RE: [WSG] is html done? [was semantics]
If I'm on the same track, then the spec you're speaking of is an xml schema (.xsd) file which takes care of defining your xml elements. etc? Kind regards, Frank M. Palinkas Microsoft M.V.P. - Windows Help M.C.P., M.C.T., M.C.S.E., M.C.D.B.A., A+ Senior Technical Communicator Web Standards Accessibility Designer website: http://frank.helpware.net email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] Member: Society for Technical Communications (S.T.C.) Guild of Accessible Web Designers (G.A.W.D.S.) Web Standards Group (W.S.G.) super group trading ltd. Sandhurst, Gauteng, South Africa website: http://www.supergroup.co.za Work: +27 011 523 4931 Home: +27 011 455 5287 Fax:+27 011 455 3112 Mobile: +27 074 109 1908 From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Breton Slivka Sent: Friday, 09 February, 2007 9:18 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] is html done? [was semantics] On 09/02/2007, at 4:14 PM, Geoff Pack wrote: So nameJoe Blogs/name is meaningless with out a spec to tell me that 'name' means a name, while j79hfd98y28[EMAIL PROTECTED]*/j79hfd98y28 is meaningful if a spec says so? Absolutely correct. To a computer, any given string of characters holds exactly the same amount of meaning as any other given string of characters. It is the spec that defines how those characters should be handled. The spec adds meaning to a system which inherently has none. What if I write spec that says simply: The meanings of all my tags names are the same as the meanings defined in the Standard Oxford English Dictionary? What if I claim my spec to be the English language? You still have to clarify: 1. Which definition of any particular word are you using in the case of homonyms, and words with multiple related meanings? when you make an orange tag, are you referring to the color, or the fruit? 2. If you did make an orange tag, what would the contents of this tag mean? The attributes? 3. If you converted your format to another format, say, vCard, can you define a proceedure for doing so? Can a computer infer one? The spec defines what a computer is doing with the data. XML is not a magical file format, you still need to do the dirty work of teaching the computer what to do with it, and what it means. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Not a Good Impression
My apologies, let me describe my experience with it further: In Opera 9.1, loading and executing the url produces an addition to the address: /error_msg/unknown_browser.cfm The Unknown or Untested Browser/Operating System Combination page opens. Clicking the Text Only Version hyperlink produces an Object Instantiation Exception dialog box. Clicking the Enter the full graphic version (Internet Explorer comp. mode) and (mozilla comp. mode) hyperlinks produces the web page, but also with the misaligned top nav as you also see it. Frank -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Faulds Sent: Thursday, 08 February, 2007 11:57 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Not a Good Impression Opened OK using Opera 9.1 for me. The top nav is a bit misaligned though. On Thu, 08 Feb 2007 19:22:41 +1000, Frank Palinkas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Opened with Opera 9.10...got the same message as below: Unknown or Untested Browser/Operating System Combinationetc. Kind regards, Frank M. Palinkas Microsoft M.V.P. - Windows Help M.C.P., M.C.T., M.C.S.E., M.C.D.B.A., A+ Senior Technical Communicator Web Standards Accessibility Designer website: http://frank.helpware.net email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] Member: Society for Technical Communications (S.T.C.) Guild of Accessible Web Designers (G.A.W.D.S.) Web Standards Group (W.S.G.) super group trading ltd. Sandhurst, Gauteng, South Africa website: http://www.supergroup.co.za Work: +27 011 523 4931 Home: +27 011 455 5287 Fax:+27 011 455 3112 Mobile: +27 074 109 1908 -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matthew Smith Sent: Thursday, 08 February, 2007 10:51 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Not a Good Impression Hi All Wondering if there are any SA Government folks here (or anyone else) who would like to comment on this beautiful welcome to the State Library site; for a moment, I thought I'd hit a test site or something. The offending site is at: http://www.slsa.sa.gov.au/ I have never seen anything quite like this before - and hope I don't again: Unknown or Untested Browser/Operating System Combination The Browser and/or Operating System you are using has not been tested in this site. You may still enter the site by clicking on one of the 'Enter' links below. Alternatively you can download a known browser from the browser vendor links below. If you wish to continue into the site regardless, please select a version from the choices below * Enter the text only version - should work in most browsers that support javascript (this is not a html-only version). * Enter the full graphic version (internet explorer compatibility mode). * Enter the full graphic version (mozilla compatibility mode). Compliant browsers can be found at the following links: Microsoft Internet Explorer Netscape Navigator Please contact us if you require further information or technical assistance: Email: ...visited with Firefox 2.0, Linux. -- Tyssen Design www.tyssendesign.com.au Ph: (07) 3300 3303 Mb: 0405 678 590 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Re: usage of fieldset
Joining Barney, this is semantically wrong and should never be done. If a visible outline or box to indicate a containing div is needed, and further elements and content within it, it can be accomplished easily with css. If you want an example, please let me know. Kind regards, Frank M. Palinkas Microsoft M.V.P. - Windows Help M.C.P., M.C.T., M.C.S.E., M.C.D.B.A., A+ Senior Technical Communicator Web Standards Accessibility Designer website: http://frank.helpware.net email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] Member: Society for Technical Communications (S.T.C.) Guild of Accessible Web Designers (G.A.W.D.S.) Web Standards Group (W.S.G.) super group trading ltd. Sandhurst, Gauteng, South Africa website: http://www.supergroup.co.za Work: +27 011 523 4931 Home: +27 011 455 5287 Fax:+27 011 455 3112 Mobile: +27 074 109 1908 -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Barney Carroll Sent: Friday, 12 January, 2007 16:59 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Re: usage of fieldset Mihael Zadravec wrote: Hi! What would be your reaction, if you'd see someone using fieldset for something else than containing forms? eg. something like... fieldset legendSome tite here/legend div class=notification pThis is some content./p /div /fieldset cya! Mihael It's incorrect and pointless. Why would anyone want to do such a thing? Regards, Barney *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Re: usage of fieldset
Hi Steve, Yep, I've seen it also. Pity the visually challenged user with a screen reader trying to figure out what's going on. Frank -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve Green Sent: Friday, 12 January, 2007 17:28 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Re: usage of fieldset I have seen several sites that have done this, presumably for the visual effect of having a border around each subsection of content; some browsers will give that border round corners. Of course the same effect can be achieved with the correct use of CSS but maybe they just thought this way is easier. Steve -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Barney Carroll Sent: 12 January 2007 14:59 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Re: usage of fieldset Mihael Zadravec wrote: Hi! What would be your reaction, if you'd see someone using fieldset for something else than containing forms? eg. something like... fieldset legendSome tite here/legend div class=notification pThis is some content./p /div /fieldset cya! Mihael It's incorrect and pointless. Why would anyone want to do such a thing? Regards, Barney *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Visited Links and Accessibility
Apologies, my reply was to Matthew, not Dwain. Frank -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matthew Smith Sent: Thursday, 11 January, 2007 10:18 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Visited Links and Accessibility Quoth Dwain Alford at 01/11/07 18:09... for accessibility purposes in using color (on links and visited links, etc.) i would recommend using the color contrast analyzer from http://www.accessibleinfo.org.au/ http://www.accessibleinfo.org.au/ since web sites need to be accessible to everyone, don't forget the color blind, so make sure your colors work for them not just those with normal color vision. I find excessive colours distracting and confess that I am guilty of displaying visited and unvisited links the same, and only changing on focus/hover. With the colour blindness issue taken into consideration as well, would it not be better, therefore, to style visited links in a manner where colour is not involved at all? Not being a CSS guru, I would need to check what options are available, but something like a line over and under the word for visited links may be a possibility. Cheers M -- Matthew Smith IT Consultancy Web Application Development Business: http://www.kbc.net.au/ Personal: http://www.smiffysplace.com/ LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/smiffy *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Gap in IE
Hi Jermayne, 1. In the markup code, move the #logo id to beneath the #rologo id. 2. In the css file, add float: left; to the #rologo id. 3. In the css file, add clear: both; to the #text id. This should make it look pretty similar in IE, Firefox and Opera. Hope this helps? Kind regards, Frank M. Palinkas M.C.P., M.C.T., M.C.S.E., M.C.D.B.A., A+ Microsoft Registered Partner Senior Technical Communicator Web Standards Accessibility Designer website: http://frank.helpware.net email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] Member: Society for Technical Communications (S.T.C.) Guild of Accessible Web Designers (G.A.W.D.S.) Web Standards Group (W.S.G.) super group trading ltd. Sandhurst, Gauteng, South Africa website: http://www.supergroup.co.za Work: +27 011 523 4931 Home: +27 011 455 5287 Fax:+27 011 455 3112 Mobile: +27 074 109 1908 From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jermayn Parker Sent: Wednesday, 06 December, 2006 7:14 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Gap in IE Hi Im sure this is an easy problem and everyone knows how to solve it but for the life of me, i cannot remember and can not get it right I have not got it uploaded yet due to problems with the client but I have included the css and html file plus a screenshot of it in ie (right) and firefox (left). In IE underneath the top section a gap appears while in firefox it doesnt. I have come accross this problem before but cannot remember the solution Thanks -- JP2 Designs http://www.jp2designs.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Gap in IE
Hi Jermayne, 1. In the markup code, move the #logo id to beneath the #rologo id. 2. In the css file, add float: left; to the #rologo id. 3. In the css file, add clear: both; to the #text id. This should make it look pretty similar in IE, Firefox and Opera. Hope this helps? Kind regards, Frank M. Palinkas M.C.P., M.C.T., M.C.S.E., M.C.D.B.A., A+ Microsoft Registered Partner Senior Technical Communicator Web Standards Accessibility Designer website: http://frank.helpware.net email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] Member: Society for Technical Communications (S.T.C.) Guild of Accessible Web Designers (G.A.W.D.S.) Web Standards Group (W.S.G.) super group trading ltd. Sandhurst, Gauteng, South Africa website: http://www.supergroup.co.za Work: +27 011 523 4931 Home: +27 011 455 5287 Fax:+27 011 455 3112 Mobile: +27 074 109 1908 From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jermayn Parker Sent: Wednesday, 06 December, 2006 7:14 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Gap in IE Hi Im sure this is an easy problem and everyone knows how to solve it but for the life of me, i cannot remember and can not get it right I have not got it uploaded yet due to problems with the client but I have included the css and html file plus a screenshot of it in ie (right) and firefox (left). In IE underneath the top section a gap appears while in firefox it doesnt. I have come accross this problem before but cannot remember the solution Thanks -- JP2 Designs http://www.jp2designs.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone?
Adding on to M. Hodgson's comment, the only way to accomplish this on the same computer is to install a virtual hard drive and mount WinXP+SP2 on it. This will give you the ability to work with both IE6 and IE7. Kind regards, Frank M. Palinkas M.C.P., M.C.T., M.C.S.E., M.C.D.B.A., A+ Microsoft Registered Partner --- Senior Technical Communicator Web Standards Accessibility Designer --- Member: Society for Technical Communications (S.T.C.) | Guild of Accessible Web Designers (G.A.W.D.S.) --- website: http://frank.helpware.net email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Work: +27 11 523 4931 Home: +27 11 455 5287 Mobile: +27 741 091 908 --- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matthew Hodgson Sent: Friday, 24 November, 2006 11:00 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone? There is no official IE6 standalone. M From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matthew Pennell Sent: Friday, 24 November 2006 7:43 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone? On 11/24/06, Tee G. Peng [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I got the IE 7 and IE6 standalone running, and is very upset to find the IE dev tool no longer working for IE 6 standalone. Is there a way I can make it work? Really need this tool for troubleshoot IE 6 layout problem. Related - IE7 came down the Automatic Update pipe yesterday, so can anyone point me in the direction or a reliable standalone IE6 that will run happily next to IE7, 5.5 and 5? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone?
Oops! I stand corrected, thanks Elaine. I also took a look at another site which offers comments on some problems incurred after doing this. Might be worth a look for future reference: http://labs.insert-title.com/labs/Multiple-IEs-in-Windows_article795.aspx Frank From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Web Dandy Design Sent: Friday, 24 November, 2006 11:55 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone? I upgraded to IE7 then installed IE6 as a standalone (http://browsers.evolt.org/?ie/32bit/standalone). I've had them running side by side along with IE5.5 and IE5.0 (as standalones) for a few weeks now and have had no problems. Kind regards, Elaine http://www.webdandy.co.uk http://www.webdandy.co.uk/ From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Frank Palinkas Sent: 24 November 2006 09:31 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone? Adding on to M. Hodgson's comment, the only way to accomplish this on the same computer is to install a virtual hard drive and mount WinXP+SP2 on it. This will give you the ability to work with both IE6 and IE7. Kind regards, Frank M. Palinkas M.C.P., M.C.T., M.C.S.E., M.C.D.B.A., A+ Microsoft Registered Partner --- Senior Technical Communicator Web Standards Accessibility Designer --- Member: Society for Technical Communications (S.T.C.) | Guild of Accessible Web Designers (G.A.W.D.S.) --- website: http://frank.helpware.net email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Work: +27 11 523 4931 Home: +27 11 455 5287 Mobile: +27 741 091 908 --- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matthew Hodgson Sent: Friday, 24 November, 2006 11:00 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone? There is no official IE6 standalone. M From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matthew Pennell Sent: Friday, 24 November 2006 7:43 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] ie dev tool for ie 6 standalone? On 11/24/06, Tee G. Peng [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I got the IE 7 and IE6 standalone running, and is very upset to find the IE dev tool no longer working for IE 6 standalone. Is there a way I can make it work? Really need this tool for troubleshoot IE 6 layout problem. Related - IE7 came down the Automatic Update pipe yesterday, so can anyone point me in the direction or a reliable standalone IE6 that will run happily next to IE7, 5.5 and 5? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
