
The only drawback on GNU/Linux is that sound is not working very well,
at least in my experience:

http://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=860

I dunno if there is a way to get better sound out of java applications.
Maybe some devs can help this application with ALSA and/or Jack support?

Kind regards,

\r
--- Begin Message ---

I got this reply from the main developer:
--- Begin Message ---

On Jun 9, 2009, at 12:44 PM, Grammostola Rosea wrote:

Hi,

I've found a very interesting application, Improvisor

*Impro-Visor* (short for “Improvisation Advisor”) is a music
notation program designed to help jazz musicians compose and hear
solos similar to ones that might be improvised. The objective is to
improve understanding of solo construction and tune chord changes.
There are other, secondary, things it can do, such as improvise on
its own. It has also been used for transcription. Because rhythm-
section (e.g. piano, bass, drums) accompaniment is automatically
generated from chords, Impro-Visor can be used as a play-along
device. Now having a wider array of accompaniment styles <http://www.cs.hmc.edu/%7Ekeller/jazz/improvisor/Styles.htm
>, its use is not limited to jazz. Distributed with Impro-Visor is
"The Imaginary Book <http://www.cs.hmc.edu/%7Ekeller/jazz/improvisor/ImaginaryBookIndex.html
>", a chords-only fakebook with chord progressions to about 2500
tunes.

http://www.cs.hmc.edu/~keller/jazz/improvisor/

Afaik it's GPL software and that makes me dreaming about having
Lilypond functionality in it... It has an midi export function, so
maybe the midi can be converted to lilypond?

Are people here working with this application?

Regards,

Yes, this is the home of Impro-Visor.

It is GPL.

There is no Lilypond export to speak of, although it should be
possible. However, I don't believe I can work on it myself, as there
is too much else to do at the moment.

In the next release, we will be redirecting questions to the Yahoo!
impro-visor forum and improvi...@cs.hmc.edu will be phased out
(because it attracts too much spam).

I'd be happy to answer any other questions.

Regards,

Bob Keller

Robert Keller
Csilla & Walt Foley Professor
Computer Science
Harvey Mudd College

--- End Message ---
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Re: [LAD] Connie, an organ template for JACK

2009-05-31 Thread Grammostola Rosea

Martin Homuth-Rosemann wrote:
> Am Samstag, 30. Mai 2009 schrieb hermann meyer:
>   
>> There are some things I dont like,
>> 1.) there is a glitch when change the note
>> 
>
> That's already on my todo list. It's because I switch the signals on/off 
> without any smoothing like in a real instrument RC, parasitics etc. 
> I have two solutions to choose from:
> 1. I'll add some filtering - maybe in the output stage.
> 2. Delay the switch on/off until zero crossing.
>
>   
>> 2.) there is no handler for all notes off (panic)
>> 
>
> ok.
>
>   
>> 3.) cpu blow up when hold a key on.
>> 
>
> Connie 0.1 is a straight 1:1 translation from schematics found at 
> http://www.reinout.nl/?page_id=80
> A lot of optimizing still has to be done - you're welcome ;)
> That's why I "release early, release often".
>
>   
>> but like I said, not bad.
>>
>> regards
>>  hermann
>> 
>
> Thanks
>
> Martin
>
> NEW VERSION: 
> Connie 0.2 (good vibrations)
>   
Thanks for your work. Looks promising.

I doubt if the vibration of 0.2 is better then 0.1. The tempo  of the 
vibration if  very high...

\r
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Re: [LAD] VST and Qt

2009-04-07 Thread Grammostola Rosea

Justin Smith wrote:
> On Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 10:00 AM, David García Garzón
>  wrote:
>   
>> On Monday 06 April 2009 18:19:19 Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>> 
>>> David García Garzón wrote:
>>>   
>>>> On Monday 06 April 2009 14:45:40 Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> David García Garzón wrote:
>>>>>   
>>>>>> Hi, lads! Some news from the CLAM project.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For anyone interested in that subject, we managed to build Qt based VST
>>>>>> interfaces (from linux!). Not about integrating existing VST in Qt
>>>>>> applications but building brand new plugins using Qt. This is an step
>>>>>> to get visual prototyped VST from CLAM as we got from LADSPA and JACK
>>>>>> on last releases. I don't think the integration could get into the next
>>>>>> CLAM release, but i guess that just the Qt-VST integration could be
>>>>>> useful to someone in the community.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> See more information here:
>>>>>> http://vokicodder.blogspot.com/2009/04/vst-plugins-with-qt-user-interfa
>>>>>> ce .html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The code is available in the first link to the CLAM developers list.
>>>>>> Not the proper distribution but i plan to make it available from clam
>>>>>> or other repository in short. Any collaborative hacking to improve it
>>>>>> is very welcome.
>>>>>> 
>>>>> I'm an programmer noob, but some questions.
>>>>>
>>>>> 1) what is your aim? Building VST plugins for Gnu/ Linux? Is a VST
>>>>> better then an LV2 plugin?
>>>>> 2) why is the focus in the Gnu/Linux work on VST and not on AudioUnit
>>>>> plugins? Linux and OS X are both Unix like systems right?
>>>>>   
>>>> The principle we follow is "design once, generate many". We are aiming on
>>>> building any kind of plugins or audio backends our users want to build
>>>> using the CLAM framework. See:
>>>> http://clam-project.org/wiki/Network_Editor_tutorial
>>>>
>>>> One of those targets is building VST plugins *for Windows* (crosscompiled
>>>> from linux or natively from windows). The main advantage for linux users
>>>> is that they can visually build their plugins or JACK applications in
>>>> linux with CLAM, and then, if they want their plugin to be available for
>>>> Windows users, just click a button and you'll have a VST plugin as well.
>>>>
>>>> LV2 is also on our roadmap, and I guess that having already support for
>>>> Ladspa it won't be that difficult. But right now our interests where VST
>>>> just because a project partners asked us for some vst's and, well, it was
>>>> funny doing that from linux. We had vst code working for a couple of
>>>> years but without GUI, and in order to make this code valuable we had to
>>>> unlock the GUI front. That's what we did.
>>>>
>>>> The good news, if you are interested in AudioUnits, is that one of our
>>>> coworkers, Ferran Orriols, already has an assigned time slot to implement
>>>> AudioUnits in CLAM, after his eastern exams.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, any help on supporting whatever plugin/backend platform would
>>>> be very appreciated as we have a limited number of hands. ;-)
>>>>
>>>> David.
>>>> 
>>> @ Paul, thanks for your explanation.
>>>
>>> @ David, Ok, thanks for information. I read often that people regret
>>> that certain Free VST plugins are not available on GNU/Linux. VST plugin
>>> authors don't want to make it for GNU/ Linux... maybe if it's easier to
>>> build for both platforms this will improve. Also sometimes there is a
>>> GUI for the Windows version and not for GNU/Linux (I think Freeverb3 is
>>> such an example). Would be nice if such an Gui for Windows could be
>>> easily build on GNU/Linux too.
>>>   
>> Yes, that's the point, reusing the same Qt interface for JACK apps, LV2 and
>> VST. No need to use VSTGUI which is tailored just for VST and not even
>> inventing a new toolkit, just taking a general purpose one.
>>
>> David.
>> ___
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Re: [LAD] VST and Qt

2009-04-06 Thread Grammostola Rosea

David García Garzón wrote:
> On Monday 06 April 2009 14:45:40 Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>> David García Garzón wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi, lads! Some news from the CLAM project.
>>>
>>> For anyone interested in that subject, we managed to build Qt based VST
>>> interfaces (from linux!). Not about integrating existing VST in Qt
>>> applications but building brand new plugins using Qt. This is an step to
>>> get visual prototyped VST from CLAM as we got from LADSPA and JACK on
>>> last releases. I don't think the integration could get into the next CLAM
>>> release, but i guess that just the Qt-VST integration could be useful to
>>> someone in the community.
>>>
>>> See more information here:
>>> http://vokicodder.blogspot.com/2009/04/vst-plugins-with-qt-user-interface
>>> .html
>>>
>>> The code is available in the first link to the CLAM developers list. Not
>>> the proper distribution but i plan to make it available from clam or
>>> other repository in short. Any collaborative hacking to improve it is
>>> very welcome.
>>>   
>> I'm an programmer noob, but some questions.
>>
>> 1) what is your aim? Building VST plugins for Gnu/ Linux? Is a VST
>> better then an LV2 plugin?
>> 2) why is the focus in the Gnu/Linux work on VST and not on AudioUnit
>> plugins? Linux and OS X are both Unix like systems right?
>> 
>
> The principle we follow is "design once, generate many". We are aiming on 
> building any kind of plugins or audio backends our users want to build using 
> the CLAM framework. See: http://clam-project.org/wiki/Network_Editor_tutorial
>
> One of those targets is building VST plugins *for Windows* (crosscompiled 
> from 
> linux or natively from windows). The main advantage for linux users is that 
> they can visually build their plugins or JACK applications in linux with 
> CLAM, and then, if they want their plugin to be available for Windows users, 
> just click a button and you'll have a VST plugin as well.
>
> LV2 is also on our roadmap, and I guess that having already support for 
> Ladspa 
> it won't be that difficult. But right now our interests where VST just 
> because a project partners asked us for some vst's and, well, it was funny 
> doing that from linux. We had vst code working for a couple of years but 
> without GUI, and in order to make this code valuable we had to unlock the GUI 
> front. That's what we did.
>
> The good news, if you are interested in AudioUnits, is that one of our 
> coworkers, Ferran Orriols, already has an assigned time slot to implement 
> AudioUnits in CLAM, after his eastern exams.
>
> Of course, any help on supporting whatever plugin/backend platform would be 
> very appreciated as we have a limited number of hands. ;-)
>
> David.
>
>
>   
@ Paul, thanks for your explanation.

@ David, Ok, thanks for information. I read often that people regret 
that certain Free VST plugins are not available on GNU/Linux. VST plugin 
authors don't want to make it for GNU/ Linux... maybe if it's easier to 
build for both platforms this will improve. Also sometimes there is a 
GUI for the Windows version and not for GNU/Linux (I think Freeverb3 is 
such an example). Would be nice if such an Gui for Windows could be 
easily build on GNU/Linux too.

Regards,

\r

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Re: [LAD] VST and Qt

2009-04-06 Thread Grammostola Rosea

David García Garzón wrote:
> Hi, lads! Some news from the CLAM project.
>
> For anyone interested in that subject, we managed to build Qt based VST 
> interfaces (from linux!). Not about integrating existing VST in Qt 
> applications but building brand new plugins using Qt. This is an step to get 
> visual prototyped VST from CLAM as we got from LADSPA and JACK on last 
> releases. I don't think the integration could get into the next CLAM release, 
> but i guess that just the Qt-VST integration could be useful to someone in 
> the 
> community.
>
> See more information here:
> http://vokicodder.blogspot.com/2009/04/vst-plugins-with-qt-user-interface.html
>
> The code is available in the first link to the CLAM developers list. Not the 
> proper distribution but i plan to make it available from clam or other 
> repository in short. Any collaborative hacking to improve it is very welcome.
>
>   
I'm an programmer noob, but some questions.

1) what is your aim? Building VST plugins for Gnu/ Linux? Is a VST 
better then an LV2 plugin?
2) why is the focus in the Gnu/Linux work on VST and not on AudioUnit 
plugins? Linux and OS X are both Unix like systems right?

Regards,

\r
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Re: [LAD] Build and get your package in Debian/ Ubuntu (was Re: [LAU] Join the Debian Multimedia Team! (to improve the state of Linux audio))

Dennis Schulmeister wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Wed, 2009-04-01 at 14:48 +0200, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>>> 3. Documentation - especially man pages which are required for all
>>> binaries (even if they just refer to online documentation or info
>>> pages). This requirement is often skipped for Ubuntu-only packages which
>>> makes me as a user sad. 
>>>   
>> Yeah an manpage is required. You can use the app gmanedit for example to 
>> create one.
>> 
>
> I really got accustomed to help2man because creating man pages is a snap
> with it. All it takes is the following:
>
>   * A sanely formated text file (w/ optional troff commands)
>   
What is a sanely formated text file and what do you mean with (w/ 
optional troff commands)?


>   * Your program's --version string
>   * Your program's --help string
>
> That's it. With such tools available there's really no excuse for not
> having a man page.
>
>
>
> Yours sincerely,
> Dennis Schulmeister
>
>   

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Re: [LAD] Build and get your package in Debian/ Ubuntu (was Re: [LAU] Join the Debian Multimedia Team! (to improve the state of Linux audio))

Dennis Schulmeister wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Wed, 2009-04-01 at 14:48 +0200, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>   
>>> 3. Documentation - especially man pages which are required for all
>>> binaries (even if they just refer to online documentation or info
>>> pages). This requirement is often skipped for Ubuntu-only packages which
>>> makes me as a user sad. 
>>>   
>> Yeah an manpage is required. You can use the app gmanedit for example to 
>> create one.
>> 
>
> I really got accustomed to help2man because creating man pages is a snap
> with it. All it takes is the following:
>
>   * A sanely formated text file (w/ optional troff commands)
>   * Your program's --version string
>   * Your program's --help string
>
> That's it. With such tools available there's really no excuse for not
> having a man page.
>
>
>   
Thanks for the tip!

What do you think, should an upstream author take care of the manpage or 
the package maintainer?

\r

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Re: [LAD] [LAU] Join the Debian Multimedia Team! (to improve the state of Linux audio)

Grammostola Rosea wrote:
> Ivica Ico Bukvic wrote:
>>> Hey Ico,
>>>
>>> I'm sorry, but I don't really understand what you mean. While I would
>>> encourage the people from the Debian Multimedia Team to subscribe to a
>>> list
>>> like linux-audio-tuning to discuss tuning issues and grab ideas from 
>>> here,
>>> I don't see how we could provide mirroring or any kind of services like
>>> this (we have limited resources), and even if we could, I don't see why
>>> *we* should do it.
>>>
>>> If I understood the original mail correctly, this initiative is 
>>> meant to
>>> be
>>> integrated to *Debian*, and is meant to make the *Debian* distro 
>>> better,
>>> because it is *Debian* which has issues with linux-audio. Why should
>>> linux-audio chime in ?
>>
>> Because this is an opportunity to extend distro transparency and 
>> ultimately
>> allow developers to spend more time on developing rather than dealing 
>> with
>> differences between distros.
>>
>> Besides, we already mirror UbuntuStudio, JACKlab, and 64Studio, so why
>> shouldn't we also encourage Debian Multimedia to join the consortium 
>> and in
>> turn allow them to use whatever resources we may have.
>>
>> All that being said, I do agree with you that we have limited 
>> resources, and
>> in part I am hoping that through these kinds of initiatives we could 
>> bring
>> in more contributors to the core Linuxaudio.org services.
>>
> So far so good. Ardour hits testing finally, a RT kernel wishlist bug 
> with patch is filed, people are working on LV2 etc.
>
> Here you can find more information about maintaining multimedia 
> packages for Debian/ Ubuntu and joining the Debian Multimedia Team 
> and/ or the Ubuntu MOTUMedia team.
>
> http://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=817
>
> I suggest add a 'chapter' in the wiki of linuxaudio.org with 
> information about maintaining packages. The information about 
> Debian/Ubuntu you can find in my link. But I can imagine that also 
> other distro's like to write down some information about maintaining 
> multimedia packages, cause it would be nice if we could improve GNU/ 
> Linux audio by getting more packages into the different distro's.
>
> Please take some action here.
>
There is an Ubuntu package day tomorrow:
Maybe a good start to learn to build Debian/Ubuntu packages and maintain 
audio packages for Debian Multimedia Team ;)


/Hello everybody,

the Ubuntu Developer Community is proud to announce the following new
initiative to help YOU find your way into developing Ubuntu.

Thursday is from now on Packaging Training day. We'll have regular
one-hour sessions in #ubuntu-classroom on irc.freenode.net where we'll
have speakers who present a packaging technique and leave enough time
for all packaging related questions you might have.

For those of you who are not familiar enough with the English language,
we'll have people in #ubuntu-classroom-{de,es,...} who will help to
translate your questions.

We will rotate session times to make sure the sessions work for all
timezones. We'll follow a 1st Thursday 6:00 UTC, 2nd Thursday 12:00 UTC,
3rd Thursday 18:00 UTC, 4th Thursday 0:00 UTC (5th Thursday 6:00 UTC)
pattern. For the first month April, we're proud to announce the
following sessions:

* 2nd April, 06:00 UTC: Daniel Holbach, Fixing an Ubuntu bug
* 9th April, 12:00 UTC: James Westby, bzr builddeb –in-15-minutes
* 16th April, 18:00 UTC: Didier Roche, How-to update a package
* 23rd April, 00:00 UTC: , TBA
* 30th April, 06:00 UTC: Daniel Holbach, Getting Started with Ubuntu
Development

If you want to give a session, request a session, help out as a
translator, share your comments, help with the organisation or anything
else, please head over to

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training

and let us know.


These sessions are going to be what we make of them, so let's make the
most out of them! Rock on everybody and see you on Thursday! :-)/
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Re: [LAD] Build and get your package in Debian/ Ubuntu (was Re: [LAU] Join the Debian Multimedia Team! (to improve the state of Linux audio))

Hans Fugal wrote:
> Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>
>   
>> Changed the title, cause it's an important discussion opened by Fraser imo.
>>
>> \r
>> 
>
> I think it is, too. I've maintained a few Debain packages in the past
> (don't have time at the moment), so I can weigh in.
>
> The documentation is out there, but unless you're an aspiring debian
> maintainer it's not easy to find nor very accessible. It's a pity,
> because there are a few things you can do as an upstream author to make
> debian packaging really simple, and it's not rocket science.
>
> I'm going from memory here, but I think these are the most important
> things you can do:
>
> 1. Make it easy to install to an arbitrary location, a la --prefix with
> autotools.
>
> 2. Put stuff in the right places under that prefix (see the FHS or
> section 9.1 of the Debian policy manual).
>
> 3. Documentation - especially man pages which are required for all
> binaries (even if they just refer to online documentation or info
> pages). This requirement is often skipped for Ubuntu-only packages which
> makes me as a user sad. 
Yeah an manpage is required. You can use the app gmanedit for example to 
create one.

> It's also very helpful (for maintainers and
> users alike) if you give a list of dependencies in your README.
>
> 4. Use a sane versioning scheme - one that monotonically increases and
> has the most significant parts first and doesn't use funky characters.
> So, if you base it on a date, 2009-04-01 or 20090401, not 1/4/2009. See
> section 5.6.12 of the debian policy manual.
>
> It can also be especially convenient if you use a distributed version
> control system, esp. git, 
yeah the Debian Multimedia Team uses git, so this is highly preferable imho.

> but a good maintainer should be able to work
> with tarballs or whatever system you use. Encourage the debian
> maintainer to pass along patches or bugs and not keep them to himself,
> and consider keeping the debian/ directory in upstream (in ideal cases
> everything needed for debian packetization is there in debian/ - out of
> the way of non-debian users - and none of your sources need to be patched)
>
> Hope that helps.
>
> 1. http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/
> 2. http://www.pathname.com/fhs/
> 3. http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/
>
>   
Also I got the advise:
/Upstream should switch to autotools or something that does DESTDIR out 
of the box.
(|automake(1)| and/or |autoconf(1) |related issue?)/
see: http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ch-modify.en.html

Another quote:
/I don't see a difference between adding a (well maintained) debian/ 
directory to someone else's software or to my own, i.e. if you know how 
to make Debian packages out of sources for package foobar, you are also 
able to prepare the packaging for the softeware you wrote yourself. Why 
should this be documented separately? /

Also a clear describtions about the AUTHORS of the app and COPYING 
(copyright of the app and maybe other files etc it uses which are 
copyright by other authors, is very important.

\r
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[LAD] Build and get your package in Debian/ Ubuntu (was Re: [LAU] Join the Debian Multimedia Team! (to improve the state of Linux audio))

Grammostola Rosea wrote:
> Fraser wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>>
>>  
>>> I suggest add a 'chapter' in the wiki of linuxaudio.org with 
>>> information about maintaining packages. The information about 
>>> Debian/Ubuntu you can find in my link. But I can imagine that also 
>>> other distro's like to write down some information about maintaining 
>>> multimedia packages, cause it would be nice if we could improve GNU/ 
>>> Linux audio by getting more packages into the different distro's.
>>> 
>>
>> A thought to consider - when I embarked upon creating debian and 
>> ubuntu packages of my own software, I found very little in the way of
>> guides to assist a developer, the guides are focused on maintaining 
>> someone else's software (often already packaged).
>>
>> It can't hurt to educate developers on how to assemble packages for 
>> their own software, just making them aware of what's required will lead
>> to reduced effort to package and the ones who chose to include the 
>> debian build files in the source shift the maintainer effort to quality
>> control type role (hopefully fed back to the developer to include).
>>
>>
>>   
> That's an good point. Did you see this documentation?
>
> http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/index.en.html#contents
>
> Maybe this?
> http://www.debian.org/doc/developers-reference/best-pkging-practices.html
>
> As a package maintainer you can got help from mentors.debian.net and 
> that mailinglist. I think people can help you too.
>
> There are a lot developers who makes Ubuntu PPA repo's. IMO it would 
> be better if the package hit Debian and so also Ubuntu. It's better 
> then having PPA packages all over the place (I know it could be handy 
> to offer you last release). Maybe it's a good thing to discuss with 
> the Debian Multimedia Team if it is possible to  get your package in 
> Debian/Ubuntu and how you can deliver packages which could be 
> implemented in Debian without much efforts. You know also the people 
> of MOTUMedia in Ubuntu are subscribed to the Debian Multimedia 
> mailinglist and they work closely together.
>
> Debian Multimedia Packages Maintainers 
> 
>
> AFAIK it's an open list, so send an message (and CC it to yourself).
>
Changed the title, cause it's an important discussion opened by Fraser imo.

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Re: [LAD] [LAU] Join the Debian Multimedia Team! (to improve the state of Linux audio)

Fraser wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Grammostola Rosea wrote:
>
>   
>> I suggest add a 'chapter' in the wiki of linuxaudio.org with information 
>> about maintaining packages. The information about Debian/Ubuntu you can 
>> find in my link. But I can imagine that also other distro's like to 
>> write down some information about maintaining multimedia packages, cause 
>> it would be nice if we could improve GNU/ Linux audio by getting more 
>> packages into the different distro's.
>> 
>
> A thought to consider - when I embarked upon creating debian and ubuntu 
> packages of my own software, I found very little in the way of
> guides to assist a developer, the guides are focused on maintaining someone 
> else's software (often already packaged).
>
> It can't hurt to educate developers on how to assemble packages for their own 
> software, just making them aware of what's required will lead
> to reduced effort to package and the ones who chose to include the debian 
> build files in the source shift the maintainer effort to quality
> control type role (hopefully fed back to the developer to include).
>
>
>   
That's an good point. Did you see this documentation?

http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/index.en.html#contents

Maybe this?
http://www.debian.org/doc/developers-reference/best-pkging-practices.html

As a package maintainer you can got help from mentors.debian.net and 
that mailinglist. I think people can help you too.

There are a lot developers who makes Ubuntu PPA repo's. IMO it would be 
better if the package hit Debian and so also Ubuntu. It's better then 
having PPA packages all over the place (I know it could be handy to 
offer you last release). Maybe it's a good thing to discuss with the 
Debian Multimedia Team if it is possible to  get your package in 
Debian/Ubuntu and how you can deliver packages which could be 
implemented in Debian without much efforts. You know also the people of 
MOTUMedia in Ubuntu are subscribed to the Debian Multimedia mailinglist 
and they work closely together.

Debian Multimedia Packages Maintainers 

AFAIK it's an open list, so send an message (and CC it to yourself).

Success

\r

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[LAD] Programming for Lilypond (how to become an developer)

Hi,


I'm just an Lilypond user, not an programmer. I really think Lilypond is 
a core app for GNU/Linux musicians and many apps has Lilypond export 
functions. To keep improving Lilypond and because some people are 
starting to work on some Tablature improvements, which makes me really 
excited, I thought, let's make a call.

Maybe you are a Lilypond user with a little programming background and 
want to contribute to Lilypond or you need a special feature/ 
improvement in it. Then you can start learning to do the programming 
yourself.
You can start as a Frog, some kind of 'Lilypond student programmer'. You 
start learning the basics, maybe fix some bugs (like Frogs eat flies) 
and add some features you want with the help of the Lilypond developers.


More info about developing for Lilypond:
http://lilypond.org/web/devel/participating/


You can see the Contributors' Guide for some detailed information about
participating:

http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.13/Documentation/devel/contrib-guide/index#index

At this moment there are some guys beginning to work on more and better 
Tablature functionality for Lilypond. Which is great imo also to get 
better Tablature functionality in GUI apps like Mscore and Tuxguitar.
So maybe it's a good moment to jump in, and I think they can use some 
man power!

See for example these threads:
http://www.nabble.com/guitar-tab-feature-request-td21995370.html

Thanks in advance,

\r

(Just an happy Lily user/ guitarist)



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Re: [LAD] [LAU] Join the Debian Multimedia Team! (to improve the state of Linux audio)