Re: [usb-storage] Re: usb3 fails to write when using usb3 hub in usb3 port
On Sun, 30 Sep 2012, Adrian Sandu wrote: > > We are working with computers. Weird stuff is not supposed to happen. But > > it does. Occasionally, this needs to be remembered, as it does > > occasionally cause real-world problems and is often the likely explanation > > for what is otherwise inexplicable. Thus, sooner or later some old geezer > > comes along and reminds people that Murphy is still around to do his > > mischief. I am glad that my suggestions turned out to be helpful. > > I can't thank you people enough .. I just hope that this thread will > help someone else in the future ( feel free to add this to your list > of stories ! :) ) > I just hate it when hardware (or in my case, cable ) makes don't stick > to the specs or "improve"/change them as they see it fit. If I'm > payin' for a product ( especially from a brand ) I expect it to do its > job better than others. I wouldn't of expected this from WD .. Oh? Why not? Of course, perhaps Seagate stuff is always better. Or Microsoft. Or Apple. Or ...??? (:-) Specs and standards are for violating, you know. Or that is what some people think. It has been that way from the beginning of time. But what would be the solution? To have neither specs nor standards? One wouldn't expect that to work out too well, either. Peter Stuge's comments are quite relevant, too. He is probably right about the category of external hard drives, these days. Indeed, they seem too good of a bargain. But maybe we are the ones who are fooled and it is the internal hard drives which are overpriced. Who knows? Anyway, one of the things which makes life really complicated for too many of us is, the statement that "you get what you pay for" is not necessarily true, either. It happens sometimes that some fly-by-night or Brand X company is making and selling the best product on the market in some category, but they can't charge nearly as much money as the so-called reputable producers and vendors precisely because they have no brand recognition. So one never knows. Cheers, Theodore Kilgore -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-scsi" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: [usb-storage] Re: usb3 fails to write when using usb3 hub in usb3 port
On Sat, 29 Sep 2012, Adrian Sandu wrote: > > The only solution I see is to buy something else, like an Asus > > EB1501P-B057E .. I need something small and fast enough .. :| Maybe > > any other recommendations ? ( other root chipset / atom cpu .. small > > powered .. etc. ) > > DON'T KILL ME ! .. I got the best cables I could get my hands on ( > double-shielded, 24k golded connectors .. metal pieces .. the best I > could get my hands on on such short notice )... I replaced 2 cables ( > to hard drives ) and the one from the hub to the computer. I only got > 1 "reset" message in /var/log/messages in 24 hours .. I'll replace the > other 4 just to be sure .. Now I should "spam" the companies and tell > them they should provide cables within specs .. > > I guess having 6 drives that close ( among with other powering cables > .. networking (I think I got at least 40 cables in that 1 sq m. )) > isn't that good especially when the usb has another power source and > stuff.. > > IT WORKS. YEY. Hope this will help somebody in the future. Thanks for > bearing me .. I sure learned a lesson from this. I guess all is well > when it ends well. Adrian, I certainly would not think of "killing" anyone. I don't think anyone else on the list would, either. But your problems with the hard drivers are in fact an object lesson about flaky and barely-within-spec or barely-out-of-spec hardware. The problems are indeed very vexing and are quite difficult to isolate. I am glad that a couple of us actually began to suspect the hardware. It seems that those suspicions panned out, and all is well that ends well. Even though I was not the first to pinpoint the problem, I had been reading this thread and the other post which raised the issue of hardware problems really got my spider-sense tingling. I started to remember some of my own experiences. Two of them immediately come to mind and might serve as a further object lesson to anyone who passes by and reads this: 1. A camera with the SQ913 camera chipset inside. My camera, which was used to write the driver code in libgphoto2, worked just fine on a Dell Pentium 3 system and on an old laptop with an OHCI setup for its USB, and refused to work properly on any of several computers in the house which ran an AMD cpu on top of a VIA-based motherboard. On those systems, severe data loss, data corruption, and actual crashing occurred while downloading still photos from the camera. Putting a magnetic core around the cable helped a little bit, but the problem did not go away. So, again, an example of a poor specimen of hardware hooked by a cheap cable to a cheap motherboard, and there was trouble. To this day I have no way to pinpoint the exact cause of the problem. 2. I forget which dual-mode camera it was, but it is one of those for which I wrote the kernel support. I discovered the problem at the worst possible time: after already writing the code and submitting same, and it actually went into a production kernel. When I found the problem, it was too late to get anything changed until the next release date. What was the problem? Well, the camera needs several mysterious initialization commands to start the video stream. Some of these were obviously superfluous and could be safely left unused. But I left out one too many. I developed the driver on an AMD system with ATI USB host controllers. Everything worked, and the code was duly submitted. Then, too late, I tested on a Pentium4-on-Intel system. There, the video stream would not start, or it would start and speedily crash. When I put back into the driver that pesky "one too many" omitted init string, the camera worked on an Intel setup, too. What exactly does that one command do? I don't exactly know. Precisely what caused the problem? I don't know. All I can say for sure is that the Intel (UHCI) system needed for a certain setup command to be sent to the camera, whereas the ATI (OHCI) system did not. And that is, in fact, something very strange. Go figure. We are working with computers. Weird stuff is not supposed to happen. But it does. Occasionally, this needs to be remembered, as it does occasionally cause real-world problems and is often the likely explanation for what is otherwise inexplicable. Thus, sooner or later some old geezer comes along and reminds people that Murphy is still around to do his mischief. I am glad that my suggestions turned out to be helpful. Theodore Kilgore -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-scsi" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: [usb-storage] Re: usb3 fails to write when using usb3 hub in usb3 port
Adrian, I think that the suggestion about checking the power supply, the cabling, the grounding screws, and anything of like nature that has been omitted from this list is a very good idea. If successful it would eliminate the problem for you, as well as resolving the mystery. Unresolved mysteries are unpleasant for the user, and at least equally unpleasant for a developer. I have seen hardware do really weird things, myself. As a trivial example, once a local computer shop gave me a motherboard which had been returned because of booting problems. I was told that it had been brought in twice by the customer. No problem had been detected in the shop; they had replaced it to make a customer happy. I brought the board home. It was a hot summer day. I put it on the floor, hooked up a spare power supply, and it booted. No problem. I left it sitting there overnight. The next morning, I tried it again. Dead. But in the evening it came to life again. Guessing, I looked at the solder joints under the power connector on the board. One of them looked suspicious. So I fired up the soldering iron and put a dab of fresh solder on it. After that, the board was in use for years and never had the booting problem again. The reason that the problem was not detected was that it was the middle of the summer in Alabama, and when the computer was brought to the shop it was put in a car for the trip. The board got warm enough for the solder in that joint to expand enough for startup, while en route to the shop. Thus, I definitely do encourage you to check for hardware or cabling problems before deciding to buy additional equipment as a workaround. Good luck, Theodore Kilgore On Thu, 27 Sep 2012, Adrian Sandu wrote: > > They're the same chipset. There's minor differences in the PCI > > capabilities, but not much else. It could be something electrically > > wrong with the AsRock system, I suppose. That's possible if you see > > the errors popping up erratically. > > > > Any chance you can exchange the AsRock system? > > Nope... I have it for more than 1 year and I kinda' need it even if > the usb3 won't work... at least I can use the 2 ports to dirrectly > connect 2 drives...nothing else is wrong and I wouldn't of known if I > wouldn't of got these hubs... > > My only solution if no more debugging can be done is to get a nas a > put the drives in it... > > Maybe it's the drives fault somehow ? maybe we should mail wd ? > manhattan's fault ? via ? :) There must be someone/someway/somehow > that can analyze it in someway and say what is wrong .. > > Still weird..I'll try on another laptop tomorrow or so ( a dell > inspiron with an usb3 port .. dunno what usb3 root chipset it has ) > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "USB Mass Storage on Linux" group. > To post to this group, send email to usb-stor...@lists.one-eyed-alien.net. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > usb-storage+unsubscr...@lists.one-eyed-alien.net. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/a/lists.one-eyed-alien.net/group/usb-storage/?hl=en. > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-scsi" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
