[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
I found Neutrogena hand cream quite convenient. If you need to use gloves (for very hard work), have a thin pair of woolen gloves + leather work gloves. --- En date de : Mar 29.6.10, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com a ecrit : De: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Objet: Re : Re : [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? A: jean-michel Catherinot jeanmichel.catheri...@yahoo.com, Narada blues.for.nar...@ntlworld.com Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Mardi 29 juin 2010, 10h59 Dear Jean-Michel and Neil Thank you for your very useful reflections. It is a good idea to treat gardening in the same spirit as lute playing, with as relaxed an attitude and with as economic gestures as possible. It has been a long time since I had to do this, and I am almost certainly forcing things, and also still looking for the right tools to deal with a particularly hard ground. What oil or cream do you use, Jean-Michel? % I don't want to turn this into a gardening programme, but as Neil says these problems can also occur, just with carrying equipment. I will try out the various hot and cold water methods, and see how that goes. Thanks again Anthony __ De : jean-michel Catherinot jeanmichel.catheri...@yahoo.com A : lute@cs.dartmouth.edu; Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Envoye le : Mar 29 juin 2010, 12h 34min 08s Objet : Re : [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Wide experience in thaht stuff. Using tools needs also practice, and you have to be as decontracted while gardening as you're supposed to be while playing your lute. Treat your gardening tools kindly (laisser l'outil travailler), that means use his quality at his best without forcing it, use the right tool., and work quietly. You'll be less tired, with a better result, and no stiff hands.For me the problem is the dryness of the skin after having my hands in the ground: and using gardenning gloves is not a solution, it's even worse. You need some specific oil or cream to avoid that. That's all. Bon jardinage! __ De : Narada blues.for.nar...@ntlworld.com A : Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Envoye le : Mar 29 juin 2010, 11h 55min 09s Objet : RE: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Anthony, Interesting point. As guitarist playing in a working band ( as well as enjoying playing the Lute ) gigging on average 3 times a week with no roadcrew as such, shifting half a tonne of equipment twice nightly does have a tendancy to stiffen the fingers - as well as stiffening the back. I usually find that a couple of minutes with my hands in luke warm water, followed by a minute or so of clenching my hands and waggling my fingers helps a lot. I also occasionally suffer from what I call 'Hot Hand ' this is where the muscle between the thumb and first finger on my right hand swells and gets very painful due to lactic acid build up. For this I put my hand in very cold water to bring the swelling down. The same happens with my left hand occasionally, again I do the same thing. Hope this helps. Neil -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Hind Sent: 29 June 2010 10:10 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? --- En date de : Mar 29.6.10, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com a ecrit : De: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Objet: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Mardi 29 juin 2010, 9h09 Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Hi Anthony, At this time of year, when the demands of the garden are taking over from lute-playing, it is difficult to find compatibility for both hobbies. Obviously it is important to wear gloves to protect the skin from cuts, abrasions and the forming of hard-skin. Also use plenty of hand moisturizer as heavy manual work dries the skin. But I find 'Chinese-balls' are a good exercise. I was given a pair as a present a few years ago. They are about 3cm diameter, hollow steel which you hold in one hand and keep crossing them over in a clockwise direction and then vise versa. Then do the same with the other hand. (Or use two pairs at the same time). Mine have a faint chiming sound inside, but you'd hardly notice. This exercise is good for all the muscles/joints in the hand. I suppose table-tennis balls could be used as a substitute, but would not have quite the same 'slippery' surface to rub together. Golf balls would be even less forgiving. Best Wishes Ron (UK) -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Hind Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 10:10 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Dear All The collective wisdom as usual runs deeper than I expected, from advice on how to minimize the damage done by gardening (economic relaxed gestures, use of the right tool for the job, softening the ground with water, wearing gloves: leather and wool for protection, or latex for grip) to ideas on how to recover from gardening's bad effects (soaking the fingers in warm water, use of various lotions, oils and creams: Neutrogena, Aveeno) and last but certainly not least the Greg Irwin's finger limbering exercises, suggested by Stephen, and the Chinese balls suggested by Ron. When I first went back to lute playing, I did use finger exercising (including Chinese balls), and even whole body limbering up, as I was so conscious of the loss of my youthful suppleness (reminds me of Lewis Carol's Father William), but I admit I now tend to go straight to playing, as I also tend to do with gardening. You have convinced me that a return to limbering up, for both activities would be a help. A professional singer would never begin singing without first exercising the vocal chords, clearly a lutenist is just as dependent on the state of their fingers, and indeed their shoulders and back. It has often been an old shoulder injury that has caused me to stop playing. I now realize just how tough it must be for a professional lute-player, not only is there the constant worry of instruments being broken just before the performance, and sometimes jet-lag (having to play in what, for the player, is the middle of the night, as happened to me for a conference in Sanfrancisco), but also the problem of stiff hands from carrying the luggage, and the consciousness that any hand-injury could prevent play. Thank you all for you help and advice. Regards Anthony __ De : Ron Fletcher ron.fletc...@ntlworld.com A : Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Envoye le : Mer 30 juin 2010, 10h 12min 26s Objet : RE: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Hi Anthony, At this time of year, when the demands of the garden are taking over from lute-playing, it is difficult to find compatibility for both hobbies. Obviously it is important to wear gloves to protect the skin from cuts, abrasions and the forming of hard-skin. Also use plenty of hand moisturizer as heavy manual work dries the skin. But I find 'Chinese-balls' are a good exercise. I was given a pair as a present a few years ago. They are about 3cm diameter, hollow steel which you hold in one hand and keep crossing them over in a clockwise direction and then vise versa. Then do the same with the other hand. (Or use two pairs at the same time). Mine have a faint chiming sound inside, but you'd hardly notice. This exercise is good for all the muscles/joints in the hand. I suppose table-tennis balls could be used as a substitute, but would not have quite the same 'slippery' surface to rub together. Golf balls would be even less forgiving. Best Wishes Ron (UK) -Original Message- From: [1]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:[2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Hind Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 10:10 AM To: [3]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at [4]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 2. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 3. mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu 4.
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
I experienced that after my last trip to America in March where I was working on my house everyday for 5 weeks, holding tools and driving, so much so in fact, that I've had to stop playing. Hopefully this will be temporary. It's been 6 months since I've done any real playing and I am limiting myself to just computer sequencing and a bit of keyboard for the time being. It is tenosynovitis according to the doctor. Soaking the hands in hot and cold water might be a way to prepare for playing. It seems to loosen things up. There is a lute case maker not too far from me who makes cases out of styrofoam. These are something between a hard case and a soft case, ideal I reckon for in town gigs. I guess Ariel Abramovich and Benjamin Narvey wouldn't mind me mentioning that they both have recently acquired styrofoam cases. On Jun 29, 2010, at 6:09 PM, Anthony Hind wrote: Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at [1]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html Ed Durbrow Saitama, Japan [2]edurb...@sea.plala.or.jp [3]http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/ -- References 1. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 2. mailto:edurb...@sea.plala.or.jp 3. http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
As a young man ( I've been a young man for many years ) I worked as a carpenter building houses in the midwest (USA) for seven years while studying classical guitar, practicing 3 and 4 hours a night. This was before pneumatic and electric nailers were in widespread use. After slinging a hammer all day, my hand would be frozen into a cylindrical shape just big enough to hold a can of beer. It's a hard life in our capitalist paradise. Gary - Original Message - From: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:09 AM Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.830 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2969 - Release Date: 06/28/10 11:35:00
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
If one has performed so much manual gripping that one's hand is 'stuck' in a contracted fist-like condition, or just very stiff to opening and closing the fingers, the problem isn't just in the hand - all of the flexor and extensor muscles that move the fingers are in the forearm, so it would help to apply ice (or heat, but preferable ice) to the forearm and massage the forearm, from the wrist up to the elbow, in addition to all of the great advice that has been offered. -Original Message- From: Gary Digman magg...@sonic.net To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wed, Jun 30, 2010 6:59 am Subject: [LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing? As a young man ( I've been a young man for many years ) I worked as a carpenter building houses in the midwest (USA) for seven years while studying classical guitar, practicing 3 and 4 hours a night. This was before pneumatic and electric nailers were in widespread use. After slinging a hammer all day, my hand would be frozen into a cylindrical shape just big enough to hold a can of beer. It's a hard life in our capitalist paradise. Gary - Original Message - From: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:09 AM Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.830 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2969 - Release Date: 06/28/10 11:35:00 --
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
of course, there is no incompatibility! Just use a scarifying lute while gardening and all will be fine!! Charles To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Anthony, Interesting point. As guitarist playing in a working band ( as well as enjoying playing the Lute ) gigging on average 3 times a week with no roadcrew as such, shifting half a tonne of equipment twice nightly does have a tendancy to stiffen the fingers - as well as stiffening the back. I usually find that a couple of minutes with my hands in luke warm water, followed by a minute or so of clenching my hands and waggling my fingers helps a lot. I also occasionally suffer from what I call 'Hot Hand ' this is where the muscle between the thumb and first finger on my right hand swells and gets very painful due to lactic acid build up. For this I put my hand in very cold water to bring the swelling down. The same happens with my left hand occasionally, again I do the same thing. Hope this helps. Neil -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Hind Sent: 29 June 2010 10:10 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Wide experience in thaht stuff. Using tools needs also practice, and you have to be as decontracted while gardening as you're supposed to be while playing your lute. Treat your gardening tools kindly (laisser l'outil travailler), that means use his quality at his best without forcing it, use the right tool., and work quietly. You'll be less tired, with a better result, and no stiff hands.For me the problem is the dryness of the skin after having my hands in the ground: and using gardenning gloves is not a solution, it's even worse. You need some specific oil or cream to avoid that. That's all. Bon jardinage! --- En date de : Mar 29.6.10, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com a ecrit : De: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Objet: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Mardi 29 juin 2010, 9h09 Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at [1]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/%7Ewbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Dear Jean-Michel and Neil Thank you for your very useful reflections. It is a good idea to treat gardening in the same spirit as lute playing, with as relaxed an attitude and with as economic gestures as possible. It has been a long time since I had to do this, and I am almost certainly forcing things, and also still looking for the right tools to deal with a particularly hard ground. What oil or cream do you use, Jean-Michel? % I don't want to turn this into a gardening programme, but as Neil says these problems can also occur, just with carrying equipment. I will try out the various hot and cold water methods, and see how that goes. Thanks again Anthony __ De : jean-michel Catherinot jeanmichel.catheri...@yahoo.com A : lute@cs.dartmouth.edu; Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Envoye le : Mar 29 juin 2010, 12h 34min 08s Objet : Re : [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Wide experience in thaht stuff. Using tools needs also practice, and you have to be as decontracted while gardening as you're supposed to be while playing your lute. Treat your gardening tools kindly (laisser l'outil travailler), that means use his quality at his best without forcing it, use the right tool., and work quietly. You'll be less tired, with a better result, and no stiff hands.For me the problem is the dryness of the skin after having my hands in the ground: and using gardenning gloves is not a solution, it's even worse. You need some specific oil or cream to avoid that. That's all. Bon jardinage! __ De : Narada blues.for.nar...@ntlworld.com A : Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Envoye le : Mar 29 juin 2010, 11h 55min 09s Objet : RE: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Anthony, Interesting point. As guitarist playing in a working band ( as well as enjoying playing the Lute ) gigging on average 3 times a week with no roadcrew as such, shifting half a tonne of equipment twice nightly does have a tendancy to stiffen the fingers - as well as stiffening the back. I usually find that a couple of minutes with my hands in luke warm water, followed by a minute or so of clenching my hands and waggling my fingers helps a lot. I also occasionally suffer from what I call 'Hot Hand ' this is where the muscle between the thumb and first finger on my right hand swells and gets very painful due to lactic acid build up. For this I put my hand in very cold water to bring the swelling down. The same happens with my left hand occasionally, again I do the same thing. Hope this helps. Neil -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Hind Sent: 29 June 2010 10:10 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? --- En date de : Mar 29.6.10, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com a ecrit : De: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Objet: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Mardi 29 juin 2010, 9h09 Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at [1]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/%7Ewbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
I do a fair amount of gardening/DIY/Woodworking, and have similar problems. One thing that I've found to be useful is wearing a snug-fitting glove with a rubberized palm and fingers (Grip is the common brand in Seattle). They significantly reduce the amount of hand strength you have to use to get a good grip on your tools. It at least mitigates the wear and tear a bit. Guy -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Hind Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:59 AM To: jean-michel Catherinot; Narada Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear Jean-Michel and Neil Thank you for your very useful reflections. It is a good idea to treat gardening in the same spirit as lute playing, with as relaxed an attitude and with as economic gestures as possible. It has been a long time since I had to do this, and I am almost certainly forcing things, and also still looking for the right tools to deal with a particularly hard ground. What oil or cream do you use, Jean-Michel? % I don't want to turn this into a gardening programme, but as Neil says these problems can also occur, just with carrying equipment. I will try out the various hot and cold water methods, and see how that goes. Thanks again Anthony __ De : jean-michel Catherinot jeanmichel.catheri...@yahoo.com A : lute@cs.dartmouth.edu; Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Envoye le : Mar 29 juin 2010, 12h 34min 08s Objet : Re : [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Wide experience in thaht stuff. Using tools needs also practice, and you have to be as decontracted while gardening as you're supposed to be while playing your lute. Treat your gardening tools kindly (laisser l'outil travailler), that means use his quality at his best without forcing it, use the right tool., and work quietly. You'll be less tired, with a better result, and no stiff hands.For me the problem is the dryness of the skin after having my hands in the ground: and using gardenning gloves is not a solution, it's even worse. You need some specific oil or cream to avoid that. That's all. Bon jardinage! __ De : Narada blues.for.nar...@ntlworld.com A : Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Envoye le : Mar 29 juin 2010, 11h 55min 09s Objet : RE: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Anthony, Interesting point. As guitarist playing in a working band ( as well as enjoying playing the Lute ) gigging on average 3 times a week with no roadcrew as such, shifting half a tonne of equipment twice nightly does have a tendancy to stiffen the fingers - as well as stiffening the back. I usually find that a couple of minutes with my hands in luke warm water, followed by a minute or so of clenching my hands and waggling my fingers helps a lot. I also occasionally suffer from what I call 'Hot Hand ' this is where the muscle between the thumb and first finger on my right hand swells and gets very painful due to lactic acid build up. For this I put my hand in very cold water to bring the swelling down. The same happens with my left hand occasionally, again I do the same thing. Hope this helps. Neil -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Hind Sent: 29 June 2010 10:10 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? --- En date de : Mar 29.6.10, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com a ecrit : De: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Objet: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Mardi 29 juin 2010, 9h09 Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Anthony, You might want to look at Greg Irwin's finger control exercises on YouTube. I have found them very helpful and really should do them more regularly. They begin with this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWmDbbYH1OQfeature=PlayListp=85E9D05280DCD668playnext_from=PLindex=0playnext=1, and there are quite a few of them. Good luck, Stephen Arndt -Original Message- From: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Sent: Jun 29, 2010 4:09 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Thank you for your very useful reflections. It is a good idea to treat gardening in the same spirit as lute playing, with as relaxed an attitude and with as economic gestures as possible. It has been a long time since I had to do this, and I am almost certainly forcing things, and also still looking for the right tools to deal with a particularly hard ground. Water, and a little time for it to work in and loosen the soil. I live in a dry place and the ground can get very hard. Water is the best tool I've found. What oil or cream do you use, Jean-Michel? It probably matters less what, and more that you use it, and use it enough. In the US I use a lotion called Aveeno, which is very good. The other thing I find very important in not ruining my hands for lute playing with my gardening is pacing. Do a little, take a break. Do some today, some tomorrow. That sort of thing. Suzanne To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
My wife, who's a knitter, introduced me to Udderly Smooth handcream, which is what I mostly use now. It doesn't leave an oily residue on your fingers, which is why it's popular with knitters. Guy -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Suzanne Angevine Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 10:42 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Thank you for your very useful reflections. It is a good idea to treat gardening in the same spirit as lute playing, with as relaxed an attitude and with as economic gestures as possible. It has been a long time since I had to do this, and I am almost certainly forcing things, and also still looking for the right tools to deal with a particularly hard ground. Water, and a little time for it to work in and loosen the soil. I live in a dry place and the ground can get very hard. Water is the best tool I've found. What oil or cream do you use, Jean-Michel? It probably matters less what, and more that you use it, and use it enough. In the US I use a lotion called Aveeno, which is very good. The other thing I find very important in not ruining my hands for lute playing with my gardening is pacing. Do a little, take a break. Do some today, some tomorrow. That sort of thing. Suzanne To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
I found that wearing heavy, preferably leather gloves tend to help prevent booth finger stiffness and skin roughness. It prevents getting dirt under the nails as well. It is interesting to look at rural cultures where the farmers also also musicians - fiddle players, etc. Their playing definitely is affected by the years of hard work; they can still play, but not always in tune or very fast, but they still play with a great deal of soul. Big difference between being able to scratch out fiddle tunes and performing Dowland or Weiis though. -Original Message- From: Guy Smith guy_m_sm...@comcast.net To: 'Suzanne Angevine' suzanne.angev...@gmail.com; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tue, Jun 29, 2010 1:58 pm Subject: [LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing? My wife, who's a knitter, introduced me to Udderly Smooth handcream, which is what I mostly use now. It doesn't leave an oily residue on your fingers, which is why it's popular with knitters. Guy -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Suzanne Angevine Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 10:42 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Thank you for your very useful reflections. It is a good idea to treat gardening in the same spirit as lute playing, with as relaxed an attitude and with as economic gestures as possible. It has been a long time since I had to do this, and I am almost certainly forcing things, and also still looking for the right tools to deal with a particularly hard ground. Water, and a little time for it to work in and loosen the soil. I live in a dry place and the ground can get very hard. Water is the best tool I've found. What oil or cream do you use, Jean-Michel? It probably matters less what, and more that you use it, and use it enough. In the US I use a lotion called Aveeno, which is very good. The other thing I find very important in not ruining my hands for lute playing with my gardening is pacing. Do a little, take a break. Do some today, some tomorrow. That sort of thing. Suzanne To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
I found that wearing heavy, preferably leather gloves tend to help prevent booth finger stiffness and skin roughness. It prevents getting dirt under the nails as well. It is interesting to look at rural cultures where the farmers also also musicians - fiddle players, etc. Their playing definitely is affected by the years of hard work; they can still play, but not always in tune or very fast, but they still play with a great deal of soul. Big difference between being able to scratch out fiddle tunes and performing Dowland or Weiis though. manual labor of any kind, not just agricultural will do a number on dexterity. I took up guitar at age 8, was working on Sor, Villa-lobos, Milan et al some 16 years later while also working as a programmer. But, accessible work opportunities failed as Massachusetts succumbed to the wrath of a spurned Nixon, and lacking a car (even a license) I was obliged to turn to unskilled day-labor, stacking boxes of food at a piece-work rate - a typical day was 30 tons stacked at a little over a dollar a ton. My guitar practice was now much more about therapy than repertoire building. Luckily I had a lady friend who enjoyed pounding the kinks out of my back muscles. -- Dana Emery To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Wow! Are my fingers ever out of shape! Thanks for sharing this link--why don't they teach us this stuff the minute we pick up an instrument?? Leonard Williams On 6/29/10 1:36 PM, Stephen Arndt stephenar...@earthlink.net wrote: Anthony, You might want to look at Greg Irwin's finger control exercises on YouTube. I have found them very helpful and really should do them more regularly. They begin with this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWmDbbYH1OQfeature=PlayListp=85E9D05280DCD668 playnext_from=PLindex=0playnext=1, and there are quite a few of them. Good luck, Stephen Arndt -Original Message- From: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Sent: Jun 29, 2010 4:09 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
I saw Irwin give a demonstration (mostly to sell videos) at a percussion clinic years ago. It was intriguing. Eugene -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Stephen Arndt Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 1:36 PM To: Anthony Hind; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Anthony, You might want to look at Greg Irwin's finger control exercises on YouTube. I have found them very helpful and really should do them more regularly. They begin with this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWmDbbYH1OQfeature=PlayListp=85E9D05280DC D668playnext_from=PLindex=0playnext=1, and there are quite a few of them. Good luck, Stephen Arndt -Original Message- From: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Sent: Jun 29, 2010 4:09 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Anthony Hind wrote: Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthon I have found that it IS rather difficult to play lute (or any other instrument) while gardening ;) More seriously: the problem frequently is tired, overstrained muscles which have be performing unaccustomed actions. If the muscles become accustomed to the exercise you may even find that your playing ability has improved because the muscles are stronger and need a lower percentage of their power to play, meaning your fingers are more relaxed. I found this out may years ago when I was first seriously working on classical guitar and had to milk a cow; at first my fingers were impossibly stiff, but after a while I found that my fingers were stronger and could play more easily. Of course the joints need to be worked to maintain flexibility as well, since frequently the exercise which strengthens the muscles doesn't involve much range of motion. Of course, now age and surgery to repair a severed tendon in my left hand have reduced my hand's flexibility :( Stephen Fryer To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Wow! Are my fingers ever out of shape! Thanks for sharing this link--why don't they teach us this stuff the minute we pick up an instrument?? some do, some dont, depends on the teacher. I was blessed in moms choice of a guitar teacher, at age eight; it wasnt volunteered to me, but when I asked about how to prepare for lengthy practice sessions I was shown some relaxation techniques, and told basically, dont do so much that you have bad pains. -- Dana Emery To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: incompatibility gardening/lute playing?
Did you try a good pair of work gloves? SS --- On Tue, 6/29/10, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com wrote: From: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com Subject: [LUTE] incompatibility gardening/lute playing? To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Tuesday, June 29, 2010, 5:09 AM Dear lutenists Recently, I have found myself having to do some rather heavy gardening, which appears to be almost incompatible with lute playing. the simple fact of being physically tired is part of it, but also the fingers seem less supple after clenching a spade or a pick-axe. One lute player told me that even carrying suit-cases to a performance, can make their fingers stiff; and certain lute makers told me that using a lute maker's tools can make lute playing more difficult; although there are some excellent lute maker-players, even among us. % Do others have similar impressions, and if so, are there any ideas on how to get round this, (apart, of course simply from getting someone else to carry your lutes, and do the gardening, or play your lutes): some exercise between activities to help prepare for playing, perhaps? % At present, I am back in my flat in Paris, and so playing as much as I can, in spite of the hot weather, which also makes things more difficult, and I have regained the suppleness, but I will soon have to go back to gardening. Thanks for any advice, Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at [1]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
