[LUTE] Re: Help with LH fingering
This is the fingering I sent to Leonard. Any thoughts, improvements? Is it clear? __ In the 4th measure, 2nd beat, prepare by fingering the c-a with the index finger, then the d-f with either index sliding up to "d" or middle finger, (I prefer sliding index) but little finger on "f" fret 3rd course in any case and KEEP IT DOWN! Last beat of that measure, the "c" fret, 2nd course, under the first * top line, use index finger. KEEP THE INDEX FINGER ON THAT 2nd COURSE! Next measure, slide the index to the "d" fret, middle finger takes the low 6th course B flat, "d" fret, little finger "f" fret, 3rd course- where it has been since the last measure. Keep middle finger and little finger in place as you slide index finger BACK to 2nd course "c" fret, then back up to "d" fret for last beat/chord of measure 5. Next line, complete position change and back to more normal fingerings. Hope this is clear, it may feel a touch counter-intuitive or weird at first, but it works- and I can't see a smoother way. Please let me know how this works for you, and if I've explained adequately. Dan | |\ | | * | | __ _a__c__a_ _c__a _a_a_ a |_c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_| |_d__f_|_|___f_|f|_f_f_| |__|_|_|_|_| |_a|_a___|_a___|_a___|_| |__|_|_|_|_d___| * _ _ _ a _ |_c__a|_a_a_|_c__a__c_|_d__c__d_|_c__a| |_d__c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_|_f_f_|_d__c__d_| |___e_|e|_|_|___e_| |_a___|_|_a___|_|_a___| |_|_a___|_|_d___|_| | | *|. _ _ a _ _ ___ |_a_a_|_c__a__c_|_d__c__d_|_c__a|_a_a_|_c_| |_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_|_f_f_|_d__c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d_| |e|_|_|___e_|e|___| |_|_a___|_|_a___|_|_a_| |_a___|_|_d___|_|_a___|___| To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Rachel Winheld 820 Colusa Avenue Berkeley, CA 94707 rwinh...@comcast.net Tel 510.526.0242 Cell 510.915.4276 --
[LUTE] Re: Viola-Matic
Are they doing the "viola-matic-Forte" ? V. ;-) -Message d'origine- De : lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] De la part de Daniel F Heiman Envoyé : jeudi 21 janvier 2010 07:22 À : lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Objet : [LUTE] Viola-Matic Decidedly off-topic, but something to think about for folks performing under less than ideal weather conditions. With a matched set of fluorocarbon strings http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yf2w2zMNvzE *This is a real playable musical instrument.* (Not quite as inexpensive as the tag line suggests.) Daniel Heiman To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Viola-Matic
Decidedly off-topic, but something to think about for folks performing under less than ideal weather conditions. With a matched set of fluorocarbon strings http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yf2w2zMNvzE *This is a real playable musical instrument.* (Not quite as inexpensive as the tag line suggests.) Daniel Heiman To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Help with LH fingering
I've been working on Capirola's "Baleto da balar bello". The middle section has some simple looking but tricky chord shifts which I've been trying in various ways to make a smooth transition. Any recommendations? The section is below in ascii tab (use a monospace font). The tricky palces are marked with an *, but I'm not sure of the accuracy of the marking (e.g., the dotted note toward the end belongs at the end--can't seem to find the right font on my machine!). It's a Bb chord going to an Em? Thanks and regards, Leonard Williams | |\ | | * | | __ _a__c__a_ _c__a _a_a_ a |_c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_| |_d__f_|_|___f_|f|_f_f_| |__|_|_|_|_| |_a|_a___|_a___|_a___|_| |__|_|_|_|_d___| * _ _ _ a _ |_c__a|_a_a_|_c__a__c_|_d__c__d_|_c__a| |_d__c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_|_f_f_|_d__c__d_| |___e_|e|_|_|___e_| |_a___|_|_a___|_|_a___| |_|_a___|_|_d___|_| | | *|. _ _ a _ _ ___ |_a_a_|_c__a__c_|_d__c__d_|_c__a|_a_a_|_c_| |_c__d__c_|_d__c__d_|_f_f_|_d__c__d_|_c__d__c_|_d_| |e|_|_|___e_|e|___| |_|_a___|_|_a___|_|_a_| |_a___|_|_d___|_|_a___|___| To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 1006842.pdf (application/pdf Object)
Dear Joachim, dear all, could you specify what is the facsimile about? Thank you, Luca Dr. Joachim Lüdtke on 19-01-2010 11:25 wrote: Dear Rainer, dear all, I have to ask everybody's pardon for the poor quality of the reproduction - I have digitalized a film, which itself had been copied from another film years ago, with my home equipment. No professional job though, :(, but as it may be that even such a copy is now a rarity I thought it fit to do this and not to wait until I might eventually be able to afford the services of pros. Unfortunately, the Cologne archive repeats the misleading dating of the book on its site. I will ask them to correct this after the second part of my article about it has appeared in the German lute society's "Lauten-Info". And now for something completely different: There will be some people on this list who receive the "Lauten-Info" - in No 4/2009 something has gone awry between setting and correcting its contents and imposition. I was in quite a hurry to send 4/2009 on its way before Christmas, and did not look over it a last time before sending it to the printer. Imposition has resulted in breaking the connection between the columns containing the footnotes to Andreas Schlegel's text about the work on his forthcoming facsimile edition of french manuscripts from the hand B of the "Rhétorique ee Dieux", and so some lines are missing from page 6, left column, footnote 3, where Andreas gives the URL to the english version of an article of his. The missing URL is: http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/DownloadD/files/Rhetorique_Englisch.pdf I am sorry for this mistake and for any inconveniences it may have caused. All best, Joachim "Rainer" schrieb: Another facsimile - thanks to Joachim :) Rainer adS http://www.historischesarchivkoeln.de/documents/org/1006842.pdf To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Thumb rest stroke - 'lute stop' evidence
As far as renaissance goes, the Mueller harpsichord has many of the qualities of a lute, tone transposition and a crank that moves the plucking point closer to the bridge and closer to the center. I can imagine that most players would vary their plucking points, though some would prefer to stay planted until the divot burnishes through. dt At 10:55 AM 1/20/2010, you wrote: >Agricola wrote: > >"... heard a 'Lautenclavicymbel' in Leipzig in about 1740, designed >by Mr. Johann Sebastian Bach and made by Mr. Zacharias Hildebrand, >which was smaller in size than a normal harpsichord but in all other >respects similar. It had two choirs of gut strings, and a so-called >little octave of brass strings. It is true that in its normal setting >(that is, when only one stop was drawn) it sounded more like a >theorbo than a lute. But if one drew the lute-stop (such as is found >on a harpsichord) together with the cornet stop, one could almost >deceive professional lutenists." > >I think we have to take this with a large pinch of salt - like you >say, modern reconstructions of lautenwerks sound exactly as you would >expect - like a gut-strung harpsichord with leather plectra. > >Andrew > >On 20 Jan 2010, at 18:37, wrote: > > > Yes. Also compelling are the contemporary descriptions of the > > lautenwerk as being nearly sonically indistinguishable from the > > lute. There are even reports that professional lute players could > > be fooled if the instruments were played behind a screen. From > > the sound of the modern lautenwerks I've heard, I have never once > > feared that I might make the same mistake! > > > > Chris > > >-- > >To get on or off this list see list information at >http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Thumb rest stroke - 'lute stop' evidence
Agricola wrote: "... heard a 'Lautenclavicymbel' in Leipzig in about 1740, designed by Mr. Johann Sebastian Bach and made by Mr. Zacharias Hildebrand, which was smaller in size than a normal harpsichord but in all other respects similar. It had two choirs of gut strings, and a so-called little octave of brass strings. It is true that in its normal setting (that is, when only one stop was drawn) it sounded more like a theorbo than a lute. But if one drew the lute-stop (such as is found on a harpsichord) together with the cornet stop, one could almost deceive professional lutenists." I think we have to take this with a large pinch of salt - like you say, modern reconstructions of lautenwerks sound exactly as you would expect - like a gut-strung harpsichord with leather plectra. Andrew On 20 Jan 2010, at 18:37, wrote: > Yes. Also compelling are the contemporary descriptions of the > lautenwerk as being nearly sonically indistinguishable from the > lute. There are even reports that professional lute players could > be fooled if the instruments were played behind a screen. From > the sound of the modern lautenwerks I've heard, I have never once > feared that I might make the same mistake! > > Chris -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Thumb rest stroke - 'lute stop' evidence
Martyn, --- On Wed, 1/20/10, Martyn Hodgson wrote: > Also note the 'lute stop' or 'theorbo > stop' on the harpsichord which > was a row of jacks plucking closer to the > bridge than the main and > gives a more brittle and brilliant > sound. > Yes. Also compelling are the contemporary descriptions of the lautenwerk as being nearly sonically indistinguishable from the lute. There are even reports that professional lute players could be fooled if the instruments were played behind a screen. From the sound of the modern lautenwerks I've heard, I have never once feared that I might make the same mistake! Chris To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Where Arthur Ness?
How nice to be remembered! Yes, I'm still here, lurking and watching far too many YouTube videos. Likewise glad to hear that Arthur is alive and well. We used to chat regularly. Peter In a message dated 1/19/10 1:36:15 AM, ceth...@gmail.com writes: I'm glad to hear that. By the way, has anyone heard from Peter Danner lately? On Jan 19, 2010, at 8:06 AM, Edward Martin wrote: > Yes, I talked with Art last week. He is fine and well. > > ed -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Thumb rest stroke - 'lute stop' evidence
Also note the 'lute stop' or 'theorbo stop' on the harpsichord which was a row of jacks plucking closer to the bridge than the main and gives a more brittle and brilliant sound. As you suggest the 'baroque' lute technique described by contemporary sources needs much more consideration (and as discussed earlier probably entails significantly lower string tensions than modern practice). tho' perhaps not to most modern taste as yet MH --- On Tue, 19/1/10, chriswi...@yahoo.com wrote: From: chriswi...@yahoo.com Subject: [LUTE] Re: Thumb rest stroke To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu, dwinh...@comcast.net, "Ron Andrico" Date: Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 19:27 Ron, Good points. I'm working on exactly this point. The main issue with true thumb-out is getting a decent and - far more importantly - _consistent_ sound out of the treble strings. There clearly was a marked aural difference between the too positions that the baroquenists admired. How else to explain the Stammbuch of Stobaeus when he contrasts the "pure, sharp, bright" tone of thumb-out versus the "rotten and muffled" sound of old thumb-under. I think most modern baroque lutenists attempt to re-create the thumb-under sound. They therefore have an anachronistic conception of tone. I can't say that I agree with the "rotten and muffled" part, but for me, there is nothing saying that a brighter sound can't be expressive. In my experiments, I've found that it is quite possible to have a wide range of timbral, tonal and dynamic shadings. The lute just responds differently with the fingers in this position. Still a work in progress. The secondary issue is that the true baroque lute technique is very, very close to modern classical guitar technique. I think this strikes too close to home for many lutenists for whom thumb-under is part of the (modern) "identity" of what it means to be a "real" lute player, as distinct from wannabe classical guitarists who thrash around on a pear-shaped instrument at ren. fests, etc. Chris --- On Tue, 1/19/10, Ron Andrico <[1]praelu...@hotmail.com> wrote: > From: Ron Andrico <[2]praelu...@hotmail.com> > Subject: [LUTE] Re: Thumb rest stroke > To: [3]chriswi...@yahoo.com, [4]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu, [5]dwinh...@comcast.net > Date: Tuesday, January 19, 2010, 11:09 AM >Chris & All: >The rest stroke for the thumb seems a > logical means to both produce a >strong bass and teach the thumb to keep > track of diapasons, although >there is no specific referral to this > technique by name in any written >historical source I've seen. The > term 'rest stroke' seems to be a >classical guitar convention useful in > adapting to lute technique. The >thing I find extremely puzzling in the > 'awful lot of paintings' you >mention is that, for late 16th and almost > all 17th century examples, >there is a nearly uniform depiction of a > thumb-out technique, which is >also described clearly in written > sources. With one exception, nearly >all our notable baroque lutenists of > today use a thumb-under >technique. This even applies to a > lutenist I've seen in a recent video >who is described as never having played > renaissance lute. What gives? >Why don't baroque lutenists today use > what is an unquestionably obvious >historical technique? I admit to > not having paid much attention to >this issue in the past. >Sincerely puzzled, >Ron Andrico >www.mignarda.com >> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 05:10:57 > -0800 >> To: [6]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu; > [7]dwinh...@comcast.net >> From: [8]chriswi...@yahoo.com >> Subject: [LUTE] Re: Thumb rest > stroke >> >> I've seen Paul O'Dette use repeated > rest strokes in the bass, >sometimes for fairly fast lines that I > would take with p-i alternating >(free) strokes. On the other hand, I've > seen Robert Barto occasionally >use rest strokes in the treble. >> >> There are an awful lot of paintings > (especially, but not exclusively, >baroque) in which the players are clearly > using a rest stroke with the >fingers a la classical guitar. In most of > these the player is obviously >tuning; in some, its not so clear. I know > of no printed instructions, >however. >> >> Chris >> >> >> >> >> >> >> To get on or off this list see list > information at >> [9]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > >__ > >Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email > service. [1]Get it now. -- > > References
